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The US Student Loan Bubble Broken Down By State, And Why Washington D.C. Sticks Out Like A Sore Thumb

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Curious how the student loan bubble, just shy of $1 trillion, and now the largest debt portion of the US household non-mortgage wallet,  bigger than credit card and auto loan debt - affects your state? Then the following three charts just out from the NY Fed are for you.

What the data shows is that less than 12% of the population in Hawaii has student loans, while the record is in D.C. at over 25%. All those "students" in the nation's capital. Really?

But that's not all. While the average loan balance is under $21,000 in Wyoming, it is once again highest in D.C., with the average loan balance over $40,000. It is almost as if D.C. "students" have learned how to game the system.

Yet where the very "studious" population in the capital city truly excels is in the amount of delinquency: here it is all West Virginia at the top with over 18% of all loans delinquent 3 months and over, while DC is not even in the top 10 - must be all those well-paying jobs for interns and college grads in the beltway. It is almost as if someone is closing their eyes when it comes to the delinquencies of DC borrowers. But that would be yet another preposterous conspiracy theory of course...

Borrowers as share of population:

Student loans balances per borrower:

Percentage of 90+ day delinquent:

The supporting detail.

  • Student loan borrowers as a share of the population. The population with active student loan debts, or “SL borrowers,” as a share of the population with a credit record varies substantially over space. For example, in Hawaii, less than 12 percent of people with a credit report have student debt, while in the District of Columbia over 25 percent do.
  • Student loan balances per SL borrower. Student indebtedness is significant for SL borrowers in virtually all states. Educational indebtedness per SL borrower ranges from a low of just under $21,000 in Wyoming to a high of over $28,000 in Maryland. Again, Washington, D.C., stands out: the average SL borrower there owes over $40,000. In general, we find SL-borrower debt levels are highest in California and along the Atlantic and Gulf coasts.
  • Percent of balance ninety-plus days delinquent. Delinquency rates show a distinct regional pattern, with states in the south and southwest having generally higher rates than those in the north. The lowest delinquency rate is South Dakota, at just over 6.5 percent, while the highest is in West Virginia, at nearly 18 percent.
 

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Tue, 05/14/2013 - 12:48 | 3561033 Divided States ...
Divided States of America's picture

Why would anybody need to study when they can borrow money and plow into the stock markets that never drop???

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 12:51 | 3561050 Arius
Arius's picture

day trading the loan money

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:04 | 3561115 Shocker
Shocker's picture

Basically a good chunk of college kids are coming out $20,000+ in debt.

In a normal healthy economy, they can be paid back in 5 years, but in today economy... Good Luck

Hope your degree is in something in demand.

Layoff/Closing List

http://www.dailyjobcuts.com

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:09 | 3561142 dontgoforit
dontgoforit's picture

Hope that trip to Cancun on your student loan money was worth it. 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:45 | 3561356 jbvtme
jbvtme's picture

what about the useless shit these clowns are studying? swapping debt for the privilege of politically correct critical thinking, darwin and collectivism.  look at boston, the education capitol of the usa.  those pussy fratboys shouting "usa usa" after being all "sheltered in" during that fake martial law excercise last month?  gag

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:04 | 3561474 TheSilverJournal
TheSilverJournal's picture

And if they can't find work, the debt is now of no concern.

http://studentaid.ed.gov/repay-loans/understand/plans/pay-as-you-earn

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:10 | 3561499 Hohum
Hohum's picture

Darwin?  What's your alternative: Intelligent Design?

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:30 | 3561606 tango
tango's picture

Forget it.  Anybody that dismisses all knowledge as shit is not to be taken seriously.  College should be a time of growing up, learning to prioritize, plan, research and prepare yourself for the real world.  It should NOT be an on-site job training center.  Despite the emphasis on technology we still need literature, history and anthropology majors (I am an engineer). 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:55 | 3561685 marathonman
marathonman's picture

The market for literarture, history, and anthropology is shrinking and over-supplied.  We need that stuff?  Not really. 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 15:09 | 3561767 They trynna cat...
They trynna catch me ridin dirty's picture

On the contrary, the market for literature, history and anthropology has been inundated with politically correct drivel.

One can never have too much Plato, Shakespeare or Pound. 100 years ago people came out of Harvard reading Latin. The Founding Fathers were exposed to this sort of true education, the same type that Alexander the Great's father hired Aristotle to provide him with. All science, economics, beauty and virtue leads back to the one divine architect who created it all for his inscrutable purposes, with one logical system underpinning all of it.

Reject relativism and the lies and censorship necessary to uphold it. Accept truth, embrace beauty, knock and the door will be opened to you.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 17:53 | 3562331 Yes We Can. But...
Yes We Can. But Lets Not.'s picture

I live in the DC area, which is why I am aware of a little known fact: the Congress provides any DC high school grad with a nifty $50,000 bonus:

http://www.examiner.com/article/dc-residents-qualify-for-huge-tuition-br...

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 18:42 | 3562511 Go Tribe
Go Tribe's picture

The fuckin' shit! What the hell is going on???? Nothing more than paying for votes and greasing the palms of fed workers.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 20:38 | 3562859 Offthebeach
Offthebeach's picture

So, two...three. 'utes a year, qualify.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 15:50 | 3561908 potlatch
potlatch's picture

you do realize you take a range of classes in a proper college education, correct?  It is not like your vo-tech school.  You take classes in lots of things, not just your profession, or as you would likely call it, yer jerb.

