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Crime Is Getting Worse: Violent Crime In America Increased By 15% Last Year

Tyler Durden's picture


Submitted by Michael Snyder of The Economic Collapse blog,

If your neighborhood is not as safe as it used to be, then you have something in common with the rest of the country.  All over America, crime is on the rise.  According to a government survey that was just released, violent crime in the United States increased by 15 percent last year, and property crime was up by 12 percent.  If violent crime keeps increasing at this rate, it will approximately double in just six years.  But as I wrote about the other day, when the next major economic downturn strikes it will probably greatly accelerate the growth of the crime rate in this country.  Desperate people do desperate things, and as you will read about below, there are people out there that are already stealing entire truckloads of food. 

In the future, when people are extremely hungry or crazy for their next drug hit, they won't think twice about invading your home or pulling you out of your vehicle.  The rise in crime that we are witnessing right now is just the beginning.  It is going to get a lot worse than this.

Whenever I do this type of an article, inevitably someone leaves a comment insisting that I am lying because crime rates are going down.

Well, that used to be true.  It is no longer accurate.

As an ABC News article that was just released explains, the crime victimization survey shows that violent crime in America has now increased for two years in a row...

The violent crime rate went up 15 percent last year, and the property crime rate rose 12 percent, the government said Thursday, signs that the nation may be seeing the last of the substantial declines in crime of the past two decades.


Last year marked the second year in a row for increases in the crime victimization survey, a report that is based on household interviews.

This is one of the primary reasons why so many people are moving out of the big cities right now.  In the city of Chicago, police are so overwhelmed with crime that they will no longer respond in person "to 911 calls reporting vehicle theft, garage burglary or simple assault".

Things have gotten so bad in Chicago that a 14-year-old girl was sexually assaulted as she was walking to a bus stop this week and it barely made a blip on the news.

But we have come to expect this kind of thing in crime-infested cities such as Chicago.  We don't expect it to happen in "quiet communities" such as Augusta, Georgia...

"When we first moved out here three and a half years ago, my wife and I, it was a quiet community, it was a deal that we felt we couldn't pass up on," Don McIntee says.


McIntee lives in the Butler Creek Mobile Home Community, but he's trying to change that. He recently put his home up for sale because he says the crime in his neighborhood is too much to deal with.


"I want to live in a place that I feel is secure and safe for my wife because I'm out of town a lot," he says.

And it seems like criminals are becoming more brutal than ever.  For example, one thug actually put his gun into the mouth of a 92-year-old World War II veteran in Fresno, California and threatened to kill him during one recent home invasion...

"I was sound asleep at about one or two o'clock in the morning, all the lights were on and a guy shook me with a gun in my face. (I said) Hey what's going on? (He said) Shut up and he slapped me," he explained.


While the suspect held him at gunpoint, three others ransacked his house, taking about 200 dollars in cash and jewelry including his 1941 class ring from Woodlake High School in Tulare County.


"They were in there for almost a half hour," said Fresno County Sheriff Department spokesperson Chris Curtice. "So they had plenty of time to search the house, it was the middle of the night."


At one point, Joseph said one of the suspects put a gun in his mouth and threatened to kill him. While being ordered into the bedroom closet, he said he hit him in the head with a handgun, causing him to fall to the floor.

Was there any need for that?  That 92-year-old man was certainly no threat to the four home invaders.

But this is what is happening all over the nation now.  Criminals appear to be getting crazier and crazier.

In Houston recently, one team of home invaders decided to storm a house at 8 AM in the morning while people all along the street were leaving their homes to go to work and to school...

It was about 8am -- daylight, with people going to work and kids going to school, yet no one apparently saw this coming. The homeowner told me four men, armed with guns, broke in through her garage and forced their way inside her house.


The woman's daughter and son-in-law were in the home with her, along with two of their daughters, ages four and six. The homeowner says the gunmen pointed guns at all of them -- even the children -- and demanded money over and over. They ransacked the house and the cars- and eventually got away with some cash, at least one cell phone and the homeowner's wallet.

Who robs a house at 8 AM in the morning?

That is either incredibly bold or incredibly stupid.

In my article yesterday, I included another example of a crime which is either incredibly bold or incredibly stupid.  One very enterprising carjacker actually decided to try to carjack the police chief of Detroit while he was sitting in a clearly marked police vehicle...

Just four months on the job, Detroit’s new police chief got an early taste of the city’s hardscrabble streets.


While in his patrol car at an intersection on Jefferson two weeks ago, Police Chief James Craig was nearly carjacked, police spokeswoman Kelly Miner confirmed today.


Craig said he was in a marked police car with mounted lights when a man quickly tried to approach the side of his car. Craig, who became police chief in June, retold the story Monday during a program designed to crack down on carjackings.

So what is going on here?

Are criminals becoming bolder or are they just becoming stupider?

I don't have an answer for that question, but one thing seems certain - crime is definitely getting worse.

As I mentioned at the top of this article, some criminals are now actually stealing entire truckloads of food.  A recent CBS News article explained how they are doing this...

To steal huge shipments of valuable cargo, thieves are turning to a deceptively simple tactic: They pose as truckers, load the freight onto their own tractor-trailers and drive away with it.


It’s an increasingly common form of commercial identity theft that has allowed con men to make off each year with millions of dollars in merchandise, often food and beverages. And experts say the practice is growing so rapidly that it will soon become the most common way to steal freight.

And what we are talking about is not just a few isolated incidents.  This is literally happening from coast to coast and the dollar values of some of these thefts are staggering...

News reports from across the country recount just a few of the thefts: 80,000 pounds of walnuts worth $300,000 in California, $200,000 of Muenster cheese in Wisconsin, rib-eye steaks valued at $82,000 in Texas, $25,000 pounds of king crab worth $400,000 in California.

As economic conditions continue to deteriorate, I actually expect that we will start seeing armed guards on food trucks in a few years.

Desperate people do desperate things, and as food prices continue to rise I believe that food trucks will become highly prized targets.

