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Deutsche Bank Investigated In Gold Manipulation Probe

Tyler Durden's picture





 

A month ago, regulators in Europe began their investigation into manipulation of the "London gold fixing" (and we explained the methods here). While the complete history of gold manipulation goes a lot deeper than just banging the close on this crucial benchmark (which goes back to first world war); the decision by Germany's financial regulator (BaFin) to probe Deutsche Bank signals greater concerns over the precious metals markets.  As The FT reports, BaFin has demanded emails and documents from Deutsche Bank as part of an investigation into potential manipulation of gold and silver prices.

 

Via The FT,

Germany’s financial regulator has demanded documents from Deutsche Bank as part of an investigation into potential manipulation of gold and silver prices.

 

...

 

Deutsche Bank is one of five banks that take part in the twice-daily “London gold fixing”, and one of three banks that take part in the equivalent process for silver.

 

...

 

Some bankers believe BaFin has come under pressure to show it is willing to get tough on suspected market manipulation. It was widely seen to have been slow to respond to the concerns over possible manipulation in the forex market expressed by other regulators around the world earlier this year.

 

Although the gold and silver fixings are, like Libor, set by small groups of banks, they contrast with the process for setting Libor in that they are based on trading activity rather than theoretical quotes.

 

...

 

The visit to Deutsche offices signals that BaFin now has greater concerns over the precious metals markets. Officials have asked to observe documents and processes related to precious metals trading as well as to interview bankers, the person said.

 

...

 

The other banks that take part in the gold fixing are Barclays, Bank of Nova Scotia, HSBC and Société Générale. The other banks involved in silver fixing are Bank of Nova Scotia and HSBC. As the only German member of either fixing, Deutsche is the only bank to come under BaFin’s remit.

Of course, despite day after day of closing price smackdowns (and the very occasaional vertical ramp), we are sure the regulators will find no wrong doing... for, as we noted here, this manipulation is by design, not malfeasance...it's for your own good...

 


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Fri, 12/13/2013 - 19:52 | Link to Comment deKevelioc
deKevelioc's picture

LOL

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 19:56 | Link to Comment CounterPartyVice
CounterPartyVice's picture

You know they call it "fixing" for a reason ...

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 19:58 | Link to Comment mvsjcl
mvsjcl's picture

Absolutely a sham.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:01 | Link to Comment Occident Mortal
Occident Mortal's picture

Despicable human scum.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:45 | Link to Comment Manthong
Fri, 12/13/2013 - 22:03 | Link to Comment philipat
philipat's picture

On a related matter, why has nobody submitted a Freedom of Information request to release details of the CFTC Silver manipulation investigation?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 22:26 | Link to Comment Harlequin001
Harlequin001's picture

Because there's nothing to find.

There was no investigation, it's activities extended as far as putting an 'investigators' sign on the door and that's it...

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 22:54 | Link to Comment philipat
philipat's picture

We know they were given the testimony of at least two JPM whistleblowers. My guess is that JPM was always acting on behalf of the Fed, which is above the law under the MSF. Hence the conclusion that nobody was breaking any laws. But it would be interesting to have that confirmed?

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 01:33 | Link to Comment zaphod
zaphod's picture

Germany should keep quiet for at least the next 7 years until they get half of their gold out of the FED.

Any serious attempt to expose the Gold market might have the side effect of causing "unexpected delays" of the FED's slow as molasses delivery (which some might call a FED default)

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 09:21 | Link to Comment Papasmurf
Papasmurf's picture

On the other hand, if the Germans will end up taking cash settlement, it would be in their advantage to have the price correct.

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 11:11 | Link to Comment JamesBond
JamesBond's picture

the US can't afford to buy back all the gold it needs to make good on the gold it is supposed to be holding for other countries at peak prices!

smack down that price so we can buy on the dip

 

 

jb

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 11:53 | Link to Comment Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

JPM is a major shareholder of the FED. So they act of their behalf, yes. They also act on behalf of the US Treasury. And if you look at their derivatives book you will come to the conclusion that they are Godzilla of the marketplace (a crazed monster).

