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Gold Bitcoined, Bonds And Yen Soar, Dow Back To Unch (Of Course)

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Gold was Bitcoin'd (or Baumgartner'd) as it suffered its biggest daily drop since LTRO2 on 2/29/12. The JPY rallied over 1% - its biggest rise in 7 weeks. 10Y Treasuries had their best day in 7 weeks. Macro data was absymal. But it was evident that the only thing mattered was a new high close for the Dow - as we noted 10 minutes before the close:

 

 

And thanks to some help from the old ramp standbys - HYG and VIX - they nearly made it (but not quite) as the Dow ended -0.08 points rallying 75 points off the lows on the worst macro data day in months, with the EURUSD ramping just the right amount over 1.31.

 

Not a good day for Commodities... gold...

 

A Great day for bonds...

 

Not a good day for JPY carry traders and the rest of Western Civilzation banking on Abenomics to save the world...

 

But The Dow came through so mom and pop wouldnt even know the stuff had hit the economic fan...

 

The S&P did not have such a sgood day though once Europe closed the algos were in charge and we oscillated around VWAP... and closed prefectly balance at VWAP...

 

But FX land was more active today than it has been a week or two...

 

as Treasuries reversed almost all their losses on the week...

 

Not a fun week for precious metals (or oil for that matter)...

 

 

VIS compressed back to the market (as hedges were lifted) but we note that market breadth was weak - suggesting the macro hedges were lifted as single-name positions were reduced also...

 

Charts: Bloomberg and Capital Context

 

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Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:23 | 3442612 fuu
fuu's picture

100.25

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:24 | 3442626 malikai
malikai's picture

Isn't it odd how a currency can "collapse" yet still be worth $100?

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:28 | 3442667 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

What's a dollar?

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:36 | 3442696 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture

Premiums came up a little on silver and dealers are reporting robust sales.  

It won't be long before they run out, or premiums jump through the roof.  

I know, we've heard that all before, but I always stepped in and said "Not True" and pointed to the link below as proof.

This time, premiums have come up. Not a tremendous amount mind you, but as a % due to the lower price, more than most realize.

Gold and Silver still trading for a bit longer. Watch how it finished up here:  http://www.pmbull.com/silver-price/

How many dealers will find technical issues with their sites and have to suspend sales over the weekend, hoping for a big Monday bounce?

 

 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:39 | 3442750 CH1
CH1's picture

Maybe the overlords have something scheduled for this weekend?

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:43 | 3442771 Rubicon
Rubicon's picture

One thing is for sure... Sinclair et al have no fucking idea whats going on.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:51 | 3442824 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

I think he's got the big picture but I think he doesn't understand how the "markets" operate now--the scale of the goonery.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:14 | 3442927 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