 

The general and broad malaise of idiocy that is driving the world and US economy into the ground, is often -- I say often, not always -- quite vividly indicated in the comments of those angry about the idiocy, re: "education."

 

They demonstrate all too often, they are the thing itself they are speaking of so angrily.  The general and broad malaise of idiocy.  It's not just the economy, stupid.  It's just general stupidity, free range stupidity, that bedevils us. 

And not understanding the nature and purpose of a solid higher education, is part of that general idiocy.

 

Learn, people.  Do not fear having it ALL.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 17:17 | 3562241 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

Green for you sir, however, they are actively teaching stupidity at many of these institutions.  Unless a parent teaches a child to think, they are vulnerable to becoming part of the problem.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 19:20 | 3562649 optionsman
optionsman's picture

i am tempted to say you are correct. however correct you are about the range of subjects etc. and generally about education (more is better than less)- overall you are wrong. just think how the education is given- most of it is multiple choice tests and exams etc.- which is just an extension of xbox games for a couple of generations. it is about how to game the system not about the actual substantive knowledge. why would anyone bother with striving to really learn?- that is another question for another day......but the short answer is similar to the reason why it is a better paying job to shuffle papers in security markets (rentiers) rather than create added value typically represented by those pieces of paper......

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 17:12 | 3562231 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

"College should be a time of growing up, learning to prioritize, plan, research and prepare yourself for the real world.  It should NOT be an on-site job training center.  Despite the emphasis on technology we still need literature, history and anthropology majors (I am an engineer). "

Well said, and I'd give anything for you to be right, but unfortunately, the world has changed and kids have to grow up BEFORE they go to college or their lives will be ruined by debt and despair. 

"(W)e still need (insert well rounded liberal arts degree here)"... equates to you saying society needs to do this to fix this mess.  Unfortunately, fixing this mess is not going to happen.  The people who call the shots are pulling the tuna nets out of the water, so in this crappy "winner takes all" society, you either get a skill to escape the net, or you get eaten by the killers pulling the lines.

It's not pretty, but there it is.  I'm not arming my kids with what I think society needs, I'm trying to equip them to survive.  I'll send my kid to welding school before I send him to get an Anthropology degree.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:33 | 3561618 They trynna cat...
They trynna catch me ridin dirty's picture

How about the acknowledgment that the rigid order of the universe must have come from some orderING intelligence, since all order must necessarily and ultimately come from intelligence and not randomness.

Apparently a bunch of liberal arts major retards are now more intelligent than Plato because they think that logical proof is limited only to what you can see and what is vetted by "peer-reviewed journals" (just don't ask who the "peers" are!).

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 17:22 | 3562258 JimS
JimS's picture

Are you deft? There is no "rigid order" of the universe. Chaos is probably closer to "normal", than not.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 19:17 | 3562639 They trynna cat...
They trynna catch me ridin dirty's picture

Ever hear of physics?

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:15 | 3561166 Political_Savage
Political_Savage's picture

$20,000 seems a little light to me. Maybe for state schools or online degrees.

Go to a higher-end school (which still doesn't guarantee a job in the new normal) and you're looking at $80,000.

Hard to justify the paper, until you go online and submit an application knowing you're disqualified because you do have AT LEAST a CFA/MBA/PhD... online auto-filter won't even let you land in an inbox.

A recruiter called me last week about a job (I'm actually happily employed now after a punishing year without). Said I wasn't interested but I got a friend that's better qualified and currently out of work. He responded they weren't looking at unemployed candidates at this time... DOUCHE BAG!! You and the hiring manager... go FUCK yourselves!

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:36 | 3561270 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Go to a higher-end school (which still doesn't guarantee a job in the new normal) and you're looking at $80,000.

My sibling was doing cost analysis for Phd program at Stanford (as a non-American + living expenses) and estimated it would require somewhere in the ballpark of $300k of loans. Meanwhile top school for the speciality in Europe offered a full scholarship + $60k / yr salary and many other benefits. 

Stanford, great school and all but people would do well to look outside of the US unless you're really certain a giant loan is worth it. 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:44 | 3561648 The Carbonator
The Carbonator's picture

I got a Computer Engineering degree from a City School.

 

I'm doing better than many of my friends who went to private high end schools, and got BS (bull shit) degrees.

 

They looked down at me when they went to their fancy dorms and I stayed home with my parents.  Now i'm kicking them in the Balls.

 

It's what YOU make of your education, not the BS paper.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 16:07 | 3561986 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

 

I'm doing better than many of my friends who went to private high end schools, and got BS (bull shit) degrees.

 

They looked down at me when they went to their fancy dorms and I stayed home with my parents.  Now i'm kicking them in the Balls.

 

Which is probably why there's such a concerted effort to defund public colleges (and thus raise tuition astronomically high) in many areas. Lazy / stupid people are sick of competing with folks who may not have the financial resources but get ahead through hard work & sacrifice. 

