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Welcome To The Age Of The Online High School

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Put down that prom dress. It seems, as ConvergEx's Nick Colas notes, Retail isn’t the only service moving from the brick and mortar world to the virtual one. Online high schools have been popping up (on the internet, of course) more and more often in the last few years: even Stanford University started a program in 2006. Of the 22 million high-school aged (14-18) population in the US, about 1 million are estimated to be enrolled in a class or a full-time high school online. That said, virtual schools are unlikely to replace traditional classrooms anytime soon: they’re still used mostly for supplemental or make-up courses rather than a complete education. But, Colas adds hopefully, the technology points in a positive direction: free high school education means more high school diplomas, which could lead to a higher labor force participation rate, lower unemployment, and higher earnings for those who might have otherwise dropped out.

 

Via ConvergEx's Nick Colas,

Online high schools may not become the norm, and they might not bring graduation rates to 100%, but they could be changing secondary education – and the workforce – for the better.

Note from Nick: Online education is moving upstream, from college to high school. Today Sarah looks at this emerging trend to see what it may mean for long term trends in unemployment, labor force participation, and social welfare.  Bottom line: Americans without a high school education face far worse economic prospects than any other cohort; anything that helps this group is worth exploring.

What if there was a way to add 3 million Americans to the labor force, increase earnings, reduce the unemployment rate, and increase labor force participation? Might sound too good to be true. But there is one way we might accomplish this: send the 25 or so million non-high school graduates back to school to get their diplomas. We’ll get to exactly how we can do that in a minute, but first a brief outline of the problem:

Of the 25 million or so US adults with less than a high school diploma, only 11.3 million are actually in the labor force; their participation rate was a dismal 43.7% in December 2013. In other words, if you don’t finish high school, you’re more likely than not to drop out of the labor force or never engage with it in the first place.

 

Men actually have a much higher rate of participation here – 57.9% - compared to women, of whom only 33.4% are active in the workforce.

 

The unemployment rate for those in the labor force currently stands at 9.8% - a full 3 percentage points above the headline number. That said, 9.8% is a significant improvement from November’s 10.6% and last year’s 11.6%.

So what would the labor force look like if all of these workers – who represent “only”  7.3% of employed Americans – were to complete their secondary educations, giving them the same employment outlook as high school graduates? We ran a few quick calculations, and this is what we came up with:

More than 3.5 million people would join the labor force. High school graduates – who now make up about 27% of the workforce, would then represent about 38%.

 

Of that number, 3.3 million would be employed – and would make about $10k more a year than they would have without a diploma, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics earnings data.

 

The overall participation rate would rise to 64.2%. Still not up to par with historical standards, but certainly higher than current rates.

 

Unemployment would drop to 6.5% overall – and the absolute number of unemployed persons would drop by about 40k. Again, not a huge improvement – but it’s getting there.

The US population has been slowly moving towards a labor market with more high school graduates with increasing graduation rates, but there’s one relatively new service that could help us accelerate the process: online high school. Almost every state has founded some form of online primary education in the last decade or so; the idea has actually been around since about 1993 when the EBUS Academy in Canada began offering virtual classes. Originally, it was intended to be supplementary to established high school classes, not a replacement for them: students could take higher level or more challenging courses that may not have been offered locally.

As it’s evolved, though, more and more online schools are offering full-time programs that result in a diploma in four years or less; even Stanford University founded its own online high school in 2006. It’s the luxury version of online education, of course: seminar-style and directed-study courses, full-time or part-time, for $16k a year. And it’s been quite successful; the school is currently home to a few young superstars in science and the arts. But it offers the same essential service as the free public school programs: students dictate their own schedule, and thus learn on their own terms and in their own time.

Still, online high schools are nowhere near replacing their brick and mortar counterparts just yet. While researchers agree they have a few advantages over traditional classrooms, some doubt its efficacy in the short and long term. Here are a few of the facts they highlight in the literature:

Out of about 22 million high school-aged kids in the US, 16 million are enrolled in some sort of high school – but less than 1 million are enrolled in online classes, according to estimates from Anthony Picciano and Jeff Seaman of the Sloan Consortium. More than half of these are online part-time students, or students only taking one supplementary class; very few are enrolled full-time.

 

A 2000 study (Bigbie & McCarroll) found that more than half of the students who completed an online course in Florida scored an A or higher; only 7% received a failing grade. Another study in 2009  by Barbour and Mulcahy showed that in more than 200,000 cases, students enrolled in online classrooms performed as well as traditional classroom students on exams.

