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DOJ Finally Going After The Criminal Masterminds With Arrest Of 24 Year-Old Bitcoin Exchange Founder

Tyler Durden's picture


The US crackdown on Bitcoin has been long in coming, with ebbs and flows of enforcement as regulators have been unsure exactly how to proceed with dismantling the digital fiat alternative. This morning the ebb became a rising tide, after U.S. prosecutors announced charges against two men operating Bitcoin exchange businesses for attempting to sell $1 million worth of Bitcoin to users of the underground black market website Silk Road, which was shut down by authorities in September.

Reuters reports that the U.S. Attorney's office in Manhattan said in a statement that authorities arrested Charlie Schrem, chief executive officer of the exchange, on Sunday and Robert Faiella, who ran an underground Bitcoin exchange called BTCKing, on Monday. The two were charged with conspiring to commit money laundering and operating an unlicensed money transmitting business. Schrem is also vice president of the main Bitcoin-focused trade group, the Bitcoin Foundation, according to the foundation's website and Schrem's LinkedIn profile.

Some details from the charge against the defendants:

Federal prosecutors charged Faiella, 52, and Shrem, 24, with engaging in a scheme to sell more than $1 million of Bitcoins to users of Silk Road. Each defendant was charged with conspiring to commit money laundering, which carries a maximum prison sentence of 20 years. They are additionally charged with operating an unlicensed money transmitting business, which has a max sentence of five years in prison.


The U.S. also charged Shrem with violating the Bank Secrecy Act by “willfully failing” to file suspicious activity reports on Faiella’s questionable transactions. This charge carries a maximum sentence of five years in prison.


In addition to the Manhattan U.S. Attorney, the charges were announced by the Drug Enforcement Agency and the criminal investigation division of the Internal Revenue Service.


“Hiding behind their computers, both defendants are charged with knowingly contributing to and facilitating anonymous drug sales, earning substantial profits along the way,” said DEA acting special-agent-in-charge James Hunt.


Schrem was apprehended by authorities at JFK International Airport in New York on Sunday and is set to appear in federal court in Manhattan later on Monday. Faiella was arrested at his Cape Coral, Fla., home on Monday and is expected to appear in federal court in the Middle District of Florida.


The court documents allege Faiella operated an underground Bitcoin exchange on the Silk Road website between December 2011 and October 2013 that sold the crypto currency to users who wanted to buy illegal drugs on the site. After receiving orders, he filled them through a New York company designed to enable customers to exchange cash for Bitcoins anonymously, the U.S. alleges.


Shrem served as the New York Bitcoin company’s CEO during much of that timeframe and was “fully aware that Silk Road was a drug-trafficking website” and that Faiella was operating an exchange service for Silk Road users, the documents say.


Prosecutors say Shrem still did business with Faiella to maintain a “lucrative source” of revenue. He personally processed Faiella’s orders, gave him discounts on high-volume transactions, failed to file a single suspicious activity report and even helped Faiella “circumvent” the company’s anti-money laundering policies, the documents allege.


Bharara said the investigation remains ongoing.

As a reminder, BitInstant, which at the time "aimed to be the go-to site" to buy and sell bitcoins, received a $1.5 million investment by Winklevoss Capital in May 2013. From the TechCrunch profile of the startup:

BitInstant, which has a full-time staff of 16 led by CEO Charlie Shrem, has emerged as a key player in the nascent Bitcoin market: The company already processes approximately 30 percent of the money going into and out of Bitcoin, and last month alone facilitated 30,000 transactions, the Winklevosses said in a phone call this week. The funding is meant to allow the company to further scale up its staff and product as it angles to become the go-to site for Bitcoin transfers.

The US charge is not a ringing endorsement for the premise behind the Winklevi investment:

The Winklevosses say they were attracted to invest in BitInstant in large part because of its leadership. CEO Shrem is the vice chairman of the Bitcoin Foundation, and CIO Alex Waters previously worked with the core developers on the original Satoshi Bitcoin client. “Charlie has been in the space for a very long time, and he has an impeccable reputation among Bitcoiners. He knows everyone in the space and everyone in the space knows him,” Cameron Winklevoss said. “One of the most exciting things about people who are into Bitcoin is that they’re a really passionate community, and Charlie is a passionate entrepreneur. He would be in that category of someone who lives, breathes, and sleeps Bitcoin.”

Perhaps. However, in retrospect Charlie's biggest crime was not being CEO of JPM or, at worst, HSBC, where money laundering and other criminal activity is not only encouraged but rewarded with soaring bonuses. The good news is that one can once and for all confirm that when it comes to "Justice" in the US, some - those who deal with legacy status quo mandated and enforced ponzi scheme fiat - are far more equal than anyone who dares to think outside the Fed's printer.

