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Chicago Vs. Houston (In 4 Charts)

Tyler Durden's picture


Perhaps not so United States? can 2 of the nation's favorite cities be so painfully different?


(h/t @Not_Jim_Cramer)


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Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:19 | 4242187 Capitalist
Capitalist's picture

Texas should secede from the union. 

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:58 | 4242226 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture can 2 of the nation's favorite cities be so painfully different?

Lawmaking isn't necessarily a full-time job in Texas.

The Legislature of the State of Texas, operating under the biennial
, convenes its regular sessions at noon on the second Tuesday
in January of odd-numbered years. The maximum duration of a regular
session is 140 days

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:01 | 4242312 ACP
ACP's picture

Very good point. That will have to be in the New Improved Constitution, which will have to be changed to prevent the mistakes allowed by the current one.

That will have to be added along with a hard limit of the number of government employees and taxes anywhere in the country, elimination of benefits for doing nothing, the ability of any citizen to prosecute any government employee in court, as well as a bevy of other "corrections."

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:21 | 4242343 Ag Tex
Ag Tex's picture

Also, many Texans are believers in Christ and love, seek and fear the Lord God Almighty. We all need Him now, more than ever.


This world is moving into some very troubling times, the likes of which it has never seen before.  God will take delight in being your refuge.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:59 | 4242470 Tijuana Donkey Show
Tijuana Donkey Show's picture

That's cool and all, but can you leave the others alone? 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:30 | 4242913 Zadok
Zadok's picture

Well, if you are a libertarian, you are aligned to the ideological principals of the King of Kings.

Gal 5:13 For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another.
Gal 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

The character of God IS liberty.

Thank You Lord.

Best wishes with your decisions.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 09:30 | 4243012 yrbmegr
yrbmegr's picture

Most libertarians fail here:  "only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh".

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 09:41 | 4243035 I am more equal...
I am more equal than others's picture





There is Chicago style pizza (ummmm good), Chicago style beating (1 victim multiple people beating the victim), now there is ChicaGo - and never come back.

Then there is Texass. 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 10:09 | 4243096 Keyser
Keyser's picture

As a resident of Houston I can atest to the quality of life and low cost of living. I'm not from Texas and didn't get here as fast as I could, but after 20+ years of working in every major market in the US and around the world, I would up here a few years ago for work and decided to stay. Chicago, you can have the place as far as I'm concerned. Try finding authentic TexMex in Chicago. 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 12:05 | 4243446 lasvegaspersona
lasvegaspersona's picture


how do you know about 'most libertarians'?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 07:22 | 4242847 greatbeard
greatbeard's picture

>> the Lord God Almighty

Which particular cult do you prefer?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 07:40 | 4242865 new game
new game's picture

Disclaimer for many comments that follow:

Please use the comments to demonstrate your own ignorance, unfamiliarity with empirical data and lack of respect for scientific knowledge. Be sure to create straw men and argue against things I have neither said nor implied. If you could repeat previously discredited memes or steer the conversation into irrelevant, off topic discussions, it would be appreciated. Lastly, kindly forgo all civility in your discourse . . . you are, after all, anonymous.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:04 | 4242887 General Decline
General Decline's picture

well done, sir

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 10:55 | 4243200 Lmo Mutton
Lmo Mutton's picture

"Also, many Texans are believers in Christ and love, seek and fear the Lord God Almighty."

This needs an Amen brother to go along with all those up arrows.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 12:38 | 4243576 Crash Overide
Crash Overide's picture

IMO god or christ has nothing to do with all this or they would of stepped in tossing lightning bolts at bankers and politicians a long time ago. This is our hell on earth shit show and we have to go it alone.

God setup the game, we have to finish it. Not trying to start a religious fight or anything I am just saying...

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 15:58 | 4244306 Ag Tex
Ag Tex's picture

"God setup the game, we have to finish it.  Not trying to start a religious fight or anything I am just saying..."


I know you are not trying to start anything.  You want the truth.  Let me clarify thoroughly.  Satan set up the game, and Jesus Christ will finish it.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 11:18 | 4243298 thunderkiss
thunderkiss's picture

Yeah many Texans are believers but this has nothing to do with preferential treatment from God.  Although this Texan thinks God should love us more, I don't think he does.  These stats are only a reflection of the results from 2 very different political beliefs.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:04 | 4242495 brettd
brettd's picture

It doesn't matter what document you produce if it's ignored.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:11 | 4242347 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

So they work more than the U.S. Congress?

When they are not passing laws written by oil companies, insurance companies, and bankers, they are raising funds from said companies.  As in Texas.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:59 | 4242475 Tijuana Donkey Show
Tijuana Donkey Show's picture

To be clear, the companies write the laws, and they just pass it. It's the true definiton of an asshole, I never see what I take in, just what I shit out. I call this the Nancy Pelosi theory. 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:32 | 4242915 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

You have to shit it to know what's in it.

