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As Confidence In Dollar Wanes, Over A Dozen States Push For Gold As Legal Tender

Tyler Durden's picture




 

In more than a dozen states, legislators are pushing for a movement back to a world where gold is considered money. As Bloomberg reports, lawmakers in Arizona are poised to follow Utah, which authorized bullion for currency in 2011. Similar bills are advancing in Kansas, South Carolina and other states to recognize gold and silver coins as legal tender. "The legislation is about signaling discontent with monetary policy and about what Ben Bernanke is doing," which seems confirmed by the recent shift in Texas to bring its gold back from the New York bank warehouse. The new measures would give "people the option of using money that won’t lose any purchasing power to inflation," one supporter of the bill explained, with another adding, "there is a fear that the government, or Bernanke in particular and the Federal Reserve, is pursuing a policy that will lead to the collapse of the dollar." The U.S. Constitution bars states from coining money and also forbids them from making anything except gold and silver coin tender for paying debts. Advocates say that opens the door for the states to allow bullion as legal tender.

 

Via Bloomberg,

Distrust of the Federal Reserve and concern that U.S. dollars may become worthless are fueling a push in more than a dozen states to recognize gold and silver coins as legal tender.

 

Lawmakers in Arizona are poised to follow Utah, which authorized bullion for currency in 2011. Similar bills are advancing in Kansas, South Carolina and other states.

 

...

 

“The legislation is about signaling discontent with monetary policy and about what Ben Bernanke is doing,” said Gatch, who studies alternative currencies at the Edmond, Oklahoma-based school. “There is a fear that the government, or Bernanke in particular and the Federal Reserve, is pursuing a policy that will lead to the collapse of the dollar. That’s what is behind it.”

 

...

 

In Texas, lawmakers are considering a measure supported by Republican Governor Rick Perry to establish the Texas Bullion Depository to store gold bars valued at about $1 billion and held in a New York bank warehouse. The gold is owned by the University of Texas Investment Management Co., or Utimco, which took delivery of 6,643 bars of the precious metal in 2011 amid concern that demand for it would overwhelm supply.

 

The proposed facility would also accept deposits from the public, and would provide a basis for a payments system in the state in the event of a “systemic dislocation in a national and international financial system,” according to the measure.

 

...

 

“We are seeing a distinct movement back to a world where gold is considered money,” ...

 

The measures give “people the option of using money that won’t lose any purchasing power to inflation,” said Rich Danker, economics director at the American Principles Project. The Washington-based public-policy group supports the steps as well as a return to the gold standard, which pegged the dollar’s value to bullion. President Richard Nixon formally ended the convertibility of U.S. currency to the precious metal in 1971.

 

“People in these states find the idea of having the option to use hard currencies appealing over these policies they have no control over,” Danker said.

 

The U.S. Constitution bars states from coining money and also forbids them from making anything except gold and silver coin tender for paying debts. Advocates say that opens the door for the states to allow bullion as legal tender. The measure being considered in South Carolina would recognize foreign or domestic minted coins as legal tender.

 

...

 

In Utah and some other states, the measures also eliminate state capital gains or other taxes on the coins.

 

...

 

Critics say... “It is simply grandstanding to get people afraid that somehow President Obama’s agenda is going to drive us into hyperinflation and economic collapse,” Farley said. “We have enough real problems to deal with. I don’t see undercutting our entire financial structure as a priority.”

 

...

 

The bill’s sponsor, Senator Chester Crandell, 66 of Heber, said he is convinced the move is the “logical thing for the state of Arizona to do.”

 

“I think you look at some of the things that are happening and the amount of money printed by the Federal Reserve and who has control of that money, and I think anybody would be concerned,” Crandell said. “Gold and silver have been around a long time and people are secure with it and we should give them an opportunity to use it.”

 

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Mon, 04/08/2013 - 09:59 | 3421630 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture

 

 

I was talking to a guy in New York and he told me he's now a felon.

