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JPM Vault Gold Drops By 28.4% Overnight, Slides To Fresh Record Low As Withdrawals Accelerate

Tyler Durden's picture




 

With a massive 6,208 (or 80% of the total in the entire Comex system) Customer Delivery issues outstanding against JPM so far in June alone, many have been wondering - how and when will the firm reconcile what is seemingly more demand for JPM vaulted gold than the firm has in its possession?

While we still don't have the answer, what we do know is that as of an hour ago when the Comex released its daily vault depository statistics, JPM has said goodbye to another 28.4% of all of its vaulted gold - the largest one day withdrawal since April 25, the result of the departure of 61.5% of its Eligible gold, or 218k troy oz, as hundreds of thousands of registered ounces in the bast few weeks have seen warrant detachment.

Which means that as of last night, total gold held by JPM has fallen to a new fresh all time low of just 550k ounces, down from 768K the day before, and total eligible gold of only 136,380 troy oz in inventory (just over 4 metric tonnes) - also a record low.

Whoever is "running the JPM vault" shows no sign of relenting. At this pace, the world's biggest gold vault located below 1 CMP, and just next to the Fed's own gold vault, will be empty in about 1.5-2 months.

 

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Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:48 | 3647903 takeaction
takeaction's picture

My stash didn't float. Does anybody have a good metal detector??  Also  I lost my Zerohedge Password...and I just called the NSA  (301) 688-6524.....They had it...Thanks NSA

 

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:49 | 3647914 The Shootist
The Shootist's picture

Their worthless, barbaric gold. "Buy 'em out boys."

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:03 | 3647953 Pinto Currency
Pinto Currency's picture

 

Everything's good.

Buy JPM.

Whistle, whistle, whistle.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:12 | 3648002 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

I have been saying for a long time (but my timing has always been bad) that there may not be too much time left to buy physical gold.  Au supplies seem to be getting a little tighter each month.

When owners of gold finally decide not to sell, then the big price reset comes, but anyone without the physical gold will be S.O.L.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:15 | 3648018 SafelyGraze
SafelyGraze's picture

no big deal

what people forget is that these accounts can always be settled in cash

or else, not settled at all

hugs,
jayjay

 

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:19 | 3648038 Super Broccoli
Super Broccoli's picture

Duh, that sounds so HKMEX !!!!

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:22 | 3648047 kliguy38
kliguy38's picture

GIT YOUR GOLD BITCHEZZ........step right up and get your hot fresh gold......GOLD ...HOT FRESH GOLD BITCHEZZ...Step right up......get it while its hot

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:49 | 3648182 knukles
knukles's picture

CONSPIRACY FACT AGAIN!

Remember the prognostications here on da' Hedge about the French peacekeeping/invasion of Mali being for Gold and Uranium coinciding with the demand from someone like Germany was it, where the annual Mali production just about equaled the annual repatriation to the Krauts?

Get this shit, kids

http://www.thedailybell.com/29222/Mali-to-Ban-Native-Gold-Mining--Was-Ji...

It just never fucking stops
There already is a NWO World Government in all but the formalities

Welcome to the New Versailles

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:38 | 3648370 zaphod
zaphod's picture

Guys, these are bankers.

 

Once the vault is empty, they will simply post negative holdings. For example today our vault holds -32 million ounces of gold. Negative values simply indicate a short position.

 

This is perfectly normal and the bankers are comfortable with these situations. For those of you on ZH who are not as smart as the bankers in the ways of finance, a short position simply means the banker promises to give you gold, or something else they say is equivalent (such as paper), at some indeterminate time in the future. 

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 20:14 | 3648496 rosiescenario
rosiescenario's picture

Correct...when the number goes negative expect the price of gold to follow it down until such point in time as they decide to cover the short. You wonder how they might do so? Well, they have the full faith and power of all elected officicals and bureaucratic appointees to call upon...trust me, they'll find a way.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 22:56 | 3648995 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

from available info, they have covered the short.  the bullion banks, especially jpm, are net long gold for the first time in over a decade.  as the original jp morgan said, the prices in the financial markets will fluctuate.  imo they are getting ready to make a little (or more) on gold going up.

soros thinks the miners are the leveraged bet on a rise in gold.  they are certainly wildly undervalued to bullion (historically unprecedented, actually).  check it out; don't believe me.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 05:54 | 3649388 malikai
malikai's picture

So the available physical is declining, but where is that gold going? Moving it from a comex vault to an internal vault doesn't change posessor status.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 06:12 | 3649405 painlord-2k
painlord-2k's picture

The problem is "How much, at what cost and how fast, the miners can dig out gold (in US$ or % of their production) in the future?"
Or the price go up a lot, or the miners will shut down a lot of production. They are already shutting down some lines.  

