This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.

Edward Snowden Issues Statement From Moscow, Slams Obama

Tyler Durden's picture


Via Wikileaks:

Statement from Edward Snowden in Moscow

One week ago I left Hong Kong after it became clear that my freedom and safety were under threat for revealing the truth. My continued liberty has been owed to the efforts of friends new and old, family, and others who I have never met and probably never will. I trusted them with my life and they returned that trust with a faith in me for which I will always be thankful.

On Thursday, President Obama declared before the world that he would not permit any diplomatic "wheeling and dealing" over my case. Yet now it is being reported that after promising not to do so, the President ordered his Vice President to pressure the leaders of nations from which I have requested protection to deny my asylum petitions.

This kind of deception from a world leader is not justice, and neither is the extralegal penalty of exile. These are the old, bad tools of political aggression. Their purpose is to frighten, not me, but those who would come after me.

For decades the United States of America have been one of the strongest defenders of the human right to seek asylum. Sadly, this right, laid out and voted for by the U.S. in Article 14 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, is now being rejected by the current government of my country. The Obama administration has now adopted the strategy of using citizenship as a weapon. Although I am convicted of nothing, it has unilaterally revoked my passport, leaving me a stateless person. Without any judicial order, the administration now seeks to stop me exercising a basic right. A right that belongs to everybody. The right to seek asylum.

In the end the Obama administration is not afraid of whistleblowers like me, Bradley Manning or Thomas Drake. We are stateless, imprisoned, or powerless. No, the Obama administration is afraid of you. It is afraid of an informed, angry public demanding the constitutional government it was promised — and it should be.

I am unbowed in my convictions and impressed at the efforts taken by so many.

Edward Joseph Snowden

Monday 1st July 2013


- advertisements -

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Mon, 07/01/2013 - 18:12 | 3711523 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

On this July 4th holiday... Let 'Serfdom' Ring...

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 18:17 | 3711542 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Their purpose is to frighten, not me, but those who would come after me.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 18:44 | 3711646 1100-TACTICAL-12
1100-TACTICAL-12's picture

Here's what you do Ed. Find a way to get to Mexico , Change your name to Abdul Ali Sanchez , sneek across the border. report to the local HHS office & sighn up for your benifits.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 18:47 | 3711652 jbvtme
jbvtme's picture

i'm skeptical of this character snowden.  however, this incident continues to embarrass this country at every turn.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 18:52 | 3711681 BoNeSxxx
BoNeSxxx's picture

Patriot.  <------ PERIOD

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 18:59 | 3711705 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

Snowden should have asylum, Obama/Holder, etc. should be in one...

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 19:06 | 3711724 Fukushima Sam
Fukushima Sam's picture

I was going to write my congresspeople about this, but then realized that would result in me getting put on a list or two...

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 19:09 | 3711740 jbvtme
jbvtme's picture

and worse, they'll be watching you darn your sock puppet in your rocking chair

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:05 | 3711917 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

Snowden is treating Obummer like the whore he is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

“They spend billions of dollars every year lobbying to get what they want. Well, we know what they want; they want more for themselves and less for everybody else. But I’ll tell you what they don’t want—they don’t want a population of citizens capable of critical thinking. They don’t want well informed, well educated people capable of critical thinking. They’re not interested in that. That doesn’t help them. That’s against their interest. You know something, they don’t want people that are smart enough to sit around their kitchen table and figure out how badly they’re getting fucked by a system that threw them overboard 30 fucking years ago. Because the owners of this country know the truth, it’s called the American Dream, because you have to be asleep to believe it.” George Carlin

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:07 | 3711950 Pegasus Muse
Pegasus Muse's picture

Powerful commentary.  Greenwald speaks truth to power.  Well worth the 55 minutes.


Glenn Greenwald Speaks Out 


Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:29 | 3711997 clymer
clymer's picture

I just can't believe it took the liberal trendies 5 friggin years to figure Barry out. Gee, didn't the 180 on FISA and warrantless wiretaps clue you in back in 08? Or the 1 Billion dollar campaign courtesy of Goldman Sachs? I knew the trendies would come along sooner or later, just wish it was sooner.

Not Edward Snowden -he cast a ballot for Ron Paul in 08. God speed sir.

If you can let us know via ZH or reddit, or any other way how we can help fund your predicament

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:31 | 3712036 DaddyO
DaddyO's picture

Holy Sh*te, what is ZH coming to, over 300 comments for ES and 17 for Benzo Diazabernanke.

We've all lost site of the fiatsco and its puppeteer...


Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:14 | 3712144 Yes We Can. But...
Yes We Can. But Lets Not.'s picture

I love Edward Snowden, who has done more good for his country than Bernanke could ever hope to. That is, if we heed his clarion call informing us all as to the deep corruption, cynicism, abusiveness and negligence of our government.

