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"The Chinese Don't Want Dollars Anymore, They Want Gold" - London's Gold Vaults Are Empty: This Is Why

Tyler Durden's picture


Today gold slid under $1200 per ounce, dropping to a level not seen in three years. Judging by the price action one would think that gold is not only overflowing from precious metal vaults everywhere, but can be found thrown away on the street, where nobody even bothers to pick it up. One would be wrong. In fact, as Bloomberg's Ken Goldman reports, "you could walk into a vault in London and they were packed to the rafter with gold, and the gold would trade from me to you to somebody else. You could walk into these vaults today and they are virtually empty. All that gold has been transferred out of London, 26 million ounces...." To find out where it has gone and why it is never coming back, watch the clip below (spoiler alert: listen for the line: "the Chinese don't want US dollars anymore, they want gold").


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Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:04 | 4262692 G.O.O.D
G.O.O.D's picture

we so solly that our garden now.

Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:10 | 4262713 Four chan
Four chan's picture

a foolish people and their money are soon parted.

this is now america, its over. they won.

Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:12 | 4262720 kliguy38
kliguy38's picture

There's two sides to this trade...........PHYSICAL and PAPER........that's all you need to know........eventually one loses big. If you're paper trading with the boyz then you're playing their game.......listen to papasmurf

Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:15 | 4262740 Crisismode
Crisismode's picture

The Chinese will be buying at $1100.


The Chinese will be buying at $1000.


The Chinese will be buying at $900.


The Chinese will be buying at $800.


The Chinese will be buying at $700.


Ad Nauseum.



Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:18 | 4262743 kliguy38
kliguy38's picture

They might.......but you won't be

Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:30 | 4262782 layman_please
layman_please's picture

can anyone follow their twisted logic? so if there will be no gold to have in 2014, then that will be the reason it will fall down to 700? and that it hasn't already is only due to china buying with both hands? it only has few more days? until the vaults are empty? nice to know. cheers.

Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:37 | 4262805 TeamDepends
TeamDepends's picture

Reason?  Logic?  They caught the last train for the coast....

Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:48 | 4262809 Manthong
Manthong's picture

Confooscious  say..

Wise guy gringo with bald head and gray beard get large wong stuck while wrong.

But the yellen will be swellin' while she be be smellin' from the jellin'.

Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:56 | 4262837 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

This story was up all day over at Silver Doctors (and other sites). Why does it get posted in the middle of the night around here? Not the first time I've seen this either.

It's a BIG fucking devolopment if true.


Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:58 | 4262841 kliguy38
kliguy38's picture

yeah pig.....I wuz wunderin' the same thing too........looks like its gettin' some love though....even in the middle of the night

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:02 | 4262855 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

“Platinum, we talked about South Africa - that was very good“

Need moar labour strikes and mass shootings, c'mon gawddamnit get those prices up!


Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:35 | 4262906 IridiumRebel
IridiumRebel's picture

You cuss too much IR.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:54 | 4262934 DoChenRollingBearing
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The Bearing Guy got his gold yesterday (0.25 oz Gold Eagle) paid for with BTC.  Also yesterday I met with a local who sold me BTC for CA$H, we did the deal, yes, at a Starbucks (respecting "tradition").

"Bitcoin Insider" straightens me out on a few points.

And while is gone, is now broadcasting the same (Andrew Hodel's) information in near-real-time about BTC trading via the world's BTC exchanges.

"Fun With Bitcoin for Beginners: Part Five"



An Italian lady (a friend of my wife) came by this evening.  I asked her "WTF" is going on in Italy (no, I was more polite...).  She told me that things are terrible there and getting worse.

And that the Chinese are moving in and buying places in Tuscany, vineyards, "trophy properties", etc.  And teh Italians ain't happy about it...

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:54 | 4262944 IridiumRebel
IridiumRebel's picture

Dang it entice me with your libertarian digitry. Stop and you may just make IR sell some stawks for a BTC or two.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 01:06 | 4262962 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Fonestar told me China really wants to corner the bitcoin market, and is trying to amass a surplus of physical gold with which it can do so.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 01:20 | 4262987 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Chinese Proverb:

Wai su man bai me ta lu, no bai pei pa.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 01:36 | 4263005 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Confucius say "[I]f you don't hold it you don't own it, and I don't want to hear any bullshit about digital wallets, bitchez."

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 06:38 | 4263075 i-dog
i-dog's picture

The Chinese will indeed wish to grab (and hold) physical gold ... until the State tells them they must transact in GlobalCoin.

Governments will soon (2 more years?) all be transacting with their dependents, err, citizens in cyber-currency/s.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 06:51 | 4263249 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture






Wudda ya mean I can't get gold out of my ETF?

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 07:35 | 4263269 negative rates
negative rates's picture

Gold is meant fer spendin, not savin.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 11:26 | 4263755 BaBaBouy
BaBaBouy's picture

GERMANY Is Waiting 7 Years To Get Just 20% Of Their GOLD Back From The NYC FED!!!!!!!!!!!


We Now come To A FORK In The Road, Go With The Chinese, Or Go With GreenShpan Bernanky And Yelling... You Have A Choice... 

Which Way You Go ???

