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CME Hikes Gold, Silver Margins By 18.5%
Anyone surprised, please raise your hands. And yes, it was fun when margin were hiked only on surges in the various futures contracts. Now, dumps works just as well. The logic, of course, is that gold shorts are also margined. However, judging by the immediate $15 drop in gold upon the announcement, those who are short the metals certainly have a much, much bigger balance sheet and cash hoard to satisfy any collateral requirements than those long. Next: expect the Shanghai Gold Exchange to hike margins in a few short hours once China wakes up and looks at overnight PM prices in horror.
Source: CME
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spreads are always wide on off hours. as the volume increases the spreads will tighten.
You missed the joke.
Jim Willie says real price of physical gold right now in Dubai, Shanghai, Hong Kong is $2000 for large orders. Says the predicted decoupling from paper has been happening.
Jim Sinclair had predicted margins would be hiked until it is 100%, ie., cash price market for physical gold. Happening? Had also predicted a smash down would occur so Goldman Sack and JP Morgue, et. al., could get their hands on phyzz before running up the price.
Something is going on, strange days indeed. Looks like Central Banks are decoupling and it's every Calimari for themselves. Lots of shoes to drop, the big one will be decoupling USD from oil.
"Tell you the truth, I don't exactly know who I'm gonna shoot first. I never predict an order. All I know is who gets it last." -- Will Munney, The Unforgiven
When are the idiot longs going to learn that they have to take delivery?
There is less than 20 billion dollars worth of silver in inventory. That's nothing. All they have to do is take delivery. But NOOOOO, they still haven't learned that they have to take delivery.
Getting tired of the stupid longs, and "investors". You're going to get scared or forced out, unless you take delivery. The governments will force people to liquidate ETFs when it's down, they do this all the time. The only way you can possibly invest on the long side is to take delivery. You cannot buy contracts unless you take delivery. You cannot margin, because even if you do 100% the CME will simply raise it to 110%.
When are these stupid morons going to realize that they must take delivery?
My expectation is when there is no more gold, and there is no more silver, and there's an honest to god, for real, default. Then they will attempt to take delivery, after the market goes dark, they are not allowed to sell their position, and the system blows up. That's when they will realize that they have to take delivery, with the money they no longer have access to, to a market that is dark. Then and only then will they ever freaking learn.
The people getting hurt are just traders.
They will never take delivery, becasue they are trading on margin, and they'd have to pony up the dough they don't have.
Well, people who still don't get it, yet, deserve to be absolutely wiped out, and it appears, that's exactly what is going to happen.
SHTF In Progress!
Gainesville selling ASE for $5 over spot AND they are OUT of stock (shipping after 4/30)!!!
http://www.gainesvillecoins.com/products/162421/2013-1-oz-american-silve...
The Doc is reporting that wholesalers have NO silver!!!
http://silverdoctors.com/cnt-sold-out-of-all-physical-silver/
Here we go.
Enjoy the ride, bitchezz!
:-)
Best news all day! Thanks.
Provident Metals has a warning banner NOTICE at the top of the site claiming that they are experiencing extremely high order vloumes and that the website is somewhat slow as a result.
EDIT: OMG! On the first page of silver rounds they are either "out of stock" or "stock delayed" on EVERYTHING... with one exception, the Incuse Indian Head silver round.
A Scream Worth $119,922,500
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/scream-worth-119922500
Alright, I am suspending Operation Shitload of Silver Dimes until further notice. I am 0-4 on my last four Ag purchases so I am going to sit back and relax for a while. I have taken delivery on all four now. Thank whatever deity of choice that they were smaller purchases at least but that is why I approach AG in that way. Since I did not sell any of the phyzz, I can still turn this around and go 4-0 which would bring me back to batting 1.000. Looks like I will have to wait a while but at least I replaced what I sold at a cheaper price than what I sold it for in 2011.
My Brother and I work together on acquisition sometimes and we had agreed yesterday that it was his turn to place an order this time and the order was to be placed this morning for some phyzz. As luck would have it, a deer was hit by a car near the end of his driveway so that required the sheriff's participation which took forever. The heat finally showed up and dispatched the wounded animal. They just leave them lay in the ditch so my Bro asked if he could have it and did some paperwork to make it legal and he never got around to placing the AG order which is fine with me. For those of you that are a little more country in nature, you know what time of year it is. This deer was a doe. Enough said.
We are just going to watch what is going on for a while with AG. We can eat some moar venison too as we were running out from last year's hunt. No reason to waste the protein.
Then you have this Boston thing. I can not comment on that much other than to offer my best wishes and condolences to those injured and to the families of those who were killed.