America is rapidly changing, and not for the better.

So what are things like in your area of the country?

Are you noticing an increase in crime?


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Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:36 | 4091897 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Just don't look at this:

Or top most violent cities in the us (almost as if there's a trend):


10.Inkster, MI

9. Newburgh, NY

8. St. Louis, MO

7. Atlantic City, NJ

6. Detroit, MI

5. Saginaw, MI

4. West Memphis, AR

3. Flint, MI

2. Camden, NJ

1. East St. Louis, IL



Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:36 | 4091906 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

People who commit crimes are making Democratic leadership (City/State/Federal) look bad, therefore it's a hate crime. Tack 20+ years onto every prison sentence.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:38 | 4091911 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

No description of the suspects was available.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:04 | 4092136 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

been in the crime business 23 years. The court system and prosecutors are definitely overloaded. So is the pubic defender system. Most crime comes from the youth and the youth have less and less jobs. THe system is feeding itself and starving itself. THe police and prosecutors are defintely avoiding the property crimes. Ironically, I am seeing better deals being handed out not in the misdemeanor system but in the felony charges where the state is trying to save months or years of expensive jail and prison time. None of this helps the reality on the street. Add to that the disfunctional soldier returning from record breaking tours only to add to these system and have the federal "crimes" pass their costs to the states   

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:36 | 4092195 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

Yes. You're right. All those crimes in the article above were, I am sure now that you mention it, committed by dysfunctional soldiers. Probably members of the Tea Party, too. Bastards.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 11:56 | 4093218 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

Putting soldiers on a pedestal is not recommended. Many of the people sent over seas are third strikers to begin with.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 18:16 | 4093982 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

you seem to have missed my point completely 

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 21:21 | 4094212 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

Well, not completely, but I may have placed undue emphasis on one part of it, which I find a rather tiring canard du jour.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 07:19 | 4092691 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

The destruction of the core elements of the Social Contract is undertaken at Society's own peril. Race and economic disparity merely distract from this larger problem. Take away the multiple races and the rich v. poor bullshit, when people get fed up with crime, and the "justice" system fails to punish the transgressors of societal norms, society WILL take the "law" into its own hands (right or wrong). The end result doesn't look any different than the videos below in the instances where the mob gets it right, and if the US doesn't get its act together, a derivation of this WILL find its way back to American shores.

Last month's Badagry lynching

Last year's Port Harcout lynching

The justice system can make any excuse it wants for its non-performance, Society won't care.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 11:39 | 4093179 Sparkey
Sparkey's picture

Perhaps they didn't do `This`but surely no one can deny, `They Might have` that is all the justification a Mob needs. (Mobs have `Looser?) standards than courts, in this case, if they might have, they now no longer have, case closed!

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 17:02 | 4093867 The Burning Planet
The Burning Planet's picture

Dude. Work on your writing skills.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 16:15 | 4093787 SWRichmond
SWRichmond's picture

The destruction of the core elements of the Social Contract is undertaken at Society's own peril.


I give up a lot to live in a "society" and by its "rules".  This "society" now has "rules" which concentrate more on taking from me and enforcing that, than they concentrate on protecting me from force and fraud.  These "rules" are now the source of most of the force and fraud in my life.  I am really fucking close to taking it all back.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 10:18 | 4093014 ejmoosa
ejmoosa's picture

" I am seeing better deals being handed out not in the misdemeanor system but in the felony charges where the state is trying to save months or years of expensive jail and prison time."


Just imagine what they will be doing when it's time to cut medical costs....

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:09 | 4091968 akak
akak's picture


Or top most violent cities in the us (almost as if there's a trend):


10.Inkster, MI

6. Detroit, MI

5. Saginaw, MI

3. Flint, MI


Damn, southeast Michigan is such a Hellhole!  Just a sucking, swirling eddy of rot, poverty, crime and the shadows of lost prosperity and pride.

If there is a capitol of mindless drudgery, soul-sucking conformity, social and economic decay, dreary hopelessness and outright depravity, it lies somewhere along the axis between Flint and Detroit.  Let's say in Pontiac, as good (or more accurately, as bad) a representative place as anywhere there.

Hell, SE Michigan was a crappile 20 years ago when I left there (much belatedly).  I can't even imagine how much worse it has gotten since.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:10 | 4091987 jekyll island
jekyll island's picture

I'm with you Akak. I left in '97, couldn't get out fast enough. Very high suicide rate there too. Makes perfect sense that Kervorkian lived there. I guess he really was putting people out of their misery.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:16 | 4092011 akak
akak's picture

Jekyll, congratulations on your escape!

Looking back, I don't know how I lasted as long there as I did.  In fact, I very nearly did NOT last at all, being driven almost to the point of suicide by the emptyness, shallowness and bleakness of life in SE Michigan.  I have been forced to return several times to visit relatives, but my last visit I vowed would be my last, period --- it  is simply too depressing.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:37 | 4092069 jekyll island
jekyll island's picture

Thanks, I completely understand your feelings as a fellow refugee. I was run off the road three times by drivers venting their rage. It truly is the armpit of the nation.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:04 | 4092133 vulcanraven
vulcanraven's picture

True story:

Went to Detroit for a punk show this year. Rented a car, got drunk as shit at the show and ended up passing out in the car. Parked on Woodward in downtown, woke up the next morning... nothing happened.

Am I crazy? Perhaps. Was it a stupid idea? Definitely. Booze makes the worst ideas sound amazing.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:11 | 4092154 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

No one fucks with Heisenberg, dude.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:38 | 4092198 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

Yes. Renting a car is a stupid idea.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 00:49 | 4092387 Alpo for Granny
Alpo for Granny's picture

vulcanraven forgot to mention he had a bag of mercury fulminate as his pillow...

