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If Deposit Confiscation Happened In The US, It Wouldn't Impact 57% Of Americans

Tyler Durden's picture


The average US worker remains concerned about their retirement even as the stock market reaches new all-time highs. The WSJ reports new data that shows the impact of stagnating wage growth and aging demographics is combining to squeeze individuals as a depressing 57% of Americans reported less than $25,000 in household savings and investments. On the bright side, the latest and greatest 'Cyprus' tax limit appears to be €20,000, or roughly the $25K threshold in the US, freeing those 'un'-wealthy citizens to keep their hard-earned private property.

On the dark side, 28% have no confidence they will have enough money to retire comfortably - the highest level in 23 years.

Americans are living longer and their extended life spans are putting additional strains of pension plans as the percentage of workers who have saved enough for retirement plunged to 66% (from 75% in 2009). What is perhaps more worrisome is the fact that when asked if they could come up with $2,000 for an unexpected need, only about half were sure as the paycheck-to-paycheck lifestyle persists.

Though older workers fret, it is the younger generation is of more concern given the current central bank policies: "they're never going to be able to create wealth, other than what our generation leaves them and what they do with it, they have more uncertainty than we have."



Via WSJ,

Workers and employers in the U.S. are bracing for a retirement crisis, even as the stock market sits near highs and the economy shows signs of improvement.




Fifty-seven percent of U.S. workers surveyed reported less than $25,000 in total household savings and investments excluding their homes, according to a report to be released Tuesday by the Employee Benefit Research Institute. Only 49% reported having so little money saved in 2008.


The survey also found that 28% of Americans have no confidence they will have enough money to retire comfortably—the highest level in the study's 23-year history.




While Americans are living longer, the extended life spans will make it tougher for workers trying to stretch retirement savings and put additional strains on pension plans.




The percentage of workers who have saved for retirement plunged to 66% from 75% in 2009, according to the Employee Benefit Research Institute survey.


Only about half of the 1,003 workers and 251 retirees surveyed said they were sure they could come up with $2,000 if an unexpected need were to arise in the next month.


"Workers are recognizing there is a crisis," said Alicia Munnell, director of the Boston College Center for Retirement Research. She noted that companies continue to do away with traditional pensions.




According to the society, a male who reaches age 65 in 2013 is expected to live an additional 20.5 years, up from 19.5 in the earlier projections. Women turning 65 this year are now expected to live an additional 22.7 years, up from 21.3.


Although the increases might seem small, Bruce Cadenhead, chief retirement actuary with Mercer, a consulting unit of Marsh & McLennan Cos., MMC -0.78% said they are the largest he has seen in more than 25 years.


"It represents a meaningful jump in liabilities," he said.




The effect of longer life spans on pension obligations has been dwarfed by the impact of declining interest rates over recent years. Because of the way pension obligations are calculated, lower interest rates means that future obligations are higher today.


But interest rates are likely to rise at some point, which will lessen pension obligations. That is less likely with longevity assumptions.


"Rates can go up," said Rama Variankaval, an executive director in the corporate finance advisory group of J.P. Morgan Chase JPM -1.03% & Co.'s investment bank. "Mortality is more of a one-way street."


... is more concerned about what the future holds for his children, a 51-year-old art director-turned-roadie and a 49-year-old third-grade teacher.


"They're never going to be able to create wealth, other than what our generation leaves them and what they do with it," he said. "They have more uncertainty than we have."



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Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:06 | 3346736 sunnydays
sunnydays's picture

So they are going to confiscate the Retirement funds for U.S. bonds for the good of the people.  That way they get the money and it is not insured.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:09 | 3346756 MillionDollarBonus_
MillionDollarBonus_'s picture

I think a levy is a good idea. It's just like tax. The government needs to raise money for its essential functions. Functions that we all agree cannot be provided voluntarily.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:12 | 3346777 prains
prains's picture

or you could just pucker up and service the gov't yourself, a function you should gladly volunteer for

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:14 | 3346788 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

SSSSSHHHHHH, be vewy vewy qwiet - Im hunting sheep!

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:46 | 3346881 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture



If you are not absolutely sure you...

...could come up with $2,000 if an unexpected need were to arise in the next month...

...but you have more than $2,000 per month in regular expenses, then you know you're a debt slave. 

If you do not want to be a debt slave your entire life:

  1. Cancel cable
  2. Cancel your cell phone
  3. Don't eat out
  4. Stop smoking and drinking
  5. Take public transportation, walk, or bike
  6. Work a second job

...until you do have $2,000 (90 days max), or be a debt slave and ward of the state.  It is your choice.



Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:55 | 3347010 MiguelitoRaton
MiguelitoRaton's picture

So the 57% vote to steal from the 43% (mob rule after all is "fair"). The 43% decide to pull out their money in advance and bury it in the velocity goes to 0 and we enter a new greater depression. People are so ignorant...

