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And Now Another Poll: Most Americans DISapprove Of Government Spying

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Two days ago, when Pew Research came out with a poll showing that a majority (56%) of Americans replied affirmatively to the question if "the National Security Agency’s (NSA) program tracking the telephone records of millions of Americans is an acceptable way for the government to investigate terrorism," we were disappointed if not shocked.

However, what is surprising, is that moments ago Gallup has released its own poll conducted on June 10-11  "with a random sample of 1,008 adults, aged 18 and older, living in all 50 U.S. states and the District of Columbia" and which finds precisely the opposite: "More Americans disapprove (53%) than approve (37%) of the federal government agency program that as part of its efforts to investigate terrorism obtained records from U.S. telephone and Internet companies to "compile telephone call logs and Internet communications."

In other words Pew has uncovered a nation of sheep, who are all too willing to hand over their full privacy to a government operating in secrecy while being modestly "inconvenienced" in the name of the security of the "greater good", whereas Gallup uncovers just the opposite.

What can one deduce from this discrepancy? Perhaps it is nothing more complex than polling bias, most recently observed during the 2012 presidential campaign, and which shows that sometimes it is more important who is doing the polling than who is being polled and what questions are being asked.

Indeed, as Gallup concludes: "The reactions to these types of government programs have remained constant over the past seven years, although Republicans and Democrats have essentially flipped their attitudes over that time period, reflecting the change from Republican President George W. Bush to Democratic President Barack Obama."

And logically following from this, it also assists in perpetuating public bias and a political agenda - once again split according to party lines - in determining what the prevalent public mood should be based on such and such poll to force one to abdicate one's own views and beliefs, and to be absorbed by the Borg collective just because some (artificial) majority believes the contrarian view to be the correct one. After all humans are mostly social animals, unwilling to deviate far from what is "considered" the prevailing normal.

While we will leave this question open, here is what else Gallup found:

 

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These results are from a June 10-11 Gallup poll. Although the current survey context was different, these results are similar to those obtained in a May 2006 Gallup poll measuring support for a government program that "obtained records from three of the largest U.S. telephone companies in order to create a database of billions of telephone numbers dialed by Americans." In that survey, 43% approved and 51% disapproved.

There are significant partisan differences in views of the government's program to obtain call logs and Internet communication. Democrats are more likely to approve, by 49% to 40%. Independents (34% vs. 56%) and Republicans (32% to 63%) are much more likely to disapprove than approve.

In 2006, when Gallup asked a similar question about a program that came to light at that point, Republicans were significantly more likely to approve than Democrats. The differences in partisan reaction between 2006 and 2013 reflect the party of the president under whose watch the programs were carried out at those two points in time.

Twenty-one percent of Americans disapprove of the government's actions, but say there could be circumstances in which it would be right for the government to carry out such a program, yielding a combined total of 58% of all Americans who either approve or could theoretically approve under certain circumstances.

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A June 9-10 CBS News poll also found a majority (58%) of Americans disapproving of the government "collecting phone records of ordinary Americans." A June 6-9 survey conducted by Pew Research Center and The Washington Post found that 56% of Americans said a program in which the National Security Agency "has been getting secret court orders to track telephone call records of millions of Americans in an effort to investigate terrorism" was "acceptable." The combined 58% in the Gallup survey who either approve or say there might be circumstances in which such a program would be right is similar to the acceptable percentage in the Pew/Post wording.

Thirty-Five Percent of Americans Very Concerned About Violation of Their Privacy Rights

A separate question included in Gallup's survey found that 35% of Americans said they would be "very concerned" about violation of their own privacy rights if the government had computerized logs of their telephone calls or Internet communications. Another 22% said they would be "somewhat concerned."

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Sixty-four percent of Americans are following news about this issue very or somewhat closely, which is slightly above average for all news stories tested by Gallup over the past two decades.

Mixed Sentiment About the Leaker's Action

U.S. officials are engaged in a manhunt for Edward Snowden, the former U.S. government contractor who claimed to be the source of the leak. Americans break roughly even when asked if it was right (44%) or wrong (42%) for Snowden to share that information with the press.

A plurality of Republicans said he did the right thing in leaking the news of the surveillance programs, while a plurality of Democrats said he did the wrong thing.

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Americans are more positive about the media's actions in this matter, with 59% saying it was right for The Guardian and The Washington Post newspapers to publish the information once they received it.

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Implications

Results from the Gallup poll indicate that Americans have somewhat flexible views about the government's surveillance program and/or that they are still forming their opinions on the issue. A majority of Americans say that they might find the type of government surveillance program that has come to light in recent days as acceptable under some circumstances, but less than half say they approve of the program as it stands.

The reactions to these types of government programs have remained constant over the past seven years, although Republicans and Democrats have essentially flipped their attitudes over that time period, reflecting the change from Republican President George W. Bush to Democratic President Barack Obama.

Americans are divided as to whether the self-confessed leaker, Edward Snowden, is a hero or a villain, while one-third of Americans fault the press for advancing the story.

 

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Wed, 06/12/2013 - 16:53 | 3651532 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

In other news, around 40% of Americans are totally pants-on-head retarded...

You think voting will change things? Lulz!