Probably more bloodbath until paper prices stabilize. I tried to buy some silver here in México and there is plenty to buy at the equivalent of $29 dollars.
More than 6 dollars of premium... Imposible to purchase moar silver close to the paper price.
Good to see you here.
MX, it's GREAT to see you again! It's been a couple of years already hasn't it?LOL I wish it were under better circumstances. I see you are still watching the market like the hawk you have always been. You know that I have never went 0-4 on Ag so something is up. I do not think, I am really 0-4 when we calculate the MS-64's out of this recent batch of dimes but the 55D Washington quarters are on hold for now. Ag is way too cheap right now on spot but the dealers are not lowering the premiums so I am going to sit out. This is too much too far and too fast.
It would be good to chat with you again in private. manipuflation@boatingaccidentnews.com I don't check it every day but if I know someone has something to say or wants to reconnect, then I will. Definitely reconnect with me MX. The world has changed a bit since we last chatted and it is good to see you here as well. Several of us ended up here. ZH, no matter what, has a higher number of financially educated folks per capita compared to other financial websites out there. Plus they are cynical as hell which is just our style most of the time.
this margin hike is desperation - the gold terrorists have given us a golden buying opportunity....there are shortages of gold all over god's green earth and they will not abate....gold is in severe and permanent backwardation.....to get quantities of verified assayed gold, you will pay in the neighborhood of 2000 per oz even after today's paper charade.....
fiat are exploding into confetti and vaporization. jpm is making another raid on the etfs and god help the fucktards who have bought those fraud riddled tar babies.
No, the margin hike is because gold nuts are no diff than anyone else, they lose money they don't really have, so the exhanges are protected themselves from the deadbeats.
I disagree the China government will not see the low price Of gold as a horror, but rather an opportunity as it continues to build reserves and go for a later Far East reserve currency. The Chinese citizen on the other hand will be unhappy.
The start of,it is! different this time, 85 billion won't fix it this time.
Could the margin hikes be used to further hurt the dealers so that one day there would be no more selling of their precious metals?
Margins are increased when volatility increases. Obviously there has been a heck of an increase in gold price volatility, as we see daily price changes exceeding $100. So it is only prudent for the CME to increase margin requirements. Sorry, folks, this is not an anti-gold conspiracy theory.
Everything about the CME is anti-gold. Everything.
Exactly! Only a naive blowhard who's never had a futures account would think there's anything nefarious about this very small margin increase for gold and silver in response to recent daily ATR going up by a factor of ten, more or less.
Margin can be thought of as what your broker needs to have to cover your loss if you buy or sell and forget about the position until the next day. $8 K sounds about exactly right.
Also financial insider, V, warned to watch the price of the metals as a signal.
Margin hike? Ha! The earliest link (Beneath the article) with a previous CME margin hike was Feb 2010. Gold price was $1118/oz. In less than a month, after falling to $1105/oz, prices were skyrocketing. Buy now. Buy quick. If you can find a dealer who is willing to sell you at these prices. Anyone thinking it will last at these prices the whole year because of the cash being funnelled into equities making everything look rosy, and because the weekly takedowns are getting brutal might get it wrong. Why take the chance?
stack stack stack stack stack stack stack
Fuckin shits gonna stop sometime right?
Yes.
We might not enjoy how it stops, though.
I do not expect to sell my silver for US dollars.
I expect to outlive the United States.
And I'm not a young man.
Frightening
Not a bull or a bear, and have traded the long side of gold just a few times in the last 3 or 4 years....
My question is......Who is left to buy???? People have been piling on for years and most who want BTFD is already fully invested and can't add anymore.
Just too many massive sellers right now, Although I would not rule out some decent short covering a few days from now to give sellers another chance to dump.
Scary freakin chart right now
No, its a Bitcoin chart. The chart of a pumped up bubbly.
I would be buyer in a stable market. We might have to take some more pain on paper price. The joke is on them though as it is on phyzz. Do you hold it in your hands? Ammo did not drop in price and we might accept payment in silver. Now where is the price of PM's again?
Stocks are all set up. Today's action was very similar to early 2007; I think it was China at that time. I may be wrong. Been drinking. Bull's been running for over 48 months in equities. Time running out and there are many more problems.
Market crash within 30 days max or I'll never buy another silver quarter ever again (well, I may have gotten my wish already, since the premiums on ebay are already over 15%).
Good luck to everyone.
From Kitco 1 oz Silver American EagleProduct details
USD $ 27.49 ea.
Bulk Discount 100+ : $ 27.24 ea. 500+ : $ 26.99 ea.