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:57 | 3347029 MiguelitoRaton
MiguelitoRaton's picture

I keep telling my friends that once they discover that taxing income is insufficient, they will tax wealth. Those that understand the difference simply refuse to believe it.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:02 | 3347060 Muddy1
Muddy1's picture

"...It Wouldn't Impact 57% Of Americans",  and I'm supposed to feel good about this?????


Which 57% wouldn't pay, along with the 47% that don't pay taxes.  What a load of crap.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:17 | 3347155 fourchan
fourchan's picture

The confiscation is happening right here to we the people right now.

the fed steals silently through inflation and it affects every single one of us.

frankly im suprised no zh'er has pointed this out yet. maybe its too obvious.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:24 | 3347206 SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture

The percentage of workers who have saved for retirement plunged to 66% from 75% in 2009, according to the Employee Benefit Research Institute survey.

Well points out that 9% of the workforce got tired of being 401k-fucked and cashed out.  


Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:55 | 3347416 syntaxterror
syntaxterror's picture

Ben Bernake says inflation is only 1% sir.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:58 | 3347037 Maos Dog
Maos Dog's picture

SToP DrinKing ?!?!?!??!?!?!?

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:14 | 3347120 GubbermintWorker
GubbermintWorker's picture


Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:22 | 3347196 SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture

Car and Housing are regular expenses and those EASILY got over 2,000 a month 


Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:28 | 3347250 GubbermintWorker
GubbermintWorker's picture

Really? I'm retiring it less than two years and the house expense will be $725/m, incuding taxes and insurance. Both vehicles will be paid for but will require maintenance and fuel but no where near  $2,000 combined.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:37 | 3347279 mirac
mirac's picture

Without smoking and drinking I would have to question whether life is worth is becoming work

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 13:53 | 3348307 caconhma
caconhma's picture

If a government takes away people checking and saving accounts and give it all to jewish bankers, how will people be able to pay their mortgages, loans or even their taxes?

I get it. It will be a slave society. Then we will need a new Moses to get us out from America so Jews will have it all just for themselves. Then, who will work and feed them?


Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:18 | 3346796 MillionDollarBonus_
MillionDollarBonus_'s picture

How about this: We levy every bank account at a FIXED rate of 4%, NO exceptions. All the money goes into a Federal Stability fund, managed by a committee apointed by our elected congressmen. The money will be invested in the economy as and when it is needed.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:19 | 3346816 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

Hopefully it is managed by people who know how to spell "appointed".

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:26 | 3346840 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

But MDB... What if those 'elected congresspeople' didn't attend Ivy League schools? [&/or the electoral district was full of nerdy, pimply faced, doomer libertarians]?

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:20 | 3346817 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

I dont think 4% will be high enough to support banker bonus'!

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:38 | 3347294 whotookmyalias
whotookmyalias's picture

It's not.  Why should we think that "this time it's different" and the Bankers will not continue to rob us blind?  Fool me once shame on you......

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:23 | 3346822 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

We do that already via all the taxes we pay, to be managed by Congress.  How's that working out? Oh, it's fucked up so we need ANOTHER tax and committee? And when that one FAILS we'll need ANOTHER tax and committee?  I honestly hope this is your sarcastic side. I'd really like to say nobody can be this stupid, but I've talked to some of them that are still walking around this country, and then look at what's been elected to office, so yes, people can be this stupid....

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:53 | 3346999 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

According to people like El Krugmano, we have a revenue problem, not a spending problem.

I think MDB is just messing with us here, but if you read the comments on a Krugman article, MDB would fit right in and be welcomed with open arms as a "deep thinker."

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:23 | 3346830 johnQpublic
johnQpublic's picture

if you could trust politicians with any sort of fund at all, then social security system wouldnt be would have trillions in assets

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:40 | 3346907 max2205
max2205's picture

Levy by another name..rising property have to pay out of your checking different

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:25 | 3346834 prains
prains's picture

I'm sure if you can hit a treble C on Bennies sphincter you'll get your way on that too

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:26 | 3346842 Clint Liquor
Clint Liquor's picture

How about this: 'We' continue to have the FED fund the Governments excesses by printing money and buying Treasuries.  That way, the low information voters will never figure out they are the one actually paying for it through devaluation of their currency.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:26 | 3346845 camaro68ss
camaro68ss's picture

MDB, How are you so brain dead and willing to fork over your capital to a bunch of elected officials you don’t know? Do you not see how there running this country into the ground yet you still want to give them more money? You sir are FUBAR!  

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:15 | 3347130 GubbermintWorker
GubbermintWorker's picture

No, MDB is a troll. Sometimes a very effective troll.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 13:25 | 3348136 ILLILLILLI
ILLILLILLI's picture

Yes, subtlety is the hallmark of an expert.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 15:20 | 3348962 stacking12321
stacking12321's picture

see, the problem with this site is there are so many know-it-alls, who can't stand it when someone has an opinion different from theirs.

our great nation is struggling to pay its bills, and our elected officials haven't been able to come up with solutions.

new and fresh ideas like those MDB has come up with, should be welcomed, not ridiculed.


Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:59 | 3347042 Telemakhos
Telemakhos's picture

Besides that 4% is probably too low, there's one glaring problem with your idea, MDB:

All the money goes into a Federal Stability fund, managed by a committee apointed by our elected congressmen.

It should be clear from Congress' oft-demonstrated intransigence that the legislature is not to be trusted with such an important responsibility as appointing a Federal Stability fund.  Who knows how long they'll stall such appointments, just to spite the executive?  No, clearly control over the Federal Stability fund should rest solely with the executive branch without any legislative interference.  Clearly, that's the only path to a more stable Union.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:51 | 3347390 One of We
One of We's picture

WTF? 4% wouldn't cover the skim! "Managed by a committee...". LMFAO! Those fucking crooks we "elected" can piss away money faster than Chris Mattews can give Dear Leader a reach around. The solution is there is no solution because the rules are there are no rules. Cyprus, then New Zealand, soon Mainstreet USA for outright deposit removal......

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:54 | 3347411 GubbermintWorker
GubbermintWorker's picture

Go ahead, I no longer have any bank accounts.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 14:26 | 3348556 House-of-Cards
House-of-Cards's picture


"Federal Stability Fund" mean like our Social Security Trust Fund? .... what a novel idea....except...Something tells me that putting politicians, money and trust together just doesn't work too well. 

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 17:04 | 3349503 theprofromdover
theprofromdover's picture

MDB special ""We levy every bank account at a FIXED rate of 4%, NO exceptions""

But mdb, there will have to be exceptions. The committee and the congressmen shirley can't be expected to pay up.

Why, that might make them poor, they have had to work very hard to turn that miserable salary into countless millions in their savings accounts.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:12 | 3346778 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

Dear government,

Please make me stop writing bad checks.



Ben Bernanke

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:29 | 3346854 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

I think technically  Jacob Lew is writing the bad checks....the Bernank is kiting them for him.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:33 | 3346875 madcows
madcows's picture

Is it check Kiting or Money Laundering.  I tend to think that the FED is playing the same role as HSBC did for the drug cartels... thus laundering.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:13 | 3346779 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

'Essential Functions'...that generally being keeping 400 pound baby mammas and their 5 illegitimate kids full of Cheese Doodles and Snacky Cakes and having a free computer phone!

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:18 | 3346810 Aguadulce
Aguadulce's picture

Grape drink will enter a huge bull market phase this year.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:23 | 3346832 Ancona
Ancona's picture

Hey man, don't be fuckin' wit my joose!

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:25 | 3346839 Leopold B. Scotch
Leopold B. Scotch's picture

What, Me Worry?

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:12 | 3347115 MiguelitoRaton
MiguelitoRaton's picture

Grape drank will enter a huge bull market phase this year. Fixed it for you

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 15:55 | 3349185 marathonman
marathonman's picture

Beat me to it.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 21:30 | 3350658 jumbo maverick
jumbo maverick's picture

Technically that demographic calls the grape drink and/or grape kool aid...


Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:28 | 3346829 xtop23
xtop23's picture

"Rates can go up..."

Of course that means our debt service achieves escape velocity and we go Bill Paxton in Aliens.

"Game over, man! Game over! Now wtf are we supposed to do!? We're in some real deep shit now, man!"

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:29 | 3346858 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

Yeah, how can rates ever possibly go up? They can't, at least not in a controlled manner that isn't forced on us. Bernanke has painted himself and all us into a corner.

Math hurts, America.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:39 | 3346905 xtop23
xtop23's picture

Seriously. Bond implosion ... parabolic rate spike... frn's with ever increasing zeroes and Alfred E. Neuman on the face.......and then things get decidedly easier to project.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:52 | 3346991 bigkahuna
bigkahuna's picture

Rates will go up only after all of this debt has been rolled into 30 year notes and placed on the back burner for future generations with even more inflated currency than we have now to pay it. That is what is going on. Rates will go up after they completely "pass the buck". (IMO)

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:30 | 3347251 xtop23
xtop23's picture

I agree that's what they're doing, I just disagree that they'll be able to completely pass the buck. Fundamentals always win out eventually. The market will make the decision for them. Can you say 7+ trillion dollar FED balance sheet in 3 years?

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 19:34 | 3350229 bigkahuna
bigkahuna's picture

Yep. Not sure how they unwind that nor how the market reacts. These guys are too smart for anyones' good.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:28 | 3346851 Croesus
Croesus's picture

@ Million Dollar Bonus:

Yes, we should give the government even MORE of our money to manage......since they have such a stellar track record of prudent fiscal management.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:54 | 3347004 Meat Hammer
Meat Hammer's picture

I'm sure the debate about "essential functions" would last many days, over many beers, with a few right hooks.  

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:08 | 3347093 Winston of Oceania
Winston of Oceania's picture

They already take in enough for that just via taxation, it's the vote buying that gets hurt in sequester folks, and you can rest assured that obama will hurt the districts of republicans over dems,; not that it matters as both parties are just two different sides of the same wothless inflationary coin.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:11 | 3346769 kralizec
kralizec's picture

Getting their hands on any stored wealth is on their agenda...except for the Ruling Class, they'll be exempt of course...