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 16:55 | 3651536 SemperFord
SemperFord's picture

Those 40% deserve what they get in the FEMA camps

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 16:57 | 3651542 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

Those 40% won't end up in mass graves... the other 60% will, on the other hand.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:00 | 3651558 dick cheneys ghost
dick cheneys ghost's picture

I saw him wearing green shoes

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:00 | 3651559 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

This seems interesting.  Personal peer to peer encryption to only people you trust.  It's called Retroshare.

Have a look here....

http://retroshare.sourceforge.net/index.html

 

And here is an article about it here....

http://www.unixmen.com/retroshare-a-next-generation-secure-communication...

 

Best thing is....it's all free

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:07 | 3651577 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

"More Americans disapprove (53%) than approve (37%):"

~~~

The 37% apparently come from Maxine Waters & Dianne Feinstein supporters & other such water carriers...

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:13 | 3651598 espirit
espirit's picture

Just caught a blurb on the yahoo thread that sums up the situation.

"What's happening now is like watching a friend die of cancer."

Amerika the beautiful, withering away.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:14 | 3651788 jbvtme
jbvtme's picture

obviously, from the way those senators were ballsucking nsa and dhs, their phones were in capable hands

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:55 | 3652010 DaddyO
DaddyO's picture

Exactly, when one particular Senator started to ask a tough question, the Chairwoman cut him off mid-sentence and rephrased it for him...

DaddyO

Edit:Looks like the IRS is having 2nd thoughts on expanding the surveillance state.

http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/irs-cancels-order-spying-equipment

Thu, 06/13/2013 - 04:21 | 3653364 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

 

"The reactions to these types of government programs have remained constant over the past seven years, although Republicans and Democrats have essentially flipped their attitudes over that time period, reflecting the change from Republican President George W. Bush to Democratic President Barack Obama."

"we have always been at war with eastasia".

and when the red/blue flips again, so will they.

no shame, no self-consciousness, no enlightenment.

 

 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:39 | 3651859 gwar5
gwar5's picture

It's a 6 foot melanoma. There's an old surgeon's saying that has saves many lives: "If in doubt, cut it out."

 

Thu, 06/13/2013 - 04:16 | 3653359 Cap Matifou
Cap Matifou's picture

Here rather applies an other saying:

Please remove the patient from this mountain of tumor.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:08 | 3651584 pods
pods's picture

Funny thing about most americans............

I don't give a fuck what they "think," if you can call it that.

Makes me warm and fuzzy that the morons are on my side now. 

Great.

I am actually surprised that anyone stays on the phone when someone calls asking for an opinion.

pods

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:42 | 3651688 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

87% of those polled disapprove of polling Americans on whether or not they approve of government spying.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:04 | 3651925 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

silly, polls are the new alternative to court intervention

I thought you knew that

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:58 | 3651741 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

These dumb-shits act as if submitting to Tyranny is up for a vote.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 21:28 | 3652434 Frankie Carbone
Frankie Carbone's picture

Bingo! There is NO VOTE for inalienable rights. They exist. Period. That's why they are called inalienable.

 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 21:28 | 3652436 Frankie Carbone
Frankie Carbone's picture

Bingo! There is NO VOTE for inalienable rights. They exist. Period. That's why they are called inalienable.

 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:25 | 3651815 greyghost
greyghost's picture

the one thing i notice about these polls, is how many questions they ask. i just ask my neighbors if they approve of the nsa reading e-mails and listening to their phone calls. every single one says...NO. i don't ask if it would be okay if it only happens on the third thursday following the last full moon!!! what a crock of crap these polls are.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:04 | 3651924 Creepy Lurker
Creepy Lurker's picture

That's how a poll is spun. You can make a poll say anything you want.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:40 | 3651681 thisandthat
thisandthat's picture

Problem with trusted "friends" is they're either few or not really trustworthy at all...

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:45 | 3651693 CH1
CH1's picture

Best thing is....it's all free

"Gimme free shit" is for suckers.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:50 | 3651710 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

Best thing is....it's all free

"Gimme free shit" is for suckers.

 

Retroshare is FOSS...Free, Open Source Software....written for Windows, OS X and Linux.....you know....Linux....which is also free and open source.......and what's probably running ZeroHedge's Web Site and Servers.  Also free and open source is the kind of info we get here at Zero Hedge......

......but you're right of course....it's for suckers......douche bag

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:05 | 3651926 thisandthat
thisandthat's picture

But... that's socialist! (or so said MS)

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:14 | 3651946 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

But... that's socialist! (or so said MS)

So sayeth the software version of a fascist. (Steve Ballmer)

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 21:37 | 3652462 Frankie Carbone
Frankie Carbone's picture

Not true. 

Just as there are things worse than death (like living in a totalitarian state) there are things far more valuable than any pile of money.

Giving one's time FREELY to restore privacy is one of them. So sometimes, the best things in life are gifts, which are FREE.

There are people that give a shit. And by helping you, they help themselves by continuing the legacy of the republic.

Which was.. Freedom from Tyranny.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:01 | 3651562 MillionDollarBonus_
MillionDollarBonus_'s picture

This is why the public shouldn't be allowed to vote on issues trhey don;t understand. Do average Americans really understand the threat of cyberterrorism? Of course not. Decisions that require a detailed understanding of modern cyberwarfare should be left to experts at the CIA and the Pentagon.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:12 | 3651591 Rustysilver
