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Ron Paul: "The Great Cyprus Bank Robbery"

Tyler Durden's picture




 

By Ron Paul

The Great Cyprus Bank Robbery

The dramatic recent events in Cyprus have highlighted the fundamental weakness in the European banking system and the extreme fragility of fractional reserve banking. Cypriot banks invested heavily in Greek sovereign debt, and last summer's Greek debt restructuring resulted in losses equivalent to more than 25 percent of Cyprus' GDP. These banks then took their bad investments to the government, demanding a bailout from an already beleaguered Cypriot treasury. The government of Cyprus then turned to the European Union (EU) for a bailout.

The terms insisted upon by the troika (European Commission, European Central Bank, International Monetary Fund) before funding the bailout were nothing short of highway robbery. While bank depositors have traditionally been protected in the event of bankruptcy or liquidation, the troika insisted that all bank depositors pay a tax of between 6.75 and 10 percent of their total deposits to help fund the bailout.

While one can sympathize with EU taxpayers not wanting to fund yet another bailout of a poorly-managed banking system, forcing the Cypriot people to pay for the foolish risks taken by their government and bankers is also criminal. In their desire to punish a “tax haven” catering supposedly to Russian oligarchs, the EU elites ensured that ordinary citizens would suffer just as much as foreign depositors. Imagine the reaction if in September 2008, the US government had financed its $700 billion bank bailout by directly looting American taxpayers' bank accounts!

While the Cypriot parliament rejected that first proposal, they will have no say in the final proposal delivered by the EU and IMF: deposits over 100,000 euros are likely to see losses of at least 40 percent and possibly as much as 80 percent. “Temporary” capital controls that were supposed to last for days will now last at least a month and might remain in effect for years.

Especially affected have been the elderly, who were unable to use ATMs or to transfer money electronically. Despite the fact that ATMs severely limited the size of withdrawals during the two week-long bank closure, reports indicated that account holders who had access to Cypriot bank branches in London and Athens were able to withdraw most of their funds, leading to speculation that there would be no money available when banks finally opened up again. In other words, the supposed Russian oligarch money may well be already gone.

Remember that under a fractional reserve banking system only a small percentage of deposits is kept on hand for dispersal to depositors. The rest of the money is loaned out. Not only are many of the loans made by these banks going bad, but the reserve requirement in Euro-system countries is only one percent! If just one euro out of every hundred is withdrawn from banks, the bank reserves would be completely exhausted and the whole system would collapse. Is it any wonder, then, that the EU fears a major bank run and has shipped billions of euros to Cyprus?

The elites in the EU and IMF failed to learn their lesson from the popular backlash to these tax proposals, and have openly talked about using Cyprus as a template for future bank bailouts. This raises the prospect of raids on bank accounts, pension funds, and any investments the government can get its hands on. In other words, no one's money is safe in any financial institution in Europe. Bank runs are now a certainty in future crises, as the people realize that they do not really own the money in their accounts. How long before bureaucrat and banker try that here?

Unfortunately, all of this is the predictable result of a fiat paper money system combined with fractional reserve banking. When governments and banks collude to monopolize the monetary system so that they can create money out of thin air, the result is a business cycle that wreaks havoc on the economy. Pyramiding more and more loans on top of a tiny base of money will create an economic house of cards just waiting to collapse. The situation in Cyprus should be both a lesson and a warning to the United States. We need to end the Federal Reserve, stay away from propping up the euro, and return to a sound monetary system.

 

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Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:32 | 3399707 ihedgemyhedges
ihedgemyhedges's picture

End the Fed? Good luck with that Dr. Paul.....

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:43 | 3399756 DJ Happy Ending
DJ Happy Ending's picture

"Bank runs are now a certainty in future crises"

There hasn't been a single bank run yet, how is this a certainty? After watching Cypriots and PIIGSeons sit idly by through this event, it makes me wonder what it would take.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:48 | 3399772 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

No bank runs yet, huh?  I guess a whole lot of people with faith in their overlords are going to go down with the ship.  One way or another, that account they worked for their whole lives is going to become worthless.  Probably through both theft and hyperinflation at the same time.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:04 | 3399830 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Ron Paul's article above is the BEST short piece I have yet read summarizing what happened in Cyprus and what the fallout may be.

 

Bravo, Tylers, for bringing us this piece!

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:26 | 3399891 BaBaBouy
BaBaBouy's picture

"STUPID SALE"  ...

 

... On Right Now

In GOLD And SILVER ...

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:31 | 3399924 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture

Look at Silver continue to dive in real time:  

http://www.pmbull.com/silver-price/

The premiums on the physical remain cheap too. I feel like an idiot having pumped it awhile back now.

Then again, now that I think about it, whenever I feel like an idiot and want to go hide, that is the time to buy. 

Gold doing the exact same thing.  Watch it pop hard and fast:

http://www.pmbull.com/gold-price/

How do I know they will pop?  Cuz I don't have funds to get my order in for 2 or 3 days.  

 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:49 | 3399979 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

AllThatGlitters

Hear ya.  80% of the time I buy gold, the price drops markedly within 1 - 3 days following.  I should sell my planned purchase dates so everyone can take the other side of the trade...

But, I will just continue to buy gold as money comes in.  Even at $1535, $1235...  Because NONE of our financial problems have been solved.  Not even addressed!

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:12 | 3400073 caconhma
caconhma's picture

People IQ are not very high after all. The money was stolen/Corzined from their accounts (both here in America and in Cyprus) and they still entrust their money with thieves and robbers. Incredible!

PS

After all, who needs gold? Let these blood-thirsty banks have it all. We, the people, prefer to have funny money...

 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:16 | 3400085 aerojet
aerojet's picture

You have no choice but to entrust savings with thieves and robbers--it's not like there is some alternative.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:50 | 3400161 TwoShortPlanks
TwoShortPlanks's picture

Ding Ding Ding Ding Ding...Jackpot!
http://kingworldnews.com/kingworldnews/KWN_DailyWeb/Entries/2013/4/1_Sin...
Enjoy.

Pump those markets Ben (Bilge Pump that is). Eurozone can't do that so they confiscate.

TSP predicted earlier: $134k/oz....we'll see....

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 14:06 | 3400287 Pegasus Muse
Pegasus Muse's picture

After all what's a mere Quadrillion (1000 Trillion) dollars of derivative exposure (notional) between friends?