 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:45 | 3561656 They trynna cat...
They trynna catch me ridin dirty's picture

$20k is very light. When I was in school not too long ago, the average schmuck owed near or in the six figures.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:27 | 3561220 Son of Loki
Son of Loki's picture

There are jobs but you have to settle for less and also work while in univeristy. I did both and even took a weekend job after grad and paid off 100% in 3 years...was not easy but being Debt Free is incredibly nice.

 

people do not realize many companies (like law offices, doctors,, etc) will not hire you if they see lots of debt or bad credit. It's a security (and liability) risk to them they do not need.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:34 | 3561619 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

Of course, many WILL hire you because you have student loan debt...  so they can agree to pay it off over a number of years while paying you substandard wages...  then, when you're almost about to vest (and not have to repay the payments they have made on your behalf), they'll fire your ass...  seen it quite a few times...  in employer friendly/at-will states, good luck getting any redress.

This is also why government jobs are so sought after...  not only do they pay as much or more than their private counterparts, but they'll extinguish your loans for you too!  Must be nice...

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:38 | 3561306 Gert_B_Frobe
Gert_B_Frobe's picture

Hey, that Harvard degree got Soledud O'Brien a nice cushy job to show off her Ivy league expertise.

 

"God d@mn rich c*nt"

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:39 | 3561630 underman
underman's picture

College kids (children) are taking on 20-40k (and more!) in debt without the slightest idea of what's to come of their lives after graduating.  Running on nothing but blind, absolute optimism.  Debt slaves before they even know how to think for themselves.       

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 16:39 | 3562120 jerry_theking_lawler
jerry_theking_lawler's picture

20-40k isn't alot of money....its equivalent to a mid-medium level car....but it is easier to get out of the car loan than the student loan. just saying.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 12:51 | 3561051 pragmatic hobo
pragmatic hobo's picture

because we have learned that stock markets do drop ... and margin calls are a bitch to deal with.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 12:59 | 3561081 ratso
ratso's picture

Perhaps you might consider the concentration of recently graduated lawyers in DC who have the very high debt levels.  Not as confusing as it looks at first sight.  Many of them are on K Street.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:13 | 3561121 Arius
Arius's picture

and many more looking for a job, while temping ... a job which most likely will never come ... there you have it - THE DREAM!  everyone can become what he wants to, and he/she deserves it!  as a smart man once said you got to be sleeping to believe it ...

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:40 | 3561313 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

In DC, it is about where you went to school. What a rotten place.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:36 | 3561287 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

I want to collage on my computer and recieved two degrees from the comfort of my own home! Now I am lucrative gyrocopter repair/painter and message therapist! I owe less than 110,000 student laon and am very eployable.  Soon I fix gyrocopter, then message you longtime!! Thanks you very much, University of Phoexnex!

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 18:07 | 3562380 Keynesian Mess
Keynesian Mess's picture

Chuckle of the day!  Thanks RM.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:54 | 3561406 Dr. Kenneth Noi...
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater's picture

Or you could give the money to Jiggs Casey..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giq52BbLxRQ&t=6m41s

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:09 | 3561498 Blano
Blano's picture

One of the more original avatars I've seen there Doc.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:02 | 3561460 tempo
tempo's picture

robots and studeent loans. Millions of jobs are lost each year to automation/robots. Its accelerating. So to keep consumption from dropping, central banks create trillions of new debt. Central bankers hid youth unemployment keeping people in college and poverty with foodstamps. College just one of the many bubbles being created. Let everyone have their dream.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:33 | 3561617 The Paucity of Hope
The Paucity of Hope's picture

Add to that, a friend of mine (a teenager) was looking at joining the Peace Corps. That now requires a minimum of a BA

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:40 | 3561634 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

Case in point, my wife has her own practice...  rather than hire someone, we opted to purchase some practice management software that performs all of the functions of a billing clerk, filing clerk, scheduler, appointment reminder, and information/data security...  many of these functions are the only jobs available for twenty-somethings...  these jobs are going away due to productivity gains in software.  The software company probably requires a staff of ~20 to keep maintained...  meanwhile, it's probably destroyed 20,000+ jobs (albeit mostly part-time/low pay).  Oops.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 12:49 | 3561042 Shizzmoney
Shizzmoney's picture

The more student loans in a state usually means the more corrupted their people are.

When you have a society in ad hoc, you have a society that will do tricks for treats like a dog to his master.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 12:53 | 3561059 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

That's insulting to my dog. He does tricks to amuse himself.

The treats are just because I love him. :)

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:10 | 3561147 Arius
Arius's picture

nice ... i am sure your dog loves you too!

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:42 | 3561332 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

does he know he's a dog?

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:52 | 3561394 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

He says he does. But I think he thinks he's human.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:57 | 3561422 Arius
Arius's picture

if he doesnt think so, then he must be a contrarian :)

 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:01 | 3561455 Crtrvlt
Crtrvlt's picture

dogs> humans

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:10 | 3561148 ugmug
ugmug's picture

I was waiting for a bus recently and overheard two blacks talking about basketball shoes where one told the other that whenever he gets tired of his shoes he pokes a hole in them and then takes them back claiming that there was a defect. He said it works every time. A corrupt citizenry is already well established.....

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:45 | 3561354 Gert_B_Frobe
Gert_B_Frobe's picture

 "Look, I don't wanna mess with no reefer addicts, okay?"

