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Snowden: Patriot Or Traitor? America Responds
"I'm neither traitor nor hero. I'm an American," is how Snowden describes himself to the South China Morning Post, but, according to a Reuters/Ipsos poll released today, more Americans see the NSA Whistleblower as "Patriot" than "Traitor." Some 23 percent of those surveyed said former National Security Agency contractor Edward Snowden is a traitor while 31 percent said he is a patriot. Another 46 percent said they did not know.
As Reuters reports, the Reuters/Ipsos poll finds 35 percent of those surveyed said Snowden should not face charges while 25 percent said he should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.
The confusion reigns as some 45 percent of those surveyed say the program is acceptable under some circumstances, while 37 percent say it is completely unacceptable though only 6 percent say they have no objections to the program.
Source: Reuters
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I have been sensing something like this but you put your finger on it. I think we are seeing the over-reach of propaganda.
The US is divided and both sides cannot be reconciled.
One side wants the government to fuck off... the other side wants the government to control your life.
Either split up the country into 2 countries or bring on a civil war.
Today's USA is like if the US and the USSR of the 60s were merged together... it cannot end well.
One side wants the other sides stuff and the other side doesn't want to give it to them (their stuff that is).
Trollers are feeding into comment sections, turning every topic into D vs R. But when you talk to people, there di not feel that strongly toward the other party. The supporters of this policy do not represent most people. The volume is just turned up. Fanfair for nothing.
This is the Wizard of Oz, pulling levers. Angitating, redirecting, confusing, delaying, and burying until it is accepted as normal. Terrifying events are about to take place. Prison could be the graveyard for innocent people who are attempting to correct this road to a one world oligarchy. so fucking unreal. they deserve to suffer for even attempting to pull this off. A better plan could have been put into place. They want suffering.
http://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2013/06/13/did-the-cia-give-the-nsa-documents-to-ed-snowden/
CIA v NSA
In reply to Rappoport, in my Engineering experience, new hires are thrown into the deep end immediately, and just told to follow instructions.
Remember that the military enlisted are mostly 19 year old high school graduates.
I've long been a proponent (in my own head) of splitting the country in half as an experiment in success. Draw a line down the middle of the US and give the leftists half and the conservatives the other half. The left can use their communist manifesto and the conservatives use the US Constitution. Build a one mile deep minefield along the border between the two halves and watch the action and see which half succeeds.
Give the Liberals the East of the Hudson and the West of the Rockies ?
PRISM is illegal let alone unacceptable even FISC court ruled it was as far back as 2011 and the DOJ had the ruling buried.
http://freepatriot.org/2013/06/12/government-court-rules-prism-program-u...
You may have heard about the NSA-based PRISM program that’s been blowing up the web lately. What you probably haven’t heard, is that the secret Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court ruled that it was unconstitutional. In 2011.
Why hasn’t this come up before now? Simple, once the ruling made its way to the DOJ, they immediately moved to seal the judgement and keep it a secret from the American people. In a recent (and rare) public filing, the DOJ’s actions are made clear (if you have the patience to read all the way through it, that is).
So, let’s follow the chain of events here:
Yeah, that seems to be about the size of it. As if the DOJ hadn’t already lost the confidence of the American people, now we learn that they actively work to hide violations of the bill of rights. Nice.
Should be enough to have Holder removed as AG and brought up on criminal charges. All the supporting documents are embeded as links in there courtesy of EFF.
This is good stuff. I dig your posts. Thanks for that...
Many people need to be asked, what would they do and how far would they go to protect their rights?
I would also ask, what have they done and how far would they go for their liberties?
"Should be enough to have Holder removed as AG and brought up on criminal charges."
Can we call for the arrest of Rep. King and a few others, too? Jeez, I hate that prick (calling for the arrest of Glenn Greenwald is his latest).
My own personal poll of the situation yesterday began with me saying King should be hung for being a totalitarian prick and then having 5 co-workers argue with me that reporters who report classified information broke the law. My argument was "I don't want to live in a country that prosecutes journalists for doing their jobs of letting the public know of government crimes" and "when I think of a country imprisoning journalists, I imagine the Soviet Union, or Mao's China, or the DPRK, not the land of the free." To which one particularly Gestapo-ready colleague replied with "that worries me that you think that."
Which is why my preferred interactions at work are to listen to Bach's Unaccompanied Cello No. 1 and ignore the whole lot.
The irony in all of this is that PRISM will only make the NSA that much less effective. As any good data scientist knows, more "unwashed" data leads to more false postives and ultimately noise. At some point, the noise will drown out the signal completely.
On the bright side, unemployment should go down with half the country monitoring the other half.