 

I asked him how he felt about that. He said.....screw'em.....technically so are the cops.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:26 | 3421780 IridiumRebel
IridiumRebel's picture

Yes, but he chooses to stay. I will give them no more of my money. It is my own little protest to STARVE the beast. I hope the whole fucking place goes into the shitter. We returned yesterday after scoping out our new digs. As soon as we passed over the state line we felt stressed. I'm done with this place. Everyone thinks they're so high and mighty, but truly they are just a bunch of assholes who buy shit to over-compensate for the fact they are getting FUCKED. 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 12:40 | 3422356 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Well at least the guy you were talking to in NY does not show up at your house to shoot your dog for no reason like most cops.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 15:46 | 3423307 Trampy
Trampy's picture

Go out West where guns and ammo are readily available.   After the fake Newtown massacre, cops in a major city had a gun buyback and there was a crowd of "gun protectors" on the sidewalk paying more than the cops were paying, and they were buying anything that appeared in working order and didn't have the serial number ground off.  For all they knew, they could've been buying stolen guns but what they were doing was still perfectly legal.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 09:55 | 3421616 ultraticum
ultraticum's picture

Ah . . . the sweet smell of nullification in the morning!

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 09:56 | 3421619 observer007
observer007's picture

They know what they do: 

Central banks continue to buy gold

 

 

The central banks of emerging economies took advantage of the low gold prices in February and bought additional gold to diversify their currency reserves. 

 

http://homment.com/centralbanks-gold-buy

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:04 | 3421655 CH1
CH1's picture

Meanwhile, Mr. and Ms. 401K are clueless.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 09:55 | 3421620 saints51
saints51's picture

In Texas, lawmakers are considering a measure supported by Republican Governor Rick Perry to establish the Texas Bullion Depository to store gold bars valued at about $1 billion and held in a New York bank warehouse.

 

And its gone!!!

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:02 | 3421651 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

No hurry to build it.It will take seven years to get 15% of it.

What gold ?

It was here yesterday,I swear.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:19 | 3421697 saints51
saints51's picture

@ Winston-When i read this article that quote is what stood out from everything else. Texas will buy gold for preserving wealth for the people of Texas but allow it to be held at a fucking bank in New York of all places. Are you fucking serious? Whats the purpose of buying gold then? The only reason you would buy gold is to hedge against the us dollar due to the current monetary policy according to the article. Maybe Rick is using Texas tax money to double the purchases of Gold to fill the Fed's vault faster. The people of Texas definitely need to insist the gold is kept in Texas or they will be using those underground tunnels.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:25 | 3421767 RSBriggs
RSBriggs's picture

You missed something.  Texas is bulding their own repository to house the gold bullion CURRENTLY BEING HELD at the FED in New York.  They aren't planning to store it in New York.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:38 | 3421839 saints51
saints51's picture

Germans want their gold and got a 7 year time line for return. Texas wants their gold delivered after a repository is built so what will be that time line? I am sorry but anything that the FED is holding may not be there in the future. Its like trusting a pedophile baby sitting your children. I just would not trust the Fed with anything. They are the FED and can do whatever the fuck it wants. And we both know there is not one politician or law enforcement agency that would arrest these pieces of shit.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 15:33 | 3423248 Joe Sixpack
Joe Sixpack's picture

Chavez brought Venezuala's gold home, then died.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 12:43 | 3422364 Freddie
Freddie's picture

It is on that underground conveyor belt between JP Morgan Chase (Rockefeller-Rothschild) vault and the NY Fed.  It is like the street corner sheel game or three card monte.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 09:55 | 3421623 firstdivision
firstdivision's picture

The measure being considered in South Carolina would recognize foreign or domestic minted coins as legal tender

Someone should inform them that they may want to exclude all Russian bullion

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 09:58 | 3421634 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

Of course in Orwellian doublespeak, they will say any protective move a state makes will undermine faith in the dollar

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:09 | 3421676 carguym14
carguym14's picture

Yep,the Feds will put a stop to this if it looks like it's going to get too big.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 09:59 | 3421636 Tinky
Tinky's picture

Mere tradition. Nothing to see here folks – move along.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:00 | 3421639 orangegeek
orangegeek's picture

Politicians making decisions about the US Dollar vs gold and silver.  Right up there with the shoe shine boy handing out stock tips.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:03 | 3421648 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

It sounds like some of the states are disgruntled with the quality of the joobux lately.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:15 | 3421684 otto skorzeny
otto skorzeny's picture

speaking of that-where has Mr Sawyer been lately-probably went to Israel for Holocaust Remembrance Day festivities

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:03 | 3421649 Inthemix96
Inthemix96's picture

Let me guess,

Wouldnt be the walking corpse Soros behind this would it?