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 17:52 | 3401091 redpill
redpill's picture

In a way I guess it's a good thing Ron Paul didn't become president because he would have been shot by now.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 18:56 | 3401210 Slack Jack
Slack Jack's picture

The EU gives the Cypriot system 10,000 per citizen yet Tyler tells us that the EU is stealing from Cyprus.

TYLER IS A TOTAL MORON.

So what does Tyler mean when he implies/says the EU is stealing Cypriot money?

He means the Cypriot banks have stolen the money, right?

If a bank invests your money and loses it, then is that theft?

 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 19:01 | 3401257 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

did you not read the article? how can somebody be this fucking dumb and ask these questions? Just run head first full sprint ito a concrete wall and spare us all. Your not worth an explanation.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 19:50 | 3401373 Slack Jack
Slack Jack's picture

The moron silverserfer has no answer to the questions.

Pity you don't have the intelligence to answer the questions.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 18:39 | 3401203 Vagabond
Vagabond's picture

Listen up ZH, we need to get our facts straight.

Deposits in the U.K. and Russian subsidiaries are separate from the Cyprus banks. Depositors in those countries were able to withdraw money on deposit in the U.K. or Russia. But they were not allowed to move money from Cyprus to the U.K. or Russia. It would be like if you had money in a Citibank subsidiary in Brazil and Brazil imposed capital controls. You wouldn’t be able to take money out of your Citi Brazil account, but your account in New York would not be impacted. So while reports may have indicated this happened… it didn’t.  None-the-less I completely agree that fiat currencies and fractional-reserve-banking are the culprit and must be eliminated.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 17:14 | 3400970 CH1
CH1's picture

You have no choice but to entrust savings with thieves and robbers--it's not like there is some alternative.

Of COURSE there are alternatives - have been for a long time.

People just don't have the guts to use them.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:24 | 3400116 Dr Paul Krugman
Dr Paul Krugman's picture

People who bought silver are getting what they deserved, too.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:37 | 3400163 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture

Keep gloating.  What you deserve is coming. Sooner than you think.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:43 | 3400184 Dr Paul Krugman
Dr Paul Krugman's picture

When I have pointed out time and time again that holding gold and silver in bullion form is nothing but putting a dead weight on economic activity, and that it is not a wise way to speculate, it is gloating?  I beg to differ.  I am merely showing what a proper way to invest is; financially and economically one should put money towards investments that grow - this helps oneself and one's economy.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:45 | 3400205 resurger
resurger's picture

Oh, you jest?

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:54 | 3400240 Dr Paul Krugman
Dr Paul Krugman's picture

There are so many things wrong with this thoughtless band of right wing fanatics I can't count them on my feet and hands.  Obamacare is going to bankrupt the U.S., we can't finance the deficit, we must go back to the gold standard!  All of this is wrong, and has been disproven time and time again by lengthy research at the top level Universities across the globe.  So while you to sit in your armchair and get emotional others are using time tested and true theories that win awards and rescue nations.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 14:12 | 3400303 Colonel Jessup
Colonel Jessup's picture

Dr. Krugman - Let me say that I relish the opportunity to communicate - by communicate I mean express my disgust for you and your poilicies - directly. And so in that vein, let me say that I do hope that this is really you.

You and your fiat pumping pals have destroyed nearly every economny on the planet via your fractional reserve banking ponzi scheme ( it's OK and works great as long as nobody actually wants access to their physical currency). And the only reason that the game has gone on for so long is that people never could quite catch on - oh, that, and Legal Tender laws that prevent people from refusing to accept your paper for goods and services. But people are catching on now - and that must make you nervous.

To your comments about rescuing nations - you mean like Argentina? Where the IMF demanded that they privatize their infrastructure ( like water supplies ) by selling them to crony firms to raise capital to pay back IMF loans - and then those companies then recover their "investment" by raising the prices for said basic services provided thru the infrastructure by 500%+. This is how to destroy nations, not save them. But I'm sure, deep down, you know that.

You sir, and your ilk, are not economists - you are nothing more than two-bit con men who have been found out for what you are.

Oh - and I thought folks would find this photo of you - and the only pussy you've ever had or are likely to ever get - amusing.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 18:31 | 3401189 MillionDollarBogus_
MillionDollarBogus_'s picture

I am Dr. Paul Krugman....

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 18:48 | 3401219 SilverIsKing
SilverIsKing's picture

A definite similarity.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 14:23 | 3400353 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

Oh, so this is satire. Thanks.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 17:42 | 3401058 CH1
CH1's picture

That's a relief, isn't it? :)

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 15:23 | 3400561 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

LOL and greens Krug-girl!

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 15:36 | 3400610 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

"others are using time tested and true theories that win awards and rescue nations."  - LMFAO!! A troll of trolls.  The real Krugman wouldn't recognize a safe store of value if it hit him on the head.   Still waiting for him to print up some more oil.  Halarious, no energy, no eCONomy, period, print all you want.  At least this troll admitted it was really a CONfindence game and nothing more.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 17:37 | 3401047 just a dude
just a dude's picture

DPK = MDB in disguise?

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 17:48 | 3401084 auric1234
auric1234's picture

Maybe the opposite

 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 14:00 | 3400271 Chuck Walla
Chuck Walla's picture

Krugie means City of Stockton Munis. Safe, Sure!

 

FORWARD SOVIET!

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:48 | 3400219 Plata con Carne
Plata con Carne's picture

In 1998 you said By the year 2005 the internet will have done no more for the economy than the fax machine. Idiot.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 14:38 | 3400402 denverdolomte
denverdolomte's picture

Dr. Krugman, I'd relish this opportunity to ask you a question regarding explaination of your economic beliefs. What algorithm is being used currently to avoid austerity of the markets and TBTF's, that will contain a shift in the near future to reclaim all this exposed debt wagered through QE's and Bailouts, as no matter how I have mathematically figured there is ZERO chance of paying back said debts.....as debt is paid through GDP growth and interest, growth comes via consumption, consumption of resources, and resources are not infinite......infinite growth is thus impossibile, so back to the same point, how do we unwind trillions in debt with zero interest rates and a GDP that by the laws of physics will not grow bigger than it already is?

 

For 5 years we have watched this add more to the pot theorems with the same results, really austerity is that bad? Allow say 1 year for market correction, tough times for society during this phase, 1 year more for the rebuild. (hypothetically) OR why doesn't your think tank agree on debt forgiveness if money consumption is your largest goal?

