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Bitcoin Trades Over $1000 On BTC China Exchange And Crashes 30% ... Then Rebounds
Update: following the 30% drop to under $600 in seconds, BTC promptly rebounded to $800 in a few more seconds, as the entire BTC market is now just an algo arena.
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Putting to rest fears that today's Senatorial hearing on digital currencies would crater Bitcoin (if in the immediate term), moments ago the digital currency priced in USD on the Mt Gox exchange, rose to yet another unpredecented price, hitting $850 moments ago, or about 50% higher than where it was this morning.
But you ain't seen nothing yet.
Because at the same time, the Renminbi-denominated price of Bitcoin on BTC China, has the digital currency at 6780CNY. At a USDCNY exchange rate of 6.09, this means a price over $1100 per Bitcoin.
And as the two day chart shows, somehow while Bitcoin rose 50% in 2 days, it has doubled on the Chinese exchange.
Naturally, at this point we would suggest picking up the 20%+ free arb, however it is unclear how one can short the CNY priced leg of the transaction, or if for that matter, there is even an actual, liquid market in the currency.
And as if to prove BTC just head us, as the final chart shows, taken literally moments before we were going to post this article, BitCoin touched $900 on Mt Gox... and promptly tanked to just under $600, entering a bear market in the span of seconds on what appears to be about 10,000 trades.
And a better chart of the tumble which sent BTC lower by 33% from $900 to $600 in seconds:
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If they are using them? Are you watching this? It's absolutely amazing. Price going and down hundreds of dollars in a blink of eye (600 to 800).
Regulated markets? LOL...yeah, sure.
Algos?? Written in Amsterdam in 1636 maybe.
If there's a market, Goldman's rigging it.
I'm currently running a program called bitcoin-qt. It's not having a good time trying to re-sync to the blockchain right now. The number of blocks is see-sawing like mad!
Funny thing is:
If you download the source code from bitcoin.org and compile it yourself the size of the executable is much smaller than the precompiled binary offered from their website.
http://bitcoin.org/en/download
Monkey business. Beware.
Over.
Go figure...
We might have to solve some problems.
And as it goes, in spite of Bitcoin.
Read it and weep.
"Man up" comes to mind.
"I am here!"
"for fuck's sake man!"
This is pathetic.
man up indeed.. yes the spark to awaken everyone that fiat is a scam is not too far away..
Lol, that is funny. Fiat and the bitCon are valued on the same thing.
CONfidence.
Over.
wtfs.
Can bitcoin be used to buy tulip bubs?
Yes. I have 3 tulip bulbs (genuine bought in Amsterdam blood-reds) that you can have.
Send me 0.02 btc and they are yours.
1LjH6qL76MJ3PNBgxmFeXiUr43sdyCaey1
Cheers.
Bitcoin will survive for as long as JP Morgan et al can figure a way to manipulate the price up and down for their own gain.
What backs this Bitcoin? Nothing!
Even I know that. The utility of a common ledger for transactions. The concept and usefulness of a bitcoin give it value. Same as gold.
Same thing as fiat, no?
Over.
the pope know faith and fiat. there is no decree in btc.
BTC is Backed by Liberty and Courage!!!
indeed! +1
the same type of free-wheeling bravado at custer's last stand.
The exact same thing that backs gold. If you would bother thinking for yourself you might figure it out one day.
except that gold can be used for things? some (like myself) may argue we haven't even maximized its physical potentional?
We haven't maximized Bitcoin's full potential either: multi-signature contracts, escrow, smart keys, colored coins (stocks and bonds on the bitcoin protocol), etc.
How about the ability to transact freely with the other 7 billion people on the planet without paying 4-6% to Visa/MC or paying Western Union or a $50 wire fee to the banks.
That, my friend, is worth trillions.
And that is ultimately why it will fail.
I back it, and millions more like me and growing. It's money because we say its money and because its money it has intrinsic value. 101 of money and so many ZH'ers don't understand it. Imagine what this thing will be worth when the daily unthinking masses discover its monetary utility.
Question:
Is volatility in a Bitcoin like vehicle symmetrical?
IE, if you wanted to play with it would it be easier to do so by buying or selling?