It all depends on how you define "effective".
The lawyers in congress are pretty sure that the unwashed data can be converted to ethanol with just a little additional subsidy.
Clapper testified a few months ago that they weren't skanking info from American communications.....sooo does he get brought up on perjury charges now????
Damn Skippy, Kito. Lied like crazy and looked like he shit himself while doing it.
Although the Mockingbirds in the MSM can't just come out and say he's a fucking lying sack....Doublespeak manual says he Misspoke.
Burns my ass.
You and I tell a cop the sky is red, we get the book upside the head fast and hard.
These results only confirm we have much further to fall, not that I thought otherwise.
Proof positive that the average american is a total fucking idiot.
Proof positive that the average american is a total fucking idiot.
I think that's been apparent for a long time with proliferation of reality shows on network TV who pander to the common denominator.
Worth saying twice
Patriot. Remember the old saw, absolute power corrupts absolutely. Does anyone really think that this information ultimately won't be used by the politically powerful to blackmail or otherwise abuse citizens who stand up for their constitutional rights?
Ding. Ding. Ding. (I think it's actually the point of the program).
It's about the tax money; the jackboots-on-the-lawn scenario is just fun 'n games psyops on the white American people who are getting fleeced yet again.
It's about fed tax money, then state, county and city.
They will be /are selling your 4-dimensional profile to subscribers.
You're not going down in a hail of bullets - they are going to bleed you by 1,000 cuts. The banal truth is more horrible than most can handle.
Very soon time to sign off electronically. Not a solution but the 1st step to one imho. The greater mass shall plug along, they always do.
"If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about the answers." -- Thomas Pynchon, Gravity's Rainbow.
Trapatriator. Seize him, then hug him, then cut his balls off, then offer him a sizable settlement.
"I'm neither traitor nor hero. I'm an American"
What a great statement.
Any American should do what he did when they realize their own government is RAPING the Constitution and the rights of their own citizens they claim they are protecting.
I would rather die in a plane, a high-rise, by pressure cooker bomb - than to have the ideals of the nation completely debased.
Why are we sending our young Men and Women to die in foreign countries and at home when THIS IS WHAT WE DO TO LIBERTY!?!?
"Why are we sending our young Men and Women to die in foreign countries and at home when THIS IS WHAT WE DO TO LIBERTY!?!?"
Anything, ANYTHING, to avoid the infamous 'death by pressure cooker'.
Good post.
NWO Tyranny is a quest for Global Tyranny.
One country is not enough for the Psychopaths to control.
People love to be led, love to be told what to do. They love servitude. Big Brother is watching now and he will tell you how to live your life and you will love him for it.
Fuck you american citizen.
It's not just Americans. It's everyone. Asch's comformity experiment, and Milgram's obedience experiment, reveal the sad truth: most people are Gestapo- and Stazi-ready:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asch_conformity_experiments
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milgram_experiment
Patriot possibly Martyr if a nigga ain't careful
It isn't about Snowden anymore, it is about you and I.
What is our foundation? I appreciate what Snowden did and the sacrifices he is prepared to endure. Others want him hung. Hung for what? Telling the truth? Doing his duty protecting the Constitution?
He didn't endanger anyone. They are more dangerous to themselves as well as to peace loving, liberty minded people on this planet.
If there is an argument for good or evil, the results of these polls reflect it.
Civil disobedience has a long history. In this case, the fact that the administration goes to a secret court, where there is no opposition, and relies on a secret judicial decision, is more than enough to justify Mr. Snowden's actions.
And the facts that
A) no judge, secret or otherwise, could or would sign 310 million FISA warrants
B) no FISA court would say 310 possible suspects (present watchers excluded, of course) could support anything resembling probable cause
When do we get an American Spring, a Constitutional Spring? When he is martyred?
1- Martyred in Secret, No one will know.
2- Not enough true believers in the martyr, willing to die in revenge against the killer of the martyr.
"For democracy to thrive, however, specific procedural norms must be followed and civic rights must be respected. Any polity that fails to impose such restrictions upon itself, that fails to follow the "rule of law" with regard to its own procedures, should not be considered democratic."
-Philippe C. Schmitter & Terry Lynn Karl
The PRISM code needs a bit of work, for surely it was supposed to "catch" Snowden years ago.
They apparently did not notice the multiple stickers he had on his computer indicating alegance to a "free Internet" and civil disobediance.....
Nor that he sent money to the Ron Paul campaign fund
45% of the Americans polled are insane.
The WH just replaced the CIA director with a WH lawyer... So if you think the CIA was crooked now... you ain't see nothing yet.