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:02 | 3421650 Lendo
Lendo's picture

Why would anyone want to deal with a barbaric relic such as gold?

 

/Bernanke 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:04 | 3421661 dick cheneys ghost
dick cheneys ghost's picture

''Just two months after Kennedy's assassination, in his first economic report to Congress, Johnson recommended that America "expedite the release of silver from the coinage."  Johnson discontinued the issuance of silver certificates in 1964, and the process of retiring the outstanding certificates began.  As if that were not damaging enough, Johnson followed with his second major monetary reform in 1965, claiming that "the growing shortage of silver" had to be addressed.''

 

http://www.americanthinker.com/2011/07/the_year_1965_and_the_destruction...

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:04 | 3421662 thebigmozey
thebigmozey's picture

Ever hear of the last time states wanted to do something different than the Federal Goobermnt?

They lost - starting with the Civil War, then the Civil Rights movement, then Obamacare.

Ammo is the best thing money can buy right now - or gold, if you can find a safe place to store it,

Gooberment is screwing US citiznes - and without a kiss, too!

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 14:11 | 3422737 Pelosis Usless Brain
Pelosis Usless Brain's picture

Civil War? I do believe you are referring to the War of Northern Aggression, also know as the War Against States Rights.

And Texans did not loose Sir, we are simply biding our time.

 

Tue, 04/09/2013 - 23:28 | 3429594 MeelionDollerBogus
Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:09 | 3421663 pappacass
pappacass's picture

I'm gonna push for the re-introduction of slave girls as currency here in Ireland.  We had success with that before.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:05 | 3421664 adr
adr's picture

Why would they want to do something like that? They should just make Bitcoin legal tender and be done with it, right? Right?

By the way the supply of Bitcoins is infinite. The supply of full Bitcoins may be set at 21 million, but as the value grows, there is greater supply as more and more people buy parts of a Bitcoin instead of the full unit. Since Bitcoins can be divided the supply is infinite. .1 Bitcoin is now worth the same as 1 Bitcoin a few weeks ago. Could we get to the point where .0000000001 Bitcoins is worth $100?

You can say the same about gold to a point, however eventually it becomes impractical to divide up a gold bar any further. I mean if a speck of Gold leaf is worth $100, a gust of wind could erase a fortune. Or perhaps everyone will carry electron microscopes to transact gold atoms.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:14 | 3421700 jeebus
jeebus's picture

This post is silly. The divisibility of bitcoins is what would allow for billions of people to transact with bitcoin instantly. Satoshis started with 21 million to allow for initial abundance followed by scarcity after mass adoption.

 

Gold could shoot through the roof to $1,000,000/ ounce. Then nobody would buy it. It's called a free market.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:35 | 3421823 adr
adr's picture

Bitcoin didn't start with 21 million available. Bitcoin started with scarcity which has been followed by the division of a Bitcoin making the supply abundant. If Bitcoin could not be divided, the supply would become scarce as more and more people tried to obtain it.

The supply of full Bitcoins is set at 21 million. Which will take over 140 years to "mine". The Bitcoin supply was supposed to be initially scarce.

Your argument is backwards.

Bitcoin is working like a massive stock split. As long as the value continues to increase, you will not lose anything splitting off parts of your Bitcoin and selling them. 1/10th of a Bitcoin will be worth what one Bitcoin was worth a short time ago.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:27 | 3421773 riphowardkatz
riphowardkatz's picture

wow you took that much time to prove how ignorant you are.  a lesson for you, the less you say the less foolish you will look.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:46 | 3421888 adr
adr's picture

Often times the ignorant are the first to call others the same. If you can't understand the point, then who is ignorant?