And lo and behold, it's shit.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:46 | 4242432 yrad
yrad's picture

4th generation Texan here. Born in Houston. I hope to die here, but I got out of Houston as soon as I could. Houston is slowly losing the battle of the "brown wave." I would like to see the above graph in ten years after Houston has been officially over run. The City Councel looks like a group picture from a third world nation and they love free shit.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:19 | 4242515 salvadordaly
salvadordaly's picture

Been in the Houston "area" all my life. 45 years now (born as well). "IF" things keep progressing the way they are, it will be another Chi Town before to long. Lots of blue people moving in from other states for the work that is here. Will not take to long before they will try and push the same agenda that ruined their state and forced them to move here. YOU CANT FIX STUPID!!! I make it a point to "check" all my new neighbors and make sure they understand why they have chosen this state to relocate. I do not have one bit of reserve about it at all! Do not come to my "HOOD" and run it like the one you ran away from!

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:29 | 4242529 salvadordaly
salvadordaly's picture

Oh and by the way, I have my CHL license and walk around with a Springfield XDS .45 strapped to my side every where I go. I have had not a nare problem yet. Imagine that you fucking anti gun suck asses!

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 10:13 | 4243105 Keyser
Keyser's picture

I run into transplants from blue states all the time in Houston and take great pleasure in welcoming them to the great state of Texas, and in the next breath tell them to leave their liberal agendas where they came from as we don't cotton to those notions in Texas. You should see the look on their faces. Priceless!!!!

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:31 | 4242533 e_goldstein
e_goldstein's picture

Been to the Heights recently?
It's starting to resemble Stepford. 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 05:35 | 4242759 vato poco
vato poco's picture

I saw the gentrification of the Heights coming 30 years ago. Unfortunately, was too young & broke to do anything about it. Older now, slightly richer too. I read about the soaring land values of the Heights, & West U, & the Museum/Rice area, etc. But I never hear squat about Montrose - the (formerly?) scuzzy part, not the high-end areas near the museum. (and no, I wasn't a Montrosian, if you know what I mean). I'm pretty sure the 4th ward will be the absolute *last* to gentrify - but how's (formerly?) scummy Montrose doing? It'd be nice to buy into a chunk of 'Stepford' before it becomes 'Stepford', no?

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 03:14 | 4246048 e_goldstein
e_goldstein's picture

Montrose is in a gentrification process as well. Property values have skyrocketed, and it's a lot less seedy than it used to be. I worked at the MFAH a few years back and watched as the whole neighborhood changed from gay party central, to settled down gay couples, to upper income straight couples. Now, it's pretty much just another cookie-cutter inner loop neighborhood with bad traffic and no character.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:36 | 4242536 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

All successful cities, states, and countries eventually
succumb to being undermined by the foragers of the world.

Success always attracts those who are not capable of achieving what is currently being done.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 06:47 | 4242809 Kobe Beef
Kobe Beef's picture

If you build it, they will come..

and fuck it all up.

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 16:50 | 4246918 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture


All throughout history.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 09:46 | 4243057 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

All efficient systems attract parasites. It is a law of nature.

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 16:53 | 4246923 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Especially the biggest of all parasites: government.

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 16:56 | 4246924 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture


Sat, 12/14/2013 - 16:53 | 4246925 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture


Fri, 12/13/2013 - 03:23 | 4242658 Manthong
Manthong's picture

That Houston homicide bar would probably be a lot lower if not for Katrina.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 10:16 | 4243109 Keyser
Keyser's picture

Yep, the crime rate doubled in Houston right after Katrina. 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 11:38 | 4243357 Stoploss
Stoploss's picture

Fucking Bill White..

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 12:08 | 4243462 MarsInScorpio
MarsInScorpio's picture

Bill thought he was going to suck down a ton of emergency federal aid, then ship the refugees back to NOLA.


Surprise! The feds bought one-way tickets to Houston. There was never any intention whatsoever to return those people to NOLA.


It's not an accident that Katrina was used as a means to de-colorize NOLA.


You can't show me one city, state, or nation, run by "people of color" that does not degenerate into a cesspool of crime and violence - and is throughly looted by it's new masters.


Check out this assertion in NYC with Dinkins, or Detroit, or NOLA . . . or the US under the current administration.


Fri, 12/13/2013 - 06:09 | 4242782 new game
new game's picture

truely reflects the mindset of two differenttypes of human beings.

-do gooder humans that ruin others by not holding them accountable for their actions-free shit army mentality.


mindset of most zh ers.


texas like nevada is getting polluted by libtard thinking. they arrive from NY and cali for a better life-lol.

the true civil war being waged is one of values...

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 09:42 | 4243040 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

Joe Soucheray had the great idea of having state legislatures add laws on odd years and eliminate laws on even years.

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:58 | 4242306 frankTHE COIN
frankTHE COIN's picture

It's written in their Affluenza Bill of Rights.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 10:59 | 4243214 tempo
tempo's picture


Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:21 | 4242189 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Houston has oil revenue.  It will be a boom until it's a bust.  Chicago has financials.  It will be a boom until it's a bust.  Same shit, different bullshit.

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:27 | 4242209 CCanuck
CCanuck's picture

How do the Gun Stores, and Homicide rates factor in to Boom/Bust?


Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:32 | 4242224 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

There is plentiful middle class employment in Houston due to the oil boom, thus less poverty, thus less crime.  I am a firm believer in the 2nd, but it has nothing to do with this equation as much as it appeals to small minds to say otherwise.  

