This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.

The Highest Concentration Of Bitcoins In The World Is In... Berlin

Submitted by Tyler Durden on 04/27/2013 15:46 -0400

Via Michael Krieger of Liberty Blitzkrieg blog,

Fascinating article out today from the Guardian about the Kreuzberg area of Berlin, which has the highest density of businesses accepting Bitcoin in the world.

The clip above a must watch, as it becomes readily apparent how excited both the merchants and the customers are about using this free market currency. I am completely convinced that the more people learn about Bitcoin and use it, the more exponential its adoption will become. My favorite line from the video comes at the very end from Joerg Platzer, owner of the bar Room 77:

“Every day we do not start using a free currency like Bitcoin, we actually actively vote for the current system to continue.”

From the Guardian:

Like Chebli, Martens, whose Kersenvlaai (cherry cake) from her native Maastricht is rated as one of the best culinary offerings of the area, says she decided to accept Bitcoins because of the ease, cheapness and transparency of its payment system.

“It’s an easier way of digital payment than credit cards, which cost me a lot of money as a business and to which I’m forced to sign up for years,” she says.

These two tradespeople are among around a dozen in the Graefekiez, a cosy neighborhood established in the 19th century in the southern Berlin district of Kreuzberg, which currently boasts the highest density of businesses accepting the currency in the world. Its growing list of Bitcoin establishments includes a restaurant, a printing shop, a bar and boutique.

“Kreuzberg is traditionally an area in which people are very politically aware, critical towards existing systems and are constantly discussing and looking for alternatives to them, which makes it the perfect breeding ground for Bitcoin,” says Joerg Platzer, a staunch Bitcoin advocate who roams the neighborhood with a missionary zeal in search of new recruits.

“It could be from a science fiction novel, but the fact is we have it in the here and the now,” Gallas said, listing the items he has bought with Bitcoins, including “honey from Thailand, historic flags from the United States, gold and silver, concert tickets”, and of course, his beer and burgers.

He taps the amount he owes Room 77 into the virtual Bitcoin wallet on his Android phone and, aligning it with a code on the bar’s device, presses a button to process the payment. A theatrical “kerching” sound follows and Gallas is grinning from ear to ear. “It could hardly be easier,” he insisted.

Platzer buys the beer for Room 77 from the nearby Rollberg brewery, owned and run by qualified brew and malt meister Wilko Bereit. He pays for the barrels with Bitcoins and, while Bereit says he doesn’t fully understand the workings of the payment system, he is willing to trust it. “There is no middle man involved,” he said, talking in his hop-scented brewing parlour with its gleaming copper kettles, and casually dropping into the conversation that the German president is among his customers.

Looks like the first localized Bitcoin economy has been born. Go Kreuzberg!

Full article here.

- advertisements -

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:46 | 3506283 Haole

I'd like to know how too, because it's virtally impossible.

"2. This would be a defacto admission by TPTB that BTC = Money"

Well, they've already tipped their hand and now with FinCEN statements, Western Union and PayPal, etc. sniffing around...

Who knows, maybe someday soon it might even attain the title of "tradition", if not money... ;)

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:49 | 3506300 css1971

Please provide a complete list of all of your Bitcoin addresses and private keys, on pain of having all of your assets confiscated and going to prison for a long time.

Something like that?

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:49 | 3506309 Haole

How would anyone know one is transacting in Bitcoin without full voluntary disclosure by those people?

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:54 | 3506320 css1971

All transactions are published in the block chain. Everyone has full access to that, the government included.

All they would need is a suspicion, e.g. the software installed on your computer or the counterparty to a transaction telling them you use it & then if you don't provide them the info they need, you go to prison.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 18:28 | 3506381 Haole

Yes I know but despite the blockchain being public domain, how can a transaction be "traced" to anyone specific? Businesses may be one thing but individuals buying a bag of apples for .05 BTC is another. That is what I'd sincerely like to know free of any "government hacked of the encryption", etc. speculation.

It's akin to the argumen that Bitcoin is crap because all they have to do is turn off the internet... If they turn off the internet or if they start shaking people down on the suspicion that they use Bitcoin or to acquire information about Bitcoin tax evaders from people, we have a whole hell of a lot more to worry about than simply paying some tax on Bitcoin transactions.