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 11:09 | 3421990 riphowardkatz
riphowardkatz's picture

you didnt have a point. a debit card couldnt be used with gold?

and bit coin keeps getting used in smaller increments....AND?? WHAT?

you are the classic idiot who thinks because his salary has doubled in twenty years you are making more. I get it. 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:08 | 3421673 Richard Head
Richard Head's picture

I hope this Steve Farley fellow is right after Blankfein and Dimon when the mob comes to hang scumbag bankers.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:14 | 3421699 Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

just sayin....

look what happens at the open in London and Ny....

every fucking day the same fucking pattern...

who is in London selling always at the open and also in NY????

http://www.kitco.com/charts/livesilver.html

 

you know who..........

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 13:54 | 3422593 Trampy
Trampy's picture

Sam Kirtley: "Proposing an Overnight Gold Fund"

http://www.kitco.com/ind/Kirtley_Sam/aug272010.html

Also look up Ranting Andy and his Plans A through D for silver/gold takedown times, Sunday Night Massacre, Leap Day massacre, etc. etc.  Also see the numerous Bernanke selloffs like the time someone dumped 10,000 contracts of GC (one million ounces sold at market) at the exact second he began his Humphrey-Hawkins testimony a while back, ticking gold down over $10 on next trade.  Size on that really was 10,000 contracts!

Now that's Momentum Ignition by folks so brazen they don't even bother to split up the orders, because even before the SEC was "invented" Jesse Livermore would always break up his orders to hit four different brokers at same time.  Did anyone even BOTHER to try and get the CFTC to see who dumped a million ounces of paper gold in one order?  Naah!  

 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:16 | 3421709 TalkToLind
TalkToLind's picture

All of your remaining purchasing power are belong to us.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:18 | 3421730 Bansters-in-my-...
Bansters-in-my- feces's picture

Hey maybe that's why the gold lease rate is like Negative 0.5%
And Silver is Negative -0.590% for a 6 month lease the bullion banks get PAID .590 % for the six moth silver lease so they can dumpit ontothe market

Check out the NEGATIVE LEASE RATES in Silver and Gold today
BigTime.
Fucking criminals running the show is all I can say.

Fuck YOUS all Central bankers.
How yous sleep at night is beyound me.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:20 | 3421736 yrbmegr
yrbmegr's picture

One suggestion.  Before you accept gold or silver coin as payment, you might want to check the purity first.  Just sayin.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:22 | 3421742 MyBrothersKeeper
MyBrothersKeeper's picture

The gov't will probably tout this as a good thing, only because they eventually confiscate the gold and make it illegal to hold it.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:23 | 3421747 adr
adr's picture

This is awesome, there has already been cashiers at McDonalds that accepted Monopoly money and given back real Federal Reserve Notes in change.

Now I'll be able to use Chuck E Cheese tokens to buy all kinds of things. You think those cashiers know the difference between brass and gold? Just say it's a foreign currency.

Man, a Chuck E Cheese token has to be at least a quarter ounce.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:41 | 3421857 TalkToLind
TalkToLind's picture

And those McDonalds cashiers are about to become even dumber:

Cashier position available; college degree required.

 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:25 | 3421756 sansnobel
sansnobel's picture

It is already legal for a state  to make Gold (Legal Tender)!!!  Read the US Constitution morons!!!!!  Article 1  Section 10.....Fucking Law makers can't even read much less write laws.  No wonder there is so much excess and redundancy in the law.  We have hired the Department of Redundancy Department...  If they want to give the finger to Bernanke and crew secession is the only way they will get the message. 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:32 | 3421804 Crash Overide
Crash Overide's picture

It's nice that 4 states have started to wake up but when the SHTF I doubt anyone will care what money laws will be in place when your bartering goods and buying food for silver and gold. People adapt and systems balance. 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:32 | 3421807 King_Julian
King_Julian's picture

The feared Krugman-MDB ZH cagematch tagteam. Fucking awesome! Sueey!!