Rustysilver's picture

MDB,

This why you should NOT be allowed to post. Period. You have no comprehensions related to finance or life in general.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:20 | 3651618 Buckaroo Banzai
Buckaroo Banzai's picture

MDB trolls for humor! Relax.

Thu, 06/13/2013 - 02:27 | 3653289 Umh
Umh's picture

He is wasting space and distracting people from the topic at hand.

Thu, 06/13/2013 - 04:24 | 3653369 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

not imo. he is coming at it from another direction and making a similar point.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:04 | 3651753 Lendo
Lendo's picture

Like Buckaroo said, he's obviously trolling.

Something something I'm only entitled to first amendment rights, not those I disagree with, something something.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:13 | 3651596 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

MDB - either this is wickedly good sarcasm, or you would turn your Mother in for Soylent Green.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:37 | 3651675 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

MDB has learned to love his chains.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:16 | 3651607 Scro
Scro's picture

I love this little retard.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:23 | 3651628 prains
prains's picture

unfortunately although MDB's scrotal proclamations tend to the ridiculous he is a thread filling troll

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:27 | 3651808 11b40
11b40's picture

I love him, too, but he is far from being a retard.  He is wickedly perceptive, and a deliberate agitator, willing to poke a colied snake for fun.  The reaction he wants, he gets.

 

The first time I read one of his posts, it set me off and I spent 10 minutes on a response ripping him, but once understand his game, it is simply amusing to watch responses from those have not yet caught on.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:23 | 3651613 espirit
espirit's picture

MDB, I think you've hit the nail on the head.  Perhaps it is the CIA and Pentagon sparring with the NSA, and as you well know - "There can be only one."

Revenge for David Petraeus can be sweet!

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:46 | 3652046 DaddyO
DaddyO's picture

+1

I know a retired E7 who provided security for Patraeus in theatre and said he's a true man's man fwiw...

I personally think he was gonna paint someone in a bad light and paid a high price for it without ever uttering a word.

Patient Revenge is a bitch!!

DaddyO

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:27 | 3651646 1100-TACTICAL-12
1100-TACTICAL-12's picture

MDB you are either a cool dude or you need your ass kicked..

 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:28 | 3651649 notadouche
notadouche's picture

Hard to understand subjects that remain shrouded in secrecy, lies, disinformation and partisan bullshit.  The average American can understand common sense information not rehashed in legal jargon, double talk, political BS.  It's one of those things that is always stated but never tested as the average American is never given the chance.  

The reality is that these political hacks that call themselves leaders are nothing more than "average Americans" masquerading as above average organisms because they've had their asses kissed for so long they actually believe their own BS.  People of economic advantage generally act as if they are more intelligent than what they actually are via confidence and the twisted notion that rich equals intelligence.  

I guarantee you the average American can understand the evils of voyerism.  Political voyerism is more sinister than your average run of the mill voyerism.  Average American's can understand the notion of Jack Booted Thugs breaking down their door and abusing their constitutional rights in the name of national security.  Get profiled once with the potential of being victimized by the abuse of power  and you will know the scared shitless feeling you get in your gut when you realize you are at the mercy of the authority and whether they know the difference between right and wrong and actually give a shit.    

I was naive once to that notion until about 5 years ago.  From that day forward I understood.  

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:42 | 3651687 thisandthat
thisandthat's picture

MillionDollarBogus at his "best"...

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:51 | 3651717 Satan
Satan's picture

Exactly MDB!

Voting should be left to white, heterosexual, male 1%ers with a clear understanding of stuff and things.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:02 | 3651564 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

"Those 40% won't end up in mass graves... the other 60% will, on the other hand."

Those 40% will be forced to dig our graves....until they get the bullet in the back of the head when they are done.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:14 | 3651600 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

Well, jobs are jobs! And when the job is done, being killed by the state increases the percentage of people employed... which is bullish!

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:29 | 3651655 espirit
espirit's picture

"Americans are divided as to whether the self-confessed leaker, Edward Snowden, is a hero or a villain, while one-third of Americans fault the press for advancing the story."

I got a chuckle out of this because the press has had the approval to release this story, no if's and's or but's. 

Divide and conquer the Amerikan Sheeple. 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 16:59 | 3651552 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

The gallup poll has a higher percentage of cellphone users than the pew, people who use primarily landlines are a fairly specific group.

Results from the Gallup poll indicate that Americans have somewhat flexible views about the government's surveillance program and/or that they are still forming their opinions on the issue.

This is what the media is for, to help spoonfeed Americans the correct attitude (support of the program / view Snowden as a traitor). 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:57 | 3651736 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

The only polls I have participated in were telepathic. Do you get those...the voices in the head asking you questions?

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 16:59 | 3651553 Lets_Eat_Ben
Lets_Eat_Ben's picture

You see there are three types of people in this world: Dicks, Pussies, and Assholes. And apparently most democrats are fucking pussies! lol

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:02 | 3651566 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Methinks you missed one of the main points of the article.

In 2006, when Gallup asked a similar question about a program that came to light at that point, Republicans were significantly more likely to approve than Democrats. The differences in partisan reaction between 2006 and 2013 reflect the party of the president under whose watch the programs were carried out at those two points in time.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:10 | 3651588 knightowl77