When you think about it, the amount of fiat to spend to achieve this is basically minimal and I would think, less than selling.
Plus if you are bent on introducing volatility in a thingie, buying on the way up and selling at the retrenchment would be a way to do so.
My experience has been the slope on selling is much steeper than on buying. The kast $300 of the ramp up tonight happened over about 30 mintes, with the last $200 in 15 minutes. The $300 drop happened in about 10 minutes.
Good point, But selling now would be more important than selling two weeks ago... Even one week ago... Even one or two days ago....
I guess it is just my conspiracy theorist side.
Buy The Collapse
I recieved a nice cheque in the mail today. I'm going to visit the Store and BTFDAu. Maybe BTFDAg.
Those China Men traded their constantly diluted dollars for worthless bits. Maybe the phyzz is getting hard to find there?
Stack On
Feeling like my gold is an ancient relic. They finally found the finite item that is virtual. This will appeal to those who like online gambling and people who have their heads stuck in virtual words. The thing I don't trust is if it is hacked, a virus is developed, whether trojans can spy on your keystrokes and steal keys or if other sites start up with their own form of bit coin. Your wealh would vapourise in milliseconds. Volume is the other concern if you deal with big lots, liquidity issues will arise as the price rises. As there is nothing to value it, other than the market,it has the potential to see many zeros behind a number. I remain open-minded, by then it's too scary to join the party. Good luck to those ZHers who dare(d).
History rhymes or we would just be in an endless stasis
Stackers you are on a VIRTUAL GOSSIP FENCE yet you act like everything else in life should be stuck in the 1800's
there is something about BTC that i just don't trust my diminished income to.
but my gut has been wrong before.
Like the feeling you might have got when bankers started offering to keep your gold safe for you and give you a paper receipt for it?
A slightly queasy "somthing just isn't right" about this, but I don't know what kind of feeling.
You are not alone...
Thanks Razzle! It is pretty stressful/scary out there in the BTC exchange land! I have already cashed and withdrawn 3 times what I invested originally (last purchade was some btc @$69 a month or so ago). I have also been vacuuming up Litecoins this last few months and I am now sitting on a (paid for in one trade yesterday) stack o them. I have been day (and night) trading them and putting the profits into bitcoins.
Example:
I bought some Litecoins yesterday morning at $4.59, sold 4hrs later at $7.40 then bought back at lunchtime at $6.94..... so when I left for home I set a silly $8.86 sell out incase of an unlikely pop on my 45 mins way home. Got home and it had already sold them!!! I quickly logged in and bought the following dip at $8.44 (it dipped to $5.50 an hour later doh!!!!) I then fell asleep on the couch after a celebratory GnT and woke up to $9.97!!! Mental stuff!!!! Cheers!
Bitcoin tanks all the way back to . . . what it was an hour ago.
I tell you, I'm starting to sweat here. /s
Got rich off of Bitcoin? Good. Now get to work rebuilding health care, education, infrastructure, and the 1000 other failures in the real economy.
http://www.fakenation.info/please/beauty-not-bitcoin-will-save-the-world
I was actually just planning on becoming some eccentric chav and maybe getting my stuff back from the pawn shop too.
People keep talking about losing power = losing bitcoin? If power disappears in an apocalyptic fashion, you need not worry about your gold and silver. You better hope for guns, ammo, and food at that point. The urban nanny colonies will quickly spill into suburbia, as far as a tank of gas will get em.
Which is why I'm looking to get farther than a tank of gas from the nearest hive colony of Life's Failures.
there are larger forces at play than i am, for sure.
It's more likely that Chinese are in a Dollar panic than in a Bitcoin mania.
Takes some pretty big balls to criticize those folks who are currently cleaning up.
Most everybody here wears big boy pants.
Try to keep up
Yeah, correct answer.
Can't blame people for being happy when they win.
Not my cup of tea, I like boring investments that gather dust, but good on you bitcoiners, I hope you make winning trades.
Realtime qutoes Bitcoin
High 900 Low 530
http://btcpost.net/index.php
Free Bitcoin!!! lol did FOFOA have any BTC?
this will end in tears [for some]
IF Bitcoin does not have a major correction or stop increasing any time soon serious questions will start being asked of Gold.