 

Not all the news is positive, though. Researchers Ballas and Belyk (2000) reported that participation rates for virtual students were up to 30% lower than classroom-based students; Bigbie and McCarroll (2000) reported that 25-50% of the students they followed dropped out of their virtual courses over the period, skewing the year-end exam results higher.

 

Students in online high school courses tend to come from one of two backgrounds: highly motivated and overachieving, or underperformers required to repeat a class. According to Barbour, this bipolarization skews the literature of virtual school students to focus on the high performers – giving virtual schools a better rep than they might otherwise get. In 2007, the two classes with the highest enrollment in the US were Algebra I and Algebra II – and many of the students enrolled in the course were taking it for the second or third time. Put simply, there is a split between those students who take courses to challenge themselves – like those enrolled at Stanford – and those that John Watson (2008) calls “at-risk” students: those who probably would have dropped out of traditional schools. Online schooling might be effective for the former, but the jury is still out on the latter.

Despite some of these setbacks, its existing and potential advantages make online schooling a theoretical boon for society at large. Aside from offering out-of-reach classes to students who want them, there are three major benefits to virtual schools:

It gives everyone the opportunity to get a high school diploma – anywhere, any time – which means a more educated workforce, a larger workforce, and higher earnings potential. Currently, those without a high school diploma make about $10,000 less per year than someone who graduates: they’re also more likely to be unemployed, if they are even in the labor force. If they’re given the chance to complete their education on their own time and at their own pace, though, it’s possible that graduation rates will rise – quite a few states, in fact, have created public online schools for exactly this reason. With a high school diploma, those who may otherwise have dropped out increase their earnings potential and employment opportunities – and as we showed before, increase the participation rate and reduce unemployment.

 

As Stanford’s experiment exemplifies, it lets schools (and society) identify the all-stars even before they reach college age. It’s no fluke that Stanford’s online student body has so many award winners; they’re specifically selected because of their high potential and intellectual capabilities. Moreover, online education gives Stanford (and other schools) the chance to recruit from abroad, and thus bring the best and brightest in the world. And since the school can shape the education of its students, it would not be surprising if Stanford’s OHS became a funnel for the university: catching the students early on gives the school the possibility of enrolling an exceptionally bright or entrepreneurial student before they’re even teenagers.

 

Finally, like most online operations, virtual schooling helps lower costs. According to UC Berkeley, online classes each take about $50k-$100k to develop; but once they’re finished, they require very little maintenance. Eliminating the classroom, the books, the desks – all leads to lower costs for schooling. Some private online schools cost a pretty penny, yes – Stanford will set you back $16k for a year – but free public schools could benefit from this lower cost alternative to summer school or class repeats. And not to worry, teachers, you’re safe: online classrooms require an instructor, a grader, and a mentor. While you may not be teaching in front of a classroom, you can keep your job – and potentially work in your pajamas.

Again – online high school is not likely to take over the role of the traditional classroom anytime soon. And more research is necessary to determine its efficacy – though school districts in Georgia and Alabama are already touting the benefits of their programs. Overall, though, virtual schooling is a net positive: not only does it foster a larger, more educated workforce, but it also allows us to identify outperformers and lower costs. The only thing it’s missing is the prom.

 

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Mon, 01/27/2014 - 20:58 | 4373244 dark pools of soros
dark pools of soros's picture

and you bolded this many lines for this?? is that a random bold line generator?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:05 | 4373264 The Gooch
The Gooch's picture

i-common core.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:11 | 4373294 CH1
CH1's picture

Government schools SUCK.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:13 | 4373306 knukles
knukles's picture

Well there was a shooting today at a N.C. Mental Health Faciltiy

Get the irony?
Holy BeJesus....

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:17 | 4373325 bigdumbnugly
bigdumbnugly's picture

an obviously glaring deficiency with online high schools would be the lack of backseat training available...

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:20 | 4373341 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

So who thinks the NEA will allow themselves to be automated out of existence?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:25 | 4373364 knukles
knukles's picture

"A teacher in every keyboard!"
Proudly serving America's youth

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:16 | 4373568 SafelyGraze
SafelyGraze's picture

the next game-changer:

online prison

 

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:49 | 4373668 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture

This poses serious questions. If High School is taught online, how are the teachers going to bang the students?

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 03:23 | 4374226 Zero Point
Zero Point's picture

By web cam, as the students pay for their online tuition.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 05:54 | 4374309 Richard Chesler
Richard Chesler's picture

Whether or not they can spell "Do you want fries with that?"

What fucking difference does it make?

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 06:43 | 4374343 Disenchanted
Disenchanted's picture

Can I pay for my virtual education with bitcoinz?