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 12:03 | 4263904 OutLookingIn
OutLookingIn's picture


They who have the gold - RULE!

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 19:17 | 4265545 zaphod
zaphod's picture

Forget the chinese

I don't want dollars anymore, and want gold instead.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 20:06 | 4265637 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Speak for yourself I am BTFBTCD!!

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 20:13 | 4265655 zaphod
zaphod's picture


I'll bite. Searched all over and can't find what that means.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 20:19 | 4265668 fonestar
fonestar's picture




Fri, 12/20/2013 - 20:54 | 4265740 zaphod
zaphod's picture


No idea why someone would downvote that...

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 13:36 | 4264278 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

I have hunch geman gold reclamation news was delayed abotu two years late deliberly after the cash for gold craze. Notice how that has vanished? then the news comes out? Why no more cash for gold advertisements up in everybodys face?

All I know for sure is shenanegins. I'm calling out sheenanegins going on in the physical gold market 

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 15:39 | 4264941 daveO
daveO's picture

I still see the ads. Bet it's going to China, too.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 02:36 | 4263067 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

Ho Lee Fuk

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 04:21 | 4263156 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Yu no zhou king!

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 01:06 | 4262967 Dugald
Dugald's picture


Nurts.......leave it the Cosa Nostra....they fix

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 02:50 | 4263083 holgerdanske
holgerdanske's picture

This is true. The Italians are very close to boiling over. I saw the Financial Police threaten a small Chinese girl on a train from Italy to Switzerland. Three grown men demanded that she empty her bag to search for cash money. She resisted them calmly and politely asking for ID. They eventually stopped the train, but she was left in peace after a lot of passengers got upset.

The Italians in charge are fascists, they have been ruled by fascists and EU technocrats, they have lost a lot of respect for the police the government and the the rest of EU.

This applies to almost any other European country. The rulers have become faceless bureaucrats, appointed, not even elected. More and more the national agenda is subjugated according to the international agenda, and people are loosing faith. This will be the last generation where we can expect to live our lives in peace without fighting for our freedom.

The international elite press ahead, "privatizing" = stealing public assets like roads, water, sanitation, health, policing, security, you name it, they steal it. First we pay for it through taxes, then it is stolen and we have to pay for it again through extra taxes. It can't continue, it can't last. You can only drive a people so far up the creek, and they will turn and bite.

The indoctrination of school children makes it difficult for people to speak freely, because there is a racism paragraph somewhere threatening to silence you. But the take over by Chinese is a disaster for many places on earth, and it is one that can only be countered by resistance. This is not something you can be polite about. If you don't like it, prevent it. The politicians have long enough run roughshod over the local populations and demanded that the world become "multicultural".

I think the local populations around the globe have had about enough of this "cultural enrichment". People in need should be looked after, but people that overwhelm, overburden and overextend the locals will be resisted and rejected.

Money should not be the only determinant in this play, because the Chinese can now buy about anything with their fake dollars, and soon even more with their real gold. Europe and the USA is fast on the way to become the servant of China.

The banksters, IMF, the monetary elite like Bernanke and his ilk before him the international gang of hereditary politicians, have some serious problems to answer for. They will soon be able to add another, social resistance and defiance, which can quickly lead to resistance and insurrection.

We, the people, have had it.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 07:58 | 4263303 29.5 hours
29.5 hours's picture




So, this is all the fault of the Chinese? The world is simpler than I had thought...

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 11:29 | 4263775 debtor of last ...
debtor of last resort's picture

He didn't say that.

Sat, 12/21/2013 - 04:37 | 4266264 trader1
trader1's picture


Sat, 12/21/2013 - 10:08 | 4266446 Bendromeda Strain
Bendromeda Strain's picture

But the take over by Chinese is a disaster for many places on earth, and it is one that can only be countered by resistance.

Maybe you could start by parsing this...

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 08:21 | 4263328 fiftybagger
fiftybagger's picture

Wait.  Now it's somehow the Chinese' fault that Europe is becoming a socialist backwater hellhole?

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 20:17 | 4265661 angel_of_joy
angel_of_joy's picture

What do you mean by "is becoming"??

That happened 10 years ago.

Sat, 12/21/2013 - 04:36 | 4266265 trader1
trader1's picture

i'll take europe any day over the usa.  

give me a break.

Sat, 12/21/2013 - 10:18 | 4266461 BoNeSxxx
BoNeSxxx's picture

I, for one, will not take any European country seriously until they convert to proper toilets.

What the hell?  Those little tall bucket-looking things?  I still giggle every time I sit on one.

Sat, 12/21/2013 - 11:16 | 4266506 RealityCheque
RealityCheque's picture

Yankee shithouses are insane. Way too much water. It's like taking a dump in a swimming pool.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 09:28 | 4263398 Doña K
Doña K's picture

What if the megabanksters wait until China has cashed out all the Dollars and all the gold is bought out and make a sharp u-turn ala Volker at 22% - 25% ? 