 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 17:32 | 3401025 just a dude
just a dude's picture

Dr. PK, you are viewing purchase of precious metals as speculating/investing (as an aside, I admire your honesty in equating the two).  I grant you that there are at least some precious metals purchasers buying them for exactly that.  Then there are others, like myself, who purchase and stack, but do not trade them or otherwise speculate in them.  So, your argument is either ignorant or disingenuous.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:43 | 3400195 resurger
resurger's picture

I have sent you a silver .408 for free.

It's okay no need to thank me. 

 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 20:40 | 3401498 DaddyO
DaddyO's picture

As in CheyTac?

DaddyO

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 17:01 | 3400937 thisandthat
thisandthat's picture

Mr. Krug Man sir, nice seeing you! Btw, not tot waste your time, but being a (wise and knowledgeable, obviously, duh) Jew(ish!) e-conomist, you're probably just the right person to enlighten us about this, which I'm sure you're familiar with, but I wonder if any of those genius ECB Haircut Cowboys ever heard about a certain Samson (you know, that Samson)?

For the ignoramus gentiles, story goes way-too-cool dude got one major haircut (and I mean, one of biblical proportions, you could definitely say!), again, for being way too reckless and overconfident for his own good (rings a bell?). The aftermath of said epic shaving, though, should maybe come as a warning to anyone hell bent on trendsetting it (probable sole reason it was ever put in writing, btw).

So, I don't know (yep, gentile, here...), but shouldn't those ECB folks better apply for Sunday/Saturday/Friday/whatever school, before going all Dalilah on each and any rogue "peasant" they run into (you know, just in case they ever cross the wrong one)...?

What's your take on this - is it the kosher thing to do. or is biblical wrath under way on them, oh Wise One?

Shalom!

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 17:43 | 3401064 just a dude
just a dude's picture

DPK, my average acquisition cost (including premiums) for silver is $18/ounce.  I did most of the acquiring in 2009.  At this point, given the expansion of the monetary base during the ensuing 4 years, a +51.44% return (on paper) is FAR LESS than I deserve, were I a trader of silver, which I am not.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 17:50 | 3401066 thisandthat
thisandthat's picture

You mean, silver?

At least they got what they purchased, not tungsten, like some IMF customers...

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 17:45 | 3401073 auric1234
auric1234's picture

You seem to think people bought silver in order to sell it later for a higher FIAT price? Poor misguided one...

I'll be buying again this month. Thanks for the discount, IDIOTS

 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 18:18 | 3401135 Mine Is Bigger
Mine Is Bigger's picture

I am enjoying massive gains on my silver purchases. (At least, the ones I bought several years back.)  I have been buying PMs for the long term.  I still have the same ounces as yesterday.  So, I don't let these price fluctuations bother me.

Hopefully, we'll see who is right soon enough.  In the meantime, plese keep us entertained.  Thanks!

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 19:04 | 3401264 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

you buy vagisil beacuse you get what you deserve as well troll.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 19:29 | 3401336 moonstears
moonstears's picture

"It is easy to imagine a broad public demand that those who have been lucky enough to find gold be required to share a significant fraction of their winnings with those who have not."

-- Paul Krugman, The Washington Monthly, October 1995

Look what the actual shitbag you claim to be said, in 1995. Interesting commie thought, interesting choice of words, huh?

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 14:03 | 3400092 Strider52
Strider52's picture

Methinks the boat sails tomorrow, after the price of silver drops just a bit more...

Alert the crew, mate! We sail at sunrise!

Update: the ship actually sailed moments ago. I couldn't resist...

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 18:45 | 3401217 cornedmutton
cornedmutton's picture

Remember, price and value are not the same thing.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 19:28 | 3401338 jvetter713
jvetter713's picture

Premiums cheap?  Umm...I don'y know where you get yours but 25%+ is not cheap.

Wed, 04/03/2013 - 00:28 | 3402060 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture

What the heck are you talking about?  Where do you get 25% premiums?

 

 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:33 | 3399931 Peter Pan
Peter Pan's picture

You bet there is a stupid sale on. It really makes you wonder when the Wal Mart style of consumer crush will come to gold and silver.

Patience though and all will be revealed......including how much gold China has been accumulating during such smackdowns.

Why else do you think China keeps her mouth shut?

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:24 | 3399892 The Juggernaut
The Juggernaut's picture

Viva il Ron Paul!!!

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:59 | 3400023 Stock Tips Inve...
Stock Tips Investment's picture

Very good explanation of what is happening in Cyprus. I think the crisis in Europe is going to go country by country triggering. The strategy of the Fed, ECB, BOJ and China, seems to be to minimize losses in Europe. This means that Europe grows up "zero percent" over the next decade. That would give time to the U.S. to solve their problems, strengthen the growth of China and many emerging countries. Finally, allow Japan to have some growth. Will they succeed?

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 16:40 | 3400859 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

Ron Paul is truly a gentleman, a great one

The only thing I have to complain about is not his fault, it's just a... lens

The lens of "the EU is something like the US"

Example: he writes about "the european banking system" while we still have each it's national one - which is again a word that might get misunderstood, so I should write Each Country has A Banking System. And an Army. And sometimes a Navy and Airforce or a Crown. And a Tax System. And often an own language, culture, etc...

Nevertheless we often shared... systems. Like a currency, or a Legal System. Or a Measurement System. Or Churches and Moral Systems, up to the shared agreement on what Sovereignty is and isn't.

noboby and nothing pushes so much european super-state-integration so much as those American Expectations

it's not a conscious effort, it's just... A Lens

Wed, 04/03/2013 - 02:43 | 3402213 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

good video about the "F9 Monkeys" and the "salesmen", thanks

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:31 | 3399920 Professorlocknload
Professorlocknload's picture

Bearing, you can catch 'em all here. I subscribe.

http://www.ronpaul.com/

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 14:29 | 3400380 Crash N. Burn
Crash N. Burn's picture

 Piece only goes so far. He should have mentioned:

 

"U.S. Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation and the UK Bank of England jointly release a “position paper” titled Resolving Globally Active, Systemically Important, Financial Institutions.