@CH1 ^^^^^... "Maybe the overlords have something scheduled for this weekend?"

~~~

Not to worry... You've ASSURED everyone... to date... that BITCOINS are impervious to anything & that jews have nothing to do with anything...

OVERLORDS???... How could that ever be possible?...

I'm a 'conjecture' oriented 'INTELLECTUALIST'... Same as you are...

I'm just not as SMART as you... So I 'beg' your reasoning...

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:35 | 3443014 CH1
CH1's picture

So I 'beg' your reasoning...

<crickets>

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:10 | 3443104 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

naturally ~ 'CRICKETS'... smartest thing you've ever said or commented upon...

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:35 | 3443181 fonestar
fonestar's picture

BLAH ~~ 'blah' Blah, Jews, Blah, BLAH ~~ '~'

Sat, 04/13/2013 - 12:00 | 3444530 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

BLAH BLAH BLAH Bitcoin is best thing ever, you are all fools who will envy me soon enough BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:35 | 3443182 fonestar
fonestar's picture

.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 23:41 | 3443994 Hive Raid
Hive Raid's picture

What do you really know? Manipulation?

Look at the 10 year silver and gold versus money supply:

 

http://www.kitco.com/charts/historicalsilver.html   (multi-year silver etc)

http://www.shadowstats.com/charts/monetary-base-money-supply

 

These fluctuations correlate pretty well, no?

There was exuberance and fear in 2011, but also a rapidly expanding money supply.

They are printing lots of money, but presumably there is significant deleveraging in an economy that has been offshored--meaning debt pay-downs and defaults collapse money supply due to the fractional reserve dynamic. Perhaps the printing is just offsetting the deleveraging.

I don't know. That's why I didn't buy in the 40s or 30s.

Ignoring the correlation and looking only at the 10 year trend, 26 silver does not seem like an amazing deal, especially if you chop off the ~50 bubble and write that off as a little mania. At 20 it may be a great buy.

People speculate on the cost to mine, but silver was under 10 in 2006. Does that mean miners were losing money if you trust seeking alpha's $25 to mine estimation? I doubt it.

It's all relative. What do you really know?

I don't study economics, so I welcome you to tell us why this is wrong.

 

 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:51 | 3442832 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Sinclair et al have no fucking idea whats going on.

I took a look at his blog, too funny, guy has lost his mind. What's Sprott saying? Let me guess - buy my ETF's, everything's on sale!! One time only!! Buy now or forever be shut out!!

It's a great mystery why anyone is even still in his etfs. Or maybe they aren't...

http://www.google.ca/finance?cid=882109556598902

Genius at work!

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:07 | 3442900 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture

Well, he isn't in them.  Or is in them a lot less as of a few days ago (nice timing).

He was sellign the hell out of PSLV a few days ago, from his charitable trust.  

When other "gurus" asked about it, he first replied that it was because he had certain charitable obligations. Then he said he was going to swap the PHYZ for Miners.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:30 | 3442991 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Then he said he was going to swap the PHYZ for Miners.

Sounds legit lol

Maybe he dumped the cash into one of their recent favourites CIS.to - phenomenal performance this week!

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:00 | 3443083 thewhitelion
thewhitelion's picture

Not that it means much, but I swapped some PHYS for RGLD and SLW yesterday.  Looked at the charts and just could not resist.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:18 | 3443127 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture

Well, to be fair, I was thinking about doing just that, but didn't sell in time to do it.

If Sprott follows through and does buy miners, after today's big dip, having first sat on cash...  Well, respect man.

I just always wonder how the billionaires know when it is coming. Especially Sprott, who is a supposed adversary of the Fed! 

Sat, 04/13/2013 - 00:47 | 3444067 HedgeHammer
HedgeHammer's picture

Aside from nailing down one's loyalties be it good or bad. The Good guys have moles too and plenty of money to buy information. Just saying.

Sat, 04/13/2013 - 08:12 | 3444272 Gazooks
Gazooks's picture

GS says short, money shorts

 

who the fuck needs a mole when you have satan itself

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:56 | 3442855 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture

LOL.  Check it out, they just stuffed Silver under $26 in the last few minutes.  

 

Maybe Sinclair is a tool of those that want to push PM's lower.  Possible? All his fame comes from what, one call that a bull market would start, at an inflection point?

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:25 | 3442968 catacl1sm
catacl1sm's picture

It's almost in free fall. Fucking amazing. Bitcoined bitchez.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:02 | 3443086 Bunga Bunga
Bunga Bunga's picture

Gold bitcoined, but bitcoin gets golden ... trading above 100 again.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:22 | 3443141 Mine Is Bigger
Mine Is Bigger's picture

The way it is going, bitcon may hit an all-time high in a week or two.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:55 | 3443243 Supernova Born
Supernova Born's picture

"Bitcoined" sure made it to verb quickly.

They have a verb, the proponents now need a nickname.

Bitcoin viri.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 19:34 | 3443347 Bunga Bunga
Bunga Bunga's picture

... here we go ... bitcoined.com

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:33 | 3443174 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Thought I'd never see 1400 again...as they say, timing is everything.

I hope to hell all the rest of the "former sovereigns" of europe are forced to exchange all of it to cover their debt...the object (for us) has always been to relieve them of as much of it as possible.

Its clear, they can't be trusted with it ;-)

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:00 | 3443082 Croesus
Croesus's picture

Yes, guys who've been in the business longer than you've been alive have NO CLUE what's happening....because they've never seen this before.....

 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:58 | 3443248 1fortheroad
1fortheroad's picture

What's Happening??

Uncle Ben is injecting 85 billion a month and you expect the Markets to be rational??

 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 20:58 | 3443622 Papasmurf
Papasmurf's picture

He can't stop or things will completely collapse.  Morphine withdrawal would kill the patient.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:18 | 3443124 AllWorkedUp
AllWorkedUp's picture

Absolutely no fucking clue is right. This ain't the 70's and 80's. This is the era of manipulation 24/7 and the crushing of any semblance of free markets or threat to the USD fiat joke. Sinclair and all the rest of them should just shut their pieholes.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:50 | 3443240 johngaltfla
johngaltfla's picture

Gold Bulls and traditional market gurus have NO CLUE AS TO WHAT IS ABOUT TO HIT!!!!!

 