knightowl77's picture

In 2006 I didn't like it even then, when they claimed that they "were only intercepting calls coming into the US"...

Today I hate it, and now I know that they lied then, and are lying now

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:30 | 3651835 11b40
11b40's picture

Not taking sides on this, but what exactly are they "fucking pussies" with?  Dicks, maybe?

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 21:21 | 3652400 Frankie Carbone
Frankie Carbone's picture

I am now convinced that there is such a thing as "useless eaters".But I think your 40% number is a wee bit low.

 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 16:59 | 3651550 StarTedStackin'
StarTedStackin''s picture

Those 40 % certainly are the Obowel Movement ticks and leeches who are quite content with their ebt cards and obamaphones

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:03 | 3651569 A. Magnus
A. Magnus's picture

Joined by the inbred piece of shit White Shoe boys who get government bailouts more often than EBT card sharks buy up the gummy worms at 7-11....

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:33 | 3651841 11b40
11b40's picture

Yep....they even make big bucks servicing the EBT cards.  Who do you think administers the program for .gov?  Reckon it might be fee based?

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 21:44 | 3652486 Frankie Carbone
Frankie Carbone's picture

I know who does.

J.P Morgan Chase.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:16 | 3651606 prains
prains's picture

the ice breaker slash quality control before asking anyone a "poll" question should be to first ask them to spell "opinion"

if that fails then get them to spell "poll", then if that fails........ 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:18 | 3651615 otto skorzeny
otto skorzeny's picture

Uhhh- I think that # is closer to 80%.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:55 | 3651725 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

So are you saying this could be a positive for the world? Making possible further culling of the heard and advancing the scientific theories of evolution and survival of the fittest? Or are you saying they world is devolving, humans progressively getting dumber until we simply implode? Like martian heads exploding when hearing yodeling in "Mars Attacks"? Just asking cause I'm trying to make retirement plans.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:35 | 3651846 gwar5
gwar5's picture

There's a lag time for the news to be able to filter out to the public and grasp what is going on. The Pew poll was taken before anybody had a chance to really even hear about the scope of the NSA scandal. A surprising amount of people do not camp out on Drudge and ZH like we do. 

 

More and more polls just seem to measure if the MSM is winning or losing the propaganda war. If they begin to lose you always see action by the politicos on the MSM to try and reverse the numbers. 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 16:57 | 3651541 B2u
B2u's picture

I think of the poll where 80% of drivers thought they were above average.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:07 | 3651581 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

There's a poll or study for anything you want to promote.  If there isn't you can pay for one.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:22 | 3651624 B2u
B2u's picture

You missed my point.  The average or mean would be 50%. 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:15 | 3651644 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

I'm not disagreeing with you.  I'm just telling you a fact.  That most polls or studies don't mean shit because they're either directly or indirectly paid for by special interests.

Oh, now I get the joke, above average.  I didn't get it at first because most really think they're above average.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:11 | 3651782 gwar5
gwar5's picture

In Lake Wobegone all the children are above average.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:27 | 3651823 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

That's the Lake Wobegone effect. :)

Thu, 06/13/2013 - 02:34 | 3653294 Umh
Umh's picture

Maybe it's not as wierd as you think. I know there are neighborhoods where most of the children are above average.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 16:57 | 3651543 toady
toady's picture

Will someone please ask the important question?

What are YOU going to do about it?

PLEASE!

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 16:59 | 3651557 StarTedStackin'
StarTedStackin''s picture

What are YOU going to do about it?

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:01 | 3651561 Argent
Argent's picture

jinx

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:00 | 3651560 Argent
Argent's picture

what are YOU doing about it?

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:04 | 3651571 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

NONE of you are going to do anything about it....because you CAN'T.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:13 | 3651594 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

<Chuckle>.....

Hey downvoter(s)....so tell me what YOU think you can do to reverse the tide....hmmmm.????

Vote em out.....LOL

Shame them out.....LOL

Simultaneous DDoS 24/7, 365, for the next fucking 5 decades or until they desist....whichever comes first....LOL

Revolution.... armed or otherwise?.....LOL

Public Demonstations.......LOL

Million Man / Occupy Wall Street shut downs of every major city and transportation hub.....LOL

 

Come on....these are just some of the few ideas I could come up with......what do you have in mind that would be of any lasting, nation-wide use?

 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:20 | 3651620 otto skorzeny
otto skorzeny's picture

I just down voted you because you seem to be a massive twat.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:24 | 3651626 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

ROTFLMAO.....I AM A TWAT.....

I'M ALSO COMPLETELY RIGHT  !!!!!

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:55 | 3651730 prains
prains's picture

you're only right in that you share the same type of apathy as most of the mouth breathers that in habit your country, but in this case your majority is not right, the minority can carry this through and it will.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:11 | 3651779 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

you're only right in that you share the same type of apathy as most of the mouth breathers that in habit your country, but in this case your majority is not right, the minority can carry this through and it will.

What you see as apathy is someone unplugged from the Matrix as much as I can for now.  I am a citizen of my own country which is my home and my fellow citizens are my family and friends.  I have no flag for there is no need of telling anyone else what I stand for because they would not understand as they are still plugged into the Matrix which includes hope for a country founded on a dream that was destined to die anyway given enough time.  For people are irredeemably corrupt and no matter what plan or Constitution is constructed to bring forth a "more perfect union" that plan will fail.....and another reset will take place and another plan brought forth.