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 11:49 | 3422154 fuu
fuu's picture

Better than tmosley vs trav7777 or akak vs Red Neck Repugnicant.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 14:08 | 3422708 akak
akak's picture

What, no mention of akak vs. AnAnonymous?

My US citizenism eternal nature is much hurted in the mattering way!

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 16:08 | 3423411 fuu
fuu's picture

I find those mostly tedious so I skip them. Sorry duder.

Tue, 04/09/2013 - 23:36 | 3429623 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

YES, my sorrying is much blobbing up too at lullaby opiumism of blab blah blab blah blab blah …. Zzzzzz

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:34 | 3421820 q99x2
q99x2's picture

The battle of the United States of America against the FED banksters and Washington D.C. has begun. Long live the revolution.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:45 | 3421856 steve from virginia
steve from virginia's picture

 

 

Back to the future! Welcome to the 19th century! Get on the train to the 18th century ... 14th century ... 10th century ...

 

why stop there? We'll all be living in caves just like that oil company lobbyist said on TV.

 

I love it, every day a step toward a car-free America. Long shoes ... and walking sticks.

 

How many rednecks own gold? (Crickets)

 

How many Wall Street bankers own gold? Back in the 'gold heyday' in the 19th century, J. P. Morgan and the banking clique owned 90% of the country's gold ... which is why most Americans used banknotes (issued by private banks). Gold = bankers.

 

How many will spend golden 'purchasing power' on gasoline? Exxon-Saudia will have all that golden purchasing power nobody else will have any purchasing power at all.

 

How many will turn over gold 'money' to the state of Texas to pay property and other nuisance taxes? Texas and the rest will have all the golden purchasing power and nobody else will have any.

 

Demand by the Sovereign for gold to pay taxes and private debts was the primary reason for the American Revolution ... as well as for various other 'insurrections' in the US (Great Depression).  Be careful of what you wish for, you might get it.

 

 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 11:06 | 3421976 riphowardkatz
riphowardkatz's picture

"An almost hysterical antagonism toward the gold standard is one issue which unites statists of all persuasions. They seem to sense — perhaps more clearly and subtly than many consistent defenders of laissez-faire — that gold and economic freedom are inseparable, that the gold standard is an instrument of laissez-faire and that each implies and requires the other."

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 17:51 | 3423914 steve from virginia
steve from virginia's picture

 

 

Don't misunderstand ... I personally like the idea of a gold standard, a nail in the coffin of modernity as we know it ... excuse me, as you know it.

 

The sooner the better.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:42 | 3421868 q99x2
q99x2's picture

Bitcoin High:$194.50000 (current hourly high)

On its way to $796,000

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:52 | 3421919 adr
adr's picture

It could be worth $1 million, doesn't mean you'll be able to trade it back for $1 million when it hits that value.

Try placing an order to trade 100 Bitcoins out for the dollar value. Most likely, you'll need to wait a while.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 11:42 | 3422125 Blano
Blano's picture

The next Bitcoin flash crash should be epic.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:49 | 3421903 franzpick
franzpick's picture

Every country that has a non-value-based currency issued by a private 'bank' (federal reserve) charging interest, has or soon will be going down the financial drain when equity and bond prices and world trade collapse, and shortages and rioting ensue.

But then Biden the Moronic can pull a Bush41 ("I said 'No new 'taxis' '") and clarify his recent NWO call to have been for a New World Money Order.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:53 | 3421915 steve from virginia
steve from virginia's picture

 

 

It's funny! People over here believe the 'Dr Paul Krugman' is the real Paul Krugman.

 

They get baited out by an Internet troll. (Snicker ...) They probably also believe WWE wrestling is real ...

 

Steve from Virginia is the real Steve from Virginia.