He's not of the agency, so ironically- he is an errand boy, sent by grocery clerks, to collect a bill. Brennan is more dangerous- since he is on familiar ground, and to the degree that the public is preoccupied with intercepts and warehousing by the NSA, they are not paying attention to the CIA's preferred methodology and tools, or what they are/were doing in Libya, Turkey, Syria, etc.
Did any of you catch the piece on Brennans swearing in ceremony? He swore to uphold an ancient draft of the Constitution, a copy that was circulated to one of the colonies and had no Bill of Rights attatched.
That was either:
1) A clear message to the country of what's next, a thinly coded warning,
2) A limited hang-out,
3) A legal maneuver in anticipation of his treason trial,
4) A sop to his conscience.
5) A jokey "Fuck You" to the public
The elite are going for the throats of the elite as vultures gather above and piranha's begin circling the waters below.
Queenie, better get your goat hooves a clamperin.
The good news- they had to find a high school dropout that wasn't initiated into the Ivy League school of corruption to run their program on the technical end of things. The technology to do all this is so technically intensive that, unlike, say, the Supreme Court, you won't get a few Harvard frat brothers calling all the shots as long as this exists. You're bound to get more and more Snowdens.
It looks like the near to intermediate future is going to be the techies vs. the lawyers. I think we all know who has the popular support, at least among people that can still speak in complete sentences.
Look at how horrified David Brooks was that this upstart was allowed to become anything in this country:
http://www.fakenation.info/please/david-brooks-demands-you-respect-his-authority
Patriot.
[This space normally reserved for Fuck You Bernanke]
Patriot, perhaps, but I scratch my head on the simple question: WHY Hong Kong (i.e. China) ?
I have spent considerable time in Hong Kong since the handover and can say from firsthand experience that it is far from a bastion of liberty and freedom.
They have *some* flexibility not available on the mainland, but ONLY because of the ties to finance and commerce.
They are also contained. The security apparatus there is sizable, closely tied to the mainland and HK itself is quite small.
He can get out if he is well connected, but if he wants to ditch Chinese and Western security, his options are more than limited.
Can he hide there for an extended period of time? Perhaps, but this is not realistic over an extended period. He is a White Boy. While there may be many there, they are seriously outnumbered and DO stand out.
The place can also be fairly expensive. Eventually his cash will run out and I can't imagine he is using plastic.
Sure as all hell the PRC would love to chat him up (if they are not already his hosts.....), not to mention other intelligence services.
There are only two airports; Chek Lap Kok (Hong Kong International ) and Shek Kong Airfield, which is used by the PLA Air Force.
That essentially means air travel is out and he sure as hell can't drive out. That leaves a maritime egress of some sort.
I just can't get my head around this aspect of his actions. Considering all of the above, things just do not add up. He could not have run to a worse place. It is akin to hiding in a closet. Few options.
The confusion is even more pronounced as he seems to be a smart guy and critical thinker.
It will be fascinating to see what happens.
Seconded.
After chatting him up, the smart Chinese move would be to off him in a very Yankee way.
Talk about stirring up some shit.
Maybe he's not there to begin with.
He has one of those faces that doesn't really stand out, if I were him, I'd hide out on a community college campus. He'd merge into the background perfectly. Maybe even finish that degree, law might be a good choice this time around
This is one reason I doubt his story. Another is that he lied about his salary and background. Another is that he was able to steal thousands of TS documents. Something is not right here. Think of an alternative narrative. A spy in the NSA machine is a computer geek. He may be working for China, Russia, or even freelance. He sees digital clues that show the authorities are onto him. So he quickly goes to China and puts out his story to the Press. The story has the effect of building public support for him so he can possibly gain asylum somewhere. It gives him more options than garden variety spies like Walker or Pollard ever had. He may also have even more encrypted TS documents with him than he gave the Guardian. He may be bargaining with the Chinese or others to earn some income from these documents. Also, going public opens the possibility of political supporters around the world sending him money.
Excellent points.
Yes, something stinketh in the narrative we are being fed.
Fuck the polls they are all horseshit psyops
37% believe in astrology
Just because people are naive about some things doesn't mean they're naive about all things. Trying to get laid in High School taught me this cruel lesson.
A random sample of Americans was asked "Where is your ass?"
78% responded, "I don't know."
21% said , "In my pants."
1% replied, "He's out drinking with his buddies again."
45% have accepted the new normal. Goebbels would have been proud
The elite must be spewing at the results of this poll. They spent Trililions getting control of the Government and the media and brainwashing the public and yet still the public retain enough of a sense of right and wrong to see Snowden as doing the right thing. Hope remains!
Are you for turrurists??
NSA director: Programs disrupted dozens of attacks (AP)
Thank god for the NSA or else we would all be dead at least twice!
