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Gold And Silver Slammed
No new news as a catalyst this morning but it appears someone decided it was highly inappropriate for the precious metals to be holding their gains as stocks and bonds revert back to pre-payrolls 'taper' levels. Gold and Silver have been monkey-hammered lower this morning as heavy volume hit futures markets about 419ET and 645ET. Futures were not halted. Some speculation that gold's drop followed positive comments from Ukraine's foreign minister but that seems a stretch...
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Your grandkid's future tax dollars at work.
Maybe Germany can get a fraction of it's gold back in three years now.
Sweet, now I can stack Moar...
Cartel delinda est.
modus operandi
finem respice
Bovina Sancta
"Interesting" how the breakers work on upward price movements and not when someone's monkey-hammering the bid.
Just bought my first miner of the year (SLW), good luck and good bowling.
huge dip, but this morning your seeing recovery. Love the shinnies.
I have been trying to buy some physical metal over the last few days....and I'm a small fry. I can't find anything even near spot price. Anyone having any luck?
You can't buy gold at spot. There are two markets and the paper one is an illusion.
I've been buying at spot (or even at 98% of spot) with some regularity. I know some guys who buy up gold and silver as scrap at these pawn shops. They will send it off to the smelter, where they get 95% of spot, so they are happy to sell it to me at 98%. (Now they've paid about 60% of spot for it.) But that avenue has been drying up as of late.
It's Christmas. Everyone wants a little fiat to buy their kids the latest Chinese plastic shit. I've been buying guns like crazy recently. You can't find any ammo, but someone I know had it all stockpiled. I was hoping I could pull the same trick on the shiny, but I'm getting shut out now. All I've gotten recently is someone's old Mercury dime collection...
BTW, there is a pawn dealer in my area that will pay me 97% of spot on any type of gold or .999 silver on the spot at anytime. So that can't be right he only gets 95% selling to a refiner. He's probably just glad to make the sale, and he probably swindles the people he buys metal from.
If you want to buy phyzz close to the spot price your best bet is to buy generic silver rounds or bars. Depending on the amount you need, you can still find silver at $.99 over spot for new silver. Apmex has 24 hour free shipping today so that helps keeping the final price down. Others offer free shipping based on amount purchased. https://comparesilverprices.com/
Tulving is where you want to go for the lowest price possible on any product, but you must buy a minimum 500 ozs silver or 20 ozs gold, so not the place to go if you just want to buy a tube of silver or a few gold coins. I like Provident better than Apmex. They have better prices, although Apmex has huge selection...
Choose your illusion
Lose your illusion.
Hoof. Set up a booth somewhere with a sign that says "cash for gold".
That's your best option.
Otherwise pay the premiums like everyone else, and realise the hilariousness that is spot price.
Hoof, if the dealers that you're pricing from buy as well as sell PMs, they should be quoting the current repurchase price. Rather than obsess about the premiums, I focus on the spread between what they're paying to buy versus the price they're selling at. That's a more realistic bid/ask.
Somebody needs to set up a club or a newsgroup, where stackers can sell back and forth to each other at spot when they need to cash in or out... local meet at a restaurant, with somebody local sort of thing
Gainesville might have something for you.
$21.18 for a 1oz silver round at Gainesville. That's a 7% premium, and about as good as it gets.
http://www.gainesvillecoins.com/bestseller/
Nah, tulving and provident are better. I read the fine print at Gainesville and they seem like total dicks. I can't remember exactly what it was, but they are not user friendly like provident and apmex. I've never ordered from those people.
"I have been trying to buy some physical metal over the last few days....and I'm a small fry. I can't find anything even near spot price. Anyone having any luck?"
Local coin shop:
20+ oz's ASE @ $3 over spot
20- oz's ASE @ $3.75 over spot
They have maples and generic as well in the $2-2.75 over spot range.
Agis quod agis
Just as edible as your Ipad. Then again you can make jewelry with it and be the next MR T.
Better yet, trade it for lead.
My arms are tired!
Well shit...OK!
same ole same ole. used to make me mad once but now i am reconciled to it happening.
Same here.
This year on multiple occasions I added more funds to my investment account and every time I look I have less and less money :-) It's hard to keep up with the sinking HUI!
One day this QE is gonna end... badly.
Likewise, let's hope they "hammer" gold back under $500 an ounce soon.
I'm in @ $500.
Don't despair, Foxenburg. They can't do this forever. The longer you endure, the more your patience will pay off.
