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"Panic" For Physical Gold Spreads To UK Where Royal Mint Sales Of Gold Coins Triple

Tyler Durden's picture


Following the entire "developing" world (where faith in paper money "backed" by $1 quadrillion in derivatives is at times questioned, and instead the people, for some inexplicable reason, fall back to hard currency equivalents) scrambling out to their local precious metal dealers to find "out of gold" signs virtually everywhere, yesterday it was the US Mint's turn to announce it had halted shipments of the popular one-tenth ounce gold American Eagle coin as it had run out, following a surge in demand (we expect this shortage will soon spread widely to traditional one-ounce denominations shortly).

Things in the US have gotten so bad, not only are most online dealers backlogged weeks and months in advance for most PMs (as the CEO of Texas Precious Metals explained in detail), but respected bullion vaults are also now on the verge of running out of inventory. As Reuters described, "Michael Kramer, president of Manfra, Tordella & Brookes (MTB), a major U.S. coin dealer in New York, has been inundated by orders from existing and new wholesale and retail customers. "It's panic. This is one of the busiest times in quite a while. People think gold's at the lows and they want to take advantage."

It was only a matter of time before the last bastion of paper money, London, also succumbed to the soaring demand for physical, and sure enough moments ago Bloomberg reported that the "Britain’s Royal Mint, established in the 13th century, sold more than three times more gold coins this month than a year earlier as prices declined."

Sales are more than 150 percent higher than last month, according to Shane Bissett, director of bullion and commemorative coin at the Royal Mint.

“Since the dip in the price of gold we have seen increased demand for our gold bullion coins from the major coin markets, and this presently shows no sign of abating,” Bissett said by e-mail in response to questions from Bloomberg. “The Royal Mint continues to supply to its customers and is increasing production to accommodate the higher demand.”

Its not only the UK Mint, but a pervasive global "panic" to get as much gold as possible while prices are as low as they are, courtesy of the recent takedown in spot.

Standard Chartered Plc said yesterday its gold shipments to India last week exceeded the previous record by 20 percent and were double the total of the week before.


“The concern is really how long it can last,” said Dan Smith, an analyst at Standard Chartered Plc. “A lot of people surge in on the low prices and then they are likely to back away a bit as prices rally and they’ve restocked.”

Don't worry, Dan: for now the surge is going on, and on, and on, and so on. We will be sure to inform you, however, when physical demand is finally satisfied. Until then, we have several months of backlogged demand to catch up on, and possibly the default of one or two depositories in the meantime.

Finally, for all those confused by the non-linear relationship between paper gold (selling via ETFs and other), and physical gold (buying via retail and corporate channels), here is Bank of America with a quick and dirty summary of how to think about the relationship:

With prices now below $1,500/oz, we expect a pick-up in jewellery demand in the medium term and see considerable pain for miners should prices dip below $1,200/oz. As such, we believe the downside to gold prices may be limited to an additional $150/oz. In fact, we estimate that jewellery demand may become so pronounced by 2016 that prices could trade above $1,500/oz even if investors remain net sellers. Looking at sensitivities from a different angle, investors would need to buy merely 600t of gold to sustain prices at $2,000/oz by 2016, compared to non-commercial purchases of 1,798t in 2012.

So yes - physical demand can and will offset even virtually unlimited paper selling, assuming of course demand for physical persists at the recent pace.


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Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:13 | 3493435 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

Im from America, isnt that Veerd!

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:24 | 3493464 Pinto Currency
Pinto Currency's picture


Investors know a bail-in is coming and are getting off of the investment grid:

BOE’s Carney’s DIESELBOOM: Policy-Makers Working Diligently to Devise an International “Bail-In” Regime

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:29 | 3493515 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture


Not seeing much panic today in spot price:


Plus, the physical gold bars on that page are still at just $21 over spot.

So, when does the panic for gold in the US kick in?


Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:32 | 3493538 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Perhaps tomorrow I will have some feedback for you re my LCS having gold in stock.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:35 | 3493557 Pinto Currency
Pinto Currency's picture



The price is simply advertizement. 

The news is the physical flows at the various physical exchanges - and they are huge.

If this is true, it is pathetic:

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:41 | 3493590 SilverIsKing
SilverIsKing's picture

Anyone with a GoldMoney account with concern for their holdings?

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:51 | 3493639 redpill
redpill's picture

I always have concern for holdings I'm not holding.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:01 | 3493683 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture


Looking at sensitivities from a different angle, investors would need to buy merely 600t of gold to sustain prices at $2,000/oz by 2016, compared to non-commercial purchases of 1,798t in 2012.

I'd like to see how BoA (always a reliable source) arrives at this logic / math. 

Jewellery demand has been depressed for a decade, with prices heading down it makes sense that demand would pick back up again, but that doesn't mean the price will follow. 

