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Humana Warns Of "Adverse Obamacare Enrollment Mix"
Submitted by Michael Krieger of Liberty Blitzkrieg blog,
Thought the incredibly unpopular Obamacare health plan (the most epic disaster story was the woman who was touted as a success and then later kicked off her plan) had put most of its problems behind it? Think again. Yesterday, after the stock market close, health insurer Humana warned that the “risk mix” of those who have signed up for the program will be “more adverse than previously expected.”
In plain english what this means is that only old and sick people are signing up, while younger generations with piles of student debt, a couch in their parents’ basements and no jobs decide to ride things out uninsured.
Honestly, I can’t blame them, as I just received my own 12% rate hike the other day. Happy New Year to you too Barry.
From Investor’s Business Daily:
Humana said the “risk mix” of its ObamaCare exchange members will be “more adverse than previously expected,” the latest evidence that the health reform is attracting older, sicker Americans than originally projected.
The health insurer, in an SEC filing late Thursday, cited the Obama administration’s 11th hour decision to let people stay on plans that had been cancelled due to ObamaCare regulations. The White House was reacting to political anger of President Obama’s “if you like your plan, you can keep it” vow.
Humana made no mention of the administration’s late December decision to let people with cancelled plans avoid the individual mandate tax penalty in 2014. Those who choose to forgo insurance presumably will be younger and healthier.
The White House has refused to give any information regarding the age or health status of people signing up on the federal healthcare.gov site. Data from some state-run exchanges have suggested fewer “young invincibles” are signing up.
The ObamaCare exchanges need young, healthy people to make up a significant share of enrollees. If not, the plans may be more costly for insurers, potentially creating a premium rate death spiral. But the Obama administration plans to use “risk-corridor” and “risk-adjustment” payments to offset much of insurance companies’ unexpectedly high costs. Such taxpayer bailouts may keep insurers from hiking premiums in 2015 or simply bowing out of the exchanges.
“Premium rate death death spiral.” Call me crazy, but I’m not itching to find out what that means…
Full article here.
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I wish people would quit thinking this is a failure. This is "failure by design" to get what they really want - single payer rate. The government will blame these failures on everyone but themselves and then bring in the real disaster.
This is "failure by design" to get what they really want - single payer rate.
Or perhaps what they really want is for the next generation to hand over their consent to be ruled by the few while people are distracted as they bicker about the tab.
ANY Fecking Idiot Analyst Would Have Seen This Coming A MILE AWAY!!!
AND Please Stop This Bullshit Wording "risk mix”.
Get SOME BALLS And Say It Like It Is: "EXTREME HIGH RISK".
The 'effect' of this fact is that people will forgo enrollment and pay the TAX. This in turn supports the dollar via increased tax revenues. No fools, these guys. Bastards, yes. Fools, no.
We need to get rid of all hospitals and just have ERs and ambulances. ...give out asprin....just see how many come back
Fixed it!
These is brilliant. Leave preventative care to chiropracters, physical therapists, dieticians, and acupuncturists. People can get rid of their health problems this way and then we wouldn't need hospitals except to perform surgery.
Don't you understand yet? This whole thing has NOTHING to do with treating sick people.
Humana Warns Of "Adverse Obamacare Enrollment Mix"This could be corrected to read:
Humana Warns Of The Imminent Need For A Bailout Of The Insurance 'Industry'
It's the FUCKING BANKSTERS...
I am fine with single payor as long as I am not the ONLY one paying....
Don't you understand yet? This whole thing has NOTHING to do with treating sick people.
And let's not forget about the death panels. The fastest way to fix social security is to kill off the beneficiaries ..... by design.
So Obummercare is attracting only older and sicker people when it is meant to be compulsory. Pathetic
Can you say TARGET?
Obama is going to go after those millenials hard. There may not be a major war requiring compulsory military service today, but this is a war for the new liberal america which requires compulsory participation by all.
It is what the millenials voted for after all.
Death panels were coming obamacare or no obamacare. To many ways to keep a dying meat body from giving up the ghost now a days. No way everybody was going to get cadillac service to the grave. My prediction is taxpayers bailout insurers losses until 2016 when a Republican plays the bad guy and kills the bailout (Rand Paul???) which in turn kills the insurers and then we go single payer.
If you have good insurance hospitals PROLONG your death and rack up hundreds of thousands in charges. Saw this first hand with my mother where they blatantly ignored her request NOT to be put on a ventilator - among other requests. She was dying, accepted that and simply wanted things over with. Intead the hospital kept her alive for at least two weeks longer than they should have - and collected $200,000 more in the process. Made her last days miserable for NO reason.