I look forward to more revelations. I hope concerned Americans will get behind his cause and support him and build upon his effort to right this country. I hope that there will be a way I can help him if he needs it, financially or otherwise. He is a hero, a patriot, a historical figure, and his actions and word may provide the impetus to right this nation and clear our cockroaches like Obama, Holder, Napolitano, Clapper and many other statist goons.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:17 | 3712180 Real Estate Geek
Real Estate Geek's picture

I keep finding reasons to like this kid.  Latest one is his use of the plural in this sentence: "For decades the United States of America have been one of the strongest defenders of . . . "

Stay tough, lad.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:36 | 3712403 jerry_theking_lawler
jerry_theking_lawler's picture

haven't seen it in so long....had to reread it to make certain it was right....yep, it is.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:44 | 3712430 Spirit Of Truth
Spirit Of Truth's picture

All you ignoramuses lauding this treasonous jackal would do best by following his patriotism by taking the soonest available one-way flight to Moscow where you seem to think freedom reigns.  Other than that, there's a need for America to defend its national security from enemies foreign AND DOMESTIC.

Ying yangs...

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:00 | 3712478 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

...said the kook that thinks he's the reincarnated Jesus.

MDB and AnAnonymous have more credibility.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 02:24 | 3712949 BaBaBouy
BaBaBouy's picture

AN ABSOLUTE HERO, 2013 Man Of The Year, Maybe Decade...

I Bowe At His Feet...

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 14:54 | 3714769 nugjuice
nugjuice's picture

Spirit, I think you're missing the point. He didn't go to Russia b/c he's a Russian spy. He went to Russia because he's being hunted by his own country and he knows that Russia isn't our friend. If we had welcomed him back with open arms he never would have gone there. Nobody is saying we think Russia is a wonderful place, we just think it's one of the few places not afraid to say 'fuck you' to TPTB in the USA

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 14:53 | 3714770 nugjuice
nugjuice's picture

Edit: dupe post

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:21 | 3712565 tango
tango's picture

I disagree with your assumption (and think Snowden has done us all a good thing) but it is galling in the extreme to read on ZH, a forum allegedly dedicated to individual liberty, fulsome praise for such authoritarian states as Iran, Syria, China and Russia.  One can disagree with the actions of one's governments without losing all sense of proportion.  After all, a site like ZH would not be allowed to exist in any of the countries so often fawned over in these columns.  

Obama and Company are angry not that someone "broke the law" (the Administration does that routinely) but that embarrassing secrets were revealed.  Pathetically and ironically, our massive collections of data has not helped analysis one whit.   What good does it do to record the actions of every man, woman and child on the planet if incorrect conclusions are drawn? 

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:29 | 3712593 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Yes, very good reply, + 1.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:32 | 3712611 Spirit Of Truth
Spirit Of Truth's picture

I concur that all the information gathering in the world won't do you a bit of good if your underlying judgment is flawed.  This is why the DJIA today currently trades around the 15000 mark.  What we are at in the current age is an ultimate peak of misled collective beliefs and expectations even though there has never before been such massive knowledge.  This is the Elliott Wave Grand Supercycle peak playing out in human history:

As for Western "intelligence", there's probably never been a more profound oxymoron:

Moscow is misleading the West, and the world as-a-whole, into collective destruction and subjugation:

And this will be done in the name of "god" when nothing could be further from the truth:

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:42 | 3712650 tango
tango's picture

Thanks for the reply but I don't get the religious aspect since Biblical prophecy was ALWAYS for those who heard the prophecy itself - never for thousands of years in the future in a land they didn't even know existed. Russia is not misleading at all.  She is very clear about what she wants but I don't worry since she is doomed by demographics - massive dying off accompanied by massive Muslim growth, a disaster in the wings.  

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 01:23 | 3712873 Lore
Lore's picture

Elliott Wave charts are like Global Warming charts. They look backward and tweak the analysis to fit the thesis.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 09:07 | 3713463 StandardDeviant
StandardDeviant's picture

Yes, the above post was worth a -1 just for dredging up this rubbish.

A better analogy than global warming charts might be the ancient Greek astronomers' epicycles, in which the retrograde (non-circular) motion of the planets was explained away by having them move around the earth in circles like the other stars -- but then move in smaller counter-rotating circles, then in smaller circles again, and so on, so as to approximate the observed behaviour.  All very clever, but in fact bears no relation to what is really going on.

And, like astrology, it's not falsifiable.  If an EW prediction happens not to work out, there's always an explanation/excuse, usually involving a longer- or shorter-term cycle which, if it had been properly accounted for, would of course have resulted in the correct prediction.  More wishful thinking.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 09:38 | 3713617 Spirit Of Truth
Spirit Of Truth's picture

Thanks for the reply but I don't get the religious aspect since Biblical prophecy was ALWAYS for those who heard the prophecy itself - never for thousands of years in the future in a land they didn't even know existed. Russia is not misleading at all.  She is very clear about what she wants but I don't worry since she is doomed by demographics - massive dying off accompanied by massive Muslim growth, a disaster in the wings.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 00:17 | 3712730 Taku
Taku's picture

Snowden uncovered illegal government surveillance of American homeland citizens.


That's something some conveniently overlook.

The argument 'any cost to protect security' has been used before by regimes.

Think about where things are headed.

If any cost including illegal is OK, then where is the line?

It's wherever the State says.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 09:08 | 3713466 StandardDeviant
StandardDeviant's picture

So is the definition of "illegal".

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 00:38 | 3712773 Nehweh Gahnin
Nehweh Gahnin's picture

Neither truth, nor spirit.