You really have to care and be invested enough in something....including America....to even put forth the effort at apathy.

I care much less than that.

And am more free because of it.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:18 | 3651793 prains
prains's picture

I care much less than that.

 

sounds like a "sim city" caricature of a life to me where you and your "kind" just bump around in a self induced bubble and coming across an outlander is only to see a skin bag with a floating name tag. >> very 21st century self absorbed cultural american. you must be in your 20's or 30's. The pinnacle of the checked out dispossessed anarchro-american. bearded and all is my guess.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:34 | 3651843 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

sounds like a "sim city" caricature of a life to me where you and your "kind" just bump around in a self induced bubble and coming across an outlander is only to see a skin bag with a floating name tag. >> very 21st century self absorbed cultural american. you must be in your 20's or 30's. The pinnacle of the checked out dispossessed anarchro-american. bearded and all is my guess.

LOL!!!!!

Clean shaven, age 49, played the original Sim City from a shareware disc I got from the now defunct Babbage's computer store which was borged several times and is now Gamestop.

Anarcho....maybe.....but don't feel that way.  American...that's your term not mine.

Guess again....or do you want to just shut the fuck up now while you are ahead?

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:40 | 3651854 prains
prains's picture

sure got the age wrong, too bad for you, but nailed the attitude, sim city boy......all day

 

how about the beard?? your wife has it, right ! LOL

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:55 | 3651894 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

how about the beard?? your wife has it, right ! LOL

In the right place.......LOL !!!

But..once again...thanks for playing...."LOOK FOLKS....I'M A DOUCHE BAG !!"  Come back and try again sometime.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:01 | 3651914 prains
prains's picture

your clubs are definitely custom fit to your douche bag,

 

you should retire to a phat blunt to savour in the smugness of your "freedom"

 

yawn!

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:20 | 3651969 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

your clubs are definitely custom fit to your douche bag,

That's actually pretty funny....I'll have to remember that one.....can I have permission to use that or is it copyrighted?

 

you should retire to a phat blunt to savour in the smugness of your "freedom"

LOL !!!   Drugs are for fools and the weak minded.....but if you want to blow your mind out....be my guest.  As I already told you before I have no illusions of any freedom above and beyond my own mind and that is still a struggle.....no room for smugness.

 

yawn!

AAaawww....he sleepy.....time for beddy-by.....and dream the American Dream once again.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:22 | 3651928 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

I can see where you would think he's a bearded hippie "anarchist".  After all he does fit the profile. He's says that he's a vegetarian and he listed Million Man / Occupy Wall Street "shut downs" as legitimate attempts of resistance. And he seems to be a "citizen of the world".  NWO indoctrination.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:24 | 3651985 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

I can see where you would think he's a bearded hippie "anarchist".  After all he does fit the profile. He's says that he's a vegetarian and he listed Million Man / Occupy Wall Street "shut downs" as legitimate attempts of resistance.

Sigh.....another mind turd crapped out of the anus that is our public school system. 

Reread the post very slowly.  I listed FAILED attempts at widespread, long-term change......NOT legitimate attempts at resistance....as a way to force the discussion of what anyone can do to stop the fascist state.  No one has come up with a solution the last time I checked the posts.......seems I am still right.  History certainly proves I am right.

But hey....give it your best shot.  I'm up for any good ideas.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:28 | 3651997 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

Oh...by the way....it is the hippie anarchist types of the 60's who are your overlords now.....I may eat like some of them did or do now.....I may reference some of their tactics.....but they were fools then to believe they could change the fascist state as it was during the Viet-Nam war.....and have become the fascists they fought against all those years ago.

Simply the continuing sad, never-ending story of humanity trying to forge a life that is controlled and chaos-free.....somebody's idea of utopia.

All roads to hell are paved with good intentions.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:29 | 3652001 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

I read your posts.  I notice you use my phrases which means you've read my past posts.  Right now I think you're a plant.  You'll have to convince me otherwise.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 20:17 | 3652168 prains
prains's picture

I think your right H, a thread filler paid by the word

Thu, 06/13/2013 - 01:45 | 3653234 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

ROTFLMAO !!!

A plant....paid by the word.....LOL !!!!

The destruction of the country is assured with morons like you defending it.   LOL !!!!

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:34 | 3651672 DollarMenu
DollarMenu's picture

Yo, Jumbo-

Still with a TBTF?

Still using Visa, Amex, MC, Discover?

Eatin' @ chains?

Still payin on cable?

Chowin down on GMO Doritos, Lean Cuisine, and the like?

Working with a govt ally - Verizon, Google, Microsoft, GM - well the list goes on doesn't it?

Stick your head up in a group and you'll get smacked.

As one person, all you can do is check out as far as your resources permit.

 

 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:55 | 3651727 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

Educate yourself and get out of their system completely or as much as possible. Get your children out of their system and educate them.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:17 | 3651735 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

Yo, Jumbo-

Still with a TBTF?

Still using Visa, Amex, MC, Discover?

Eatin' @ chains?

Still payin on cable?

Chowin down on GMO Doritos, Lean Cuisine, and the like?

Working with a govt ally - Verizon, Google, Microsoft, GM - well the list goes on doesn't it?

Stick your head up in a group and you'll get smacked.

As one person, all you can do is check out as far as your resources permit.

 

Uhhh....no.  I've banked at a local credit union since 1994.

I do not have a credit card.

