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Ron Paul On Bitcoin: "If I Can't Put It In My Pocket, I Have Reservations"
"You will not see economic growth until you liquidate the debt and liquidate the malinvestment out there," is the hard truth that former Congressman Ron Paul lays on Bloomberg TV in this wide-ranging interview. Paul is concerned at "the erraticness of the dollar... and its devaluation," explaining that, "people think the gold price up and down is a reflection of something wrong with gold; no, I say it is something wrong with the dollar." The topic gravitates to inflation, which Paul explains is far from missing as, "Bond prices go up. Stocks are going up. Housing prices are starting to go back up again. Education costs are going up," adding that, "CPI is not reliable." Paul is buying gold, believes "we are in as much trouble as Greece," and while fascinated by the free market nature of Bitcoin, he notes that while he doesn't fully understand it, "if I can't put it in my pocket, I have some reservations about that."
Paul on whether he's concerned about the drop in gold:
"I am concerned about the erraticness of the dollar. The dollar is up, the dollar is down. We print a lot of dollars. The dollar gets devalued. That is really the concern. If people think the gold price up and down is a reflection of something wrong with gold, no, I say it is something wrong with the dollar. People have been expressing concerns over the past couple of months about gold, but compared to what?
Compared to where gold went from when the Fed took over where it was $20 per ounce compared to what has happened in the past?...
I remember in the 1970's when they finally allow people to own gold and it went from $35 to $200 rather rapidly, and then it lost 50%. Then it went up to $800.
To compare a couple of months or a couple of weeks and forget about a bull market in gold price in relationship to the dollar for 12 years. I would say the comparison is not an authentic comparison. What you have to look at is the inflation. Inflation is an increased supply of money.
Since 2008 they have quadrupled the supply of Federal Reserve credit and are buying $85 billion per month of treasury bills. At the same time last week they bought $60 billion. That is the inflation. That is the distortion of the market and that's why we're not getting economic growth."
On whether we're seeing the opposite of inflation right now:
"It depends on how you define it. Inflation is when you increase the supply of money. Bond prices go up. Stocks are going up. Housing prices are starting to go back up again. Education costs are going up, but the gross distortion is the effect that the inflation of the money does on the price of money and interest rates and how it causes economic problems and why you don't get economic growth.
You have to look at the malinvestment and destruction that occurs when you mess around with the price of money. It's not just the CPI because the CPI is not reliable. The government fudges that as well. They change the way they measure it. Free-market economists say it is going up about 8%. A lot of deception going on out there. I was just talking to someone on getting social security, they're not happy with the purchasing power of the dollar and you can't tell me there is no inflation."
On what the real value of gold is:
"No one knows it other than what is happening at that moment. The Supply and demand of gold is very important. That is why it is money, because gold is used elsewhere and it is commodity. The supply and money of paper is the culprit. That is the one that is causing all the trouble. People ignore the supply and demand of paper. Yes, paper goes up and goes down, but look at the long term purchasing power of the dollar. It has been devastating. At the rate they are printing the money, you will see a continual devastation of the value of the dollar.
You will not see economic growth until you liquidate the debt and liquidate the malinvestment out there. Sure, you will see housing go up again, but you will see more bubble formation because prices go up does not mean there is economic growth. We are a long way from the correction, mainly because they ignore the definition of inflation and ignore the need to liquidate debt and the need to liquidate and get rid of all the malinvestment.
One good comparison is look at the price of stocks and gold. Although in the past couple of weeks it has changed a bit. The price of the stock market has crashed, because you used to be able to buy the Dow with 44 ounces of gold. Now it is under 10 ounces of gold. It will probably go a lot lower."
"I think the way gold is acting it acts like a market does. You get ahead of itself, there has to be a correction. The amazing thing is not the correction, the amazing thing is the biggest bull market of the century when one commodity went up for 12 years straight. You cannot ignore that. To say, well there has to be an adjustment because prices are subjectively decided by many factors so you cannot predict exactly where the money will go. Unfortunately right now the money that the Fed creates goes into reserves, further distorting the markets and pumping up prices of bonds, further building a bubble that will burst because our economic growth is not there and we are in every bit as much trouble of Europe and Greece.
Someday there will be a lack of confidence in our dollar and you will see the correction in the paper a lot more severe than you see the correction in the dollar-gold ratio."
On Bitcoin:
"To tell you the truth, it's little bit too complicated. If I can't put it in my pocket, I have some reservations about that. But it has been designed in the free market. If it is a means of exchange, it would not ever be illegal. You shouldn't regulate it in the free market, but I do not think it fits the definition of money, which has been around for 6000 years.
People want to see something they can know what it is, they can define it, touch it and put in their pocket. If you do not have a computer and someone running the computer and calculations, you don't have it. I am not a big supporter of that, but I am not opposed to it. I admit, I do not fully understand what is going on with it."
On whether the Boston marathon tragedy is an opportunity to fix immigration:
"There is always an opportunity because there is a need for it, but I do not think they will solve any problems at all because they are too big and complicated and very much involved with economics. I don't think you can deal with immigration unless you deal with the welfare state. It is an incentive for people not to work. It is an incentive for others to come and get free services. Also, I think it is more important that we look at our work permit, letting people come in and work, and put aside the idea of how we will give automatic citizenship.
That becomes a political football because everyone is lining up. Who is going to get the vote? One side says that we are going to get all the votes -- we want them all to be legalized. I think you have to deal with the economic policy and really open up the opportunities for people to come back and forth and to work, but not to insist everyone will become a citizen because I do not think that will work under these circumstances."