Not the first down-arrow I've been forced to inflict upon you.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 01:47 | 3712912 Tsukato
Tsukato's picture

Haha! Good one! Just flawless! However, if you're not joking, then this is something all together. People need to grow the fuck up. We may all be Americans, but make no mistake, we needn't be our brothers keeper. There are a hell of a lot of Americans that are by no means our brothers, nor beneficial to the republic, or the idea of liberty. We needn't always make excuses for the stupid, lazy, cowardly, or spite filled. We all know who these people are. And. That they are unchangable. They are a cancer in the body pf human freedom,needing to be removed. If not for us and our posterity, then for the whole world. If Americans can't turn this machine of tyranny off, who will?

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:47 | 3712669 Uchtdorf
Uchtdorf's picture

I noticed that, too, and thought most Americans don't write like that, but perhaps a highly educated Russian might.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 03:42 | 3713020 Sandmann
Sandmann's picture

Some Americans can write English well, few it is true, but there are some and you clearly do not know them

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:06 | 3712150 Troll Magnet
Troll Magnet's picture

have you read some of the comments on liberal blogs? they remain CLUELESS. they deserve to be slaves.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:14 | 3712172 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Not that it should need to be stated, but for the dumbasses out there... Few Americans (including most of the commentators on this site) are either liberal or conservative, they'll vote for whatever is convienent. Lot of the morons on here would happily vote in fascists as long as it satisfied their xenophobia (as evidenced from an article earlier today). 

For the record, the Snowden leaks were first published by a liberal newspaper (funded by a trust) in an article written by the keynote speaker at the socialist conference 2013. 

Deal with it. 

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:46 | 3712259 Ident 7777 economy
Ident 7777 economy's picture


Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:51 | 3712451 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

the oddity of one of the lowest turnout elections in history being declared a "mandate" did stand out to me. Nixon was VERY popular as well..."until he wasn't." nobody believed all the "wackos who thought the President was so stupid as to personally order the break in at the Watergate hotel." check your emotions at the door...and don't underestimate the ability of Americans to check in their's.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 01:29 | 3712884 Lore
Lore's picture

It is clear that James hasn't spent much time on ZH, or if he has, not much has penetrated.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:46 | 3712433 Spirit Of Truth
Spirit Of Truth's picture

Could you be more specific?

Thanks for the comment.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 00:05 | 3712716 BeetleBailey
BeetleBailey's picture asinine message, delivered in douchebag style...that'll win people over

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 00:55 | 3712810 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Not trying to win anyone over, the folks here whining endlessly about liberals, black people, mexicans, etc. ought to be called out from time to time, otherwise this place'll be completely overrun by stormfront. 

These last few months there's been a deluge of whining from these pathetic white supremacists. If you can't compete with liberals, mexicans etc., it's not their fault, it's yours.

Many of these stories zh is regularly citing are coming from liberal newspapers, organizations and writers, get the fuck over it already. 

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 03:44 | 3713023 Tsukato
Tsukato's picture

Hey shit for brains: not every person who doesn't want to get ass raped by Israel, lose their jobs to Asians, and Latinos, and doesn't love Obama, is a xenophobe or white supremacist, people like you should learn to shut the fuck up, as CHANGE is coming, and cunts like you will be hanging from light poles. Enough serious people have had enough of your you American, or not.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 09:12 | 3713473 StandardDeviant
StandardDeviant's picture

One has to love that whole "freedom of speech" thing, no?

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:36 | 3712239 BoNeSxxx
BoNeSxxx's picture

Don't fret DaddyO... it's just that ES is fresh news...

Ben "Printerhands" is... well... still printing...

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:14 | 3712469 Al Gorerhythm
Al Gorerhythm's picture

Daddy me boyo, you need to read the Carlin quote and learn to identify or do I sense a smidgeon of <sarc> there

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:50 | 3712106 ACP
ACP's picture

Disagree...they have figured him out, and they love him for it.

Every liberal's dream is to oppress anyone who disagrees with their cause. Preferably kill everyone who disagrees. This was true with single socialist movement in world history.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:06 | 3712125 clymer
clymer's picture

well then those brain-dead, starry-eyed, pencil-dicked, no-load pukes are in for one hell of a rude awakening when they finally figure Barry-O for what he is. HINT: the plan don't include you, trendies

it truly is too rich; vote for a guy because you like his sound bytes and bumber stickers, and the fact that he can speak so gracefully (while reading a teleprompter), but ignore the corporate lobby behind his campaign. I never can figure out people who don't at least try to see the big picture.

It's like they said to them selves, "Let's see. I hate Facism. So I Will VOTE FOR IT!!" yeah, thats the ticket.

here's a word to remember for the next time you have a chance to mobilize behind a POTUS candidate: DUPED

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:31 | 3712606 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Lenin had the right term for them: "useful idiots"

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:34 | 3712616 Meat Hammer
Meat Hammer's picture

Someone once commented here on ZH that the closest supporters of tyranny are the first to go to the gulags.  

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:45 | 3712659 tango
tango's picture

Actually the first to be swept up and removed from public life were the intellectuals - journalists, teachers, lawyers and liberal democrats (classic sense).  Both the USSR and Nazi Germany sought to remove the head - the rest was easy.  

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:21 | 3712350 NaN
NaN's picture

clymer:  your venting and name calling is off-topic. And boring.

Fix your world view: there are now more independent voters than either Republicans or Democrats.