You sure the Chinese ain't selling this shit rather than buying it?
Well the AP says they're buying it......they wouldn't lie to us would they?
Maybe someone should ask Jay Carney about it.
Carney belongs in a circus, oh wait...
this is not even shit .... cow shit you actually pay for it ... this must be poluted air
You mean selling the paper and buying the physical?
Nothing makes sense anymore. Talk of taper supposedly brings stock market down but gold & silver stays up. Now it gets knocked down for no apparent reason. How can anyone invest anymore when everything is rigged and fundamentals don't matter.
gold is toast. banged for any which reason. taper bang with dead bag bounce- short upside to suck in more false hope buyers, wash/ repeat bang it lower on more dollar/taper talk.
1187.90 good as taken out...
After thousands of years.......they finally killed it dead.
Now we can fully implement Agenda 21.......you're gonna love it!
They are getting desperate now, can you smell it?
Do they have any choice? Contracts standing for delivery in Dec. at the Comex at 20 tonnes and there is only around 22 tonnes available as I understand the situation. These fuckers are weeks away from having their pants pulled down and being exposed. They won't allow any triggers to stop the decline until they chase all the contract holders out of the market, if they can. Looks like a lot of strong hands holding on so we'll see. I hope someday someone writes an expose on who specifically at JP Morgan, or wherever, was in charge of doing this so they could be paid a visit. Assholes.
Names. We want names.
Absolutely correct. They are OUT. They are desperate for more, Like a junkie and his/her fix.
Gotta starve the beast, baby!
Nope. The only desperation I smell is on this board. You guys can justify almost anything.
What group and elements ruled the planet 10,000 years ago, and than some...still rules today.
.
Because, '
Their is nothing new under the Sun, History is repeating itself.'
Well, Slave, it's not like they weren't warned...
:D
Thats true.
.
This life is nothing short of strange and bizzare beyond comprehension...it couldve been something really beautiful.
.
Us humans are a tortured species...caught between something great and animals.
Yeah right, like nobody warned you on your USD/Euro call that blew up in your face spectacularly.
Some people are actually using these artificially and depressed low prices to load up on physical douchebag (see China).
Hey Bay, not to start a fight...but read your comments on the below link.... Silver was getting hammered on May 3, 2011 and you're out there offering advice that may have crushed many people. But you're slamming someone on a bad trade? Sounds pretty hypocrytical dont you think?
http://www.zerohedge.com/article/silver-bears-are-back
"Re: Mish's Global Economic Trend Analysis: Silver Plunges 12%, What's Going On?
Silver will never see the $20's again. I doubt even low $30's are possible with this much pent up demand. Physical supplies will vanish quickly even at these higher levels. Call a coin dealer, he'll tell you the truth. You sure as hell won't get it here.
Mish blasts GATA and Ted Butler even though they've been on the correct side of the trade for over a decade or more. These fellows have been correct on gold and silver yet Mish belittles them? Kind of sad and pathetic.
When less that 1-2% of the public has any silver at all it's hard to believe Mish can utter such incredible nonsense about everyone being "all in". I can only laugh at this as it is so stupid and ignores the facts of the matter. This blog is a complete joke on PM's. The only fools around here are those who ignore the 11 year Golden Bull market. When silver finally confirms at $50, we'll see who knows what they're talking about."
Yes, prices have crashed farther than anyone ever expected. Miners are even worse off and in danger of going under. Some are mining under production costs now. Doesn't have much to do with worldwide physical supply and demand though. (see China and India demand for gold and silver). US Mint is setting all time records on sales too.
Everything in those last two paparagraphs is still true. $50 is still the line in the sand, historically speaking. Inflation adjusted silver still needs to see around $150 to set a real new high.
This bull market has yet to see a mania phase yet, unlike stocks and BTC which are already there.
Au is NOT an investment, it's financial insurance!
Then BTFD
Got in late on Silver, been buying all the way down from $36/oz, the price doesn't mean anything to me because I am not trying to make money, I am trying to protect my future.
Your answer is you DON'T INVEST. That's what stashing gold and silver away are. TAKING YOUR CAPITAL OUT OF THE RIGGED MARKETS, preserving it, and waiting for a better opportunity.
Fox, give it time and the moves will get reversed so we'll have a 3am bid etc.
Stock market complacency; everyone is being told all is good and more are starting to drink the kool-aid.
The stock market is a Fed hearbeat away from collapse and those holding metals will be golden - so to speak.