There is a limited supply of both, yet they are moving in opposite directions based on the same economic environment and data.
Is Bitcoin in a bubble?
-or-
Is it purely the case Bitcoin is a freely traded market (at the moment) and gold is not.
Why not both? Freely traded markets can blow bubbles, too, and it sure looks like the monkey-hammer is getting applied to gold (and silver) on a regular basis.
But, whatever. I got tall stacks of shiny, and feeling good even though it is way off their highs. If someone is making their ends off of this BTC madness, congrats!
Possibly both.
But when I read things like ' The Department of Homeland Security referred to Bitcoin as an emerging threat ' I tend to think one more than the other.
The U.S will try to regulate BTC and gain a level of control over it, it's inevitable.
Lets put it this way, if 30% of the worlds population started using bitcoin.
There would be no governments left.
The transactions Peer to Peer are more or less anonymous, one could perform work, get paid in BTC and go along his merry way.
No income Tax
No socialism security Tax
No Insurance Tax
No Obama Phone Tax
No Capital Gains Tax
How can you tax, what you can not track?
Governments would fall apart because they rely upon
1) The ability to print and spend the money of the society they are leaching off of.
2) The ability to borrow and spend the money of the society they are leaching off of.
3) The ability to tax and steal and spend the money of the society they are leaching off of.
Without those 3 things, government can't exist unless it provides a service people are willing to pay for without threat of force, thats why I think the government is buying up all the guns, bullets, and tanks and oil it can............to wage war against a free society.
A cashless society is a government free society, pure democratic anarchy, pure free market.
I can't think of anything more exciting or dangerous to tell you the truth, because its never been tried before.
Internet Kill Switch is there though, the government would flip it before they let bitcoin threaten them.
Without the internet bitcoin would crumble.
My salary is paid 100% in bitcoin and I approve this message.
Hilarious. And the USB Asic Miner I bought off Amazon for 20 bucks 3 weeks ago is now going for $40. --. I should have invested in ASIC USB sticks, instead of BTC.
The people who made a fortune off the Alaskan Gold Rush weren't the suckers who thought they were going to strike it rich--it was the retailers selling them overpriced equipment in Seattle.
I still have a couple handfulls of those hashing away .. cool little gizmos
like sheep being led to slaughter.
Bitcoin is volatile in an ascending fashion. Look at the price of Bitcoin on a 7-day average log scale:
http://blockchain.info/charts/market-price?showDataPoints=false×pan...
Note the jump to the 4th degree of the scale a year and half into Bitcoin's existence, straight up the wall. This defines Bitcoin's true curve: straight up the wall. It's taken another three years for Bitcoin to traverse the next four degrees. The next four degrees will take 4-6 years, putting 1 bitcoin somewhere in the $1-10 million range.
Bitcoin crashes up for awhile and then takes a slight breather downward before crashing up some more. Adoption is fueling the price and volatility. This is just the beginning. As Bitcoin rises in adoption worldwide and also rises in value, it will attract further attention. At some point, critical mass will be achieved. Bitcoin's true genius is its understanding of one human constant: simple greed.
I'm actually surprised by the quick run-up. I didn't expect anywhere to break $1k for another month or two.
haha
$1 - $10 million?!
dude, seriously. what strain are you smoking?
Btc is showing faint free market volatility on its march to $1m usd to 1btc.
You didn't think the Chinese were going to let the Briber Jamie Dimon control the BitCoin market did you.
Shit now what do I do. I'm getting scared. Looks like the revolution has just been funded.
Damn I liked being able to say up my fasfa yellen mutha fukka. Look out Harvard here come the Q99X2.
Got hundreds of em running around in my head right now.
uh uh Moe Larry the hunch the hunch.
Better Now.
Well I went through the annoying routine.... and now apparently mining bitcoins, though probably at a loss, since my power consumption and wear and tear on CPU and GPU and other heat assisted wear and tear will add up to more than I make.... Unless bitcoin goes to $10,000
Got this Wallet thing which is a bit opaque to me....a and somehow it relates to my mining application... though the naming conventions don't make it obvious to anybody but the orginal nerds...who probaby revel in it all.