Let me get this straight.... Nixon White House dispatches gang of ex-CIA contractors to break into Democratic National Committee Headquarters and rifle through some desks... 2 years and dozens of indictments later... president has to resign with threat of impeachment hanging over his head.... fast forward few sloppy decades.... president sics national security apparatus on entire country to do as it pleases.... country yawns.... and we need to have a debate on whether our "deep throat" is a fucking traitor or not?
The implications of what these motherfuckers are getting away with is sooooo over the head of the average shmuck it's beyond pathetic.
We are fucking doomed.
The implications are greater. Nothing like apathy and ignorance to spoil reality for many of us.
This nation is not united. It is divided over so many things, including the subject we are commenting on.
We are not about to change the minds of those who yawn at this, nor are we going to change the minds of those who agree with the survellance and calls for Snowden's head.
What do we do? That is a good question, isn't it?
We have known the NSA analyzes all digital data since Binney leaked this a decade ago. There is nothing new here, except the notion that the USG has a direct link to the central servers of major internet companies. And nobody should be surprised by that, either. Think about it. If you want to identify someone who is researching a topic (like making nerve gas or scoping out potential terror targets with Street View) on Google, what better way is there to do this than to use Google. If you want to search for a group of enemies who use Facebook to congregate, what better way is there than to use Facebook itself. I don't think this kind of surveilance bothers the public all that much. But how it is used is where the rubber meets the road. If the Administration was using the central servers of Google and Facebook to identify political opponents who are organizing to stop vote fraud, and then sicc the regulatory apparatus on them in advance of the big reelection campaign, this is a much bigger deal. And this may have happened, and without the NSA. The Google management was part of the Obama Campaign, and they built the entire electronic infrastructure for his reelect campaign. It would not surprise me if the Google management identified people and groups who were dangerous to the reelect effort and had to be stopped, and did this on its own.
I agree Andy. I'm stumped on the survey... the complete apathy and lack of understanding what this _implies_... and the general "buidness as usual" atmosphere.
We're fuckin doomed is what I'm sayin.
Watergate and all its consequences were part of some powerful agenda.
It was not the result of the outrage of ordinary citizens.
Any American who willingly gives up their Constitution protections is a fool...and according to the Rueters poll, the majority of Americans are fools.
So, to you fools: Don't bitch when the chickens come home to roost. And stop being ignorant. Pry your ass away from that plasma TV and read about the consequences of totalatarian regimes in the 20th century -- fools!
Confusion reigns because respondents think the poll asking 'is PRISM acceptable' think it's asking about the TV channel.
OK, so Prism is now out in the open. It was bound to come out in the end.
So what?
Is it going to stop? Will the systems be physically dismantled? Will people be brought to book?
Nah, none of those things will happen. There will be a bit of contained outrage and then it's back to "business as usual".
TPTB will do what they want to ... because there exists absolutely nothing to stop them.
It is that simple.... "The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress."
Oh, there is someone to stop them. Mother Nature, She bats last.
Peak Oil will stop them. Not enough food will stop them, Lack of water will stop them.
Physical Realities that they can't kill, buy off, subvert, or intimidate will stop them.
It all needs Energy 24/7/365 or the machine stops.
They will find that the machine they built is a 427 fuel injected 1000 hp with primaries the size of garden hoses that gets 2 miles per gallon and we are running out of that kind of fuel very quickly.
And it's sooner than they think.
The electric power grid programmed to supply non-stop to the NSA.
Wasn't Cold Fusion electricity discovered in Utah ? Scale Up a Secret ?
This poll reminds me of the time a Russian general went to the Russian leader and said:
General: Mr President I have bad news
Russian President: What is the bad news?
General: The opposition got 51% of the vote in the elections.
Russian President; So what is the good news?
General: You got 52% of the vote.
Looking at the results of the poll it would seem to me that either the results have been tampered with or there is something seriously wrong with a section of America which can find Snowden to be a patriot yet find prism acceptable.
I am citing this an an example of MSM manipulation. Nothing further.
It is a picture of a huge Hasidic rally held in Downtown Manhattan a few days ago against the Israeli draft:
Someone brought this to my attention and I was amazed at the photographs. Although their religious ideology is anti-Zionist, they were careful not to frame this as an anti-Zionist rally.
Nevertheless, no mention of this in the MSM as far as I can tell.
Nothing is ever what it seems through the "prism" of the MSM.
This is why it is outrageous that the proposed press shield laws are not aimed at protecting internet journalism.
Thx Will. Didn't catch that. Hasidim are famously anti-Zionists. Probably the only ones on the planet who can get away with it without getting tarred and feathered as Jew-haters.