On how Republicans will win the next election if there is no solidarity:
"I think the solidarity is the same problem in Republican and Democratic parties. It's ongoing. There's always factions. Of course, I want to unify everyone in the belief and the cause of liberty. Sound money, balanced budget, the constitution. So yes, there's a good way to unify them, but unity for the sake of unity makes no sense whatever. The old guard are losing their way. The party is getting smaller. It is splintered. They will have to face up to the fact that if they talk about limited government and personal liberties, they have to believe in it and do something about it because the young people will not be fooled. If this continues, the party will become smaller."
On whether Rand Paul will run for president in 2016:
"You'll have to ask him. I have no idea what he wants to do."
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That's my pres right there. Not some CFR/Banker puppet bitch like we've had for the last 100 years give or take.
Ron is one of the few guys in Washington that actually reads the fine print and understands it.
How long before someone creates a physical receipt representing BitCoin?
Physical bearer instruments have been around for some time:
https://www.casascius.com/
Amen to that! Only real commodities can be money! Bitcoins only have "value" in a controlled/regulated/constrained environment and are not anarchist at all!!
I have never held a "Windows XP" or a "Windows 7" in my hand and never put one in my pocket. Yet I am pretty sure they exist....
Ron Paul is ok, he just said he can't understand it... I bet his grandchildren understand it very well... Heck, it's easier to carry a hash for $1 milion in the head than a ton of gold in a pocket...
Bad choice of words, "if I can't put it in my pocket"....sounds like a Congressman!
Can't put farmland in your pocket, either, and it's more valuable than anything.
Not yet, but it soon will be.
Until they confiscate it . . . oh, wait - they already do - just slowly for the time being. But even more pernicious "land reform" I'm sure is on the Usurper's bold agenda.
If you THINK you own farmland here in the USSA, or any real estate, you are sorely mis-guided (google allodial title).
I'm very familiar with farmland having owned it and invested in it. It has good returns currently. There's only one problem with it. If you do some research, you'll see that it can be taken in a 'national emergency' by the government. So youre absolutely tied down to it and there's no way to bring it out of the country no matter what you may try.
Very true...all you can do is burn the buildings (and maybe salt the earth) to keep them from using it.
Going long salt here bitchez ;-)
You don't "own" something in your pocket either if someone puts a gun to your head and takes it.
Ron Paul has the guts to admit he doesn't understand bitcoin and therefore simply doesn't know yet. I see that as a very honorable trait.
You can put farmland in your pocket but if you drop it somewhere be prepared to do ten in the pen (thanks Monsanto!).
Can't put farmland in your pocket, either, and it's more valuable than anything
I had a Dentist and his helper laugh about how much my farm land was worth 5 years ago. Now it's up 30 percent and his land is down 40.
Remember he who laughs last...laughs best.
metaphor.....
Did you miss the part about Bitcoin emanating from the free market?
As for the controls and constraints, they are analogous to the same physical scarcity that help make gold the premier form of money.
Dr. Paul did a great job discussing what he knows about Bitcoin, and what he doesn't know. Yet you failed to follow his lead, instead choosing to champion your ignorance of the subject.
BTW, I'm not even a proponent of Bitcoin, even though I understand it's structure enough to trust it. What I don't trust is the criminal cartel who will destroy it, due to it being unwanted competition.
Satoshi is far more intelligent and wise than the cartel. He has his eye on the queen while they struggle to save their pawns.
WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO?
lmao@stupidty and lies
how does this man remain so polite dealing with these fucking parroted uneducated brainwashed assholes.....what a man...
bit con...love it...freuding i suppose but....
You can create your own paper wallet which is just a printout of your private key. https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Paper_wallet
You can also create a "brain wallet" which is where your private key is generated from a strong passphrase that you memorize. Take unlimited funds in your brain across borders. https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Brainwallet
It's important to understand that neither of these is a "note" or "receipt" that has to be redeemed from someone. They are direct keys to your funds in the blockchain - there is no counterparty.
There is no counterparty
Perhaps the computer or functioning exchange? Or redemption ability? Maybe .gov is the real counterparty in the true sense of the word
Where did all the people screaming "bubble" go? BTC is right back up at $143.52 today!
GO SATOSHI WE LOVE YOU AND WE LOVE THE DEFLATIONARY TIGER!!!
Counterparty means another person who is legally obligated to perform when you wish to access your funds. (Like a bank, brokerage, creditor, etc.) Bitcoin exchanges do not generally hold peoples funds, but if you did foolishly keep your BTC on deposit with an exchange then yes they are your counterparty.
I didn't say there aren't things like computers, electricity, and the internet needed for bitcoin to work.
Is that what it counterparty means? Shit, all these years I thought it was the older guys partying in the flat at the end of the building....
That would be a Lemon Party.
I can just loojk at my actual wallet and convert the fiat in it to actual useful things in life.........like PMs and guns and ammo
how does one become a certified Bitcoin Assayer? how do you know you are lookin at a bitcoin or a tungstoncoin?
That is the job of the network of miners who validate each transaction when adding it to the blockchain. That role is built into the open source client software.
Ron might read the fine print and understand it, but his son seems more interested in getting elected than taking a stand for what's right. His spineless flip-flop today on the use of drones cost him any chance of ever winning a vote from me.