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 09:29 | 4374591 smlbizman
smlbizman's picture

would not surprise one bit {get it} if fonestar bitch slapped the shit out of you for desecrating on "bitcoins" with your spelling error...i wouldn't want to be you..

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 12:35 | 4375452 kralizec
kralizec's picture

I was going to ask if prom was online too, but damn, I guess we can skip that shit.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:25 | 4373368 Debt-Is-Not-Money
Debt-Is-Not-Money's picture

"Government schools SUCK."

Agreed, but you need to spend a night in the "box" to get your mind right!

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0061512/quotes

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:23 | 4373595 max2205
max2205's picture

The only thing missing is the porn.....fixed it

Wed, 01/29/2014 - 11:44 | 4379827 Kobe Beef
Kobe Beef's picture

Public Zoo System

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:21 | 4373587 Offthebeach
Offthebeach's picture

The highest quality place in a government reeducation minimun skool is the cafeteria. After that its downhill.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 01:47 | 4374098 Freddie
Freddie's picture

This has been going on for a while with home schooling.  There has been course work created and online classes, etc etc.  This is why the NEA hates home schooling.  Oh and it is harder to brainwash the kids without the NEA but TV and Hollywood do their part to brainwash em.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 20:59 | 4373245 W74
W74's picture

There seems to be a fallacy in this country that high school diplomas make people smarter.

By extension that same fallacy suggests that college degrees make people smarter.  If you get one in your hand then you are smarter than you were the day before.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:04 | 4373258 logicalman
logicalman's picture

Pieces of paper tell a potential employer that you are capable of dealing with bullshit rules and keeping on being a 'productive citizen'

Talent just shows.

I know what kind of person I would be looking for.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:25 | 4373363 CH1
CH1's picture

a fallacy in this country that diplomas make people smarter

It's the magic piece of paper: We've been taught that we MUST have it. Joe Average will pay anything to get it.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:00 | 4373250 logicalman
logicalman's picture

If kids can learn at home, what's the problem with home schooling?

Go to school, you get schooled.

Parents should be the educators.

That was my approach with my kids and it seems to have worked - they both think.

 

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:28 | 4373376 Deo vindice
Deo vindice's picture

Homeschooled kids consistently score higher marks on tests than public schooled ones.

If a homeschooled kid applied for a job with me, I would automatically lean towards hiring him before the others.

They are generally much more able to work through a problem and think laterally than the indoctrinated ones coming out of the system.

Also, contrary to one of the (supposed) big negatives against homeschooling, those kids are much better socially adapted than those who aren't.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:18 | 4373570 spinone
spinone's picture

That may be, but I see homeschooled kids who wear their underpants outside the pants.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:40 | 4373648 markovchainey
markovchainey's picture

For every one homeschooled kid I see wearing his underwear outside his pants I see 100+ government schooled kids dressed the same.  

 

Food courts can be interesting. 

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:47 | 4373667 bobert
bobert's picture

No you don't Spinone.

My children were homeschooled.

You'd be amazed to see what they are doing with their careers today.

And they are very popular socially.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:03 | 4373253 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

Been saying this for almost 10 years. 10 years later everyone still laughs at Me. Of course the public takers hate the idea. But also the parents who want an all day baby sitting service. 

 

Forget how much waste and savings can be had. 

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:08 | 4373281 logicalman
logicalman's picture

I think you may have missed something.

Women's 'Lib' was not about 'liberating' women, it was about getting more people to tax.

I don't think women are inferior in society just because their role in life is different from that of the male.

The two are complementary and, in my view equal.

If it was left up to just guys, I think extinction wouldn't take long!

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:15 | 4373318 BidnessMan
BidnessMan's picture

Brick & Mortar school is free day care for a good percentage of the "students".

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:22 | 4373353 knukles
knukles's picture

And a free lunch.
Don't forget the free lunch

But wait, says Knuks, there ain't no such thing as a free lunch!

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:27 | 4373374 logicalman
logicalman's picture

I'm glad you added the small print!

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:30 | 4373383 logicalman
logicalman's picture

dup

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:09 | 4373895 Oleander
Oleander's picture

Free breakfast too. Before school care opens at 7 am and afterschool care until 6 pm. Who is raising those kids?

 

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:05 | 4373266 williambanzai7
williambanzai7's picture

Fast Times at Online High

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:08 | 4373283 The Gooch
The Gooch's picture

Fast Times at Mainline High.