But instead treated like it didn't happen
As usual for anything contrary to the wishes of TPTB.
Look at the videos where Hasidics visit Ahmadinejad, embrace him and join his cause, which is not to wipe Israel off the map as proclaimed by the Zionists, but to encourage respect for non-jews as well in Israel.
People that are informed have known about regular jews being against Zionism for a long time. Even in Israel there are protests against their leaders, against killing of innocent Palestinians. But, MSM will NEVER give you this information. I am not a Jew, and as most people I have my own opinion on them. Nevertheless, this is misfortunate situation for everyday Jews. Because they are being judged not by what they are doing, but what their Zionist leaders are doing.
Judaism is respectable religion like any other religon in the world.
Zionism, is a pernicious movement to establish a state within a state.
Judaism, Talmudism, Zionism.
One belief leads to the other, like some children grow into being monsters.
I suggest everybody kick back with a frosty one and watch Swordfish, a 15 year old movie that is totally relevant to this subject... who could forget the part where Travolta gives the good senator the treason speech and proceeds to shoot him through the heart?
Please be lenient toward me, but I'll briefly break out into a rant here:
If Orwell would have lived, to see this happen ... He saw many decades ahead. There was just one point, where he hasn't been quite right: It's not the watchdogs that assault not only each and every american citizen but plain simple everbody. It's the people themselves, who sacrifice much of their hard earned money to buy the whole shebang which is now conveniently being used to spy on them. Good ol' George would shirley be surprised (Aldous Huxley probably not so much).
Empires have always had the bad habit not only to guard themselves from the rest of the world, but also and even more from their own citizens. (Linguistic giveaway: They own you!) And don't you dare posting this on Fuckbook! You would regret it. History rhymes. Even the slightest optimism is inappropriate. According to the "Washington Post" the US citizens bother less about big brother than ten years ago.
The "USA Patriot Act" of October the 25th 2001 has paved the way to trade freedom for security. Anyone remembering Benjamin Franklin? "The state" has the duty to save its citizens from harm, catch criminals and punish illegal activities. But, alas, the safety of the average citizen is not an issue here. No, the defense of the government is what counts, and nothing else. The scale of collecting of data indicates that the US-government simply regards each and every citizen as a potential delinquent. And that ain't by far enough. According to the "Guardian" Germany is amongst the heavily monitored states. Shirley because we are so hospitable here.
What has been built in the middle of a desert in Utah is nothing short of a scandal. I don't know if Obamywan Dontknowbee has a conscience - but I know for sure that he has the ability to sell the increasing surveillance as progress to the disinterested public. The Teletubbies also don't know of anything wrong.
And what now? No protest? Haven't they stolen private data from us, and are doing so right now?
I can only witness a great degree of indignation among the american public, that it has been an employee of the intelligence apparatus who blew the whistle. That's the real scandal! The USA demand extradition. How could Snowden dare?
'America' is great. Yeah ... a great madhouse, as it seems.
(/rant off)
Here's the dilemma. Disconnect from the Matrix entirely and suddenly you are both isolated from others of like mind and ignorant of what is taking place outside of a small, localized area. There is no telling what the government would be up to in our names if people took that route.
I have no answers.
Top trending story right now on Yahoo...this is why this story is dying (as may be snowden)...this is what is mst important.
http://www.i4u.com/2013/06/54559/george-takei-facebook-scandal-rocks-net
Thanks for the link. (*turns light on, because everything just went black for a moment.*)
....or Snowden just moved on to his next assignment with a new name.
Something is fishy about Snowden. Knowing the full scope of the NSA, he is "safely" in Hong Kong with his creditcard.
This whole Snowden thing seems to be timely synchronised with the Hawks, wanting the current Administration to interfere directly in Syria.
With Obama's head about to roll, that might happen, the price for not being decapitated.
I know I am in a minority, but nothing so far makes me trust Snowden, or anyone in the Beltway for that matter.
So, do you think the Jews are taking Obama down because he won't go to war with Iran and invade Syria?
I think they are communicating with him, that unless the Administration goes in directly in the Middle East (McCain's line, which is essentially Joseph Lieberman's line) he will face impeachment.
http://www.jpost.com/Middle-East/Clinton-calls-on-Obama-to-act-more-forc...
correct.....i said this the other day.........'they' want 'him' to do something that 'he' may not want to do........hence, all the scandals.....
I agree there are a coupla issues that I find rather strange about Snowden, but this may simply be because he is genuinely deeply concerned about the growth of the American Surveillance State (ASS) and he took whatever actions he could to expose it in the hope it would kick-start a national debate, so far denied by government.
