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Bitcoins Go Parabolic
In the last 48 hours, the price of the virtual currency has surged by 50% from $94 to $141 as the rate of expansion goes more than parabolic. This leaves us with the question, which line item on the Fed's Balance Sheet is 'Virtual Currency Transactions'... what better way to destroy an up and coming currency competitor than to blow a bubble in it and explode it?
That is a 14x rise since the start of the year...
Source: BitCoinCharts
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They love Keiser when he talks about silver but not about bitcoin.... biased much people?
Can't help but somthing smells fishy...
Too much , too fast..
Somebody will have a face landing big time.
Not selling a single Krug or Sovereign for bitcoin.
F**ck I just love that shine of the St Gaudens Double Eagle.
No digital substitute available.
Maybe I'm just a fool missing out on the biggest run since Klondike ... !?
And on the same day that Italy started money grabbing from it's citizens, too.
Big surprise. Governments have basically announced to all that they will steal money right out of bank accounts, and at the same time the price of a virtual currency that the government has no way of stealing goes through the roof.
I'm just gonna say it. I've read all these threads, followed the back-and-forth and the insults, and I still don't get bitcoin. I even have a friend who helped write the code and I'm not ignorant of programming myself - and I still don't get it. Maybe it's just because I'm intensely conservative, but I prefer to clutch hard, cold metal. My girlfriend is mad at me for advising her against investing in it when it was $30 and she definitely has a point. Still, I just don't see this having the staying power of a mass of metal occupying space, but I've been wrong so far and maybe I'll be wrong to the end. I honestly don't know.
That mean's you're a Jungian Sensing type. But that's ok man. :)
That mean's you're a Jungian Sensing type. But that's ok man. :)
Think of it like this: its just another type of currency.
If companies like Amazon.com or Itunes started accepting payments in Bitcoin tomorrow there would be a shitstorm from TPTB the likes of which we have not seen before. Then all the other mainstream internet vendors would start accepting it, and the Ben Bernanke would be shitting himself in what to do.
MarcusLCrassus
and the Ben Bernanke would be shitting himself in what to do.
Nope,they would simply pull the plug bro.
That's the beauty of bitcoin. Its impossible to pull the plug. They would have to destroy every single laptop and computer and smartphone and tablet in the world.
In other words, impossible.
l2bitcoin
To the Moon! :)
Mountain Gox looks a bit... Exponential.
Everyone is struggling to find value and maintain value. It might have been eaier if the market was free. Nevertheless each of us in his or her own way do the best we can and even though we each hold some pretty strong ideas, the reality is that the manipulations are so strong that self doubt often takes hold.
It may be a bubble. But this one's going up much further. Most people still do not even know bitcoin exists.
Capital is in flight all around the world right now. Cyprus and the failing euro certainly deserve an assist in this matter as well. Bitcoin is perfect for the atmosphere of 'capital in flight' - its that simple.
So you pretty much admit that it's a ponzi.
I did not realize ponzi or not is determined by the size of participants.
Listen, I even thought of playing a bit (pun intended), but at these levels of appreciation I'm waiting for another "wallet malfunction", not wishing it on you guys, just sayin'.
p.s noticed the Euro transacions are approx only 1/5 of usd, so this "Cyprus gettin liquid" cannot be a true answer.
if/when all the new ASIC miners come on there should be a swoon as a new round of 'easy gold' is mined but then that will taper with difficulty rising after that... but the other side of this is the death spiral of fiat pushing bitcoin value way faster than any new boom in mining
Going long parabolas.
Bitcoin 36,000
Why so low?
Is there a method to short Bitcoins?
Because I would.
That said, I agree with Hayek's view that currencies should compete to see which is deemed "most acceptable". This is a general acceptance of Gresham's Law (bad money drives out the good), because Gresham's Law can't be revoked, and when a nation backs a fiat currency, it can be undermined, leaving only dupes and ignoramuses (which most of us are most of the time) with worthless paper.
Then again, even gold can be undermined thanks to Gresham's Law, which is why I said to a very good friend of mine recently "who cares about Gresham's Law? The bad money always drives out the good, but there's still a currency - and that's what matters. Unless you're holding the old currency, then you want to create laws to stop what you perceive to be 'theft', which is really just the market doing what it does."
Yes, I support gold. Yes, it IS a currency. But it is no longer a complete currency - every other usable currency competes because of one thing - portability. Gold isn't something you carry in your pocket everywhere (not that it ever was...most people never carried gold back in the days when it was a real currency, they carried bank scrip).