…[Item 19] The introduction of a statutory bail-in resolution tool (the power to write down or convert into equity the liabilities of a failing firm)…"

US already has:

 

"…Title II [of the Dodd-Frank Act] requires that the losses of any financial company placed into receivership will not be borne by taxpayers, but by common and preferred stockholders, debt holders, and other unsecured creditors…"

 

Lets not forget the idiotic Canadian government actually put bail-in in the official budget - not that Canadians have noticed. Scan your governments budget for "bail-in" (in your language), you may be surprised.

Cyprus Steal: The West’s Premeditated Bank-Robbery 

 

 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 20:18 | 3401451 Radical Marijuana
Radical Marijuana's picture

Yeah, I agree, DoChenRollingBearing, that Ron Paul presents excellent analysis of these problems. I would also agree that he has done more than anyone else that I am aware of to awaken more people about these issues. BUT, I continue to regard his "solutions" as silly, and superficial, because those "solutions" are embedded inside of the impossible ideals of Libertarianism, and thus, based on false fundamental dichotomies.

Of course, more than 99% of the people do not want to understand the deeper realities that money is backed by murder, and that "Ending the Fed" cannot be actually accomplished without paradigm shifts in militarism, since the murder systems would have to be changed along with the money systems, in order to actually work. Since the debt controls depend on the death controls, and the already established systems are the result of the runaway triumph of the methods of organized crime taking control of the government, no "solutions" which adhere to the old-fashioned false fundamental dichotomies, and their related impossible ideals, are something which could theoretically work.

(Not to say my theories are actually any better, since the realities appear to most probably be more genocidal wars, along with democidal martial law, rather than any other better kinds of death controls instead. But still, the fact that money is backed by murder requires that the theory of changing the monetary system admit and address that central reality.)

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 22:43 | 3401791 Buck Johnson
Buck Johnson's picture

I know, and when that day comes and EVERYONE HEAVES.  There won't be enough money to control the masses and there won't be enough. 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:50 | 3399777 bank guy in Brussels
bank guy in Brussels's picture

Not clear that electronic bank runs are not taking place in the Mediterranean GIIPS countries

The significant bank runs would not be people in the streets (with small savings, insured) but big depositors with accounts over € 100,000 ...

And it seems the ECB is 'delaying' reporting some current money flow statistics ... hundreds of billions could be leaving Spain and Italy and we might not be told for a while

---

In 43 years, 147 banking crises around the world, and even including ridiculous banana republics and tinpot dictatorships, it seems it is only in Cyprus that they actively stole depositor money.

In some cases (as in Iceland) depositors did lose money on bigger, uninsured deposits because banks went bust ... but that seems quite different from stealing the depositor money to pay off some big creditors - like the European Central Bank - which yet continue to grab Cypriot funds.

Why did the EU-ECB-IMF steal the depositor money, when even internal troika memos said this could set off disastrous euro contagion?

Four theories are out there:

(1) It is a scheme to frighten depositors around the world into spending or investing their uninsured deposits. This is supported by the sudden near-simultaneous 'leaks' of possible deposit confiscations in New Zealand, Canada, Switzerland, the US and UK.

(2) It is a desperate last-ditch scheme to prop up the petro-dollar, i.e., the US dollar as reserve currency, which is at death's door as the BRICS and half the world join bi-lateral trade agreements by-passing the dollar. As IMF chief Lagarde (worked for big American law firm) and Angela Merkel (husband works for US Pentagon companies) are both American agents, they pushed this scheme onto the EU, not caring about damage to Europe. France was so angry at this they sent police to raid Lagarde's apartment

(3) The EU 'project' of a grand united Europe is collapsing, so the final EU 'Hail Mary' play is to catastrophically destroy the EU banking system by creating pan-European bank runs, such a huge 'crisis' they hope this will finally lead to the 'United States of Europe' against all popular wishes.

(4) The Germans, Dutch and other North Europeans are so anally-obsessive about limiting their own taxpayer losses they idiotically blind themselves to the destruction of Europe they are causing

« In 147 banking crises since 1970 tracked by the IMF, no depositors, irrespective of the amounts held and the banks with whom the deposits were placed, suffered losses. The Cyprus measures derogates from the general principal of protecting depositors. »

http://www.prudentbear.com/2013/04/the-cyprus-file.html#.UVrW3PMhESU

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:08 | 3399845 jal
jal's picture

"People are coming to the realization that deposits in their local bank are not 'safe' places to put their spare cash, but are in fact loans to extremely leveraged businesses."


Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:15 | 3399866 DJ Happy Ending
DJ Happy Ending's picture

If that's true they have a funny way of showing it. Where are the bank runs by ordinary depositors?

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:56 | 3399986 Professorlocknload
Professorlocknload's picture

Banks and Mutual Funds are all they know at this point. That and non investment RE, where most got clipped. Ask one if he thinks it would be a good idea to lighten up in bank deposits and he will instantly respond "and put it where?"

Possibly the Mutual Fund crowd (especially MM funds) are next up for a shear, beginning when they break the buck. That's most likely going to run the average Joe deeper into FDIC land.

The buzz in the boutique bars these days is "Dividend Paying Stocks" are the place to be.

Personally, a Treasury Direct account, linked through a bank account for transaction purposes to PM dealers might seem more prudent. Then, after this mini RE pump job fades, some income producing property maybe, cap rates confirming.

 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 20:20 | 3401449 Slack Jack
Slack Jack's picture

"It is a desperate last-ditch scheme to prop up the petro-dollar, i.e., the US dollar as reserve currency, which is at death's door as the BRICS and half the world join bi-lateral trade agreements by-passing the dollar. As IMF chief Lagarde (worked for big American law firm) and Angela Merkel (husband works for US Pentagon companies) are both American agents, they pushed this scheme onto the EU, not caring about damage to Europe. France was so angry at this they sent police to raid Lagarde's apartment..."

"Angela Merkel (husband works for US Pentagon companies) are both American agents..."

Merkel is a Jew; both her married name Merkel and her maiden name Kasner are German Jew names.

Merkel is also (most probably) a communist.

So does Merkel work for the Jews (United States) or communists, or ... ?

I think she works for the Jews (United States) and what you say is correct.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:58 | 3400018 Creepy Lurker
Creepy Lurker's picture

The smart ones are taking their money out now, quietly, while the morons are still watching Dancing With The Stars.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:19 | 3400098 Strider52
Strider52's picture

Well, you sure ain't been watching me lately.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 19:08 | 3401276 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

you can't have a bank run when there is capital control in place. You are held hostage at financial gunpoint. pull your head out DJ  

Wed, 04/03/2013 - 04:18 | 3402268 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Every check I receive, I cash and "deposit" it into 1st bank of posturepedic.  Multiply my doings by thousands of other people, and the source of the munny velocity slowdown becomes apparent...