If you don't have insurance..... well.... you get to die faster.
Just because medicine CAN do something doesn't mean that it SHOULD. I saw 70 year old 350lb people in double wide wheelchairs who had double knee replacements - to no point since they would not/COULD not do the needed therapy. They were NEVER going to leave that wheelchair but because the gov paid for the surgery and therapy (even if they refused to do the therapy) it got done. If you're 85 and will be dead withing the year who CARES if you need a hip replacement (to be paid for by the taxpayer). Makes more sense to pay for basic care for kids to keep them healthy instead of paying for the mistakes old people made and continue to make. Someone who smoked all their life and weighs 300 lbs gets their Oxygen and Rascal scooter paid for by the gov but someone who's worked construction all their life and NEEDS a knee replacement at 50 pays for it themself (if they can afford it).
Mont, I do agree that all insurance companies have to be operating on fumes after 5 years of zero bound interest rates. Insurance and pension fund collapse in 2014 maybe 2015. I believe it was auto or home insurance in Texas that a few insurance companies are trying to get approval to increase premiums by 15%! Obammy and the Fed are making the gravest of mistakes EVER in history.
nope, more people will not pay any taxes whatsoever as they segue to shadow econ where plenty of employers will be more than willing to pay under table and yet single payer sickcare will still go through...we r fukd.
I'm speaking of those who have above-board jobs and would rather not enlist the ire of the IRS.
And everyone is aware their is no extra penalty for not paying the no insurance tax right? The most they can do is withhold your return. It says so right in the law.
But they had to pass it to see what was in it.. Fucking retarded idiots!
And the conspiracy theorists might well be right that Obamacare was intentionally made so FUBAR in order to pass the no health insurance penalty tax that leads to a government single payer system.
Moar than that, it means there will be a much expanded Health and Human Services Dept or even a new health care dept which will then mandate which procedures anyone (but the elites) can get so the USSA can kill off which ever group they want.
Get injured in a car accident while driving oveer the DUI limit?? No health care for you!
Obese? No health care for you!
Smoker? No health care for you!
Convicted felon? No health care for you!
See how it can work?
Visit Zerohedge?
No healthcare for you!
Illegal Alien ?
Yes Free Healthcare for You !
Outside of the Felon part I wouldn't mind the others experiencing the consequences of their actions. For example the DUI guy can get the care, but he'd gotta pay for it just as he does now. Government coercion is with us whether we like it or not unfortunately. This example wouldn't keep me up at night.
The real corruption is about to happen. The government will pay off the health care insurers losses to placate them. Although, Obama wants it to fail he does not want it to implode this soon. We voted for these thieves and we are about to get royally screwed and get what we voted for.
i didn't vote for any of this shit on either side of the imaginary party bullshit mendacity...
i'm thinking the marketplace of money (ten yr treas) might vote fubar, and the dolla be toast and all this is moot. then health care will be survival of fit...
and this could be happening soon. watching that ten yr rate and manipulations to keep a lid on it at 3.
really this goverment is growing like americans' waistlines. everything is spinning out of control...
Do you watch TV and Hollywods's crap? If so then you voted for it and support it. Everytime you turn on you f***ing TV - you vote for it.
The health care industry is exempt from the Robinson-Patman Act, AKA 5 USC Section 13. The doctors or hospitals can bill at whatever price they deem and do not have to disclose their fees up front. They are exempt because the health care industry lobbied Congress for the exemption. Until this is repealed, there will be no solution. Health care costs will continue to outstrip inflation and premiums will continue to skyrocket.
thank you for that Deacon.
Ding ding ding, there's the cause of the problem. Exemption from the normal competitive marketplace for services, via our Lords and Masters in CONgress.
Wait up there Deacon. You are partly right. Docs and hospitals can CHARGE whatever they want. But they only get PAID what the insurance companies want to pay, and that is based on contracts. I can charge a patient $1M bucks but if the insurance company reimburses me $1 then that is what I get. 30 years ago, 80% of doctors who graduated went into private practice; today it is 6%. Why is that? Because new physicians cannot afford to go into practice and are not educated enough, nor emotionally equipped enough, to deal with the monopolistic insurance companies. So all the new grads go to multispecialty clinics or to the hospitals to work - they don't go out on their own, and that totally destoys the free market place (not that there is a free market anywhere anymore). The whole system is broken on many more levels than just the Robinson-Patman Act.
Got
They can charge what they want until your deductible is satisfied or if you are self insured.