Pssst: The left vs. right thing is stupid, pass it on.


Tue, 07/02/2013 - 03:44 | 3713022 piceridu
piceridu's picture

Absolutely awesome video..thanks for the link. Greenwald...the director's cut.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 19:09 | 3711741 DaddyO
DaddyO's picture

I hope you wrote that with /sarc as it shows were many may fall short, in the balls category.

I have blown up my congresscritters email box, let's hope more do and let me encourage you to get on a few lists...

Ed Snowden deserves nothing less from us!


Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:07 | 3711895 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

Have a pair sure, but writing the congress-critters seems more useless than dangerous.

Here's Thomas Drake talking about testifying before congress on NSA illegal search and seizure.


Edit - re. the down arrow - What you're not seeing is that they're all black mailed to keep them in line with the program. 

When they need to choose between acting upon a constituents email/letter vs. going with the flow and avoiding the black mail repercussions, you can see it's an easy choice for them.

They would not get to where they are if they were not already OWNED.  The country has already been captured.

If the black mail threats don't work for some reason, there's always the airplane crash, etc. 

Martin Anderson European Politicians Are Realizing – Blackmail is the Game


Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:44 | 3712428 Totentänzerlied
Totentänzerlied's picture

They've floated this 'blackmail' line recently. It's bullshit. Just one tool of many, active and passive, that they wield. The vast majority will never need to be blackmailed to stay in line, they will do it, willingly, their whole lives.

The blackmail info is an insurance policy, and when it's known by the people being targeted, an intimidation tactic. It is not a particularly intelligent method, as it is far easier to simply invent evidence after the fact, especially with modern data fabrication techniques. Stalin's Great Purge is my exhibit a. Despite an enormous network of informants, spies, detectives, intelligence operatives, and so on, the vast majority of all charges leveled against suspects were simply PULLED OUT OF SOMEONE'S ASS based on crude probability estimates and quotas.

History has proven that people in power are very paranoid, but, more importantly, they have no reason to be, the sheep are too busy fighting among themselves over truly moronic non-issues. The type of people who rise in bureaucracies are opportunists, careerists with no ethics. They will do whatever is asked, and they have no interest in serving any interest but their own; the risk of defection is trivial - there is nothing in it for them. That is simply the nature of bureaucracies, they reward the ruthless, unscrupulous, petty who desire nothing but higher career status and the benefits it brings.

The ones who mind are easily weeded out during purges. Purges are great, you see, because they allow the serfs to do competitive denunciations, morally implicating themselves, and identifying those who have qualms with denouncing others, which is totally unacceptable. Such people don't last very long.

"They would not get to where they are if they were not already OWNED."

Haha, sure, keep telling yourself that.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 01:31 | 3712531 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

You're contradicting yourself.

It[blackmail]'s bullshit. vs. The blackmail info is an insurance policy, and when it's known by the people being targeted, an intimidation tactic.

Which one is it?

And look up J. Edgar Hover for starters.  Then move on to the East German Stassi.  Collecting information to blackmail and intimidate the public and their functionaries is what police states do. Y/N?  

"They would not get to where they are if they were not already OWNED."  Haha, sure, keep telling yourself that.

Nothing you wrote contradicts the above line - So hahaha keep telling yourself whatever.


Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:36 | 3712626 tango
tango's picture

but writing the congress-critters seems more useless than dangerous.

Absolutely.   I've given up trying to express my opinion to my senators.  I get a general response ("Thank you for your interest in this legislation." or a canned issue response ("Senator Alexander is proud to have sponsored the Market Fairness Act and thanks you for your input.").  Weeks later a response actually arrives, "While Congress has spent unwisely, I feel this is a state's right issue and a matter of fairness.   Lowering taxes on state businesses to level the playing field is a state issue." 

I'd wager 100-1 he never sees the thing (how could he possibly read so many?) and the real thrust is fund-raising, such as the "followup" I received (after bitching about the Senator's vote) asking for a donation to fight "tax and spend" liberals.  LOLOL

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 00:17 | 3712740 OldPhart
OldPhart's picture

Right after Congress voted for the Bail out in 2008, my congressvermin Jerry Lewis held a townhall in our area.  It was packed.

He admitted that he had received overwhelming reaction in the form of letters and email telling him to vote NO on the bail out.  But he voted Yes.  I was one of those that emailed his office tovote no.

During the town hall I asked him, in front of everyone, during the live mic Q&A, why we even needed him there.  That since the Constituion was a contract between we, the people, and the government we created via the States...did his vote ont mean that the government had unilaterally voided the rule of law and the law of contracts.

He stuttered and the crowd cheered.  He didn't directly answer the question.

The son of a bitch should be swinging from a streetlight.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 01:59 | 3712926 Svendblaaskaeg
Svendblaaskaeg's picture

"Martin Anderson European Politicians Are Realizing – Blackmail is the Game"

Interesting read (link), Thank You!

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 19:10 | 3711747 DarkAgeAhead
DarkAgeAhead's picture

So do it anyway.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:02 | 3712486 Richard Chesler
Richard Chesler's picture

The only thing Obozo the corrupt bankster lackey is afraid of is losing the support of the criminal banking mafia.