Wait, you not only listen to politicians, but you vote for them too?
Which part of there's "no such thing as a necessary evil" escapes you?
As I've said before, I don't vote. There was, however, the slimmest chance I would have considered voting for Rand if/when the country completely goes to hell by 2016. No chance now.
I'll have to check that out. Rand is a repub, though better than most. As far as I'm concerned DC can screw itself, - it sure screws us. There will never be any real 'solutions' out of that place, ever.
Not spineless or a flip flop. more like a realistic look at what is actually occuring in the world.
fag jurinalists will always attack what they don't get.....
Yes, I too have reservations about who's in reserve. His son is dead to me. The Hydra system to which he kowtows is dead to me. Ron was sent a message, me thinks. Such conviction only to drop out at the run for home. WTF?
DINOSAUR
ASSCLOWN
Ron Paul was our last chance to begin to turn it around before we go off into the pit of Hell.
Unfortunately, too many Americans were too stupid to understand that. So there werent enough of them to overcome all the vote fraud early in the election to give Ron Paul needed momentun.
So now Americans get to experience Hell. Theyll probably yell "USA, USA, USA !" just like those dumb fools in Boston, - - - too ignorant to recognize their loss of Liberty. Guess the country deserves to be a bankrupt slave plantation.
When Ron Paul ran for office it was almost as though Thomas Jefferson did so.
Unfortunately, unlike in 1776 - few Americans today have much of an idea of what Jefferson was all about. They probably wouldnt have voted for him either.
when did bitcoin go back to 140?!
how? why??
how? FIAT
why? FRAUD
Best case scenario, it's a bubble. Worst case scenario, it's a Ponzi scheme. This article lays out the case for that worst case scenario: http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=219284
Its probably here to stay as an online medium of exchange. Will gold oil ever be traded using it ? Not in our lifetimes and I am 28.
When the bond bubble blows, and gold will not be available ( ScotiaBank Edmonton told me to wait till May this morning) at any price, more BitCoin exchange will be going on then we think.
PS. Had anyone else had trouble with the BlackBerry Z10 browser and ZeroHedge ? I can log into ZH no problem but when I click on a story, it doesn't do anything. When I click to log in, the keyboard doesn't show up.
Singned, Canadian with no shares or short interest in BB or ZH.
Have problems with IE 10 on a Windows 8 tablet too. Keep refreshing page - also clear cache and reboot ever so often.
You can already trade bitcoin for gold.
www.amagimetals.com
www.coinabul.com
http://www.bitmit.net/en/shop/c/23-money/11-coins-amp-bullion/3-gold-bul...
I will be surprised if in the next year there is not a gas station that accepts it.
"I will be surprised if in the next year there is not a gas station that accepts it."
Howdy A_D. Next year? Hummmm...may not be any gas or gas stations open in a lockdown of the country. Very few will be going anywhere if they shut down everything after the next false flag event. Ponder that.
Of course, if the banksters and their ponzi schemes were all arrested and stopped and say, many minds led by Ron Paul gathered to fix the problems of America and there was a real reset, then maybe in a peaceful transition with little hardships caused by the marxist-nazi's in BLACK, there could conceivably be a possible way to save what is left of America to rebuild from the well entrenched infrastructure. Perhaps the weeks, er months during the mildly harsh transition people going to the daily trade markets would learn to be better neighbors, and become stronger communities. Of course this is contingent on those babylonian marxist-nazi's all throwing away all that BLACK nazi stuff, and just being a part of the community of real people instead. If they really want to fight someone, fight off all the privateer mercenaries that are in the USA. They really should all go home.
You'd better hope it is near where you are running out of fuel.
. . . because they won't be accepting fiat by then.
No worries, I keep a little silver and a little fiat in the car too.
I think the way bitcoin will first appear in gas stations is there will be a dedicated terminal inside the shop, maybe just an iPhone, where you can pay your BTC for so much gas on pump #4. Very simple and easy to deploy.
Direct processing at the pump will come later and would surely be fought by regulators.
Gold is already traded in BTC
Has been for a long time
Its only normal for RP or anyone else for that matter to have reservations, but that's why we ave the ability to analyze things like BTC objectively.
Obviously if the price goes up it must be a bubble.
Q.E.D.
That author actually had some good arguments but they are already out of date. For example, upgrades are coming that will add the quality of untraceability to Bitcoin (essentially a built in dark escrow pool):
http://spar.isi.jhu.edu/~mgreen/ZerocoinOakland.pdf
Bitcoin is not a static entity, it is growing and getting smarter along the way like any good open source software project.
Best case scenario is people realize Satoshi is our cyberchrist who has come to save us from our fiat sins. Worse case is people ignore the teachings of the great Satoshi and continue to languish in fiat misery.
The more you use their "name," the more you make the whole thing to appear to be a cult of personality. In other words, you're doing yourself no favors in the court of public opinion.
Because for every action, there must be an equal and opposite reaction.
It is the law.
bitcoin is merely the beginning of the people's shadow market in response to a shadow banking system that does not in any way serve the real economy.
It is a natural reaction. And, the first of many such fiscal devices born from the collective will of the people.
Its growth will be proven to be on going as it simply has a long way to go.
We got to do away with all of these people not drinkin the Koolaid. We can't keep this imaginary shit alive with rational people out runnin loose.
"if I can't put it in my pocket, I have some reservations about that."
Obama does not fit in my pocket............
He's workin on it!
He's got his grubby hands in there for certain.......