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 06:12 | 3649406 painlord-2k
painlord-2k's picture

The problem is "How much, at what cost and how fast, the miners can dig out gold (in US$ or % of their production) in the future?"
Or the price go up a lot, or the miners will shut down a lot of production. They are already shutting down some lines.  

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 00:47 | 3649205 putaipan
putaipan's picture

i know the analogy doesn't really work, but i had to say it anyway ... "sort of a bankers boating incedent"

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 20:25 | 3648527 TwoShortPlanks
TwoShortPlanks's picture

I don't know why everyone's getting so wound-up about JPM's vault inventory. They can and will settle in cash.

Do not place your hope of a run-away Gold price on whether or not a Paper Gold Casino Table has or has not got any Physical.

What you really want is to scare the sheeple, and especially the investor money into the Gold space. China knows this and in now finalizing its own Gold Casino, which they really will back.

This alley is getting really narrow now, and my shoulders are touching brick. It's now single file through the Gold Alley...watch what happens when someone fires a shot.

The Banksters, who are Long Gold now, are looking for a plausible and deniable trigger to fire-off that shot.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 20:36 | 3648573 Croesus
Croesus's picture

@ TwoShortPlanks:

I'm dying to know what China and Russia's actual holdings are at this point. Years of aggressive buying + domestic production (being kept out of the market) = A lot more Gold than people think.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 21:20 | 3648676 TwoShortPlanks
TwoShortPlanks's picture

Wound you like me to run out the back and add it up?

Yes, that's something which only the most ardent of Gold Bugs have the courage to ask, but to fathom,,,when you 'game-out' its future potential.

I can assure you, there will come day in my lifetime where the average person will never see 1oz of Gold in one piece, and where the average person will have access (possibility to buy) 1oz every 25-50 years.

The math doesn't lie, and invading Russia, China, or India is the only way of undoing that reality.

And people laughed at my $134k/oz 'Price Of Gold' figure.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 22:49 | 3648974 strannick
strannick's picture

BRICs of gold. Word.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 23:56 | 3649142 RaceToTheBottom
RaceToTheBottom's picture

"It's now single file through the Gold Alley...watch what happens when someone fires a shot."

 

So what you are asking is is it best to shoot a bankster in the back or in the front?  Hmmm, I don't think it matters to the bankster or me as long as you don't miss....

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:22 | 3648049 cifo
cifo's picture

2 months is a long time.......

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:35 | 3648119 Citxmech
Citxmech's picture

Not if that's how much time you've got left to live. . .

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:28 | 3648077 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

No doubt GLD will soon see "unprecedented selling pressure" - which is also the headline Marketwatch will go for - ignoring speculation that the sellers are those who have to provide physical in the spot market.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:04 | 3647958 Martial
Martial's picture

It's time for JPM to seriously look into Spiderman towels.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:50 | 3648184 SILVERGEDDON
SILVERGEDDON's picture

Buy what out ? 

All that's left has been double triple quadruple re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re- hypothecated.

3,998,073 people own that one ounce left in the vault. All that other stuff belongs to the important people.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 20:56 | 3648621 Beatscape
Beatscape's picture

No worries. We can just settle everyone in cash -- that we create as needed.  No need for the barbaric relic.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 22:59 | 3649008 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

cash settlement is a tell.  you can fool all the people some of the time ....

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:50 | 3647918 jcia
jcia's picture

All my life I've been waiting for...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--gQSbItPkE

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:51 | 3647919 jcia
jcia's picture

One day...
One day...

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:54 | 3647930 zorba THE GREEK
zorba THE GREEK's picture

Wave goodbye, it ain't coming back.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:01 | 3647951 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

" Also I lost my Zerohedge Password...and I just called the NSA (301) 688-6524.....They had it...Thanks NSA"

Lol, silver linings!

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:38 | 3648369 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

Great idea, Thanks!  Need to call them to recover the last 2 years of Palm Desktop data, that vanished into thin air while online in a hotel room.  So much for having Norton + VPN! 