We are 25% physical and 75% cash

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 12:41 | 4264038 donsluck
donsluck's picture

It cannot be done without horrific consequences for the national debt. Unless the USA repudiates, we are stuck in ZIRP land. The 70s/80s are long gone.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 04:33 | 4263167 Lost My Shorts
Lost My Shorts's picture

The Chinese have a great system.  They are simultaneously refugees from communist PRC oppression and merchantilist aggressors destroying Western economies.  All they want is freedom of speech ... and to own your house.  Good luck getting rid of them.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 07:36 | 4263278 Joenobody12
Joenobody12's picture

Right on. The Chiense is coming for your house, your wife and your kids too. You did not do this to yourself. IT is the Chineses fault. 

Sat, 12/21/2013 - 10:15 | 4266449 Bendromeda Strain
Bendromeda Strain's picture

If you have to sell to pay the wages of your debt slavery, why is that the buyers fault? China/Chinese playing the hand they have been dealt.

Don't hate the playa - hate the game...

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 06:53 | 4263252 Prisoners_dilemna
Prisoners_dilemna's picture is gone

However is here.


Same site, different domain name.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 20:04 | 4265628 fonestar
fonestar's picture is still working.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 09:43 | 4263438 Fire Angel
Fire Angel's picture

Hey, dude. Congrats on that!!! I've been on the edge of my seat over the last week or so wondering how that trade would work out for you. I'm glad you've now got your shiny in the palm of your (grease-lubed? LOL) hands. 

Fire Angel 

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 10:50 | 4263658 thestarl
thestarl's picture

They seem to be on a property buying orgy at the moment DoChenRB very very active down here in Oz and right across the board 

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:34 | 4262908 IridiumRebel
IridiumRebel's picture

Right cuz it's the metals that are the problem and not the slave driving owners of the mines. Oh if we all could have intangible digitry, a sheep marketplace if you will....problem solved. Keystroke Karma will become you.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:06 | 4262859 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Let's recap, record demand from China (imports), record exports from the USA, refiners going berserk in Switerland and now this.....near empty vaults in London.

You got to be fucking kidding me that the price of gold "should be" lower in light of these facts. It's like the Twilight Zone these days...

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:11 | 4262871 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

It's like the Twilight Zone these days...

Because you don't understand it = twilight zone. How much has gold demand fallen in India again? Globally?

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:16 | 4262880 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Suck a bag of dicks James.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 09:36 | 4263430 CosmicDebris
CosmicDebris's picture

"Suck a bag of dicks James."

That's the funniest fuckin thing I've heard all day.

Thanks. I needed that.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 11:47 | 4263852 fooshorter
fooshorter's picture

"That sucks a fat bag of dicks"



I wanted to class up the place.

Sat, 12/21/2013 - 08:31 | 4266374 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



Pull the ejection handle James.....get the hell out of there man!

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 05:00 | 4263187 Crash N. Burn
Crash N. Burn's picture

"How much has gold demand fallen in India again?"

Amazing how much it fell after importing gold was banned.

"Informed precious metals investors are well aware of the tremendous “squeeze” placed upon gold demand in India, via the draconian suppression of imports. Regular readers of my work understand that this gold-squeeze was, in fact, instigated by the One Bank – through placing enormous pressure on India’s government.

This economic blackmail took the form of attacking India’s currency, the rupee, in global currency markets, and driving its value to record-lows, until the government of India capitulated. With the global rigging of currency markets (by these same Banksters) now being fully-exposed; this is nothing more than “business as usual” for the One Bank.

But as readers are frequently reminded, actions have consequences. When the supply of gold to the world’s largest precious metals market (and most-astute precious metals investors) was severely restricted; Indians switched to silver – and in a big way.

Even by June of this year, the Indian stampede into silver was already apparent. As noted in a previous commentary; it was at that time that the One Bank was maximizing its efforts at Indian gold-suppression (resulting in a total ban on imports) because monthly Indian gold imports had exploded to an annualized rate of around 2,000 tonnes/year.

In the silver market meanwhile, by the end of May; India had already imported over 2,400 tonnes of silver to meet surging demand, versus 1,900 tonnes in all of 2012. By the end of October, India’s total silver imports amounted to over 4,600 tonnes. Barring a complete collapse; 2013 silver imports in India will hit an all-time high – eclipsing the previous high-water mark of 5,048 tonnes, set back in 2008."

Gold-Starved Indians Still Soaking-Up Silver


 Maybe not so amazing.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 06:27 | 4263230 giggler321
giggler321's picture

Ofcourse in your argument you never presented a reason why the Indian government might want to limit imports?  Truth hurts...


Fri, 12/20/2013 - 06:46 | 4263242 Crash N. Burn
Crash N. Burn's picture

Ah the old "current account deficit" bullshit, lmfao:

"What is phony here is the lie behind the mythical “current account deficit” of India. As the world’s largest importer of gold bullion, each year India has a large out-flow of the bankers’ bogus paper currencies and a large in-flow of real money: gold. Obviously you cannot have a “current account deficit” (or surplus) in exchanging one form of money for another."

Gold-Confiscation Coming To India?


Truth is the Indian government (like other governments) is betraying  the people in favour of you know who!
Fri, 12/20/2013 - 08:11 | 4263281 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



Gold-Confiscation Coming To India?


Yeah that's gonna happen.....those guys have been operating the world's most efficient black market for thousands of years now.