Take a look at this chart and pay attention to three things; investor demand, jewellery demand and spot price:


Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:16 | 3493766 fonestar
fonestar's picture

I hope these dipshits in the cartel realize what they did.  Instead of scaring people out of gold & silver they have only driven people into it and severely wounded any credibility they had left.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:18 | 3493785 redpill
redpill's picture

Yep I think it's finally going to backfire on the a-holes.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:34 | 3493870 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

I hope these dipshits in the cartel realize what they did.  Instead of scaring people out of gold & silver they have only driven people into it and severely wounded any credibility they had left.


Kind of the 'INVERSE' sociological response vis-a-vis people who were shilling bitcoins just about 3 weeks ago dontcha kno?

Edit: Hey Look!... 2 bitcoiner junks... But on a positive note, it's nice that you geek-a-zoids are beginning to see the light of day... [I doubt the joojunkers ever will]...

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:44 | 3494205 strannick
strannick's picture

Even the bloody Brits are finally clueing in. Jolly good for them...

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:51 | 3494236 TeamDepends
TeamDepends's picture

Well I've got to run to keep from hidin'

And I'm bound to keep on ridin'

And I've got one more Silver Dollar

But I'm not gonna let 'em catch me no

Not gonna let 'em catch the midnight rider

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:23 | 3494409 unclebill
unclebill's picture

Didn't they said that gold is not money?.......I've been miss informed

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 21:50 | 3495612 Crash Overide
Crash Overide's picture

I am long Goldmembers...

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:26 | 3494426 draug
draug's picture

Meanwhile, bitcoin is back at $150+. (And I take beeing called a geek as a compliment.)

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 22:11 | 3495683 Ctrl_P
Ctrl_P's picture

-1 for spellling you tossser.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:48 | 3494509 fonestar
fonestar's picture

WTF does Bitcoins have to do with it?  I've been into coins since I was eight years old.  I've been invested in silver since $12/oz and Bitcoin since 2010.  Been on eBay since 1998.  I need to work on being fashionably late.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:38 | 3493877 seek
seek's picture

I think it already has -- the cartel is the BBs, who screwed up and had to have the central banks rescue them with the slamdown on AU pricing. The central banks are going to throw the BBs under the bus once they have enough of their AU back, and rest assured the lease supply (along with physical) is going to disappear.

I'm still trying to understant WTF happened to the lease rates on 4/19, maybe it was part of a rescue as well.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:44 | 3493902 jayman21
jayman21's picture

What if the inventories are just being moved between mints/depositories?  Who is selling right now?  Who is buying?


Good luck

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 17:28 | 3494654 mayhem_korner
mayhem_korner's picture



I'd love to take credit for doing my part, but I only bought Krugs this month.  So hat tip to the rest of y'all.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 18:09 | 3494665 fuu
fuu's picture

Go Team.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 17:23 | 3494632 rosiescenario
rosiescenario's picture

This recent gold take down just confirms with the few doubting Thomases left that both the stock and commodity markets are rigged for the sole benefit of the big noyz who we as tax payers just had to bailout a few years ago.



Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:16 | 3493771 JailBank
JailBank's picture

Well demand should skyrocket after Kim and Kanye's baby is born.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:01 | 3493988 Panafrican Funk...
Panafrican Funktron Robot's picture

Agreed that it's a dumb argument, I tend to look at aggregate demand vs. aggregate production in coming to a rough estimate of the fundamental picture, and even there, the price of gold has a commodity and currency component to it, and the currency part is particularly hard to nail down with any degree of utilizable accuracy.

Main point, I think forecasting the price of gold is about as useful as forecasting the price of AUD/CAD.  Who the fuck knows, really?  

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:59 | 3493689 whotookmyalias
whotookmyalias's picture

We've heard rumors of the gold not there for so long, many take it as fact. I've seen recent rumors of exchanges refusing to provide physical delivery against futures contracts.  If true (which I believe based on my scant knowledge), once it hits mainstreet media, the S is going to hit the fan like never before.  Buckle up, pucker up, and pop some popcorn or you'll feel like Clark Griswold when he says "holy shit, where's the tylenol".

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:51 | 3494521 Rip van Wrinkle
Rip van Wrinkle's picture

One thing I'll guarantee. It will NEVER make the mainstream media.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 21:53 | 3495624 GeezerGeek
GeezerGeek's picture

And I never thought I'd hear Bill Maher attack high tax rates or admit that Islamic jihad is far more dangerous than evangelical Christianity. But he did both, recently.

Strange days have found us.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:27 | 3494097 Croesus
Croesus's picture

I'm concerned about the holdings of other Goldbugs.....please send them to me, immediately, for safekeeping.


Your Friendly Neighborhood Bankster

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:55 | 3494250 Levadiakos
Levadiakos's picture

Your address please

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:55 | 3494255 PontifexMaximus
PontifexMaximus's picture

You mean short positions?