We can only watch and wait to see how things pan out over the coming days/weeks/months.
These poll results showing a significant number of people in favor of prosecuting Snowden are not surprising in the slightest. Western societies are stuffed full of big-government supporters. They have zero understanding of the concepts of freedom, liberty and self determination. They want the Almighty State to impose their preferred model of collectivism and conformity onto everybody.
If the US Govt tabled a bill to introduce a compulsory DNA database, hi-tech ID Cards or to implant a surveillance chip in everybody's neck at birth so that our every daily activity could be monitored and supervised by government, a full 20-30-40% or more of people would support it. Why? Because many are already jackboots hiding in the shadows waiting for their day to come (Brandon Smith at www.alt-market.com wrote an essay about these people several months ago), and the rest because it would make them feel safer.
There is no salvation for any society where such large proportions of people have handed over responsibility for their lives to government and its agencies. One look at the Middle East Islamic nations is enough to see what happens. It can only get worse.
These Polls are as truthful as the BLS data.
smacker, why do you berate the ave american? the ave joe public pre 1980's was born in usa, now with ted kennedy's immigration bills and no border enforcement (see operation wet back of the 50's) America has had millions of third world types coming here year after year..they have no respect for American law or the constitution and they make up those who see no problems with .gov we have today, why should they? they broke laws to get here and nada happened. The Transformation of America has long ago been done, by invasion.
"why do you berate the ave american?"
Perish the thought! I'm an America-phile.
I was simply expressing my view of current western societies - in America and almost everywhere else come to that, especially the UK where the number of people who supported Blair's ID Card program was mind-boggling. OUR societies have become stuffed full of the people I describe. HOW that came about is another matter. Your explanation looks pretty good to me :-)
Peace.
smacker, almost seems like the elite NWO plan is coming together ..rootless peoples no agreement of what .gov is or should do.
You can do something:
https://secure.avaaz.org/en/stop_prism_global/?tLXoWdb
Sign the petition.
Sign a petition? Oh yeah that'll fix'em. Only the righteous outrage, and massive resistance of unified sovereign citizens, will have any effect. This is a test to see how far they can go.
This is a way to unify.
If it is a test how far they can go a petition is one way to show resistance.
More as only spewing nonsense at ZH as the most guys here are doing.
Altough some are paid for it.
what way to unify? 69% dont know. what test? to see if the clones will let king obama put us in camps? what nonsense? yours? please help me to understand your sooper dooper argument or just let me know where your police round up station is to save you from missing judge judy.
You've already been stripped naked by the Surveillance State. What's signing a petition going to do?
Make you feel morally superior?
Never underestimate the power of smug satisfaction that a useless and futile gesture brings to it's participants.
You really need a hug
There is no "United States" nor "US Constitution" when the executor of the Laws is an illegal entity. When will you all get it through your heads? The Usurper was put in place to finish the job of taking away any remaining sovereignty of the US Citizen--- that's why he matters. Your ignorance to that fact and the fact that Obama is not a natural born Citizen allows this all to happen. We the people must pull the Usurper out of the Oval Office, or else slip on the chains of tyranny ourselves.
This tells you everything you need to know of how well job the US government has done to brainwash its own people. When you have 69% of the people voting either "I don't know" and "He's a traitor", on a matter that concerns your freedom, I fear most people have been indoctrinated to not give a s*** on what the government does. Even if it's lying!
As others before me have pointed out, it doesn't matter if 100% of the people think Prism is acceptable. The Fourth Amendment of the Constitution says it is not. End of Prism, end of story. A Constitutional republic prevents a majority of stupid people from making bad decisions for everyone else.
Only in theory.....
The constitution is what a judge(s) says it is. (Supreme Court Chief Justice Hughes) We shall see.
Badges?!? We don't need no stinkin' badges.
No outrage from liberals when it's their own guy doing the human rights violations, liberty and privacy violations and showing total disregard for constitutional law. The problem isn't the politicians, it's the fucking hypocrites that vote for them.
Snowden's first choice was to be an overpaid PUBLIC SERVANT OLIGARCH .... now he wants to return and be one of the unwashed, worker slaves .... maybe the question should be .... is he stupid .... he risks being put on paid leave .... like the IRS bitch .... appointed by Bush ?
Thank you. I was wondering how long it would be for some miscreant to bring up Bush.
Mob rule
Hes a Hero! Fuck gov
How you word a survey is just as important as the survey itself, those that compile them know this very well. So they will adapt it to get the outcome nearer what they desire, so surveys can be extremely biased at the outset
U.S.A. 1998: "We're going to flood China with so much capitalism it will become a Democracy!!!"