Ready the torches!

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:31 | 3346865 toys for tits
toys for tits's picture


Anybody know where the pitchforks are?

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:11 | 3347107 mrdenis
mrdenis's picture

Mine was confsciated along with my guns and Packard clipper delux straight 8 gas guzzling automobile ...

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:11 | 3347106 Dooud
Dooud's picture

57% is the new 47%, this will be on the agenda in the next election as the takers will vote for the party who promises to take the most from the remaining 43%!!!

But man I only keep $30.22 in my checking account for the occasional half and half at jiffymart.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 13:13 | 3348030 caconhma
caconhma's picture

Shit. here we are returning  back to the basics: physical gold and guns.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:16 | 3347143 tabasco71
tabasco71's picture

Please just reply, 'I do', if you have more than USD$25k in short term savings/investments, so basically cash, stocks, bonds or commodities...  (exclude pension, exclude home equity):

Me...? Sorry, I certainly am nowhere near it...

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:09 | 3346750 tuttisaluti
tuttisaluti's picture

They don't need to confiscate your savings. They will just devaluate the US$ 30% over night so that every owner of the US$ worldwide get slammed. so easy.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:09 | 3346755 Dagny Taggart
Dagny Taggart's picture

Creative capital controls... we ain't seen nothin' yet.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:31 | 3346868 Rusticus
Rusticus's picture

Indeed ...  there's always the life expectancy side of the equation that can be tweaked, it's currently in a  bubble.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:10 | 3346762 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

Maybe.....just maybe in the event of deposit confiscation and bank failures that the truly fortunate will be the presently "unbanked".

<How do I become unbanked bro?>

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:10 | 3346764 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

NAH the peasants are NEVER adversely effected OF COURSE!! 

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:12 | 3346770 Big Corked Boots
Big Corked Boots's picture

What percentage of the US is represented by the Free Shit Army? Those are the voters that would urge a savings confiscation.

Reparations, bitchez.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:14 | 3346789 LFMayor
LFMayor's picture

You just described why the upper echelon parasites tend their inner city shithole vote gardens so lovingly.  Making sure they get plenty of EBT and WIC and RIF.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:16 | 3346800 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Bingo.  Break the supply lines (will happen eventually) and starve the fuckers.  Then both problems take care of themselves (as the EBT recipients decend on their former "representatives").  Bring it.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:57 | 3347028 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

"Vote gardens" is the perfect way to describe it, especially when you consider the fact that most of the brain-dead voters could be called vegetables.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:18 | 3346809 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

So the 47% morphs into 57% into ?...Anyone taking bets on the next 'election'? The dependent vs. independent tide is turning/has turned.  The downward slide is going to leave quite a bit of rug burn...

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:31 | 3346866 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

The middle class is being squeezed out of existence. All part of the plan.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:03 | 3347067 Winston of Oceania
Winston of Oceania's picture

I believe the FSA (free shit army) comprises about 47% of the electorate, my own mother among them. I used to pay for her cell phone but she cancelled it for a free Obama phone because as she stated "I'm entitled to it". She has even allowed that entitlement mentality to affect our relationship. Took a real burn to me calling Obama the Wolf in Sheeps Clothing contrasted to the honesty of Dr Carson who I claimed represented the Lamb. One sows divisiveness while the other seeks unity of purpose, one seeks to mark us all for Obamacare while the other wishes to actually provide healthcare and not just assumed coverage.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:12 | 3346774 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

They already confiscated it all in '08/'09...........

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:29 | 3346850 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

That was just a bumper crop. They have so many ways of confiscating wealth. Inflating equity through fraud and then making people pay for it. Student loans paying for worthless degrees that are "required" for "success". Wealth tax on deposits. Devaluing currency. Crashing stocks. And on and on.

With physical gold and silver, they have to come to my house with guns and confiscate it. If nothing else, it is a lot harder to steal that wealth.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:14 | 3346775 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

If it wouldn't impact 57% of Americans that's a sure sign that it will happen. Tyranny of the masses bitchez!

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:12 | 3346776 timbo_em
timbo_em's picture

Immagine what one could buy with said 25.000 USD (or even less) some ten years from now if Obama (and his succesor(s)) keeps spending lika a lunatic and Benny (and his successor(s)) keeps printing.

Welcome to the Great Zimbabwe of the Western World!

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:15 | 3346795 prains
prains's picture

1 gallon of Benjamin Moore clear eurythane $47 (2010)

1 gallon of Benjamin Moore clear eurythane $80 (2013)

(not USD though)

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:20 | 3346818 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

Been doing some painting over the weekend getting the PLan A house ready to be rented so that we can move to the Plan B house.

OMG......did I just pay $130 (plus tax) for five gallons of medium grade paint?