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:04 | 3494306 HardAssets
HardAssets's picture

The level of criminality is starting to become more obvious. 'Rule of Law' for us serfs doesnt apply. The crooks just change the rules, right after positioning themselves to take advantage of the changes.  So many people are looking at multiple approaches. They could try to confiscate physical gold like in the 30s. But they could also declare overseas PM accounts 'illegal' or try to prevent you access to it by not letting you travel overseas, or monitor your online transactions.

The best 'security' there is in this time is informing and educating as many of the sheep as you can. Praying can't hurt either.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:48 | 3493641 Troll Magnet
Troll Magnet's picture

Oh Gawd...Please don't quote or link  That's like quoting the Enquirer.

You guys can down vote me all you want but the fact of the matter is, if you've been listening to "The Doc" and his bullshit, you'd be about 50% poorer.  Today alone, he cites someone who knows someone who knows someone who says some former CEO of CME stood for delivery on his measly 2 contracts but was denied.  How much longer are you guys gonna fall for this bullshit?

Buy gold and silver (I am) but don't trot out these trolls as some credible source on anything.  There are gullible people out there who might listen and lose their shirts.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:54 | 3493963 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

When you start naming names, times, and amounts, that's specific enough to publish.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:16 | 3494059 Troll Magnet
Troll Magnet's picture

Riiiight.  The same douchebag who said gold will never go below $1,700 again.  And how silver is about to go parabolic.  Because the game was up!  They were all out of gold and silver!!!  Over and over and over again.  Just until before they were smashed down to $1,300 and $22.  Very credible!

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:25 | 3494091 HulkHogan
HulkHogan's picture

Silver Doc is porn for goldbugs. Nothing more, nothing less. Instead, I get my advice from trusted sources on major news stations, such as Jim Cramer.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:34 | 3494460 draug
draug's picture

The problem with the goldbug story is that it was built on the belief that a hyperinflationary collapse of the USD was imminent. Well so far it's been "imminent" for five years and has failed to materialize. Meanwhile, modern-day shoe shiners and elevator operators are screaming "gold!" in every forum across the net - which should have been as clear a sales signal as any.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:49 | 3494504 akak
akak's picture

Bullshit.  I am sick to death of that ridiculous strawman argument of the deflationary flat-earthers.

It has almost solely been the deflationist morons who keep screaming about hyperinflation --- most so-called 'goldbugs' do not and have not, from all that I have read.  What the gold advocates HAVE trumpeted, and rightly so, is the inevitability of currency debasement as a result of the exponentially rising governmental debt and corresponding monetization of that debt.  That currency debasement need not take the form of hyperinflation, just as it did not during the 1970s, when the US dollar still managed to lose two-thirds of its value in one decade.

Boy, you anti-gold trolls are really out in force again; it feels like 2010 all over again here on ZH.

You are either a liar or full of shit --- which is it?

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:53 | 3494531 Troll Magnet
Troll Magnet's picture


I'm not arguing that they're not debasing our currency because they are.  And "hyper"inflation might be right arond the corner.  But right now, you're basically fighting the Fed.  And the key to winning in this environment is to be opportunistic in your buying & selling instead of just being ALL BULLISH ALL THE TIME on gold and silver.  

Thu, 04/25/2013 - 01:32 | 3496327 Pinto Currency
Pinto Currency's picture




Good luck trying to time the market on that one.

Gold has been displaced from a 5,000 year history as money by a motley crew who have convinced everyone that you can create money from nothing negating the need for work and savings to develop capital.

It is a hilarious concept that wealth can be created by a group of central planners - nevermind the fact that they work for an institution owned by the major banks who profit from bubbles.  Ridiculous.

Gold will reassert itself with a bang and not a wimper leaving the paper bugs who are off-side speechless (and moneyless).

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 18:59 | 3495088 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

Besides hyperinflation as the end - a domino collapse due to staggering unpayable debts is highly probable. Or an electronic bank run like we saw in 2008. But the dollar is done, we just don't know the means of execution.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 23:22 | 3495917 StychoKiller
Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:41 | 3494477 Troll Magnet
Troll Magnet's picture

There's no such thing as a credible source on anything related to gold and silver.  People are either talking their books, being a mouthpiece for the establishment or just smoking a whole lotta hopium.  You just gotta do your own research, go with your instincts and hope for the best.  Personally, I bought gold and silver all the way up to $1,800/$42.  I'm still waaaaaaay up on some of my PM purchases and underwater on others but that happens in the world of investing.  Get over it and go long physical or cut your losses and STFU.  And don't ever listen to a used car salesman like "The Doc."  

I mean, shit, I think it's funny that "Tyler" is making fun of those who predicted AAPL to go to $1,000 but he/she's MUM on those who were calling gold to go to $5,000-$10,000 and silver to $500.  