Finally, here is a recent profile of 24 year old "criminal mastermind" Schrem via Bitcoin Examiner.

Meet Charlie Shrem. He’s 23 years old and the co-owner of Evr, one of the most famous gastro pubs in Manhatan. The name might sound familiar, since we talked about this pub before, when it became one of the first establishments to receive Bitcoin as a payment for drinks and food in New York City.

But why is Charlie Shrem different from other crypto-millionaires? Because he is now a BitAngel, member of an investment group created to invest in Bitcoin startups. We’ve also talked about this group before here.

Today, whenever someone pays at Evr with digital coin, Shrem gets a little bit richer, but he’s using his money to help others. Everything started in 2011, when Bitcoin became more famous, he bought thousands of Bitcoins for about $20 each. He invested almost everything he had in what could have been a dangerous game. However, since then, the digital coin value has skyrocketed.


At Evr, with his business partner.

After his investment in the bar, he founded the exchange platform Bitinstant. “Infrastructure is what we need. We’ve got to build, build, build–financial software, exchanges, and different payment products”, says Charlie Shrem, who clearly followed his own advice and profited with it.

He might not have the same funds as big Silicon Valley investors, but he has turned into a Bitcoin angel anyway. “The early guys are the ones that run everything. In this space, how long you’ve been around matters”, explains the entrepreneur.

However, we would like to look at him and others and see some kind of Bitcoin ambassadors, the ones that are setting the example and showing how it’s possible to grow once you leave your fear behind and go deep into a new world like cryptocurrency. Because they show what Bitcoin is for real: an opportunity.


* * *

And now, please join us in a moment of solemn silence as we fondly recall the memory of all the HSBC bankers who were thrown in prison for aiding, abetting and profiting from laundering money with known global terrorists...


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Mon, 01/27/2014 - 13:53 | 4371628 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Looks like the DOJ doesn't need to pursue these cases as best as I can see from the attitudes displayed on this blog.  The wimps have already scared themselves out of owning Bitcoin and admitted defeat to the money masters.  

All seeing eye anyone?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 13:56 | 4371646 H H Henry P P P...
H H Henry P P P Paulson's picture

Bitcoin trades like any other company stock.  Why would an alternative currency's value be reflected by this news?  It shouldn't. 

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 13:59 | 4371672 TeamDepends
TeamDepends's picture

Free Jon Corzine!

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:15 | 4371751 mrdenis
mrdenis's picture

The Honorable Jon Corzine


Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:16 | 4371763 max2205
max2205's picture

Round up the usual suspects...Casablanca

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:42 | 4371875 Pegasus Muse
Pegasus Muse's picture

Another example of a capricious, selective, Gangster-Bankster perpetuating (in)justice system, otherwise known as a Protection Racket for the Status Quo Top 0.1%-ers. 


“It's a Criminal system, built by Criminals for Criminals. The business of America used to be business. Now the businesses of Amerika are war, theft, mass murder, and police state crackdown on anyone who objects.”  –-Chupacabra

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:29 | 4372111 redpill
redpill's picture

"It's a big fuckin' club, and you ain't in it."

-Mr. Carlin

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:24 | 4372329 Ratscam
Ratscam's picture

the brilliant Larry Summer

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:46 | 4372398 HoofHearted
HoofHearted's picture

Phony star, are you going to help your BTC brothers by posting bail in BTC? Oh, wait...nevermind.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 23:26 | 4373788 CheapBastard
CheapBastard's picture

I'm glad they finally caught these two. They look very dangerous.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:32 | 4373952 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture


Yahoo is apparently going to buy some company called Tomfoolery for 16 billion USD.

A few points.

1) I didn't realize Yahoo was solvent. What do they do?

2) I have no phukkin' idea what Tomfoolery does/is.

3) If you had ANY doubt that we are in bubble v2.0, doubt it no more.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:40 | 4373989 BC6
BC6's picture

Every day now seems to be more like it will be the last day of the Ponzi.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:47 | 4374002 BC6
BC6's picture

I hope he can get eyebrow cuts at Riker's.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:56 | 4374020 eatthebanksters
eatthebanksters's picture

Not that the Guvmnt shouldn't go after these guys if they, in fact are breaking the law.  But why them and not Dimon, Blankfein...

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 01:44 | 4374095 Four chan
Four chan's picture

the sec should be a sub set of the fbi. because right now they are nothing costing us billions.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 06:44 | 4374346 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



First they came for the Liberty silver dollars.....