$10,000.00 bill for aspirin from the hospital without insurance - you gotta pay.
And this is exactly what is fucking individuals into the ground under this system.
Wrong. Has nothing to do with your deductible. If it is a covered service under your health plan and the doctor is contracted with your insurer, the doctor MUST accept the fee established by your insurer. Say I'm a doctor and I bill $100 for a service, my contract says I can only collect $5. You have a $10000 deductible... I send you a bill for $5. Ins co pays nothing, you get a reduced rate. Essentially you pay a monthly premium for a middle man to twist the doctors arms. Health insurance has become a mechanism for central control of prices....that's it. Obviously if you have a health catastrophe that costs more than 10 grand the insurer will reach in their pocket and start paying...but how many 20 year olds are willing to pay $200/month for that?
One more thing. I contract with 50 different health plans that have 50 different contracted rates for the same service...and you want me to post my fees... Um my fees are irrelevant, and it is damn near impossible for me to keep track of all 50 health plan fee schedules. Easier by far to just send the bill to your insurer and let the insurer tell me what to bill you the patient.
All good points, but why then is the medical industry the only ones Exempt?
Yes. Despotism succeeds when the Constitution is swept aside and ignored. With regards to any Federal government function, agency, or attempted usurpation, the discussion should always revolve around this question: Does the proposal pass the litmus test of the 10th Amendment? When this question goes unanswered, let alone even debated, proponents of despotism will always win.
Here is the law that overrules and makes invalid any federal healthcare system no matter what it is named:
"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people."
Tell that to chief justice Roberts.
It can go in the petition for a redress of grievances.
(TBT done for now, TLT until time to TBT again.)
.
I am appreciating my health a lot more these days!
Health is one of those gifts from the Creator we only think about when we lose it. Having been around some serious sicknesses in life, I'm thankful for mine everyday.
people have been brainwashed think that disease is random. In the vast majority of cases, it is not random at all. Your body is your responsibility. Delegate that responsibility to the system, and chronic disease is all but assured.
No shit. As you get older (40 and above), health is all about daily routine maintenance. You have to be willing to go through hours of maintenance every day (dental care, preparing healthy food, exercise, taking supplements, getting enough sleep, etc.) When I'm out walking around, I can tell just by looking at people who is putting in the maintenance time and who is not (most are not).
Noted vegetarian author and health nut drops dead while jogging.
http://nypost.com/2014/01/11/author-who-collapsed-in-prospect-park-dies/
I think he went unidentified for the week while the vegan army tries to get their story straight why he dropped dead from a heart attack.
Lots of carbs and toxic vegetable oils packed with pro-inflammatory omega-6 PUFAs.
Unpossible, everything from plants is good for us!
/do I really need the tag?
They often do. Look up Jim Fixx.
He was 68, and people have inherited issues. How long was he vegan, and not all heart attacks are block age based.
"supplements"? sheesh!
By "supplements" I meant things like Vitamin D. When you live in Seattle, you will be vitamin-D deficient.
Interesting, thanks.
What! Take vit D and rob the Cancer industry of its revenue stream? I think there is a terrorist in our midst.
100s of studies have shown the benefits of vitamin D supplementation. Reduction of cancer rates of those who have adequate levels is just one benefit. I take 5000IU daily to keep my level above 50. Without supplementation I run around 33 even with plenty of sun exposure. Research has shown vitamin K2 is needed when you take D so I take that as well.
Of course, eating a proper diet is far more important than popping pills. It really cracks me up when people live on junk and think popping a Centrum is going to counteract all that crap. Considering synthetic vitamins are not even utilized by the body the joke is on them when it just goes down the toilet.
Miffed;-)
Hate to point it out, but disease can be random. Genes mutate randomly, which is part of the foundation of evolutionary theory.
Your are what you eat, or more fully realized you are what you consume.
Your physical health is a direct reflection of this reality. Make no mistake there are plenty of toxins in our 'modern' world. If you have persistent health issues take a cold hard look at your daily environment and what you stuff in your face.
Good health is based on good knowledge, a good diet (increasingly difficult in the US with GMO goods and processed foods) and a disciplined lifestyle. Artificial Intelligence can play an important role in bringing specific knowledge to your particular health situation. A good, simple example is the following website which brings specific recommendations to increase your life expectancy and quantifies your health care cost savings. Programs a thousand times more powerful are easily possible and they are our best chance for living longer, happier, healthier lives with significantly reduced healthcare costs. Hope some of the smart folks here or elsewhere will develop such programs:
http://diabetesrisk.net/
People who eat right, exercise, take good care of themselves, have strong emotional relationships, and pursue meaningful work have better lives - however long or short they are. That is the payoff.