(sad truth)

 

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:09 | 4373287 U4 eee aaa
U4 eee aaa's picture

Yeah man. To pay for the school they could sell links to online porn sites where the porn companies could set up virtual peepholes into virtual cheerleader's dressing rooms (I don't know where I got that idea from). The total school experience

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:06 | 4373269 U4 eee aaa
U4 eee aaa's picture

This is so cool. The internet has now made it possible to flunk out from the comfort of your own home! :)

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 00:23 | 4373938 Matt
Matt's picture

There is no failing, you just stay at the same level until you complete it, however long that takes. Government should totally pay people $15 an hour to do that, there is no way it could backfire.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:08 | 4373274 random shots
random shots's picture

"free high school education means more high school diplomas, which could lead to a higher labor force participation rate, lower unemployment, and higher earnings for those who might have otherwise dropped out."

 

This only makes sense if there is a supply shortage of high school grads for higher paying jobs.  This will most likely result in a higher labor supply for the same jobs which will push earnings down. 

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:10 | 4373289 U4 eee aaa
U4 eee aaa's picture

Educational version of Sisyphus

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:17 | 4373321 logicalman
logicalman's picture

There are a multitude of jobs requiring a multitude of skills.

There are a multitude of people with different skills.

Any sane society would at least attempt to fit the right people to the right task (from the point of view of the individual performing said task). People doing something that makes them happy do it better than those doing it because they have to. Some people can hold their noses while shovelling shit if it makes them the money to do what they want to do in the time they are not working.

Let supply and demand sort out remuneration.

A safety net of some kind is essential, IMHO, in any decent society. Even fossil humans show that old and infirm people were cared for.

 

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:30 | 4373395 Deo vindice
Deo vindice's picture

I met a fossil human recently. He didn't seem to care for much of anything actually. ;-)

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:41 | 4373447 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

Currently we have far too many College Graduates whom are unemployed. If they are earning ZERO then how can a High School Grad be earning $10,000 less than ZERO if he is also unemployed?

 

Oh...I know...The author of the article was writing about Statistical Averages.

 

There is a Supply Shortage of productive employment in the United States currently. That is the reality.

 

An Education for the High Schooler, online, or Brick and Mortar, is not going to make the unemployment problem any better.

 

The author of the original article is high on Hopium.

 

You might have better stated that the article makes absolutely no sense at all.

 

THis is Main Stream Media claptrap...drivel.

 

Without a fundamental change in our system the entire generation, uneducated, or educated, will be lost.

 

(When Obama wanted to provide the opportunity for a College Education to everyone that meant that he wanted to produce a glut of Bachelor's Degrees. With an increasing supply of Degrees the value of the Degree declines. If supply is restricted upon merit then the value of the Degree increases.)

 

Education is not a panacea. MOAR EDUMAKATION IS NOT A SOLUTION.

 

THERE ARE NO POLITICAL SOLUTIONS.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 03:23 | 4374223 cynicalskeptic
cynicalskeptic's picture

There is a Supply Shortage of productive employment in the United States currently. That is the reality.

THAT is the fundamental truth underlying all of the current problems.  We have seen a mindless pursuit of the cheapest possible labor costs by corporate employers - irregardles of the other effects on society.  'Free Trade' has meant wholesale offshoring of manufacturing jobs - followed by comp sci positions, call center customer support jobs and pretty much anything that can be relocated.  The west has seen factories moved overseas lock, stock and barrel.  Meanwhile you have cheap labor brought in legally via H1B visas or illegally to suppress wages for jobs that can't be relocated.  You have some VERY highly educated doctorate and post doctorates who are vastly underpaid in technical fields while minimal or unskilled jobs are filled with illegals.  Forty years ago I dod woerk (as oart of my engineering degree) in meatoacking plants.  At that point most were unionized, paying good wages and benefits - needed to reduce what had been high turnover levels.  Productivity was high and turnover low in what was really a crappy job - but salary and benefits offset the working conditions.  Ford's unintentional discovery that paying workers more actually created MORE consumers had proven correct.  Productivity increased and so did profits.   But that POV is viewed as naievely anachronistic today. The real irony is that the US is OVEREDUCATING many of its youth in fields that do nothing to increase their value in the job market.  High schools push college - even for those who are not really qualified.  Gone are the days of wood shop, metal shop and auto shop.  You have people  going in to trades by default now because their uncle owns a plumbing business instead of having people who would be good in these jobs.  Auto mechanics require more skill now than many college degrees - and require continuing education.  Yet basic accounting degrees - which guaranteed employment 40 years ago - now see much of their work fed to people in India.  All those people that naievely retrained as computer programmers after losing manufacturing jobs saw the existing jobs in that field evaporate as they were shipped overseas. The jobs that remain are often NOT 'productive' - they do not creae wealth or add value in any way shape or form.  Attorneys, bankers, and many more exist only to deal woith wealth already created by others - except that wealth is no longer being created.  The US does little mining, smelting and manufacturing these days.  Our focus is on CONSUMPTION - that is how our economy is measured these days - consumption, not PRODUCTION.   At least the robber barons created industry, and jobs along with the wealth they EARNED.  Today we have the ultra wealthy simply looting whatever they can from the wealth remaining in society. Unlike the 1930's when government paid the unemployed to WORK and add value to society in exchange for the payment they received - think of the CCC and WPA - now we pay people NOT to work and finance those payments with ever increasing debt. The US saw massive increases in productivity over the last 40 years but the increased profits gained through those increases were not shared with workers but went only to a very few at the top of the economic pyramid.  Consumption was funded not by expanded earnings but by debt. 99% of the US workforce ended up worse off 
Tue, 01/28/2014 - 10:56 | 4374975 Daisy Duke
Daisy Duke's picture