I don't have a problem with bitcoins.....I'm not going to buy one.....but I don't have a problem with them.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 07:58 | 4374391 TheHound73
TheHound73's picture

Something tells me this Shrem guy won't be dumb enough to have his bitcoin wallet stolen from him by the feds like the Silk Road guy.

Doesn't help too much from inside a prison sell, but hey, it's those small victories that count.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 17:04 | 4372471 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Bitcoin takedown, Phase 1... discredit participant and leadership.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 17:12 | 4372509 fonestar
fonestar's picture

These "Bitcoin Foundation" leaders are stooges.  Arrest the lot of them for all I care, we have no leaders or representation.  We ignore the status quo and do not offer explanations to congress members.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 18:06 | 4372703 Exponere Mendaces
Exponere Mendaces's picture


Yeah, been saying for a while that the Bitcoin Foundation idiots were off their rocker to extend a hand to the government to be "partners". This is why Satoshi is anonymous.

The people who don't like what you're doing make damn sure they can use anything against you. Whether these charges were merely manufactured or he's deep in a hell of his own making - it just shows that you can't yell "OVER HERE, YOOHOO!" to the "Eye of Sauron" and expect to come out unscathed.

I full expect the JPMorgan "summit" to result in legislation that will constrict and constrain Bitcoin exchange activity in the USA. No big surprise there. We're in the "Then they fight you" phase of the Bitcoin struggle.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 19:38 | 4372977 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Boris is observation...

  1. BitCoin is cannot have "leadership" by definition. Same is for Libertarian Party (is really "Libertarian Party"!?) because liberty is self determination but fiat currency (Fed Reserve, BOE, ECB, Banc du Canadia, etc. orBitCoin) by definition is require regulation.
  2. BitCoin is has no backing. Is create from ether but is not create by tangible value. Is no more value than is fiat petro dollar or Ruble or Rupee. But is even less because is not even back by GDP or credit of backing nation.
  3. All bank is at once fearful of embrace BitCoin, but is also fearful of ignore BitCoin.
  4. Member of political class is control by member of bankster cabal, so in shadow, ill speaking is of BitCoin or any competition to monopoly money system.
  5. All attempt is make with light hand to discredit BitCoin, by mockery, by criminal investigation, not immediate to put BitCoin participant in jail, but to create fear, uncertainty, dubiosity and scare other participant or investor.
  6. Make legal argument without equitable basis. Make up new law to "protect" citizenry from self.

Boris is sadly prediction BitCoin is dead and crash by end of year... along with USD, Ruble, Hryvnia, Rupee, Yuan, Yen, Peso, etc. as WWIII is commence.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 19:44 | 4373003 logicalman
logicalman's picture

Always nice to hear from the optimist in the room!

Points well put (for anyone familiar with your 'English' that is!)

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:15 | 4373912 margaris
margaris's picture

Mr.Boris. Bitcoin can't die. As long as people use it, it is alive and well.

TPTB can't keep every human on the planet from using the bitcoin network to do transactions. It's NOT POSSIBLE.

Bitcoin value will fluctuate like crazy...yes...


I say what I haven't said in a long time: BTFD! Buy the fucking dip.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:16 | 4373917 willwork4food
willwork4food's picture

No, my virtual Russian friend, Bitcoin will not die by years end. The powers that be just want to send a flare that dealing with illegal drugs (THEIR TURF) will not be accepted. If the powers that be wanted to kill Bitcoin they could have done it years ago.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:24 | 4373946 silvermail
silvermail's picture

Some idiots say: Bitcoin is a threat to the U.S. dollar.
At that time, they forget that Bitcoin is supported by the U.S. Senate and the U.S. Army.
If someone thinks, that the system which represents a real threat to the hegemony of the dollar will have the support of the Senate and the U.S. Army, he is definitely a full idiot.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 01:13 | 4374033 i-dog
i-dog's picture

The boyz behind the curtain ALWAYS play both sides of a dialogue. It's how they force change.

They created Bitcoin and they also pretend to oppose it. The synthesis WILL be an electronic currency fully controlled by them.

Thanks for that nice link that exposes their stealthy background moves. Soon, all government payments will be electronic...and fully traceable/taxable at every step.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:32 | 4373968 exartizo
exartizo's picture

I like that word... "dubiosity".

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 05:14 | 4374290 palmdetroit
palmdetroit's picture

This Boris guy is good

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 18:00 | 4372682 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

Hiding behind their computers, both defendants are charged with knowingly contributing to and facilitating anonymous drug sales, earning substantial profits along the way,” said DEA acting special-agent-in-charge James Hunt.