Useless Norton, what a scam... it crashed while doing a backup, and then crashed the whole computer.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:18 | 3648033 SgtSchultz
SgtSchultz's picture

NSA is the new password recovery go to agency.......Thanks NSA!

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:02 | 3648238 Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

Shit, my hard drive just crashed and I don't have a backup - oh wait, I can just call the NSA.  Thanks NSA!

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:35 | 3648362 This just in
This just in's picture

Who needs the cloud?  Shit, who needs to remember anything?  Go-go NSAtube!  

We lose our freedoms, sure.  But it damn well beats having to think.

Oh Hell, that erased line I just typed....

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:39 | 3648135 MeelionDollerBogus
Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:14 | 3648288 OneTinSoldier66
OneTinSoldier66's picture

Nice one!

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:44 | 3648156 Relentless
Relentless's picture

Me : Uh, hi, Mr NSA guy. Look I got the phone number for this really hot chick the other night and I accidentally deleted it from my phone. Can you let me know what is was?

NSA: 555-757-8289, and "her" name is Steve.

Me: Arrrgghhhhhh!!!

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:46 | 3647904 larry david
larry david's picture

Physical gold, bitchez!

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:47 | 3647905 nope-1004
nope-1004's picture

The great theft continues.  I'm not convinced ALL of this is headed to Asia.  Can't believe they'd let it all go without hiding some for themselves.

 

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:49 | 3647911 Frastric
Frastric's picture

Yeah one bar for Asia, seven for them.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:51 | 3647922 Freedom In Your...
Freedom In Your Lifetime's picture

I've had the feeling that this is the precursor to something very bad happeing. The crooks that have advance knowledge of .gov plans are plundering the little real wealth left in the system before either a huge market crash or 'kinetic action' in asia/middle east. Or a combination of both.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:16 | 3648026 economics9698
economics9698's picture

JP is selling to insiders, most likely the Goldman crowd.  Is there some bad new ahead…well yea.  When there is uncertainty in the currency markets companies price the risk into their products, they tend to err on the high side, raising prices, resulting in less sales, other follow, inflation, when the public realizes there is inflation, and that their money is worthless there will be a “crack up boom” aka TSHTF or something to that effect.

 

Stock up and good luck.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:52 | 3648195 knukles
knukles's picture

Well the COT et al reports have the biggies net long a buncha the shiny again.
Seems like the olde smack down worked for the big guy shorts to get covered, leaving who must it be net short now...
Lemme guess here....
Wouldn't be Satan would it?
Nah, he covered and's gonna run it....

Gosh
Sorta all fits with the New Revelations, no?

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:06 | 3648260 Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

Now that the banks (including JPM) are net long on the Comex, the next step is, when JPM has to settle their remaining short obligations, suddenly the Comex rules change and cash settlement ceases to be an option.  So now it's not JPM on the hook for these missing ozs, its those clever hedge funds who've been so smartly 'following the trend'.  Just watch, these fuckers at the Bullion Banks wrote the rulebook, there's no way they're going to lose.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:20 | 3648315 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

When that happens Al I would like to buy you a beer, somehow, because that is one hell of a call.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 20:24 | 3648532 Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

Sounds good, I'll meet you after the rioting subsides.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 20:26 | 3648540 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

We gotta meet mid riot. You need to bask in the moment. We can both watch Kito navigate the crowd to bring me my sandwich.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 21:45 | 3648764 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

Now THAT is funny, you guys made me cry and laugh at the same time!  Will it be a Reuben or Sailor sadwich!!! yes the mis-spelling is intentional...

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:39 | 3648374 DeadFred
DeadFred's picture

This is not likely to be as simple as it seems but I can't figure it out <yet>.

Possibilities:

-JPM knows about the confiscation order coming soon

-JPM is the designated target in the game of "Which primary dealer will go under in this economics crisis" game [My favorite]

-They have found a way to profit from a Comex default and they're making it happen

Subpossibilities for the last one:

--The rumor is that they are now net long in their gold positions

--They have contractual positions with the gold mining companies such as they are rumored to have with silver mining companies that essentially say "If the Comex blows up we own you"

And as always the most likely reason is something I haven't thought of.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 21:50 | 3648779 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

Well, with our largest copper-silver-gold mine in rubble, you make me go hmmmmmmmm

Methinks the mine went to rubble on purpose!  