Attention Carry Concealed Licensees, Ham Radio Operators, and Precious Metals Owners: Registration is Confiscation

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:59 | 3442865 HardAssets
HardAssets's picture

World War 3 ?

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:26 | 3443150 deKevelioc
deKevelioc's picture

This take-down smells of incredible desperation.  What can be so bad that these jokers need to trash paper metals?  We all know, but could there be something worse, like war?  When I saw the metals sliding from levels that are already cheap, something BIG must be on the horizon.  It's amzing to be around to see this insanity, and it will get worse.  We haven't seen the final act, yet.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:13 | 3442925 Room 101
Room 101's picture

Yeah, premiums are up.  A couple percent today.  Naturally, the decrease in price is due to a decrease in demand.  That's why premiums are up and the dealers are overwhelmed.Here is a dealer price comparison tool.  Note that the head of Liberty Coin and Precious Metal is a ZHer. 

https://comparesilverprices.com/

 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:42 | 3442772 malikai
malikai's picture

Lovely little trinkets with all sorts of beautiful pictures of masonic symbolism intertwined with a denominational symbol, featuring a long dead figure who turns just a little, every time one is printed.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 21:37 | 3443721 jekyll island
jekyll island's picture

A dollar is an IOU nothing

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:28 | 3442668 TraderTimm
TraderTimm's picture

Waiting for the "Gold is dead" pronouncements... oh wait, markets can fall and it will still be around?

Amazing.

But of course if bitcoin has a decline its the end of the WORLD. (To some rather misinformed people.)

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:06 | 3442901 fonestar
fonestar's picture

The gold and silver only crowd:

"The enemy of an enemy is an enemy"

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:05 | 3443092 Croesus
Croesus's picture

Poor Buttcoin Pumpers.....

What's it going to take, to get it in your thick heads that Buttcoin is NOT 'anti-establishment'?It's not "Good as Gold".

 

 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:40 | 3443210 fonestar
fonestar's picture

It doesn't get any more anti-establishment than Bitcoin! 

And there is no comparison between gold and Bitcoin!  YOU are making that up!

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:44 | 3443224 dick cheneys ghost
dick cheneys ghost's picture

Tell me how many bitcoins in this picture.........

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you can guess the right answer, Ill give them to you.........

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:49 | 3443237 Croesus
Croesus's picture

@ Fonestar:

No, I never claimed Buttcoin is good as gold. Your fellow BTC pumpers were doing that. Anti-establishment? I call bullshit.

It doesn't get any more pro-establishment than a 'currency' that travels along the net architecture (bought and paid-for, by TPTB), and maintains a record of ownership (like http://www.wheresgeorge.com/). It doesn't get any more track-able than that.

The legal framework isn't there, but that's today. DotGov would love to be able to know how you spend your money, where you spend it, when you spend it, and more importantly, "did you pay taxes".

It's about power, man.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 19:29 | 3443332 fonestar
fonestar's picture

"bought and paid-for by TPTB" are you serious?

So you are saying because ARPANET was government funded research program 40 years ago they control all network devices on Earth?  I am not even going to debate this.  Just the lack of basic reasoning is disturbing. 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 21:46 | 3443747 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

Why don't you check who owns the most used, largest capacity network transit paths & hubs NOW.

Then you can give yourself a -1.

Sat, 04/13/2013 - 02:13 | 3444118 fonestar
fonestar's picture

I know the people who own hubs... the ones that didn't upgrade to a switch back in 1997?  LOL...

Sat, 04/13/2013 - 00:46 | 3444068 Croesus
Croesus's picture

@ FONESTAR:

Not saying DotGov controls it, just that they have unrestricted access to all of it. DotGov is a revolving door for BigBiz. Do you think that net architecture was put in place without backdoors for DotGov?

To quote your words: "Just the lack of basic reasoning is disturbing."

To prove that point, consider the DotGov-BigBiz incest in these diagrams:

http://endthelie.com/2012/04/18/18-venn-diagrams-showing-how-corrupted-a...

This is a very superficial study on that.

Now, to show you that DotGov LIKES BITCOIN, I submit for your perusal:

http://developer.mintchipchallenge.com/challenge.php

 

That's right, young Fonestar, it's the Mintchip Challenge, brought to you by the Royal Canadian Mint! A contest to develop e-currency apps. Geeh, sounds a lot like Buttcoin to me, only it's a Canadian DotGov agency. And the irony of it all? The contest winner got $50,000 in Gold Bullion.

Now, I'm sure you'll come up with some justification like "well, that's Canada, not here"........Cyprus is Cyprus, not here or Canada, but similar bail-in plans are in place (or in effect) in all 3, are they not?

There was a reason I said "Bitcoin plays right into the hands of the establishment it claims to be fighting against".

(h/t Terminus C)

Sat, 04/13/2013 - 02:11 | 3444116 fonestar
fonestar's picture

That is completely false.  The Canadian MintChip was anounced a few years back and I have heard nothing of it since.  Besides the fact that MintChip is also a digital currency, it has absolutely **nothing** similar to Bitcoin in terms of protocol, issuance and architecture.  MintChip is a centrally planned, centrally controlled currency by The Bank of Canada.  Bitcoin has no central authority.  You may wish to actually bother reading up on some of these obvious differences, unless of course your primary purpose was just to help spread FUD which I don't discount.

Sat, 04/13/2013 - 10:03 | 3444372 Croesus
Croesus's picture

@ Fonestar:

No attempts at spreading FUD here. I personally don't care what anyone does, but allow me to point something out to you:

DotGov version of Bitcoin, or Bitcoin version of Bitcoin? Who will win that fight?

DotGov can easily classify Bitcoin users as "subversives", "dangerous terrorists", "criminal elements", etc.

Under that guise, DotGov can enact laws against Bitcoin, and criminalize its use and acceptance.

They'll give the law a name, like "The E-Currency Freedom Act", or something to that effect.

 

 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:15 | 3442936 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

Maybe now that the European Central Bank sees that GLD is going down, they won't be taking the physical Gold out of Cyprus.  LoL!  Draghi thinks those little cypridiots won't be needing that yellow relic any longer. What they need is more Euros.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:30 | 3443162 Mine Is Bigger
Mine Is Bigger's picture

.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:53 | 3443246 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

That's exactly what Cyprus will be left with.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:28 | 3442672 fonestar
fonestar's picture

$26 silver?  I never thought we'd be here in the spring of 2013.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:45 | 3442731 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Let's see...