The big mistake that a lot of 'health nuts' make is believing that by doing all the right thngs they can guarantee future outcomes. If doing all the right things makes you happy then by all means do so, but if you're doing all the right things because you think it is giving you an exemption from disaster, good luck. That kind of behavior is a lot like praying - the act of prayer is healing and uplifting in itself, but there's nobody on the other end listening who is going to answer your prayers.
hey life isn't always fair. but eating right and exercise is living life. why do so many choose non-life sitting in front of a tb and so lazy they don't even go for a walk. living dead, so fuck em and refuse to pay their bills via insurance. self insure with saving for such an unexpected event. been doing so for over twenty years. just by being self insured will change your outlook on life unless you are fucking dumb...oh maybe that is the problem or could it be the entitlement mentality of the great society from the 60's. lots a problems a brewing in merica. lol and enjoy the day and read this shit for laughs.
I think a main motivation among "health nuts" is they want to live into extreme old age. Based on my observations, extreme old age sucks.
...want to live into extreme old age.
it's all about quality of life. we all come here knowing the deal...we have to leave. so the time spent here we need to come to terms with how we choose to live. eat drink and be merry and screw the outcome, or to be diligent and take care of the details. those who choose to eat all and everything that pleases them, drink to oblivion, drug to senselessness and sit out the day and night feel it's society's obligation to cover their questionable life style choices, and those that chose to eat well, drink in moderation and supplement are then destined to pay not only for their own prudent choices but the inprudent choices of others. somehow this is deemed democratic. add fukushima to this and hanford and a couple of decades of pollutants in the water and atmosphere and we can rest assured our time as well as that of this beloved planet is finite.
bailout coming in 3,2,.....
They knew they would have to be bailed out - they wrote it into the law. This is a premeditated bailout. And when it happens, we'll hear that lovely refrain we're all familiar with: "Hoocoodanode?"
I gotta believe your right. Anybody with all those multiple screens up close and personal could do a YOY survey of all enlisted providers in this ACA mess and track stock value and PE over time before and continuing to see just who's "winning" this situation. As with the bank bailouts, I don't see any of the TBTF bank sphincters getting monkey hammered regarding value and PE. Let's see if the socialist libtards really are just buying the systems with imaginary money.
Leave me alone. 3 more years to Medicare. Bitches!
>>>They knew they would have to be bailed out - they wrote it into the law.
Exactly. The ACA requires billions to be set aside to subsidize insurers who might suffer "greater than expected" losses.
The set-aside amount (somewhere around 60 billion, I believe) is already out there in fictional-money land, and the amount can no doubt be increased at the stroke of a pen.
The way to watch Obamacare is to watch profit statements form health care providers. My guess is that they're going to roll in dough: higher premiums with higher deductibles equal huge profits.
The attempt to get more younger people to sign up for health care is just smoke screen.
Wrong.Read the artcle before commenting.
Only the sick and old are signing up.They will breeze thru' those deductibles on the first hospital visit.
Obozocare is but the last curve in the death spiral of USD.
Pretty much this. And note the young have no jobs and won't be filing tax returns and so won't be paying the fee/tax/penalty.
And even if you get them to pay the fee, there is no way they are paying the high deductibles. That bill is going uncollected or moved to a collection agency.
Even if you pay taxes, all you have to do is adjust withholding so that you are not due a refund. That's the penalty collection mechanism, docking your refund. No refund, no penalty. As I understand it.
You'll still owe it, but it will be harder to collect.
As the law is written they can pursue no collection measures beyond withholding your refund.
Have you looked at any health care stock price. The biggest one Humana is up 40% in 2013. The only people that are supposed to sign up are self-employed and those without insurance, that's a small percentage of insurable pool.
<---- Give 2 dollars to your doctor
<---- Give one dollar to the insurance man and one dollar to your doctor
How would you prefer to distribute your health budget?
I also think we should pay doctors when we are well. The less sick we are, the less work the doctor has to do. Under the present system, the instant we are cured the doctor loses his revenue stream. Where's the incentive in that? Treat the symptoms, don't bother with a cure. Ring a bell, anyone?
In a sense, the insurance company should be on our side. They don't want us to get sick either. They just want us to be scared of getting sick. How does that pan out in the real world?
Not that simple, and not a good example. More like give a dollar to the doctor, or a dollar to the insurance company and the doctor. Reason being is the insurance company discounts what they pay the doctor, plus your co-pay. I'd rather just cut the majority of the insurance companies out, remove the ANTI-RICO protections for the medical industry, and pay a COMPETITIVE fair market value for services to the doctors.