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:22 | 4092428 Freddie
Freddie's picture

I went to MI about 4 years ago and went to Grand Rapids in W MI.  I liked it. The people were great but W MI is not like SE MI.  It is like another planet.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:31 | 4092014 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

I grew up in Midland, Michigan, a stone's throw from Saginaw.  A bit different there because it is the home of the Dow Chemical Company, world oligarch and maker of shit that kills people.   I went to high school in the 1980's and it was sweater button down collar preppy madness.

The common thread of the most violent places is poverty.  It's interesting because poor blacks knew a long time ago about NWO, police injustice, two systems of justice for the haves and have-nots, etc.  They don't hate us for our freedoms.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:58 | 4092233 W74
W74's picture

....used to know.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 00:28 | 4092363 Georgiabelle
Georgiabelle's picture

If poverty was the root cause of crime then Appalachia would have among the highest crime rates in the country. But it doesn't. Now why is that? Could it be that it's more about demographics than about poverty?

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 00:37 | 4092371 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Are you serious?  Meth capital of the country.  But the cops by and large leave them alone.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 00:52 | 4092390 Georgiabelle
Georgiabelle's picture

We are talking about the alleged correlation between poverty and violent crime, not drug addiction:

"The 10 U.S. counties with the lowest annual median household incomes are:

1. Owsley County, Ky. – $21,177

2. Zavala County, Texas – $21,843

3. Clay County, Ky. – $22,255

4. Knox County, Ky. -$22,493

5. Wilcox County, Ala. – $22,611

6. Quitman County, Miss. – $22,625

7. Sumter County, Ala. – $22,857

8. McCreary County, Ky. – $23,163 "


‘Yet, The violent crime rate for Appalachia in 2010 was lower than the national violent crime rate average by 56.76%."


Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:00 | 4092392 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

You do realize that these places have low population density.  Have you been to any of these places?  In Detroit, there is great wealth among the poverty.  There is still great auto wealth in pockets.  In Saginaw, you drive 15 minutes and see country clubs and Range Rovers.   It is the disparity that breeds the crime.  Poor people occasionally steal from each other.  They more frequently steal from ...

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:36 | 4092443 Georgiabelle
Georgiabelle's picture

This article is about the 15% increase in violent crime, not about poor people stealing stuff. Violent crime as in shootings, stabbings, home invasions,beat-downs and rape. And there is one particular demographic, present in large concentrations in all the cities cited in the post at 20:26 as having the highest crime rates in the US, that is responsible for a disproportionate amount of that violent crime. You are either an apologist (AKA a progressive) or willfully blind. Even Thomas Sowell has acknowledged the truth that we are afraid to say out loud:

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:43 | 4092456 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

You tools need to get over your stupid racist nonsense. 

Go to a predominantly white country (i.e. Russia) and gasp! There's lots of violent crime! Committed by white people!! Ahhhhh! But how is this possible?? 

Miiddle class folks don't tend to engage much in violent crime doesn't matter if they're black, white or whatever - this is a worldwide trend.  

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 09:33 | 4092899 scrappy
scrappy's picture

An injust socioeconomic system is the cause of most social ills.

It must be addressed first.

How do we divide the fruits of our labor?


Earn what you want, work as much as you wish.

Succeed and fail, but we should all be able to "live."

Food, Shelter, the basics at least.

In the geoeconomic system, it is up to you.

Be free!



Sat, 10/26/2013 - 10:10 | 4092993 Bendromeda Strain
Bendromeda Strain's picture

Dude, word. If you go to Plimoth Plantation you will get hit with a cluebat administered by the bluest of blue state actors. They tell the story (dressed for and affecting the period) of how socialism almost starved the fledgling colony to death. Everyone was bringing their harvest and labors to a common wealth store to be distributed as needed in a (Marxian) experiment conducted as mandatory Christian charity. The accumulated totals fell steadily until there was scarcity to the fear of death. The charter was abruptly remanded and everyone was allowed to keep the abundance of their own labor, and only then did the colony flourish. True charity still maintained the orphans, widows and lame.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 22:47 | 4094346 scrappy
scrappy's picture

The Wampanoag are my brothers, for real.


Sun, 10/27/2013 - 10:46 | 4095017 Boiling Frogs
Boiling Frogs's picture

Now if there was a country somewhere in the world with a large middle class of predominantly black folks to test your theory.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:58 | 4092474 Georgiabelle
Georgiabelle's picture

Nice try Rand, but crime rates are expressed as a percentage per capita, which by definition accounts for population density.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 07:22 | 4092696 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

It is the disparity that breeds the crime.

Wow. Just WOW.

Hey I know, perhaps we develop some kind of program that gives negroes money, and easier admissions to college, and jobs they are in fact unqualified to perform?

It's never been done, but I'm thinking a massive transfer of say, several trillion dollars, and maybe 3 generations of affirmative action should be enough.

Who's with me on this?

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 09:17 | 4092874 thatthingcanfly
thatthingcanfly's picture

We could also give blacks positions of leadership in our government institutions so they're better represented. That would definitely help.

Sun, 10/27/2013 - 06:35 | 4094656 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

Hey. One more improvement. Since boys will be boys, we'll create a criminal justice system where blacks are given at birth five get out of jail free cards, too. That way, they won't have to suffer any long-term consequences from 'youthful indescretions'. (Central Park jogger, anyone? Channon Christian? Topeka Massacre?)

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:22 | 4092426 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

The 10 U.S. counties with the lowest annual median household incomes are

Lowest median income / poverty is skewed highly relative to cost of living. 

'Conservatives' love to peddle this undisputedly wrong analysis that poverty and crime are unrelated, here in the WSJ for ex::


If poverty is the root cause of lawlessness, why did crime rates fall when joblessness increased?

Yet almost like magic, during the year that article was written, crime rates started reversing and have suddenly and 'unexpectedly' creeped up. 

Americans need to spend 10 seconds looking outside their country once in a while to examine issues they face back home, the link between poverty and crime being an obvious one. 

Spend some time in Mexico and see if you notice a trend between violent crime and income bracket. 


Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:31 | 4092437 Dingleberry
Dingleberry's picture

And you liberals always want to blame something or someone else as an excuse to steal, rob and rape..

Fuck off.

Mexico is corrupt because it is inherent in their culture. Even the rich are corrupt there.  Maybe visit Italy & Spain. Or basically anywhere south of the border. No difference there either. They are poor because they are largely corrupt. Not the other way around.




Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:36 | 4092444 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

And you liberals always want to blame something or someone else as an excuse to steal, rob and rape..

How ironic, you've stumbled upon the US foreign policy on latin america!

Mexico is corrupt because it is inherent in their culture. Even the rich are corrupt there.



Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:42 | 4092449 Dingleberry
Dingleberry's picture

of course....those gringos are to blame for the endemic and systemic corruption.

No doubt the indiginous ones are pristine and white as snow.

Have you ever studied cultural anthropology? Maybe you should. And perhaps learn something.


Sat, 10/26/2013 - 04:05 | 4092542 Kobe Beef
Kobe Beef's picture

Study physical or forensic anthropology instead. Or population biology. These are hard sciences, they deal in measurements, distributions, and genetic markers.

Cultural Anthro got taken over by Boasites and egalitarians a long time ago, and consists of "narratives", ie Cultural Marxism. You won't learn anything there other than The Evil White Patriarchy is the cause of everything Evil, because it's Evil.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 09:34 | 4092912 tvdog
tvdog's picture

Actually, the U.S. is to blame for systemic corruption in Latin America. Every time people down there elect a reformer, the CIA has him killed. Got to make the country safe for United Fruit.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 10:14 | 4093003 Bendromeda Strain
Bendromeda Strain's picture

Yes - the way they administered cancer to the reformer Chavez is the most chilling.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:46 | 4092461 Georgiabelle
Georgiabelle's picture

OK, James. Here is your chart from 20:36 with the AA population added: 

10.Inkster, MI----------------------73.2%

9. Newburgh, NY-----------------32.96%

8. St. Louis, MO-------------------49.2%

7. Atlantic City, NJ----------------38.29%

6. Detroit, MI------------------------82.7%

5. Saginaw, MI---------------------46.1%

4. West Memphis, AR------------55.93%

3. Flint, MI---------------------------56.6%

2. Camden, NJ--------------------48.07%

1. East St. Louis, IL--------------97.74%


Sorry, but I live in the real world (AKA outskirts of majority minority city).


Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:56 | 4092473 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Consider another way to look at this. In Louisiana right before hurricane katrina most of the middle class white folks left, who got left behind? Mostly a lot of poor black people.

After the hurricane there was a major spike in crime, you might say this is clearly because of the high concentration of African Americans. But I'd say it probably had more to do with the devastation and institutional breakdown left by the Hurricane. 

If you look at each of those cities they mostly have something in common, not a literal hurricane but definitely an economic one. And just like in la the middle class white folks got out and the poor folks got left behind to deal with the mess. 

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 05:53 | 4092616 Element
Element's picture



"In Louisiana right before hurricane katrina most of the middle class white folks left, who got left behind?"

Only whitey can drive a car or own a car, rent a car, catch a bus, get on a train, or fly out. Whitey is to blame, BAD whitey!

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 09:22 | 4092883 DanDaley
DanDaley's picture

Take a look at the incompetent Democrat (but I repeat myself) mayor, Ray Nagan, who left his people behind and did nothing to get them out when he could have. Hideous individual.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 10:22 | 4093026 Bendromeda Strain
Bendromeda Strain's picture

Nah - there was nothing he could have done, you rayciss

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 12:28 | 4093281 DanDaley
DanDaley's picture

Ah, funny, and sad.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:32 | 4092054 DavidPierre
DavidPierre's picture

You guys are slow to get the message.

I bugged out of Dearborn 43 years ago.

Saw it all plain as day and never went back, even to visit.

Deep in a valley of central BC is the place to be.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:58 | 4092232 W74
W74's picture

BC is on my list.  The morning I get done with court here is my last day in Maryland.  Shit is being sold off every single day or otherwise discarded.  Gona be fun.  I hear wages are (still) decent in Canada, and the only thing that concerns me are housing costs.  But I'm a cheap enough fuck (...which is exactly why housing costs piss me off) that I can live well as long as I'm working.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:15 | 4092422 prains
prains's picture

most dudes in the interior BC build their own house and stop about half-way done, it's how they do things there. If you get to building paper you've "finished" your home. Don't forget the Rotweiller and 4x4 with massive lift kit

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 13:32 | 4093448 wee-weed up
wee-weed up's picture

And prepare to freeze your ass off!

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 03:47 | 4092535 SubjectivObject
SubjectivObject's picture

I am informed that the ship building industry in the VC area will be kicking off a boomlet soon.


Sat, 10/26/2013 - 07:17 | 4092687 John Law Lives
John Law Lives's picture

I moved out of there nearly 20 years ago.  The one thing I remember most fondly about my departure was seeing the skyline of Detroit. as reflected in my car's rear view mirror, grow smaller and smaller until it vanished.  That was a good day.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 14:18 | 4093570 batterycharged
batterycharged's picture

"Damn, southeast Michigan is such a Hellhole!"


Pull out a map, dumbass. Saginaw/Flint are in the middle of the state. Inkster and Detroit are SE Mich.

Benton Harbor is another problem area, again not in SE Mich.

This is what happens when you lose jobs. Go watch Roger and Me to see the demise of the Saginaw Flint area.

The common thread? Moving auto jobs to China and Mexico.

You people here crack me up, you don't want any social welfare, then whine like a fucking bitch when crime skyrockets because people can't find jobs.

If you're going to complain about socialism, embrace the crime that results from your corporate stooges that fuck everyone over.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 14:34 | 4093609 akak
akak's picture

Flint is very much economically, politically and socially part of Southeast Michigan, and while Saginaw is geographically more toward the middle of the state, its problems are similar to those of every other large Southeastern Michigan city.