~~~

It's Friday, April 12th... I have to PAY MY TAXES on Monday, April 15th...

Since I'm short on 'CASH', I'll just liquidate my GLD/SLV 'paper' positions that I knew all along, because I have an 'Illuminati GET OUT OF JAIL FREE' card [with instructions], [MAYBE MY NAME IS EVEN GEORGE MOTHERFUCKING UNDEAD SOROS], so I won't be subject to 'CAPITAL GAINS' taxes in 2014...

You know, sinced I'm UNDEAD [& not a 12yo GENIUS marketplaya like that fonestar, & those other dweebs who have already bragged, [on a public internet blog], about the PROFITS that they made by TOPTICKING bitcoin [that the IRS is TOTALLY uninterested in]... I'll just SELL [because only THOSE geniuses are the only ones who know how to hide from the tax authorities]

~~~

Nonstop COMEDY on ZH...

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:55 | 3442849 TraderTimm
TraderTimm's picture

@francis "random bold tilde" sawyer

Are they transmitting to you again on the other 'precious metal' frequency?

I see two tilde lines - did they up the medication?

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:17 | 3442949 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

They???... I'm confused... Who is THEY?...

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 19:35 | 3443351 Hulk
Hulk's picture

Everybody but us !!!

 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:02 | 3442878 Poor Grogman
Poor Grogman's picture

Relax dude.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:13 | 3443110 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

I thought you hipsters spelled it 'dood'...

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:39 | 3443202 fonestar
fonestar's picture

d00d

Sat, 04/13/2013 - 02:28 | 3444132 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Ok 'd00d'

~~~

While you're having so much fun with your buddies, CH1, & Trader Timm... Come on... We all want to hear it... This is 'tax weekend'...

So, in between all the fun & hijinks you & your friends are having by criticizing the francis_sawyer method of syntax... Please ~ brag to us MOAR about all the tax free profits you've made trading in & out of bitcoin... We need to be reminded how stupid we all are...

Sat, 04/13/2013 - 12:39 | 3444627 fonestar
fonestar's picture

I'm not trading out of BTC, I know you could and take profits but I just want more.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:44 | 3442776 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

I think there's still a decent amount of downside, the silver report on the 19th is likely to be a big disappointment too. 

Though the bugs on here will come up with a million reasons why it's all bullshit. 

Once pms pick up heading toward fall I bet you'll see a decent rebound, question is to what range. 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:54 | 3442840 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Why is Tulving out of 12 silver items and there are record setting sales going on at the US Mint then?

Maybe open your eyes to whats really going on or just STFU.

 

 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:04 | 3442887 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Why is Tulving out of 12 silver items and there are record setting sales going on at the US Mint then?
Maybe open your eyes to whats really going on or just STFU.

Yeah that's what people were saying about gold until the WGC report came out and made a mockery of that thinking. The hardcore goldbugs of course simply denied it all, but everyone with a rational brain accepted it. 

And hucksters like Sprott took parts of the report they liked and mischaracterized the rest but such is life!

On the 19th this myth of phys silver shortages is also going to be dispelled. 

I'm not anti-gold or silver either, would love to see them skyrocket. 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:09 | 3442911 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

The WGC report? Sprott a "huckster"? LOL...

Are you really this stupid James or are you just having some fun trolling?

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:22 | 3442958 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Sprott and his merry band of lying wankers get paid to lose money and trade against the people investing in their funds / stock picks. Some of the worst stock promoters I've seen.

They will literally hard sell grandmas a POS penny stock exploration prospect just so they can make a few bucks dumping it. 

Sprott ETF performance is pure garbage - simply based on that his opinions should be tossed. Yet he goes around buying up websites and making sure his voice (and his buddies) is ubiquitous in certain circles.

If you think the WGC report is joke, well whatever. 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:25 | 3442979 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Yeah, and thats why he has his entire fortune invested in gold and silver.

And no, not the WGC report, the WGC itself is a fucking joke.