Is is not quite obvious, that the manipulations of PM's was to get the price to a nice low level in order to buy buy buy, for when the papers go up in flames? Which goes up in flames first, the world or paper, a conundrum of epic proportions!!!

Gotta love the evil plan the spin, problem for them is they will have nowhere to hide if the maelstrom ensues.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:42 | 3648383 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

I treat it as a Countdown clock, hiding in plain sight.  For those with eyes to see.  The rest are... hamburger, lamb stew and pig roast.

Tick, tock.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 21:51 | 3648787 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

Five before midnight anyone?

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:09 | 3647984 Midasking
Midasking's picture

Who cares? Let the Asians have the tungsten.. http://tinyurl.com/lq63ahd

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:29 | 3648087 tbd108
tbd108's picture

I suspect the Asians are doing some serious assaying before they take delivery.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:36 | 3648122 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Last night I saw a US Tungsten ad at the top of the ZH page. I LOLed.

http://www.ustungsten.com/home

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:09 | 3648270 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Do let us know if they ever start offering tungsten disks about 32 mm in diameter and 1.5 mm thick...  For future testing purposes.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:16 | 3648015 Dead Canary
Dead Canary's picture

Oh yes my friend. I would bet my stash, a lot of big players in this country are talking up stocks and bonds on CNBS and squirreling away some shiny stuff.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:48 | 3647909 SilverMaples
SilverMaples's picture

Let's sell more paper again and "borrow" more phyzz from across the street! That should solve the problem isn't?

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:49 | 3647912 falak pema
falak pema's picture

mr paulson I presume?

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:49 | 3647913 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

JPM are pikers... I regularly lose 100% of my stash on any given "safe boating" day...

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:50 | 3647915 Clowns on Acid
Clowns on Acid's picture

Germany said 7 years.... they really meant 7 months.... gimme my gold bitchez...

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:20 | 3648040 BurningFuld
BurningFuld's picture

NO! And fuck you.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:50 | 3647917 Groundhog Day
Groundhog Day's picture

When they have run out and the next Muppet asks for delivery they will have to settlw in fiat or go to court. Good luck Muppets

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:43 | 3648152 Citxmech
Citxmech's picture

Sure to be timed with a monumental, last-ditch, price supression effort.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:16 | 3648296 JoeSexPack
JoeSexPack's picture

That happened 5-13.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 06:11 | 3649402 Ronaldo
Ronaldo's picture

When JPM runs out of physical, that will mark the beginning of the confiscation period.  They will have nothing to loose at that point.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:52 | 3647924 jg
jg's picture

Great news!  Thanks!

 

Die, JPM scum, die!

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:55 | 3647934 markettime
markettime's picture

From what I understand JPM covered a whole lot of thier short positions and started going long gold. How did they do that in a declining market? 

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:14 | 3648012 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

they must be taking delivery of gold but off the books.

a secret fizz stash, as it were.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:15 | 3648017 Ignatius
Ignatius's picture

"Volume."

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:56 | 3648209 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

From Ed Steer today:

I would ask you to consider that it would be impossible for any entity to buy 10 or 20 or 30 million ounces of gold in a matter of months on the deepest price decline in years. It would be like someone buying all the commercial office space in New York City in a few months 20% below market rates. Or someone buying all the stocks in the S&P in a short time frame at a big discount. That would be impossible. Just like it is impossible for JPMorgan to have bought as much gold (and silver) as they have over the past few months at such steep markdowns in price. The Bank Participation Reportof June 2013 shows that the big short crook has positioned itself massively on the long side of gold in a manner that would be impossible in a market that wasn’t manipulated. - Silver analyst Ted Butler...08 June 2013

CFTC Gold and Silver Bank Participation Report - Ted Butler's Comments

"Since the BPR of February 5, the US bank category position (in effect, almost exclusively JPMorgan) has swung by a net 100,000 contracts, from net short 70,000 contracts to net long 30,000 contracts (all rounded). There has never been a move of such magnitude before. Over that same time, the total net commercial short position (in the COT) declined by 113,000 contracts, meaning that JPMorgan accounted for almost 90% of the entire commercial decline. It is not possible for that extreme degree of concentration and market share not to be manipulation, pure and simple.