However, bitcoin, much as I'm all for it's open nature, seems to be bubbling. So it's worth a short soon. If you can. But I don't know enough about it to do it.
You would get stopped out at a loss shorting here. Do you really think it will collapse in the next 24 hours? You would have to short in such a way that there was no margin call, or you would have to be prepared to have a very massive margin, several times the current value you are shorting.
People who say to short something never understand how dangerous it is--it is not the same risk as going long anything. You can lose your ass a lot faster.
Oh I understand the risks, and I also did NOT say I would do it today (which was a big assumption on the prior commenter's part). I would short it, however. Timing is always the big question of shorting.
The question I asked was - is there a way to do it?
No, I don't think it's going to crash in 24 hours, and I realize at a parabolic growth rate the likelyhood of hanging on to my money is infinitesimal.
But the short phase is rapidly approaching. I just spent the last few hours picking over Bitcoin, and I still don't see the value of it. Of course, I don't see the value of the Federal Reserve, either - but that doesn't mean I'm ready to short the Fed tomorrow, either.
All in good time.
In the meantime, let the people do what they do and pump it up. If it works (for however long), then great, it's nice to have alternatives, yes?
But there isn't anything backing this up aside from trust in Bitcoin itself. Which isn't all that different than trusting the US Government, or any government that prints fiat.
Unless someone can explain to me how it is different?
Hayek's principle of letting money compete was based on the fact that while the bad money drives out the good, bad money can't drive out the good if people know there's nothing backing it up - eventually the people pushing the bad currency would lose out, or be forced to back it up with something of value. Thus, it's better to present a currency backed by value and let the market decide if its value is something society really wants.
At this stage, Bitcoin has something society wants/needs. But I suspect that's being driven by the fact that tons of people just lost their money.
Couldn't access MtGox earlier today. Its true though...the Fed or any major bank could detroy this market while staying totally incognito on a dime. Technically i suppose they already are with QE... hell even if JPM turned a fraction of their processing power toward legitimate mining they could probably outdo some of the most robust private networks.
I smell tulips, did someone plant some tulips around here?
When has anything that ever rose this fast ended up turning out good? EVER!
This time is different?
can we start a BitCoin ETF? Then we can all trade paper BitCoin...
BitCoin is like directives. Smoke and mirrors. You can't carry it in your wallet, bury it, hold it and who takes BitCoin as payment for products or services rendered? What if your WiFi is screwed up and you can't transfer payment? What if the Chinese hack it? You don't think the CIA doesn't know who is transferring BitCoin?
What if there is a Hurricane Sandy re occurrence? When you have cash you can buy necessities. Good luck with electronic currency.
So they blow a bubble up in bitcoin, then explode it. Then what?
In the meantime, the whole world learns of it and jumps aboard.
Wrong. a 90% price collapse will burn alot of people, and many will vow to never use it again. Others will stay away until the next mania, and get burnt a second time.
Agreed...you see time and again the hesistance that the retail investor can carry for multiple years following a steep loss.
> a 90% price collapse will burn alot of people, and many will vow to never use it again.
I bought bitcoins at $1 in 2011, watched it go to $30 and then crash to near zero. It hasn't kept me away.
Only idiots "vow" over a commodity.
If you had bought at $30, your perspective might be different.
If you bought a house in 2003, the housing bubble might not have had any impact on you. If you bought in 2007 and you got foreclosed on in 2012 when you went to refinance, your perspective would be different.
The volume of people getting into bitcoin (or any bubble) rises as the mania reaches its crescendo.
Its right there with "gold receivables" under things that don't exist.
Meanwhile, the true coin materials are going down...
They're not going down....they're going on sale!
... what better way to destroy an up and coming currency competitor than to blow a bubble in it and explode it?
Or better yet - make billions off those who are long bitcoin as it tanks and watch it explode itself.
since the btc reminds me of a pyramid as well as penny stock pump and dump scheme, the early adopters of and entrants in the btc market will make a killing on this as they dump their stash onto greater fools. if i were in, i'd be dumping about now.
My interest in Bitcoins is from the sidelines only, should be fun to watch it all play out... I find BTC's intriguing but not enough to trade in my worthless paper for them, seems like just another side show to me.
-neutral-
Another way to look at it is BC is a little too convenient in taking the pressure off the physical gold/silver market. When govt is done with it it can kill BC by starting another digital currency that works exactly like BC but is a bargain and then start to drive the price up. Faith in BC is shaken as realization takes hold that BC is very dilutable.
There might be something to that.