 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:36 | 3443010 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Yeah, and thats why he has his entire fortune invested in gold and silver.

You mean he has his clients entire fortunes invested in gold and silver. 

And no, not the WGC report, the WGC itself is a fucking joke.

Pray tell what insider knowledge you have that makes you state this claim so authoritatively. 

Funny, when the WGC was showing a bullish case for gold everyone was in love with it and would quote the reports verbatim. Now that their research is making a bearish case all of a sudden they are a 'fucking joke' to goldbugs.

Co-incidence...?

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:39 | 3443027 akak
akak's picture

I don't recall the (so-called) WGC ever being particularly bullish on gold --- just the opposite, they usually sound more like a slightly diluted version of Jon Nadler on gold's price prospects.  That, and their consistent downplaying if not denial of the monetary aspects of gold, and their insistence on trying to treat it as just another commodity like cotton or corn, and their disingenuous supply-demand statistics which again invariably try to mask and downplay the investment sector of the gold market, all lead me to see the WGC as just another (if not quite so egregiously obvious) anti-gold tool of the financial and political PTB.

To deny this is to deny the obvious.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:47 | 3443043 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

I don't recall the (so-called) WGC ever being particularly bullish on gold --- just the opposite, they usually sound more like a slightly diluted version of Jon Nadler on gold's price prospects.  

Memory can be faulty, a good reason not to trust it and use google instead. 

http://www.gold.org/investment/research/regular_reports/gold_demand_tren...

Check 2010, 2011. Then take a look at 2002-2007. Bullish case year after year.

Incidentally, they're still optimistic currently but their report paints a bearish picture. 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:58 | 3443067 akak
akak's picture

Be that as it may (I am not conceding the point of the WGC being bearish on gold, but I just do not have instant access to that data, as those PDFs will not readily open for me), it is an undeniable fact that the WGC routinely goes far out of its way to downplay if not outright deny gold as a monetary instrument, and to minimize and trivialize gold investment as mere "jewelry" and as a "collectable", which I note you failed to address.

Once again, as in our argument last month regarding worldwide gold jewelry being mainly actual gold investment demand, you prove yourself quite dishonest and disingenuous on the subject of gold.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:13 | 3443108 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

but I just do not have instant access to that data, as those PDFs will not readily open for me

You need to give them a moment to download as they are a couple MB. 

deny gold as a monetary instrument, and to minimize and trivialize gold investment as mere "jewelry" and as a "collectable", which I note you failed to address.

Not going to argue this, but let's say that's true. So what? Their research is still top notch and highly predictive of where the overall market is trending. 

Once again, as in our argument last month regarding worldwide gold jewelry being mainly actual gold investmentdemand, you prove yourself quite dishonest and disingenuous on the subject of gold.

If people had sold when I brought all that up they would've been able to rebuy today for ~$180 less. So my 'dishonesty' could've saved you $180 / oz, much better performance than 'honest' guys like Sprott!

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:20 | 3443125 akak
akak's picture

 

Once again, as in our argument last month regarding worldwide gold jewelry being mainly actual gold investmentdemand, you prove yourself quite dishonest and disingenuous on the subject of gold.

---------------------------------

If people had sold when I brought all that up they would've been able to rebuy today for ~$180 less. So my 'dishonesty' could've saved you $180 / oz, much better performance than 'honest' guys like Sprott!

Um, great way to completely evade the point that I raised.

Incidentally, nice job of reaffirming your evasive and dishonest arguments against gold.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:33 | 3443180 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Um, great way to completely evade the point that I raised.

You really want to go through all that again? If memory serves I don't even think our positions are that different to begin with. 

In any case, like they say 'talk is cheap.' If you invested along the lines of what WGC report suggested was happening or what I was saying you protected against losses / took profit. If you traded on what the gold bug leaders were saying at that time you've certainly lost money. 

Conveniently gold bugs always say "spot price is irrelevant." Fine, whatever - that's one way to look at it, another way to look at it is you'd be able to buy more gold now. 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:41 | 3443193 akak
akak's picture

Not everyone who holds gold is a short-term trader, or any kind of trader at all, nor necessarily should they be.

Monday-morning quarterbacking is always easy, and just as pointless.

There is this quaint, old-fashioned notion indulged in by some of these eccentric, long-term thinking "goldbugs" called saving.  Look it up --- you may find it interesting.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:55 | 3443250 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Not everyone who holds gold is a short-term trader, or any kind of trader at all, nor necessarily should they be. Monday-morning quarterbacking is always easy, and just as pointless.

It's not Monday morning quarterbacking if you release an extensive report predicting certain market outcomes and they come true..

There is this quaint, old-fashioned notion indulged in by some of these eccentric, long-term thinking "goldbugs" called saving.  Look it up --- you may find it interesting.

That's fine, I'm not arguing against that necessarily. Personally I don't see the advantage to holding a particular commodity regardless of the market, but I understand the logic (don't subscribe to it obv).