Wish I could give this more than 1 up arrow. Right on Cynical

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:13 | 4373290 akak
akak's picture

Oh great, even MORE socially-inept, socially withdrawn, navel-gazing, computer-obsessed disfunctional young people even MORE tethered to the e-leash. 

They'll virtually be part of the REAL world.

Yeah, that's what this society really needs.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:19 | 4373336 logicalman
logicalman's picture

Unfortunately, that is what today's society needs.

Somehow, society needs to change, so that values change.

Make learning fun and any kid will learn.

 

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:20 | 4373343 knukles
knukles's picture

Or really be part of a virtual society.
Or be virtually apart from society
Or...

Oh who gives a fuck anyhow?  There aren't enough jobs to go around so why even bother to pretend?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:24 | 4373367 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6AiM-dfe7M gonna ruin the country i'll tell ya'.

might wanna get some privacy settings on that there thing.
things might get out of control...

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:41 | 4373446 edotabin
edotabin's picture

We all have some type of an e-leash whether we like it or not.  For some it is ZH, for others porn, porn in one window and ZH in the other for others still. Seriously though, cell phones, tablets, debit cards, etc.  We are all online at all times.

Truth be told, if their minds had any structure all the info is there for all to see. It isn't as if the classes will be giving them anything we all don't have access to within a matter of seconds. Evidently, they are not doing that on their own. So, I'd prefer them taking classes to remaining entirely illiterate, lazy and completely unproductive.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:50 | 4373480 akak
akak's picture

 

Seriously though, cell phones, tablets, debit cards, etc.  We are all online at all times.

Speak for yourself. 

While that may be true for you (and I pity you if so), it is NOT true for me and many others.

I have:

No cell phone. 

No 'tablet'.

No debit cards.

Only a desktop computer, which I sometimes do not visit for days at a time.

Why and how does the e-addiction, so common and yet so socially destructive, remain so unrecognized?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:22 | 4373583 Hook Line and S...
Hook Line and Sphincter's picture

Hey Akak, it's been a hell of a long time since I logged on to ZH, but what a timely article this has been. Incidentally, I've in incognito developing the following online ShopClass for High School students who had their tradeskill classes replaced by 'Hermaphroditic Studies'.

Launched it today!

Also, going to have business classes like small bus management, money basic, etc. Any of the long timers here are welcome to contribute a class/course. 

The target is to partner with large building supply warehouses, unions, educational orgs, and contractors to host the physical testing component through N America.

Pass it along..  www.shopsquawk.com

"At ShopSquawk, you can learn the trades that will make you marketable, become prepared for the skilled craft apprentice system, or launch yourself into sustainable building entrepreneurship. Study online, and get hands on training in the vocational trades that are no longer available at your school, plus ones that were never offered… like applied green technologies. When a student becomes 18, they can transfer their contact information and course achievements to the employment resource center, frequented by organizations and companies who are looking for their skill set."

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 23:01 | 4373705 Andre
Andre's picture

gunsmithing

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 02:17 | 4374145 Hook Line and S...
Hook Line and Sphincter's picture

Duly noted. That actually would be a great class.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 01:53 | 4374103 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

Hook Line and Stinker! I graduated collage with twin degree, one in Phrenology and second in Afro Studies! I owe only 89K and need work! I come your house read cranial topography, then cut hair into Afro! Same day!

As always thanks you very much, Univercity of Poenix!

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 02:18 | 4374148 Hook Line and S...
Hook Line and Sphincter's picture

Are you part of that same Korean family in the OC that has the donuts and muffler repair shop?

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 10:48 | 4374930 edotabin
edotabin's picture

Hardass, highbrow and personalized comment. Not that I give a shit but it almost seems spiteful as opposed to insightful.

You choose to live the way you do and that's fine. I made a general comment  that most people are "connected" via cell phone tablet, laptop whatever....and, for better or for worse, they actually are.