Who is going to confirm anything? The entire US gov't has beeen compromised or taken over. There is no rule of law when the DOJ, SEC, FBI, etc...are not enforcing exisiting laws and regulations. That's the whole point. A sham investigation leads nowhere (see any other US false flag event). Sadly, the MSM is nothing but misinformation and propaganda now.

Sorry, but no help is coming.  

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 19:55 | Link to Comment ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

Joe "the forehead" Bologna will claim this is a witch hunt.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/25101821/

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 22:09 | Link to Comment akak
akak's picture

Personally, I always thought that a suit and tie looks rather anachronistic on a macrocephalic.  Like putting reading glasses on your dog.

I believe that an institutional gown (open in the back, of course), or perhaps a straightjacket, would be much  more appropriate to Mr. Bologna's demonstrated level of intelligence.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 19:52 | Link to Comment nope-1004
nope-1004's picture

Duh.... wonder if it's true?

 

 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 19:59 | Link to Comment Sufiy
Sufiy's picture


Peter Degraaf: Here Is How You Will Know If The Gold Bull Market Has Ended

Peter Degraaf presents very interesting set of charts in his big picture view at the Gold market. With JPMorgan chasing Bicoin success in the bubble exercise top Russian Sberbank is talking about its own version of the Crypto-Currency. Banks would like to control any currency in circulation and you have another 42 to chose from right now. Once this brave experiment with "Gold 2.0" - distraction of 99% from the real values ends in tears, Gold will remind everybody about its qualities and why China is buying so much Gold this year.

 

http://sufiy.blogspot.co.uk/2013/12/peter-degraaf-here-is-how-you-will-k...

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:00 | Link to Comment Going Loco
Going Loco's picture

And in other gold market news there have been some unusual trips to China by the British leaders. Something up? http://www.financeandeconomics.org/the-great-game-accelerates/

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 22:19 | Link to Comment williambanzai7
williambanzai7's picture

They are real estate finders

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:02 | Link to Comment WTFUD
WTFUD's picture

Save yourself some taxpayer euros and get your friends at nsa to hand over the emails. 3 2 1.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:07 | Link to Comment Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

    Meh... Let me know what the fine is after Terrance and Phillip finish their investigation.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:11 | Link to Comment Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

Fuck all of these shitheads, with their sham 'investigations'.

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 14:55 | Link to Comment Seeking Aphids
Seeking Aphids's picture

They need to be careful.....there is sometimes a rotten apple in the investigative barrel.....one honest man can do a lot of harm........although I admit I can't think of any recent examples.....and I am now thinking back to the Greeks......oh well, never mind....good post!

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:13 | Link to Comment seek
seek's picture

I think the probe is legitimate -- and if they don't speed up the repatriation of Germany's gold, they'll start leaking the truth until they do. Germany's gold miraculously returned ahead of schedule? Well, the probe found nothing, nothing at all.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:58 | Link to Comment Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

  Investigations are based on the premise of integrity.

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 03:26 | Link to Comment Jaspergers
Jaspergers's picture

Good point. 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:16 | Link to Comment logicalman
logicalman's picture

HSBC seem to be heavily involved.

Not saying they are any worse than the other perps, but, they were born out of the opium wars and are still heavily involved in the drugs trade.

I'm sure this doesn't make them untrustworthy.

Of course, gold and silver are not manipulated.

 

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:25 | Link to Comment SweetDoug
SweetDoug's picture

'

'

'

Ah… Let me look into the future!

 

I foresee a hefty fine… No one admits culpability and life goes on…

 

•J•
V-V

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:27 | Link to Comment no more banksters
no more banksters's picture

"Despite the swap scandal of "fixing" the Greek deficit by Goldman Sachs, for which the Greek government paid the bank at least 300 million euros, (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/14/business/global/14debt.html?pagewanted...), Goldman Sachs is included in the Primary Dealers list, in order to continue providing "valuable services - advice" to the Greek government. Another two banks, Merrill Lynch and Citigroup, are included in the Primary Dealers list, despite that according to the US Financial Crisis Inquiry Commission (FCIC) report, together with Goldman Sachs, are those responsible for the "creation" of 30% of the destructive financial "tools" known as CDOs during 2004-2007, which contributed significantly to the creation of the housing bubble in US. Two more banks which had significant presence in CDOs that time are Deutsche Bank and UBS, which also continue to be two of the twenty two Primary Dealers."

http://failedevolution.blogspot.gr/2013/11/an-example-of-how-banking-car...