 

:)

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 10:54 | 3421925 overmedicatedun...
overmedicatedundersexed's picture

steve you ignorant slut, you think we don't know that?? having read many of your posts you never understood much you opined on. liberal drivel thy name is steve.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 13:31 | 3422515 forwardho
forwardho's picture

Steve from Virginia is a freind of mine, and you sir are no steve from virginia.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 11:02 | 3421960 riphowardkatz
riphowardkatz's picture

all for gold but making it legal tender doesn't really do anything.  the only way to make a difference is for there to be a return to the gold standard.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 11:18 | 3422024 The Abstraction...
The Abstraction of Justice's picture

Will anyone take such a standard seriously, when all the goverments broke the standards in the first place? Need first to purge the banksters, before anything good can come to pass. Justice must come first.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 14:00 | 3422669 Alpha Monkey
Alpha Monkey's picture

If people choose to use it, it becomes the standard.  It's as simple as that.  No government needed...  But they can certainly help by doing what the private banks won't do, which is provide platforms for gold and silver to be used like we use cash today.  Debit cards, savings accounts, secure storage, transfers, etc.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 14:50 | 3422996 riphowardkatz
riphowardkatz's picture

try paying your taxes in gold. there is a standard needed or writing a government contract in gold

Tue, 04/09/2013 - 23:44 | 3429653 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

Goldmoney is a step in this direction. Europacific Capital with Peter Schiff has a gold-backed credit-card now too.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 11:13 | 3422003 Bingfa
Bingfa's picture

North Korea readies missle launch as fears of a covert Cyber war grow....

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/apr/07/north-korea-missile-launch-c...

Now we see where this is going....

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 11:15 | 3422013 MrBoompi
MrBoompi's picture

Believing a paper dollar bill is actually worth $1 is no different from believing a 1-oz gold Eagle is worth $20 or a 1-oz silver Eagle is worth $1.  These new "laws" are only going to work if they value of the gold or silver is not tied to the face value of the coins.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 11:39 | 3422116 Blano
Blano's picture

Until states start PAYING in gold and silver, this just doesn't mean much.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 13:54 | 3422646 Alpha Monkey
Alpha Monkey's picture

Why? States can continue paying people in USD, while providing them with a banking infrastructure that permits the purchase, saving and spending of accounts of gold.  They don't need to pay gold, just create a platform for it's use.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 11:48 | 3422147 pndr4495
pndr4495's picture

If I recall correctly the CME accepts gold/silver as margin for the trading of its listed products. It is a commodity market/exchange. The CME is involved in international as well as interstate commerce. It's ludicrous that gold and silver , regardless of the form it takes , is not considered money. Try not to overlook the simple. It's easy to clustereff something.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 12:17 | 3422242 Trampy
Trampy's picture

Nope.  USD and T-bills are the only acceptable margin for CME.  Do ya really think your broker will let you bring in bags of junk silver or even a monster box of ASEs to fund a futures trading account or meet a margin call?

If I recall correctly the CME accepts gold/silver as margin for the trading of its listed products.

The closest you can get is margin relief on your paper PM "holdings" in that account for a pairs trade like platinum-gold 1:1 spread, or for Da Boyz, it could be GC-SI at ~ 1:50.

'

 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 14:03 | 3422672 Urban Redneck
Mon, 04/08/2013 - 15:32 | 3423050 Trampy
Trampy's picture

oh, really?  well, name just one of those (BETTER) retail brokers.

Tue, 04/09/2013 - 23:33 | 3429598 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

Nope, last year it was already announced that gold is acceptable as margin. Category 3 in that other link there, 15% haircut applied to the market value Utilizing JP Morgan Chase, Deutsche Bank, and HSBC only

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 12:01 | 3422215 Bansters-in-my-...
Bansters-in-my- feces's picture

Take a look at the one year gold lease rate chart at kitco for an idea why gold is getting wacked again today.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 12:58 | 3422407 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

That is not the rate to lease gold.  This is the real data you want:

http://www.lbma.org.uk/pages/?page_id=55&title=gold_forwards&show=2013

The stated "lease Rate" is Libor minus GOFO.  It is at least a 50% totally cooked number that means nothing.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 12:00 | 3422223 GraveyardSpiral
GraveyardSpiral's picture

Finally, real HOPE going FORWARD!!!!!!!!!