Do your own research and stick to your convictions.  

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 23:25 | 3495922 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

$16+Trillion reasons, and NO END in sight.  Do the math, exponential functions ALWAYS approach infinity over time.  "Ain't but one way out babe..."

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 17:48 | 3494743 rabbitusvomitus
rabbitusvomitus's picture

Now that Is some funny shit!

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:43 | 3494194 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Sooooo, name, time, amount?

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:55 | 3494258 Levadiakos
Levadiakos's picture

Mr $50 silver and buying more

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:08 | 3494323 akak
akak's picture

I smell the taint of a Trav, and it ain't a good smell.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 17:35 | 3494674 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

Please stop comparing Gold to Apple stock. Unless Apple stock has some correlation to actual apples that I am not aware of.


Wed, 04/24/2013 - 17:31 | 3494662 Citxmech
Citxmech's picture

Thing is, TM, the smash-down was for paper contracts - not physical.  Nobody can get Ag or Au for anything near spot - in fact, it's pretty much where it was before the "smack down."

This is uncharted territory and it remains to be seen what happens - but I'm not worried one bit about holding and I sure as hell ain't selling.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:48 | 3493936 Creepy Lurker
Creepy Lurker's picture

I got nervous and took delivery last year.

Then decided to go canoeing...

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:24 | 3494092 EasterBunny
EasterBunny's picture

Why do you ask?

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 17:11 | 3494597 Bunga Bunga
Bunga Bunga's picture

It's a rumor spread by the Bilderbergers. They want a panic on the paper markets, making European governments sell physical.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:41 | 3493586 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture

That would be helpful DoChen.  I see plenty of LCS reports about silver, but not many on gold.

As I've said on other threads, there are differences between Gold and Silver:


Gold - GLD and COMEX Drainage. COT Reports suggest short covering.  Yet dealer inventory appears fine.

Silver - The opposite is happening to an extent.  Dealers are wiped out, but COT still bearish and SLV not getting drained.

Which begs the question:  

Is dumb money (small guy) buying silver (from dealers) while smart money taking gold in size (from Comex and GLD)?

I imagine smart money is ignorning the small dealers at the moment, as apparently the small guys are too, reports lumping gold and silver together notwithstanding.


I'd be curious as to whether others have insight on this.


Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:51 | 3493646 redpill
redpill's picture

Keep in mind the silver market is much smaller so it will naturally be more prone to shortage.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:58 | 3493675 ATM
ATM's picture

much smaller in what sense?

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:13 | 3493757 redpill
redpill's picture

In most senses.  Certainly dollar amount.  But also in physical supply because the majority of silver produced every year is consumed through industrial uses, unlike gold which is primarily kept in jewelry or bullion form.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:02 | 3493695 imbrbing
imbrbing's picture

uhhh......Much smaller as compared to what?

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:13 | 3493755 JonNadler
JonNadler's picture

uhhh......the gold markrt maybe

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:06 | 3493718 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

keep in mind a measly $500K in silver weighs almost nearly 1 ton. Thats a bitch to move and carry and store.

$500K in gold weighs about 29 lbs and can fit in a briefcase nicely. what would you rather deal with if you were going to stand for delivery of physical metal?

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:11 | 3493744 imbrbing
imbrbing's picture

And there are a lot more people that cant afford $500K than there are that can. So which comodity gets the most attention?

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:35 | 3494157 FEDbuster
FEDbuster's picture

1,000 rounds of 7.62x39 steel cased, hollow points weighs 38 lbs, and fits nicely in a 50 cal. ammo can, since we are talking precious metals weight and size.  

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:12 | 3494343 espirit
espirit's picture

What's that priced in A.S.E.'s now?

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 20:23 | 3495339 FEDbuster
FEDbuster's picture

405 FRNs delivered to my door (no ammo can included).  With ASE street priced at about 30 FRNs, looks like 13.5 ASEs/1000 rounds. Plus, it looks like Barry is going to pull the dictator card and ban the import of ammunition from the USSR to the USSA.

I figure if it's good enough for Big Sis and DHS to buy stock up on extra hollow points for "training", it's good enough for me.  Molon Labe.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:29 | 3493837 mick_richfield
mick_richfield's picture

Yes, $500,000 in Ag is about 1500 pounds.

So, OK, don't expect to carry it all in your purse at once.

( I also make it a point never to carry $500,000 in cash on my person...)

The size is not tremendously impressive, though:  about a 16" cube.


Wed, 04/24/2013 - 23:28 | 3495940 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

A 10-carat diamond is even smaller, but what a b!tch it is to find a buyer!

Thu, 04/25/2013 - 01:08 | 3496285 natty light
natty light's picture

Boat ballast

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:35 | 3493851 Oracle of Kypseli
Oracle of Kypseli's picture

340 eagles * 2.87mm = 1m of pvc pipe About $500k

Glue two end caps and use it in your home exercise room as lifting bar

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:35 | 3494152 KnightTakesKing
KnightTakesKing's picture

That's some expensive exercise equipment you got there. Can I come over and work out?