Shipping only outside USDue to high demand, this product is only available outside of the US. If you are looking to buy this product, please call us toll-free at 1-877-775-4826.
Banco Azteca in Mexico sells Libertad coins at the equivalent of $29 and buys them at around $24.60
Good luck finding physical at the fire sale prices offered by the CME
Congrats to all of you that kept all of you in gold all the way down to .......
Margin levels only matter to traders, investors take possession. Big financial institutions are not really subject to margin calls, except as a source of revenue.
Only thing you're possesing are massive maket to market losses.
Keep reading gold nut press, you'll ride it back to 300
Shit, we are getting hit even more now on PM's. I have seen plenty of takedowns in my 14 years of buying and selling PM's but this one is bad thus far. I am not buying but am 50 miles past selling now. This is not a dip, this is fucking outright smackdown. It may be a long evening. I can still find numis out there that were not too far over spot....LAST WEEK... but the dealers are not changing their prices. Why should they? Lesson, when the phyzz dries up you know the "market" has gone full retard. Watch your phyzz spreads to know the bottom.
I have inadvertently managed to teach my two year old son a couple of handy words much to my wife's chagrin. Those words are "Fuck" and "Oh Shit". I didn't really mean to but that's how they learn and they like to repeat in front of guests and strangers. I really do not care as I do not like many guests and strangers around here anyway. I have a feeling by the time this PM whackdown is over, my son will have a much better grasp on just how to cuss properly. After today, I plan on advertently adding the words Cocksucker, Douchebag, Cunthole, Pissflap, and Asshole to the little critter's vocabulary so that he will know how to speak to the banksters he will eventually encounter later in life since we can't seem to get rid of them thus far. We have to start small though but I intend to add the words to a basic sentence, " a central banker is a _____."(see above) If he does not get it, I will start to steal all of his toys until he does get it.
Show him a Mercury dime,
and say: "Money."
Excellent suggestion. However, if I only call it a mercury dime, a rather well informed AKAK might take offense, and correctly state that the dime is also known as the Winged Liberty Head Dime.
For now, we need to focus on proper ennuciation of cusswords to provide a proper effect. We already have an eight year old daughter around here who can't keep her mouth shut and she already knows way too much. I already have a collection of failed fiat currencies for training purposes....and investment purposes too though...hmmm.
Perhaps I should just give him a few DXY and he can watch it implode eventually or see if he spends it first? He is only two though. I already observe my tracking in being a father to a son and what is the best way to do that? I am going to have to ditch the sports, the arts, the sciences and have to be one of those fathers who will have my son and daughter in "Dad Training" so that they will, in fact, learn "modern" monetary policy and special interest in elections rather than any real innovative education.
Come on, that fucking sucks for a kid!
I will have to eventually tell my young son that everything that appears to be a price is a lie unless I can do something; and that this policy has not been working in the spirit of true price discovery the whole time.
I saw an article rejoicing in congressman Pauls paper losses. They published a list of his assets which seemed to include every PM miner in the world. I wonder if he declared his physical metal in his financial report. He has been buying for many years and is still no doubt way ahead. The fools still think he is a crazy old man. He has the decency to wish he had been wrong for the sake of our country, but had the courage of his convictions and invested accordingly.
LBMA and CRIMEX, JPMORGUE out of PM's. As discussed Saturday morning its becoming more apparent that the supply of the real stuff is gone! At least whats available for sale. Check out the internet sites NOTHING is for sale. Yet they are stll driving the price down. Check Tulving, Check AMPEX check your local coin stores NADA.
Harvey Organ and Andrew Mcquire both are pointing out that longs are still standing for the metal. Which makes perfect sense if you are buying for physical delivery at $30 why do you care if the price goes to $20... you just buy more. The Open Interest on the Exchanges is NOT dropping inspite of huge Naked shorting by the Bullion Banks. Showdown at the PM Corral. The only hope for the Bullion Banks now is the CRIMEX and the LBMA halt trading. But WTF when they reopen. END GAME hang on to your metal. Party is getting ready to start!
http://kingworldnews.com/kingworldnews/KWN_DailyWeb/Entries/2013/4/15_Maguire_-_LBMA_Default_Triggered_Gold_%26_Silver_Takedown.html
http://harveyorgan.blogspot.com/
Chin up! Stiff upper lip and say FOAD to the Banksters!
Anti Emm! Anti Emm!
From my end, it's impossible to get on to the PerthMint bullion prices page. I'm stuck on the page they had when they closing yesterday for a 10oz bar, AU$253.50. Has to be at least $20 lower now.