The Royal Canadian Mint is untertaking just such an endeavour
http://mintchipchallenge.com/
You can't dilute it. There is only a finite amount of coins that can ever be mined. All you can do increase or decrease value and that is dependent upon trade and price discovery not some sociopath sitting in the center deciding what they want it to be valued at and manipulating value by dilution. The market controls the price which is driven by all the participants not a single central individual controlling the market which is our current monetary system. Decentralization is economic freedom bitchez. Freedom has responsibility and risks, that is just how it is. I'd be happy if both are allowed to exist without each trying to kill the other off and let the people migrate accordingly to what they value. That is freedom of choice to be a slave with no consequences for your bad actions or be free and live and die by your choices.
I'm sure there are a lot of bitcon believers that feel like geniuses right now.
Enjoy it while you can.
Parabolic maniacal charts like that ALWAYS end very badly.
What is BitCoin valued in? USD. Ha Ha.
BitCoin has no value of its own. It goes up and down based on what people with fiat decides its worth. Based on that, BitCoin is worth as much as a bit or byte, lost in a sea of electrons.
What is gold, silver, oil, and food valued in? USD. Ha ha. Do they have no value of their own if their value is determined by supply and demand, and what people are willing to pay in fiat to acquire them?
That is incorrect and you know it. Gold is valued in every different currency, and is worth more in some countries and less in others, but not by much. Oil is valued in dollars because we made a deal with the Saudi's that we'd let them train a whole bunch of jihadi's to blow us up and not do anything about it if they trade their oil for dollars. This is backed up with trillions of dollars in weaponry sold to the Saudi's as you know. Food is valued in whatever the hell people want, barter is best, now that is a great place to avoid using fiat.
Maybe there will be a bitcoin futures/derivative market someday. So the price of virtual currency would be determined by the "paper" price. LMAO
H/T Jazze;
Did any of y'all know that bitcoin's largest exchange has withdrawal limits?!!
I thought the beauty of BTC was free movement of your money... Max 100btc or 1000$ per 24hr LOL.
https://mtgox.com/press_release_20130313.html
you don't need an exchange to move bitcoins - that's their rules, you don't need to use them..i don't, mt gox dropped the ball a couple times with me for me to bother with them anymore
Bitcoins go up because of the following:
1. There is a limited supply, and each new bitcoin becomes marginally 'harder' to mine than the one before it.
2. Mining bitcoins has become so expensive (in dollars) that only a few can do it profitably these days.
3. If you own a bitcoin, you probably won't sell it. Either buy exchanging it for goods or services, or for other currency.
4. If you wanted to buy something for $5 online to a retailer that accepts bitcoins, you'd have to buy them it lots of 30 qty because you can't spend a fraction of a bitcoin.
Until one is able to spend them freely on goods and services (as opposed to simply exchanging for other currency) to a much larger extent, coupled with the above points, the price shouldn't go down.
wow - on a place like ZH there are a lot of misinformed people here... can't spend fractions of bitcoins?? this place has gone from ignorance to outright lies
to be fair, there's a lot of disinformation being disseminated for both sides of the *cough* bitcoin.
A) Bitcoins are batches of numbers which makes them divisible to 1/1,000,000,000.
B) Bitcoins are easier to smuggle across borders making them useful in the current Eurozone.
I am not claiming that bitcoin is perfect; I am merely pointing out two errors in your analysis. If you want to move your deposits into pm's an leave less of a paper trail Bitcoin is a good medium of exchange.
POMO going into Bitcoin?
Well Bitcoins might just be the destroyer of states and banks. We'll see. I intend to be a free rider, so good luck and I'll get some value for free. Knock yourselves out. Just remember, I'm rooting for you. Up to a point.
Bubble city. I was wondering why this thing was all over the msm, probably going to herd everyone into it, kill it, and then preach that central bank control is essential for a stable currency.
cool story bro
most people don't even know how to obtain bitcoins...
That's because they dont exist...
I hope Bitcoin DESTROYS the Fed! After that I really don't care which direction it goes.
no way dude, this trend is just reflecting the easing. except it isn't following debasement in a linear fashion. whoops. that alone should be a good predicter of what happens next.
just how far can it go up to?
definitely entertaining to watch.
One of my neighbors who used to be a silver bug told me he bought bit-coins and buiried his laptop in his backyard. I think that he should have read up a little more on bitcoins
Duuude, I said I lost my laptop, while boating.
Apparently the price is locked at Last price:$141.32001.
I went online and entered in as if I were going to buy and that was also the price.
I think BitCoin was a good idea.