I'm just trying to make an educated guess what the market conditions actually are and stating my opinion on them and investing on that theory. 

If you're not trading it's sort of irrelevant what guys like me are saying or if we're right or wrong...?

If you're actively buying, you are trading though.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:55 | 3443068 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

You apparently dont know much about that outfit do you?

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:59 | 3442864 toys for tits
toys for tits's picture

If it gets cheap enough, the gov't can start minting its coins in silver again.

Yeehaaw, it's 1964 all over again (and gas will be $.35 a gallon).

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:47 | 3443052 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

The problem with your thesis of a decent amount of downside, is that wholesale discount prices like todays attract buyers. Buying went on steadily the whole month of March; at an average above 27.25$; Some of the "real People" or serious players are going to be interested in this new bargain price. It's also possible that's why it was created; one standard theme of manipulation is to cause a wipe-out so you can be the pick up buyer at the bottom; because YOU KNOW THE PRICE IS GOING HIGHER. This type of action hase been recorded in various major markets since 1812; that we know of for sure.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:16 | 3443120 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

The problem with your thesis of a decent amount of downside, is that wholesale discount prices like todays attract buyers. 

Price fell another 60c after I wrote that. Probably you'll get a bounce, but I still figure downside in the near term. 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:54 | 3443065 Panafrican Funk...
Panafrican Funktron Robot's picture

James is right, there is still a decent amount of downside.  In the paper price.  The CB's are buying phys, selling paper.  We know this.  Hedge accordingly.    

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:43 | 3443037 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

I didn't either. but since Dec. traded above my purchase price of $27.34 for a couple of days; I put in a stop loss at $27.40; which was executed perfectly. I don't have a crystal ball, so I follow rules. I bought it back again at $26.225 this morning. After a day like this, there's "always" a bounce. Not really, "always", you understand; but the probability is enormously in my favor. Cheers. Trading can be fun; and profitable.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:40 | 3443206 nmewn
nmewn's picture

"$26 silver? I never thought we'd be here in the spring of 2013."

Try and get a grip on yourself, gold or silver will never drop to zero in fiat pricing...like a stock or bond or fiat itself.

Or ethernet-bits for that matter ;-)

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:25 | 3442624 JeremyWS
JeremyWS's picture

BTFD, that is all

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:34 | 3442719 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

This is like Mr. Rogers' fucking Land of Make-Believe, and Bernanke is that goddamn creepy-ass king. I can't believe how FUBAR'd this shit is.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:41 | 3442754 gjp
gjp's picture

Hear hear, well said, we're a long way down the rabbit hole and bernanke is the queen of hearts painting everything green, to use another fantasy analogy.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:54 | 3442837 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

See the other article on people living in caves, so yeah, rabbit holes it is...

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:13 | 3442894 Supernova Born
Supernova Born's picture

This some trippy shit, man.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:03 | 3443089 Pooper Popper
Pooper Popper's picture

Trip of the brain,Trip of the Brain!!

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:35 | 3443012 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

Not to gloat, but what's feel like to get Bitcoined?  I hope that the gold bugs finally understand that both  AU/PM and BTC are enemies of the State.  Even if gold bugs don't care for BTC, they should cheer for it because it is the enemy of fiat/Fed.

Coulda. woulda, shoulda... cashed in my paper-PM for fiat after the 10% gain.  Now it's -15%.  Want to scream when ppl ask me:  "How's that gold thing working out for ya?"

 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:41 | 3443028 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

Professional trading is done on the Comex with a little item called a stop loss order. The downwave cost me nothing. Learn to trade. Forget about ETF's; they wrere designed as a consumer "product".

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:55 | 3443075 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

You're a gentleman.  I owe you a cold, gold-colored beer.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:38 | 3442737 gjp
gjp's picture

What a shitshow. But what is going to stop it? Orwell and Huxley all the way, where do I get off? Please?

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:39 | 3443019 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

I got a zero loss stop executed on my Dec. Silver Contract at $27.40; perfect executiion. I bought Dec. back again at $26.225. I don't scare easily.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:25 | 3442639 carlsbro
carlsbro's picture

GREAT OPPORTUNITY TO BUY GOLD!! ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:15 | 3442940 PhilofOz
PhilofOz's picture

Yeah that's ok if you have any reserves left to buy it, when I could now have 15-20% more in my stack had I waited until today to get it :-(

Sat, 04/13/2013 - 12:14 | 3444566 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

GREAT OPPORTUNITY TO BUY BITCOINS!!!! LULZ!!!