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:49 | 4242287 CCanuck
CCanuck's picture

Could it be the lack of Gun stores that make Chicago a Bigger Shit-Hole, regardless of the amount of middleclass, or lowerclass, or any class?

Way more Cocksuck'n Fuck'n Criminals in the upper classes per capita What does class have to do with homicide rate?


Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:56 | 4242296 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

I agree that people should be able to defend themselves with guns, including whatever cool ass machine gun one wants to buy.  But I disagree with cause and effect in this instance.  Chicago is a shithole because there is a huge underclass living alongside an in-your-face financial class of great wealth. 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:04 | 4242334 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture



Chicago is a shithole because there is a huge underclass living alongside an in-your-face financial class of great wealth.

Same here in Houston, if not more so, because we don't have zoning like Chicago.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:46 | 4242440 knukles
knukles's picture

I didn't think twice about buying that cheapo McMansion right between the gas station and the gay nightclub.
Thought the gas station would be a bad influence on the kids

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:41 | 4242539 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Naw, they took the lead out of the gas.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 06:31 | 4242793 SunRise
SunRise's picture

What did they do with the lead?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:23 | 4242906 General Decline
General Decline's picture

turned it into 450 mil rounds of .40 cal HP

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:29 | 4242914 BandGap
BandGap's picture

Zoning? Are you kidding? You don't zone based on "rich" or "poor". There are plenty of locations where they neighborhoods change within a few steps in Chicago. Wilson Avenue in Chicago is a great example. One side of the street is skid row, the other has two story brownstones starting in the low 300s. There are whole neighborhoods on the south side that go from utter crap to middle class the same way.

The disparity of wealth is everywhere. Chicago has gone to hell in a handbasket in 40 years. The Daley Machine has finally run out.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:09 | 4242339 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

"I agree people should be able to defend themselves, but....." 

With all due respect, fuck you and your but, Counselor Lola.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:13 | 4242353 CCanuck
CCanuck's picture


Chicago's homicide and crime rate would drop like a stone if you could own and carry a firearm there. That huge underclass you talk about are the victims, if they were allowed to defend themselves against the armed middle/upper class criminals; well then...

I have seen lots o shit holes in Texas, lots of poverty there too. The difference criminals know all classes can carry in Texas. 

If you can't see the cause and effect there, then...... then.......oh nevermind....


Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:23 | 4242363 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

First, I favor free gun ownership for all.  Second, most of the murders in Chicago are gang related (both sides have guns).   Understanding that I don't disagree with your basic premise about gun ownership (let everyone have guns), please show me the murder statistics involving unarmed persons who were killed versus armed that would support your basic premise about the cause of murders in Chicago.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:35 | 4242413 CCanuck
CCanuck's picture

A armed society, is a polite society.

Gangs...with guns...selling drugs...supplied by who?

Gangs..with guns..selling drugs...policed by who?

What is your problem with seeing the most obvious cause and effect?

Or perhaps you like gett'n slapped around the thread????  Fight Club eh???


Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:53 | 4242564 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

The solution is to permanently expel criminals from society.

One chance, then you don't enjoy the benefits of civilization anymore.

Keep the barbarians outside of the gates. There are 7+ billion people, savages are not needed for anything except for the State to claim to be needed to protect you from them.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 02:22 | 4242612 CCanuck
CCanuck's picture

A Fucking GREAT IDEA.....Start'n with the cocksuckers at the top!

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 09:38 | 4243033 yrbmegr
yrbmegr's picture

Easier said than done.

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 16:59 | 4246934 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Because the guv paid barbarians are guarding those at the top.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:05 | 4242885 artless
artless's picture


Enough with the poverty causes crime meme. It's bullshit. Just check historical crimes rates from Depression, etc.

You are correct in your statement about who is killing whom in Shitcago. One poster said something like "middle class, etc killing poor" or some such which is patemtly absurd. It IS predominently gang related. Drug related. Innocents caught in the middle with-AND THIS IS THE BIG PART SO PAY ATTENTION-no menas of defending themselves whether it be by Shitty Police (who have effectively withdrawn from troubled Chicago districts) Private Security Companies (as in Detroit) which they probably cannot afford, or the BIG BIG FACT that they have one of the strictest gun control laws in the country. Those things are all not a coincidence.

Buit that still leaves the fact that there are those who WILL commit murder and violent crime regardless of the environment. And we as a society are pathetic politically correct wuuses who do not have the balls to identify the true root of the problem. IT IS CULTURAL. There is an enormous demographic that has been raised WITHOUT FATHERS and thus without the male role model. Any socioilogist worth their salt can demonstrate the destructive aspect of that situation. It crosses all race barriers, income barriers, and even education barriers. I can think of a certain fatherless baby boomer with a law degree who sleeps at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave who is no different than the permanent adolescents in a South Chicago gang. He just acts on different stage and thus his crimes take a different form. Like droning a fucking wedding party in Yemen the other day that killed 15 innocent men, women, and children. Oh, and then there's that lying, cheating, fraudulent, unaccomplished part.