And here’s the manipulative icing on the cake – JPMorgan was able to flip a net short position in COMEX gold of 50,000 contracts in February to a net long position of 50,000 contracts on a gold price decline of as much as $350. I would submit that the singular purchase of 10 million ounces of gold (worth the equivalent of $15 billion) within four months on a greater than 20% price decline could only be accomplished if the price was manipulated lower by the purchaser. No other explanation would be possible...

  ...posted on the jessescrossroadscafe.ca Internet site on Saturday. 

 

Read more...

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:13 | 3648284 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

+ a big number

Rocky wrote from Ed Steer's quotation:

I would ask you to consider that it would be impossible for any entity to buy 10 or 20 or 30 million ounces of gold in a matter of months on the deepest price decline in years. It would be like someone buying all the commercial office space in New York City in a few months 20% below market rates. Or someone buying all the stocks in the S&P in a short time frame at a big discount. That would be impossible.

***

FOFOA has said similar things about huge buyers of gold (say, the Saudis).  They show up in London one day looking to buy 400 tonnes, they then would be invited into an office at the LBMA and politely instructed in the realities (limitations) of the physical gold market.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:52 | 3647927 q99x2
q99x2's picture

JP Morgan just sold the last of the gold bar from the days of Andrew Jackson. Time for Dimon to make his getaway to his new island.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:28 | 3648079 AL_SWEARENGEN
AL_SWEARENGEN's picture

Old Hickory would have cleaned up this mess a long time ago.  And he did!  The cocksuckers are back at it again stealing with impunity.  Imagine that, the only US President to successfully pay off the national debt also shut down the Second Bank Of The United States.  Coincidence?  Think again.  But alas while we're talking coincidences, I doubt this is another one http://tinyurl.com/koco4ln

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:52 | 3647928 chubbyjjfong
chubbyjjfong's picture

Something smells fishy here.. goldfish! Physical!

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:08 | 3647982 Rainman
Rainman's picture

Fishy ? ......like London Whale margin calls fishy ?

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:11 | 3648000 chubbyjjfong
chubbyjjfong's picture

Fishy ? ......like the toilet door on a japanese squid boat fishy?

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:55 | 3647933 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Why is it all specifically coming out of JPM vaults?  I thought one vault was as good as another in the COMEX system.

I SUSPECT, but don't know for a fact, that the gold is actually coming from the Fed vaults, and that is why so much is leaving through JPM.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:57 | 3647940 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

I'd imagine that the fed would recommend anyone trying to withdraw to knock over a cash for gold store instead. I can't believe they would let it go.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:05 | 3647967 reload
reload's picture

Not so many of those C for G places in my part of the UK now, big reduction in last 3 months. The needy and foolish have been parted  from their metal already.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:06 | 3647973 tmosley
tmosley's picture

I firmly believe that the current generation of central bankers bought their forefather's bullshit hook, line, and sinker, and genuinely just don't know any better.  They have never studied history (at least nothing prior to 1929, and nothing outside of the West), and thus they think that their "experimentation" is somehow new.  They think they are smarter than anyone who ever came before.  Of course, they are doing exactly what those guys before did, and will get what those guys got as a result, and they will be genuinely surprised when it happens.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:11 | 3647993 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

I am watching this with muted interest at this point. I called my lcs today and they, amazingly, had plenty of ASE for around $25. I realize the premium is still high compared to spot. But it's there if I want it.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:29 | 3648085 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

$25 is a steal for ASE's. Grab some of them.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:31 | 3648097 SemperFord
SemperFord's picture

Plenty of silver bars on APMEX cheap(24 and change)...don't know what to think myself.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:31 | 3648102 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

I almost owe it to myself to bring my cost basis down from $35 lol.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:00 | 3648226 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

I know I shouldn't try to bait you into buying into this mess of a market, but I couldn't help myself.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:22 | 3648326 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

I'd rather you bait me here than 2 years ago at $49.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:47 | 3648402 Pareto
Pareto's picture

Wait Fonz, and you will get it for even less.  It looks to me that both gold and silver are set to have a big dump, imo.  So average in even lower.  I get the feeling that silver wants to be priced somewheres around the cost of a pack of Canadian ciggarettes - $13 so that with a premium of 40% you might get it for $20 or $19.  Important to note that there is no analytical basis for my guess.  Just a gut feeling is all.  Gold, fuck who knows.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 20:17 | 3648508 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

If Silver hits $15 and I can get it, it's all in time.

and I will max out credit to boot.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 01:21 | 3649241 Non Passaran
Non Passaran's picture

Same here.
It's extremely unlikely that it'll drop below 16-17.
I'm buying now, in my book anything below $26 is cheap; who cares about the exact timing and whether it'll drop another 10-20%..