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 20:10 | 3443459 ManOfBliss
ManOfBliss's picture

I backed the truck up. :)

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:27 | 3442642 debtor of last ...
debtor of last resort's picture

Black swans will shit all over the place, and it's not gonna be in 2016.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:27 | 3442645 warezdog
warezdog's picture

Time to buy, was actually hoping the dollar would get stronger and pound metal some more but the sad fact is until paper is gone we'll never have a real price discovery

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:27 | 3442655 LuchadorChumba
LuchadorChumba's picture

I am Satoshi. Soy! The seductive electrons of Bitcoin

Recuerdo... bitcoin is like a newbie Luchador stomping around the ring, el cuadrilatero, right before he's pile driven and wimpering like a puta barata.

Uno mas ves... I'm sooo mysterious because of the mask that covers my face. Te sabes... I have a bullion bank to back this bitcoin too, suckers! Huh? don't think that I wont fractionalize your bullion pendejos.

Aye aye aye, never a better time to sell my bitcoins and buy Au at the bottom of the V (we need more margin, expect the margin reqs to be lowered soon to pull you into paper, and get you in the triangle) Timing is everything, so if you want to remain an estudiante, and not be part of my upcoming culling, drop to your knees y wash me feet with Mescal... ahora! Use this p2p today for some serious PM slam down feeding while you can.

Escucha, a hot chica ring lady told me we got 20 mil or so digital luchabitcoin out there, y tambien, about 800 million people (that is, after I have the stadium collapse to cull the audience from its 6.5 bil). Take out su calculators and start number crunching. Then you'll see that ahora, today, now, you need swim quickly out of the 'current' of alternative currencies, digital currencies, and counterfeit soul currencies!

Viva El Luchador

www.askchumba.com

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:31 | 3442681 malikai
malikai's picture

Are you on mescaline?

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:52 | 3443062 natronic
natronic's picture

If he is he should share!!

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:41 | 3443212 ersatzteil
ersatzteil's picture

Nice gringo Spanish, come down to Hong Kong south of the border if you wanna see some three-girl shaving cream lucha libre while on mescaline. Leave the wedding ring on, they don't care!

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:07 | 3442880 TraderTimm
TraderTimm's picture

@Luchador

No habla pendejo

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:42 | 3443221 ersatzteil
ersatzteil's picture

Luchador habla como googletranslate, pinche pelado! Jajaja

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 19:24 | 3443316 noless
noless's picture

You are amazing chumba..

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 20:13 | 3443472 ManOfBliss
ManOfBliss's picture

The "take out su calculators" bit made me LULZ

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:29 | 3442656 i_fly_me
i_fly_me's picture

Why does this always happen off pay-cycle weeks?

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:38 | 3442746 Creepy Lurker
Creepy Lurker's picture

That's why you gotta keep some extra cash around.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:06 | 3442903 HardAssets
HardAssets's picture

"Why does this always happen off pay-cycle weeks?"

and going into the freakin' weekend, and before tax day for cryin out loud

That's just damned evil . . . and not very nice

 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 21:47 | 3443754 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

Because they can spy on who gets paid when by each bank account. Transfers reveal cycles within cycles, amassments of cash and actual pay days. Same here. But I amass enough that I am ready at all times to break the cyclic nature of attack on me. I don’t regret my buys that drew my down into this day, though another buy at these prices is of course desired. What matters is that I still got good discounts.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:29 | 3442661 adr
adr's picture

Why even open the markets at all? Just add .5% a day, and every third Thursday add 1%.

Simpler, and just about the same results.

 

I guess even though you know you are going to lose, you have to go though the motions to keep up appearance for the crowd. They paid money and deserve a show.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:28 | 3442662 Hubbs
Hubbs's picture

The central banks and governments must be really trying to cover up some bad stink if they have to pump the markets so blatantly.

 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:32 | 3442693 adr
adr's picture

Trust me, I'm out there in the thick of it and neck deep in shit. They just closed and locked the the lid of the pit.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:17 | 3442948 Room 101
Room 101's picture

Please explain....

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:28 | 3442673 There ya go again.
There ya go again.'s picture

The best path to prosperity is FREE MARKET CAPITALISM.........    can we try it now ???

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:34 | 3442720 CH1
CH1's picture

It will NEVER happen until people stop asking permission.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:51 | 3442828 dick cheneys ghost
dick cheneys ghost's picture

started storing my bit-coins on the front porch......since they are invisable and all I dont have to worry about them getting stolen

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:05 | 3442892 TraderTimm
TraderTimm's picture

That's funny, your bank stores your balance with invisible electrons!

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:37 | 3443016 dick cheneys ghost
dick cheneys ghost's picture

got the tip from Bit-Coin Magazine............The feature article this month is of the newest crypto-currency....Bernie-Bits........named after some madoff guy.......I bought me some......at .000000000000000001........Im going to be rich!!

 

www.bernie-bits.com

Sat, 04/13/2013 - 12:16 | 3444577 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

You're right Tim, Banks suck just as much as Bitcoins.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:36 | 3442721 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Sorry, prosperity has been outlawed in order to provide for the greater good.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:41 | 3442756 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

And you think the establishment would have any interest in deviating from the status quo exactly why?