I do not disagree about the e-addiction and its effect.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:28 | 4373468 JuliaS
JuliaS's picture

The biggest positive - less competition for the rest of us... unless we're talking about our own kids who are supposed to take over and carry the torch. Then it's no laughing matter.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 09:30 | 4374594 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

It will be some day Julia. The globalists seem hell bent on destroying middle class jobs. If an online HS saves money, people will push it..even if they got their degree from the local school system. Anything to save a buck.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:34 | 4373629 Bangin7GramRocks
Bangin7GramRocks's picture

But they will be good Christians right? Because that's really what we are talking about when we discuss home schooling. Nutty Christians who keep their kids from the heathen schools. Read that dumb book all day and mix in some writin' & rithmatican'!
'Merica! Fuck Yeah!

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 09:46 | 4374679 Woodhippie
Woodhippie's picture

You are way off base.  Home-schoolers are doing it because they want their children to have a real education.  It's about controlling curriculum. 

Not everyone that home-schools are religious.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:14 | 4373310 rtalcott
rtalcott's picture

If you wanted to learn some serious Physics check out Leonard Susskind's Lectures on Theoretical Physics on youtube...stunning stuff...this online stuff ain't all bad! 

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:16 | 4373317 RmcAZ
RmcAZ's picture

Online schooling does nothing except make it easier for .gov drones to be created of our kids, and makes them utterly useless in any real-world work scenario.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 10:55 | 4374961 edotabin
edotabin's picture

Perhaps, only the future can show this definitively.  As it stands, the traditional school system appears to be doing quote well in the .gov drone area though.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:15 | 4373319 Clowns on Acid
Clowns on Acid's picture

Bullshit article. Colas must be bored now that the Fed is dictating where the markets are headed. Hey Nick - discuss pirvavcy rights or somthin' that is useful to your clients.

Either that or go full retard and  start talking about the Fed / QE / and facism. That should get you that fat bonus this year...

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:24 | 4373366 Dewey Cheatum Howe
Dewey Cheatum Howe's picture

More education isn't the answer... More intelligence is needed. Public education is like eating junk food for the mind these days.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:33 | 4373402 logicalman
logicalman's picture

Intellignece is one slippery fucking concept.

Some of the most 'intelligent' people I've met were labelled 'handicapped' by the rest of society.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:39 | 4373427 Dewey Cheatum Howe
Dewey Cheatum Howe's picture

A diploma doesn't tell the whole story. Those old Iowa scale tests should be a requirement for businesses these days when hiring people. To many educated above their intelligence level dead weight blocking out more deserving candidates for jobs who can't game the H.R. system or don't have contacts in the first place to get their foot in the door.

To many credentials and not enough substance anymore with no way to screen the wheat from the chaffe.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:57 | 4373511 Accounting101
Accounting101's picture

Really??? Please document the research proving your thesis on public education. Nothing your radio has told you counts, nor anything from the bowls of your ass. Another dumbass.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:33 | 4373406 gwar5
gwar5's picture

All I can say is that it's about time for online education, the fastest, best way to disseminate information. 

 

2 million American homeschoolers would already be ranked as the highest acheivers in the world, by far, if they were counted as a single country and for 1/10th the cost of public education. Having online education available to augment this movement would be huge incentive for others to turn their backs on government failed schools.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:40 | 4373440 Dewey Cheatum Howe
Dewey Cheatum Howe's picture

Yes and no on that learning still really needs a degree of human interaction because a moron self teaching themselves still winds up being a moron with a credential at the end of the process without some guidance in most cases. If you are not able to self teach yourself in the first place online education is not going help.

 

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:01 | 4373508 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

Children are natural autodidacts. But Public Schools and parents kill that natural ability through total structuring and control.

 

If left alone and allowed to explore children, most children, would excel at self teaching. Of course it is the parent's job during the formative years, the first five years, to READ to their Children every day.

 

It is that most parents do not inately know this method is because, while they were growing up, that was not done to them.

 

As a parent you do not create an autodidact.

 

But, for the sake of your child, you do not stifle that ability either.

 

 

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 05:10 | 4374289 Socratic Dog
Socratic Dog's picture

Please explain why reading to them is better than, say, watching Tom and Jerry cartoons.  References appreciated.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:23 | 4373458 Accounting101
Accounting101's picture

Yes, but that disseminated information may be pure bullshit. We have the highest high school graduation rate this country has ever seen, yet the labor participation rate continues to fall. This is especially true for the 16-24 year old cohort.