Reminds me years ago when I was setting up Linux for the first time... super annoying Linux nerds hyper arrogant in their little world, telling everybody its the greatest thing, but making sure their behaviour drove everybody away.
Yeah, I had a guy try to sell me on investing 5 grand into his mining group.
I just figured it to be an arms race, and sorta figured it would never pay off it's infrastructure outlay.
Like, by the time your machines start paying, the next gen is pre ordered and you get fucked.
Dunno though, I'm terrible at math.
If you are mining with a gimp rig, chances are you will discover nothing that will ever recuperate the power costs.
As EuroAmerican banks put more strictures on bank-to-bitcoin transactions, buying PMs with bitcoins will increasingly be a way for people to cash out when they're locked out of exchanges.
All holders of PMs (caveat: includes me) should be hoping Bitcoin succeeds. It will increase demand for PMs. Increasing PM value and increasing Bitcoin value means that much more money power is taken from the likes of Lloyd, Jamie, Ben and Janet. Large holders of PMs should trade out a portion of their PMs for bitcoin if they want the value of PMs to have a better chance of rising in the future.
BTC will never replace anything, it's FAR FAR too unstable.
How can you base an economy on something that rises and falls 20-30% day after day?
I see now that some people are being allowed to trade it on margin? In that case we will see a lot more of these brokers "risk management" algos crashing the market and margining everyone out at the nadir.
Doesn't matter what the asset is, if you can trade it and an electronic exchange exists then the algo's will turn up and manipulate it.
What better asset for the algo's to manipulate than an illiquid market with mass media attention and zero regulation.
The dollar would fall 99% in one day if the US government and the Fed were not constantly in the markets expending massive resources and effort to maintain the status quo. And now it is falling 99% vs the thing they are unable to influence.
Aye, silver would go the same way were we to know that the naked shorting had been banned and the ban enforced.
Anyhow the fluctuations in BitCoin are no different than a stock with a low float. What matters is how much of your portfolio is in BitCoin
I wonder what happens to a crypto currency dependent on the network peers if, say, a govenment blocked those packets. Truly a popcorn moment.
ssh tunnel to an out-of-country server
There is going to be no gold left anywhere once bitcoin starts sucking all the air out of the room.
You know, those exchanges are pretty much closed systems on an individual basis. Only so many USD actually went into them. As the price risies, without new buyers, there is only so much money that can be pulled out of each exchange. I am not going to crap on someone else's "not dollars" but if you are in it for a trading profit, only the first guy out is going to get anything. I can see these exchanges actually folding on a single big redemption. Maybe I am looking at it wrong. I don't know if I am missing something. But money has to be put into this system before it can be pulled out. If you are just buying to have bitcoin forever on a USB, it doesn't matter to you. But if you are trading, the exchanges gets dangerous the higher bitcoin goes.
All these prices up and down are made on what volumes?
The limiting factor could be the number of decimal places on a vendors calculator.
I'll put an imaginary value on BTC,
Lets see, 1BTC = $263,761.06
An Ipad is worth $475
That'll be....BTC 0.00180087235015
Of course tomorrow, well who knows?
Bitcoin is divisible into 100,000,000 pieces, so that sum is actually quite a bit larger than the smallest quantum.
max eight decimals ..
I don't know about you,but it makes me feel uncomfortable the fact that Governments didn't make a move against Bit-coin,as they should have had if they feared it,but instead are giving it legitimacy and support. Draw your own conclusions if you must,but personally i don't trust virtual currencies any more than i trust fiat.
Bitcoin=Pet rock.
Is Bitcoin the illusive trillion dollar coin discussed over the last few years?