OMG they made SUBSTANTIAL PROFITS!? And made money from GASP! drugs? And money laundering? And they are not part of the Fascist-Corporate Elite!?


They should plead for instant death, rather than torture, then death. What kind of imbecile tries to earn debt instruments, AKA FRN, without being in the club?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 19:06 | 4372886 Nick Jihad
Nick Jihad's picture

This from the administration that has been selling guns to the Sinaloa cartel? No matter how cynical I get, I just can't keep up.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:42 | 4373991 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

@redpill: ""It's a big fuckin' club, and you ain't in it." - G. Carlin

With all deference to Carlin (RIP, bro!), I believe he 'misspoke'... I'd argue that it's a small club, and we ain't in it.  A club of the "1-2 Percenters".

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:40 | 4371882 fonestar
fonestar's picture

I just sent some of my Bitcoin to Czech Republic, converted it into Litecoin on BTC-E and got it back to my wallet in Canada.  Whole process took less than twenty minutes, totally outside of banks and governments.

Amazing technology.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:44 | 4371894 whatthecurtains
whatthecurtains's picture

You started with nothing and ended with nothing.  Good job.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:46 | 4371916 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

You do realize he only has two bitcoins lol.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:54 | 4371954 fonestar
fonestar's picture

I have many, many Bitcoins, hundreds of Litecoin and even bought some NMC just for the hell of it.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:02 | 4371994 TruthHammer
TruthHammer's picture

glad you are actually dumping and not just pumping.  Not surprised you actually have more LTC than BTC.  Keep FUD Pumping the good fight, but get out while you still can. 


It was never a currency, and its first adopter status is irrelevant.  Take the free money from "the greater fools" while you still can.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:30 | 4372116 redpill
redpill's picture

Unfortunately true.  While a noble effort, Bitcoin's legacy could ultimately play out as the biggest pyramid scheme in the history of mankind once finally decides to tighten the screws.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:35 | 4372137 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Your .gov is just one of many .govs on planet Earth.  

The sum total power of all of these .govs, their machine guns, aircraft carriers, attack helicopters, drones, satellite systems is less than one brilliant idea.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:58 | 4372452 redpill
redpill's picture

Possible, but unfortunately that idea is not Bitcoin.  Believe me I wish it were.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 19:42 | 4372994 Boris Alatovkrap
Boris Alatovkrap's picture

Boris is special talent to pass spaghetti noodle into nose, through nasal passage, and back out through mouth. Is gross, time consuming, extremely full for pain, but is can be done, like BitCoin transactional.

Boris is consider first boil spaghetti noodle so is more softer.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 19:45 | 4373009 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

In Glory Days of Mother Russia, black-out-drunk vodka fueled sex with gulag Mongoloid women in Siberia stayed in Siberia.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:19 | 4373929 willwork4food
willwork4food's picture



Mon, 01/27/2014 - 20:10 | 4373075 nmewn
nmewn's picture

ROTFL!!!...I swear Boris, you kill

Try it with some encryption sauce next time, a little moar expensive (just like a fee or tax or cost of doing biz, whatever) but makes zeee transaction smoother and doesn't tickle the back of the throat ;-)

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 23:20 | 4373773 CheapBastard
CheapBastard's picture

... and back to square 1:

"If you don't hold it....."

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 05:17 | 4374292 palmdetroit
palmdetroit's picture

they can't take it?

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:50 | 4374007 Yes We Can. But...
Yes We Can. But Lets Not.'s picture

Boris, you make me snot on screen.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 06:59 | 4374358 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



Boris owes me 3 monitors and 2 keyboards.....I've sent him a bill.


So far.....nothing.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 05:07 | 4374288 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

maybe is Boris be invent Noodlecoin!

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 17:19 | 4372541 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

The sum total power of all of those .govs, their machine guns, etc. etc., --is less than one brilliant idea";  Viper one, be advised, target claims to have secret weapon defense, "brilliant Idea"; "Viper, check; will open with chain gun from max. range". OH, too bad; your magic didn't work.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 17:22 | 4372554 fonestar
fonestar's picture

.gov shill

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 19:46 | 4373008 snr-moment
snr-moment's picture

To ignore reality for this long takes some serious wishful thinking.  At least they'll need their surveillance drones to find my Blanton's and Van Winkle stash.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 19:09 | 4372896 Nick Jihad
Nick Jihad's picture

Dude, how can you even mention "the biggest pyramid scheme in history" in the same sentence with "", without acknowledging the obvious?  Sheeez, wake up!