I'm pretty sure it was me...I picked up some miners yesterday. Sorry 'bout that.
I wanna be fucked by you, by you, and nobody else but you
I wanna be fucked by you alooone
BooBoopyDoo
LMAO, that was a good episode of Gilligan's!
Made my day!
Fucken classic.
They're going to protect this fractional reserve system to the end, and will end......in war. All in.
For those with hope that nature will be allowed to take its course in this price mechanism, it will.by force, no other way.
It's a shame the miners are mostly committed to their bankers.
Unlike the 85 year old pensioner, living just east of Kalgoorlie. Somehow been able to access a dozer, digger, blast hole drill, water truck........ect, amazing what an Aussie pension will get these days......
I think, at the bottom of it all, you are right.
Gold is the Anti-FED. Actually gold is the Anti-FED and Fiscally Disciplined Congress.
WS doesn't want either, and each of the players likes the situation as is.
They will fight to the bitter end to keep it. And when you have the power to print and the power to tax, you have a lot of power.
I am saying that and I own a lot of PMs, probably too much.
Glad I waited!
OK....but take pictures or it doesn't count.
How bout a picture of the hole I drop it in? Does that count?
Naw, no need to get fancy....just a picture of a receipt will do.
Also, I was talking to the rep yesterday at Gainesville (they were the cheapest on comparesilverprices.com) and I asked her about cutting the min t wrapper to look at the coins upon delivery. She advised against it as the wrappers are very difficult to counterfeit and most buyers will buy them back if the bands are in intact without inspection. Is this wise? Is this gtrue? what have others on this blog seen?
it won't bring the value down, like you'd have with action figures when you open the original box.
some time in the future you'd probably want to sell your silver by the roll or by the coin, so you'd have to open that mint box anyways.
Thanx
"the wrappers are very difficult to counterfeit and most buyers will buy them back if the bands are in intact without inspection"
OK, I get it, what you are really buying is not the (alleged) silver but the wrapper, right? The wrapper acts like a silver certificate?
Gonna get a Monster box of AG. 300.00 less than yesterday!
now 400. less
hey i'm a stacker, but really look at the chart-worst ive seen in a long, long time.
so, you tell me where the bottom is? 1180, 1200, 1000. 850. 12xx(recent low).
i have a sense that 1180 has to be taken out for this to finally shake all weak hands and capitulate.
JMFO...
Back up the fucking truck
Christmas is early this year
Why are you trying to chart a rigged market?
what guides your next purchase? Hibernation? solar eclipse?
Timing of mine is driven by the calendar, quantity is determined by the amount of frn's I have and a few well dressed men in London.
Why are you buying if the market is rigged? Seems really dumb.
what if its rigged in our favor?
@new game
any one of those can be a bottom
Look at a 5 10 15 year chart and draw the support line if it drops below that it's look out below untill supply dry's up.
in 1,2,3 + years we will be laughing at worrying about the price drop from 2011
this is a good read
http://www.caseyresearch.com/articles/the-correction-isnt-over-but-golds-headed-to-20000
Corruption, thy name is the CFTC executive.
Aww....come on man....cut the new kid some slack.
He doesn't even know his ass from a hole in the ground yet.
I believe someone here pointed out that part of the FEDs role is to defend the dollar. It is written right there that they will sell gold and buy gold as they see fit to defend the dollar.
That is why no one can find manipulation except for trivial garden variety WS criminals making a few hundred million of it via pricing schemes. It is not considered manipulation when it is in their charter.
I guess debasing it is not considered bad, because they don't defend against that.
I believe that its the ESF (Exchange Stability Fund) that does that.
Shocker.
The AU/AG investment horizen is 20 years, otherwise fuggeddaboudit.
Drink deep of the stawk semen...
thanks asshole sociopath fucking bankers...
knew the sideway trading just above $20 per oz portended another phony paper price assualt...
will be buying more today.....
FUCK YOU BERNANKE AND O'YELLEN......
We've got to get Wilson and tell him to sell!
bought NUGT on monday for a 30% gain and was feeling good then........................ fuck me! Go DUST!
dammm those are some big fat titties are they real?
When Western central bankers give that puzzled look when asked about gold as if it doesn't matter..............
Page 151 chapters 7 and 8 http://www.scribd.com/doc/17233336/September-11-Commission-Report-Revised-December-2008
Obviously big players to the upside and then to the downside. JPM to the upside and the Chinese to the downside?
Exactly, harvest the chicom wealth and hope they return to "flight-to-trashuries." Good strategy if you can get them to take the bait ... doubtful.