I have not had cable or sat. TV since 1992.

I'm almost totally veggie....except for the occasional fish at home or a burger during the holidays.

Too poor to really eat out much.

Do not have a cell phone except for the one my company pays totally for ....once I'm gone....no cell phone for me....survived without one until this job.....I can get by afterwards.

Two vehicals were hand me downs and totally paid for.

No mortgage....house totally paid for.

Own 5 acres of land with horses, chickens, goats.....soon to start expanding garden and getting into raising talapia and next year starting a 5 year solar build out to get completely off the grid.

Homeschooling 5 kids who are all at or above their peers in testing.

 

 So....I hope now you see that it's not my head you are smacking but it's your ass.....so stick it up anytime douche bag and I'll give you something you obviously like to begin with

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:49 | 3651699 Argent
Argent's picture

sadly nothing will change because of people like you

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:59 | 3651744 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

sadly nothing will change because of people like you

And things are getting rapidly worse in spite of people like you

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:03 | 3651752 prains
prains's picture

you're going in the wrong direction; derision, division, fission is a form of aiding and abetting > americans lack any concept of "team" outside of sports because of attitudes like yours

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:27 | 3651819 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

you're going in the wrong direction; derision, division, fission is a form of aiding and abetting > americans lack any concept of "team" outside of sports because of attitudes like yours

Just because I was born and raised in America does not make me one.  I am free to shed that distinction and I do.  I did not need the Constitution or a Declaration of Independence to allow me that freedom....for in the words of your founding fathers....."These Truths we hold to be "SELF-EVIDENT".....

It was an act of God....(or if you are more comfortable with the idea of fate....so be it) that I was born on this soil.....but the SELF EVIDENT TRUTH that already existed before I was born was there until I became aware of it.  And that truth was that I was born free.....with no need of a king to allow me rights.....or a Constitution that somehow people still believe will protect them from elected officials who are acting like the very king you overthrew 200+ years ago.

You have no rights under any government.....neither monarchy or democracy or constitutional republic....you always and forever more will have only privileges.

Free your mind.....for they can never take that freedom away from you for they never had it in the first place.....and only you can enslave it.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:34 | 3651844 prains
prains's picture

"being" wihout a label is fine, borders are political constructs sure! BUT

 

you do not walk this earth alone and your freedom is just that, yours alone. unfortunately for you, you are not alone, so in order for you to "imagine" being free you've made another construct much like a border, only that border is just you, another matrix within a matrix.

you're tricking yourself

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:02 | 3651918 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

you do not walk this earth alone and your freedom is just that, yours alone. unfortunately for you, you are not alone, so in order for you to "imagine" being free you've made another construct much like a border, only that border is just you, another matrix within a matrix.

you're tricking yourself

I most certainly do walk this earth alone even though I physically interact with friends, family and co-workers for no one completely knows my mind or from whence my feelings or beliefs come from.

I am under no illusion of any freedom outside of the freedom of my own mind...and that is a constant struggle from forces without and within.

Yes....we all construct a matrix for ourselves with varying degrees of success  even after some of us like me check out of the one we are born into (mainly the American Dream) .

as far as tricking myself.....self delusion is amongst the worst of all enemies and is always a wolf at the door.  My struggle continues.  How about you....American Dreamer?

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:17 | 3651963 prains
prains's picture

not even american,

you obviously don't know what a haka is,

you'd like its philosophy but be warned people live, love and learn through the haka

and occassionally get eaten

polynesians know how to get it done, when the SHTF i venture to guess you'll be one of the eaten......

but it's only a hunch, you may prove me wrong but i doubt it.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:42 | 3652029 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

LOL....could not care less about the haka.....or any other useless tribal screaming

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 20:20 | 3652188 prains
prains's picture

like I said. <anachro smug american only in it for himself>, you will be eaten, because you already have been.

Thu, 06/13/2013 - 01:49 | 3653238 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

Make sure you tenderize me real good now and add a little salt and pepper while you're at it.  I'm an old bird tribal man....LOL!!!!

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:06 | 3651763 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

What am I gonna do about it?

1. For starters, I'll take precautions:  I've learned from my "Ossie" (East German) friends to watch my Ps & Qs:  Watch what I say, to whom, where and when.  In person is best, and 'vetted' friends are best also.

2. As for 'online' stuff, ZH bloggers and Writers (Doug Casey, Simon Black) have advised us to get offshore email account(s), and offshore websites if we have one.  Then there's encryption for ALL stuff, and snail-mail or courier for hard copy.  Runners and Face-to-Face worked for Dick Cheney in 2001.  And he certainly "had nothing to hide", right?

3. As for using FB... keep it to basics, boring, vanilla stuff -- to manage your public image.  You can always create an alter ego for your more civic-minded & Libertarian views -- for which your scumbag employer/HR_dept can't retaliate against or keep you from getting hired.  IMO, 'Mind-fucks' are a 2-way street.  And make sure you not only Log Off from FB, but close the Tab and regularly clean the History and Temp files.  Maybe FB cookies too.

4. As for Amazon... I've done a complete 180 on Kindle: Be damned if I'll have them monitor in real time what page of what e-book I'm on!  Gone back to hard copy.  On principle.

5. Log off Google if you're gonna surf Youtube or Alternative News sites!

6. I have no use for porn sites anyway, but I hear that they are infested with 'STDs':  Software-Transmitted Diseases.  Better to buy DVD's from a shop, I suspect.  And most of these sites are run by the Human Trafficking gangs anyway, so screw 'em, so to speak.