No, tax payer #1,556,308, you will work for us, and vote for our proposals to eliminate any choice outside the status quo.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:03 | 3442884 ross81
ross81's picture

as if Raygun would've done anything different

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:36 | 3442674 thismarketisrigged
thismarketisrigged's picture

today was the funniest of all.

 

bernanke, i must say i am impressed with u. u were able to bring the dow not red or green, but outright flat with a 0 percent movement.

 

if that is not what it takes to be investigated, i dont know what will

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:43 | 3442764 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

Investigated?

The sec exists only to go after outsiders.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:51 | 3442831 Non Passaran
Non Passaran's picture

That's what he meant: anyone who places orders for phyzz this weekend clearly didn't get the message and is to be flagged and investigated.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:21 | 3442961 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

Bernanke could go on a killing spree at every day care center in DC, rape every women he encounters on the street, shoot 55 cops at point blank range right between the eyes and there would still be absolutely no investigation.

Wake up. The law does not apply to all.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:30 | 3442678 MichiganMilitiaMan
MichiganMilitiaMan's picture

Pass me more of the Ag please!  Thanks!

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:32 | 3442680 EclecticParrot
EclecticParrot's picture

"Strange," said Marge as she returned to working the creaky back-porch rocking chair after a brief pause, shading her eyes with wrinkled hands.  "Is that the sun a-tryin' to peek through the clouds?"

"Yep", replied Beatrice, "and to think this mornin' I'd a bet ya dollars to donuts it wuz a-gonna rain."

"And, boy-howdy, do we need a bit o' rain."

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:32 | 3442694 Gene Parmesan
Gene Parmesan's picture

I think I'm back to hating Fridays. It'll be interesting to see if any big news is released between now and Monday.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:35 | 3442706 Mine Is Bigger
Mine Is Bigger's picture

I was wondering about that, too.  

It's been a crazy week.  Have a great weekend, everybody.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:41 | 3442761 Creepy Lurker
Creepy Lurker's picture

When they pull some shit, it's always over the weekend.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:50 | 3442818 Gene Parmesan
Gene Parmesan's picture

Whenever they start scheduling this sort of drama for after-hours on Friday things seem to start going off the rails. I don't mean to say that the Friday action/news causes the derailment, just that the events seem to coincide. At least they did a few years back, and today seems to follow the pattern. Buckle up.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:33 | 3442699 LoneStarHog
LoneStarHog's picture

FIVE HUNDRED METRIC TONS OF PAPER GOLD DUMP.../

Whistleblower Andrew Maguire told King World News that more than a stunning 500 tons of paper gold has been sold in today's takedown in the gold market.  Maguire also spoke to KWN about the staggering Chinese physical gold purchases.  Below is what Maguire had to say in this remarkable and exclusive interview.

 

Eric King:  "How much paper gold was sold to take this market down, and how much tonnage have the Chinese and others been taking out of the physical market?"

 

Maguire:  "Just since the cross (today) of $1,550 into the (London) fix and the breach of $1,500, we are now looking at in excess of 500 tons of paper gold that's been sold....

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:36 | 3442730 CH1
CH1's picture

No one doubts that the overlords would do such things (and worse), and yet, everyone keep obeying them.

WTF is wrong with this picture?

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 17:06 | 3442905 TraderTimm
TraderTimm's picture

@CH1

Is this where the rules of zerohedge state that we should shout a market is "dead" because it declined? I'm not sure, never been much of a follower.

Sat, 04/13/2013 - 12:20 | 3444583 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

Yes Tim, we realize you only come here to troll ZH. You should be stacking Bitcoins today, they are on sale!!!

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 18:08 | 3443102 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

I also smell PM mining stock ready for friendly/hostile takeovers.  Certainly consolidation into fewer hands.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:36 | 3442734 Gene Parmesan
Gene Parmesan's picture

When everyone finally wakes up to the paper gold scam it'll make today's price action look downright reasonable.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:34 | 3442707 Non Passaran
Non Passaran's picture

Peak bullshit.

Time to place some unusually large orders!

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:34 | 3442718 assumptionblindness
assumptionblindness's picture

All of these charts make sense so long as you use a mirror to look at them.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:35 | 3442722 mdtrader
mdtrader's picture

Doesn't Bernanke realise the middle classes are all short the Dow and long gold lol. 

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:44 | 3442786 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture

Yes, he does in fact realize that.

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:36 | 3442724 thismarketisrigged
thismarketisrigged's picture

look at this bs article. could this be a more misleading article?

 

http://www.businessinsider.com/closing-bell-april-12-2013-2013-4

 

headline- stocks fall,  ha ha ha, well i guess in this market 0.08 point drop in dow is a selloff

Fri, 04/12/2013 - 16:40 | 3442749 tornado_watch
tornado_watch's picture

I believe this will be reflected as Black Friday--the great plunge of 2013

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