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 08:27 | 3649589 KnightTakesKing
KnightTakesKing's picture

I would imagine that silver is getting very near the total cost of extraction. The all-in cost of gold mining is around $1200 or so. Can't get very much lower, I would think. But in this manipulated market, who the hell knows.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:03 | 3648234 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Aydin has 10 oz priced with free shipping:

10 oz Sunshine Mint Silver Bullion Bar & Decoder Lens Combo The Sunshine Mint Silver Bars contains 10 troy ounces of pure .999 silver each. The Bars are hallmark stamped by the manufacturer and measure 3.5...

$286.38
In Stock

Ships in 1 - 3 Business Days NOTE!  Always figure in your shipping costs when pricing an offering!  
Tue, 06/11/2013 - 20:38 | 3648577 FreeMktFisherMN
FreeMktFisherMN's picture

Provident has 10 ozt. NTR silver bar for about 230 and it might also be free shipping. Much better deal IMO, unless one really wants that decoder thing with the Sunshine ones. 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 08:28 | 3649592 KnightTakesKing
KnightTakesKing's picture

I always compute the cost of shipping in my average cost of Au and Ag. 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 11:35 | 3650186 One of these is...
One of these is not like the others..'s picture

How can this be?

It works out considerably cheaper to buy the ten oz as 10 individual oz bars!

Go on then, tell me how many of you spotted that, eh?

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 21:15 | 3648661 Cthonic
Cthonic's picture

Had a broker I dealt with in the past cold call me last week when metals were getting killed, virtually pleading for me to pick up some inventory.  Think these guys went in big on the May swoon and are shit scared of it dropping further.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 21:55 | 3648791 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Sounds like blood is hitting the streets.  Now would be a good time to start cost averaging into PMs, if you haven't started already.

Thu, 06/13/2013 - 08:50 | 3653664 Cthonic
Cthonic's picture

Agree that it's probably closer to a bottom, however, this selling may go on for a while, so if one is starting, might want to start small.

"

We can see from the chart that even though the [sentiment] score has dipped well into extreme territory several times in the past year, gold hasn't reacted immediately, like it had for much of the past 10 years.  Even the recent score of 0%, showing maximum pessimism, has only halted the selling and not led to a rally, so far.

 

This is very similar to the last [1996-1998] bear market.  The chart below shows the same kind of behavior that we're seeing now.  Despite several forays well into extreme pessimism, traders just kept right on dumping gold.  Every time the score touched extreme optimism territory, gold peaked almost immediately.

-- Jason Goepfert, sentimentrader, 06/12

"

 

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 17:59 | 3647942 Element
Element's picture

Wot?! Who'd even want that shit, it's like the 21st century and stuff!? WTF? ... people will be buying fiat bonds next!

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:08 | 3647978 King Nothing
King Nothing's picture

Me: I got 50 fiat for 50,000 Fiat bonds sir

 

Trade Floor: here ya go

 

Me: ok I've double my investment I'd like to cash out now

 

Trade Floor: Sorry we don't have enough fiat we will pay you in turd balls as agreed upon in your original prospectus, you can find it in the printed so small you need a x1000 power mag glass to read, yes it looks like a turd smudge, right... there.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:12 | 3648001 Element
Element's picture

Yeah, I see, kinda circular buyin fiat bonds with fiat ... ok, gimme some gold then, I'm hungry.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:17 | 3648028 BurningFuld
BurningFuld's picture

You forgot to get a tunneling microscope and review the print contained in what looks like a period right here.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:17 | 3648029 King Nothing
King Nothing's picture

Oh yes there is plenty of gold give me your fiat and I'll be back with your gold...

 

Here's your gold plated turd, I mean Tungsten I mean its just gold, pure good old gold go weight it I swear its all there... (drops of sweat all over his shoes)

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:43 | 3648148 Element
Element's picture

hmm ... maybe you and my .270 Remington need to go over the terms of this transaction ... we're happy to make a further deposit if you prefer? ...

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:44 | 3648155 logicalman
logicalman's picture

THE LARGE PRINT GIVETH....

the small print taketh away.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:01 | 3647948 ekm
ekm's picture

Assuming the data is correct (I think it's way worse), this is a good example to explain a pyramid scheme or what happened to MF Global or Lehman or Bear Stearns.