And just for racial balance since everyone will now pile on and call me a racist because I have the intelligence to observe the obvious, I'll give you a previous POTUS who has the very same fatherless/grew up to be a full on narcissist, lying, thieving, nurderous, asshole one William Jefferson Clinton. The problem with these guys is that deep down they are insecure little boys or i other words NOT MEN.

Of course like any sociological thingy there are always exceptions to the rule. I'll stick with POTUS and give you FDR as a psychopath and GW as another although one could argue that Shrub (little Bush) actually was genuine and just fucked up rather than exhibit narc/depraved traits. By looking at how he behaves as a former Prez is telling. That and his refusal to respond to the gutter politics aimes at him from 2000-2008. That said he was a horrible POTUS.

It's CULTURAL. I give you one Aaron Henandez. Not Poor.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:31 | 4242916 BandGap
BandGap's picture

Hard to defend yourself against random violence. Best to just avoid the turf where the turf wars are going on.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:37 | 4242923 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

We don' need no steenkin' stats - just more ammo.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 09:51 | 4243067 mr1963
mr1963's picture

Chicago is a shithole because of the black south and west side. Check DNA Chicago site sometime for the crime blotter. 80% black, 15% mexican and 5% white. Then the punk blacks go up north and rape and rob the wimp liberals who cry for more union thug police. And I'll tell you now, the problem isn't the blacks, it's the white liberals refusing to do anything  but cower before them.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:45 | 4242934 headhunt
headhunt's picture

Yo-yo-yo - HA!

There may be more 'Cocksuck'n Fuck'n Criminals in the upper classes per capita' but they are not trying to kill anyone, they are getting up and going to work.

The Chicago problem is directly derived from the theft of entire generations education. The teachers union has dumbed down the education to the point that no real education exists. When a person leaves their high school they have no real education and no hope. Who wants to hire an uneducated person who was taught that they 'deserve' shit. They are trapped and the democrats did it to them - word.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:06 | 4242337 Nels
Nels's picture

Poverty has little to do with crime.

The crime rates for poor white Applachia are low.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:02 | 4242485 Tijuana Donkey Show
Tijuana Donkey Show's picture

To methed out, and too spaced out. I live close enough to a denser "Appliachia" city, and it's all the same story buddy. It's almost worse, as the meth-billies are even crazier...

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 06:53 | 4242816 Kobe Beef
Kobe Beef's picture

Poverty is correlated with a certain demographic. Murder and violent crime, even more so.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 07:13 | 4242838 Dapper Dan
Dapper Dan's picture

could be this,


IN The Bell Curve, Herrnstein and Murray set out to prove that American society was becoming increasingly meritocratic, in the sense that wealth and other positive social outcomes were being distributed more and more according to people's intelligence and less and less according to their social backgrounds. Furthermore, to the extent that intelligence was not subject to easy environmental control, but was instead difficult to modify and even in part inherited, genetic differences among individuals, Herrnstein and Murray posited, would contribute significantly to their futures.

The evidence for this thesis came largely from an analysis of data compiled in the National Longitudinal Study of Youth (NLSY), an ongoing federal project that tested over 10,000 Americans in 1980, with follow-up interviews regularly thereafter. Each participant completed the Armed Forces Qualifying Test (AFQT)--which, like any diverse test of mental ability, can be used as a measure of intelligence--and was then evaluated for subsequent social outcomes (including high-school graduation, level of income, likelihood of being in jail, likelihood of getting divorced, and so forth). As a rule, a person's intelligence turned out to predict such outcomes more strongly than did the socio economic status of his parents. This relationship held for all ethnic groups; indeed, when intelligence was statistically controlled, many "outcome" differences among ethnic groups vanished.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 07:59 | 4242882 new game
new game's picture

oh yea- ding ding, a winner! correlation between intelligence and outcome of inputs. wow, we need another study to verify the results...

even intelligent people lack "common sense" - sold many a home to specialized programmers that were clueless to a physical dynamic constructed world of substructs(home, tools to build).

and as a bonus we are ruled by these fucks-harvard bankers...

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 12:02 | 4243440 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

Perhaps a small mind might look at the way one government regulates (makes owning a gun shop near impossible) versus the other that makes it far easier and then extrapolate this to the broader economy and how it affects small business in general thereby changing the potential outcomes in each city.

The common man trying to run a business is hammered by regulations and rent seekers in Chicago.  Not so much in Houston.  Small minded people may like to think that oil booms (in North Dakota?) and financials have a lot to do with it but the reality is the poor in Chicago are trapped on an invisible plantation while the poor in Houston are freer to make lemonade and sell it for a profit.  One look at how the markets are performing completely blows away your idea.  Chicago should be doing great but it's a hell hole for the poor.

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:31 | 4242212 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

"Houston has oil revenue."

What, did they secede from Federal control?

"It will be a boom until it's a bust."

What boom? WTF are you talking about? the QE boom?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 12:03 | 4243443 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

He's bad at geography.  He's putting the North Dakota oil boom in Houston.  Public education and all that...