They have it down to a freakin art.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 09:21 | 4263386 Crash N. Burn
Crash N. Burn's picture

 Unintended consequences incomming? *disclaimer - wall of text

"As is typical of human behavior in any sphere, when demand (i.e. desire) in one form is restricted or prohibited, it morphs into a new form. In the case of Indian demand for bullion, as has been well-documented, some of that demand has moved into the exploding Indian blackmarket for gold. Gold-smuggling into India has now regressed to the same levels which existed before India “liberalized” its market – precisely to eliminate the scourge of gold-smuggling.

But much of this demand also simply morphs into “frustrated demand”, pent-up demand; the economic equivalent of a spring being even more-tightly coiled. The desire for the good (in this case gold) remains, and (as with any un-met desire) if anything it increases with the passage of time.

The obvious example here is China. Until the middle of last decade; purchasing gold in any form other than jewelry was tightly-restricted (and nearly prohibited) in China. What happened when China liberalized its domestic gold market?

Despite being the world’s largest producer of gold; gold imports into China have steadily risen, and now will easily exceed 1,000 tons this year. That is double the amount of gold which the central banks used to dump onto the market each year, which by itself was enough to permanently stifle the global gold market. Clearly after being deprived of gold bullion products for many years, the Chinese people are now buying with both hands.

Meanwhile, with central banks themselves now buying (on a net basis) more than 500 tons per year; this alone amounts to nearly a 2,500 ton/year swing in the supply/demand equation – in a world which mines less than 3,000 tons per year (in total), and that number is now in decline.

Now we have pent-up demand being built-up in other traditional gold markets in Asia. Sooner or later the internal problems caused by the brute-force suppression of gold demand will be worse than the threats/coercion of the One Bank, and these gold markets will be liberalized – as is now taking place in Sri Lanka. Then, like the explosion of gold-demand in China, we will see similar (proportional) tidal waves of demand hit the market when these temporarily suppressed markets are liberalized.

But I’ve left the most-important consequence of this demand-suppression for last: the decoupling of prices in these markets. What was previously described as simply higher and higher “premiums” for the purchase of real bullion (but with one price) is now being simply described as two prices for gold.

This is far more significant than mere semantics, and there could be no better illustration of this important concept than a recent headline:

Smuggled gold has its own price in India"

Gold Market Secretly Decoupling


Banksters have created two gold prices in India and the only way to restore it is to liberalize it (as was done in China). Hold a ball underwater - what happens when you let go?

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 19:14 | 4265532 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture


The reason the demand is down is completely fucking irrelevant to the point - demand is down, gold price is down - makes a lot of sense when you look at it. No big gawddamn mystery there.

Demand may be up in china, but 28% down in India (alone). It ain't the fucking twilight zone, ok? 


Sat, 12/21/2013 - 08:30 | 4266377 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



No....not OK.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:37 | 4262917 G.O.O.D
G.O.O.D's picture

I have figured it out lille piggy.. If China has all the gold, there wont be any for sale, so the  price will drop to 0 b/c there is no market any longer.



i am a genius


<<pats himself on back...


Ye all blow the trumpets as GOOD is a fvking number one certified genius!

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 06:49 | 4263248 new game
new game's picture

to a certain degree you are correct.  phyzz at honker hongy exchange will exchange phyzz at phys clearting price whilst over in fiat phoney merical they will be trading paper gold for who the fuck cares price, because the phyzz will be all gone..the markets will be replaced on e-bay, kitco ect. that exchange of phys will set price.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 01:12 | 4262974 Dugald
Dugald's picture

Many mines are scraping the bottom of the barrel, take more muck to yeild an ounce of gold....

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 01:14 | 4262977 Dugald
Dugald's picture

Many mines are scraping the bottom of the barrel, takes more muck to yield an ounce of gold....

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 09:36 | 4263420 Cacete de Ouro
Cacete de Ouro's picture

So, this Bloomberg guy Ken Goldman talk about walking into a London vault a few years ago and walking into a London vault today. Hold on...! Nobody just walks into any London vaults. This guy is either just lying or else is on hallucinogens. And the interviewer didn't take him up on this....

Maybe the vaults have low inventory levels but this guy did not provide any proof. Export data and ETF data is not proof.



Fri, 12/20/2013 - 10:02 | 4263498 eclectic syncretist
eclectic syncretist's picture

And as of last night the total COMEX registered gold dropped by a quite substantial 20% to less than 500,000 ounces.  The bitch is about to break.  JPM has already stopped more than 500,000 ounces this month alone, and they won't be getting it in physical gold.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 05:33 | 4263208 jballz
jballz's picture


desperate much?

Nobody gives a shit. You know what China will do? Lease it all back to th bankers, You know what you and all your goldbug bottomfeeder stash amounts to? Not enough to move the market a nickel, and you all lose,

Gold will be back to 300 in a couple years. Worst invetment ever. 

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 06:41 | 4263238 caShOnlY
caShOnlY's picture

Nobody gives a shit. You know what China will do? Lease it all back to th bankers

China did that back in the 1990's with and lost it.  Unlike most americans Chinese learn lesson one time.  Now run along and buy some STAWKS for your 401(k) because the bull run in stawks is different this time. 

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 07:42 | 4263283 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



Gold will be back to 300 in a couple years. Worst invetment ever.