Wait until JPM releases their own version of Bitcoin and then the swings in gold and silver will be epic! LOL
Or some other math...
China owns USA debt +
USA owns 90% opium trade +
China smokes opium +
China buys gold +
= makes no sense
Gold has been rising for 11 years straight. This is strange, it is unusual for any asset class and a correction was overdue. So can we just sit aside and call this for what it is, a significant correction in a major bull market that still has a long way to go?
It's unusual for an economy to be pumped by a central bank for so many years also so expect the price of PMs to keep going up as the FED prints out of control.
Yes, but if you pour money in an economy that doesn't mean you control where it will end up. And since there is considerable momentum in the stock market people looking for yield will liquidate everything else and pile it there, generating even more momentum. They are stupid for doing it, but they will keep doing it until the move runs out and everyone panics.
That makes too much sense - hence - all this is simply noise
A good ship rises when the water level rises and gold should rise continuously as purchasing power is eroded. Why not say, since purchasing power has been eroded for 100+ years, a correction is overdue? But M2 keeps climbing, doesn't it? Is M2 due for a correction as well? Since that's not likely to happen, why should gold correct in such a massive way?
And any ship hit by a rogue wave can go under. PMs are long term inflation benchmarks, not overnight indicators.
"Paper Fictitious COMEX Gold Price Slammed"
There, fixed it for ya.
Stand and deliver the real metal cocksuckers.
Meh.. Seems someone has an algo that can trigger for $.50 silver/ $10 gold profits after a few days of letting it drift up into the top of the approved set channel. They are not just pounding it down, they are pounding it down because there is profit (Maybe they can add this to the Ferengi Rules of Acquisition).
I? I buy dollars!
Gold and silver are soooo 2011
Federal Reserve Notes are so 1913. The concept. Not the buying power though. Ooops it was backed by gold then. My mistake.
Yes, reconciled is a good choice of attitudes. Nothing but purchases of the real thing for me, now.
NK is selling of parts of its 2000 tons of gold, might be a desperat act to avoid imminent financial colapse.
North Korea is selling thousands of tons of gold. THAT IS THE BIGGEST PILE OF BS I've heard recently in the anti-gold propaganda. First of all, North Korea has little gold. They can't even pay for all their food and electricity. Lil Kim probably has a stack that would shock and awe, but that is his personal and he ain't selling!
By the way, why is gold "monkey-hammered" when its down 1.3% but when the S&P is down 1% or higher it's a "correction". Point of view I guess. Gold is still overvalued right now. You guys HATE hearing that but it is. Quit bringing out the deer when the S&P is down 1% after being up 28% on the year. Then turning around and calling days like this in gold a "monkey-hammering". Maybe you should roll out the deer when gold gets slammed down because it's the same effect for those that bought in much much higher than it is right now. As a matter of fact most people on this board should be getting the "deer in lights" look right now, because you're so confused why you arent getting rich on all your gold/silver coins. As a matter of fact, you're wishing it would go lower so you can buy more. LOL. Then sell now, buy back at a lower price!!!! But oh well, fear is a great motivator I guess.
great sarc/
or you are extremel butt hurt over something.
Well yeah, of course, why would I be wasting my precious time and life on a friggin blog posting comments when I could be doing something else productive? I obviously have an axe to grind. lol. Thanks for pointing that out. But, I'm not being malicious. I'm being real.
What makes you think that gold is overpriced?
You gotta lay off the bath salts Zombie
"Then sell now, buy back at a lower price!!!!"
A classic insanely high risk maneuver that is known to spectacularly backfire at the worst of times. If you are long term bullish you hold, if you are bearish take your loss and go. Middle of the road, get ready to be hit by a truck. If you think you are looking at a potential crash, buy a put.
Classic trading error indeed. Try to remember to -
Buy into the dip, sell into the rise
You would think gold would be up over the great budget deal yesterday...spend more today for savings in 10 years....
Just exactly as predicted this is / was a fake move.
Perma one-trick ponies paying the price for stupidity.
Smart ones laughing all the way to da bank.
And a lot lower we go.
Actually just what is the COMEX measuring in relatioin to gold and silver, not the physical price of course.
If the all the gold sold had to be proven to exist fuck knows the price of gold... but you would be talking orders of magnitude.