I hope you know where I'm coming from. Personally, the last people I want to pull one over on is CRA and will gladly pay my capital gains tax on the one Bitcoin trade I've done this year or any in the future. I just don't see how they can declare they are going to tax all these transactions without either full disclosure by the parties involved or in a world that would make Orwell's jaw drop.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 18:59 | 3506439 Dr Benway

With the complete list of all transactions, you could easily trace unknowns from the known users. Even just looking at transactions, if they were regular enough, would be enough to easily identify you. You can identify a good chunk of people based on their google history alone.

As for looking for tax evading bitcoiners, it would be naive to think the authorities are not doing this already. With black money, the problem is spending it, that's where they get you.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 18:49 | 3506414 freedogger

They can tax my capital gains as soon as they accept my capital losses from the power surge that fried my RAID array way back in 2010. Modern day equivalent of a boating accident.

Sun, 04/28/2013 - 08:51 | 3507250 Croesus

@ Kirk2NCC1701

To answer your questions as I see it:

1. How are they going to do it? I don't know all the technical aspects behind BTC, but how hard is it to implement reporting requirements at the exchanges themselves? Hypothetically, go to Mt. Gox and say: "In order to fight money laundering and terrorist financing, we need you to report all transactions to us. If they don't agree, they would be re-classified as "an organization that supports terrorism".

DotGov's and Banks are all in bed with each other. Getting foreign government compliance is not as hard as it sounds. Threaten to pull foreign aid, threaten to pull military aid, there's a number of different ways to achieve the objective.

2. It wouldn't necessarily be an admission of BTC as money; look at it like a stock. People put their money in, get their money out. Maybe their share of BTC gains 'value' in the currency they transact in. DotGov is simply interested in making sure you pay "capital gains tax", and possibly VAT (if applicable).

These points you raise all go back to one of my original contentions that BTC is not "threatening the system", or "being subversive", because if it was, DotGov would be "pulling the plug on it". By that I mean, "legislating it out of existence", or "making it such a pain in the ass to use, that it loses its attractiveness to people".

In the end, from DotGov's perspective, it's all about the money. DotGov always needs MOAR, and they will never run out of ideas on how to separate you from yours, whether it's taxation, bail-ins, direct theft, or other.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 16:53 | 3506118 JLee2027

Didn't the Germans learn anything from the worst Hyperinflation in history?

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:40 | 3506269 Uncle Remus

That's rhetorical right?

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:46 | 3506298 Haole

What does any of that have to do with Bitcoin?

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:58 | 3506324 JLee2027

That only Gold and Silver are money, hello. The rest is all fiat currency. Including bitcoin.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 18:56 | 3506391 Haole

Open source, decentralized, free-market currency willfully used by choice is not "Fiat". Money can be anything at all if a people want to accept it for a good or service, transact with it, etc. Bitcoin is inherintly a deflationary currency which is why I found (find) your comment irrelevant.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 16:58 | 3506132 100pcDredge

Wollt ihr den totalen Bitcoin?

Sun, 04/28/2013 - 01:02 | 3506991 putaipan

sofa?

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:09 | 3506176 The Dancer

Authentic people the world over are gropping for ways to get the state out of their lives...only the losers want more statism!

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:13 | 3506187 malek

Hey, I actively vote to replace their fraud (the current system) with my fraud!

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:11 | 3506188 Hulk

I suppose that if my neighbor wouldn't return the gold that I trusted him with, that I would be collecting bitcoins too...

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:19 | 3506208 StarTedStackin'

ach die lieber.....

or whatever the fuck those Amish guys say .......

BITCOIN's existence within itself proves what a fucked up state the world financial condition is in..........

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:46 | 3506295 ultraticum

Are you saying we should not do anything to try to make the world not be in a "fucked up state"? Any ideas . . . . or do you just feel comfortable with the statist status quo?

Sun, 04/28/2013 - 08:08 | 3507194 StarTedStackin'

Are you as obtuse as your post implies? Statist Status quo? lol@idiocy

Look at my name, Douchebag.......do you think I am stacking bitcoins?

No, I am stacking actual money

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:18 | 3506213 bugs_

Jamie realized that the government can seize the gold but they will have a hard time doing that with bitcoins. Bitcoins will outlive Nation States and Political Unions (but not war).

Sun, 04/28/2013 - 08:07 | 3507196 StarTedStackin'

So the government has no control over the internet, or even electricity to run it?