His greedy hands are certainly in your pockets. As you're bent over you're not even getting a reach around, he's simply stealing your wallet.
He's not interested in just pocket Change anymore? ;-)
I'm shocked!!!
"But the study also finds that some Americans of more modest backgrounds would face more taxes. Some people earning between $100,000 and $200,000 a year would pay about $150 more, while some earning less than $100,000 a year would pay less than $100 in additional taxes.
The increase in taxes on middle-class earners is notable because both political parties have said that they do not want to raise taxes on people earning less than $200,000 a year."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/under-obamas-budget-most-americans-would-face-somewhat-higher-tax-burden/2013/04/22/fd2f0432-ab8f-11e2-b6fd-ba6f5f26d70e_story.html
@ A Lunatic:
"Obama does not fit in my pocket............"
Tell that to Reggie Love.
Is there enough gold and silver to be in the pocket of the entire population?
When we were on the gold standard, we still had a federal reserve and derivitives.
Bitcoin eliminates banks for the most part especially federal reserve debt based system.
For the record i have gold silver and bitcoins.
Cant be too careful
Btw who the fuck is satoshi nakimoto?? Is he real? Sounds like the government could easily have designed bitcoin under the guise of this mysterious japanese man. Afterall if tptb wanted to end bc they would have already
Cant trust anything anymore
how?
were TPTB ever able to shut down P2P illegal filesharing?
Don't think so.
They can attack the exchanges alright...
I trust Ron Paul...consistant and rational.
It's open-source code, so it doesn't really matter WHO designed it.
It will matter when the only legal exchange has a .gov behinde it
https://localbitcoins.com/
As for legal exchange, well good luck on that with physical fiat [paper/polymer/cupronickels] or even Bullion being non tracable means of trade. Exhibit A: the war on drugs.
Why would a government create something, which they can't control? Bitcoin is all Open Source and it would need 51% if the network's computing power to control it. Even the combined computing power of all supercomputers in the world does not match this. Not impossible to control it, but it would be quite an effort.
They can outlaw it hence controll it, no? Place certain restrictions... Taxes .... I dunno im just paranoid and i think alot of other people are too... Untill we get some more bank runs to push peeps into it.....
I must reiterate i own bc
The mining pool BTC Guild could already do it. Just sayin.
If it can't crack a skull when stuffed in a sock and violently swung at someone, it's not money.
Wait - so I can use my hand gun as money? That makes me very happy! :-D
So that's why when they stone some poor guy in some backward country they call it "payday".
I used to get stoned on payday too. Ah, the good ol' days...
Female Bloomberg talking head:
yes Dr. Paul, we in the financial media have decided that gold is the worst possible insurance/investment and you'd have to be a complete fool to buy physical gold with the stock market headed to infinity. In fact in our three-some with Warren Buffett last nite, my male colleague here licked Warren's old man balls for an hour session of the Oracle's infinite wisdom. What say you re: that?
Ron Paul: Gold is money and will be a lot longer than FRN's
Bloomturd talking heads repeating their mantra. Makes you want to play whack-a-mole with these idiots, for real.
One more time: If it's not in your possession, you don't own it.
With Bitcoin your private account keys and a copy of the ledger are in your possession.
You "own" it as long as someone else doesn't steal the private keys from you.
or have your account "hacked"........
Yes, the only known way to have your personal Bitcoin account "hacked" is to have the private keys stolen.
Now if you keep Bitcoin on an exchange that is a whole different story since the exchange operator is the one holding the private keys and could potentially "corzine" your funds. Also, exchange software has been cracked/hacked before so it's definitely a risky place to keep funds for any length of time.
If it doesn't weigh down your boat to the point of sinking, it ain't money.
Loved the skull-cracking joke. Still laffin...
"former Congressman Ron Paul"
Thank God. He might have helped stand in the way of "CISPA" and the "Free marketplace - ah fuck it, lets tax everyone because we can Act" that I'm looking forward to.
Go CONgress!
Doesn't Ron Paul want to be a Bitcoin Billionaire and worship the CyberChrist?
Paul cookiness destined for junk pile.Good ridance to the Bircher !
A cook huh, and that makes you feel smart right? the guy makes more sense than most pols out there, but you wouldn't want to hear about sanity would you? The Constitution is the key and free markets, and that is what Paul is about, but due to ideology you could not see that could you? I am no Paulbot, as I have a few things (geopolitical) that I disagree with him on, but he would have been a good President none-the-less!
As your nick implies,fly with dim-witted Paul if you must.I strongly suggest you sell your ,ooooh,wait for it----gold and take profit!Then go back in after it drops to $700.
Further to Paul-Please,support son of Paul to insure pendulum swing futher to Left.
Geez what do you say to that? Oh yeah thats right, I remember. YOU'RE FUCKING RETARDED. awesome. i feel better already.
Yes, its ALL coming together now. I did notice a tilt to port in the old Bitboat from its very conception.
We can make credits stronger, faster, more "new age". We have that technology...with apologies to Lee Majors ;-)
Ron Paul should be every bit as ashamed as all of you who endorse this grotesque practice. Paul is now a babbling idiot consumed with the dollar and gold. No doubt because of all the toxic heavy metal by-products. He should re-evaluate his position in light of the gruesome legacy this horrible metal is leaving your children and your childrens children.
"You can mine gold ore at a lower grade than any other metal," said Mike Wireman, a mine specialist at the Denver office of the E.P.A. "That means big open pits. But it must also be easy and cheap to be profitable, and that means cyanide."