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:02 | 4242486 yrad
yrad's picture

You're being short sighted. Houston's medical district is recognized the world over.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 10:26 | 4243132 Keyser
Keyser's picture

To support your observation, I was in Cebu, Philippines a while back and had to go to a private hospital for treatment. When talking to the resident that was working on me I told her that I was from Houston. She said, Oh, the mayor of Cebu is in Houston right now for cancer treatment at MD Anderson. The entire western I-10 corridor is filled with medical facilities, all world class. 


Fri, 12/13/2013 - 11:15 | 4243287 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Will TX state govt vote to refuse ObamaCare like SC?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 11:17 | 4243288 SubjectivObject
SubjectivObject's picture

Ha!  And there's Hospital City just south of down town. 

Moar skyscrappers right there than in some small cities. 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:08 | 4242502 Spungo
Spungo's picture

Venezuela has tons of oil, but that place is a complete shit hole due to socialism. 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 05:46 | 4242769 vato poco
vato poco's picture

"Houston has oil revenue. It will be a boom until it's a bust."

Nice try. Sure, that _was_ the case.....30 years ago. Houston was hurt *badly* by the oil collpase of the early 80's. But back then, they had competent-verging-on-outstanding city leaders who saw the problem for what it was, had the balls to figure they'd make it better - have NEVER seen a city expanding/building new freeways in a downturn before or since - and went out and brought new business in and diversifed the city's economy like a motherfucker.

Houston has its problems: large parts of the city are shitholes populated by gimme-free-shit scumbags. But they don't depend on oil anymore. They do better when it's high, sure. Should it ever collpase......Houston (and Texas) will keep chugging right along kicking the shit out of Chicago et al.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 10:30 | 4243148 Keyser
Keyser's picture

Lots of industry relocating to Texas and Houston/Dallas specifically due to the economic and political climate in the state. No state income tax, right to work state, industry friendly regulation, etc... Everywhere you turn in Houston you see new construction. 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 11:20 | 4243303 SubjectivObject
SubjectivObject's picture

I agree. 

And no apparent comfirmation of the the ZH doomer meme. 

The mind reels. 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 16:05 | 4244328 RonJon715
RonJon715's picture

Or until the fact that this glorious city of 2 million doesn't have a sustainable fresh water supply dawns on everyone...Fuck Texas, I'll lounge by Lake Michigan every summer and stay off the South and West sides of the city.  

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:43 | 4242930 Offthebeach
Offthebeach's picture

Notice LTER's use of the passive tense. " Houston ?HAS?oil..." As if was a large welfare check. As if it justs rains down or its a trust fund, which gives us some idea of how LTER gets by, outside the productive trade of road side canning.
All. ( Although you well know ) have to watch LTER's poor POLITICS AND THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE.

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:21 | 4242190 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture



how can 2 of the nation's favorite cities be so painfully different?

Texas is a right to work state.

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:35 | 4242197 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Texas is awash in oil wealth.   Fill the tank lately?   I hear times are good in Saudi Arabia, too.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:04 | 4242487 Tijuana Donkey Show
Tijuana Donkey Show's picture

If your not looking for a job /sarc

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:46 | 4242547 salvadordaly
salvadordaly's picture

Damn dude where do you live and how old are you? Have you ever been to Houston? This is not a rich town. Let me show you the east side. OK the west side, no wait the North side, shit just trust me!

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 02:35 | 4242613 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

I'm 47.   Been to Houston a dozen times, probably more.  It's Generica with oil.  

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 05:50 | 4242772 vato poco
vato poco's picture

If you've "been to Houston 12 times", then you weren't paying attention. Houston is a great many things, but Generica it ain't.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 10:35 | 4243157 Keyser
Keyser's picture

Yeah, there is a lot of oil wealth in Houston, but no different that any other large city with pockets of wealthy. In the case of Houston, it has helped the lower classes through trickle down economics as the wealthy actually run companies that employ people and not just moving numbers around on a trading ledger as with Chicago's financial industry. You are correct, Chicago has no industry to support the lower classes whereas Houston does. 


Fri, 12/13/2013 - 04:38 | 4242717 BorisTheBlade
BorisTheBlade's picture

Saudi is a sh*thole despite the oil revenue.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 09:52 | 4243068 GeezerGeek
GeezerGeek's picture

You hear times are good in Saudi Arabia? Not if you're a woman, or a foreigner, or a Hindu or Christian or Jew or Buddhist or any other non-Muslim. 

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:30 | 4242210 mofreedom
mofreedom's picture

I would say by the U-HAUL one-way chart that a number of "don't want to works" are commin to TX for their lone-star cards, just like they went to Milwaukee and Minneapolis before.

God Bless Texas (save Austin and bat poop/pee) and Ted Cruz!

Pesticide for locusts!!!

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:36 | 4242227 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Which state is Detroit in again?  Oh right, no oil there.  But right to work state.  So it must be the right to work thing that is the cause of it's economic malaise.

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:39 | 4242242 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture



Michigan, home of global auto production for a century, became right-to-work in March of this year. 

Too little, too late, if you ask me.

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:40 | 4242247 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

How about Nevada?  And Florida?

Are you really saying that oil prices have nothing to do with it?  If oil were at $40/barrel, would TX be kicking ass or taking prisoners?  Serious question.

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:47 | 4242258 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture



Sure, the oil business is a big part of the economy, just like auto is in Michigan. 