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:41 | 3561637 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

some reason why it was necessary to tell us they were "blacks"?

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 15:27 | 3561851 Remo Williams
Remo Williams's picture

You're right, no reason needed.  It's TNB.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 15:46 | 3561879 ugmug
ugmug's picture

 

A couple of years ago I listened as a black man on a bus started to brag to another black man about how he went after young white woman who had a job because they had a good credit record and could pass a landlord's credit check in order to get an apartment because he had an arrest record. These people are 'economic' predators whether you want to believe it or not.

 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 15:58 | 3561965 They trynna cat...
They trynna catch me ridin dirty's picture

Mooching off females is seen as something to aspire to among certain 'cultures.'

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 16:03 | 3561981 Everybodys All ...
Everybodys All American's picture

I'm going out on a limb and say because they were.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 16:46 | 3562145 jerry_theking_lawler
jerry_theking_lawler's picture

same story....was at auto parts house. guy came in, purchased expensive break pads, walked out of the store and told the counter clerk he didn't need them and wanted a 'refund'.

counter clerk processed the charges and told the guy he was putting it back on the card. this guy went BALLISTIC saying it could not go back on the card because it was a debit card, not a credit card. then the guy asked to speak to a manger. manager came over, looked at the charges, return, refund process and said it was back on the card. the guy said it was impossible and that he wanted cash back. the manager explained he had to put it back on the card. the guy then blurted out that it could not go back on the card because it was a .gov card........and that he needed cash.

this guy was black and trying to 'game' the system. i'm sure it happens with whites, browns, yellows, etc. It is because of the before said 'system' that this behavior takes place.

down with the system.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 17:30 | 3562266 ugmug
ugmug's picture

I could relate many stories about muslim woman who show up on the day food stamps get reloaded on their EBT card and then filling up 3 shopping carts of food and strolling up to the cashier and using 4 different EBT cards to pay for it all. The ironic fact is that the children (many) help pull all those carts around the store with no man in sight - they're always waiting outside in the minivan.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 18:51 | 3562555 Go Tribe
Go Tribe's picture

And all these people noted above have been trained in their ways by state and local government bureaucrats. Burn baby burn.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:13 | 3561158 seek
seek's picture

I disagree. I think the loans and especially the default ratio is reflecting how large the presence of for-profit schools are in the state.

The people aren't corrupt, the for-profits and the student loan system itself are.

A close friend of mine briefly worked at one of the local for-profits teaching entry-level computer science classes for a couple semesters. She knew the system was horribly broken and corrupt when the first few weeks of the semester she had mentally ill homless people in her classes. The schools actively recruit anyone that can get a loan, and the "counselors" main job is keep the people recruited long enough for the student loan to be funded. Once they're funded, they don't herd the students to class anymore, and not surprisingly those loans go to into default.

My belief is that the schools clusters in the southern states due to using the weather as a selling point.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:56 | 3561301 pashley1411
pashley1411's picture

Now that everyone-and-their-dog knows about ZH, we get the lefty "but its my fantasy" over here.

This nonprofit schools "good", profit schools "bad", is pure BS.    Not that for profit schools are paradigms of virtue, au contraire, but they report their placement rate to the Department of Education, who hold their feet to the fire.   The for profits I know of place their marginal students with a zeal your never find with nonprofits.

Meanwhile, nonprofit schools specialize in rioting (Swathmore), pass-fail for the elite class, and shamelessly doctor the data that goes into their rankings.     

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:31 | 3561611 seek
seek's picture

I have no doubts whatsoever the non-profits are corrupt as well, but it gets expressed differently.

There's a specific class of for-profit school (in my state, the infamous University of Phoenix is the best example) that is at the root of a large part of the student loan default problem. Easy to spot: they advertise nationally with saturation advertisements in venues people don't normally associate with highed education, charge much more than the median for classes, and emphasize student aid for payments. I've seen Full Sail ads here on ZH, another great example of this ilk. The fact that they get away with it (and let's face it, this is plain and simple fraud, funded by taxpayer guarantees) just shows how broken the entire educational funding system is.

The rest of the problem beyond the for-profits is systemic, e.g. having unlimited Fed dollars flowing into college and creating tuition inflation at both for- and non-profit schools that would make Argentina blush. Remove the taxpayer guarantees and make student loans dischargable in bankruptcy, and I suspect tuition costs would look very, very different.

Also, anyone that's read my postings over the past three+ years here would realize I'm a libertarian anarcho-capitalist, and hardly a "lefty" prone to fantasies.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 12:51 | 3561052 Bad Attitude
Bad Attitude's picture

Damn, I almost feel like an idiot for keeping current on my student loan.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:12 | 3561152 dontgoforit
dontgoforit's picture

Nah, man - you gotta pay it.  10 years I paid mine and then coverd a number of years of my wife's too.  It's all good.  I can't see being too critical of banks and politicians and loanees if I don't keep my own house in order.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:03 | 3561468 Victorio
Victorio's picture

Lets see... banks and politicians are running massive criminal scams and you can't see being critical too of them if you cant pay a bill?  ARE YOU FUCKING SERIOUS!

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 12:52 | 3561053 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

Don't hate the student. Hate the student loan system.