That kind of massive operation can be seen at Yanacocha, a sprawling mine in northern Peru run by Newmont. In a region of pastures and peasants, the rolling green hills have been carved into sandy-colored mesas, looking more like the American West than the Andean highlands.
Mountains have been systematically blasted, carted off by groaning trucks the size of houses and restacked into ziggurats of chunky ore. These new man-made mountains are lined with irrigation hoses that silently trickle millions of gallons of cyanide solution over the rock for years. The cyanide dissolves the gold so it can be separated and smelted.
At sites like Yanacocha, one ounce of gold is sprinkled in 30 tons of ore. But to get at that ore, many more tons of earth have to be moved, then left as waste. At some mines in Nevada, 100 tons or more of earth have to be excavated for a single ounce of gold, said Ann Maest, a geochemist who consults on mining issues.
Mining companies say they are meeting a demand and that this kind of gold mining, called cyanide heap leaching, is as good a use of the land as any, or better.
Cyanide is not the only option. But it is considered the most cost-effective way to retrieve microscopic bits of "invisible gold." Profit margins are too thin, miners say, and the gold left in the world too scarce to mine it any other way.
"The heap is cheaper," said Shannon W. Dunlap, an environmental manager with Placer Dome. "Our ore wouldn't work without the heap."
But much of those masses of disturbed rock, exposed to the rain and air for the first time, are also the source of mining's multibillion-dollar environmental time bomb. Sulfides in that rock will react with oxygen, making sulfuric acid.
That acid pollutes and it also frees heavy metals like cadmium, lead and mercury, which are harmful to people and fish even at low concentrations. The chain reaction can go on for centuries.
dude.. honestly!
you can stop pasting the same shit on each and every thread here. We got your point on the first time already.
He's a useless fucking troll like AnAnonymous, preaching the perils of 'goldmanism' over and over, ad nauseam.
Stop offuscating and monolizing the speeching means like a typical US 'american' citizen forcing blame to the exterior according to his eternal nature.
It is actually "goldminingism".
Obviously you have not. You keep repeating the same moronic mantra over and over. You encourage this otherwise great site to keep pimping this stupid relic and the delusion of all encompassing security it offers. I bring the truth about the consequences of your actions and aberrant behavior
I wil send you 40c via PayPal. With this change you can use it to call someone who gives a f**k.
The world is already polluted enough without your garbage. Have some respect.
hey pud, look on the bright side. at least the end product that creates so much environmental degradation doesnt get burned up in an automobile or thrown in the garbage every day............go easy on the stupid relic......i gots lots of my teef capped with it.................................
I was going to go Long Stupidity, but it looks like PUD's got control of the market.
"Truth. You want the truth!? You can't handle the truth!" Fact is Pud, there is no truth in markets anymore. Just corruption. It is a total fiction of the reality felt and experienced by 99% of people. You're right the exploration and recovery of PMs - probably not that good for the environment. But, take a look around you. Rights and liberties are being hollowed out. Money is losing exchange value every day. Employment prospects detroyed by disloacted capital markets littered with perverse, rather than productive incentives, established by the very institutions you believe will save you. Distraction economics going on EVERYWHERE. Perhaps things will change where we don't have to seek alternatives to protect ourselves, our families, and so on. However, until that day arrives, recognize the rush to PMs as a response to what really is, and not what you think it is.
What about all of the cyber waste that is created in the mining of Bitcoin? How much of Farmville are you willing to see laid to waste on your evil schemes to create a digital currency? Gotta love hypocrites...........
I'll bet even you can see the ignorance of that reply. You have a perverted agenda on these gold topics...I have an honorable agenda.
Is you sez I are ignernt?? Themz thumb rastlin werdz myster!
PUD,
I've noticed you trying to draw some sort of "moral equivalance" regarding gold lately. How do you square that knowing you're sucking up fossil fuels and/or nuclear energy to do so? Typing on a plastic keyboard (oil synthetic), sucking up bandwidth & electricity, promoting bitcoin which replicates all those "bad habits"?
How do you reconcile all that?...its a fair question.
I've answered that many times already. In the 21st century there are certain things one absolutely cannot do without. Energy, transportation etc. There are also things one can do without. Excessive waste of energy, an suv, a giant 6 bathroom house. If one has any ethical standards at all he seeks to minimize his footprint for the betterment of all including his own legacy. You do not need gold. You think you do, you think it is some kind of security but it is not. Just because I use oil doesn't mean it's fine for me to burn tires on the front lawn does it? Just because I have a computer doesn't mean it's ok for me to dump my oil down the storm drain does it? One evil does not condone all evils does it? Gold is fllthy in so many ways. To champion more mining is to endorse unneeded destruction of the planet, peoples and the future of many. It is the same as random acts of violence or graffiti on a building wall. I'm quite shocked at the level of juvenile responses to my factual points. The level of rationalization is unbelievable
Thank you for the response & partial confirmation of my suspicion.
"In the 21st century there are certain things one absolutely cannot do without. Energy, transportation etc. There are also things one can do without. Excessive waste of energy, an suv, a giant 6 bathroom house. If one has any ethical standards at all he seeks to minimize his footprint for the betterment of all including his own legacy."
One mans excess is another mans need or desire. What you seem to feel the need for or desirous of, is control over other peoples lives.