Miserable POSUS.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 19:11 | 3711751 Go Tribe
Go Tribe's picture

I wrote to mine, got the ole "am monitoring the situation closely" response after being told a lower court had ruled the criminal eavesdropping to be within the bounds of the law. Responded back that I would not vote for him again because I consider him in cahoots with obama, holder and the other criminals.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:07 | 3711952 A82EBA
A82EBA's picture

exactly..tell em youre not getting my vote til i see your ass on tv from raising so much hell over this issue

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:12 | 3711969 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

I hate to break it to you, but w/ computerized, no audit trail voting and off-shore services doing the tally, the vote's a joke.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:46 | 3712089 jwoop66
jwoop66's picture

Whenever I write to mine; about whatever, they respond about gun control...


I don't think they're really reading what I write.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 19:41 | 3711856 Creepy Lurker
Creepy Lurker's picture

You do know that you're already on a list just for being a member of this site, don't you?

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:03 | 3711932 Almost Solvent
Almost Solvent's picture



And nSa can suck my cock and massage my balls with their tongue.


Fuck you Langley, you are a waste of my tax dollars. 

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:12 | 3711970 DaddyO
DaddyO's picture


Ft Meade=NSA

Just sayin...


Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:19 | 3711991 Almost Solvent
Almost Solvent's picture

Good point. 

Fuck 'em both and the whore they rode in on. 


Fuck those fucking fuckers. All of 'em!

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:32 | 3712045 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

Fuck Vichy DC and all of its tentacles.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 00:20 | 3712743 OldPhart
OldPhart's picture

Bluffdale, Utah = NSA

Now we know where it is...what do we do about it?


Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:11 | 3711964 knukles
knukles's picture

That may be true.
But then again, everything you've read, written, spoke, e-mailed, shouted, begged, borrowed or stolen or for that matter charged on your fucking credit card is in Your File on You.

You are already in the data base in spite of your ego thinking you're important enough to demand recognition.

So what the fuck difference does it make, anymore, anyhow?

Answer that for me next time you go to a high school football game and the gate attendants a fucking armed Spetnaz trooper

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:19 | 3712351 Creepy Lurker
Creepy Lurker's picture

Yep. I used to think, well, I've been a registered Libertarian for over 25 years so I know I'm already fucked. But then I realized we are ALL already fucked.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:21 | 3712190 Mike in GA
Mike in GA's picture

If we cower in fear of being on this or that list then they have us where they want us.  We have to be willing to give up our blood and our treasure in order to begin to make a difference.  As of yet, we are not even willing to give up a few conveniences.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:24 | 3712006 kchrisc
kchrisc's picture

Writing to criminals about the actions of other criminals is, at best, insanity.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:48 | 3712096 Antifaschistische
Antifaschistische's picture

no kidding...every time I fly I look at my boarding pass and I just know the SSSS is going to print.  Well, it hasn't yet...but I assume it will, because I do write my congressmen, and I do write to POTUS even though I know I live in a 'no dissenting opinions allowed' environment.


Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:56 | 3712464 seek
seek's picture

I maxed out on donations to Ron Paul in 2008. I've been SSSS ever since.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:37 | 3712631 Meat Hammer
Meat Hammer's picture

Me, too.  Been audited twice since and won both times.

Fuck you, IRS and the rest of the alphabet soup.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:02 | 3712487 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

I'm happy never to board a flight again unless I know for sure they never go near anything like TSA.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:19 | 3712182 D-2
D-2's picture

That's a list I chose to be on because I care about my country. I wrote both of my senators, and told them I thought Snowden was a hero. (and that Holder was a criminal) It's called taking a stand.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:36 | 3712400 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture


I've got my own. Maybe you should too.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:34 | 3712228 11b40
11b40's picture

By being here, you can relax.  You probably already made your list quota.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:34 | 3712229 11b40
11b40's picture

By being here, you can relax.  You probably already made your list quota.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:46 | 3712434 Colonel Klink
Colonel Klink's picture

Agree on Snowden, but for our politicians if by asylum you mean bang them in the ass prison, I agree too.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 19:07 | 3711733 Go Tribe
Go Tribe's picture

I'd like to see Snowden form a government in exile.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:28 | 3712207 johny2
johny2's picture

At a press conference in Moscow, Mr Putin said of Mr Snowden: “If he wants to go somewhere and someone will take him — please, go ahead. If he wants to stay here, there is one condition: that he stops his work aimed at inflicting harm on our American partners, strange as that may sound coming from my lips.”

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:15 | 3712338 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

haha, i would also pay to see putin beat the shit out of chalky before the fsa eats him alive.

"Abdul! By Allah! There is no heart!"

"I just opened his skull. No brain, either."

"And he tastes like shit."

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 19:33 | 3711822 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

I am particularly enjoying the way he lets things settle down a bit and then releases another tidbit for our delectation.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:15 | 3711981 knukles
knukles's picture

La dee dah! 
Nice big word, that, delectation.

5 stars!

Flak already nominated me of grammar cop for the day.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:24 | 3712008 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

Did you have to use the dictionary, dear?