/sarc

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:04 | 3561472 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

But you can hate the educational system: http://www.noob.us/pictures/teacher-argues-that-a-kilometer-is-longer-than-a-mile/

Any wonder why kids lose it at school?

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:13 | 3561519 prains
prains's picture

1994 LOL

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 12:56 | 3561072 Aegelis
Aegelis's picture

Ha!  I'm still more than double the student loan debt average...and my degree still doesn't buy me the national average salary after 5 years of using it.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:13 | 3561157 dontgoforit
dontgoforit's picture

Hang in there, bro.  It still pays to work hard and keep your nose clean.  It will pay off in the end.  Good guys are getting harder to find, but companies still seek them out. 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:23 | 3561207 Aegelis
Aegelis's picture

Thank you very much.  It's hard to find inspirational words like this and find much comfort in being advised I'm on a right course.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:46 | 3561659 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

I'll add to not be married to a particular discipline...  if posed with a wall, some people can't help but to try and ram through it as their first choice...  I'll suggest keeping an eye on your opportunity cost and not being afraid to climb over the wall or walk around it.  You might be on the right course, but often times you won't be able to know it until it's too late in the game to change.  If you get to wake up every day and do what you love, then you're truly blessed...  but incredibly rare.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 17:32 | 3562279 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

When I was a kid working for a painting contractor in an expensive vacation town, my boss once laughed and said they'd tell him he was crazy for charging these prices in his home town.  He moved.  They are paying truck drivers big bucks to haul tar sands.  There are jobs out there, but you have to move.  Unfortunately, that means leaving your support structure, and it gets harder as you get older and have more attachments, but there it is.  To get ahead, you have to go where the money is. 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 18:56 | 3562577 Go Tribe
Go Tribe's picture

Most career paths are based on following the money.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 17:32 | 3562280 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

When I was a kid working for a painting contractor in an expensive vacation town, my boss once laughed and said they'd tell him he was crazy for charging these prices in his home town.  He moved.  They are paying truck drivers big bucks to haul tar sands.  There are jobs out there, but you have to move.  Unfortunately, that means leaving your support structure, and it gets harder as you get older and have more attachments, but there it is.  To get ahead, you have to go where the money is. 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 12:58 | 3561084 q99x2
q99x2's picture

Yep and all those students know what the Central Banks, Obama, Holder and the DHS are up to. 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 12:59 | 3561089 Schmuck Raker
Schmuck Raker's picture

Folks around D.C. do not game the system. They ARE the system.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 12:59 | 3561090 Sach Mahoney
Sach Mahoney's picture

and to think, for only another 125k, you can get your masters degree and not get a job, too

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:12 | 3561515 optimator
optimator's picture

Moochelle couldn't afford to start paying off her student loan when she was making close to 500K a year.  Somehow she forced herself to pay it off when hubby decided to run for office.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:00 | 3561099 Crtrvlt
Crtrvlt's picture

lots of lawyers in dc with high loan balances

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:03 | 3561106 FreeNewEnergy
FreeNewEnergy's picture

I do have to say that I think the average student debt of $24,810 is quite low, when one considers that just one year of "schooling" at the University of Michigan (my niece plans on beginning her career as a debt slave there this fall) is only $52,000 per year.

I fully expect the average to continue climbing until it's about $45,000 or more though 2016, what with the current crop (Ivy League schools accepted about 7% off all applicants, so there's certainly no shortage of suckers) just getting started and those with no jobs not paying down their loans.

Either that or my fellow baby-boomer and post-BB parents are just plain stupid, wanting to give their kids' the best that money can afford, thus blowing a huge wad of otherwise retirement funds.

Not that it means anything to these dufus-types. A friend of mine just blows off the fact that putting his father into a "reputable" nursing home will only cost $35,000 a year to start.

I suppose, if people with money want to blow it on retirement prisons or higher edumification, it's better than having it confiscated by the government, but only marginally.

We're truly screwed, but mostly because people are just plain stupid.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:11 | 3561150 syntaxterror
syntaxterror's picture

Then obviously the $24,810 is lie just like all of the other bullshit streamed out to the muppets.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:14 | 3561159 FreeNewEnergy
FreeNewEnergy's picture

Well, yeah, there is that. It's probably worse.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:50 | 3561382 Thisson
Thisson's picture

The average is reduced by all the people going to much cheaper places like Apex Tech (free tools!)

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:47 | 3561663 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

and quitting the party early...

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:14 | 3561527 Steaming_Wookie_Doo
Steaming_Wookie_Doo's picture

"a "reputable" nursing home will only cost $35,000 a year to start."

That's about 3K/mo. Yeesh, that's bottom of the line or the father requires very little help, i.e. still mobile and can feed himself. Otherwise, at that rate the home's "reputation" would be being highlighted on 60 Minutes "Crooked Nursing Homes" episode.

All I can say is start hiding assets now. Medicare/Medi-Cal looks back 3 years for "assets" or makes you pay. Typical post-stroke care at a nursing home is about $9K/mo in Calif. if paying out of pocket.