We all know how much a liberal lawyer like yourself hates tort reform, like we passed in Texas, and loves the unions, which are not supported in Texas.  The great thing is, you don't have to live here! 

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:47 | 4242271 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Nice non-answer.  So, what about $40/B oil and its effect on the TX right to work economy?  Care to go on record or just feed red meat to the ups?

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:49 | 4242280 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture



Sure, the energy business is importnat to Texas, but so is agriculture and technology. 

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:51 | 4242285 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

If oil is $40/B, will TX be in a boom or bust cycle in your opinion?  And here's another question -- do you care the oil is at generational highs in real dollar terms because of the Fed?  

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:54 | 4242298 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture



Bust, of course.  If a new GM Yukon Denali sells for $25,000 instead of $60,000 will Michigan be in a boom or bust cycle?  Bust, of course, but Bernanke and Yellen are going to make damn sure that never happens.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:00 | 4242309 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

I agree with all of the above.  Right to work is not the reason TX is doing well.  It's primarily oil prices caused by Bernanke/Yellen.   Detroit's problems started with globalization.  Corrupt unions played a role, but the fundamental problem is globalization.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:21 | 4242377 darteaus
darteaus's picture

Flawed analysis.

The unions locked in rules and costs for the auto makers.  When globalization changed the rules, the union couldn't/wouldn't change the rules-no "givebacks".

There are many PROFITABLE auto manufacturing plants in the US TODAY.  The vast majority being built or expanded are in right-to-work states.  Globalization would make those factories unprofitable also.

MB is expanding its plant in AL for the 3rd time.  If globalization is the problem, they'd build it in another country, no?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:26 | 4242393 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

"In 2010, Germany produced more than 5.5 million automobiles; the U.S produced 2.7 million. At the same time, the average auto worker in Germany made $67.14 per hour in salary in benefits; the average one in the U.S. made $33.77 per hour. Yet Germany’s big three car companies—BMW, Daimler  (Mercedes-Benz ), and Volkswagen—are very profitable."

Nah, let's race to the bottom instead.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:30 | 4242395 darteaus
darteaus's picture

"Nice non-answer"

If globalization affects jobs in Detroit, it affects jobs in AL also, no?

Good bye little man; your hate has blinded you.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:46 | 4242938 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

JFC, you're comparing GERMAN auto industry to the American auto industry?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 03:06 | 4242649 starfcker
starfcker's picture

wow, beat on rand day. rand, you're all over the place, but you've made some great points and yet the pile on continues. does anybody really believe globalizing the auto industry has been good for america? if you do, you are stupid. niggas didn't want to gang bang or wait for the welfare check when they could make 45 bucks an hour building chevys. do you schmucks really think you're getting a better price on a car or does it just warm your hearts to know that now, when a car gets built that same nigga makes 12 bucks an hour and all the money goes to the 'shareholders' (dimon, blankfein, et al). 16% of north american production is light trucks and SUV's, yet they earn ford, gm and chrysler 60% of their GLOBAL profits. who's the stupid ones?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 09:30 | 4243016 FredFlintstone
FredFlintstone's picture

No income tax, conservative politics, cheap land/housing...

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:12 | 4242352 darteaus
darteaus's picture

So, TX is ONLY successful because of "high" oil prices?

A "business friendly" climate has NOTHING to do with the Texas economy?

The seventh lowest tax rate and right to work have NOTHING to do with the Texas economy?

Detroit was once one of the richest cities in the US.  Explain how a freer market in another state screwed that up.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:18 | 4242373 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Florida has a zero percent income tax.  Is that why the state is foundering?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:21 | 4242380 darteaus
darteaus's picture

The moon haz a zero percent income tax.  Is that why they have no jobs?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:30 | 4242398 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Must be that taxes are too high there.   And moon unions are out of control.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:42 | 4242431 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

So what should the increase be in our taxes Mr. Buffet?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 06:25 | 4242791 new game
new game's picture

ps. lter-guns don't bite. they are rather comforting, one in almost every pocket, laying everywhere loaded and guess what- the 3 year old grandson gets it- he doesn't touch them. he knows they are dangerous- it is called "gun culture".

don't be so afraid of a dear friend...

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:05 | 4242496 Tijuana Donkey Show
Tijuana Donkey Show's picture

Because everone is retired!

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:47 | 4242941 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

Besides that fact it is Florida?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:49 | 4242554 salvadordaly
salvadordaly's picture

Ever hear of this thing called the 80's dumb ass?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 05:12 | 4242738 Offthebeach
Offthebeach's picture

$40 oil, boom or bust ?

Been there, done that.

Texas has had oil booms at $5 barrel oil.

The oil is the same, it's the dollars that have gotten small. And will continue to be "trimmed".

And it isn't oil, it is the people that act, that do, that make ...whatever. For example the New England Whale oil era.
How log had men sailed and whales swam? Yet only New Englanders roamed the world and made a immense fortune. It's the people, stupid. Oil, engineering, agriculture, computers, finance, TEXANS do fine. Welfare, and the legions of wealth stripping rent seekers in the welfare "provider industries"? Notsomuch.