PT The Chinese have a system that makes sense to me, the people pay their doctor a very small sum every month and if they fall ill they DO NOT have to pay(while out of work due to illness). I'm not sure about the cost of hospital stays, if they are to pay or if the state assist with payment. That leaves out the insurance companies as payment is given directly to the local attending doctors.
Only one flaw with that. Have seen Chinese insurance with my own eyes...and it´s basic...very very basic. Want anything else...you pay for it. On the other hand the tax rate is much lower. Now - would that sit well with your average community organiser? I think not.
Tom333 When my first born arrived in 1971, the ENTIRE hospital bill was $368.00 for a private room in a brand new state of the art hospital and that included the delivery room charges (everything ). Back then, insurance was very very bascic here in the US also. If you went for a doctor visit, you paid for it out of pocket, if you needed a prescription filled, you paid it out of pocket. IT WAS A MUCH BETTER SYSTEM THAN THIS MESS WE CALL OBAMACARE. If a person could not pay their bill for a hospital stay, charities would help or long term payments would be set up. OBTW, I don't give two shits about what community organizers like or don't like.
On the present trajectory, wealthy lefty activists will be arguing tampons should be covered too, for everyone.
Haven't you heard? They use menstral cups now.
In 1986 my first born cost $2,000 out the door. Did not have insurance as I was in college and it was a pre-existing condition (ha, ha). That is about what a years tuition cost at the time at a midwestern state university. My father-in-law had his gall bladder out last year and he said the hospital bill alone was $79,000. He has medicare and a gold plated gap policy. If you add in the doctor, must have come in over $100k. This is robbery.
Got that right, I paid fifty bucks a month with no interest directly to the hospital for each of my three kids launch into this world, never had health insurance until I was in my late forties.
The healthcare cartel is one of the biggest swindles ever implemented on a supposed advanced society.
I know. However you now have a community organizer running things now (maybe not running things , but lending his face to it)- so I think you do give a shit.Or - if not now - you will in the near future.
My daughter lived in China twice for 6 month stints. She wen to the "doctor" once and was given a couple of envelopes with some powders and was told to make some tea with them. There were jars of powers and stuff on shelves. More like a witch doctor.
I was going to say something, but you beat me to it. I have a single employee from China. She got sick last July, told me she was having an "out of body experience" and had to return to China to see her acupuncturist. She's back now, claims to be fine. We'll see how productive she is now.
Don't knock witch doctors.
One saved my foot years ago.Cut it on coral ,and conventional medicine was not working
on the gangrene that resulted.
Apart from the theatrical parts, they have knowledge forgoten nowadays.
Modern medicine spends too much reinventing the wheel.
OK, good to know.
So it's not free to provide healthcare to old, poor, sick people? Or people from the thrird world who land on our beaches in waves of 57 Chevy's?
We should all live in the same size house, send our kids to the same school, and have the same Harvard educated doctor. No one should have to pay for any of it.
Can't wait for all of the teenage Obama voters get fined for not having insurance.
"fine" them all you want, most of them are in debt and completely insolvent. Look at the employment numbers among those under 25. Good luck with that "fine".
The resurrection of debtors prison takes care of that. Just a different version of the war on drugs. Free labor at the FEMA camp if you want to eat. Corporate wins again.
RTFG
Right, becuase those approaches have always worked out so well in the past. Again, good luck with that.
.."Right, becuase those approaches have always worked out so well in the past"..
..they failed because of insufficient funding, luckily that problem has been addressed and rectified.
In fact the prison industry future has never been brighter.
Fuck Obamacare........
This would be hilarious if it hadn't screwed things up even more, and it was completely foreseeable. The young Marxists elected this guy thinking they were going to get something for free, and when it turns out they have to pay for it they give him the finger.
Why on earth anybody believes that young people are going to buy health insurance is beyond me. I didn't really give a damn about health insurance until I got married and started having kids. Up until that point I was immortal.....or so I thought.
Most young people only need bare bones catastrophic coverage if anything at all. I wouldn't have had insurance when I was younger if my employer's HR department didn't shove it down my throat. Can't recall ever using health insurance and I'm 30.
I am always amazed the Americans can graps the basic fact of this so called insurance system. It´s for the healthy and productive to pay for everyone else. Not only for themselves but for everyone else,of corse.Who else will be footing the bill? Insurance initself is a rather simple mechanism to distribute risk...however this insurance system is not only about that but it´s most important theme is to make the middle class pay for everyone else.