China 2013: "We've taken so much capitalism from the U.S. it is becoming Communist!!"
the sheep's bleating is understood..when in context of mind control.. Century of Self - Happiness Machines.. MUST WATCH
what would be delightfully interesting would be the disclosure of just how deep and a part of the NSA stuff... is actually Isreal based and controlled...
Which one is the food stamp vote results?
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/12/nsa-surveillance-data-terror...
Oh man. The Guardian is on fire.
"NSA Surveillance Played Little (to No) Role in Foiling Terror Plots, Experts Say"
Better hope the Guardian's building isn't over a subway line.
There could be a Terroist Incident.
So is this now backfiring on the CIA for instigating all this?
They wanted to rub the NSA's face in their dung and the US public is ratifying NSA's version of Big Brother....
As Chairman Diane Feinstein orchestrates a CYA show to hide her committees collusion or ommission.
next step... or % o Poll respondent who think that MAA "Manual Anal Analysis" is .....
Patriot...hero? Moral Courage! http://shutupnsing.wordpress.com/2013/06/13/nuts/
If this guys name had not been released, I might just assume that it was a real story. But after releasing the name, my guess is that is just a distraction from the IRS stories.
Obviously the government does not want its dirty laundry out in the open. To paraphrase Obumbdumb: "If the government was doing nothing wrong then they would have nothing to hide." Obviously the government is hiding almost everything it does and therefore doing many things that "WE the PEOPLE" who, we are told, employ the government to work in our best interest, would not approve.
In the extreme, they want to maintain the safety and secrecy of their spies (both foreign and domestic), murderers and corrupt private contractors that they run. Don't have any illusions that the assets that they want to protect are doing Christ-like work for the benefit of all humanity. What they want to keeo secret are the bad things that the people would not approve of if they had the ability and interest to understand it and vote on it. It is for the government's (and the government has a life and survival instinct of its own completely separate from the will and needs of the people) benefit and not for the benefit of the people of the US or the people of the world. No one should have any delusions in this regard.
That being said, the world/universe is a much more complex and rich environment than we have been led to believe, while the propagandists and so called educators want the people to believe that the entire spectra of human capacity and experience is limited to what they tell us. What they are telling us is a lie ... but if "real" secrets get out then people, in general, will know that as a certainty.
I am always suspicious of "so called" secrets that make it into the public arena, ESPECIALLY those that are picked up by the corrupt and captive mainsream propagandist media. Consisder the strange case of Julian ASSange. He was pubic enema numero uno and now he is a politician. Odd, no? There are multiple possibilites and one of the most effective is to let info out that you need to get out eventually (and believe me, if a totalitarian government wants to control the people then they need people to believe they are being watched at all times) and then they can use the person who released the information to release false and misleading information.
LET'S NOT FORGET THE NSA IS IN EVERY COMPUTER INCLUDING THE ONES THAT TAKE THE POLL'S.
THAT MEANS THEY. AN CONTROLL ANY OUTCOME TO MAKE THE POLL LOOK CLOSE THEN SLOWLY ADJUST THE FIGURES OVER A PERIOD OF TIME IN THEIR FAVOR.
IT'S THE COOKING FROG SYMDRONE. PUT A FROG IN AIR TEMP WATER AND SLOWLY INCREASE THE TEMP. HE'S COOKED BEFORE HE KNOWS WHAT'S HAPPENING.
NOW ABOUT THOSE PRESIDENTIAL VOTING COMPUTERS?
Business whistleblowers lauded, gov whistleblowers jailed. Sweet country.
They left out the graphic showing what percentage of poll participants could distinguish their head from their ass.
Maybe they need to start rating the pollees' "head-up-their-ass" quotient and posting reliability disclaimers such as "Caution:MOST RESPONDEES ARE EDUCATED IN PUBLIC SCHOOLS - DO NOT USE POLL RESULTS AS GUIDANCE FOR PUBLIC POLICY DECISIONS".
The 2008 movie Eagle Eye among others going as far back as the 1974 Coppolla movie The Conversation depicts the advanced state of surveillance in Amerika and other developed cuntries. The technology is not new, the devil or Satan is a sentient but totally evil computer program like Sauron's Eye from Lord of the Rings and has had this technology for eons. He even used it with Jesus to show him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time from his lair in a high mountain, probably somewhere in the Himalayas (like Superman's fortress of solitude). He has advanced technological fusion centres, in the heavens (spiritual wickedness in heavenly places the Bible tells us), and also inside the earth (beasts arising out of the earth, like from Shambala, in the Bible are not uncommon, particularly in the book of Revelation); he deceives the world from these fusion centres that collect and process information from minor evil spirits on the ground, and spread disinformation through mass media and education systems. It is from these fusion centres, kinda like the mile long spacecraft cloaked above major cities in the TV show, 'V' that devil created programming, educational or entertainment is beamed down to the minds of professors and journalists and script writers that turn them into subliminal programming, audio-visual or written that turns humans into fearful spineless jellyfish that go along with the deceptions for a few minor benefits. The movie, 'They Live' revealed this subliminal programming to be present everywhere, at least in developed parts of the world.