Let's keep an OPEN MIND here people. Let's look at it in the Right frame of MIND. I totally agree that BitCoin is actually NOTHING. But what is anything else Today? With the exception of PHYSICAL Gold & Silver? You guessed it, NOTHING but perception and CONfidence. But IF one would take a closer LOOK you will see that BitCoin is LIMITED and SCARCE as compared to other Currencies. There can ONLY be 19,999,999 EVER mined as compared to the other so called FIAT Currencies that are INFINITE. And when you have 7 BILLION People on this Planet and a LIMITED supply of anything that can ONLY be MANIPULATED to a certain extent, yes BitCoin is being Manipulated but they can only do so much far so long. The FIRST try by the Central Bankers took BitCoin from $266 US to $60 US, OUCH, so this latest take down while the US were having Senate hearing were so like the Gold and Silver take downs when the FED and FOMC speaks. But the % was much smaller 35%. And in time every Central Banker along with every Financial Institution is wanting a piece of the PIE just in case, and when you have a "Just in Case" with only 19,999,999 and 7 Billion People / Customers, in time you will have to PAY much more when that light finally turns on in that mind of yours on what is actually happening. ALL I can say is that EVERYONE should DIVERSIFY and BUY ONE!
YOU WILL BE HAPPY THAT YOU DID!
A Bit-coin,unlike commodities but more like fiat currencies,is created by your computer.It is comprised of zero's and one's so the rules and protocol of its creation can change at any moment in order to produce more.That cannot happen with precious metals,because their quantity is determined by nature and not humans.In other words precious metals are human independent.A Bit-coin is not backed by anything tangible,much like fiat,not even the obligation that taxes be collected in that form.Now as i stated in a previous comment,i am very skeptical of the fact that Governments actually support Bitcoin and give it Legitimacy.In my view although virtual currencies are the trend of the future,they cannot and will not serve the people.And something else,it is not scarcity alone but human labour as well that gives value to a thing,as long as that thing serves a specific human need.Gold takes a lot of time, specialized human and non human labour to produce and does not decay over time,unlike a house that has value but gradually looses it due to decay.Therefore precious metals serve the need for a portable,divisible,durable,reliable store of value and labour.
Bitcoin rises above S&P.
Bitcoin takes out Dow.
US budget deficit drops to 2 Bits.
US GDP rises to 3 bytes.
It all makes perfect cents to me.
US Treasury to 'print' Bitcoin and give it to the Fed.
All debt problems solved!
;-)
esay come easy go ...
When "paper" BTC is created via an ETF, same manipulation as with GLD and SLV vs. physical will occur. Meanwhile a pair trade of long BTC: short Visa and MC might be highly profitable.
The ironic thing is that Bitcoin was designed by NSA. The actual NSA researcher was Tatsuaki Okamoto, which to some is suspiciously close to Bitcoin's mysterious Satoshi Nakamoto. http://thebitcoinnews.co.uk/2013/06/17/the-bitcoin-created-by-the-nsa-tatsuaki-okamoto-is-satoshi-nakamoto/. And here is an NSA paper from 1996 describing a digital currency based on the same elements as Bitcoin: http://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/classes/6.805/articles/money/nsamint/nsamint.htm. Not clear that NSA actually implemented it, though.
Even more ironic: Bitcoin allows perfect tracking of all transactions, forever, as a security feature. From the Bitcoin wiki:
"The block chain assures that not only is every single transaction that ever takes place recorded, but that every single transaction is recorded on the computer of anyone who chooses to store the relevant information. Many, many users have complete records of every transaction in Bitcoins history readily available to them at any point, and anyone who wants in [sic] the information can obtain it with ease. These things make Bitcoin very hard to fool."
Since all transactions are recorded and posted, any organization that maintains a time map of IP addresses, locations, entities, and also has access to all other banking records (all mediated by the Federal Reserve or its components) can almost certainly completely reconstruct any transaction trail, and definitely so for larger transactions that cannot be easily "mixed". LOL
Still not understanding how a crypto-based video-game currency has any real value in any sense whatsoever. Traders have simply gone mad.
My suspicions may not be yet fully confirmed but evidence is re-enforcing them. Now I read that the bernank has composed a letter to our illustrious senators supporting the idea of electronic currency such as Bitcoin but regulated as such through a banking entity.
And therein lies the problem, Bitcoin co-opted. Who among Bitcoin supporters can with their straightest Obama lying ass face say the system will not become what it is presently not? A cashless entity of the global banking cabal.
Nowhere have I read who is behind Bitcoin, until then and proven, I must suspect the TPTB responsible for it's creation as a remedy for a TPTB created problem.