Finally, $241.70 @ 10oz. Spot in AU$ is $21.67. Quite a markup there. My instincts are saying buy even so, but that hole in my pocket is holding me back! Bloody hell!
Please pray along with me ... "Dear Lord Jesus, may the criminals who mastermind this mass stealing have it fall on themselves 1000 fold. Protect the widows, the orphans, and those who are defenceless. Destroy the criminally insane who feed on others. Amen."
+1,000,000 Amen
Praying may or may elicit a perceived response. How are the prices of guns n Ammo these days? Did that crash too?
Since Bloomberg pulled the COMEX inventory data from their site, I've been watching it directly. The latest report (issued today, for 4/12) shows 1% of the COMEX gold inventory with withdrawn on 4/12, via JPM. 99 days to go...
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Am I the only nutbar around here, that knows next to FA about high-finance, but who's sat here daily for two years, watching this shit, and now has to at least consider, that between the shit with Cyprus with the bail-in, the now-they-are-now-they-aren't selling their gold to finance their part of the bail-out, the 400 million sold on Friday, that this isn't a big orchestrated squeeze play, to show the EU countries that they will sell the gold, when told to, when they're in trouble, or they will sell it at a far lower price, and now they raise the margin requirements as the price is tanking?
I don't know much, but this all looks awfully suspicious, like this is nothing more than TPTB, manoevring this play to drive the muppets out of the PM markets.
Where else is somebody going to store their wealth, if the govy can just wealth tax it, or bail it in? Bit coin? Oh, yeah, they destroyed that market, too.
Who benefits by all of this? Who's buying all the gold and silver at these prices? Don't tell me the CBs?!
•J•
V-V
Years ago Jim Sinclair said the bull market would end when central banks begin to buy. He seems to have forgotten that when it happened (China, Russia, Inida, Turkey). Also, many people claim it would take a retail Gold Rush to create the next Gold Crush. The Mint selling out (of silver), plus the incessant ads on TV for buying "real money" suggest retail played its part (unless you think Soros and Paul Jones buy coin sleeves at the US Mint), suggests retail played retail's traditional role.
When far too many blogs can be supported by the retail crowd, that also suggests "all-in". Funny, too, that all of the PM gurus "predicted" this rout. Sure they did. They are like gypsy fortunetellers, always leaving an out. The gurus can never even consider the possibility that generational holders of metals might decide to seek comfort in productive assets. For the gurus, it must always be "MANIPULATION!". Also, people complain that "no real seller would dump like that, as if a 4% price swing had no meaning, forgetting that they, themselves, have held on to a tumbling asset since 100% higher (for Ag) and 40% higher for Au. Frankly, a 4% loss seems tolerable when compared to 50%. Live to fight another day.
The term that has popped into my mind is Donkey Hoddies. Those are folks so busy chasing windmills they failed to see somebody made an ass out of them. The gurus, supposed "experts" nobody had ever heard of before the PM rally, and who even today can't back up their prescience and "knowledge" with a huge portfolio, led so many by the nose, convincing them only one direction was possible. They were wrong.
I was banned from a somewhat obscure market chat board because I dared to opine this sort of rout was in the cards. The mods made up some half-assed excuse about "collaboration to harm the site", which in retrospect appears to mean holding views contrary to the positions in the mods' portfolios. As part of the site's "investigation" they poured through something called "Private Messages", which were member-to-member notes, showing that Big Brother has many Little Brothers who would be as cloying and omnipresent as any Orwellian creation if they ever achieved a position of real authority. Kill the messenger.
Originally the purpose of market sites was to create a forum to exchange ideas and opinions. Somewhere along the way they morphed into censored echo chambers (save for Zerohedge, which allows contrary views). Closed minds create open losses (I know, I know, everybody bought at $3 and $255)
Oh, and remember large players don't hold their stash in coins. They hold bars, like 5000 oz "deliverable" ingots. It will take a while to melt those down to make the coins for the shops and US Mint. Be patient; it's coming.
I remember how such experts like you, said the same thing in 2008.
But I just laughed at them and I bought many gold at $ 700.
Right now, I'm laughing at you and I buy many gold at $ 1,350.
This is a very good, that in the world there are people like you. The more stupid people in the world, the more I become richer. My friend, thank you very much, for my wealth and well-being!
I remember how such experts like you, said the same thing in 2008.
But I just laughed at them and I bought many gold at $ 700.
Right now, I'm laughing at you and I buy many gold at $ 1,350.
This is a very good, that in the world there are people like you. The more stupid people in the world, the more I become richer. My friend, thank you very much, for my wealth and well-being!