Thu, 04/25/2013 - 05:41 | 3496608 Oracle of Kypseli
Oracle of Kypseli's picture

Sorry, wrong blog.

Knight takes Queen would have been more appropriate in any case. + I am most likely 22 hours away from you. Business airfare $11k. buy some gold instead

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:31 | 3494135 philosophers bone
philosophers bone's picture

Personally, the fact that silver is so heavy has benefits.  If you are ever tempted to sell on the dip, it's too much of a pain in the ass to sell substantial amounts of physical.  As opposed to Sprott Trust where you might panic and sell.   So the stack just keeps growing.  It forces discipline!!

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:36 | 3494467 icanhasbailout
icanhasbailout's picture

It's a real bitch to confiscate, though, which is part of the point of choosing silver over gold. Very few people have that kind of money to store anyway, so it's rather moot for 99% of the population.


Be sure to buy your gold in a traceable manner so they know where to go when it comes time to confiscate!

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 17:36 | 3494685 DizzySailor
DizzySailor's picture

That is a sorry fact Jack!!! If I had to run, I know that $100K in gold would not slow me down much and that is at todays price. I know that  500 oz of silver, in a bag, weighs 31 Lbs. and that is 31 Lbs..  Grab  5 gal. of water and then you will understan the weight issue and why the masses have chose Gold and Diamonds to use the currency in flight.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 17:00 | 3494564 DirkDiggler11
DirkDiggler11's picture

Check out the move in several of the silver such as HL, EXK, and CDE,et al today. Some with +10% price moves up today on a relatively quiet day in the spot market for silver.

Strange price action as i have traded the miners for years and have rarely seen this sharp a price action on such a quiet, nothing news kind of day.

I'm not complaining but it is noteworthy that the money-flow was into the miners today.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 17:02 | 3494567 Cacete de Ouro
Cacete de Ouro's picture

For gold, just keep an eye on the Comex daily delivery notices report and Harvey Organ's daily analysis of the Comex gold inventories

and notice the withdrawls going out of JPM, HSBC, and Scotia this week, and the low inventory levels...

Thats all you need to do...

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:35 | 3493540 Pinto Currency
Pinto Currency's picture


Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:34 | 3493548 redpill
redpill's picture

Maybe when Groupon does a bullion special

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:00 | 3493684 draug
draug's picture

There's no shortage of gold, just of gold coins. If the "panic" keeps up they'll just make more.

(Never got the appeal of coins anyway - why would you pay a premium just to get it in circles rather than rectancles.)

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:07 | 3493709 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

(Never got the appeal of coins anyway - why would you pay a premium just to get it in circles rather than rectancles.)

How else is everyones LCS going to make money lol

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:27 | 3494106 Pinto Currency
Pinto Currency's picture


No shortage of gold.

There is a shortage of gold in comparison to the $100 trillion bond market.

Slowly, the elephants are starting to wake up and smell some frightening smells.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:14 | 3493764 redpill
redpill's picture

For one, they are a lot harder to drill :)

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:36 | 3493858 outamyeffinway
outamyeffinway's picture

Tell Germany that.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:17 | 3494378 espirit
espirit's picture

Check the price of older rounds, especially ASE's.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:45 | 3493905 seek
seek's picture


"Never got the appeal of coins anyway - why would you pay a premium just to get it in circles rather than rectancles"

A combination of more easily established authenticity and preferred tax status. That's why the AGE has a premium over straight bars.

The fact that people are getting warehouse receipts again after standing for delivery would imply there is, in fact, a shortage of gold.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 17:50 | 3494754 DizzySailor
DizzySailor's picture

So, everything you would need or like to buy is $10,000 or more? Get real. You need walking around money bonehead.


Wed, 04/24/2013 - 17:52 | 3494755 DizzySailor
DizzySailor's picture

So, everything you would need or like to buy is $10,000 or more? Get real. You need walking around money bonehead.


Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:35 | 3494150 philosophers bone
philosophers bone's picture

A person I know thinks the coins would potentially attract a higher premium in a SHTF scenario, because there would be more demand due to the practicality.  Interesting theory. 

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:00 | 3494278 ljag
ljag's picture

Cause you can't put tungsten in a coin whereas u can pour it into a bar.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 18:48 | 3495027 Long_Xau
Long_Xau's picture

That's not exactly correct. The website of that China Tungsten company seems to advertise gold plated tungsten coins.

I haven't seen any reports of such fake coins though. And btw tungsten wouldn't be poured into anything, since it has an extremely high melting temperature.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:32 | 3493539 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

"Where's the gold, Lebowski? Where's the fucking gold, shithead?!"