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:33 | Link to Comment q99x2
q99x2's picture

Arrest Loyd Blankfein for doing God's work.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:33 | Link to Comment Father Lucifer
Father Lucifer's picture

2 more physical ounces 4 me today.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:38 | Link to Comment walküre
walküre's picture

Who has a vested interest in manipulating the gold market? The establishment in trying to protect the status quo including all Western governments, potentially Asian governments.

If gold price were allowed to trade freely the ponzi game would be impossible to control at this point. Gold would have run past the $1,900 mark straight into the stratosphere once people had seen the meteoric rise and understood TRILLIONS in debt and unfunded liabilities.

I'd say that many have woken up and realize this cannot go on forever and the governments and their central banks or the other way around can only do one thing, print into oblivion or die.

They can never return to sound accounting practices or prices set by a free and uncontrolled market. They cannot win the faith game without the scam. Whether in politics, in finance or in religions. The foundation is faith and if faith erodes their only game is manipulation or enforcement of faith. We've been here before over and over and over again.

Same shit, different century.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 20:39 | Link to Comment Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

I'm Shocked.  SHOCKED, I say!

In case you haven't heard me say it the first 6 times... Name something of value that has NOT been manipulated in man's history.  Duh!

Next!?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 21:02 | Link to Comment StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Hmm, dilithium crystal futures?

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 21:08 | Link to Comment oddjob
oddjob's picture

Time.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 21:35 | Link to Comment nmewn
nmewn's picture

Yes, interesting comment oddjob.

Time is the one thing never recovered. One can spend time chasing stawks & bonds & bytes...but time...you cannot get back whether one wins or loses.

I used to harp on this constantly (even when an active "trader") but no one seemed to care or listen. "The market (thus the individual) has recovered all its losses" was /is the common casino refrain.

No they haven't I said.

Time was lost when they could have been gaining. How is that loss valued in order to make one whole? They're back to even with a loss...of time. Really a matter of a warped perspective of money not time IMO. Not to mention inflation (the depreciation of) what the past monetary loss is measured in...that is, dollars, yen, euro etc.

Time can be abused.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 21:23 | Link to Comment f16hoser
f16hoser's picture

Perhaps, the Banksters have Fucked with the wrong Gold...... Now, rich, old money, want something done to bring justice to the feet of these banbker assholes. Personally, I would like to see them all dead at the bottom of the ocean.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 21:46 | Link to Comment monger
monger's picture

of course it only becomes interesting if it links with other efforts such as in the probably farcical one in UK, not to nexessarily adtially bring about any changes on there own merit but maybe a beginning realization by the fed and other manipulators, along with other factors being developed, that this could be a good time to start backing off and let it go, and make some money for the long jpms and others.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 21:56 | Link to Comment Quaderratic Probing
Quaderratic Probing's picture

Gold goes up on a Semi Log Periodic breaks on parabolic rise and falls, classic bubble now burst. Only those who bought the top or thought infinite rise was the pay off are looking for conspiracy.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 22:51 | Link to Comment whopper
whopper's picture

Yea, the asian gold markets are always looking for the semi-log periodic breaks on parabolic rise and falls..................

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 22:55 | Link to Comment monger
monger's picture

not only those, don't you think? look at the timing and volumes of the usually before market gold takedowns and tell us they're normal trading actvity? only a blind cleric could be so blind.

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 00:06 | Link to Comment Quaderratic Probing
Quaderratic Probing's picture

http://arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/1012/1012.4118.pdf Nothing new under the Sun, seen coming years ago

http://arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/0801/0801.4341.pdf Other crashes the same

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 09:02 | Link to Comment RaceToTheBottom
RaceToTheBottom's picture

Very interesting article.  Thanks for posting it.  I only read the first one, but still enjoyed it, especially the later half where they discussed variations around a central path. 