Why can´t you grasp this simple truth? It´s socialism. That´s what it is.
I'll explain America to you.
i. You have the people in power. These people push agenda's on you to get more money and control. People like Al Gore who pitch things like man made global warming and scare the shit out of you. Al Gore doesn't really believe in global warming...he drives around in SUV motorcades, flies around in private jets, and his home uses enough energy to power a small town. He invests in shit like solar panel manufacturers. So he scares the shit out people and convinces people to make the government pass laws where you have to own solar panels. He get's rich.
ii. You have the American's who suffer from the most advanced stages of utopian altruism.These American's are naive and believe the things people like Al Gore tell them. They actually believe we can control the climate if we drive different cars and raise taxes. They also believe that America can solve world hunger, violence, provide free healthcare to everyone, and police the world. These people are Obama supporters.
iii. The people like me. We watch this mess shaking our fucking heads as we are small in number and powerless to do anything. We buy things like gold, guns, bitcoin and other assets to protect ourselves from the infinite stupidity that is involuntarily thrust upon us.
If the government says anything immediately question it. There is an agenda behind it by some power broker and the truth is purposefully being obsfucated to further said agenda. This US government wants as much of your money and freedom as possible.
Psst, hey dude, FYI- everybody has their own agenda...
same as it ever was...
When your agenda involves the government stealing from me at the barrel of a gun your agenda is going to make me mad.
Once again, Obamacare is an insurance scam. Why are you people acting like it is a "like good" when there isn't a good choice in this health care system? This system merely funnels money to the banks. There are no options for young people.
Do you really believe that 99.0% of the people on this site don't know that this system just funnels money to the banks and beyond, and that Zerocare is a scam? People like us were warning people ushering Zero into office about this but were completely tuned out. Now thanks to the young Marxists things are screwed up more than ever. Nothing will fix this mess, beyond tearing the whole damn thing down and starting over. God knows what we will end up with after that.
Obama is old. Hillary is old. Shit, Biden's very old. The young people ain't running things - the system won't let us. I can die for my country, I can drink, but I can't even run for POTUS!
This current political system is scared of young people because young people in aggregate are the ones with enough energy to change anything.
When I talk about the young Marxists who elected Zero it's not those people you mentioned that I was talking about, but you already knew that.
It's not like there would have been one whit of difference had Mittens won.
The whole system is a cluster of biblical proportions.
I generally agree with ya Doc, but I think you're off base here blaming the "young Marxists" for BO- it was the boomer Marxists. Having heard this bandied about regularly I looked into it and here's what I'm seeing:
Age breakdown according to US Census Dept. for 2012-
http://factfinder2.census.gov/bkmk/table/1.0/en/PEP/2012/PEPASR6H
Rounded population breakdown-
Age 20-29: 42.7 million, 30-44: 60 million, 45-64: 81 million, 65+: 40 million
Voting breakdown by age (granted this is a University study from a total shithead New England state, but I'll assume general accuracy)-
http://www.ropercenter.uconn.edu/elections/how_groups_voted/voted_12.html
Crunching the numbers it looks like this-
Age 20-29: 25.62 million Obamabots, 30-44: 31.2 million Obamatrons, 45-64: 38 million Obozos, 65+: 17.6 million Obamites
Looks to me it wasn't the young marxists- it was the old ones. Boomer ex-hippie scum strikes again as I understand math- numerically they are the biggest block of his voters.
Lednbrass: Thanks. Nice to see someone think a little harder.
I'd like to have health insurance, but I'm not interested in giving someone else a guaranteed revenue stream until I can reasonably guarantee my own revenue stream. That's fair, isn't it?
Why? Why do you want health insurance ? Why would you want a system with a middle man jacking up the costs? How about a system where we cut out the middle man? Sounds better to me.
Bingo, unfortunately more than half of the employed today are useless paper-pushing middlemen completely dependent on government largesse. Same goes for at least half of the unemployed as well. Perhaps the elimination of those two halves might be a good place to start.
In reality, Nature will solve this as that which cannot be sustained, won't be and people realize they might actually have to work dhoulf they want to eat.
Full disclosure; I remain long sharecropping and black markets.
.."Full disclosure; I remain long sharecropping and black markets"..
..might want to consider Chinese herbalist practitioners as well, there is a pretty nice old style one off 44th. Street in Phoenix at the Chinese village if Eric hasn't raided it yet.
Dr. Engali re why?