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:52 | 4242286 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

What? You think Lola passed the bar exam?  So did I.  They must have lowered the standards.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:26 | 4242392 CCanuck
CCanuck's picture

Lack of a spine and the ability to fuck people over with words, is all you need to slither over the Bar these days.

99% of Every Fuck"n Cocksuck'n Lawyer I know, need a Bar ....stuffed up there Cocksuck'n, Fuck'n ...slithering fuck.n parasites..FUCK I HATE LAWYERS!!!!



Fri, 12/13/2013 - 13:50 | 4243816 meltdown
meltdown's picture

Now there is an option. Choose not to live and work in a state that makes it their official policy to let private emploers run roughshod over workers.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 11:34 | 4243347 Freddie
Freddie's picture

I think MI can improve overtime if the FSA keeps being reduced.  A lot of Detroit left for Chicago.  The other part moved to the suburbs.   The MI UAW mentality is a major thing that has hurt MI. 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:11 | 4242350 W74
W74's picture

Michigan became a R2W state in 2012 right?  Considering how entrenched unions are in that state it was a tough win.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:24 | 4242390 darteaus
darteaus's picture

But the minute they became a RTW state, LTER started pointing out how RTW doesn't work because the state is still in the same hole the unions/Dummycrats have spent 80+ years digging.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 02:00 | 4242576 salvadordaly
salvadordaly's picture

See Rand this is what I talk about checking your neighbor. If you have just moved in next door to me with that attitude, well lets just say, me and you would have a rocky relationship, and I hope you do not need my help for anything. If the role were reversed, guess what, I would never need your help! You want to know why? Because I can get it done myself. something you have never thought of. People like you always have an excuse.

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:22 | 4242193 USS Bernanke
USS Bernanke's picture

I know one thing that Chicago and Houston have in common.

Number of fux given about actually addressing the real problems of today by the mass majority?: 0

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:42 | 4242254 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Hence "New York City launches full scale invasion of White House." talk about "team of rivals." total mess with no one charge save Speaker Boehner ironically. Love to be invited to that Frat party that's fer sure. Next up "power struggle in the Senate." Reid versus Schumer, Round One "as Israel twists in the wind." frigin' all out war between Italians and Jews. What was that television show again? Backdrop: "real war everywhere you look." As my best friend has always said to me (and yes though claims to the contrary he's as Italian as the Pope) "in the end te only Mafia is the Government."

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:25 | 4242524 t0mmyBerg
t0mmyBerg's picture

i addressed the real problem in illinois.  know how? i moved my family the fuck out of that state.  when the fucking democrats come for $20k from me to pay the fat pensions they gave in exchange for votes to the fucking scum working 2 city jobs and taking disability for their $200k/yr public union pension you know what?  i wont be there.  fuck em.  wherever the democrats rule for decades (detroit, st louis, etc) good fucking luck.  fuck you.  and fuck you let them eat rand.  god what a toad

Thu, 12/12/2013 - 23:32 | 4242223 darteaus
darteaus's picture

Start giving out free stuff in Houston, and the numbers will turn right around.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 00:00 | 4242315 stant
stant's picture

i guess detroit and chicago are off someones nuke target list, waiste of ammo

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:07 | 4242411 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Orwell would love this thread.  We hate the Fed and Big Gov (that cause oil prices to hover around $100/B) in the oil state.  The economy is best when workers make less, which is why workers make more in TX (because of the oil prices caused by MIC/Fed, that we hate).   I love guns except if gangs kill each other with guns and more guns among people who are not targeted by gang wars will cause fewer gun killings among people that are not being killed now.  I hate the MIC that is made possible by the Fed that I hate, but I love the troops that are funded by the tax payments and MIC and Fed that I hate!  

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:06 | 4242501 J Pancreas
J Pancreas's picture

You've been pimp slapped by three different people in this thread so its time to go take a nap. The loudest man in the room is the weakest man in the room. You just don't stop yammering. Don't spout off drivel without knowing the facts - I can't wrap my mind around how some troll like you even ties their shoes without help in the morning let alone remembers a password and posts on articles on ZH.


You've embarrassed yourself. Count your down votes and go to bed LTER.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 02:05 | 4242504 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

So which points are wrong, then?  Oh, right.  Not important.  It's downvotes that matter to you.  Conform away, sheep.  The sheep are indeed bigger (and sheepier) in Texas.  God bless Texas. and send everyone else to Hell.  

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:51 | 4242948 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

You're not paying attention.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 02:02 | 4242578 Decimus Lunius ...
Decimus Lunius Luvenalis's picture

You all do realize that this is a paid troll, right?  The RNC does it, the DNC does it, and their shills (i.e., elected officials) tell their donors that this is grassroots organizing.  I imagine the union bosses leeching off their worker funders paid for this one.  

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 05:29 | 4242754 Offthebeach
Offthebeach's picture

Stupid. Oil is priced world wide.