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:27 | 3346848 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

Walked into a big box store looking for a quart of generic Barn Red paint to finish the nest box on the coop.  They don't have any pre-mixed colors, none. So it was going to be $14 for a quart of custom Behr. F'in ridiculous.  I went over to the dollar/closeout store and picked up a can of red spray paint for $.99.  Not exactly a match for Barn Red but for all I know chickens are color blind...

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:34 | 3346882 BurningFuld
BurningFuld's picture

Spray paint the chickens red too in case they run away. Much easier to see red plus they may find each other more attractive. OK OK I put my pipe away now.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:38 | 3346897 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

Don't bogart that pipe my friend...........

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:28 | 3347245 tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

solution: make your own paint with lime

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:32 | 3346871 prains
prains's picture

If you have a General Paint store around you watch for their spring sale, they will sometimes run a $40% off on 5 gal to hit the spring reno market and move their aging winter stock. Last year bought 60-5 gal, the guy looked at me with bug eyes because he knew I was a general contractor and not a painter but it paid off, saved about $3000 on my  last two house built. (Not in US)

Their HP2000 premium eggshell is a nice paint and washes well. B Moore goes on nicely but if you wash a mark it will always show badly.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:14 | 3346787 orangegeek
orangegeek's picture

The US Dollar's ascent has stalled.  For how long?  Not long is my guess.


What pushes the US Dollar down is the Euro, Yen, CDN and GBP and who the fuck wants to own these four currencies?


A rising US Dollar is going to put extreme downward pressure on equities - USD Forex trades about $4T per day  - equities don't even come close.


Get the Orville Redenbacher - this is going to be fun to watch.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:29 | 3346856 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

P3... P3eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!


OMFG! Should I now go 800% short [I already blew my wad going 100% short 200% short & 400% short]

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:14 | 3346791 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

What is retirement anyway?  People still think they have a right to sit around and only be a consumer someday?  Look folks, that which is not sustainable, won't be sustained.  At least some of us will have the ability to survive and defend our wealth.  Fine by me, the earth needed to re-learn what "wealth" and "counterparty risk" were anyway.  Bring it.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:39 | 3346873 Fiat Burner
Fiat Burner's picture

"People still think they have a right to sit around and only be a consumer someday?"

Those who have produced more than they have consumed, i.e. lived below their means, have earned the ability to do that. Unfortunately, this group is almost extinct. 

Que the masses claiming they have a "right" to retirement regardless of their own bad choices. Que .gov proceeding to steal retirement from those who have earned it to give it to those who have not.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:51 | 3346977 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

So sorry to burst your bubble, but no one has earned the right to shit.  Look the fuck around you.  That is not how the natural world works.  Get your tribe in order and prepare.  The arrogance of man to think that they are somehow above the laws of Nature and physics is a major part of the problem.  You are indeed right about one thing however, extinction, as that which cannot be sustained, won't be and there are no 7+ billion people (and still growing) competing for a decent quality of life.  All eCONomies are really local and will become more so as all the centrally-planned bullshit continues to fail.  Nature does not guarranty shit buddy, you have to go out and fight for your survival (or your employees do) every fucking day.  I don't worry about lazy fucking "have-nots" they have been and will always be cannon fodder.  Grow a pair and look beyond the weak and worthless and go be productive.  Fucking cunts everywhere.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:44 | 3347349 Fiat Burner
Fiat Burner's picture

Its hard to understand your disdain for my comment.  Looks like it was just another opportunity for you to spew your macho-tribal-nature bullshit without pause.

There is such a thing as natural rights, but I guess you wouldn't care since that isn't defined by the "laws of physics".  There is a natual right to private property that was earned morally and the collection of it over time to fund a period of consumption without production is justified.  No shit that there is no gaurantee of that right being upheld and nothing I said assumed that there was.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:50 | 3347386 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

You make the following statement "Those who have produced more than they have consumed, i.e. lived below their means, have earned the ability to do that."

This would be true if bad businesses/corporations were allowed to fail and the rule of laws and contracts were being upheld, that is not the case and therefore it is a false statement.  As far as natural rights (enshined in the bill of rights and constitution), that is why you have the right to defend yourself, family, and property with lethal force.  The right to do this is enshined in the bill of rights.  You obilgation to do so is enshined in the constitution.

Perhaps we are on the same page and my anger is misplaced.  History is very clear on where this is all heading, prepare.  None of these paper-promises will mean shit.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:42 | 3346914 BandGap
BandGap's picture

I'm 52 and gave up thinking about retirement about a year ago.

I wonder at people still watching the ads for retirement. Nice for them.