How is someone owning & driving an SUV any different from you hopping into your Prius to go get a bottle of wine instead of walking or biking? There will always be some "purist" eco-freak around to say you are being "immoral" and wasteful and I'm not the least bit interested in granting them greater & greater power over mine or anyone elses life, including yours.
Is a volcano going off destructive to the planet, belching poisonous gasses into the air and unleashing buried heavy metals onto the surface of the planet? How about meteorites, they make big holes too sometimes?
I'm sure you would say no because they are "natural" occurrences.
The natural state of humans is to be free from control. So someone placing a tire around an oppressors neck and lighting it on fire (whether in his front yard or not) good or bad, long term?
Gotta go to work, be back this evening...fascinating discussion.
Correct nmewn! I have a brother in law who lives without a computer no tv no car..bicycles everywhere grows his own food no hot water(granted this is in Ecuador), however he would look at Pud and judge him as Pud is judging others.
If thats how someone wants to live, more power to him...pardon the pun...lol. But imposing ones lifestyle choices on the unwilling (always by force, of course) is wrong, its tyranny.
Because you built your computer with all natural, organic, biodegradable sticks and rocks.
Whining on the webz...the cost-free ecology.
Bad news...Birkenstocks are made from *gasp* Dead Cows.
Sorry I gotta run to go hear a liberal lefty lecture me on my profligate ways as she flys in her private Learjet and gets carted around in a fleet of giant SUVs.
She has an honorable opinoin of herself too.
Shut up, Putztecca.
Ugh, another EPA tree hugger communist! You and your ilk would cut off your own noses for the betterment of your ugly faces! Get real, don't fall for the EPA destroy humanity for the sake of a salamander, which will live and prosper no matter what we do! You EPA freaks have destroyed Kalifornia food production for a smelt...one day it will bite you in the rear.
dude, go save a fucking tree or something.
nuclear energy is potentially far more dangerous for much, much longer. where's your outrage on that subject?
I feel the same way about oil and food-destroying our environment. Farming is clearly destroying and wasting our precious topsoil. People are ruining the planet. We all need to kill ourselves for the good of the Planet. And everytime you walk on your lawn you are killing some innocent insect and thousands of defenseless microscopic organisms. It's the great holocaust that no one wants to talk about.
You are right. Now go tell it to the greedy bastards running the printing presses 24/7. I'm just a fucking little ant trying to save a few crumbs of something thats real before the lights go out for good.
he lost so much on gold he has to fill his pockets somehow.
Most of his gold was bought at the $200-$400 range
Dr. Paul is so right on so much, I just wish he could verbally express in a coherent manner rather than like some half crazed old man screaming "get off my lawn". So many more would believe his message of truth.
he whacks out thinking peoiple with his myopic view of U.S. Foreign policy.......America NEEDS to be a leader!
I met Dr. Paul a couple of times in 1995. I've heard him talk to groups on the Campaign trail 5 times in the last two election cycles. I've heard all his GOP debates. He's won every deabte IMHO, but he's not his best when limited to 30 second sound bites like Obama or Clinton were. He's best when he's talking to a crowd and can speak from the heart and say what's on his mind and develop his ideas. He always speaks from the heart -never with a script and rarely with notes. He can speak like that for 90 minutes and you never get bored. He connects with his audience like no politician I've ever seen-because he is honest and genuine. No script -he doesn't care who the audience is- he always speaks his beliefs. That's why people love him. College students love him because he is honest and real. I have been to the last 11 Texas republican Conventions as a delagate - after a few I could not stomach listening to phony politicians like Rick Perry and Kay Bailey Hutchinson give their canned speeches. I never watch political national conventions. I can stand the hot air from scripted phonies -I'd rather be waterboarded. Not with Dr. Paul. I could listen to him for hours. The audiences are having fun[ -they are enthusiastic and enjoying Dr. Paul and the comraderie of being with such a wonderful group of Patriots and kinfred spirits.
STARTEDSTACKIN' on BitCoin.........
If I can't rub my hairy scrotum on it, it was never really mine........much like a woman......or silver
I slam people who voted for Ron Paul for President (because he was not running in the GE, dumbasses).......but RP is SOLID on economic theory.......
You slammed me..... I down voted you
Hey Ron Paul - You CAN put it in your pocket! I love the elegent design of Bitcoin but think the third perties will be compromised or it will just be made illegal and it's hard for a currency to be useful in barter when it's illegal.
But you CAN put it in your pocket' It is a string of numbers/characters that only you posses (unless you have given it away or used it in commerce). You could put it on a USB drive and carry it around in your pocket. In the age of capital controls I actually think this is Bitcoins BEST characteristic. Moving gold becomes harder and harder with the more you have. When gold is illegal in the US (probably 5 years max) you might be able to smuggle an ounce to a country that allows trade but what if you have $500,000 or more? You're screwed! http://www.nbcnews.com/video/nbcnews.com/51429475#51429475 . your choice is to turn it in to your home country at a fraction of its value or sit on a hoard of valuable gold that you can do nothing with and risk going to jail.
However with capital controls in place you could travel with your Bitcoin "numbers" on a storage drive the size of a dime. And it would be the same size whether you had $1,000 of Bitcoin "numbers" or $100,000,000,000,000!
I truly believe that this is the one area where Bitcoin is FAR better than gold.
yeah, until you fall in the pool, or something electronic that was storing your tokens gets soaked.
better than gold. ROFL. thanks, i needed that laugh.