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 18:35 | 4377126 Pseudonymous
Pseudonymous's picture

You must be colorblind.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:03 | 4371999 dogbreath
dogbreath's picture

Canada weeps

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:03 | 4372004 kodachrome
kodachrome's picture

Get more every day

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:25 | 4372331 ebear
ebear's picture

Guards!  Seize him!

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:17 | 4373906 Spanky
Spanky's picture

I have many, many Bitcoins, hundreds of Litecoin and even bought some NMC just for the hell of it. -- fonestar

fonestar's chequing account is $14 overdrawn as we speak.  Savings account is $0. -- fonestar

Then fonestar is not objective about bitcoin -- all his observations and pronouncements ought be taken with a grain of salt.

I get bitcoin, fonestar, I really do. And I wish it were real. But I suspect it's not. I could be wrong. But the simple fact is, a currency is based on trust. As is a crypto algo. And the bitcoin algo is suspect. This is an assessment based on experience.

It's your money. Good luck...

But you ought be aware that this "technical" issue means bitcoin transactions and wallets are fully transparent to no such agency.

Money is a confidence game. No confidence, no game.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 17:25 | 4372560 Frank N. Beans
Frank N. Beans's picture

2 bits equal 25 cents right?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 19:56 | 4373038 Papasmurf
Papasmurf's picture

You started with nothing and ended with nothing.  Good job.

That's superior to the deal you get on Wall $treet.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 18:07 | 4372711 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

Fonestar I did something similar this weekend.

I ran a bunch of Unicorn farts through my still and bottled the resulting ambrosia. Next I collateralized the bottles, sold swaps, and am now either penniless or the King of Norway.

I can't tell.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:32 | 4373967 BC6
BC6's picture

LOL Rafter!

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:48 | 4371910 PhilB
PhilB's picture

JP MORGAN KNOWINGLY turned a blind eye to Madoff's ginormous ponzi scheme to the tune of 65B USD for DECADES, violating all sorts of criminal laws and aboslutely no criminal charges were filed against the bank or its employees.  JP Morgan pays a fine for "ignoring signs", the two guys are going to jail for a potential 1MM USD exchange.  

Something is rotten in the state of Denmark!

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 19:50 | 4373020 logicalman
logicalman's picture

If Shakespeare had known about the US he would have used a stronger word than 'rotten'

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:04 | 4373880 cynicalskeptic
cynicalskeptic's picture

Dimon got a raise to $20 million (any stock options on top of that?) while JPM employees got NO raises this year.

HSBC pled guilty to money laundering charges for drug cartels - none of their execs were arrested.


The list of TBTF bank execs who are blatantly guilty of violations of the law is huge but...... nobody even gets charged.  Why is that?

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:31 | 4373966 willwork4food
willwork4food's picture


Wed, 01/29/2014 - 02:48 | 4378810 Kobe Beef
Kobe Beef's picture

The Banks are the government.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:46 | 4374000 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

Madoff was ignored by JPM as long as he didn't try to rip of the Upstream System (FRB).  He only got nailed when he was outed for having ripped off the rich & powerful in his own Tribe.  Clearly, they could not stand for that and he had to be made an example of.

BTC, on the other hand, IS a threat to the FRB system -- and the System (Fed/Gov) won't stand for that.  A subtle, but important distinction.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 05:04 | 4374286 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

btc is in their pocket - they'll use it to attack you, not the other way around.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 04:22 | 4374253 The Heart
The Heart's picture

"Something is rotten in the state of Denmark!"

You got that right.

Fireworks are already being shot off.

Quick, where's the door!


Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:56 | 4371969 Colonel Klink
Colonel Klink's picture

And when you say Honorable, you mean lying thieving cunt?  Like our honorable judges and politicians?  Yeah, I thought so.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:35 | 4372364 Offthebeach
Offthebeach's picture

GOVERNOR John Corzine

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:23 | 4371792 replaceme
replaceme's picture



Mon, 01/27/2014 - 13:59 | 4371675 camaro68ss
camaro68ss's picture

when you try to beat the FED, you get F*** in the A** by a stranger.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 13:59 | 4371681 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Give up, lube up, bend over.

The ZH battle cry.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:04 | 4371706 Stackers
Stackers's picture

Big sell off volatility on a couple of the exchanges

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:22 | 4372072 fonestar
fonestar's picture

fonestar doesn't care if it goes to $500 or $5,000 first.  

fonestar is buying the superior system.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:32 | 4372123 bitcoinbear
bitcoinbear's picture

this is just a small bump on the fascist road, bitcoin will prevail eventually

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:38 | 4372144 fonestar
fonestar's picture

I wouldn't even consider it a bump.  Members of the anglosphere have somehow deluded themselves into thinking they and their governments are relevant.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:44 | 4372180 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Naw, the thousands of nuclear warheads at their disposal sort of make that true...