 

Let's imagine JPM runs out of gold. 

Let's assume that claim to physical gold ration is 1 x 100.

 

Hence, JPM runs out of gold = 1% of gold "owners" got physical = 99% have paper gold in their hands = JPM would give them cash instead of gold.

 

Question: Where would JPM find the cash?

Answer: They'd sell something to the FED or firesale to the open market.

 

That's where SOLVENCY vs LIQUIDITY concepts are discerned. JPM could sell stuff to cover hypothetically 9% of papergold in cash, but can't cover the other hypothetical 90%. Hence, bankruptsy. That's what happened to MF Global, Lehman, Bear Stearns.

 

 

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:05 | 3647966 nope-1004
nope-1004's picture

Only one problem:  MFG, Lehman, and BS were not working in collusion with the FED on IRS derivatives and gold document forgery.  JPM today is technically bankrupt, but will remain solvent in all appearance as long as the FED is involved and an active partner.

 

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:08 | 3647977 ekm
ekm's picture

It was hypothetical.

If JPM goes down, do does US Gov. They're one.

 

MFG and Lehman went down in order to save JPM. Somebody else will be sacrificed on JPM's altar, soon.

There is nothing new under the sun

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:22 | 3648051 The Shootist
The Shootist's picture

Morgan Stanley has been looking very ripe.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:29 | 3648086 PiratePawpaw
PiratePawpaw's picture

Then I guess you dont believe their vault locations are purely coincidental?

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:33 | 3648101 ekm
ekm's picture

By now everybody should know that nothing is coincidential about JPM

Consider JPM as a branch of the US Treasury, practically

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:45 | 3648167 logicalman
logicalman's picture

US treasury - a branch of GS, more likely.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:56 | 3648200 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

That is exactly the situation. GS also has deep hooks into the UST, Wash DC, and other CB's around the world (Carney, Draghi, etc...).

 

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:23 | 3648329 PiratePawpaw
PiratePawpaw's picture

I thought the "purely" would negate the need for a "sarc" tag.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 20:36 | 3648570 ekm
ekm's picture

I was in a serious mood :)

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 01:06 | 3649225 putaipan
putaipan's picture

that is the way i heard it simply put around here a long time ago when i first started lurking- jpm=the treasury. the squid=the state dept. been a good maxim to be able to follow the news that has unfolded in the last four years. stick around these parts and ya end up learnin' sumpin'. even if it is by late night osmosis.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:06 | 3647974 RaceToTheBottom
RaceToTheBottom's picture

Weren't JPM acting on behalf of the US Gov or the FED?

If so don't they have a get out of Jail free card that Lehman didn't....

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:08 | 3647981 ekm
ekm's picture

See below.

JPM's case was hypothetical.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:10 | 3647989 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

Isn't it that whoever is short the contract is obligated to deliver?  Didn't Jamie D just say earlier today that they don't do prop trading?  So who's short? Some hedgies as proxy for the Fed?  The Fed itself?  PPT?

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:12 | 3648006 ekm
ekm's picture

The Government

JPM = US Government

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:23 | 3648056 The Shootist
The Shootist's picture

Conspiracy theory to fact is just one ethical decision away...

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:27 | 3648063 ekm
ekm's picture

It is self evident.

All primary dealers are factually owned by US Gov since the overt bailout.

 

JPM is simply more equal than others. It's like the preferred bank of USA that handles EBT cards etc. It's become one with USA. It's infrastructure is US Gov's infrastructure.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 14:48 | 3650999 auric1234
auric1234's picture

The other way around, actually.

 

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:12 | 3648005 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

Ekm, I may be off on this one, but I thought ZH has explained in the past that the gold in JPM's vault is not theirs. They are storing for someone else. So your example still holds, but as to who won't have a chair when the music stops, could be anyone.

I wonder if this same gold vault being emptied stuff played out during MFG.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:14 | 3648010 ekm
ekm's picture

Nobody but few people know who's what.

Anything we hear is simply PROPAGANDA

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:18 | 3648032 ekm
ekm's picture

How about a pension fund? Your favorite scenario.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:21 | 3648044 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

I think the pension funds/ insurance companies are more tied to interest rates. But it could be anyone.