So please take your hair-splitting and shove it.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 16:18 | 4093790 batterycharged
batterycharged's picture

Yeah, Toledo is also economically tied to SE Mich. As is Lansing....

Did I mention that Pittsburgh and Philly are basically the same city?

Way to respond instead of just shutting it and realizing you're clueless.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 17:19 | 4093892 The Burning Planet
The Burning Planet's picture

Spot on.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 13:23 | 4093424 midtowng
midtowng's picture

This is just a blip in a long-term trend downward. The crime rate has been declining since the early 90's. Why demographics.

  Old people are less likely to commit crimes. Simple as that.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 13:35 | 4093454 wee-weed up
wee-weed up's picture



Emboldened feral yuts...

Obama's sons...

Holder's people...

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 21:43 | 4094225 El Tuco
El Tuco's picture

I have no idea how but I have managed to have driven through or visited at least 7 of those cities on the list. 1,2,3,6,7,8,,9. I do have to say that East St. Louis and Detroit were the worst of the lot. 

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:33 | 4092192 sgorem
sgorem's picture

everyone should do his/her part...............

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:30 | 4091887 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

I'm long German Shephards.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:39 | 4091915 GoldRulesPaperDrools
GoldRulesPaperDrools's picture

I've never seen a German Shephard that could shake off pepper spray or a load of double-ought buck.  For that matter, I haven't seen the human yet who could do either, body armor or not.

I'm long double-ought buck, 9mm and .223 with some pepper spray to boot.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:45 | 4091933 General Decline
General Decline's picture

True but the German Shepard (or any decent watchdog for that matter) can give you a 15 or 30 second "heads up" so you can get your 00 buck delivery device on time.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:48 | 4091940 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

exactly. Mine sits up in the bay window right next to the front door all day.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:43 | 4092087 johnQpublic
johnQpublic's picture

mines half lab, half shepard and loud as hell

if you put a sign up that says beware of dog you are liable if it bites someone, as you know it is a dangerous animal

my sign says dog on premises...if you are deaf and cant hear her yelling at you

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:43 | 4092209 W74
W74's picture

What the fuck liberal nanny state ordnance states that if you have a "Beware of Dog" sign that you are responsible for someone forcibly entering your property?

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:45 | 4092213 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

i am pretty sure if a guy breaks into my house and takes a beer out of my fridge and drinks it while I am sleeping and then slips and falls on my stairs on his way up to rob me I am liable.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 00:06 | 4092333 Citxmech
Citxmech's picture

In Washington - the "Beware of Dog" actually limits your exposure to liability.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 00:44 | 4092380 LawyerScum
LawyerScum's picture

Fonz, it depends on how much the damages are.  Not enough cash to be made means no liability, bountiful harvests means mucho liability.  It's all relative.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 08:20 | 4092764 GMadScientist
GMadScientist's picture

Even if they never find the body? :)

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:46 | 4091935 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

true. but when someone lines up a house as a target a guard dog is the best deterrant. They will just choose the next house. If they still decide to come in they will meet a borderline alcoholic insomniac with a 12 gauge that was waiting for them. But that's just my house.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 02:45 | 4092510 zhandax
zhandax's picture

Personally I think the borderline alcoholic insomniac with whatever is loaded walking around outside at 3 or 4 in the morning is a better deterrent, but that may only be around here.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 05:04 | 4092580 cossack55
cossack55's picture

Shit, Zhan, when did we meet?  I may have been over the booze border at the time.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 06:59 | 4092659 zhandax
zhandax's picture

I have spent time over that border in 25 of the constitutionally recognized states over the last 30 years.  Statistically speaking, the best odds are South Florida or Tennessee.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 08:22 | 4092770 GMadScientist
GMadScientist's picture

Mr. Zimmerman?

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:13 | 4091997 King_Julian
King_Julian's picture

True story: A few nights ago, my wife and I had just gone lights out. Drifting off, house alarm goes off. That is bad. Now we sleep upstairs in our home so this meant someone was downstairs. Number of burglaries in our hood lately. Alarm is blaring. I grab my Glock off the nightstand, run to the stairs and prepare to repel boarders! Wife calls the cops to let them know we are armed and staying upstairs until they arrive. Oh, I'm naked. She gets me dressed as I'm holding the stairs. Someone tried to remove a window air conditioner and tripped the alarm. He was not caught. It took hours and many ZH articles to fall back asleep after the adrenaline went down. I was covered in sweat.
I shoot for practice very often but it still scared me to death that I would have to shoot another human being. May we never have to do it. Something tells me this is only the beginning.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:14 | 4092001 jekyll island
jekyll island's picture

The first time is always the hardest.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:44 | 4092090 johnQpublic
johnQpublic's picture

depends on how surprised you are....personal experience

wasnt hard until after the fact

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 04:31 | 4092556 DelusionalGrandeur
DelusionalGrandeur's picture

....cue madonna's "like a virgin."


"Like a virgin, hey

Shot an intruder for the very first time

Like a virgin

With your heartbeat

A big flatline..."

(my early morning humorous attempt) 

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:40 | 4092203 sgorem
sgorem's picture

"but it still scared me to death that I would have to shoot another human being."  don't let those freebies pass you up King ? Julian

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 00:03 | 4092332 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

I've tangled with some nasty sorts before that I though I was going to have to shoot.  The first was gang bangers piling out of a car while I was stuck in traffic.  They saw that 357 mag come out and hauled ass back in their car.  I still never figured out what their problem was.  The cigarette burn scars on the neck of the second guy really tied the gang tats on his neck together.  I didn't give him money, so he wanted to start shit.  He had been cussing at me, then turned back to come at me and started lifting his shirt, and, while I didn't wait to find out if he was going for a weapon, that's what I thought he was doing at the time.  I was in the process of drawing to shoot him, and he stopped dead in his tracks.  He acted real brave, still cussing at me to impress his girlfriend, but his actions said that he didn't want to get shot.  I saw him driving down the road a couple of weeks later.  He wouldn't even look at me. 