Time to work.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:16 | 3346793 Cursive
Cursive's picture

The concept of "retirement" is a false and dangerous notion.  A product of wealthy industrialists and the banking cabal, it was born of the Industrial Age, as sort of "work after-life" that factory workers could retire to.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:27 | 3346849 johnQpublic
johnQpublic's picture

heaven on faith waned, a new religion emerged....retirement

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:16 | 3346798 magpie
magpie's picture

Quick, a politician has to demonstratively make a deposit in a bank

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:18 | 3346808 youngman
youngman's picture

There are going to be a lot of unhappy retires with only $25,000 in savings......that is one years worth of Obamacare costs......our education system is screwed up if this is what they teach......savings no..spending yes...OK ..I get it now...Democrat voters for the rest of their money man

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:30 | 3346859 Abaco
Abaco's picture

57% that don't even have $25K and only 28% don't think they have enough to retire comfortably. Better spend another trillion or two on publc school math education.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:22 | 3346823 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

If you're not in debt to jew bankers who printed your money out of thin air, pocketed the interest, & then levied a 'social tax' on all the deadbeats  ~ you're wealthy...

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:23 | 3346831 dobermangang
dobermangang's picture

I have a feeling this is all gonna end badly.  And much sooner than you think.  Got guns?

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:25 | 3346835 Tsukato
Tsukato's picture

Bwahahahaha! Am I reading things right!? You mean a massive percentage of the "ME Generation" are flat ass poor? Maybe should've spent less time hitting the bong, and fucking dirty assed bitches in the Woodstock mud! Hahaha! Eat shit bitches. Oh... And thanks for destroying a once great country. Now go fucking die.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:25 | 3346838 machineh
machineh's picture

Folks, deposit confiscation is ALREADY HERE:

The minimum Obamacare penalty/tax in 2016 will be $695 per person and up to 3-times that per family. After 2016, these amounts will increase at the rate of inflation.

Read more:

If you don't pay it voluntarily, the IRS levies your bank deposit. FDIC insurance doesn't protect you. And it's 'ALL LEGAL': John 'Sukdik' Roberts said so last year.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:32 | 3346874 CunnyFunt
CunnyFunt's picture

Yet another reason not to maintain a bank account.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:35 | 3346887 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

The government will eventually drive the entire economy underground and wonder what happened to all its precious "revenue."

Black markets FTW.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:42 | 3346915 overmedicatedun...
overmedicatedundersexed's picture

mach sense you brought the ACA, if you are in fed gov or congress you are exempt if you are a FOO, friend of obuma thousands of exemptions to unions and such. as our chief justice wrote the congress does not know a tax from a fee from a penalty, or a hole in the ground. hard to be a judge who must re write laws in contempt of the constitution, just so hard.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:47 | 3346947 riphowardkatz
riphowardkatz's picture

$696 is 2 months of my current insurance premium. That is not a tax, it is a subsidy.  

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:52 | 3346989 overmedicatedun...
overmedicatedundersexed's picture

rip, you ain't no supreme court justice. they wrote it is a tax a tax it shall be. kill em all let god sort em out

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:26 | 3346843 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

From what I can tell, the majority of that 57% are doing business in the only free market left, the "black market".  Tell me, who is the real entreprenuer in this scenario?

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:28 | 3346855 madcows
madcows's picture

Well, SHIT, I did the retirement calcs using the real inflation rate and found out that I need to save 10 Trillion in order to retire at my current lifestyle.  there's no F-ing way I can save 10 Trillion in order to retire.  So, include me in the "Ain't no way to retire" category.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:30 | 3346860 GraveyardSpiral
GraveyardSpiral's picture

Yea, 57% with the money that is CURRENTLY in these accounts....just wait until i pull all of my money out!!

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:31 | 3346864 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

I do believe that deposits are insured in the usa even higher than the written limit by the fdic. What is not insured is the value of those deposits.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:38 | 3346898 GraveyardSpiral
GraveyardSpiral's picture

Why hasn't anyone (Bueller) mentioned the plan that was already floated by our elected leaders, to restrict redemptions from "certain accounts" to ensure shared misery, er, I mean shared risk?

What was the name/premise ofthe plan?  Its not very old.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:32 | 3346870 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Just another "progressive" tax, right? They will make lots of noises about going after the rich, but we will soon realize who the rich really are and it be us!

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:35 | 3346886 Mediocritas
Mediocritas's picture

Deposit clipping won't happen in the US because (unlike the ECB) the Fed has access to the vastly superior method of theft mastered by such fine humans as Mugabe and Milosevic: inflation.

Using this wondrous tool, the Bernank can steal wealth from every dumbass with US dollars, regardless of where those dollars are in the world. Deposit clipping? Pfffff, those Europeans are a joke. /s

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:43 | 3346921 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

Yes....I so much prefer Bernanke's gradual back door deposits rather than swallowing a lump sum.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:50 | 3346969 Mediocritas
Mediocritas's picture

He could at least have the goddamn courtesy to give you a reach around.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:37 | 3346890 falak pema
falak pema's picture

doesn't this crisis beg a much bigger question :

How in Hell, in this period of Assets bubbles since 2000, has the wealth pyramid gone so skewed in first world ?

What type of governance allowed this runaway roller coaster to allow private bankstas and cronies to do this to all of us?

1% own 40 % of the accumulated wealth and 80% of all new wealth generated, which means they are more and more protected against down turn!