Priced in what?


Are you skipping class again?

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 08:53 | 4263354 jballz
jballz's picture


must hurt watching us stock bulls profit huge while your shiney metal drops like a ,,,, rock.


thanks for the investment wisdom see you at gc700 and sp3000

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 10:03 | 4263490 Harlequin001
Harlequin001's picture

Yeah, makes me cringe every time I look at the screen.

Do us a favour will you, come back and let us all know how you get on when interest rates pop, which they seem to be in the process of doing now.

Then we can discuss how much my sides hurt trying to find dumb fucks like you who are too stupid to know what they're doing.

Where've you stock bulls been for the last ten years? Let me guess, trying to ectricate your head from your arse so you could see the screen? That must have really hurt...

We've been making money dude, still up 400% last count...

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 12:57 | 4264099 donsluck
donsluck's picture

Hmm, you actually make a good argument against gold.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 10:23 | 4263562 Billy Sol Estes
Billy Sol Estes's picture

Right, because we're all furiously hitting the sell button whenever it rises $20.

At the end of the day, you'll only have a certificate of participation...

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 23:14 | 4266026 Deathrips
Deathrips's picture

Yes my good man...see i have a bet on gold, id like to turn into gold?


Cue retarded look.


See how that works.


Stack it.



Sat, 12/21/2013 - 07:13 | 4266330 Keyser
Keyser's picture

Hmm, someone doesn't have a clue about investment strategies. 

Sat, 12/21/2013 - 08:28 | 4266368 Agstacker
Agstacker's picture

Shoot, why stop and S & P 3000?  I say S & P 1,000,000!  Stawks to the moon!

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 19:03 | 4265515 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

Lots of time has to be spend writing articles pumping bitcoin.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 19:21 | 4265551 zaphod
zaphod's picture

People are spending lots of time trying to educate people and open their eyes to new possiblities. The vast majority of bitcoin supports are long-term believers, that is different from a short term pump.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:28 | 4262892 CognacAndMencken
CognacAndMencken's picture

I'm not sure where the makers of this video are getting their data, but it's absolutely wrong. Please consider the following information when making your opinion:

The most recent data on foreign Treasury holdings shows that China is actually *increasing* their holdings of US debt. In October 2013, China held $1.3045T in US debt, a $10.7B increase from September and the second highest month ever. The highest ever was July 2011 when China held $1.3149T. For the entire year, China's holdings have *increased* by over $84B.

Just FYI....

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:53 | 4262945 James_Cole
Fri, 12/20/2013 - 01:43 | 4262998 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

The different Tylers have been all over the map regarding China, from gold, to the strength/weakness of their economy & banking system, to their strength in terms of economic & military power on a relative global scale.

It's my belief, and this is not a morally or emotionally driven statement, but one based on the best objective evidence available and in consideration of current events, that China & Japan are both extraordinarily susceptible to full blown economic crises at this point and into the foreseeable future, but for very different reasons (Brazil, INDIA - I am tempted to put India into the "as bad as" basket with China but they're on the road to massive debasement of their currency as an attempted cure-all" - & Russia have massive problems, too, so the entire BRIC wall is weakening).

I'm speaking of the types and depths of crises that could manifest themselves as full blown economic depressions.

For all the talk of the weak growth in the U.S. and the sickness in the EU, Japan & China are the nations to watch in terms of spotting systemic risks to the global economy for at least the next several years, as they both are dealing with major demographic headwinds & mountains of public and private debt (whether officially recognized or not, and whether in the form of recognized or unrecognized losses on spoiled loans) that make western levels of public/private debt look positively mild by comparison.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 02:25 | 4263048 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

China & Japan are both extraordinarily susceptible to full blown economic crises at this point and into the foreseeable future

You saying Chinese ripping every last dollar that isn't nailed down out of the country as fast possible isn't bullish?

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 02:38 | 4263065 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

China, of the emerging market economies, probably has bigger economic and financial problems than just about any country aside from India, and that's a toss-up.

in fact, aside from the PIIGS, which are alleged "developed" economies and fully integrated with their EU brethren, China's probably facing some of the biggest issues of any major economy in the world, and its provincial banks are in deep shit (the extent to which they are has been MASSIVELY understated).

The whole, repeated ad nauseam meme about China dumping the USD and being on the cusp of "winning" the global game of economic & financial chess is 100% unmitigated horseshit of the highest grade.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 04:57 | 4263183 dark pools of soros
dark pools of soros's picture

what the hell is an economic problem these days??  It seems if you are a country with no economic problems you get your ass blown up



Fri, 12/20/2013 - 07:35 | 4263276 negative rates
negative rates's picture

Well then, by all rights you would have a problem then huh?

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 21:10 | 4265779 Tapeworm
Tapeworm's picture

The US demographic headwinds are bad too. The population is expanding with the least economically valuable people.-Non white trash crackers not so much.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 02:20 | 4263046 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

I can't see web video on this computer, but the size of the pie and the relative (fractional) size of the slice are different issues... Between July 2011 and June 2013 SAFE's f/x reserves have increased by $250 billion from 3.25T to 3.50T.