I'm backing up my wallet now.
Looks like MtGox went down due to too much volume. Checking to see if any other pricing methods are still running. Trying to get a view on volume.
nevermind other update.
Looks like a lot of the old-timers here are struggling with the Bitcoin concept - obviously you don't put all your money into it but the possibilities are eyewatering. I can see the establishment taking a beating with this one. Bitcoin has a cold logic, heartless, she will fuck you with an 18" strapon. How do you stop Bitcoin without stopping the internet as we know it?
Disclosure: mining rig on the way.
Bitcoins only have value while the power's on and the bits and bytes are flowing.
I see the 'establishment' throwing the kill switch on the whole Interwebz thing - that'll make yer eyes water, bitchez.
World of Warcraft gold > bitcoin - at least there is a high degree of certainty that WoW is going to be around quite a while.
I don't bother with computer games, I'm 40% stawks 40% PM 20% Cash, I've been following Bitcoin since early 2010, I have been known to go headlong into things without much thought, can't help being impulsive but the way BTC works is fascinating - just a while back BTC crashed but it has recovered and is now stronger than ever. Are you even slightly interested?
I don't do volatile-with-chance-of-flash-crash. TANSTAAFL
I wish I hadn't invested so much in Liberty Dollars.
I'll take some of them off your hands at face value.
Bit Dust:
502 Bad GatewayYou have really give consideration to the idea that the FED and the gang are manipulating this higher to only crash it and discredit it.......sort of what they tried to do to Silver.
Been to this rodeo before....MAx Keiser better stop pumping it because when it crashes it will discredit his involvement in it....
If you are a Hammer...
then everything is a nail that requires pounding.
If you are a useful idiot Bag of Hot Air like Bennie The Bernank...
then everything is a bubble in need of blowing.
So much ignorance on one page is difficult to find. But I guess its the result of "old Media's" propaganda. Yes I would like to see FED try to kill BitCoin without violence. And yes, I don't think they will succeed, without violence. They will need a global "anti terrorist" action. A new, Goerge Bush "Either you're with us or against us" doctrine. Obama will be their spokesman talking about world destruction etc. A round up of all Exchanges staff and owners, and immediate deportation to Guantanamo.
Without that FED will not succeed.
pfft..the price of buttcoin in central bank issued toilet paper is not important, what matters is the acceptability of it as a medium of exchange. Unless buttcoin gets enough acceptability, it will end up as a dodo, heck it would not even be of value to later day collectors for they cannot even collect the thing unlike the paper notes.
It doesn't cost money to enjoy the best life has to offer. Laughter, sex, human relationships, beautiful weather, flowers, other life forms and so on are all here to be enjoyed.
Then someone invents the system we have now where we are so obsessed and worried about mammon, we forget that the stuff we enjoy is free.
this is fucking abnormal
*yawn*
pass the popcorn
Sorry, but I just cannot trust this Bitcoin system.
I was looking at it when it was US$28 and made the mistake of not getting in and out now.
Can somebody answer this question:
If there was a run on Bitcoin; i.e. people tried to withdraw their local monies now; what would happen?
Could the computers physically cope?
The price would surely crash?
Would there be physical money to pay out?
> The price would surely crash?
Yep. And there's plenty of people that will buy the cheap bitcoins and the whole cycle starts all over again. It's happened many times with the price of gold, silver, bitcoin, stocks, etc. It's part of a market cycle.
With bitcoin, the market is buit-in: the entire internet. As long as the net is up, bitcoins are worth something. Right now, the market says they're worth about $125.
fortunately, there's also litecoin
http://litecoin.org/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_currency#List_of_digital_currencies
This will rival government intervention as a threat to ?. When any smart junior high school kid can invent his or her own currency ...
fortunately, there's also microcash
http://microcash.org/
fortunately, there's also ripple
https://ripple.com/
fortunately, there's also bbqcoin
http://bbqcoin.org/
OMGWTFBBQ!
i would sell now if i would have any bitcoin.
reminds me kind of the tulip bubble :)
looks like even bitcoin is not "bubble safe"
rofl
My take is that all the money velocity being stirred up by the banking system destablization going on now, first in Cyprus and now across the EU is driving the price up. That money of the average joe and we aren't talking about guys with billions or even millions in savings has to go somewhere and depending the types it is going into the bank of sealy posturepedic if they can get it out in hard cash, gold/silver (if they can find it and buy it over there) and the third option now is bitcoin. The $64 dollar question is a flood of EUR into the system causing the price to go up or a flood of USD. If it is EUR then my take is probably correct. If it is USD then my next question is who is pumping USD into the system are they 20 something year olds trying to beat the part time job 29 hours a week obamacare rigged job market working at starbucks that requires a masters degree to pour coffee types and if not who then. You got to wonder if these guys are running up the credit cards and student loans and pumping it into bitcoins.