Yes, yes, you got me there. What I really meant to say was I'd rather find a health nut, get together with a few like minded individuals and we all put in a couple of bucks each week to make a decent wage so the health nut can devote all his time to studying his favourite subject and letting us know the results and, hopefully, keeping us healthy.
Still gets a bit hard when I can't guarantee my own income, let alone someone else's.
They elected him because he promised or said he would reverse all the shit the retard Bush did. Lie after lie after lie
Then he basically did everything bush did a lot faster.
Hes the ultimate patsy for TPTB.
Until the next one.
There are a myriad of reasons why they elected him beyond health insurance , those you cited and various others. Compound those facts with the fact that McShitstain is a worthless douchbag and we end up with a guy like Zero.
In the end it doesn't make a difference, the next person TPTB offer up will move their agenda forward.
Exactly. The two leading causes of death in young people, under age 25, are suicide and car wrecks. You don't need insurance for suicides (that does need to be mentioned to some bureaucrats) and you only need catastrophic insurance for car wrecks. Catastrophic insurance is affordable.
Not only that Doc but plenty of kids are still on their parents' plan. My kids have 5 years left on their mom's plan before they have to worry about health care.
What young person is going to pay $240 (or whatever it is) a month with a $12,000 deductable?
Most people 18-25 don't even have $12,000. That's a down payment on a fucking house. The $12,000 deductable negates the need for insurance of someone 18-25.
Please put that on a billboard. ...well said!
Think about it. A 23 year old pays $240 a month for 5 years ($240 x 60 months) = $14,400 in premium paid + $12,000 deductable.
That's $26,400 paid out. Seriously WHY THE FUCK have health insurance if you're young if it's so expensive? What 20 something year old needs $26,000 in medical treatment unless they have a pre-existing condition? No onnnnnneeeeeee
The only people signing up for this are stupid red diaper doper babies.
HSA plus high deductible is the best thing ever (except for dealing with the bankers...). if i would have had this right out of college, and put in the same amount as i have paid to premiums, then by now i could have almost $30k in a savings fund with a $5k deductible.....that means i can get sick 6 years in a row for the whole deductible....
how do i know it works? because i use it now. when i need to go to a doctor i ask for the 'cash' price. it is usually about 30% of the insurance price. (i can go to the dr and get a couple of shots for cold/sinus/etc now for about $70). he would bill the insurance company about $250 for the visit, plus waste time waiting for the money and reduce payments.
so yes, you can cut out the middle man and take control of your health. when i was on regular insurance, i would just go to any doctor, if they wanted to run test i would let them, and would not care at all about how much i really spent....now, i care and get informed about pricing of tests, visits, etc. America was founded upon self reliance....with it we can reach our true potential. with .gov reliance, we are destined for the dark ages.
The author assumes the younger generations are not signing up because they are to be pitied - the author makes young folk sound self serving, reliant, and needy. This is false. We are not signing up because it is an insurance scam.
Here, here. The youngers are much more able to be informed than we fogies. Internet, Zerohedge and all that. IF they pay attention and smoke out the DC BS they will be much better at defeating the scum/criminal class. I've a lot of faith in the youngers. I will do all I can to aid in their quest to screw the DC cocksuckers all the way to hell and back.
Its sarcasm youngster and I agree with both of you.
In plain english, as in, not with a hint of sarcasm.
Right!
/sarc
Several large binders will be shoved up the asses of SCOTUS. Topics of false advertising, and lack of price controls to name a few.
[This attempt to offer free healthcare is a disaster./sarc]
Why can't we just get rid of the liar in chief now.....
Because CONgress is too CHICKENSHIT to actually do their job.
I thought their job was to lie, obfuscate and steal as much from the "people" as possible. I think they are doing a swell job.
That's the NEW job description, I was referring to the old job requirements.
"Chickenshit" when it comes to Congressional fortitude is an insult to chickens..
..It's more of a case of them having nothing but an explosive vest to attack him with, there is a good reason nothing gets done.
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article18568.htm
The man is one sandwich shy of a picnic. To declare purchasing an item under a mandatory tax law is going leave a skid mark on SCOTUS. Unless this is corrected, they’ll begin the second phase of program. You’ll be required to spent X amount of dollars each month to purchase consumer shit you don’t need. If you don’t understand that concept, I’ll explain it this way.
You belong to a Country Club, each month you’re required to meet a minimum food & beverage spending target. Miss your target, you get charged for not agreeing to the conditions of CC membership privileges. That’s how it was in the late 70’s thru mid 80’s. It’s all about the business concept.