Hadn't thought about that.
The more one goes down the bitcoin rabbit hole the more electronic devices one needs to secure your "money"...in order buy a towel to just dry off and salvage what you can from the impromptu swim.
I guess next it will be a Bitcredit Card..."Don't stand around the pool without it"...lol. Which kinda defeats the whole bankers are thieves, credit is immoral, hyper-moralistic tone of Bitcoin enthusiasts.
BitBanker...coming soon ;-)
A little tip for those unstable around pools. Write it on a waterproof slip of paper :) The analogy is still good - maybe this is easier for you - what sinks faster you falling into the pool with a waterproof slip of paper or you falling into the pool with 20 pounds of gold in your pocket. All I'm saying is while bitcoin has a lot of problems it totally solves the problem of transport in a world of capital controls
I thought that was the point of bitcoins, too, but people just want to talk shit about what is up or down on whatever day it happens to be...
Ron Paul resonated with a lot of people, just as the truth naturally does in the heart.
There are two kinds of valuables. One is in the heart, the other is kept in the pocket. One you come and go with, the other you do not.
Here is a lady that speaks her truth. See if you can put her feelings in the pocket of your heart and resonate.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3b6Zqm1a34U
http://pages.citebite.com/o1k4n4j0u8ojs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RbOQZ-92pqc&#t=13m15s
Splitting up the TBTF banks compartmentalizes
the damage they can cause, as with a ship's
flooding compartments.
The U.S. need not be the Titanic, though, so long
as the people who created the mess are forced
off the ship (a change in story.)
Then, as to what liabilities don’t net out that
taxpayers shouldn’t have to deal with, lots of
theories for annulling have been floated, along
with novel bankruptcy classes, parallel sets
of books, with force majeure as needed, basically
reflecting that counterparties should have known,
being savvy hedge fund managers, that what
the TBTF bankers was doing was essentially
not legitimate (ever more hedging with ever less
reserves for ever greater bonuses.)
The dollar’s getting shafted by monopoly, risk filtering,
gatekeeping and pay to play. Even ObamaCare
replaces a cruel situation, the inability to move between
states for job/r.e. op’s, often, lest one suffer an exclusion,
and, often, the eventual choice of “go naked” or “premium
death spiral” with a plan that’s founded on the express
open-Congress rejection of repeal of immunity from
anti-trust, a profit regimen that exists in fixed-box-like
fashhion, and risk controlled so as to serve the ability
to charge different prices based on ability to pay.
So, what’s supposed to be affordable care becomes
what are you worth care--we’ll take that and to the extent
the Treasury can swing it add some of your own taxes to
boot.
The proof is where the carriers apay an annual
fee to the Government
http://pages.citebite.com/i1y4m1t7o7pxu
that gets passed through to the patient so as to
work as a backdoor tax. After all, monopoly
is very expensive and inefficient.
It’s the essence of “harvesting.”
So as your risk profile increases as you get
older that affects your profitability to the carrier
along with how close to eligibility for subsidy you
are. It almost looks like a halfway benevolent
monopoly, but, once you think again, you realize,
it’s saying the monopoly itself forces you into
near-impoverishment before you get subsidy.
That, my friend, is how we make monopolies.
(not seeing first attempt, ZH--not meaning to double-comment)
http://pages.citebite.com/o1k4n4j0u8ojs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RbOQZ-92pqc&#t=13m15s
(sets at appropriate location though after very brief ad--not my benefit--
channeled by YouTube)
Splitting up the TBTF banks compartmentalizes
the damage they can cause, as with a ship's
flooding compartments.
The U.S. need not be the Titanic, though, so long
as the people who created the mess are forced
off the ship (a change in story.)
Then, as to what liabilities don’t net out that
taxpayers shouldn’t have to deal with, lots of
theories for annulling have been floated, along
with novel bankruptcy classes, parallel sets
of books, with force majeure as needed, basically
reflecting that counterparties should have known,
being savvy hedge fund managers, that what
the TBTF bankers was doing was essentially
not legitimate (ever more hedging with ever less
reserves for ever greater bonuses.)
The dollar’s getting shafted by monopoly, risk filtering,
gatekeeping and pay to play. Even ObamaCare
replaces a cruel situation, the inability to move between
states for job/r.e. op’s, often, lest one suffer an exclusion,
and, often, the eventual choice of “go naked” or “premium
death spiral” with a plan that’s founded on the express
open-Congress rejection of repeal of immunity from
anti-trust, a profit regimen that exists in fixed-box-like
fashhion, and risk controlled so as to serve the ability
to charge different prices based on ability to pay.
So, what’s supposed to be affordable care becomes
what are you worth care--we’ll take that and to the extent
the Treasury can swing it add some of your own taxes to
boot.
The proof is where the carriers apay an annual
fee to the Government
http://pages.citebite.com/i1y4m1t7o7pxu
that gets passed through to the patient so as to
work as a backdoor tax. After all, monopoly
is very expensive and inefficient.
It’s the essence of “harvesting.”
So as your risk profile increases as you get
older that affects your profitability to the carrier
along with how close to eligibility for subsidy you
are. It almost looks like a halfway benevolent
monopoly, but, once you think again, you realize,
it’s saying the monopoly itself forces you into
near-impoverishment before you get subsidy.
That, my friend, is how we make monopolies.
Liked it when she said, "Presidential Hopeful."
People do still hope he could be the President. After all, they do not go to the usurper for truth and advice, they go to Ron Paul. What is a real leader?