Bubble will surely burst, but why not make some money before that happens? Word about Bitcoin is just getting spread and becoming mainstream. My guess is it will reach at least $1000 before bursting.
Son-in-law just turned his $200 investment last fall in a miner into $15K with $4K cashed out and converted this to 120 silver ounces. Bubbles are great things to ride for the early adapters. Bitcoins efficacy in transferring money currency to currency and country to country might just keep it moving for another 100X increase before the inevitable blow-up. I'm too old and timid to ride this tiger but it is the sort of thing that fortunes are made and lost on....
i have an idea. why not securitize BTC and form a futures market for it?
I would not think Bit coin would play well with people that only believe in what you can stack and feel. It's mind bending enough for me without trying to keep interweb bucks in a row too.
Whats embossed on the other side of a bit coin, rainbows and unicorns ?
Got Gold?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/321100273487?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p...
Just sayin....
"All we are saying .... is give Bitcon a chance !" ..... Hi, Monedas here, I'm not the most schooled economically here .... so give me some juicy anecdotes .... of peeple who have bought in .... sold .... made a PROFIT .... and maybe .... oh, I don't know .... bought some gold ? I'm Monedas .... SHOW ME !
You see, bitcoin is just like anything in the human speculative world, bought/sold/long/short... that's all great. Bitcoin is money. I've sold stuff and bought stuff with bitcoins. I originally got into bitcoins by accepting a payment in bitcoins for something I sold. But not only can you speculate just like any other currency/commodity... you can actually pay for STUFF with it.
https://www.spendbitcoins.com/places/
8 Vendors You Didn't Know Accepted Bitcoins
Here's the rub... I found a concierge who takes bitcoin and set me up with a glory filled weekend of prostitutes and other illicit material and activities, paid for it in bitcoin, didn't use my credit card once and neither my CPA or my Bookkeeper realized I was ever gone or that I had just dropped $8k on non-deductible/non-sanctioned expenditures. I remember coming back in Monday morning and when everyone was so curious as to my whereabouts over the weekend, I told people I went fishing. "Why do you look like shit?" the bookkeeper asked. "They were really big fish," I said, thinking about Gilda the brunette and Sleeves the blonde.
And remember the treasury department has a curious view of bitcoin as well.
There is some guy "Chibster" .... who claims he wrote the algos for Bitcon .... says it's a crapshoot .... he posts on TFMR !?!
This move in Bitcoin identifies one critical flaw in the cybercurrency model.
Stocks to Flow Ratio. ( not a problem in gold)
short answer, bit coin still appears ok for cost effective transactions, but due to the lop- sided STF ratio can be manipulated easily in value
Why not litecoin, ripple? ven (been around awhile)? What's the major competition? Serious question.
Wait for the Hyperspace overlords to come and skim off 40% of your deposits. Oh Wait, there are no real deposits. Ha! that will get 'em.
Here some popcorn for the gold bugs:
Instawallet hacked: http://www.businessinsider.com/instawallet-suspended-2013-4
Lol 385 comments on some internet bullshit
Lol 385 comments on some internet bullshit
You should watch this video criticising BitCoins and come to your own conclusion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=7fvSYT7vhQY
Does anyone know any gold and silver dealers that are accepting bitcoins?
https://www.goldsilverbitcoin.com
https://www.amagimetals.com
Bitcoins might be around for a while. See they are just a front for the CIA/NSA and such groups... Ponder my other post on the subject.
=======
Does anyone really know what the computations are that the "bitcoin miners" work on so feverishly?
If we assume the belief that brute-force breaking of many popular cryptographic techniques require a MASSIVE amount of computing cycles, you need to get people to spend their own money to deploy unimaginable amounts of CPU power, all working together, but apart, to crack codes.
What more brilliant way to get the general public to help the NSA, CIA, and others crack coded messages. SETI and Distributed.net already perfected the model, so how about a money reward.. and toss in the ability to "hide" that money too? It's the perfect nerd bait!
It's brilliant..! In fact, could the gov't be that smart? Perhaps the real hidden brains are... not the public flunkies we all see. Useful idiots.
Yeah, no thanks..
When everything goes dark, I won't miss the computers (or my bitcoins)!