If China was not diversifying away from UST (and the only sizable sovereign non-USD alternatives are the Brussels Clusterfuck or the radioactive Yen, since Ben has long since bought all their worthless US Agency paper at mark-to-myth valuations and that game is now off the table) then China would now own $1.4T in Treasury securities not $1.3T (so 100B up is actually 100B less than would be required for constant weighting).

(and that's just the official f/x reserve growth and doesn't take into account the financial system spending spree fueled by the PBOC printing press)

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 02:34 | 4263064 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

then China would now own $1.4T in Treasury securities not $1.3T (so 100B up is actually 100B less than would be required for constant weighting).

Yeah but seems that could be explained by a number of things, esp. considering the Chinese economy has been sliding and China being super exposed to credit tightening.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 03:01 | 4263071 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

No one knows what China's actual financial situation is (or how bad it is, to be more precise & accurate), because the PBoC and various Chinese bureaucracies that are charged with compiling & reporting official economic & financial data make the their counterparts in the west look great & totally transparent by comparison.

China is intensely export dependent, whether they wish this to be the case or not, and they will be for a long time.

If the world thinks they saw global consumer deleveraging of the discretionary kind as China's exports were shunned in the wake of the 2008 meltdown, they really should prepare themselves for the real deal that still lay ahead.

The already busted Chinese banks and up-to-their-eyeballs-in-debt Chinese speculators that we somehow rarely read about in the west are not going to solve the sliding Chinese export problem through domestic consumption, and the Chinese Government is cutting subsidization of consumption as I type this, and not growing it (just look at repo trends as but one example).

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 13:01 | 4264117 FredFlintstone
FredFlintstone's picture

He who run in front of car get tired. He who run behind car get exhausted.


He who go through turnstile sideway going to bangcock.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 21:53 | 4265874 drdolittle
drdolittle's picture

Had to read it twice, the only one I got on the first read was bangcock. Thanks.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 12:06 | 4263923 Rafferty
Rafferty's picture

Or else the wide guys know what's really going on and are yet again gaming the market?

Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:46 | 4262818 Thomas
Thomas's picture

I cannot "follow their twisted logic" at all. The guy describes huge demand and then declares the market dead. Unless he is simply confused by the track of the conversation, this guy needs a CAT scan.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 07:55 | 4263299 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



He either works for the government.......or CNBC.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 12:17 | 4263301 InspectorBird
InspectorBird's picture

@Thomas and @layman_please

You misunderstood him... he is saying that unless gold jumps to 1700 dollars before year ends then this will be first year of this bull run when gold finishes a year lower, thats what he means, not that gold will go to 700.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 08:11 | 4263309 InspectorBird
InspectorBird's picture


Fri, 12/20/2013 - 11:01 | 4263312 InspectorBird
InspectorBird's picture


Sun, 12/22/2013 - 00:43 | 4267774 Buck Johnson
Buck Johnson's picture

He told half the truth and then had to tell a twisted story that defy's logic.  China is buying up all the gold and they don't matter how much it drops from manipulation because they know something that many don't.  The Chinese know that the dollar will soon be kaput along with a few other currencies so in their mind the Trillions of dollars in Greenbacks is essentially monopoly money.  So they are buying strategic resources and such with soon to be fake money.  And when it collapses and they try to find out what type of new reserve currency will be used, China will want to have the major corner on as much of the resources as possible. 


So when they make a new reserve currency, they will most definitely have gold as part of the basket of resources to be used for every unit of that currency.  China knows that all countries will try to put a resource in the basket that they have plenty off and it would defeat the purpose of a reserve currency.  They know that the big countries won't go for that but they will go for gold and oil and silver and platinum in the basket.

Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:52 | 4262830 FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

I think the Chinese have been reading ZeroHedge.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 02:46 | 4263080 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

If they have been reading ZH, then they'd know that
Gold + BTC = USD_killer
(not end of Dollar, but end of its status as the Global Reserve Currency).

To date, about 10.5 M Btc of the total 21 M have been mined. Imagine if they backed it by more than the "Good faith of the Free Market", and also backed it by some of these 26 M oz. of gold.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 03:00 | 4263099 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

As counterintuitive as it may seem, big USD bull is about to stampede over all currencies.

The RBI has been the first big emerging market central bank to recognize the inevitability of this and prepare for it, rather than try to swim upstream against the very strong current.

All emerging market economies, and especially those that are more intensely net export reliant, will have to rapidly debase their currencies on a relative basis against King Dollar or literally wither away in the years ahead.

This isn't a moral equation but a mathematical one. Much higher western consumption, and especially that in the U.S. and the wealthier EU nations, is the only hope to cure what ails the global economy at this point.

The now 10 year old commodity bull market is about to take a giant dump as well.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 04:35 | 4263173 FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

Actually, what you say makes lots of sense. China has a practically infinite internal demand for goods and services it could exploit and does to some extent. The problem is that when you run an export economy and purposely debase your currency your goods and production costs are priced for export. Essentially, your own people cannot afford your own products.