I'm not banking on retirement or nursing homes. I intend to take out a Ducati for a "test drive" off Hwy 1 and go out in a blaze of glory.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:18 | 3561536 Blano
Blano's picture

And after all that money is spent the only things she'll talk about will be the Hash Bash and the Naked Mile.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:04 | 3561119 franzpick
franzpick's picture

It's amazing what assinine bubbles are created in the latter phase of a 30-50-100? year long fed-sponsored, gov.-promoted credit-binge, and the latest 3, the student loan bubble, the sub-prime auto bubble, and the 3% down payment nationalized mortgage finance bubble, are, or soon will be broken allright, but it's OK, Biden and his drinking buddies are busy arranging the new world money order to make everyone whole.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:06 | 3561127 Rory_Breaker
Rory_Breaker's picture

You can use these as heat maps once the SHTF

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:09 | 3561135 syntaxterror
syntaxterror's picture

The shit storm is about to rain down on DC. And they can pick up the tab! Serves every dumb-as-fuck taxpayer right! You got the government you deserve muppets!

Another $1 trillion on the $16 trillion debt pile is meaningless at this point. Bullish!!!

 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 17:42 | 3562298 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

Absolutely.  When they print their own money and their creditors are broke too, who do you suppose is going to object and put us into bankruptcy?  China?  LOL.  We are over five years into this disaster and still limping along.  What if the whole world goes Japanese and everybody's still broke 20 years from now.  I would caution Zerohedgers to think twice about your gold going to the moon this year, or that your fiat is better in a savings account.  It's not.  When does it all go boom?  I don't know, but I know the Fed is dead set on the gamblers coming out better than the savers.  I'm definitely on the bearish side by nature, but I've kinda noticed that bearishness has been discouraged since March 9, 2009, and that was a long time ago.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 17:42 | 3562299 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

Absolutely.  When they print their own money and their creditors are broke too, who do you suppose is going to object and put us into bankruptcy?  China?  LOL.  We are over five years into this disaster and still limping along.  What if the whole world goes Japanese and everybody's still broke 20 years from now.  I would caution Zerohedgers to think twice about your gold going to the moon this year, or that your fiat is better in a savings account.  It's not.  When does it all go boom?  I don't know, but I know the Fed is dead set on the gamblers coming out better than the savers.  I'm definitely on the bearish side by nature, but I've kinda noticed that bearishness has been discouraged since March 9, 2009, and that was a long time ago.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:09 | 3561141 wcvarones
wcvarones's picture

You do know that Obama forgives student loans after only 10 years for government workers, right?

No wonder all the deadbeats are in D.C.

http://www.newsmax.com/US/obama-student-loan-forgiveness/2013/05/10/id/5...

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:49 | 3561669 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

Many public and private employers pay them off as you work...  the earliest I've seen is 2 years, but the longest I've seen is 5...  for those folks willing to take a "demeaning" job, you can probably earn half again as much as the job you want when you factor in loan forgiveness/repayment.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 15:52 | 3561950 KnightTakesKing
KnightTakesKing's picture

This is only a proposal. It's not a law... yet.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:12 | 3561153 Lord Koos
Lord Koos's picture

Point A:  There are a lot of expensive universities in DC.

Point B: How is it "gaming the system" to graduate owing $40,000?

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:20 | 3561172 FreeNewEnergy
FreeNewEnergy's picture

Just heard that they're planning to lower the blood alcohol level for drunk driving from 0.08 to 0.05%. That's like 3/4 of a beer! Jeesuz! No wonder I stay home and drink. Can't smoke in bars, and drive after one beer. Amerika! Fuck yeah!

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:03 | 3561467 syntaxterror
syntaxterror's picture

A pint is now over $5 around here. The 1% inflation miracle economy in action. I quit buying them after they went over $4. Same for $3 cups of coffee. Fuck 'em.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 17:49 | 3562311 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

Launder tens of billions of Drug Cartel money like UBS did for decades, and receive no penalty at all, even though tens of thousands of people died because of what you did.  But drink a beer?  You must be broken financially, humiliated, and incarcerated, because someone might have died in a world of might have died.  At some blood alcohol level, it becomes ridiculous.  How about a roadside test for people with insomnia, old people, or crappy drivers who hug the left lane in hybrids going under the speed limit?  Their behavior results in accidents too.  After all, every life is so sacred we have to burden 7 billion to save it, right?

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:18 | 3561180 dolph9
dolph9's picture

This is a little misleading, because in general cities are going to have more people with student loans as opposed to whole states, thus the large numbers for D.C.

Still the point should be made...alot of folks paying the bankers back by working for the federal government, that's where the "educated" debt serfs go.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:23 | 3561209 Son of Loki
Son of Loki's picture

I hate sore fingers...almost worse then bunions when they 'stick out', my Dad claims.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:25 | 3561219 cpgone
cpgone's picture

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

They (SL) are in the process of getting bailed out.

This is socialism/fascism after all.

 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:31 | 3561248 FreeNewEnergy
FreeNewEnergy's picture

Just for a point of reference (I don't know what the exact rates and terms are for student loans), a 50,000 loan with a ten-year term at 5% is $530.33 a month. I'd hate to have that hanging over my head for ten years. It's like paying rent on your degree.

Fuck. If I had kids, I'd tell them to learn how to fix cars or plumbing or something useful. Paint houses, fer god's sake. Anything is better than a $530/month debt.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:38 | 3561303 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

Hey who here wouldn't pay 530 a month for 6 years of partying and blow jobs.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:42 | 3561325 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

The beginning of the end of "Higher Affirmation".