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:17 | 3399865 newworldorder
newworldorder's picture

RE: bank guy in Brussels,

Interesting theories all 4. You seem to have your pulse  on the European monetary system. Keep reporting back to us as you see things unfolding.

My conlusion is that in Europe, UK and US, preservation of the debt based monetary systems is paramount. Everything will be sacrificed to make this happen. For European Sovereign populations, it may come down to maintaing their country sovereingty vs becoming EU economic slaves. Or putting it another way; Maintaining the Euro/Petro Dollar system vs throwing off the International Bankster created debt money ponzi, and gaining their individual sovereignty.

Any bets on how this will go down?

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 16:56 | 3400912 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

just a detail: wasn't Cyprus able to bring a good proof about how sovereign it is? For criminy, if Cyprus was an EU puppet, the first IMF proposal would have been enacted last year, with less damage, less fuss, NO treathining of sacrosanct Under100k accounts and perhaps less than two articles in ZH

economic slaves? how does this apply to Cyprus? By the "we won't send you further 10bn" writ? Cypriots got cool 10'000 per man, woman and child to fix their banking system, remember?

And the sovereign people of Cyprus just elected the president that produced this wonderful PR campaign

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 16:58 | 3400919 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

The Dollar is still the linchpin - and the Euro is clearly not "Petro"

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 18:02 | 3401112 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

the dollar is funding INTERNAL growth...it is not a "trading currency"...the exact opposite of the euro which was used to finance a MASSIVE expansion of internal trade within the Eurozone...but not to finance "risk." (Wall Street.) BIG difference. the Greenback has a rather odd "multitude of backings...yet no backing at all" whereas the Euro "suffers" from the fact that "i can see the numbers literally flowing across the borders." (or not.) a trade currency however requires ENORMOUS discipline...obviously we can all see now it is excessive...as "it has to choose a winner" and everyone else must be prepared to suffer "in its stead." the greenback is all about the means of production "with the backing of 2 World Wars to show the potential"...but nothing more? the euro requires TRUE faith that "around the next corner Val Halla awaits." Right now it looks like "Val Hella" so how these things "breakdown" is as important as "their reason for being in the first place." it would be nice if this were "merely" a philosophical argument ("just print more and buy all the debt with it.") but it is not. you have all sorts of EU "mechanisms" that have been created in order to keep goods flowing. "the USA already has the interstate highway system." in the EU that capital flowing across borders...in my opinion...IS the trade flow...and should the flow of goods cease ("we will deploy the German Army to make sure this happens") then obviously the various "internal mechanisms" are at risk. of course you want to own gold or silver "purchased in euro's." but there is a point as well where "you have to own dollar denominated assets...AND THE DOLLAR ITSELF" because indeed...it may take the military to keep those borders open. STAY TUNED ON THIS ONE!

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:27 | 3399912 ekm
ekm's picture

One word:

PANIC.

 

They have no clue what to do next and I think there's no human being on earth who would have any clue what to do next.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:34 | 3399933 little buddy bu...
little buddy buys the dips's picture

clue:

 

LYNCH A BANKER AND/OR POLITICIAN.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:44 | 3400194 oddjob
oddjob's picture

You would think that. Classic defeatism.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:24 | 3400111 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

I think there is a fifth option Bank guy.

Northern Europe is cutting the PIIGS loose, and are setting it up for them to leave.

They are not getting the message and keeping coming back for more

like an abused spouse.

 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 14:56 | 3400457 StandardDeviant
StandardDeviant's picture

Not sure it has to be that complicated.  How about...

4a) German elections are coming up.  Bailing out dodgy Russian depositors* is not likely to be a winning strategy.

 

* Obviously that's not quite the whole story.  But that's how Merkel's opponents will surely paint it.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 18:58 | 3401250 The Heart
The Heart's picture

Thank you for your good works BGIB.

Bless.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 20:19 | 3401453 jekyll island
jekyll island's picture

Channeling my inner MDB, I think this is a warning message from LaGarde to all to get your money out and buy gold. The troika actually has your best interests in mind. You were warned....

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 20:31 | 3401478 Radical Marijuana
Radical Marijuana's picture

Thanks for the link backing that up, bank guy in Brussels! 

"... only in Cyprus that they actively stole depositor money ..."

That confirms my comment in this previous article today:

http://www.zerohedge.com/contributed/2013-04-02/one-irelands-biggest-banks-busted-fudging-books-nah-busted-concealing-debt-na

"if Cyprus is the new template, than [sic] depositor funded recaps ... are inevitable!"

In several of my comments before I have been repeating the degree to which these kinds of unprecedented events are FLABBERGASTING!

When a series of events happen that look like they have never happened before, it gets almost impossible to predict what will happen next!

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:50 | 3399778 HoofHearted
HoofHearted's picture

And we had the choice of Mittens or the Bamster.

Is there any question that we do not have a republic? Don't blame me. I voted for Kodos. (Actually, Gary Johnson, but Ron Paul was my first choice.)

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:54 | 3399804 yrbmegr
yrbmegr's picture

Predicting that there will be bank runs some time in the future is pretty safe.  Like predicting there will be rain some time in the future.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:10 | 3399852 Roger O. Thornhill
Roger O. Thornhill's picture

There already was a bank run - the bigger player took their assets and ran. Do you think they left them in the bank to take 80% losses?

The smaller players wanted to run but they closed the banks on them! And implemented capital controls.

No bank run... right.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:16 | 3399871 Blue Vervain
Blue Vervain's picture

<QUOTE>There hasn't been a single bank run yet, how is this a certainty?</QUOTE>

 

Remember Northern Rock in the UK - forced nationalisation was necessary after mass withdrawals and endless queues at branches. Further nationalisations followed.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:21 | 3399885 Abiotic Oil
Abiotic Oil's picture

"There hasn't been a single bank run yet, how is this a certainty? "

Cyprus does fluoridate their water supply.  They just upped the dosage a few days prior to the announcement to encourage the docility you are seeing.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:26 | 3399908 kliguy38
kliguy38's picture

Apparently you do not understand what a digital bank run looks like//////////// trick question for you sheeple.......it doesn't "look".......WTF do you think just happened in Cyprus

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 17:49 | 3401087 SWRichmond
SWRichmond's picture

Continental Illinois

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:36 | 3399937 Colonel Jessup
Colonel Jessup's picture

No bank runs? Are you not paying attention son? Physical Euros have been exiting Spansh and Greek banks for nearly a year now - the ECB are borrowing the printing presses from The Bernank on alternating weekends to keep up with the demand and keep the game going - and have been for some time. The bank runs have already begun.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:55 | 3400002 crusty curmudgeon
crusty curmudgeon's picture

Did you order the code red?