China is letting it's currency slowly appreciate but who knows the real price at any given time? I suspect the huge gold buys are part of the end game.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 05:00 | 4263185 dark pools of soros
dark pools of soros's picture

and these things switch..  america will sit with britain on the imperialist old folk bench



Fri, 12/20/2013 - 07:15 | 4263257 caShOnlY
caShOnlY's picture

All emerging market economies, and especially those that are more intensely net export reliant, will have to rapidly debase their currencies on a relative basis against King Dollar or literally wither away in the years ahead.

 that statement presumes the old paradigm "america is the worlds greatest consumer" doesn't it?  it also presumes the credit donkey nation is still allowed to consume on paper debt promises.  I think the "world" is awake to the 30 year american consumption machine driven by easy Al's 'free from gold' policies.  Keeping the sham alive one more decade isn't going to matter much.   Debt is not wealth.  Wealth is not consumption.  Now run along and buy some stawks.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 08:39 | 4263342 fiftybagger
fiftybagger's picture

Don't waste your time on these derps.  When half the population is homeless they will still be shouting USA USA USA

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 04:30 | 4263164 FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

I do not think the Chinese mean to beat us militarily, maybe just balance out better but it will take too long. It's just too big a project. However, I do believe they mean to be a world power equal or superior to the U.S. The way to do it is ecomically. That can be done quickly. In fact, we are sort of beating ourselves. You can see in other articles here in ZH that they are buying gold as fast as they can and keeping their own production. They are minimizing exposure to our debt as well as buying whatever they can with the dollars and bond they have. Pretty smart, actually.

However, they are handicapped by several things themselves. They have also practiced and implemented lots of bad Keynesian economics themselves. The reason they have all those empty malls and cities is because of these bad economics. Fake GDP and wasted resources. It works better in China than the U.S. because of the immaturity of their economy and large internal demand.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out but one lesson I think they and even perhaps the old Soviets realize that the real basis of U.S. power is economic, not military.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 14:19 | 4264565 donsluck
donsluck's picture

Our power is both economic and military, with the economic declining.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 21:17 | 4265795 Tapeworm
Tapeworm's picture

The NSA and Barry Choom have done terrible things to what the US did lead at. 60% drops in some categories of tech manufacturing YoY.


My finger is splinted, sorry caps

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 23:33 | 4266057 FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

Yes, but our military power derives from our economic power. It is generally true in all countries over time. You cannot have a strong technologically advanced military with a perennialiy dysfunctional economy. It is why China could field gozillions of soliders but they will walk most anywhere they go.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 03:53 | 4263136 Ryan7
Ryan7's picture

of course, we Chinese will always buy...

it's not even a question- will you trust in gold or the paper the government authorized it...

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 09:53 | 4263463 Polonius
Polonius's picture

And your point is?

To prove how stupid are the sellers?

Because that's already obvious to those who understand Chinese checkers.

Sat, 12/21/2013 - 05:18 | 4266276 toothpicker
toothpicker's picture

trolling at its best

Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:14 | 4262737 G.O.O.D
G.O.O.D's picture

Four Chan, people are thinking he is scaming them because why dont he just go in and sell the coin himself?

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:54 | 4262947 Four chan
Four chan's picture

our strength was a nation of free individuals with honest money and constitutionally limited government.

its all gone now, blame government education, blame facebook, blame helicopter moms, blame screen kids,

the net result is all that matters, a nation enslaved by the fed res "system" to debt, a debased currency we the people 

throw our lives away for, and a mortgaged future for all who follow, to the communist chinese and rothschilds.


god damn us for, as ben franklin warned, not keeping the republic.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 04:24 | 4263157 mick_richfield
mick_richfield's picture

We didn't lose it because of helicopter moms, we lost it in 1913 in a series of amazingly fraudulent 'passages' of legislation which led immediately to the worst war in the history of the world.

And it's very clear that someone was trying to give us a central bank, and thus begin the process of perverting free-market money, for a *long* time before 1913.

Somebody on this planet is apparently able to follow very long-term plans.    We the people are just now becoming conscious.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 13:56 | 4264402 Four chan
Four chan's picture

what group or tribe is able to generate a multigenerational fraud?  

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 21:19 | 4265801 BigDuke6
BigDuke6's picture

Indeed ,
Americans should be grateful to the tribe that owns them, the MIC and their congress
They have put them to work and they run the world
Trust in your masters and stop complaining

Sat, 12/21/2013 - 02:24 | 4266205 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

Aristocracy (feudal Oligarchs) + Bankers.

They have multi-generational wealth, continuity, elite clubs & societies, where they can network & collaborate discretely (meet & scheme, w/o prying eyes & ears of the Serfs).

It's elementary, dear Watson.

Sat, 12/21/2013 - 04:47 | 4266269 trader1
trader1's picture

wasn't the "strength" all mythology?  

a national narrative that was several times over modified to fit certain interests?

Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:23 | 4262757 TeamDepends
TeamDepends's picture

Was it over when the Chinese bombed Pearl Harbor?

Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:47 | 4262825 Thomas
Thomas's picture

Or, as Paris Hilton tweeted, when Nelson Mandela gave his "I have a dream" speech?

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 07:34 | 4263268 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



Was it over when the Chinese bombed Pearl Harbor?




But what the hell do you expect us to do you more-on?


Well I for one will not sit around and watch them bad mouth the United States of America.


You know what this means......that's right........TOGA!!!!