More high school graduates is not the issue. A depressed economic situation is.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:45 | 4373435 22winmag
22winmag's picture

Online high school... complete with virtual drugs, virtual bullying, and virtual lolitas?

 

Listen, I'm all for anything that breaks the death grip that teachers unions, the NEA, and the Prussian style of schooling has on our nation's youth.

 

The aforementioned vampire squid of education is just as destructive and vicious as the financial vampire squid.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:42 | 4373442 ifishivote
ifishivote's picture

I'm for anything that takes down the Teachers Unions.. but but the kids. FU, I'm sick of my taxes going up. Kids taking Art and Music 5 times a week.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 21:55 | 4373498 Accounting101
Accounting101's picture

First of all, students do not go to Art and Music five times per week. You are just being a dumbass. Secondly, students probably should go to these classes five times per week. See, the educational research clearly shows that Art and Music have a profound impact on academic achievement.

Please submit the name of your place of employment. That way teachers will know where not to purchase their goods and services. You know, purchases made with your tax dollars. Fucking idiot!

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:05 | 4373537 ifishivote
ifishivote's picture

Do you want to place a bet that the kids in my middle school take art and music monday-friday?

 

You must be a teacher.. tough internet guy

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:21 | 4373588 Accounting101
Accounting101's picture

As electives to be sure, not typical and certainly not near the average educational experience. Art, Music and Gym classes are being cut dramatically all around this nation. Obviously your children made wise choices in picking their electives, and you should be glad they did.

No not tough, just knowledge based. I do not suffer fools gladly.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:30 | 4373452 JuliaS
JuliaS's picture

Pardon my french, but who gives a flying fuck about diplomas? Everything's about diplomas, certificates, accreditation, credits. It's all bullshit! I learned more useful skills online than in any of the school programs I attended. What I learned in school was communication - being able to deal with people I didn't like and couldn't avoid. That skill is invaluable, in my opinion. In real life you'll often get to do things you don't want to do and collaborate with individuals you dislike or outright hate.

Knowledge is only half the game. Social skills and diplomacy are important. Connections are important. Going through schools I made many friends. Some helped me get jobs. Others got job offers through my referral. Hasn't happened with any of my online-only acquaintances.

Still, to sum thing up - there was absolutely no reason for me to spend decades of my life simply learning to be social. I could've had a crash course and be done with it, leaving the rest to the internet (which unfortunately was nowhere as user friendly when I was staring out).

Nowdays I'm able to learn just about anything, short of doing surgeries, online, and I do exactly that. I've gained employment because of things I learned, such as electrical engineering, having no diploma, but instead a portfolio of design projects. Last time I was asked for credentials was in 2000. Since then it's been the: "Show me what you can do" question. Who cares what papers you have. Show us results!

I have a daughter and I hate the endoctrination camp she has to attend 5 times a week. I wish she spent more time learning on her own, but I can't afford to babysit her. I know she lacks discipline, and that is sadly the only thing school is likely to teach her well - how to do work she doesn't want to do.

I'm of the age where I know, I have to keep learning for my own benefit, and not because I'm told. My daughter would play games and watch cartoons all day if left to her own devices.

So, the school does teach a few things. Unfortunately it sacrifices everything else in the process. It raises drones incapable of surviving in the real wold. And me? I've got a job to pay all the bills, taxes and so on. I have little or no time to teach my kid what's right. I'm too tired by the time I get home.

If I had a second run at it, I'd choose to have no kids at all. If you can't make it right, then don't bother doing it.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:30 | 4373617 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

Did you read to her daily when she was an infant of 3 Months old? Did you read to her when she was an infant of 6 Months old?

 

I know that it is too late for that now. But you will have Grandchildren sooner or later. It will not be "too late" for them.

 

As a result of being read to daily as an infant I have a clarity of memory that is remarkable. I can remember events with clarity as far back as the age of Two. I was reading Children's Books at the age of Two. I was reading the Newspaper at the age of Four. (Then the bastards hid it from me because I would cry about the Vietnam War. But they let me read the Financial Pages..) I can remember as a direct result of being able, at the time, to VERBALIZE those memories.

 

I am not writing this to brag. Actually I was Brain Damaged at birth. They called it Cerebral Palsy. That did not affect my cognitive skills.

 

I am writing this so that you know how important it is to sit down with your babies and read to them. The results are remarkable when you do this. Furthermore do not use "Baby Talk" Use the widest variety of words possible. Use multisyllable words and do not fear that they will not understand you because, and with simple words, they will not understand you...AT FIRST.  But they will develop a command of the English Language and a Vocabulary that will exceed that of most whom they will encounter as adults.