Thanks for this Tyler. Many do miss his words that resonate in the heart like the cool waterfall of truth on hot summer day.
Frig. Well said. True Statesman. I miss him schooling the Bernanke! Ciggarette, coffee......"Can I ask you Mr. chairman, do you do your own shopping?" good times.
"If I can't create 10 trillion of it out of thin air to loan to failed global financial ponzis, then I don't trust it."
- Ben
Leave it to Ron Paul to distill theories and arguments down to basic truth:
"If I Can't Put It In My Pocket, I Have Reservations"There's no basic truth in that statement. There are probably tons of things that he can't put in his pocket but goes on without reservations. And, there's probably tons of things he can put in his pocket that he does have reservations about.
It's as good as superstition, ignorance and perhaps an unwillingness to embrace change.
Ron Paul in 2014 for President after the collapse.
Bitcoin hits 144 today, 'nuff said.
The Bitcoin Channel
I tend to agree with Ron Paul about bitcoin, but I am also prepared to give it the benefit of time to either prove itself or destroy itself. After all, it's reults over time that determines the viability of most things.
Some of my bitcoins are in my pocket and if I lose them they are gone forever. Pretty much like gold. Maybe he doesn't know that he can keep them in his pocket.
I tried to watch the video but like with most Bloomberg videos they have to keep buffering. That company is so cheap they won't even pay for bandwidth.
Money - Currency.
Are they one and the same? NO
Metal for money (store of value)
Bitcoin for currency (means of exchange)
Both together, a powerful combination.
Must admit, I'm still at the research stage for Bitcoin.
Ron Paul - an oxymoron, in a good way - Honest Politician.
I think he is in a very small club.
Indeed. https://www.amagimetals.com/
<--- Yes to bitcoin
<--- Go fuck yourself, bitcoin
Hey Ron, you need to beat some sense into your retarded Congressman son. He doesn't like the TSA groping his genitals, but let's drone strike a common robber. Yea, nothing can go wrong with that. All it will do is make no individual responsible if a mistake is made. No fucking accountability. It's bad enough cops run around with little to no accountability, but put them in front of a video game console and say take down that potential criminal. Yea, guilty until proven innocent bitch, where's my power up dude? What level am I on?
I think folks were expressing this the other day that were being trashed for not being positive on bitcoin. I think its reasonable.
It is important to understand that the day TPTB stop fighting BitCon is the day someone has figured out how to game / jack the system.
While youngsters might think they are screwing "The Man", the simple reality is that there will soon come a day, somehow, that the youngsters get screwed.
It happened last September when someone got hold of the algo securing the system
It happened last week when their bank account(s) were closed.
Something else will pop up.
To think that "This time is different" is foolishness.
Thousands of years of history show that it will be those holding physical gold and silver that will hire the people to fill in your graves.
We're in as much trouble as Greece, a country that cannot issue it's own currency when we can. That's a sad statement from a supposedly knowledgeable person. Apparently not so much. Where is all this "inflation" that inflationistas' have been calling for for years... QE is inflationary!!! Well where is the inflation...... you know why...BECAUSE IT'S NOT MONEY PRINTING IDIOTS!!!!!! keep looking into the sky and calling it purple. How much evidence do you need.
Do you feel the debt burden of 5 yrs ago, 10 yrs ago? NO!!!! And trust me "your kids" will not feel the debt burden of today.
Pauls definition of Inflation is actually correct. Regardless of whether you are feeling the pricing effects of an increase of the money supply, it is still defined as inflationary. The Fed has to book a corresponding balancing entry for the bonds purchases on its balance sheet . What is that entry?
It is a number in a computer.
I like the sensational title: take an interview about a lot of things (gold and the dollar, deflation/inflation, etc.) and make the headline a negative on Bitcoin. At least the octagenarian answered in a way as to leave open that there are probably things he doesn't understand about the crypto-currency (I was an RP delegate in my state - no stranger to his views). How many men his age are even willing to concede as much as he did?
Ask a Chinese local citizen who wants to make an international payment without approval from a legion of utterly corrupt goons and banksters which method is more effective: bitcoin or gold? Or should he just be sent to a gulag, because he must be doing something wrong? How 'bout an Argentine? A Cypriot? Soon, I imagine many Mexicans or Philippinos abroad who send money home will use Bitcoin instead of the usurious lecherous ilk of Western Union. Free currency transfers, person to person.
So, long Gold/Silver, AND hopeful that an honest crypto-currency can even minimally cause the status-quo addicted banksters, traders, and their goobermints to shit their pants, I remain.
RP did identify the root of the whole problem... malinvestment.. both public and private. The annual deficits are a annual measure of malinvestment and the total debt, public and private, the measure of unsustainability of our economic activities. From the subsidies of wars, energy, maleducation, legal overhead, corruption of public officials.. it all must come crashing down in a self stoking spiral. Stay productive, get out of debt, pursue an econmicaly and ecologically supportable lifestyle.
Don't follow leaders, watch your parking meters.
A pretty classic MSM tactic.
I agree with the rest of your points. How about those drug cartels not having to pay HSBC X% to get their money moved around. I personally don't see this as a negative. Anything that further cuts the banker tentacles makes me happy... though i wonder if we would see increased DEA/CIA activity against south american drug cartels if they tried to abandon the USD for their drug trade.
Hookers take Bitcoin?
Theres your answer.
It's something...but it ain't money.