But Satan is not omnipresent or omniscient or omnipotent like our Creator Jehovah, The Great I AM. This is why he needs these fusion centres and street light cameras etc. as shown in Eagle Eye to give the impression of omnipresence. So the battle is spiritual, Obama-Bush-Clinton are all puppets dancing to Satan's tune. We have been given the Helmet of Salvation and the armor of God as written in Epehesians 6 which is the only defense we have against such evil subliminal, and overt programming that is constantly pushing us towards evil, and away from Jesus Christ who openly defeated the devil by overcoming his greatest weapon, which is death. You will not understand the truth of the Bible without a sound Mind that comes only from God. The devil's pulpit preachers like the Popes and Billy Grahams of this world will only lead you down the road to perdition. You want truth, I can give it you, straight up and unadulterated or pray to God to give you His Holy Spirit, put your faith in Jesus Christ and then see how your understading will grow. Cheers!
This SNOWDEN affair is a Snow job, a total Psy-Op to reveal programs that have existed for a 100 years or more. Orwell wrote about them almost 70 years ago, so this info coming out now is to simply inform you that it is happening and there is nothing you can do about it, at least in the human dimesnion. But God can cloak you from their surveillance - they cannot penetrate his shields!
As one who loves the Lord, and who is greatly concerned about the ever-encroaching nanny/police/warfare state, I have to say to you: Step away from the computer, and go take your meds. Seriously.
It seems doubtful that a person who claims to love the Lord (which lord?) would respond as derogatorily as you have done. You have not addressed one opinion posited in my post yet you diagnose me with some disorder for which you prescribe medication, much as a shrink would prescribe Ritalin or Prozac to a child to destroy his mind and body. Your accusations are not signs of a SOUND MIND but of a REPROBATE MIND; a person with the MIND OF CHRIST would never resort to mud-slinging like the MSM. A True Christian would enedeavour to lead a brother away from his error (if error can be proven), not attempt to push his brother into the pit. No wonder you are are unable to process intelligent information and need to resort to vitriol to try and destroy knowledge that does indeed come from The LORD Jehovah, whom I love and worship through my faith in His Only Begotten Son, Jesus Christ! The medication I would prescribe for you is the WORD OF GOD, the KJ Bible, and havey doses of it!
God to man: "Shiney side out."
A PRISM creates rainbows.
Unicorns love rainbows.
Americans love Unicorns.
Therefore, Americans love Prism.
QED
I really doesn't matter one little turd whether he's the real deal or not, what matters is what we do about it.
Polled is tainted. Participants are fully aware that their "posted" opinion is now be watched.
We are soon going to have political prisoners in the U.S.
They're going to PRISoM.
Isn't rounding up dissidents one of the duties of the Dept of Fatherland Security?
If Feinstein and McCain agree he is a traitor. Then he is this country's bravest Hero.
Bingo. All the fucktards I despise are against Snowden, therefore, he sounds good to me.
46% don't know.....
Thats very very disturbing.
The usual cognitive dissonance of the American people on display. Nothing will change. The NSA will continue to grow its monitoring. How does it feel to live in Cold War East Germany?
"See you on the dark side" 6/13/13 www.atimes.com/ __ and __ " Digital Blackwater rules www.atimes.com/ (subtext: key questions/ highlight- 'The NAS Black Hole: 5 Basic Things We Still Don't Know About the Agency's Snooping?' www.propublica.org/ )" 6/10/13 by Pepe escobar "The roving eye'
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/World/WOR-02-130613.html http://www.atimes.com/atimes/World/WOR-03-110613.html http://www.propublica.org/article/nsa-black-hole-5-basic-things-we-still-dont-know-the-governments-snoop *by-- justin elliott and theodoric meyer*
Please note: It's starting to look like the NWO is taking shape, and only the Basel`esque has all the gambits? indeed, the ideal conditions for a symbiotic osmosis eventuality syndrome for pollinating xenaphobia with a coalescing... yet conterminous zeitgeist global [bowel?] movement?! It's not Us versus the SiNo... No! it's a UsSiNo Unification!!!
A marriage of convenience with this fallen`seraph name'd b[lial]asel consummating the devil's satori?
jmo
thankyou Tyler