7. Never, ever, never use your work-PC for anything other than 'work'!  Same for your work-cellphone (except for brief calls to immediate family).  Use your private cellphone for texting or surfing, you cheap bastard!  You have to be 'fanatical' about this.  Know too many horror stories in this category.

8.  Use other Low Profile tactics.  Am not sharing mine publicly, obviously.

9.  Lead a good life.  Avoid the LEAs and all Traffic violations or parking citations at all cost.  Refuse to get into a DUI situation. Getting a DD (Designated Driver) or a cab is far cheaper.  As an added benefit, these are things that stop feeding the Beast/Machine.

Anybody got anything else of Value Add to add?

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 16:59 | 3651547 Kiss My Iceland...
Kiss My Icelandic Ass's picture

 

 

What sickens me is that 37% approve. It's all over folks. Sheeple, sheeple, sheeple ...

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:31 | 3651661 bdc63
bdc63's picture

... and that 10% have "no opinion" ...

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 16:58 | 3651548 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

hard to believe that most people disapprove of illegal behavior

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:33 | 3651666 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

But... how can it be illegal, when they are the law?

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 16:59 | 3651551 seek
seek's picture

Gallup tax audit in 3...2...1...

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:13 | 3651595 g'kar
g&#039;kar's picture

Obama already sued Gallup for not goose stepping  for him.

 

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/09/06/gallup-doj-axelrod

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:25 | 3651636 RacerX
RacerX's picture

I just heard a rumour the Gallup prez was seen 5 colombian prostitutes, and that he didn't have on any pants.

Could be just a rumour tho.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:01 | 3651554 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

It wouldn't matter if the gubbermint promised to never do it again. Would you ever trust your phone service, internet provider, mocrosoft, google, whatever, ever again? Could you ever be that gullible? Seriously folks this doesn't matter. If you pay for phone or internet you are paying to be spied upon, it's that simple. There never was any privacy, all you had was a false sense of security. Get used to it, if you use their satellite uplink, their towers, whatever, you are being recorded. Assume the worst from this piece of shit fascist gubbermint and you will never be surprised again.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:40 | 3651856 nonclaim
nonclaim's picture

Spying can be reasonable... the problem is the wide net trolling for "suspicious activities" and then using the result for... suspicious activities!

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:01 | 3651563 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

I watched Sen. Patty Murray from WA on the Cybersecurity and Government Surveillance CSPAN thread and realized how far gone this country is.

She licked their boots like a braindead fucking stooge. Just another lap dog looking for moar gov't treats (funding). She apparently loves and supports fascism as long as the money keeps flowing to her state.

She didn't even bring up the NSA scandal or spying in general. 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:07 | 3651576 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

Spying on Americans is ok if done by Obama.....not so much under Bush.  The Demoturds don't like to acknowledge the fact that Obama is using the tools laid out by Bush.

And they still have the balls to say..."BUT....BUT.....Obama doesn't do warrant-less wiretaps like Bush did"

You fucking moron lib-pricks.....EVERYTHING IS A WARRANT-LESS WIRE TAP NOW !!

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:23 | 3651632 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

The only difference between then and now is that even the stupidest person on earth knows they can't discuss dirty laundry on the phone or internet. Anyone who does and pays the price will be ridiculed. It is the worst possible outcome for the fascists, it's all out in the open now.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:27 | 3651647 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

The only difference between then and now is that even the stupidest person on earth knows they can't discuss dirty laundry on the phone or internet. Anyone who does and pays the price will be ridiculed. It is the worst possible outcome for the fascists, it's all out in the open now.

 

Which is why the fascist state is falling apart as we speak........ROTFLMAO !!!!!  

 

US: No plans to end broad surveillance program

http://www.nwitimes.com/news/national/government-and-politics/us-no-plan...

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:35 | 3651653 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

Which is why the fascist state is falling apart as we speak...

You think it isn't??

ROTFLMAO !!!!!

Oh yeah, the fascists are acting like this because they have everything under control and aren't worried one bit. :roll:

 

the thousand year reich baby, oh yeah!

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:00 | 3651748 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

Oh yeah, the fascists are acting like this because they have everything under control and aren't worried one bit. :roll:

 It's when the fascists fear that the Holocaust comes

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:26 | 3651640 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

We need a "Fascism is Patriotic!" bumper-sticker.

With lots of eagles and flags and such. Sheeple love that shit.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:58 | 3651737 prains
prains's picture

the eagles should form a swastika

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:13 | 3651787 akak
akak's picture

Not just a bumper sticker ---- we need it as a RIBBON!!!

Real patriots always show their patriotism with ribbons.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:07 | 3651931 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

no, a medal - made out of fake gold

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 21:39 | 3652469 prains
prains's picture

Willie B

the boys are pointing the banzai institute search lite up into the clouds

really nice asian breasts are bouncing across the sky.....we need your help

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:08 | 3651770 gwar5
gwar5's picture

Murray makes me nauseous. Was runner-up as poster child of ugly progressive women. All the rest were tied for first.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:12 | 3651589 eddiebe
eddiebe's picture

And anyway, since when do the .0000000000001% give a fuck about what we the people approve of?

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 19:08 | 3651936 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

when it's products they're selling

when it's senators they're buying - not so much

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:15 | 3651599 q99x2
q99x2's picture