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:10 | 3400065 Colonel Jessup
Colonel Jessup's picture

You're Damn Right I Did!

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 18:13 | 3401145 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

"Target 2." hmmmm. "Target 2." http://soberlook.com/2012/08/target2-replacing-other-sources-of.html "what is the plan to get the economy moving again?" (in the USA it was KEEP SPENDING...we'll cross the austerity bridge when we get to it.) "make sure all the German Banks are repaid"? hmmmm. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZgeYSqUeTA

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:35 | 3399938 Colonel Jessup
Colonel Jessup's picture

No bank runs? Are you not paying attention son? Physical Euros have been exiting Spansh and Greek banks for nearly a year now - the ECB are borrowing the printing presses from The Bernank on alternating weekends to keep up with the demand and keep the game going - and have been for some time. The bank runs have already begun.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:49 | 3399982 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Did my part this morning to help start one.SWIFT has been busy today just with me.

What about you ?

It was a bank holiday across Europe yesterday,bye the bye.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:29 | 3400125 Imminent Crucible
Imminent Crucible's picture

There hasn't been a single bank run yet

What a blockhead. What a ultra-maroon. What a nin-cow-poop. You missed the multi-billion euro run on Monte Paschi Bank, I guess. You missed the list of 132 wealthy account holders who took all their money out of Laiki Bank and Bank of Cyprus while the bank was closed---for a bank run! When everyone takes their money out, that's called a "bank run". Sheesh.

Oh, by the way, if you had bothered to check their web site, Laiki Bank "offers its customers a full suite of electronic banking services". So, you won't see the traditional lines around the block when banks get hollowed out. Most of it will happen on line and you'll never see it.

Let's be clear: the bank runs are happening right now.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:31 | 3400139 crusty curmudgeon
crusty curmudgeon's picture

You don't understand. 

A bank run is where a bunch of old men in grey overcoats and fedoras stand in a long line with circa 1930s automobiles in the background.

See?  No bank run.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:42 | 3400182 It is a bargin ...
It is a bargin my friend's picture

"There hasn't been a single bank run yet"..Im pretty bloody sure I saw about 2 thousand people outside every Northern Rock in the UK a while back

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 17:02 | 3400934 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

Queing is a national sport, there. That was a Q-Marathon you saw

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:43 | 3400189 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

OH goodie we have a new troll!

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:56 | 3400251 Chuck Walla
Chuck Walla's picture

There hasn't been a single bank run yet, how is this a certainty? After watching Cypriots and PIIGSeons sit idly by through this event, it makes me wonder what it would take.

There's an EU country, its called "ITALY".  You need to find it on a map and read about Monte Paschi. Otherwise, you reveal a dumbassery that is breathtaking.

FORWARD SOVIET!

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 14:28 | 3400372 graspAU
graspAU's picture

Huh? In what scope/context are you talking about? We have had electronic "silient" bank runs in the US. Not just the "money market" run that almost collapsed the system on 9/15/2008, but there was a silent run going on at WaMu and Wachovia. Wachovia on Sept 26, 2008. Here's the quote from a Wachovia person:

"Inside Wachovia, executives started noticing customers withdrawing money on Friday morning, following the failure of Washington Mutual on Thursday. “The so-called silent run on the bank – it's real,” Carlos Evans, Wachovia's wholesale banking executive, said in an interview. “When Congress failed to pass the ($700 billion bailout) proposal, when WaMu collapsed, you could see the money flowing. My computer screen was lighting up.”

Starting Friday morning, Evans said, businesses and institutions with large accounts started withdrawing money to lower their balances to below the federally insured $100,000 limit."

From:  http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2008/10/02/226799/wachovia-faced-a-sile...

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 19:04 | 3401263 Papasmurf
Papasmurf's picture

There was a bank run in Cyprus.  Only the well-connected elite got to do the running, but it was still a run that left the bank without any assets.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 19:27 | 3401334 Mr Nice Guy
Mr Nice Guy's picture

There already was a run, but the only ones in the race were connected individuals/corporations..a stealth run. When traditional depositor runs begin, these frightened folks will find that the winners crossed the finish line the night before the race was announced to the general public...the trophies gone and the cupboard bare.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 21:03 | 3401543 Diogenes
Diogenes's picture

There was a run on the Cypriot banks but it took place in London, and other bank branches outside Cyprus because the Cyprus branches were closed.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:49 | 3399780 Longtermnotreally
Longtermnotreally's picture

The central planners intend to steal everything before the house of cards comes tumbling down. Indirectly through inflation, directly through taxes and confications while on top of that depriving people from all forms of protection such as PMs.
And that is their Achilles Heel, buy physical and make them bleed.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 14:55 | 3400446 TheGardener
TheGardener's picture

Make no mistake. We are at war. They are going for your whole net worth.

Clausewitz declared the purpose of war is to overthrow the
enemy and disarm and nothing less.No Kuwait border pushing.

The famous quote of the guy, that war is an extend of politics ; I started to question : Could as well be the other way round : Politics is the continuation of war by other means. :-)

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:30 | 3400118 crusty curmudgeon
crusty curmudgeon's picture

"End the Fed? Good luck with that Dr. Paul....."

What the hell is wrong with you people?  31 people give this lame ass comment an up vote?
So Ron Paul shouldn't suggest that we end the Fed because it will be difficult to accomplish?

Sure, let's never speak the truth because it's unpopular.  What a great way to solve our problems.

Pathetic!

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 20:11 | 3401430 jekyll island
jekyll island's picture

Federal Reserve is actually the 4th central bank in the history of the US. Three others have had their charters pulled. It can be done. Calling Andrew Jackson...please report for duty.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 20:52 | 3401524 Radical Marijuana
Radical Marijuana's picture

Right on, jekyll island! Except, as you probably know, President Andrew Jackson had to almost miraculously survive assassination attempts by the banksters, before he was able to "Kill the Bank."