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:37 | 3493564 kliguy38
kliguy38's picture

this is only foreplay....not panic......when panic hits YOU will not be able to get physical PERIOD....there is no way to know when they cross over that point of no guess is its already happened

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:59 | 3493679 ATM
ATM's picture

When panic hits it will be caused by the loss in faith in Fiat. We are not there yet. 

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:57 | 3493968 Rubicon
Rubicon's picture

Or to put it another way, when Fiat collapses.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:42 | 3494495 css1971
css1971's picture

What is Fiat today (other than a huge car company?)

It's bank credit, only 3% of money in the UK us paper. The rest was issued by the banks as credit.

So what we're talking about is the loss of faith in bank credit... We're pretty fucking close.

Particularly as the ordinary person are beginning to wake up to the fact that when they put money in the bank, it's no longer their money, they made an investment, it's at risk, the interest rate is shit.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 17:25 | 3494647 Common_Cents22
Common_Cents22's picture

a trillion here of currency money and a trillion there of bond money and soon you are talking some real money piling into physical gold.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:42 | 3493572 Canadian Dirtlump
Canadian Dirtlump's picture

I posted this already at silver doctors, but this will be coming to gold windows all over when idiots with allocated and unallocated accounts start getting OWNED en masse.


Memoires of the rental car stand from planes, trains & automobiles.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:01 | 3493691 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

It ain't just the Hunt Brothers anymore. When the entire world wants to take delivery and can't get it then the bankers will be hung from trees.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:19 | 3493469 Kiss My Iceland...
Kiss My Icelandic Ass's picture

"It's panic. This is one of the busiest times in quite a while. People think gold's at the lows and they want to take advantage."


Hmmm. Bubbles getting more bubbly ? Tulips ! I need tulips !

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:23 | 3493481 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

Lets see if I can help:

Bubbles = Higher prices, not lower!

Did I make that easy enough?

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:35 | 3493559 Kiss My Iceland...
Kiss My Icelandic Ass's picture

Ummm ... bubbles pop ? :)

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:41 | 3493589 prains
prains's picture

the popping sound is your brain cells going bye bye

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:50 | 3493634 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

Dear Dumb Dumb,

Do you buy after the bubble has popped?

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:00 | 3493685 ATM
ATM's picture

The bubble is in fiat issuing government debt.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:03 | 3493702 whotookmyalias
whotookmyalias's picture

LOL, I normally buy just before the bubble pops. :)

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:44 | 3494206 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Do people usually wait until a bubble pops to start piling in?

I think you should write a paper on the subject.  You'll get a Nobel Prize!

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:48 | 3494227 akak
akak's picture

These cretins cannot realize that a bank run is not a "bubble" in money.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:01 | 3494295 Levadiakos
Levadiakos's picture

There always fools trying to catch the falling piano. You for example are stupid enough

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 17:51 | 3494646 fuu
fuu's picture

Yay Vodka Aisle is back! 

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:25 | 3493493 Meat Hammer
Meat Hammer's picture

Tulip bulbs vs Gold - One of these has been money for thousands of years; the other is something you bury in the back yard.

Oh, wait......

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:27 | 3493509 gmrpeabody
gmrpeabody's picture


Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:07 | 3493719 jimmytorpedo
jimmytorpedo's picture

Cool, I'm going to have golden tulips!

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:57 | 3493974 eclectic syncretist
eclectic syncretist's picture

Ben Shalom is planting tulips on Jamie's knob.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:57 | 3493978 eclectic syncretist
eclectic syncretist's picture

Ben Shalom is planting tulips on Jamie's knob.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 13:49 | 3493618 Praetorian Guard
Praetorian Guard's picture

JFC... another PM tard... "money" in the history of the world has been whatever was convienent for the location and acceptable by the people. PM's were not the "standard", shells, furs, skins, rocks, food, etc. have all been used. The history of "money" is interesting, which I believe few, if any here have even researched indepth... "money" only becomes viable when basics have been secured and wealth accumulation has been established. If the current system burns to the ground or tanks, like so many of you guys here mentally masterbate about, JiT shuts down, war, starvation, civil unrest, etc. basically, no one will want your money because supplies and everyday commods will be scarce - it will be a "barter economy"... and please don't show your ignorance by quoting Zimbabwe or the Weimar Republic - two seperate issues that hold no weight - different set of circumstances, and different global monetary perspective as it equates to JiT, etc...

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:17 | 3493779 Praetorian Guard
Praetorian Guard's picture

The negative flags, with absolutely NO COMMENTS, is so brave of you... for it is a "Brave New World"... whatever...