LOL@STUPIDITY

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:43 | 3506277 Iam Yue2

Lemmings.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:41 | 3506279 Uncle Remus

Bitammo

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 17:46 | 3506288 Manipuflation

I have a "Wartune" sidebar ad with a nice CGI chick. I clear my browser frequently though. WTF? Plenty of gamers on ZH I see. Nothing wrong with that as I used to love Command and Conquer back then and still do.:-)

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 18:06 | 3506335 Monedas

If I have a cabbage from my garden .... and you have some carrots from yours .... and we swap over the backyard fence .... is that a taxable event .... technically .... do we owe sales tax to someone .... do we have to calculate our profit ? If you have sex with your date .... is that a taxable event ? If I invite you to dinner and you bring a bottle of wine .... is that a taxable event ?

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 18:17 | 3506362 Uncle Remus

If you are bartering with items that are NOT your primary trade, craft or profession, then it is not a taxable event in the US. If gardening is your hobby, no problem. If your ADM - no problem. Anyone else - you're screwed. Then there's that whole illegal garden thing.

FULL DISCLOSURE: I am not an attorney or a CPA. Information is presented for information & entertainment purposes only. You should seek the advice of a PhD in Economics, a "Nobel" Winner in Economics or a really smart guy who writes a column for a legitimate mainstream media outlet such as the NYT.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 18:43 | 3506394 Monedas

Thanks ! What's ADM .... Archers Daniels Midland ? As we enter the brave new world of Bitcoin and bartering .... we may have to find out just how intrusive government is ! Alternative Minimum Barter Event Tax ?

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 18:41 | 3506412 Haole

"If you are bartering with items that are NOT your primary trade, craft or profession, then it is not a taxable event in the US."

That's why I find the declaration that Canada is going to tax BTC transactions nothing but an empty "threat" to an exent given FinCEN's guidance. Or are these articles remiss in mentioning business transactions specifically? I don't get it really...

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 18:47 | 3506419 Monedas

I'm a "Jack of all Trades" .... guess I'm fucked ! If your spinster Aunt .... pleasures herself .... with a cordless egg beater .... does she owe a tax to the Franchise Tax Board .... Jack Off Tax ?

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 19:03 | 3506443 Haole

Try to leave your fantasies out of this and don't give them any bright ideas in the meantime...

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 20:13 | 3506552 Monedas

Macro/Micro economics .... get ready for Macro/Micro taxing .... Socialists are petty, busy body, control freaks !

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 18:07 | 3506340 lickspitler

can you shoot it ...... no

can you eat it...... no

can you put it in your bunker .....no

can you stack it ......... no

is it pussy ........no

so fuck Bitcoin who cares.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 19:06 | 3506449 paint it red ca...

I was just wondering why bitcoin now occupies such a high editorial percentage of ZH in recent weeks, on either side of the moon shot and bust.

Is it news, no.
Is it a large enough trend to make a difference, no.
Has it caused even the least ripple in currency markets, no.
Have vast inroads been made into the lives of average investors, no.
Is it the next great new thing peaking over the horizon, hell no.

So whats with over reporting a tulip bulb of a side note to a side note of a crisis?

Could it be unabashed promotion, a sales pitch, a hype job? You tell me...

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 20:21 | 3506565 Monedas

It's a Ponzi scheme .... who's time has come .... there's a first time for every Ponzi .... especially these fad .... state of the art schemes ....if you have to understand it .... that's going to cut down on it's marketability .... you don't have to explain cash .... or even gold and coke .... to hookers and pimps !

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 23:55 | 3506630 wintermute

Because TD and his crew at ZH know that this new currency has the potential to supercede most of fiat and relegate PMs to industrial status. It is this scenario which makes Bitcoin an essential on the watchlist

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 18:09 | 3506350 Keith Piccirillo

Bittecoin

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 18:44 | 3506418 Bunga Bunga

Berlin made the Wall fall, Berlin will make Wall St fall.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 19:27 | 3506430 Monedas

"Mr. Kruschev, thank you for the nice wall !" .... Willy Brandt, Mayor of Berlin ! What about Ronnie and Maggie ? Berlinercoin ! Biercoin ? Wurstcoin ? Bestecoin ? Bischencoin ? www.youTube.com/watch?v=IRmFoU4SLEI The Happy Wanderer Frank Weir, Soprano Sax 1954

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 18:52 | 3506434 q99x2

Saw that yesterday over at Keiser. There are a hell of a lot of places that will work in the US.