Furthermore, Jackson was living back in a time when there were many independent newspapers. Today, there are a handful of huge coprorations, that provide 90% of the information that the public receives, and so, "elections" are puppet shows put on by those mass media. That was obvious during the Primaries, regarding how the mass media treated Ron Paul for President of the USA!

It was totally appropriate that Andrew Jackson was a hero in the War of 1812, which was a punitive war against the USA ordered by the international banksters, for "Killing the Bank" before that. Tragically, there is nobody that I can imagine being able to actually survive being like Jackson was, and indeed, with the democratic republic already so dead, it is almost impossible to imagine any politician being able to do what Jackson did.

But nevertheless, I totally agree that, in theory, what American NEEDS is another to do what President Andrew Jackson DID!

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:33 | 3399708 Rustysilver
Rustysilver's picture

So, these are just words.  Look at gold today (-$17).  With all the risk out there I would have expected +$100. 

 

I just don't fcvkin understand.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:34 | 3399716 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Ummm... that's not the price of gold, but the price of a paper gold derivative.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:44 | 3399749 nope-1004
nope-1004's picture

Manipulated to make people question what's going on and question why you bought.  The entire system is a total farce.  Once you acknowledge that it is, there is no question that owning a hard asset outside of the banks control is the only true way to be free from their demonic tentacles.

The paper price can be anything they decide it should be, just like LIBOR.  There is no point to following it.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:52 | 3399789 johnQpublic
johnQpublic's picture

whats not to understand, and how many times do we need to go over this.....

 

buy the friggin dips!!!!!!

gold, silver, lead

all excellent stores of value

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:44 | 3399755 hankwil74
hankwil74's picture

Uhhhh, no it's not. Real physical gold for delivery on the floor of the COMEX is trading $1582, and it is down $19 from yesterday's settlement.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:50 | 3399784 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

Does the owner of that gold know it is being sold?  I doubt it.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:51 | 3399788 nope-1004
nope-1004's picture

Or how market price is set?  Double doubt.

 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:41 | 3399960 Its_the_economy...
Its_the_economy_stupid's picture

+100.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 18:01 | 3401111 auric1234
auric1234's picture

You mean the Fed? Well of course they do!

 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:21 | 3399886 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Oh yeah? Exactly who is standing for delivery down there at the fraud ridden COMEX?

You are full of shit Sir.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:32 | 3399927 kliguy38
kliguy38's picture

Only those with VERY big balls and do not have a sense of self preservation

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:58 | 3400017 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Located between their ears.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:08 | 3400060 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

Coin dealers like Tulving are cheaper today by over $20 per oz. than they were yesterday.  They are standing for delivery.  Physical is available to anyone with the cash.

Would you pay as much today for gold or silver as you did yeaterday?

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:26 | 3400122 SMG
SMG's picture

That's only true because people don't understand the smokescreen that is the current Precious Metals market. They incorrectly trust the market to be honest.  When that trust breaks down in the next few years globally, as it just did in Cyprus.  Then we will see what the true price of getting physical PM's  in your hand is.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:57 | 3400257 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

I was referring to the COMEX and the overwhelming amount of cash settlements done there. Very few standing for delivery.

And yes, Tulving is a very good company to buy gold and silver from.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:32 | 3400143 Imminent Crucible
Imminent Crucible's picture

Real physical gold for delivery on the floor of the COMEX

Don't make me laugh. The Comex settles in cash or shares of GLD, at their discretion.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 19:38 | 3401355 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

its a futures exchange dumbfuck and no its not a gold store you can go in and buy at spot. its a casino that you go to place a bet with a commercial bank gamble the future spot price on leverage. There is a reason that nearly no-one actualy takes physical possesion on a futures contract.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:46 | 3399762 TheSilverJournal
TheSilverJournal's picture

I'm pretty sure I can buy actual gold for about that amount and no more, therefore it is the price of gold.

Don't fool yourself, the price is whatever you pay for it. Just because the pricing mechanism is poor doesn't mean that it's not the price. If you recognize the price isn't being set the way it should all that means is that there is an opportunity to take advantage of the flaw in pricing. On one hand, this should be looked at as one of the greatest opportunities ever because without the world fiat ponzi being on the verge of collapse, there would be no way to drastically increase your wealth through a no brainer play like gold. Virtually nothing will outperform gold...except silver which will outperform gold by at least 5X...and maybe platinum.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:54 | 3399799 johnQpublic
johnQpublic's picture

you are sure?

now, have you actually tried it?

bernanke is sure that printing money creates jobs...he tried it, and still is

only problem is he is wrong

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:25 | 3399904 TheSilverJournal
TheSilverJournal's picture

Click ckick on the computer at this site and it will show up at your door step in a few days for a few percent over spot http://www.gainesvillecoins.com/category/251/1-oz-gold-eagles.aspx. I'm sure you can go to your local coin store too. A great tool to use to find this stuff is google if you haven't heard of it and are looking to buy gold for a few percent above the spot price. Don't tell me you can't find a way to buy this stuff because it really couldn't be easier. Of course, you'd be better off buying silver or platinum.

All printing money does is destroy jobs. This is why:

  • Every newly created FRN gains its value by taking it out of the market. Now, instead of those resources flowing to where the market demands, those resources flow where the central planners direct them. Resources are being centrally directed towards the entitlement system (medicare, medicaid, social security, disability, food stamps, itc.), national offense, borrowing condoned by government (housing, student loans), and the banking system (because without the banking system and the printing press, the government wouldn't be able to direct all of these resources). It's also creating a gian credit bubble and asset bubble for asset supported by cheap credit.