4.9 billion ion high yield debt was dumped last Friday. More redemptions are coming. I don't see how we get through this without a few people going belly up eventually.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:36 | 3648121 ekm
ekm's picture

Fresh example

https://twitter.com/CMCMFIN/status/344582914454978560

JAPAN TO ADOPT 'BAIL-INS,' FORCE BANK LOSSES ON INVESTORS IF NEEDED, NIKKEI SAYS”

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:40 | 3648142 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

That's their reward for being good savers.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:43 | 3648154 ekm
ekm's picture

There is no such thing as "savings".


That is the core of Wall street and city of london theft and propaganda.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:01 | 3647950 HyperinflatmyNutts
HyperinflatmyNutts's picture

Let the whole f@@king thing Collapse!!  Every day we learn of somthing new this Corrupt Fascist Government has perpetrated on us. We all know that this is going to be US vs them real soon.  Yes I know, I am on the list but real FREEDOM is worth dying for.  Well that is how my father brought me up. Not to sure about the rest of you? 

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:05 | 3647968 jcia
jcia's picture

Thanks for the lol. @ your username. Can I ask the NSA to reveal your real name?

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:14 | 3648291 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

You are naive, Mr. Nutts.   Or... visa versa.  We agree so I must be nutts as well.

If the thing collapses, as you advocate, then gold will seek its market level (unmanipulated) which will pull the curtain back on 1. the dollar, 2. the Fed, 3. the Banksters, and 4. the Handlers, the Gov't.

We can't have all this turmoil since they are not done looting yet.   Doncha see?

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:04 | 3647957 markar
markar's picture

I think they call this eating your seed corn

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:16 | 3648294 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Better get a taste for cobs.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 05:22 | 3649373 IrritableBowels
Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:04 | 3647960 Downtoolong
Downtoolong's picture

If a major player ever does decide to force a settlement in fiat, you can bet there will be a huge smackdown in the paper markets before they announce it too.

They don't just run the Muppets over, they back up over them afterwards a few times too, just for good measure.

 

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:05 | 3647963 Pairadimes
Pairadimes's picture

....and, it's gone!

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:25 | 3648058 MeelionDollerBogus
Tue, 06/11/2013 - 20:09 | 3648478 Pairadimes
Pairadimes's picture

One of the best South Park bits ever. Ever.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:05 | 3647964 FreeBull
FreeBull's picture

Nothing beats physical possession...http://goo.gl/XINXT

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:06 | 3647971 Rob Jones
Rob Jones's picture

I just read an article yesterday that said bullion banks (which I assume include JPM) are net long:

http://bullmarketthinking.com/us-bank-long-positions-in-gold-explode-at-...

How can JPM be going long when its vault is rapidly emptying? Can anyone explain?

 

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:11 | 3647998 seek
seek's picture

This is just gold that JPM has in the COMEX system. They could hold gold outside of the system if they wanted.

More likely other, different banks are long.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:15 | 3648013 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

Seek I thought JPM owns a few mines, no?

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:13 | 3648008 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

See my post above. The JPM vault (I think) holds other's gold. Not theirs.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 18:22 | 3648050 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

it's a custodian vault for customer gold, or deliverable gold sold by previous customers never moved out of the vault for delivery to another location.

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 19:20 | 3648313 Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

Net long Comex futures and options, which is different than the gold they hold in the vault (regardless of who it belongs to).  So either

1) They're net long because the demand to sell is so high, so they have no choice but to take the long side of the trade, and being neutral in the market (as they claim) they've sold physical gold against their net long futures position to remain neutral (since they'll get it all back in the futures market, worst case)

 

2) They're net long because they know that the demand out of Asia and Russia has risen to the point that it can no longer be met, and they're planning on making the hedge funds the fall guys (those evil fucking speculators, selling gold they don't have - fucking traitors) when the shit hits the fan.

 

So 1 if the gold market is an honest game, and JPM are trustworthy, 2 if the gold market is at least as rigged as - Libor, elections, the rest of the stock market, etc....

Tue, 06/11/2013 - 20:34 | 3648564 ekm
ekm's picture

commitment of traders data is propaganda.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 04:02 | 3649331 Central Wanker
Central Wanker's picture

"How can JPM be going long when its vault is rapidly emptying? Can anyone explain?"

 

It's their customer account side that's emptying rapidly right now. The house account activity has been very low since April. I suspect that they turned their position from short to long around early April, before the great meltdown. In the process, they may well have screwed their customers royally. 

 

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