Interesting quote:

"In this equation gold prices would theoretically goto the infinity (singularity point 1) approximately at the end of December 2014 (or autumn 2014 with an earlier starting point of hyperbolic growth trajectory)."

Love those infinity runs!

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 13:20 | Link to Comment Quaderratic Probing
Quaderratic Probing's picture

Read the second one and you will see the price never makes it there, so those dates are like price walls the failure happens long before infinity, in fact it has already has broken.

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 14:43 | Link to Comment Seeking Aphids
Seeking Aphids's picture

As an academic you should know that if one starts with a faulty premise your conclusions will be worthless...shit in shit out.....your premise that gold went through a vertiginous rise and then crashed is entirely out of line with historical reality. Gold did not go through a parabolic rise of the type it experienced in the 80's. Neither has it undergone a crash. It is trading in a tight range and has been for some time.  From a chart analysis perspective (which I don't follow) it looks as though gold has been increasingly tightly wound and is due for a sharp move (upwards?). From a macro perspective I think we should see gold move up in 2014 as it becomes clear that ZIRP/QE will be with us for a long time and that there will be no magical recovery. Currency debasement continues apace as does the destruction of the wealth/savings of the middle class in the WEST. A global rebalancing is underway and will end with many in Asia reaching levels of economic well-being that were restricted previously to the Western middle and upper classes.  As gold is a traditional store of value and cultural icon/symbol of wealth in Asia, it should do well given the increasing purchasing power of the Asian middle classes. This is the macro trend...ignore it at your investing peril, QP.

Fri, 12/13/2013 - 22:53 | Link to Comment tmosley
tmosley's picture

All fucking bankers must fucking hang.

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 03:28 | Link to Comment mijev
mijev's picture

Douche Bank.

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 03:32 | Link to Comment Kina
Kina's picture

Thye should just go straight to Timmy and Ben... why waste time with this charade.

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 09:45 | Link to Comment Sufiy
Sufiy's picture

It diid not take too long - action plan to kill Bitcoin:

 


European Banking Authority Warns Consumers On Virtual Currencies


EBA joins with its warning China, South Korea, Norway, France and other financial authorities from different countries. This warning and presented footprint for actions by authorities in order to attack and seize the assets involved is the most explicit among the ones we have seen so far. Unless Bitcoin is not the Special Op created by the FED to celebrate its Anniversary and 100 Year War On Gold, U.S. will follow soon with its actions. You can guess yourself whether it will be difficult to find evidence that some transactions on the particular exchange were involved in criminal activity and can affect Everybody Involved. Major risks according to EBA: You may lose your money on the exchange platform
  Your money may be stolen from your digital wallet
  You are not protected when using virtual currencies as a means of payment
  The value of your virtual currency can change quickly, and could even drop to zero
  Transactions in virtual currency may be misused for criminal activities, including money laundering

And the punchline and footprint for further actions against Crypto-Currencies:

"Transactions in virtual currencies are public, but the owners and recipients of these transactions are not. Transactions are largely untraceable, and provide virtual currency consumers with a high degree of anonymity. It is therefore possible that the virtual currency network will be used for transactions associated with criminal activities, including money laundering. This misuse could affect you, as law enforcement agencies may decide to close exchange platforms and prevent you from accessing or using any funds that the platforms may be holding for you." http://sufiy.blogspot.co.uk/2013/12/european-banking-authority-warns.htm...

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 10:14 | Link to Comment Jameson18
Jameson18's picture

Blah blah blah nothing is goin to happen. Its all smoke and mirrors.

 

//
Sat, 12/14/2013 - 11:26 | Link to Comment Pumpkin
Pumpkin's picture

Since TPTB has confiscated the gold and silver coins of the people and replaced it with worthless fiat, isn't it a bit ridiculous to be discussing weather or not it is being manipulated?  Manipulated seems a bit of a weak word here.

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 14:00 | Link to Comment OldE_Ant
OldE_Ant's picture

lol.  We investigated and found everything to be perfectly on the up and up.

Trust, goes a long way and it appears we are quickly running out of it.

Sat, 12/14/2013 - 16:46 | Link to Comment Misanthropia
Misanthropia's picture

Keep "fixing" so I can buy moar!!

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!