There is no way this is justifiable as a true mecanism of lawful wealth creation. This is private scam of huge proportions now plunging world into total debt destruction. Madoffian dystopia bigtime, by private enterprise for private enterprise. Those who created their own profits created the public debt and the mega banks bubbling all belly up...

What sort of world is this and what sort of THeft confiscation are we now talking about?

Do those who now sing protect private property really understand the issues while we stand on the brink?

If we had attacked this wealth creation in 2009 at the core, by shutting down ALL wealth tax free havens and knocking back corporate wealth skimmed off via shadow banking and corporate transfer pricing mechanisms, we would not be where we are trying to skim paltry island economies of their last deniers and scalawagging Ruskis outside all due process of law in pure presumption of guilt. EU didn't do due procces before, now its going for their nuts! Absurd but desperate last minute play.

Its the bankruptcy of law and its application accross all of first world, notably in King $ land, that has created this huge crap fest. 

Lets not be tax nazis but lets face it, this capital demise if its occurs, will affect three generations, two of whom are innocent.

This is the stuff which leads to war; hubristic disregard for due process. It needs transparency and rapid legal measures that attack the private wealth creation pyramid at the core as its unsustainable; like the collateral public debt.

But isn't that why we have wars?

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:41 | 3346909 magpie
magpie's picture

Why all of the sudden an urge to steal / create a depression

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:45 | 3346928 falak pema
falak pema's picture

we don't read the same bible or the events don't match somehow. 

Your "all of a sudden" at Zh, since 2010,  is worth a good laugh! 

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:46 | 3346943 magpie
magpie's picture

I get it, debt overhang, now we take "it" back hook and crook from somewhere. Why not lay back and let inflation accelerate a little, you know for the haircut required to sink Western living standards.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:56 | 3347023 negative rates
negative rates's picture

I think she means the cess pool has reinvigorated the irresponicibility curve which it is the most proud of. And their lovin it. 

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:00 | 3347050 falak pema
falak pema's picture

What a USD reserve currency can do "in pump to infinity under $ hegemony", the good ole 17 nation euro, split in two paradigms, north and south, and with mega indebted banks and no liquid surpluses to boot, cannot afford to do. 

I think ZH finance university has taught us that since 2010! 

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:03 | 3347069 magpie
magpie's picture

Ok, that was clear beforehand. So this kind of compensation / tax will obviously be continued everywhere else in the EZ.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:54 | 3347002 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Moron, we never left the depression.  There is no "creating" about it.  There is 7+ billion people competing for the same resources and a decent quality of life, they will do so in the most "free" market they can find.  If it isn't in the western world or the "official" market, so be it. 

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:58 | 3347017 magpie
magpie's picture

Of course, then the quadruple dip depression - somebody is trying hard for extra deflation after/during the extra printing, that's all. Shift in perception going on somewhere, just trying to trace it. btw the EU has now a current account deficit i believe.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:59 | 3347041 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Semantics means nothing.  So long as there are 7+ billion people competing for the same resources I have no doubt that there will be plenty of markets to do business in. 

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:01 | 3347059 magpie
magpie's picture

There is something going on, we know the EZ beforehand had some austerity/ze price stability/hard money haha bias compared to the other fiat corporations. So this follows that trend or are they frontrunning something else.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:39 | 3346903 gmak
gmak's picture

What are the numbers if pensions are included, or 401Ks or IRAs etc - anything that the gov has a backdoor into.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:41 | 3346911 IamtheREALmario
IamtheREALmario's picture

We see in Europe the fate of the US states. The EU and IMF loan money to the individual countries to make them hopelessly indebted to the uber-gubbermint. Then, when the states cannot pay back the debt, the uber-gubbermint claims to own decision making power over the states... and use the federally controlled court system and military to enforce their demands.

The irony is that it cost the uber-government NOTHING to create the fiat used to indebt the states. It cost the people nothing, other than an illusion of a future requirement to repay something that is mathematiclaly impossible to repay. The control does not really exist, other than through the belief of the states or the EU countries that they are enslaved to the supply of fiat provided by the uber-government.

It is all a mirage within a sham, within a trick of perception. And all it takes to pull off the con is for the uber-gubbermint to bribe and enlist a few cronies within the state or country government. Traitors to the people have always been useful to parasitic elitist criminals.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:41 | 3346912 sunnyside
sunnyside's picture

As Washington tightens and tightens, the black markets is where commerce will go.  We see this already in other countries and I am seeing more and more of it in the US.  Whereas it used to be the hairdresser and the plumber working for cash and all of them only reporting $23K per year while making $75K, more and more other small business owners are going down that route.  Many people who would otherwise be "good citizens" and pay their required share, are saying fuck it and fuck them.  This isn't some great secret, hence the need to eliminate cash and have traceable electronic currency (as well as outlaw barter).


Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:43 | 3346919 magpie
magpie's picture

economic activity will still go to zero

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:56 | 3347025 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

"economic activity will still go to zero"  -  LMFAO!!!!   Only if 7+ billion people are going to "disappear".  Fucking moron, the eCONomic activity will simply find another market.  People still need to survive and if you don't think that there is always a demand/market for things like food/fuel/security, you are indeed a fool.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:43 | 3346925 BurningFuld
BurningFuld's picture

Wait a minute! 25 Billion in the FDIC account...Ben is fucking printing 85 BILLION a month and some idiot comes out and actually says.(OUT LOUD). "We have 25 Billion in the FDIC account"  Does that not just sound a tiny bit stupid to anyone here? It would appear to me..and this is just me mind you....that....the plebs...meaning you and I don't rate very high on the Governments list of things to protect.

25 Billion for you....One TRILLION for me....25 Billion for you...One TRILLION for get the picture...I hope!


Tue, 03/19/2013 - 12:52 | 3347855 Alpha Monkey
Alpha Monkey's picture

Most people dont grasp the scope of fed intervention in banks.  They hear numbers in the --illions, and all sense of reality is lost. 

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:45 | 3346929 rustymason
rustymason's picture

Impact. Impact, Impact. It's "affect," moron.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:22 | 3347187 Winston of Oceania
Winston of Oceania's picture

Wrong, in both instances above the word is used as a noun and as such E F F E C T is the correct word. A F F E C T is a verb as in "that cheap laced dope you smoke will affect you brain". Simple huh?

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:51 | 3346987 BurningFuld
BurningFuld's picture

effect? Do we want to act on it or bring it about?

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:56 | 3347005 IamtheREALmario
IamtheREALmario's picture

A secondary effect of the little ruse with Cyprus is that it may move people to spend the money instead of save it in a bank. This is a critical aspect of creating hyper-inflation ... and blaming it on the people. The low interest rate paid on savings accounts apparently is not sufficient incentive to get people to part with the cash. Banks don't need people's savings. They can borrow all they want from the Fed at virtually no cost.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:39 | 3347299 the grateful un...
the grateful unemployed's picture

if everyone in the US were forced to spend half their savings that would be deflationary i think. retailers and services vendors would be competing for those dollars, and once that money is spent its a long cold winter. there is really too much of everything available, if you match up buyers and sellers the game of musical chairs is played on the sellers side.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 12:16 | 3347561 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

"too much of everything available" -  LMFAO!!!  Yeah, right, it is getting easier for those 7+ billion (and growing) to compete for the available resources on the planet.  Must be our "lying eyes" then.  Fucking halarious.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:56 | 3347016 shutdown
shutdown's picture

Revolution now!

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 10:57 | 3347033 IamtheREALmario
IamtheREALmario's picture

That is what they want. They want to create a situation where we all kill ourselves and damn our souls in the process.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:03 | 3347066 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Correct, the last thing they want are intelligent and innovative individuals working together empowering their own communities etc.  Think about it.  what does an organic farmer provide of real value?  What does a banker provide of real value?  What is the relative compensation for the two professions?  That which is not sustainable, will not be sustained, period. 

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:05 | 3347076 McMolotov
Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:34 | 3347268 Hongcha
Hongcha's picture

One word gentlemen:  Cannabis.

It is a wonder herb.  I am 52 and broke a 35-year-old heavy social drinking habit when I started sparking up again. 

These days I buy the chocolates.  I dose up 1-2 times a month.  I am reguarly told I look at least ten years younger than my stated age.

From a recreational perspective alone, setting aside the other benefits, I spend $5 on a clean, discrete high with a minimal mental hangover the next day.  I used to spend $60-100 on drinks to achieve a far more rank and corrosive state of mind. 

A word of warning for you curmudgeons - once you break out of the alcohol/caffeine/nicotine nexus, you can't go back again.  You will eschew bars for bookstores and walks in the park.  For a wound-up pessimist like me this was a game-changer.

I personally am convinced the herb works on a spiritual, mental and physical level.  No PFE meds here.

One of the good things happening in California.


Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:53 | 3347399 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Indeed, I certainly hope they can tax it to pay for all the other stupid shit going on, becuase the other states sure as hell aren't going to pay for there fucking largesse.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 15:07 | 3348856 IrritableBowels
IrritableBowels's picture

Wait until you try the fungus.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:51 | 3347392 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Regarding pensions, the biggest factor by far, bigger than the demographics, is ZIRP.  Just model a pension in a spreadsheet.  It's obvious.

But you'll continue to hear that the problem is demographics.  Why?  Living too long is YOUR fault, while ZIRP is the Fed's fault.

Go ahead and use surreptitious means to shorten Granny's life.  It won't solve the problem.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 11:53 | 3347402 syntaxterror
syntaxterror's picture

If you count the home garages and storage units full of useless shit, Americans are the wealthiest on earth, by far. Surely, the Central Planning Elite will conjure up a scheme to fix this issue.

Tue, 03/19/2013 - 12:04 | 3347464 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Yes.  A tax on hoarders.  That shit has value.

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