The funny thing is that the Keynseyians will say that if the printing is stopped, that is what will destroy jobs and in a sense they are right. Money printing is just a ponzi scheme. When ponzies implode, those in the ponzi get hurt. Does that mean a ponzi should be perpetuated just to stop this currently in the ponzi from the pain of the implosion? Clearly, the answer is no. By definition, a ponzi must grow or it implodes, so at some point, every ponzi must implode when it can no longer grow. The FRN based world fiat monetary ponzi has grown to engulf the world and there are no more CITIZENS of the world to suck into this thing. But the new entrants to this ponzi is currency. Now that there's no more countries to suck up FRNs, rates were lowere and QE was embarked upon to keep the ponzi from imploding. So when the ponzi implodes, all jobs supported by the ponzi will be wiped out. This is painful but it is a good thing because those jobs were waste. The wealth thought to be created by those jobs was an illusion. We don't need more houses. We don't need more psych majors. We don't need more lawyers. We don't need more cars. We don't need more service sector jobs. We need to make things. We need the free market to direct capital. We need real growth, not "wealth effects" on the backs of a credit bubble like nobody has ever seen, a rising stock market, and a dismal reflation of the housing bubble creating the illusion of growth.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:41 | 3399957 Zwelgje
Zwelgje's picture

Jim Willie claims that you pay $2000 per ounce instead of $1600 when you want 1000 kilo's deliverd in one go when you order in Dubai.

But who is he?

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:56 | 3400008 TheSilverJournal
TheSilverJournal's picture

I guess he's a very uninformed person that hasn't heard of Gainseville Coins, APMEX, or have a coin shop nearby.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:02 | 3400035 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Ask them for delivery on one tonne and see what the price is.

Better yet try the LME.A friend of mine had a seat there,first woman,and

still connected.Says they are scraping the barrel on actual metal to deliver.

Not much longer for the paper derivatve.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:24 | 3400110 TheSilverJournal
TheSilverJournal's picture

Are you high? Why buy from anywhere where else if it's not cheaper than gainesvillecoins.com? Please. Do. Not. Tell me the price for phyzzz is sooo high when I just showed you where to get it for a few percent over spot.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:29 | 3400134 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Of a tonne(metric ton to to you) ?

I just told you I have a connection in the real market,so believe what you want.

Buy it while you still can , these games on the price will be over by year end.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 14:07 | 3400294 TheSilverJournal
TheSilverJournal's picture

I don't know if the word I would use is "connection" if they can't find gold to buy for a few percent over spot. A swindler would call that person a "mark." Do you want me to find the number for Gold Line for your connection?...they might have a great conversation.

And you don't need a connection to tell you that the phyzz market is priced waaayyy above paper. Just use this new thing called google and you can see with your very own eyes that you can purchase bullion shipped right to your doorstep for a few percent over spot.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 17:27 | 3401023 Strider52
Strider52's picture

SilverJournal: Just said "Hi" to gainesville. Taking the boat home now. Weather looks perfect. What could possibly go wrong?

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 19:47 | 3401371 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

TSJ are you another one of those counrty folk who thinks the whole worlk exists within the US borders.  ordering Large quantities and opprotunities to buy physical outside the US vary greatly from ordering a few rolls at gainsville.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 18:06 | 3401128 auric1234
auric1234's picture

You can't buy 1000 kg in a coin shop.

 

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:32 | 3399929 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Which is why the US Mint fudged the numbers again on their ASE sales yesterday. They added 812K more on the 1st of April to avoid another record month of Eagle sales. Over 15M sold in 3 short months.

http://www.usmint.gov/mint_programs/american_eagles/?action=sales&year=2013

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:54 | 3400000 fuu
fuu's picture

If the mint suspended sales for the rest of the year 2013 would be the 6th best year by ounces sold.

At this pace 2013 will beat 2011 by about 50%.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:15 | 3400080 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

If demand is so high, why is the price dropping so much?

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:21 | 3400105 Creepy Lurker
Creepy Lurker's picture

To make you ask that very question? Just a guess.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 14:50 | 3400441 RWR
RWR's picture

So you can buy large quantities to be confiscated by U.S. gov. at a later date! They are letting you buy low so they don't have to.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:46 | 3399768 kliguy38
kliguy38's picture

Correct and it is VERY effective for its intended purpose to condition the sheep that gold is NOT true money and to maintain the illusion of the petrodollar dominance. Its avery nice ponzi scheme that has been used throughout the ages. Of course the "money of Kings" will resume its status but not until the last leaf is shaken from the unsteady hands of the sheep. Its also noteworthy that VERY few sheep relatively speaking are even in the actual bullion trade. If you don't believe that then do a little experiment. Call ten of your "MOST informed" friends and ask them how much gold they possess.......I'll wager that less than 3 have ANY bullion in possession. Imagine how many out of a true "sample" population have bullion........nil

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:52 | 3399794 TheSilverJournal
TheSilverJournal's picture

Zerohedge readers may have a different circle of friends than the norm, but on average I would be surprised if one person in a group of 10 owns any gold bullion.

As a side note, I don't see why anyone would choose gold bullion over platinum bullion considering they're the same price and platinum has a lot more upside potential with minimal downside risk. It's more rare in the ground and above ground, it's prettier, it can be coined, it's used more in industry...seems like a winner to me.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 11:58 | 3399820 DavidC
DavidC's picture

Or Silver!

DavidC

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:31 | 3399921 TheSilverJournal
TheSilverJournal's picture

Yes, silver is the best purchase. Platinum may give silver a challenge on how much it will appreciate, but silver is a surer bet. Where platinum has a clear advantage to silver is if you need to carry a lot of wealth on your person.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 13:39 | 3400171 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Still not convinced about silver or plat.I see the industrial usage

as a disadvantage in a SHF scenario.Still used to have some,

before a tragic accident........

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 14:18 | 3400328 TheSilverJournal
TheSilverJournal's picture

More uses for something isn't a negative. More sources for demand is a positive. Think of how much fiat there is in the world, how much currency is in the banks, how many pension funds own piles and piles of bonds, all that digital currency electronically locked away where people think they are safely storing wealth. When the bond bubble bursts, the banks become empty buildings, and fiat collapses, the rush for people to keep their life savings from being wiped away will be gone.

The question is, "What will the masses rush into to keep their savings from being lost?"

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 20:28 | 3401471 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

I'm thinking more the complete collapse of foreign trade.What demand will there be then ?

The market will then be over supplied with those two.Its texbook, and the history of copper

prices in the 1930's before the war buildup started,  should be looked at by any investor/prepper.

I see them more  as a hedge that may payoff briefly just prior to WWIII, whether I get

to live to see any benefit from  that, who knows ?

All depends how bad it gets, but I think most here agree, that its going to be

a catastrophe , not just bad, or very bad.

Tue, 04/02/2013 - 12:02 | 3399829 nope-1004
nope-1004's picture

Because central banks around the world are not on the hunt for their platinum.  They are after their gold, and it is gold that will be used to balance out international sovereign debt obligations.

 

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