Polls are inaccurate because of the base of information the choices are made from.

For instance if you asked the question like this: Collecting the private information of all US Citizens will assist the DHS in putting one of its 2,000,000,000 billion bullets into and through your skull, your partner's skull and your children's skull, in other words your brains will be blown out accross what little property hasn't been confiscated by the IRS if you answer yes to this question, do you think the NSA should gather all data on its citizens?

In this case you would get the results that most accurately come from an appropriate base of information Vs a fucking question like: Do you think that the Government will do a better job of protecting you by gathering personal data?

Long live the revolution.

 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:16 | 3651609 icanhasbailout
icanhasbailout's picture

told ya so

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:17 | 3651610 QuantumCat
QuantumCat's picture

My apologies if someone has already made this point, but  Pew is indirectly funded by Soros... hardly an unbiased research group.

 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:41 | 3651864 gwar5
gwar5's picture

We was robbed.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:41 | 3651865 gwar5
gwar5's picture

We was robbed.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 21:40 | 3652472 prains
prains's picture

and twice in one day, the gall

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:20 | 3651617 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

The ultimate flashpoint is coming within 24 hours...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YbkQcmjKQvo

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:24 | 3651635 Buckaroo Banzai
Buckaroo Banzai's picture

Well that sounds...intriguing. I presume Tyler will be on this, assuming Glenn isn't blowing smoke.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:42 | 3651690 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Glenn has brought forward a lot of good information over the years but this "tease" kind of work I find off-putting. I wish if he had something to say he would just do it and until then keep his yap shut, he diminshes what he has to say by commercializing it to such a high degree. But we will see,

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:11 | 3651781 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

I'll take that at it's face value.......Entertainment.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:20 | 3651619 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

I'm not against spying. I'm just against someone spying on me. Isn't that how its supposed to work?

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:21 | 3651623 NumberNone
NumberNone's picture

I was going to say I disapprove of government spying but was too scared of who might be listening in on the conversation I was having with the pollster.  

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:23 | 3651629 ziggy59
ziggy59's picture

Santelli Savages CNBC Co-Hosts, Cramer For Getting Government Data Before Everyone Else

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2013/06/12/santelli_savages_cnbc_...

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:23 | 3651631 Miss Expectations
Miss Expectations's picture

"Telephone call logs and internet communications" 

Well, since you put it like that, it sounds rather innocuous, non?

 

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:29 | 3651639 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

The latest Cheney* Poll shows that 1. "Deficits don't matter", and 2. "Spying for National Security and the Greater Good is OK".

 

* N=1.  Margin of Error... "does not matter"

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:31 | 3651660 thisandthat
thisandthat's picture

First thing I ask on polls is -who commanded it and for what purpose is it? It invariably ends there...

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:34 | 3651667 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

I have been hearing about these polls for years now and never, not once has anyone ever called me to ask what I think. In the world of surveillance, I either am invisible or they all already know what I think and are afraid to ask.

Thu, 06/13/2013 - 02:09 | 3653272 Umh
Umh's picture

I either hang up on them or don't answer the call to begin with. If I do accidentally answers a pollers call I get off the line as soon as a realize what is going on. My gut reaction to those types of question is there is a scam in there somewhere and if you think about it there probably is a scam in there. Even if it's just the NSA checking up on your opinions.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:39 | 3651680 PAWNMAN
PAWNMAN's picture

The most frustrating results of the poll for me is how peoples opinion on the matter flip flopped based on what party controls the White House. What a total lack of conviction on such an important issue. A majority of people in this country have their head planted firmly up their own asses!

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:40 | 3651682 Cheduba
Cheduba's picture

Ok, so in this age of nanotech and quantum computing, people still believe poll results?  Let me help you decipher how poll numbers are likely generated these days.

Approval for Policy X = 50 < rand() < 60

Manufactured consent for the government's policy!

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 17:47 | 3651702 MrBoompi
MrBoompi's picture

You can get any answer you want if you ask the right question. Sure, most of us don't mind spying if it means preventing terrorist attacks. But ask us if we condone spying even if it doesn't prevent attacks, or if its used by mega-corporations to stifle competition and increase profits, and you'll get a completely different result. Or better yet, make people read George Washington's posts about subject here, then ask them.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:04 | 3651755 gwar5
gwar5's picture

If you have nothing to hide, why do you need a Bathroom Door?

 

NSA surveillance is not for terrorism, it's for chilling and monitoring political dissident communications, censuring, disrupting movements before they start, creating target lists to be passed along, blackmailing select individuals, and for developing counter-propaganda. This is nasty shit. Web traffic also tells Obama's paid trolls where to go to hijack threads.

Verizon (and others) can slow traffic to targeted phone numbers. Google can down-list sites, Youtube & Facebook remove anti-Obama things they don't like. 

Anecdote: In 2010 I used my debit card for online support of conservative candidates and Tea Party groups. The bank shortly blocked my card. When I called, they said there were "suspicious charges" being put on the card. And yes, it was a bank that had received bail out money. I told them to fuck off and changed banks.

Wed, 06/12/2013 - 18:06 | 3651758 TWSceptic
TWSceptic's picture

Forget about the majority, the fact that so many people agree to be spied upon by their government is the shocking news here. Apparently that's how degraded society has become.

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