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:46 | 4372189 bitcoinbear
bitcoinbear's picture

Yes, more like a pebble. And let's not forget that this is the same government that throws babies out of incubators, they will not stop at nothing to maintain their monopoly of violence.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:51 | 4372222 fonestar
fonestar's picture

It's funny to watch this and the comments on BTC-E as it happens!  The people selling think that Bitcoin is a news driven market (like the end of the world China fake ban on Bitcoin)?  What do they think this is?  Certainly not something they understood in the first place.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:33 | 4372357 bitcoinbear
bitcoinbear's picture

Bitcoin is not hive mind friendly. It's the free market and it rewards people who think for themselves. 

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:45 | 4372399 fonestar
fonestar's picture

So in other words, not friendly to people who think there is one type of value only and it is a magical particle that exists in some coins and not others?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:59 | 4372461 bitcoinbear
bitcoinbear's picture

They do not think, that's the problem. They belong to the rubber stamp club.

“Universal literacy was supposed to educate the common man to control his environment. Once he could read and write he would have a mind fit to rule. So ran the democratic doctrine. But instead of a mind, universal literacy has given him rubber stamps, rubber stamps inked with advertising slogans, with editorials, with published scientific data, with the trivialities of the tabloids and the platitudes of history, but quite innocent of original thought. Each man's rubber stamps are the duplicates of millions of others, so that when those millions are exposed to the same stimuli, all receive identical imprints. It may seem an exaggeration to say that the American public gets most of its ideas in this wholesale fashion. The mechanism by which ideas are disseminated on a large scale is propaganda, in the broad sense of an organized effort to spread a particular belief or doctrine.” 
Edward L. BernaysPropaganda

Wed, 01/29/2014 - 10:06 | 4379394 Kobe Beef
Kobe Beef's picture

+1. If you haven't read Bernays, you don't understand the world you were born into..

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:20 | 4372319 eclectic syncretist
eclectic syncretist's picture

What would you estimate the "true value" of one bitcoin to be?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:26 | 4372330 fonestar
fonestar's picture

I don't subscribe to the notion that dollars have value.  I do not know how many ounces of gold or silver 1 BTC is worth or should be worth.

Thu, 01/30/2014 - 00:53 | 4374284 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

since btc has no atoms, btc = 0.

Real money must have an ATOMIC nucleus.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 23:07 | 4373732's picture

when 1 satoshi = the smallest logical unit of trade

or if BTC is used to back other (crypto or national) currencies, more than that

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 02:21 | 4374152 Freewheelin Franklin
Freewheelin Franklin's picture

Value is subjective.



Mon, 01/27/2014 - 19:53 | 4373030 logicalman
logicalman's picture

I think this may fit....

Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall.

I'm an atheist, but there are some good quotes in that old book.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 17:25 | 4372563 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

I'm really happy for you and your superior system; really, I am. I think every deluded fool should be allowed to revel in whatever crackbrain scheme they fall prey to; but could you do it silently? It contributes absolutely nothing to this blog; I mean it's vaguely aumuzing that you think you're superman and you're going to beat the Govt. and etc. but couldn't you have these fantasies somewhere else? Isn't there a Bitcoin mutual masturbation blog, or something? I'm sure there must be. Try Yahoo, blogs.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 17:52 | 4372642 madtechnician
madtechnician's picture

Are you referring to the FRN crackbrain debt ponzi scheme ?

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 05:01 | 4374283 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

sadly FRN's are about 100,000x more stable than bitcoin. Pretty sad.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 07:59 | 4374394 TheHound73
TheHound73's picture

Yep, 7% average volatility is actually low balling your 100,000 times less stable figure.  Bitcoin will remain volatile while its market cap remains small.

Wed, 01/29/2014 - 01:10 | 4378642 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

actually it's not market-cap, it's the fiat exchanges. Until fiat exchanges are all removed bitcoin can't be stable.
They all need to be replaced with stores selling goods & services priced only in btc. Until that day bitcoin is doomed.

7% average volatility isn't bitcoin. Bitcoin could be +50% to -80% at any given day compared to the prior day.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 18:11 | 4372719 Exponere Mendaces
Exponere Mendaces's picture

LOL - I love how a slump of 70 bucks is a "big deal" to the ZH-heads. You should've been around when it was rallying its ass off in mid-November of 2013. This is "old hat" to anyone trading Bitcoin.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 19:58 | 4373039 logicalman
logicalman's picture

I realise that all currencies can vary in value, but one of the important requiremnts for a stable currency is it being stable in value.