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 00:36 | 4092373 nightshiftsucks
nightshiftsucks's picture

Long story short,I'm white and used to live in East San Jose.The alarm went off,the police responded and harassed my wife and I for over 30 minutes,they were also white.Some time later same area was pulled over by a black SJPD officer,treated me with nothing but respect,white aint always right.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:31 | 4092439 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Make sure 9/11 is aware that you wife tells them that her naked armed husband is downstairs.  If you have a dog, lock them up because the cops usually shoot any dogs they see.  Sick bastards.

One idea is if you are concerned about shoot someone - consider a shotgun because the rack sound usually sends them running.   Also make sure there are no family members downstairs.  Also no full metal jacket for in-house use.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 08:12 | 4092642 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

Why would you rack the shotgun, unless there wasn't a round already in the chamber? Or do you enjoy taking firearms advice from Joe Biden (which incidentally more than offsets the couple arguments that actually support such a strategy in certain circumstances).

pick your preferred firepower:

a) x+1

d) x

c) x-1

d) 0

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 23:09 | 4094387 King_Julian
King_Julian's picture

A) for $100 Alex!

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 23:12 | 4094390 geekgrrl
geekgrrl's picture

Years back I heard general Schwarzkopf (sp?) kept a 12ga next to his bed in Iraq, loaded (including a chambered shell) with the safety on. I've been doing that for years, but it does seem intuitive that if an intruder has just broken in, racking the shotgun might have the same sort of deterrent effect as a dog; as fonz said: not worth the trouble.

I'm curious about the pros and cons of this. The reason I've chosen to keep a shell in the chamber is that I'm afraid that that first rack under pressure is going to be the one that jams, and that is NOT going to be a convenient time to unjam it.

I'd be interested in different views on the topic, especially views supported by any empirical data.

Sun, 10/27/2013 - 05:51 | 4094685 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

I don't have empirical data specific to shotgun use handy and I'm not sure that I've ever seen any, but the primary shortcoming of the pro argument is actually that one has to be close enough to the target (without sound barriers which conveniently double as cover) that the intruder observes the racking of the shotgun, which would imply that the intruder is not "distracted" by barking dogs or blaring burglar alarms (for details of the math see

The strongest argument for not keeping a round in the chamber is ammunition selection, but proper tactical shotgun use would be predicated on 1) prior training and 2) being awake alert etc when the intruder enters (element of surprise).

Another significant variable to consider is one's needs during the day vs when sleeping, when for example I care less about ammunition selection as I'm not likely to be dealing with a snake, coyote, or black bear screwing with my animals or crops.

And all of that ignores whether your fireteam has one shooter or two, whether there are kids in the house, the size and layout of the house, whether you exhibit OCD with regard to firearm maintenance, and whether a shotgun is actually the preferred firearm for nocturnal home defense (I prefer a suppressed pairing of 45 & 556 with my tinfoil nightcap).

Of course, if you sleep through the breach and wake up to a gun in your face, it really makes no difference whether or not there is a round in the chamber of your firearm.

Sun, 10/27/2013 - 18:36 | 4096019 geekgrrl
geekgrrl's picture

Thanks for your thoughts. I think I'm going to look into a dog.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 21:41 | 4094237 El Tuco
El Tuco's picture


You don't have enough gold or money to buy enough pepper spray or enough shells/bullets to even begin to deal with the shit in those cities. They would eat the flesh of your bones before you could reload. Anything less than a mini gun is useless.

I would sooner go for a walk in Mogadishu than go out at night in some of these cities.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:38 | 4091909 One And Only
One And Only's picture

This trend isn't economic, it's nature. Allow me to pontificate -

At one point there was a good deal of population control. We had epic wars where millions died, we had disease that killed off good large chunks of people, and we had natural disasters.

Wars aren't trendy anymore. Vaccines prevent a lot of disease, treatment of disease is on the rise, and we have warnings for about every natural disaster imaginable (earthquakes/volcanoes still kinda unpredictable).

So we have this stupid population growth and people are a lot like rats. Throw 4 rats in a 20 foot  cage and they are going to fuck and be merry. If you now put 5,000 rats in that cage they are going to go crazy. They are gona fuckin eat themselves, fight, rape each other, and some will cower in the corner like lunatic rats. Studies have actually been done about this regarding rat populations.

Humans haven't been able to evolve at the rate of population growth we've experienced. It's quite unprecedented. We simply aren't programmed to be around as many people all the time as we currently are.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:40 | 4091920 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

Obviously, then, places like, oh, say, Tokyo, Japan, must have lots and lots of this kind of crime?

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:44 | 4091929 One And Only
One And Only's picture

Places like, oh, say, Tokyo Japan have had a society longer than say, oh, America. America is oh, I dunno 237 years old with a population of uh, I dunno 400 million. 400 million people in the span of 237 is oh kinda a rapid population growth.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:51 | 4091945 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

One and Only really nailed it, fastest growing city in the US - NY. I've got it on good authority (pulled it out my ass, just like O&O) that NY has also experienced the biggest leap in crime. So, case closed. 

Population growth is the clear culprit. 

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:06 | 4091978 One And Only
One And Only's picture

New York City doesn't have a history of ruthless violence.

James. You nailed it bro. Thanks for setting me straight. Nice to know there is still a city that is pure as a wind driven snow.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:17 | 4092010 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture


If you're talking historical, crime rose as population fell off (an indication of worsening economic conditions) and began going down as population started to rise again. 

In detroit, crime rose in almost lockstep to population contraction (again, an indication of worsening economic conditions). 

That's just a couple major US cities, worldwide there's no indicators your thesis is true either.

Crime and poverty rates have been shown to be correlated consistently for a long time. 


Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:28 | 4092174 One And Only
One And Only's picture

"In detroit, crime rose in almost lockstep to population contraction"

Uh huh. Population of which demographic rose and which one fell? One did rise quite prominently and quickly.