Well, since you tards like to spew and regurgitate history, lets talk history... here is one quick example ( Now if you notice, it was several factors that contributed to the collapse of Rome - very similar to what we see on a global level currently. Also, of interest, is that AFTER Rome collapsed, gee, no one was using GOLD for trade, but it shifted to BARTER. Gee, why is that? I thought GOLD was the ultimate form of currency, PM tards? You people have no freaking clue, and suck the tit of the PM sellers and suck the hook, line and sinker down for the PM propaganda...



Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:21 | 3493793 redpill
redpill's picture

Whatever you say cupcake, that's why they pull up Spanish galleons full of BARTER.  Oh, wait.  By the way, if you act like a dick you get junked, no matter what your point is.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:23 | 3494416 espirit
espirit's picture

Amen bro.  I don't think we can uptick this one away.  Classic signs of hostility and all the other psychobabbles, so best to let this lit fuse burn.

Tyler's - Need an ip locate on aisle 1.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:31 | 3493846 Meat Hammer
Meat Hammer's picture

Change your handle to Buzz Killington.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:42 | 3493893 Mandel Bot
Mandel Bot's picture

Barter only works when both the barterer and the barteree have the exact commodities the other needs.

If there is a disconnect then some intermediate medium of exchange is needed. (Like money)

Gold is money.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:39 | 3494486 grekko
grekko's picture

Don't forget silver for smaller transactions.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:24 | 3494085 Swarmee
Swarmee's picture

Relevant trivia: how were the Roman Praetorian Guard paid?

Answer: with Donativum - Gold/Silver/Brass.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:59 | 3494557 Poor Grogman
Poor Grogman's picture

The continuing hysterical and purile attacks against golds monetary status provides valuable insight into the current discomfort level of the "money changers"...

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:19 | 3493780 redpill
redpill's picture

Right, it's not as if every major civilization since Rome has used gold coinage as a store of value.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:21 | 3493807 Praetorian Guard
Praetorian Guard's picture

...hahahaha, whatever. Like I said, you guys keep telling the forum, and these sellers are screaming to the top of their voices that the dollar is going to collapse. If it does, global currency collapses. Gee, and what is your fucking gold going to buy when tangible commods become in SHORT supply??? Yea, not a damn thing. Currency, if you knew anything, comes at a later time frame. Intitally it is barter until JiT and static lines can be established...

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:26 | 3493831 redpill
redpill's picture

You dumbass.  Why don't you stop freaking out and think about it for a moment.

Let's say you think a global currency collapse is imminent, and you have $100,000 and don't know what to do with it.  You're saying you're going to go spend the entire $100,000 on barter items?  Where will you keep them?  In a big pile in front of your house where someone could easily steal it?

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:12 | 3494036 Swarmee
Swarmee's picture

Exactly. $95k in Au, $5k in high ABV booze, cigs, med supplies, MREs, & batteries for barter. Personal supplies sit outside that calculation.

One barters with different items than one stores wealth long term. Although some barter goods keep longer than others.

As to the fall of Rome example, my Denarius is made of silver, not wheat.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:37 | 3494162 redpill
redpill's picture

If you have the space, bottles of Jack Daniels are perfect.  Instantly recognizable by anyone, highly regarded, not very expensive, and they will last forever.  Unless of course you drink them :)

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:30 | 3494444 espirit
espirit's picture

Evan Williams just a good as Jack Black, maybe better.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:44 | 3493899 Meat Hammer
Meat Hammer's picture

Let me help you....I'll try not to use too many big words.

Gold is a medium of exchange.  

I have a cow but I want a 1,000 bushels of wheat; the wheat farmer has no use for a cow but he really could use a new tractor; the tractor salesman has no use for 1,000 bushels of wheat but could use a new car; the car salesman could really use a cow to feed his family.  What is the one thing that could make all of this happen?  Right-o dickhead!  A valuable currency that can't be destroyed by a central banker because it can't be created out of thin air, is fungible, and universally accepted.  

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:48 | 3493932 Praetorian Guard
Praetorian Guard's picture

Completely DIFFERENT paradigm... jesus, some people are really that dumb...

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:16 | 3494046 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Others have covered your thesis fairly well.  I would just draw out one point for debate:

You referenced Zimbabwe.   How's about this...  Mining gold for bread in Zibabwe.

Trading gold for bread is "barter".

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:34 | 3494465 espirit
espirit's picture

Explain away the value of my $USD Silver Certificates, my Dracmas, or any other obsolete (read worthless) fiat currencies.

What a fucking tard.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:18 | 3494066 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Meat hammer did his best to teach you 8th grade econ. But you sir are concentrated industrial strength stupid, you should have a guard to leave the house.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:54 | 3493958 centerline
centerline's picture

Except for the period of time when a desperate government makes it illegal to even say the word "gold."  When the exchange rate is a hollowpoint round for that bushel of wheat.

The point here is that PMs are not the singular answer to world's problems.  There are all sorts of different ways this could play out.