Will work for BitCoin.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 19:03 | 3506448 Tango in the Blight

Kreuzberg is filled with well-to-do champagne socialists who believe in "change" and empathize with the "poor" exept when they are asked to actually donate money. They drove out the Turkish immigrants who used to live there via gentrification.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 19:23 | 3506475 walküre

Chinese, Indians, Iranians, Russians prefer CASH. They deal in CASH, no amount too large.

Forget BTC. You need cash. Cash cannot be taxed either. Once out of the system, it's non traceable. Cash will not fluctuate in a mad speculative bout of volatility as we're witnessing with BTC daily.

PMs are good store of value. Cash under the mattress is yours. It's there and you can shop with it, leave with it, gift it away and do whatever you please w/o alerting authorities. Plenty places in the world do not freak out when you pay in large amounts of cash. They don't require to tell Big Brother that you've just paid over x amount in cash and it doesn't need to be reported.

Cash is the real enemy of the system and the real libertarian's currency of choice. If we hadn't given in to credit cards and loans upon loans, the elite would have never been able to manipulate the currency. Now there's so much freakin' liquidity and cheap money in the system, it is hard work to take that money in cash out of the system. Banks typically don't have larger amounts on a daily basis. They give you $2500 but if you ask for $25000 you have to come back. They need to order it.

Don't be afraid to hold cash. Just live frugal and don't impress upon anyone that you're potentially hoarding thousands of dollars under your bed. Most importantly, don't tell anyone including your spouse. If you die, he/she will find a note.

BTC is nonsense and Berlin Kreuzberg is full of idiots.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 21:07 | 3506648 SpykerSpeed

Can you send cash to someone in another country instantly? Can you sneak cash across the border without being detected by the DHS and customs?

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 23:06 | 3506868 walküre

Sure. I go to Western Union and make a wire. Its fast, its reliable.

Who says to keep cash under the mattress in only one country? Keeping several currencies in cash is also a good idea.

When all fails and we have a reset, BTC will get treated like every other paper gimmick. Equities and bonds included. Last one out the door is holding the back. I'd rather own blue chip shares in that case.

Cash gets converted 1:1 for the first few thousand, then lesser ratios after that. Phyz is the only protection in that case.

Next question.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 23:57 | 3506921 wintermute

Next question: do you enjoy being bent over and rammed by WU when they take their eye-watering percentage of your cash?

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 21:13 | 3506661 Cabreado

Imagine if all the energy spent bickering over Bitcoin were instead applied to what has, and is, destroying the existing currency.

It seems rather foolish to think a "new currency" will solve anything, when the overarching problems have nothing to do with the currency at all.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 21:52 | 3506729 Bunga Bunga

The root cause for the "overarching problems" lies in credit created out of thin air in a monopoly currency.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 22:06 | 3506770 Cabreado

Ah, so you think you've discovered the holy grail of what ails us.

Your definition of "root cause" is very different than mine.

Sat, 04/27/2013 - 21:56 | 3506742 wisefool

As I understand it, it is a psudeo meitrocious system that revolves around math. Quantum computing will turn it upside down.

Sun, 04/28/2013 - 00:03 | 3506925 wintermute

There are alternate encyrption shcemes which could be used by Bitcoin if QCs get close to threatening SHA-256. At the moment monkeys throwing darts would have a better chance of cracking a private key than any QC running today.

Sun, 04/28/2013 - 00:08 | 3506927 wisefool

deleted.

Sun, 04/28/2013 - 00:40 | 3506968 statelessman

Myth

Quantum computers would break Bitcoin's security While ECDSA is indeed not secure under quantum computing, quantum computers don't yet exist and probably won't for a while.

The DWAVE system often written about in the press is, even if all their claims are true, not a quantum computer of a kind that could be used for cryptography.

Bitcoin's security, when used properly with a new address on each transaction, depends on more than just ECDSA: Cryptographic hashes are much stronger than ECDSA under QC.

Bitcoin's security was designed to be upgraded in a forward compatible way and could be upgraded if this were considered an imminent threat. The risk of quantum computers is also there for financial institutions, like banks, because they heavily rely on cryptography when doing transactions.

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Myths#Quantum_computers_would_break_Bitcoin.2...

Sun, 04/28/2013 - 02:50 | 3507054 OpenThePodBayDoorHAL

I love the "quantum computing" argument. Yeah, quantum computers are gonna change everything, and at the same time as they come on line we will all be teleporting to work every day...

Sun, 04/28/2013 - 00:08 | 3506939 newengland