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:38 | 3712062 knukles
knukles's picture

As a matter of fact, I did!
I confess I had to!
And that, sir is quite an accomplishment for me.
I don't mean you getting me to use it, I mean me actually finding the dictionary and being able to look up the word

(I keep one next to my desk, btw, great resource, becoming an under-appreciated and under-utilized resource in the day of the 140 character tweet or whatever they are)

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:15 | 3712139 infinity8
infinity8's picture

I love my dictionary - it's from the 40's or 50's I think (was my mothers and also next to my desk). Also could be used as a lethal weapon in a pinch. I don't have to look up much as a wordophile (there's a better word for that which I don't care to look up at this time) but I still love that old super thin-and-crispy yet strong paper that they made the pages out of back in the day.

p.s. edit - used to get on the Merriam Webster site a lot, once I got all into the interwebs, and, they're not nearly as pleasant to utilize as they used to be.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:17 | 3712346 stormsailor
stormsailor's picture

if a word was misspelled in the dictionary, how would you know?

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:19 | 3712352 infinity8
infinity8's picture

if a word was misspelled on the internets, how would you know? (it's easy to mispel misspell)

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:13 | 3712525 drunkenlout
drunkenlout's picture

If a word were mispelled in the dictionary, Hakkarz would tell you, many times.


Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:50 | 3712447 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

Meh. Convenience: I installed the spell-checker / dictionary add-on for firefox & while I know how to spell without it, sometimes I'm hit by lag. Lag with the site, lag with many programs running, keys are missed & spelling errors come up. A simple right-click on the underlined word & it's corrected.

Mind you if I want to ensure that laggy crap doesn't happen I just put it into the text editor (kate in KDE) which nicely remembers all the past words I've used & auto-fills them if I'd like which then removes spelling errors AND time to finish.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:57 | 3712465 infinity8
infinity8's picture

And a hearty "meh" to you, young man.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:42 | 3712654 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

Things that go bump is a female poster, our dear knukles...


Weee need the bump! Gotta have that bump!

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 00:40 | 3712778 putaipan
putaipan's picture

la da dah nyha .....ahh ahh ahh ahh!

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 01:15 | 3712864 Creepy Lurker
Creepy Lurker's picture

Now my dear MsCreant, you know the old saying - there are no girls on the internetz!

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 01:23 | 3712875 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

Hi, MsCreant. Nice to see you. I always enjoy your posts.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 19:54 | 3711913 Paul Bogdanich
Paul Bogdanich's picture

I don't know what to think of him.  He is a young man and therefore more impetuous than he would be if he lives to see 50.  Putin offered him a deal.  Shut up, and we will grant you asylum.  Kind of the same deal he offered Khodorkovsky.  Stay out oif Russian politics and you can keep the stolen billions and live in peace.  Khordorkovsky wouldn't stay out of Russian politics and is now in the gulag.  Putin asks Snowden to stop embarrasing the Americans for asylum and he preportedly issues this statement.  If he actually issued the statmeent and it wasn't the NSA reprinting something he said previously to make it look like he was not paying attention to the Russian offer then it was not a terribly practical decision.  If it in fact was his decision I hope he survives it but I would not bet on it.          

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:31 | 3712216 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

Putin:  "If he wants to stay here, there is one condition: He must stop his work aimed at harming our American partners, as strange as that sounds coming from my lips."

This is classic Russian dialogue chess.

Imagine Putin saying this with a sardonic tone of voice and a smirk:  " strange as that sounds coming from my lips..."

He is at once slapping Obama and the N.S.A. while reminding the Muslims in Chechnya he will give them no quarter.

It is a clever way of exerting control over the situation, while granting Snowden asylum, and throwing a piece of bait.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:49 | 3712266 Professor Fate
Professor Fate's picture

Snowden is being true to principle (in this case something called the Bill of Rights).  This is not a decision based on practicality, but rather one based on honor and "right".  He is a hero...and nothing short of it. He knows his fate, unless an uprising among America's youth becomes so great it derails it.  Unfortunately, our younger generations seem too lost, too uneducated, and too worried about the latest apps and androids.  A shame and a national embarassment.  I doubt most even know who Snowden is.

Fate the Magnificent

"Push the Button, Max" 

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 01:45 | 3712911 RaceToTheBottom
RaceToTheBottom's picture

Every major move Snowden has done has had no exit strategy.  I think that he wants to go down in flames.  Some people have said that is a symptom of his Millennial generation.  I am not sure.  But I have said his speaking is far above his formal education.  His strategy is below it. 

Therefore it appears he is just looking to accomplish suicide by global cop....


Tue, 07/02/2013 - 03:34 | 3713015 Sandmann
Sandmann's picture

Every Revolutionary lacks an escape route. It is that contented docile mass of Americans grazing on high-fructose-corn-syrup throughout the day that he had hoped to stir from their bovine stupidity. The Intellectuals in the USA are simply too compromised by their fawning over a mulatto incumbent in the White House even as he shreds the Bill of Rights

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:03 | 3711930 durablefaith
durablefaith's picture

I agree JBVTME. I like the narrative as much as anyone, but it sure seems the perfect set up for a false flag in the US on the 4th. I can see the headlines now "Activists inspired by snowden commit x random acts of terrorism, forcing the hands of the obama administration into declaring martial law, even though the nobel peace prize winning president of the most transparent administration ever really really didnt want to do that..."

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:58 | 3712115 Raynja
Raynja's picture

i am so sick of that argument, "no one do anything or they are going to strip us of our rights".