Thu, 12/19/2013 - 23:50 | 4262827 alfred b.
alfred b.'s picture


   ,,,,I think that maybe that it was the Japanese, and not the Chinese????


Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:02 | 4262858 The Proletariat
The Proletariat's picture

No.  It was the Germans

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:32 | 4262905 Thomas
Thomas's picture

No. The Germans were the ones who took out the Queen of Hawaii to support the pineapple industry.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 02:58 | 4263097 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

No...It was those Aliens of Nibiru preparing their way for the collision with Earth on December 21, 2012. And we all died in that collision and are living in Hell.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 07:34 | 4263274 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



A little warning next time......would be nice.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 23:05 | 4266012 logicalman
logicalman's picture

Not sure about the Nibiru bit, but you might be onto something with the hell thing.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:16 | 4262881 G.O.O.D
G.O.O.D's picture

No it was the Pekingese

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:33 | 4262907 Thomas
Thomas's picture

That's right: It was an army of chickens head up by General Tso. That was a spicy battle.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:33 | 4262912 alfred b.
alfred b.'s picture
 was a honest miss take!     no need to gang-up!

     So, the USD is dead....long live the (gold-backed) yuan!

       That better...or what??


Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:41 | 4262921 G.O.O.D
G.O.O.D's picture

Waht kinda dumb ass r u thinking it was the Japs.. sheesh

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 01:16 | 4262982 alfred b.
alfred b.'s picture


....and who's A-hole r u?

     ...and what GOOD stand fer....Get Out Of Dodge?      As if u know~


Fri, 12/20/2013 - 01:27 | 4262992 G.O.O.D
G.O.O.D's picture

It just so happens I do know but I am not about to tell the likes of a newman. mr. alfred b.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 01:37 | 4263006 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

Here's why you didn't get the joke about pearl harbor.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 02:06 | 4263033 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

He probably thinks the owner of South Park's only Chinese restaurant built a great wall to keep the Mongol Horde out of South Park, too.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 10:05 | 4263506 superflex
superflex's picture

Shitty Wok FTW

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 03:01 | 4263102 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

Don't get so damned butthurt. This is Fight Club.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 00:50 | 4262928 BLOTTO
BLOTTO's picture

No, It was the <looks around> Annunaki.


Annunaki - from the old name sky god An. Those of 'royal blood'

Btw, Anakin Skywalker. Had high level midi-chlorians in his blood (ie royal blood).

George Lucas, mind tripper.

K, carry on...

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 01:00 | 4262950 BLOTTO
BLOTTO's picture

BTW imo, i think their is something special/powerful about gold they are not telling us commoners...its important to 'them' for another reason not associated with the common ones we know of...

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 07:33 | 4263270 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

With the healing powers of silver being hidden for years ,it makes one wonder.

Fri, 12/20/2013 - 12:33 | 4264016 tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

hint: check out ormus.   a bit too woo-woo for most, but with patience, you'll be able to discern the wheat from the chaff.

also look at the experiments that Livermore Labs have been doing with the shiny:

there's much much more there if you were to do some digging.


Sat, 12/21/2013 - 04:58 | 4266270 trader1
trader1's picture

definitely woo-woo, although this is my first time reading of it:

Hudson's patented procedures definitely do not work, because it would be at odds with the known chemical behavior of gold under those conditions. The result is a worthless salt that has none of the claimed properties. Since gold is expensive, the used chemicals are corrosive and the fumes released during repeated boiling toxic, attempting those procedures is a good way to waste money and/or injure yourself. The countless alternative procedures of obtaining ORMUS also do not work - a material with superconductive properties occurring abundantly in nature would be very easy to detect, yet no such kind of material is known to modern science.

The concept is highly exploitable by quacks, who sell a wide variety of ORMUS preparations under names such as Cleopatra's Milk, Liquid Chi, Prime Enzymes, Zenergy, Sola, Mountain Manna, C-Gro, etc. intended for human consumption as well as in agriculture. They definitely do not contain any gold or other precious metals, which is in fact a good thing, because water-soluble forms of precious metals are very toxic. Mountain Manna even combines ORMUS with homeopathy for double laughs.

ORMUS enthusiasts invented countless even more outrageous theories, linking ORMUS to everything: pyramids, dead people's souls,[6] Bose-Einstein condensate, biblical manna - you name it.[7]The variety of magical powers ascribed to ORMUS was also expanded. As a side note, the notably crazy David Icke thinks highly of the powers of monatomic gold.[8]


on the other hand, the livermore labs link is very thought-provoking.

nice share ;-)

Sat, 12/21/2013 - 09:59 | 4266435 tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

yeah, i've read all sides of the story on ormus.   completely agree Hudson and almost all the peddlers are more than a bit on the quacky side of the fence.   however, did some experiments this year in the garden following the wet method on various sea salts and there was definitely a drastic improvement in seed sprouting, plant vigor and fruit set on those that I dosed with it.   what's attributing to that i have no idea, most likely the trace elements & micronutrients in the sea salt.   but which trace elements exactly?    have a friend who's a biochemist and we're going to do some more experimentation at some point.    fascinating stuff, though.

still choose to believe there's something "magical" about all those transition elements/precious metals that modern science has not gotten around to discovering yet.

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