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 12:02 | 3422225 One World Mafia
One World Mafia's picture

Originally there was no peg and that worked better. Peter Schiff Gold Standard Explained:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4a0Uv37png

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 12:04 | 3422240 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

Wow, if we don't keep paying our income tax, the roads and schools go away. 

Someone got the memo from Obama.

How about this:  we start by eliminating foreign aid and support to think tanks engaged in social engineering.  And we make the schools teach what we want taught, basically skills, knowledge and no PC propaganda.

Your problem, Krugman, is that the age of broadcasting is over.  The American people no longer have to sit passively while the wisdom of "experts", such as yourself, washes over us.

It's over.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 12:17 | 3422276 Bansters-in-my-...
Bansters-in-my- feces's picture

Silver 6 month lease rate right now at kitco shows - 0.600%

Thats Negative .60%...!!!!

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 12:46 | 3422373 news printer
news printer's picture

Jerry on min wage and inflation

http://youtu.be/ivJ4rrnidE0?t=50s

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 13:01 | 3422418 Son of Loki
Son of Loki's picture

'Scotty, she's gonna blow....'

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 13:07 | 3422438 caimen garou
caimen garou's picture

you know the US is in a hell of a mess when a fool like krugman is going to post bullshit here on ZH if in fact it is really him,along with million dollar butthole spewing bullshit out of their mouths as they know that the current system is falling apart or they would'nt be here! so the question is why are these fools that are so intent on making a point that everyone knows is total FUBAR! also paul as for you being such a great economist and nobel peace prize winner, should'nt you be doing something for the good of this economy! like helping us out and moving to china!

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 13:17 | 3422463 Downtoolong
Downtoolong's picture

I don’t see undercutting our entire financial structure as a priority.

They should have emphasized that to Wall Street five years ago.

 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 13:32 | 3422521 aerojet
aerojet's picture

Didn't they kill Kennedy for wanting to move the US back to a silver standard?  "They" are going to have a lot more people to kill this time around.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 13:43 | 3422581 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

Dr. PK has a "job" to do, which he does well.  He's looking after his masters and own interests very well, like most people.  I get that and don't fault him for it -- nor should anyone else, I submit -- and I don't get hot & bothered by it, the way so many here do.  In a sense loves to 'wind' up these people.  Without sounding disrespectful of these people, it does remind me of aggravating a junkyard dog:  Easy targets.  He is thus correct when he (honestly) admits that this 'exercise' allows him to sharpen his argument/skills for his own blog site.

Where he and I part company, is that his economic views are not founded on laws of Nature or Human Nature, since he comes from the Flat Earth school of economics that calls itself Keynesian.   Mine is the post-Newtonian world view of economics:  Austrian.  My fundamental position, and I think the Austrian school also, is that "Anything not founded on the laws of nature or human nature is not sustainable, and will reset or collapse eventually".

I have no problem debating him or his kind.  But, as someone once said, "Before we debate, let's define our terms".  Also, as a prerequisite, we need to disclose our fundamental world view.  This provides our relative reference frames, from which we hope to make a translation from one reference frame to another via our debate.  W/o doing these two things (defining terms and disclosing reference frames), there is ZERO change of making any kind of headway.  Even with it, the odds are not that good, because of Human Nature:  most people are way too emotional/reptilian in their thinking.  Most just cannot overcome the cognitive dissonance when their argument is exposed as flawed or wrong (Assumptions are incomplete/incorrect and/or Logic is flawed). 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 13:58 | 3422656 Colonial Intent
Colonial Intent's picture

AN AMERICAN CORPORATION
You have two cows.
You sell one, and force the other to
produce the milk of four cows.
Later, you hire a consultant to analyse why
the cow has dropped dead.

A GREEK CORPORATION
You have two cows. You borrow lots of euros to build barns, milking sheds, hay stores, feed sheds,
dairies, cold stores, abattoir, cheese unit and packing sheds.
You still only have two cows.

A FRENCH CORPORATION
You have two cows.
You go on strike, organise a riot, and block the roads, because you want three
cows.