SURPRISE!!! they already did, we might as well have incontrovertible proof.


and on the terrorist side, i'm not sure how you equate snowden with acts of terrorism.


but then again what is an act of terror? something the government points out? or a chemical plant exploding? a ship blowing up in the harbor? trains derailing? trains colliding? pipelines rupturing? giant piles of mulch catching on fire? refiniries exploding?

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:15 | 3712535 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

Raynja asked:

but then again what is an act of terror?

Terror is anything a government desperately needs its subjects to fear.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:05 | 3711942 Gordon_Gekko
Gordon_Gekko's picture

I'm skeptical of this character Obama. Obama's citizenship must be revoked, not Snowden's.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:15 | 3711980 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

Great to see you Gordo!

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:30 | 3712032 Gordon_Gekko
Gordon_Gekko's picture

Thanks Bringing It. Here is my lates piece if you missed it:

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:11 | 3712166 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

I'm all in Gordo.  Thanks.  All the best to you.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:26 | 3712372 uno
uno's picture

The London Metal Exchange, the world’s biggest metals marketplace, is seeking to speed up withdrawals from stockpiles in warehouses where waiting times exceed 100 calendar days.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 01:35 | 3712897 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

... waiting times exceed 100 calendar days???

If you bought the contract, what did you buy?

A big fat promise.


Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:28 | 3712374 uno
uno's picture


Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:47 | 3712094 Bunga Bunga
Bunga Bunga's picture

Was he ever citizen?

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:10 | 3712327 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

yes, of some country other than the usa.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 05:08 | 3713068 Flagit
Flagit's picture

I'm skeptical of this character Obama. Obama's citizenship must be revoked, not Snowden's.


i agree. inform kenya that we insist they revoke his citizenship.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:32 | 3712040 earleflorida
earleflorida's picture

say what...

, you deserve what comes next,  doubting thomas


Mon, 07/01/2013 - 19:48 | 3711883 FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

I suggest we do a hostage swap with the Russians. We give them Obama and we get Snowden! I'd throw in Holder, Biden, Kerry and Hillary, too!

I suspect they would feel more at home in Russia with their KGB Prez.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:07 | 3711949 Gordon_Gekko
Gordon_Gekko's picture

Totally agreed. Give them the entire goddamned US Congress as well while we're at it. They are the MOST USELESS animals ever to roam the earth.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:11 | 3711962 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

it's cool to see you on threads other than your own writing GG. I wish the other authors followed your lead.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:18 | 3711987 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

Fonz - some of them do.

Gordon showing up lately is like the general walking among the troops on the eve of some big important battle.  He's helping the weak hands toughen up for the greater good as well as their own.

not my down arrow btw.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:37 | 3712061 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture


not my down arrow btw.

Don't worry about the down arrows. There's at least one serial junker going through and hitting the red arrow on all of the comments.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:42 | 3712420 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

I junked you.
Just cause you looked bored of seeing green. We got FOMC for that color.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:19 | 3712550 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture


We got FOMC for that color.

According to FASB rules, red and green are differently the same.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:38 | 3712633 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

Oh shitting, what is the matterings of my 'american' choosings of colors.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 01:22 | 3712869 Creepy Lurker
Creepy Lurker's picture

Now that was genuinely funny. That goofy Chinaman has become an institution on ZH.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 01:47 | 3712913 RaceToTheBottom
RaceToTheBottom's picture

"MOST USELESS animals ever to roam the earth."


Hmmm, that might reduce their ability to command a high trading price, no????

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 05:10 | 3713070 Flagit
Flagit's picture

Totally agreed. Give them the entire goddamned US Congress as well while we're at it. They are the MOST USELESS animals ever to roam the earth.


i always found the Lemur to be pretty useless.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:27 | 3712019 kchrisc
kchrisc's picture

But that will deny the guillotine.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:33 | 3712050 Gordon_Gekko
Gordon_Gekko's picture

Agreed, but Putin should take care of it. Guillotine would be too easy for these assholes. Putin will torture them for information first (not that they have much, morons that they are).

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:15 | 3712174 angelsand
angelsand's picture

When, in the course of human events, it becomes

necessary for one people to dissolve the political

bonds which have connected them with another,

and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate

and equal station to which the laws of nature and of nature's

God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind

requires that they should declare the causes which impel them

to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are

created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with

certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty

and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights,

governments are instituted among men, deriving their just

powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any

form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is

the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute

new government, laying its foundation on such principles and

organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem

most likely to effect their safety and happiness. Prudence,

indeed, will dictate that governments long established should

not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly

all experience hath shown that mankind are more disposed to

suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by

abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. 