And crime in NYC fell after a series of NYPD procedures were enacted that were "racially discriminatory"...go figure.

...let's see how the next decade turns out. k?

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 23:17 | 4092259 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Nope, crime rates were falling in nyc before broken windows, that myth is a bunch of propaganda.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 04:34 | 4092558 One And Only
One And Only's picture

You and I will pay attention to the next decade. k?

Pay attention to it. I won't be speaking to you at that time. I'll be laughing at you though.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:38 | 4092196 W74
W74's picture

Poverty?  So West Virginia and Kentucky are high crime states?

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:43 | 4092207 sgorem
sgorem's picture


Fri, 10/25/2013 - 23:23 | 4092270 W74
W74's picture

I was trying to get him to understand that poverty/wealth do not always correlate with crime.  And I think we need to be careful here and note that we're only talking about violent crime and minor property crime.

Obviously the zyd bankers are able to steal endless sums of money, and they are not impoverished at all, and have no further need to steal...yet they do anyway out of impulse, greed, or psychopathy.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 11:18 | 4093125 Chaos_Theory
Chaos_Theory's picture

the "root cause is poverty" crowd miss very salient points.  We're not worried about a bunch of dudes robbing a bread truck.  We're talking nihilistic violence applied in conjunction with robbery for silly shit (fiat and i-junk).  If someone is about to either shoot your baby or pistol whip you because you only have $20 on your person and you don't own an iphone, does it f-king matter why that extra melanine teen is doing it?  The reality is in any urban setting a person with an IQ above room temperature damn well better have his head on a swivel and steer away from the roaming pack of ferals.  It is simply not worth the risk to give them the benefit of the doubt. 

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 23:14 | 4092253 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Yes, poverty and crime have direct correlation, endless research confirms this.

Various states / countries have found 'interesting' ways to combat this phenomenon (one telling metric is incarceration rates skyrocketing) but that's too big a can of worms to open here...

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 02:57 | 4092515 zhandax
zhandax's picture

JC, you are congenitally incapable of endorsing a solution that doesn't cost me money.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:37 | 4092445 Dingleberry
Dingleberry's picture

There is a poverty of values. And there is no cure for that except perhaps painful consequences. The great depression was far, far worse, and yet families somehow remained intact. And survived near famine conditions.

Today, poor people are generally obese. And have cable and smart phones. 

You liberals decided that morals and families had no place in society, so you destroyed them. Congrats.

Now look to your savior (uncle sam) for salvation.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 07:41 | 4092711 zhandax
zhandax's picture

DB, I could argue that because of the poverty of values, this depression is far worse than the one in the 30's but this one is not over yet.  We have yet to see the full impact (and much of the current impact is obscured thanks to plastic).

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 09:23 | 4092886 tvdog
tvdog's picture

I think the issue is inequality, not poverty per se. Inequality has been rising rapidly in the U.S. There is a lot of inequality in Latin America, and the rich have bars on the second floor windows of their houses. There is less inequality in Japan and Europe, and less crime as well - except in Britain, where again crime is rising as the rich get richer and the poor get poorer.

Sun, 10/27/2013 - 03:31 | 4094616 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

A post like yours makes one think, "Hm. Cause and effect. Cause and effect."

Post hoc ergo propter hoc is not a sound proposition of logic.

(This, mind you, from one who agrees that inequality in income is a problem.)

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:20 | 4092018 icanhasbailout
icanhasbailout's picture

> New York City doesn't have a history of ruthless violence.

Hate to end your innocence, but NYC's history is pretty bloody.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:26 | 4092037 kito
kito's picture

Bloombergs army is losing ground in the outer boroughs.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:51 | 4092107 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

when tshtf everyone will be running to Long Island.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:36 | 4092194 W74
W74's picture

THIS.  Tourists go where?  What parts do the tourists see? 

This is no different than Baltimore trying to keep the downtown area (keyword: trying) safe and secure enough for White tourists and hipster condo dwellers while ignoring the more dangerous parts of the city that don't generate as much tax revenue.

The Bronx: Hell in a handbasket.

Brooklyn and Queens: Next to auto-canabalize.

Stattan Island: I've only been to a couple bars on the north end by the ferry.  Someone fill me in on Stattan.

Manhattan: There are plenty enough seedy parts that could potentially lose it when SHTF.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 02:03 | 4092479 Freddie
Freddie's picture

San Fran is the same way.  A lot has been gentrified but there is also a lot of street crime.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 00:38 | 4092377 seabiscuit
seabiscuit's picture

Oh for fuck sake. Correlation is not causation.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 09:05 | 4092849 DanDaley
DanDaley's picture

Correlation is not causation, but for a fact, when Michelle Obama and her people moved into my neigborhood in Chicago, our house got robbed 3 times before we could move...and then had to pay extortion money (points, in Democrat-speak) just to sell the house to a black family. I usually try not to insult people on this board, but you can stick your correlation up your ass.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:32 | 4092190 W74
W74's picture

Now try that again in "per square mile".

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 01:37 | 4092446 Freddie
Freddie's picture

If you watched that weird video about Japan and sex on ZH the other day - the American guy talked a lot about and met with the Yakuza.   They have incredible power in Japan.    In the 1940s to maybe 1970s in some cities where you had a large neighborhood of Italian Mafia you had very low violent crime.   No punks robbing people in most cases.

The Yakuza are even tougher it is all managed crime.  

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:47 | 4091937 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

Lots of crime in Japan simply isn't reported or investigated in order for people/police/judicial system to save face.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 08:44 | 4092819 DanDaley
DanDaley's picture

The Japanese had hundreds of years of samurai cutting off the heads of anyone who looked at them crosseyed (or even looked at them at all without bowing) so they got rid of the vast majority of non-compliant genes, so to speak.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:19 | 4091939 Incubus
Incubus's picture

lol Pseudoscientia Obscura.

The difference between rats and people is that we have the intelligence to make observations, record them, and modify our behavior/understanding.