I support gang shootings. The more the better.
( Poor, live in a Democrat city, with Democrat cops, public gang defender lawyers while democrat social rent seekers feed your chill-der-ins, house them in section 8 owned by democrats, treat them at fed/state rip off clinics....and go to $30k/yr/body skills with 60%+ drop out rates ( and the graduates are just rocket scientists).
Hey, blame Bush. Whitey. Koch. Marine aviation. Big pharma. Oil interests. Upton Sinclair. .....and, so forth.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 01:07 | 4242499 q99x2
q99x2's picture

Texas has Ron Paul and Kyle Bass and Chicago has Rohm Emanuel.

like Bitcoin has Satoshi and Washington D.C. has Janet Yellen.

What's to explain.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 05:00 | 4242730 22winmag
Fri, 12/13/2013 - 07:24 | 4242849 Touch_It
Touch_It's picture

Interesting to see how many fellow Houstonians are on ZH. Odd seeing your neighborhood being discussed.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 07:33 | 4242858 deerhunter
deerhunter's picture

I worked in a "union shop" for a summer job.  I actually could make time and a half for making rate plus 50%.  The piecework rate was silly low.  The rate for reaming three holes in a metal bus seat frame and screwing in 14 snaps was 12 per hour or 5 minutes each.  So for doing 18 I made time and a half and could do that in six hours and play cards in the break room the last two hours.  Well the third and first shift lifers didn't like when they raised the rate to 18 cause they couldnt make rate and threatened me in the parking lot after a union meeting where I got to drink two free beers.  So,  since I don't appreciate being threatened I went to work and had the rate raised to 24 which meant that when I left you needed to do 36 an hour for time and a half.  They slashed the tires on my car since they didn't think two on one was good enough odds for trying to kick my ass.  Unions,  I have been in all three and not seen any good come of them.  Oh,, and gun control means I control the gun in my hand,  no one else.  And to LTER move to Deutschland if you love the Germans so much.  EU rules nothing over 48 hours is legal.  When you have government dictating to business how many hours maximum your workers can work you are welcome to move there in my opinion.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:47 | 4242935 economicmorphine
economicmorphine's picture

Most union guys are too busy being bused from one protest site to the other these days to have time to worry about making rate.  

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:23 | 4242905 anti Oligarchy
anti Oligarchy's picture

Brilliant ..  never thought of looking at oneway truck rentals.  Chicago is a great city to visit..  downtown and museums anyway but would never live there.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:44 | 4242931 economicmorphine
economicmorphine's picture

Lived in Texas for over 10 years and there's no place I'd rather be.  That said, the income tax thing is a non-starter, because Texas property tax rates are very high.  If you live in a state with a reasonable (admittedly not Illinois) state income tax and low property taxes (Arkansas or Oklahoma, for example) it's a wash for most folks.  People in Texas are nicer, more civil, polite, whatever you want to call it than they are in the Midwest and other parts of the country. That's just fact.  Maybe guns have something to do with it, maybe not. More than anything, this is about the perception of freedom.  In Texas, you can still build your future.  In Illinois, it belongs to the state.  That said, and as others have mentioned, if you're a blue state looter, stay the hell out of Texas.   You've already wrecked enough of America.  Clean up your own shithole instead of wrecking Texas.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 12:31 | 4243525 PrecipiceWatching
PrecipiceWatching's picture

I don't know what "Midwest" you are referring to, maybe Shitcago, but the Midwest I'm familiar with is EVERY bit as civilized, polite and decent as Texas.

Lumping up in with the barbaric, backward Coastal idiots is ridiculous. 


The Texas snobbery and exclusivity meme is tiresome.

There are huge populations in the Midwest that share the same mentality without the incessant braggadoccio of Texans.

We are on the SAME side.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 08:54 | 4242949 headhunt
headhunt's picture

The Chicago problem is directly derived from the theft of entire generations education. The teachers union has dumbed down the education to the point that no real education exists. When a person leaves their high school they have no real education and no hope. Who wants to hire an uneducated person who was taught that they 'deserve' shit and they deserve it now. They are trapped and the democrats did it to them - word.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 09:10 | 4242978 pndr4495
pndr4495's picture

Sort of a poker game on this thread it seems.  I'll take my chances wih Houston actually BEING the financial capital of the U.S. , not Chicago and not New York - or it will DEVELOP into the financial capital of he U.S.  Houston is a warm water port , in a state with a foundation of individual liberty.  Houston is a fresh petri dish while the other two cities are just plain stale and moldy, and it's happening now , not when the Astrodome was first built. 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 09:10 | 4242983 deerhunter
deerhunter's picture

Who wants to hire a college "graduate"  who has never worked a day in his/her life???  I interviewed dozens who thought a piece of paper and showing up for an interview entitled them to 85K and a company car.  Teaching to the test is what it is called.  We no longer teach kids how to think.  I would take a high school graduate who was willing to listen and learn over a college graduate who knows all the answers.  There is a reason we have two ears and one mouth,  God designed us to listen more than we speak.  That is the key to learning.  We no longer teach kids how to listen and think outside the box.  That we can spend 18K per year on a student and have half not graduate and the ones that do reading at 8th grade levels astounds me.  Accountability in government work is non existent.  The state of Illinois has over 3 thousand state employees that make over 300 K a year.  More than most all 50 state governors.  Illinois is a toilet and I am doing my darndest to vacate the premises ASAP.  I was moved here via job transfer that went in the crapper when the economy tanked.  A mind is a terrible thing to waste.

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