I'd hate to have to get up every morning and wonder what the value of my currency is today, if it's bouncing around all over.

I know the value of our present fiat isn't stable, but for now its value is sliding in a known direction at a pace that I can keep up with (didn't say I like the idea, or am comfortable with it, but it's a fact)

If it starts to take off, the Fed will get their political enforcers to just outlaw its use in transactions. Kind of like an inverse legal tender law.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 08:21 | 4374425 TheHound73
TheHound73's picture

Whatdya expect for an fixed-supply asset class that started at zero a few short years ago and who's market participation rate hasn't been established yet.

As far as outlaw use in transactions, what kind of vocabulary do you think they'll come up with?  Bitcoins are intangible, existing only in a worldwide ledger that nobody controls. A person in charge of a bitcoin address cannot stop others from sending funds to it.  The government will make it illegal to render goods or services if some numbers happen to change on the ledger?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:09 | 4371726 Toolshed
Toolshed's picture

Sounds like you will be needing some lube yourself. I will trade you some for gold. Got gold?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:09 | 4371740 fonestar
fonestar's picture

How's that armed rebellion against all enemies foreign and domestic working out?  Slavetards allowed to own guns.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:19 | 4371781 Toolshed
Toolshed's picture

Total crybaby. Boo hoo little boy.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:25 | 4371803 fonestar
fonestar's picture

The Bitcoiners are making history as you wimps hide out waiting for the CRIMEX to default.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:56 | 4372239 firstdivision
firstdivision's picture

Charles Ponzi made history, as did Madoff.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:59 | 4372251 fonestar
fonestar's picture


Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:15 | 4372300 firstdivision
firstdivision's picture



Word association games are fun.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:39 | 4372373 fonestar
fonestar's picture

What does Google-NSA pay per post?  What do you think it will be worth in terms of BTC five years from now?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:20 | 4373582 jerry_theking_lawler
jerry_theking_lawler's picture

Tylers.....can you please add a rule to the TOS for posting....if you get 1,000 downvotes in 1 day, your account is blocked for a week....if you get 1,000,000 down votes, it is blocked forever. what do you think? (nah, I'm too big a proponent of free speech...let fone get his head bashed in repeatedly).

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:37 | 4373983 willwork4food
willwork4food's picture

That's kind of funny in a censorship kind of way. Let him rant. He might or might not be a fool. If you don't like the movie, change the movie.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:20 | 4373923 silvermail
silvermail's picture

"What do you think it will be worth in terms of BTC five years from now?"


Mon, 01/27/2014 - 18:46 | 4372832 tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture


Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:24 | 4372328 eclectic syncretist
eclectic syncretist's picture

Is that a mugshot of Ezra PoundED IN THE ASS you've got there?

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 04:57 | 4374281 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

yes, a tulip plant. A very rare coloration. Easily worth a discount price of one fwazeeelyun bitcoins.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:29 | 4371822 outamyeffinway
outamyeffinway's picture

That's what you're left with? Calling someone a crybaby? Ughhhh.. ZH weighs on the cranium sometimes. Even Tyler can't resist the propaganda because he knows he stirs the shit with BTC. Fuck you Tyler.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:55 | 4371959 bigrooster
bigrooster's picture

Hey fuckstar once shitcoin hits ZERO are you still going to hang out on ZH so we can laugh at you?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:59 | 4371987 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Bitcoin will not go to $0 but morons like yourself are incapable of understanding why that is.

You have no business on this blog or living in the 21st century.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 17:52 | 4372651 madtechnician
madtechnician's picture

It''s pretty obvious that if it was truly a Ponzi scheme the governments would be welcoming it with open arms .

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 04:52 | 4374275 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

like bitcoin miners mostly being NSA server-farms now?

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 04:50 | 4374274 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

right, bitcoin will go to 0.00000001 but not zero.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 08:30 | 4374440 TheHound73
TheHound73's picture

Bitcoin will be the best performing asset this year as it has been the previous 4 years.

Wed, 01/29/2014 - 01:11 | 4378646 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

measured in what, pocket-lint?
Not in dollars, certainly not in ounces of gold or silver.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:54 | 4371961 bigrooster
bigrooster's picture

Hey fuckstar once shitcoin hits ZERO are you still going to hang out on ZH so we can laugh at you?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:57 | 4371982 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Had to post twice to prove to everyone what a dipshit you are?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:55 | 4371965 Drifter
Drifter's picture

Finally, a point I can agree with you on.   Sheep with guns.  Guns but no guts.  That's what American  so-called "patriots" are.