Sadly, as long as there is maturity arbitrage in the CONMEX physical price will be highly correlated with the futures market. Unless this link breaks, through a confidence crisis in the actual supply, futures will have the upper hand due to superior volume.
every week gold and silver are monkey hammered for no reason.
its almost like they r not allowed to have any gains.
any gains that r made r wiped away in 1 day.
i dont mind, i am a gold and silver owner and dont mind being able to buy more at a cheaper price,
its just absurd how it happens weekly.
Do you have more ozs than in 2011? Then you are winning. The mining stocks are a whole different carnival. Gold and silver stocks are not gold and silver. Do you think a $20 Jackson is better than an ounce of fine .999 Ag? I DON'T.
North Korea is liquidating all it's gold. Regime is preparing for economic collapse. Apparently Chinese are buying it all directly.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013/12/11/north-korea-gold-china_n_4424394.html
According to the Huffington Post they sold 2 tonnes to the Chinese last year. The North Koreans hold about 2,000 tonnes and routinely sell gold for various reasons. You call 2 tonnes in sales (0.1% of their supply) liquidating all their gold? Not quite. North Korea holds approximately 70 million ounces if 2,000 tons (or metric tons) is correct. That would place them 6th in the world according to the below link:
http://www.usdebtclock.org/gold-precious-metals.html
Notice the US is far superior in its gold ownership. Of course, I'm sure everyone here will say its painted tungsten, but every conspiracy is justified on zero hedge.
Well if you think the Huffington Post is the authority on North Korea and has inside information on exactly how much and when North Korea is selling it's gold..well need I say more....
As far as you or I know they could be dumping tons to China at any given moment. I guess the trick here is to see if China has stopped purchasing on the open market.
I am indifferent to it all, just what passing along what I read or come across. Consider it all speculation.
Does the Huffington Post carry more credibility than El Tuco? Yes it does. What is funny is you questioned my source but you have no source. Passing along "information" with no credible source is dangerous and misleading. You're right, you need not say more, unless you have some credibility. Your second line saying "they could be dumping tons to China at any given moment" means nothing because why even bring it up if there's no proof of anything other than what is reported by "credible" sources. If you're indifferent, then why not look into the information before you post it.
If China is buying direct from NK then it wont be affecting prices.
Well it is on the record with Kissenger that gold is a competitor to the USD ...and they have for ages tied to crush it.
Well it certainly would fill their quota's from the private market and remove demand from the open market? Wouldn't that cause some pricing pressure considering China is one of the largest purchasers?
There is a surprising correlation between the recent price history of silver and the time history of the water level in a toilet bowl during a flush operation. The water rises for a bit and holds, then plunges rapidly. Not only do the graphs appear similar but the purpose also seems similar - to float as much crap as possible and move it from inside to outside.
Somebody is quietly buying the stock market....again. All other indicators imply major bearish sentiment - except the TRIN. If you saw nothing else but the TRIN, you would surmise the DOW would be up 50 or so. I call shinnanigans.
It never used to be like this.
Bitch.
http://www.zerohedge.com/article/silver-bears-are-back
Read some of these comments... whew! I hope you guys really didnt BTFD...
http://beforeitsnews.com/gold-and-precious-metals/2013/12/silver-set-to-double-according-to-apple-2561510.html
Your mileage may vary....
http://seekingalpha.com/instablog/685812-about-ag/1494831-why-apple-is-not-experiencing-a-silver-shortage
Every story has two sides...this one is actually from seekingalpha
Yeah, those comments are just as bullish at $45 silver as things look bearish now at $19. We're at low tide now. The beachgoers who set up their chairs and towels are going to be underwater if they don't move positions soon.
The value in Gold isn't the ability to hedge against inflation or protect purchasing power but to simply loan it out to create more notional. Anyone in Gold futures is providing the liquidty for more notional to be created in the gold repo market. This is the 21st centruy finance where you take something tangible & find multiple ways to rehypothecate it to create more notional. Kinda feels like pre 1340's before the bank crash of the superbanks that depressed populations.
http://www.schillerinstitute.org/fid_91-96/954_Gallagher_Venice_rig.html
Same scenario as great depression gold/stocks as today. Stocks showing same pattern now as then. Jan 14 the area would be their crash. Coincides with the inventory lows.
Completely like them to mockingly repeat the past.
19.6 looks to be the bottom in silver.
It's just to damm easy for them to monkey wrench gold and silver down whenever they feel.
The Chinese and Indians just keep buying.... they are loving this discount today
I just sold my condo few months ago... the closing is Dec 20th... I hope I can pick up another monster box or two under $20 in a few weeks.