What happened to the "you can stay on your parent's policy until you are 26" rule? So, are most of the young folks still on mom and dad's policy. If mom and dad lost their coverage and sign up in the Obamacare exchange, can JR still tag along? That would eleminate most of them signing up on their own or paying the penalty for not signing up,no?
I'm sure they can tag along on the cancelled policies right into being uninsured. OR they can tag along onto a much more expensive policy under Obamacare right along with their parents.
According to the lying government, it's a WIN/WIN!
KLINK The point is a family plan is cheaper for them under the parent's insurance and per usual THEY DON'T PAY THE BILL. Where is the debate if these young folks are still on the parental healthcare teat? It would be interesting to know from our doctors here at ZH, are the young patients covered ?
Family plan may be cheaper, but cheaper than what? An individual plan, sure maybe, but my guess is it will still be more expensive and have a higher deductible than what they had.
..now those middle aged pre natal riders are starting to make sense eh?
If you are healthy and especially if young you should skip obamacare if you don't have health insurance from other sources and you have no current assets to protect.
If you develop a catastrophic illness you will qualify for a medicaid "spend down" in your state as soon as you quit your job (or are unable to work) and the first set of bills roll in, if you have less than a certain amount of assets. You can have a car and all the normal things and still qualify. I have been dealing with no insurance people in my clinic for a decade now.
But be careful with that recommendation Carl. Under old Medicare rules, if you received Medicare benefits, then those benefits, ie $100,000 worth of emergency cardiac surgery, were concidered a taxable benefit levied against your estate when you died, UNLESS, your assets were under a certain amount(I am not sure what that amount was, but an estate of $60,000 comes to mind). Under the new ACA, it does not matter what your net worth is. EVERYONE who receives health care benefits under Medicare/Medicaid will be considered to have received a taxable benefit levied against their estate. So I am not sure you want to burdern a young person with that future obligation. Too bad people don't know this.
The very plans owebomba outlawed will be the ones that become most popular. Offer me a low-rate plan with a $10K deductible and I will be fine. It weeds out the deadbeats and sickies who have no skin in the game.
I've got a idea!
Lets pass an unworkable law, that forces everyone to buy a product or service whether they need it or not, then bailout our cronies as it collapses by law, then implement single payer by law as the solution to the problem we created and then sue the bejeebus out of the slower moving cronies who didn't hide the graft & coruption properly, to compensate the least competent government paid doctors who decide to remain!
Timeline...ten years tops...and we'll be long gone.
Obamacare explained using coffee as an example:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TELH3PE9REo
File under: "I try to be cynical, but it is so hard to keep up!"
I had wondered why the health insurance companies were going along with ØbamaKare. These 'risk corrider' payments aren't bailouts, they are pay offs. Collusion between government and corporations lubricated with plenty of taxpayer money equals Fascism.
Support your local TEA Party. NO INSURANCE COMPANY BAILOUT!
Support society! No future tax revenue on income taxes!
OK. +1 No future taxes would certainly stop the bailout.
Yeah, like that assclown rubio? Guy was co-opted 5 min after landing in dc! As were most of them!
Yep, we have had our bitter disappointments. And I understand those of you who have surrendered. I'm just not built that way. The TEA Partiers that I know personally are very fine, strong people who will resist tyranny to the best of their ability until the end. What will you do?
Tea partiers on the street are fine! The politicians, same as the rest of em. What have i done? Stopped paying into their system as advised by carl denninger. Make enough to live comfortably and suport my family, without paying into the game. No quarterlies
Passive resistance is great. Please actively resist when you can. Good enough.
Im so ready hiney! Dont know what the catalist will be though. When will the sheeple have enough?
As a retired IT DBA manager (I designed the local Medicare processing databases) I am ROTFLMAO at the “ACA software project.” A project like ACA should take between 6 to 9 years to build properly in phases. Throwing people and money at it only makes it worse. Then switching the main contractor midstream is lunacy. All of the knowledge walks out the door with those that wrote the original code! It will continue to be a disaster.
For the above reasons Oblamo will keep the insurance companies around (big subsidies)…until… after the mid-term elections. At which time POTUS will issue executive orders to destroy and assimilate each of these bankrupt insurance companies before he leaves office.
I am also a victim of ACA. My wife (60 years) and I (68 years) were in told our insurance now covers us for maternity and lactation services for a slight increase of 35%. As a bonus we get free contraceptive devices.
"were told our insurance now covers us for maternity and lactation services for a slight increase of 35%. As a bonus we get free contraceptive devices."
Your health insurance does cover maternity, lactation services, and contraceptive devices....for poor black people and illegal immigrants. Thank you for your sacrifice citizen, you are a patriot.