There should have been a revolution long ago.  Now with things like zerocare destroying the last tidbits of individual rights, it's getting highly embarrassing for those so-called "patriots".   They keep saying "it's not time yet", and they're becoming the laughing stock of the entire world.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:42 | 4372006 fonestar
fonestar's picture

fonestar is Canadian but likes Jefferson and the ideals of the republic.  It's too bad Americans can no longer find the fire in their belly, the kind Alex Jones has and displayed on Communist News Network.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:52 | 4372221 Drifter
Drifter's picture

AJ style ranting and raving isn't guts nor courage. "Getting the truth out" is meaningless, as we've seen 5 yrs now on ZH and many other "truth" sites. 

People knowing the truth about a criminal cabal govt doesn't rein in that criminal cabal govt one little bit.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:57 | 4372246 fonestar
fonestar's picture

No, it doesn't make you a hero or courageous but people still viewing those programs need to be woken from their opiate-like slumber.  If loud noises and yelling can help, why not?

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:43 | 4373993 willwork4food
willwork4food's picture

It will come when a SWAT team destroys the wrong home allegedly looking for drugs and kills the father's 4 year old daughter (unarmed), takes out their dog(unarmed) and arrests the family for fighting back(resisting a peace officer).

Those bastards need to die.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:16 | 4372301 silvermail
silvermail's picture

"fonestar is Canadian but likes Jefferson and the ideals of the republic".


Fonstar is an idiot, regardless of his nationality and political preferences.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:27 | 4372336 fonestar
fonestar's picture

....losing at $50 BTC, losing at $800 BTC, losing at $5,000 BTC.  Losers will be losers.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:31 | 4372350 tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

there you go valuing in fiat again

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 16:54 | 4372432 fonestar
fonestar's picture

fiat currency does have value.... when it comes to waging psychological warfare.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 17:20 | 4372543 tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

and who's to say the platform isn't more valuable at let's say $800 than at $5,000?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 17:34 | 4372592 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

I have no idea what you're raving about; thank god. If I did, I'd really be in trouble.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 18:33 | 4372790 chemystical
chemystical's picture

In your timeline claims you need to include the segment where you sold at $200 to "pay some bills" and then bought back in a few months later at $800.

We all bow to the financial wizardry of paying 1600% (annualized) to buy back your own Btc.

You have neither a pot to piss nor the same courage in your convictions that you incessantly clamor that everyone else should have.


Tue, 01/28/2014 - 04:49 | 4374273 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

bitKONAmon has spoken!

I'm loading up on Treasuries, ImpossibruCoin & ZNGA before I miss out!

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 19:20 | 4372924 Nick Jihad
Nick Jihad's picture

There should have been a revolution long ago.

Yeah, because revolutions always result in increased liberty. Your reasoning seems childlike -  "things aren't going my way, so the only solution is to throw a tantrum."

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:16 | 4371768 Chief KnocAHoma
Chief KnocAHoma's picture

Quick... someone call Saul Goodman!

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:28 | 4371815 CH1
CH1's picture

when you try to beat the FED, you get F*** in the A** by a stranger.

Bow down and lick your master's boots, coward.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:00 | 4371677 fonestar
fonestar's picture

fer fucks sakes... Bitcoin is not a stock!  It is a currency!

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:02 | 4371691 superflex
superflex's picture

fer fucks sakes... Bitcoin is not a stock!  It is a fiat currency!

There.  Fixed that for ya!

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:04 | 4371704 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Most of you are too fucking stupid to even know the meaning of the word fiat.  So yeah, good luck understanding Bitcoin!

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:07 | 4371720 Toolshed
Toolshed's picture

It appears that "we" understand it better than "thee". Good luck with that.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:09 | 4371727 fonestar
Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:17 | 4371776 Toolshed
Toolshed's picture

From wikipedia? You are dumber than I thought, and a very poor LOSER. There is no such thing as fiat money. Only fiat currency. You need to learn the difference between currency and money obviously. Gold and silver are money. BTC, FRN's, EURO's, etc. are currencies. It's not that hard really. Perhaps you should post less and read more.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:23 | 4371793 fonestar
fonestar's picture

The US Treasury's silver certificate was a fiat currency.  Bitcoin is a voluntary currency.  Who needs to read more?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:33 | 4371827 cowdiddly
cowdiddly's picture

The US Treasury's silver certificate was a fiat currency.


Mon, 01/27/2014 - 14:48 | 4371889 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Right again.  Sorry, you don't get to hijack words and their meanings.  At least not if you don't want other people who converse in that language to think you're crazy.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 15:34 | 4372133 bitcoinbear
bitcoinbear's picture

you're right and the red necks are wrong as usual

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