A JAPANESE CORPORATION
You have two cows.
You redesign them so they are one-tenth the size of an ordinary cow and produce
twenty times the milk.
You then create a clever cow cartoon image called a Cowkimona and
market it worldwide.

AN ITALIAN CORPORATION
You have two cows,
but you don't know where they are.
You decide to have lunch.

A SWISS CORPORATION
You have 5000 cows. None of them belong to you.
You charge the owners for storing them.

A CHINESE CORPORATION
You have two cows.
You have 300 people milking them.
You claim that you have full employment, and high bovine productivity.
You arrest the newsman who reported the real situation.

AN INDIAN CORPORATION
You have two cows.
You worship them.

A BRITISH CORPORATION
You have two cows.
Both are mad.

AN IRAQI CORPORATION
Everyone thinks you have lots of cows.
You tell them that you have none.
No-one believes you, so they bomb the ** out of you and invade your country.
You still have no cows, but at least you are now a Democracy.

AN AUSTRALIAN CORPORATION
You have two cows.
Business seems pretty good.
You close the office and go for a few beers to celebrate.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 14:06 | 3422720 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

Old but still funny.  Where's Francis Sawyer, to ask about an Israeli corporation?  ;-)

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 15:42 | 3423293 Joe Sixpack
Joe Sixpack's picture

An Israeli Corp.

You have 2 cows.

You cage them in a strong encolsure and bomb them.

You justify it by saying they attacked you with gas (farting).

 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 14:06 | 3422707 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

As we witness the beginning of the end of the USD as the Global Reserve Currency (GRC), we will have one of 4 possible outcomes, if Jim Rickards is correct.  And I believe he is.  In all fairness, you'd have to ask or follow him to find out more.  But having listened to Rickards at Simon Black's event a week ago, I am hedging for 3 of the 4 possible outcomes.

A Gold standard (re-anchoring fiat currency to gold at some TBD reserve ratio) is one possible outcome.  Chaos is another possible outcome.  The other two scenarios that he talked about, and which make perfect sense (rational and evidence-based) are also possible.

The CB's in the West that are in proverbial ICU condition.  They are broke and insolvent, with geriatric demographics.  They are trying to stretch things out -- to play for time (for themselves, their families and their friends), while trying to avoid mass-panic of the sheep.  They are desperate to avoid a global Reset of their junk-currencies -- and the US more so than anyone else, because of the economics, political and military consequences of losing the dollar's GRC status:  No more gunboat diplomacy, no more Ueber-Bully of the world.  The rest of the world is just too fed up with the bankrupt countries of the West (US, UK, Japan, France, Italy, Spain), and the Day of Reckoning -- massive repudiation of the USD -- is not too far away.  Complexity theory teaches us that it will start small, but then accelerate fast -- like an avalanche or chain-reaction.

Unless the US can provoke a major global war (by starting it via proxies far from home), the USD's days are the GRC are numbered.  Plan & hedge accordingly.

 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 14:33 | 3422836 auric1234
auric1234's picture

The CME is calling in for more weak leveraged 1000:1 longs in Bloomberg TV.

http://www.bloomberg.com/video/trade-tomorrow-s-gold-trend-today-EH2u5A1...

 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 14:32 | 3422869 midtowng
midtowng's picture

It's sort of pointless unless states want to issue their own currency, and to do that they have to leave the union, which means war.

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 14:34 | 3422880 auric1234
auric1234's picture

Actually, the Constitution only forbids them from issuing FIAT. Gold and silver are allowed.

And private individuals can issue too. The important is legal tender status, beyond anything else.

 

Mon, 04/08/2013 - 16:19 | 3423450 Alcuin Bramerton
Alcuin Bramerton's picture

Interesting that the Josef Ackermann / UBS / Liechtenstein LLB syndicate is so busy trying to buy physical gold in Asia at the moment. Their agents are said to be all over the warehouses in Jakarta, Kuala Lumpur, Manila, Bangkok, Hong Kong and Taipei.

 

I wonder what they are trying to pay with? Surely not Euros?

 

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