Those schools in D.C. are mucho expensive.

The rust belt students need the loans more.

Most of them can't pay because they can't get decent paying career employment.

I'd wager many that are paying are having the loans payed by Mom and Dad.

Bullish for basement renovations and XBOX's and XBOX Live subscriptions and game sales.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:45 | 3561349 Z'
Z''s picture

No surprise that DC has a high rate of student loan debt, or that delinquency rates are low there.  All Federal employees, as well as many others, are eligible for the Public Service Loan Forgiveness Program (PSLF):

http://studentaid.ed.gov/repay-loans/forgiveness-cancellation/charts/public-service#what-is-a-qualifying

 

What is the Public Service Loan Forgiveness Program? 

In 2007, Congress created the Public Service Loan Forgiveness Program to encourage individuals to enter and continue to work full-time in public service jobs. Under this program, borrowers may qualify for forgiveness of the remaining balance due on their eligible federal student loans after they have made 120 payments on those loans under certain repayment plans while employed full time by certain public service employers.

 

What kinds of employment qualify? 

Qualifying employment is any employment with a federal, state, or local government agency, entity, or organization or a non-profit organization that has been designated as tax-exempt by the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) under Section 501(c)(3) of the Internal Revenue Code (IRC). The type or nature of employment with the organization does not matter for PSLF purposes. Additionally, the type of services that these public service organizations provide does not matter for PSLF purposes. 

A private non-profit employer that is not a tax-exempt organization under Section 501(c)(3) of the IRC may be a qualifying public service organization if it provides certain specified public services. These services include emergency management, military service, public safety, or law enforcement services; public health services; public education or public library services; school library and other school-based services; public interest law services; early childhood education; public service for individuals with disabilities and the elderly. The organization must not be a labor union or a partisan political organization. 

Generally, the type or nature of employment with the organization does not matter for PSLF purposes. However, when determining full-time public service employment at a not-for-profit organization you may not include time spent participating in religious instruction, worship services, or any form of proselytizing.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:02 | 3561457 Village Smithy
Village Smithy's picture

I love comments like this that add to the information contained in the original post. Thank you. How many relatively unknown perks like this are we being bled by each day?

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:50 | 3561375 Dr. No
Dr. No's picture

I got an idea: Have high school actually mean something.  Have prospective college students pass remedial english and math in high school so they can skip the first 3 sememsters of college.  By skipping these high school classes in college, they should be able to reduce totoal tution by 30% (30% less classes).

I realize I am being rediculous since it was the college system that promoted the dumbing down in order to get more enrolled sheep.  Couple this with dumbing down high school since "no child dare be left behind" and easy money government loans and it shouldnt be a surprise to anyone we are in this situation.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 13:54 | 3561401 pine_marten
pine_marten's picture

I'll tell you another thing that sticks out like a sore thumb - goverment workers on disablity compared to private sector workers.  Game the system?  They are the system.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 16:39 | 3562117 They trynna cat...
They trynna catch me ridin dirty's picture

I once interned at a federal agency and there was a female employee who hadn't come to work for six months because she was "depressed." All leave paid of course.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 17:56 | 3562336 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

They used to put you on administrative leave with pay in DOJ.  One employee was forgotten about and was at home with pay...for 12 years.  They got rid of that little gimmick in 2003.  Makes you wonder how many there were like her.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:02 | 3561458 SmittyinLA
SmittyinLA's picture

Looks like Idaho is going full retard Socialist, or they have a lot of big expensive schools

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:05 | 3561462 lemosbrasil
lemosbrasil's picture

Now, we have 2 equal big legs from lows in march-2009 to DOW JONES;

The 2 legs of 4.780 points. from march-2009 at 6.470 until may-2010 at 11.250

And from set-oct-2011 at 10.400 until now at 15.190 points.

See here: http://pracompraroupravender.blogspot.com.br/2013/05/voltemos-primeira-grande-pernas-de-4780.html 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:04 | 3561473 DDD
DDD's picture

Maybe the reason the average student loan debt is higher in Washington DC is because newly graduated J.D.'s flock there and take their $100K+ student loans with them. Same could be said for Cali. 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:09 | 3561494 Stuck on Zero
Stuck on Zero's picture

California ranks fairly low in student loans because there are huge numbers of grants for students who match the "anything but a middle class white male" category.

 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:10 | 3561501 Dre4dwolf
Dre4dwolf's picture

Education is over-priced, its really not worth it, for the cost of education its better to just pocket the money because it will take you 100 years to earn enough to pay the debt down.

All this debt is going to be liquidated, I don't get why we don't just forget about it and let it all go.... its just fucking paper.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 15:37 | 3561890 They trynna cat...
They trynna catch me ridin dirty's picture

Listen to the Peter Schiff Show, subscribe to Tom Woods' Liberty Classroom, do math on Khan Academy, read Durant's Story of Philosophy, you will learn more in a year than you would in eighteen years of politically correct conventional 'education.'

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:12 | 3561510 Caviar Emptor
Caviar Emptor's picture

Haven't you heard? Obama wants to forgive most student loan debt.
Deficits don't matter anymore, neither will debt

http://www.dailyfinance.com/on/obama-student-loan-debt-remedy-interest-r...