Too many folks around here are acting like greedy little people counting their chickens before they hatch.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:01 | 3493987 Meat Hammer
Meat Hammer's picture

Your use of hyperbole illustrates a strong inability to argue your point on the basis of facts.  

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:17 | 3494053 centerline
centerline's picture

lol.  Desperate governments do desperate things in order to keep the party going.  This is how nations die.  How ugly will it get?  Who knows.  But, there is certainly the potential for things to get downright nasty for a long period of time.

This is about surviving the voyage through the collapse of the current system and into the next one.


Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:26 | 3494099 Meat Hammer
Meat Hammer's picture

But, there is certainly the potential for things to get downright nasty for a long period of time.

+1...true dat

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:37 | 3494172 centerline
centerline's picture

Just trying to keep the perspective balanced.  lol.  Is fun as well because the PM subject gets heated so quickly.  And ZH has been fanning the flames here really good for the last week or so.  Used to be that to get some perspective out of the Tylers, you really had to read.

Trust me, if somehow the path through the coming storm was simple and those who were prudent finally get some sort of leg up, I would be a real happy camper.  I have had it with the moral freakin hazard these days and getting spanked regularly for being responsible.

Who knows what is coming.  It might be that my kids get the real benefit of anything I have bought (assuming I can find it in the lake near my house where I had that accident some time ago).  I am cool with that too.  Hell, maybe it is a ticket out from a bad place.

I would think that there is also a good chance PMs will be the basis for another currency someday.  Fiat wont be going away.  But a freegold system might actually have a chance.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:32 | 3494149 Freegold
Freegold's picture

+5000 years of history says I will never go hungry owning gold. But I guess soon people will understand that gold is just worth what the next fool pays for it.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:49 | 3494229 tmosley
tmosley's picture

What will gold buy when tangible commodities are in short supply?

Everything.  Barter is for poor people.  Gold is for the ruling class.

This has all happened before, and it will all happen again.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:13 | 3494351 Levadiakos
Levadiakos's picture

Your ass must be raw.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:20 | 3494392 akak
akak's picture

Raw assholes seem to excite you.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:52 | 3494244 klockwerks
klockwerks's picture

 PG, just a thought. The very wealthy will always have what is needed to survive and will always be interested in picking up any store of value. I would suggest a decent amount of silver or gold plus lead of course, add to that a storage of food, equipment and stuff for barter that a person should be self sustaining if something does happen. Everything in balance perhaps

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:28 | 3493836 centerline
centerline's picture

+1 from me PG.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 14:35 | 3493853 mick_richfield
mick_richfield's picture

Sorry, old soldier, I've educated more than my share of fools already.

If you come here to offer brilliance like "sea shells", you should not expect much.  It's not cowardice, it's boredom.

Age quod agis.



( This was  @ PG.     Sacrilege!  bugalert !  )

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:20 | 3494072 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Purty much...   I'm all tired out from yelling into the wind as well.

Besides, the word "barter" has been used way too much.

Definition: The action or system of exchanging goods or services without using money.

The operative term being money.  If I have too many apples and I'm slick with my debts, I might want to "barter" some spare apples for gold to make a shiny bracelet for my old lady.   That's not a use of gold as money; it becomes a commodity.

The main problem is defining terms.  There can be no debate (like between inflation and deflation) until all participants agree upon the terms being used.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:29 | 3494116 centerline
centerline's picture

At least it furthers the conversation into a space with a little more intellegence.  Things are just tad more complicated than "buy gold."

Anyone who is sitting around thinking they are going cash out at some point and be rich could be right!  And they could be horribly wrong as well.  My bet is that PMs will have essential purposes in the coming years.  And so will a whole host of other things.

As if perpetual growth in the real world (and/or financial world) stands a chance.  As proven so far by the leaders of the world, they are going to march the entire fucking planet into a complete meltdown in a vain attempt to stay in power.  

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 15:46 | 3494212 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

A lot of folks point out that gold has no industrial or other value like other commodities.  Well....  If gold were plentiful and cheap it would be used up in a heartbeat.  Like its use on electrical contacts, a small amount does a great deal to improve its efficiency and lifespan.   The very fact that gold can be theoretically beaten into a sheet an atom thick makes it useful.  HOWEVER, it's not cheap nor plentiful.  The argument thus falls on its face.  It's not used because industry can't AFFORD to use it.  It has millions of uses, but it costs too much, because it's rare, because it's so versatile.  Sigh...  I get so tired of the argument.

Wed, 04/24/2013 - 16:11 | 3494344 Bendromeda Strain
Bendromeda Strain's picture

I might want to "barter" some spare apples for gold to make a shiny bracelet for my old lady.   That's not a use of gold as money; it becomes a commodity.

Or both - don't tell her that you are making the links 1 gram each, similar in principle to the Thai baht chain. As the "commodity" gets shorter (as she sleeps), drop a hint that she might be gaining a little weight.



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