The problem is that we don't want to do it.


If you want a label for it, call it the "My Shit" theory.  As long as I've got my shit, or still am privvy to getting my shit, the world can go to hell in a handbasket.


History proves that "My Shit" is the leading factor in the downfall of civilizations.


Oh humans... why can't you think rationally?  We're being thrown into un-necessary conflict. 

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 22:56 | 4092224 Emergency Ward
Emergency Ward's picture


  • "....And he treated the rats like equals (which was right)....
    He loved everything and everybody in the world
    Only he never let on
    And nobody ever knowed it
    Poor Jud is dead...."
-- Rodgers and Hammerstein, Oklahoma! "Pore Jud is Daid"
Sat, 10/26/2013 - 12:05 | 4093232 Raging Debate
Raging Debate's picture

I think your onto something Incubus. Here's my take, excess creates complacency which attracts predators. Then necessity from robbery creates awareness and finally the ability to defend oneself and society at large and creation of excess resumes. It's an evolutionary dance, our species just tries to gloss over this difficult to digest fact with "society" which only gives temporary protection from another tribe of predators whatever race, class, religion.

Evolution does create refinement albeit slow however I do prefer to live now which I consider safer than even two centuries ago. Indeed, it is an exciting time for our species but fear of what must be to get there can be uncomfortable to put it gently. Try and get into your local "tribe" for amusement, protection and opportunity it is after all still about who you know for a better life and that requires some creative methods of getting around in your local area to meet folks.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 23:34 | 4092287 kadoka
kadoka's picture

Well the good news is, Monsanto is working hard to reverse this population trend. 

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:43 | 4091910 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

This doesn't make sense.  We have the good folks at NSA and the militarized police protecting and serving us, right?  Oh, protecting and serving the .01% while we all devolve into Escape from ___________ [your city].  Now I get it.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:58 | 4091965 prains
prains's picture


Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:20 | 4091995 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

I have some good friends on the Cape (East Sandwich).  Nantucket's a good place to hide in the coming shit storm.  Where I am (Clearwater, Florida), not so much.  But I own a business here so that's why I drink.*

*edit -- among other reasons.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:40 | 4091913 Running On Bing...
Running On Bingo Fuel's picture

"80,000 pounds of walnuts worth $300,000 in California, $200,000 of Muenster cheese in Wisconsin, rib-eye steaks valued at $82,000 in Texas, 25,000 pounds of king crab worth $400,000 in California."

Theft of business inventory, equipment is a tax write off. I'm not trying to imply inside jobs because we know those king crabs have serial numbers.


Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:43 | 4091927 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

Man. All my criminal friends just jack cheap consumer electronics. Gotta be great going to these guys' homes for dinner. "Hey, want another steak? How 'bout some more crab?"

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:41 | 4091922 ArrestBobRubin
ArrestBobRubin's picture

More guns, less crime. At least when legal owners are packing, not just the Evil-Doers (h/t Dubya) 

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 21:45 | 4092091 MisterMousePotato
MisterMousePotato's picture

Think credit goes to Tom (?) Lott (?) for that one.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:44 | 4091930 hmmmstrange
hmmmstrange's picture

I blame global warming.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:59 | 4091966 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

I blame rodeo clowns.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 02:01 | 4092478 squexx
squexx's picture

I blame the Satanic Tribe!

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 09:15 | 4092870 tvdog
tvdog's picture

The entertainment industry (owned and run by the Cheesepope Tribe) is a big part of the social decay you see around you.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 07:07 | 4092676 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

Don't forget monkeys with grenades!

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:45 | 4091931 Henry Hub
Henry Hub's picture

I wonder how many cases we will see of armed robbers killing their victims and claiming their innocence under the "Stand Your Ground" law. I know the NSA likes to portray everything as good guys killing bad guys, but some time everything isn't that clear. We're looking at a new "wild west" situation in this country.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:55 | 4091954 akak
akak's picture

An armed robber, regardless of the level of force he might use against his victim, or regardless of the level of force used against him,  is not "standing his ground" by virtue of his invasive entry into or onto somebody else's property.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 08:10 | 4092743 Henry Hub
Henry Hub's picture

That would be true in your home or on your property. But out on the street, dead men tell no tales. The mugger can claim, if caught, that he was just "standing his ground."

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 09:42 | 4092931 DanDaley
DanDaley's picture

Which is why these people want to get rid of the idea of private property, so if everywhere is public, you have nothing that you are allowed to defend. Kind of like the UK where you are not allowed to defend yourself against intruders in your own get charged for doing violence to them...unless you're cockney...nobody fucks with them.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:53 | 4091942 LeisureSmith
LeisureSmith's picture

I'm tempted to quote Gerald Celente but i won't.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:51 | 4091947 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

What? There is bad stuff happening out there? The teevee didn't tell me this so I don't believe it. The teevee tells me that life is grand and that if I take this pill, and somehow manage not to die from it's side effects, that I will look like Brad Pitt and fuck like Dirk Diggler.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:53 | 4091951 Make_Mine_A_Double
Make_Mine_A_Double's picture

Crime has been either up or constant for years.

The 'decrease' was just the cops and Feds reclassifying what used to be considered violent strong arm crime as lesser charges.

But it will get freaky once the EBT don't function.

Sat, 10/26/2013 - 11:24 | 4093146 Dewey Cheatum Howe
Dewey Cheatum Howe's picture

The cops around here big time play games with how they write up paperwork to cook the statistics so the politicians and political appointe heads can yammer how safe things are. They misclassify violent crime all the time as something else or if it is minor enough they don't even bother with the paperwork unless they go nothing better to do and want to take a break from their patrol.

Fri, 10/25/2013 - 20:58 | 4091964 Quantum Nucleonics
Quantum Nucleonics's picture

A big part of the increase in crime is drug related.  With the bad economy, large groups of people are using drugs to check out of reality.

"Who robs a house at 8am in the morning?" - A strung out meth addict looking for something to hock so they can get high.


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