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:17 | 3561550 Mr. Hudson
Mr. Hudson's picture

Student loans are not in a "bubble". A bubble is a debt that goes "pop", and then people go bankrupt; assets are sold off for liquidity; those that loaned out the money lose their asses and jump out of windows, and the people who owed the debt walk. This is not the case with student loans. Students who don’t pay back their loans will go to prison. Even though the American taxpayers are the ones footing the bill (and not the bankers), the students will be slaves to the bankers when the time comes the bankers start to collect. The bankers are holding the note, and the IRS will be their Gestapo to collect on the student loans.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:26 | 3561573 Its_the_economy...
Its_the_economy_stupid's picture

Guys (and gals),

This is a federal student loan discussion.

Nothing will save them from their private student loans. Nothing.

The private student loans ramp the interest, ramp the penalties, compound the interest on all of it, and bring average student loan totals to tne moon.

The federal average of 20k is the aversage because it is damn near the most you can borrow with gov loans.

Pity the schleps w another 50k of private loans. no 501 c 3 is going to save them. Relief will come only from reinstating coverage of private loans w bankruptcy protections. Which, by the way, is the solution to this BUBBLE!

Screw the banksters....they made their own bed. Let 'em lie in it once they again lose bankruptcy protections.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:25 | 3561574 Its_the_economy...
Its_the_economy_stupid's picture

(double)

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:25 | 3561585 world_debt_slave
world_debt_slave's picture

From the birth of the U.S. the banks have always desired to take control of this country as all others. Sadly 1913 was the death knell of the U.S.

The banks control all aspects of our lives.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:37 | 3561624 muleskinner
muleskinner's picture

The Student Loan Program is designed for the gov to make money, not to provide funds for people to become educated.

You're in school from age 5 to 18 and then you're free to attend a college or university should you plan to matriculate. Or, you can go to work.

You don't have to go to college to take up time and space.

'Rich man goes to college, a poor man goes to work'

You will be better off holding down a job for four years and earning money instead of borrowing from a lender who knows you are on the hook regardless if you land a career job or not.

The world will find a place for you with or without a higher edumacation and if you have ambition, talent, and some intestinal fortitude, you should be able to make something of what you've got to offer.

You're going to end up working no matter what it is you do.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 17:04 | 3562203 jerry_theking_lawler
jerry_theking_lawler's picture

told my 'middle of the road student' nephew this over the weekend....go to community college. if you do OK in school and make OK on ACT/SAT you can typically get a full scholorship. Get a 2 yr degree in something like nursing, radiology tech, dental hygiene, electrical/AC tech, etc. when you are done, go to work. make some money so you can afford your own place, car, etc, then if you want to go back to school, do it on your own dime and be what you want to be. it is really simple in the medical field because you could work night/weekend shifts while still going to college.

told him he would always have something to fall back on and maybe not starve to death.

doubt he will listen. he is brainwashed into believing he can go to school to be a video game programmer and his parents are condone it.....

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:42 | 3561639 ArmyofOne
ArmyofOne's picture

Just BTFD.

Next>

 

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:43 | 3561645 IridiumRebel
IridiumRebel's picture

My daughter will be learning to weld.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 15:11 | 3561776 Its_the_economy...
Its_the_economy_stupid's picture

Working w iron. There is always a need for that.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 15:12 | 3561777 Its_the_economy...
Its_the_economy_stupid's picture

double

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 14:53 | 3561680 Sigep0612
Sigep0612's picture

It makes no sense.  Because someone sold you a bill of goods that you need to go to college to get a high paying job?  It's your birthright at age 18 to leave home, pay $75K for an education and incur $40K in debt to obtain a job that pays $35K a year?  And you'll be paying on that loan for the next 22 years.   We're educating kids for 4 years that only require a 2 year education?   We're requiring Algebra 2 as a graduation requirement for high schoolers but the hotest selling financial product is reloadable debit cards because young people can't figure out a checking account?  And we need immigrants in America to do the work that Americans don't want to do?  

Naw...there's nothing wrong with this country and our educational mentality.    

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 18:05 | 3562371 lex nulla
lex nulla's picture

My take is that student loan debt is analogous to the mortgage debt fraud - for every honest student loan there are another 10 loans that are completely fraudulent.  Extending credit to bad borrowers was necessary to create enough churn to mask the scam in both cases.

I've received multiple pieces of mail addressed to individuals concerning their overdue student debt.  When queried, my neighors have never heard of any of these people, and they've all been here for 20 yrs.

Tue, 05/14/2013 - 20:18 | 3562803 are we there yet
are we there yet's picture

On what legal basis did this type of nondischargable debt come back into existance? That was the basis of indentred servants and other past forms of non inherited slavery that had been banned in the free world.

Fri, 05/31/2013 - 06:55 | 3612901 AmeliaV
AmeliaV's picture

Every time I read something about student loans I understand that things are only getting worse in the US. Higher education is a real luxury and there are lots of young people across the country who just can’t afford it and are forced to get in debt. Also it’s sad that student loan interest rate is going to double again. American youth should start its professional way from making a debt which will impact their life. I know lots of people who faced a need to learn what is cash advance to cover their expenses and to stay afloat. Sometimes I have an impression that student loan debt problem is taken lightly by the US government.

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