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:22 | 3712192 angelsand
angelsand's picture

But when

a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably

the same object evinces a design to reduce them under

absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw

off such government, and to provide new guards for their

future security. — Such has been the patient sufferance of

these colonies; and such is now the necessity which

constrains them to alter their former systems of government

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:24 | 3712201 angelsand
angelsand's picture

He has refused his assent to laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good. He has forbidden his governors to pass laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till his assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, he has utterly neglected to attend to them. He has refused to pass other laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of representation in the legislature, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only. He has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their public records, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures. He has dissolved representative houses repeatedly, for opposing with manly firmness his invasions on the rights of the people. He has refused for a long time, after such dissolutions, to cause others to be elected; whereby the legislative powers, incapable of annihilation, have returned to the people at large for their exercise; the state remaining in the meantime exposed to all the dangers of invasion from without, and convulsions within.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:28 | 3712209 angelsand
angelsand's picture

He is at this time transporting large armies of foreign mercenaries to complete the works of death, desolation and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of cruelty and perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totaly unworth the head of a civilized nation. He has constrained our fellow citizens taken captive on high seas to bear arms against their country, to become the executioners of their friends and brethren, or to fall themselves by their hands. He has excited domestic insurrections amongst us, and has endeavored to bring on the inhabitants of our frontiers, the merciless Indian savages, whose known rule of warfare, is undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes and conditions.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:36 | 3712238 angelsand
angelsand's picture

"Any soldier, past, present, or future, is from hereforth not obligated to their blood oath to the constitution of the United States, and if said soldier believes the need to not abandon the constitution than let that soldier strike down the enemies to the constitution which are so apparent in this time."

The only oath a soldier is responisble at this point is the devotion to the Delcaration of Independence.



Mon, 07/01/2013 - 23:17 | 3712546 kchrisc
kchrisc's picture

" is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security."

My favorite part. Too bad it was written by al Queda--no, wait!

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 18:54 | 3711650 jbvtme
jbvtme's picture

pretty heady prose for a highschool drop out

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:17 | 3711957 Ted K
Ted K's picture

I know there will be some jokes (hopefully with an accompanying link to audio of a rimshot) but Snowden wouldn't have got where he was unless he was pretty sharp. They don't let you have access to that stuff for knowing a few DOS or OSX commands. Same with Bradley Manning. Manning may have been emotionally/socially immature (as Snowden maybe as well, although he gives the feel of being more mature than Manning), but as far as IQ goes my guess is these two guys are at minimum in the top 5th part and probably higher than that.

....I might also add, it is no coincidence he found the extremely sharp Jew who makes his home base out of Brazil. His choice of Greenwald as his bellhorn and champion was pretty savvy and there probably isn't a better choice out there that Snowden could have made. Greenwald has been masterful so far in showing Snowden's side of the issue and giving people some sense of Snowden's ideals and the shoes he's walking in.

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 01:50 | 3712916 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

Ted - for this I had to disagree. ... there probably isn't a better choice out there that Snowden could have made.

I don't think you know the Guardian well enough, ie. willing to avoid the obvious - Iraq WMD wistleblower Dr. Kelley got suicided, big brother, heavy handed thread tactics.  Just another MSM really.

I agree Snoden's doing very well.  I wish him the best.

He has started a lot of questions to enter the minds of our kool-aide addicted bretheren. 

We need more people to understand what's going on.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:12 | 3711972 James
James's picture

Let's be clear on Edwards reported "drop out" status.

Edward was seriously ill his junior and senior year and was physically unable to attend school.

Big difference i'd say.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 20:27 | 3712017 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

Besides - HS and college [as ZH has frequently pointed out] are not all they're cracked up to be.

A guy I know almost never went to HS, but did graduate.  He got pulled out of basic training to work for the NSA.  Once he got out of the Army, he finished his 4-yr batchelor degree at a pretty good NE uni in a year and a half.

Some folks here have to get their minds out of the box a bit.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:09 | 3712117 earleflorida
earleflorida's picture

yeah, they send`em all off to ***Harvard...

, just how can i make that statement--  there's a ton of high ranking officers and 1-2-3 star generals that get their comradery attaboy  phoney accolades from the gov't.s [***harvard & yale/secondary] special school. Why? just for a bigger paycheck and see-no-evil latitude,... we own ya?

as far as the military schools... it's all incestuous-- great-great /great grandfathers, father's, uncle's, nephews, son's, their first and last unborn children [ladies now included to the club] as gratuitously their stars and stripes are laid out with a boys-club atitude about who-gives-a fuck for the foot-drones?... a war-room seat away from any real-life theatre! Don't let fool like bush #41 getting shot out of the air at 5,000ft +/+... please, give me a good-fucking as cartman would say [southpark]!

don't let em fool ya...  like j kerry that spends a couple of months in nam if not weeks and gets off to take a leak and comes back with a SIW! Walla... he's sitting in a red-carpet wall-to-wall office, next to the Admiral of Naval Operation's with a ketchup 'badge-of ho[nor?]rror as a Heroic POS!!!

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:33 | 3712225 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

Earl - Just to be clear, By J Kerry, do you mean the Irish-American Congressman from Massacheusetts or the affinity-fraud Khazar from the Chek Republic?

Re - your writing style in the post above - I have to ask, is Jose Cuervo in the house?

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 21:51 | 3712274 mayavision2012
mayavision2012's picture

That's true.

Let's remember, too, that Albert Einstein was also a high-shool dropout and Abraham Lincoln barely got through a few years of studies.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 22:48 | 3712442 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

I think that fuck Bill Gates also ditched college?

Tue, 07/02/2013 - 01:54 | 3712922 Bringin It
Bringin It's picture

True, but very different circumstances.  He was already connected and tasked with building a new software company.

Mon, 07/01/2013 - 18:52 | 3711684 Midasking
Midasking's picture

He is a true hero.  If history is any guide we could be seeing the "match" soon bringing about huge changes.  Not sure if they will be good or bad.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!