 

All children, ALL OF THEM, initially are GENIUSES. They may be ignorant and inexperienced. But they have such a great ability to learn. Information is not that which makes a Genius. It is the speed at which information can be processed, stored and used by the Human Mind is the essence of Genius.

 

Your daughter still has one more opportunity of Neural Formation, Neural Development, if she is less than twelve. This is a much smaller window then the first five formative years and this window occurs between the ages of Twelve to Fourteen while she enters into Puberty.

 

That is an opportunity to impress information upon her. Do let that opportunity go to waste.

 

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:39 | 4373645 JuliaS
JuliaS's picture

I'm doing what I can. My daughter also has a developmental problem. It brings frustration and I end up doing what's worse instead of what is better for her... most of the time I'm tired and frustrated (can't even speak right when I'm like this). That's why I regret having a child in first place. I ended up being a bad parent. Not to late to set things right, but I am simply too worn out by the vicissitudes of life. I know what I should be doing, but I can't be everywhere at the same time. School and television end up raising my kid and time passes way too quickly.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 23:03 | 4373717 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

Get rid of the TeeVee Set, the Video Games and load up the house with books and encyclopedias. You will be amazed at the results. Trust me.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 23:07 | 4373731 bobert
bobert's picture

Julia:

If we were a decent soceity we would voucher you $6k per year to teach your child at home and as many other of the neighbor children you would chose to satisfy your personal budget.

The very best to you!

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 01:08 | 4374045 Free Wary
Free Wary's picture

Do you have two hours a day of free time? Then you can homeschool your daughter.

True story I know two parents who were not college educated themselves, and they dedicated about two hours a day to running their home school for their five kids. Each of their five kids started attending a major university at age 16 and graduated with a bachelors degree in four years. All five kids did this successfully. All five kids are well adjusted adults, many are raising their own families now.

If they can do it you can do it. Look it up, you will find a common pattern of two hours a day. We have spent about two hours a day home schooling our children and our pre-teenager tests in the 99th percentile on every standardized test he takes. You can do this.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:04 | 4373538 coastalwn
coastalwn's picture

how ya gonna hook up with the teacher if its online?

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:39 | 4373643 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

Poor Miss Franklin was fired after teaching in the Seventh Grade. Poor Miss Franklin was young and hot but with a desire for hot young men. Poor Miss Franklin.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 22:37 | 4373637 q99x2
q99x2's picture

Good the parents can teach them how to defeat the globalists during breaks.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 09:26 | 4374579 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

More likely that the blind will lead the blind.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 23:19 | 4373757 BuckShotJones
BuckShotJones's picture

Homeschooling and to a lesser extent online High Schools provides an avenue around the most effective institution the state has to control what people subscribe too. Since to control education is to control the future; it is obvious why we continue to witness efforts by the state to extend their control into the online High School curriculum and to curtail home schooling as much as possible.

Consider the Romeike family that was given asylum in the United States after they fled Germany because they homeschooled their children. As shocking as the “progressive” German state attitude is toward families; President Obama is now seeking to revoke the asylum protection granted to the Romeike family in the U.S; sending them back to Germany –where they will face certain incarceration and ward-of-the-state status for all their children. The left’s academic disdain is also evident. Robin West of Georgetown’s law school has written admiringly of the suppression of homeschooling and approves of regimes under which “parents who did so were criminals.” She writes that homeschoolers are dangerous precisely because of the fact that, far from being docile sheep, homeschoolers are as adults more likely to be engaged, which Professor West worries might “undermine, limit, or destroy state functions ….”.  The contradiction of an administration arguing for citizenship of all illegal aliens on one hand and with the other hand attempting to revoke a standing asylum ruling so a family can be deported is not lost on the observant.

As a father who has home schooled 5 children from kindergarten onward - 2 of my 5 are now into their 20s -  I agree that the online High School programs can be very good but one must research the school and its relationship with the state education system. If the school is accepting federal and state funding…that is a very strong indicator to look elsewhere. The important thing to remember is that the state can take your freedom and money away…but not a proper education. That is why they fear it so.

Mon, 01/27/2014 - 23:46 | 4373832 mercy
mercy's picture

The internet is the way to go but...

 

If you like your brick and mortar school

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 01:03 | 4374035 Free Wary
Free Wary's picture

A high school diploma means a person is qualified to sit in free classrooms for 12 years and do nothing.

 

A college degree means a person is qualified to run up large personal debts and sit in classrooms for another four years

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 01:09 | 4374042 Northern Lights
Northern Lights's picture

Elementary schools in my Downtown neighbourhood are a joke.  Most of the kids that attend are from singlemother households who receive government assistance and live in government housing located in the area.  I have a relative who has his son attending this school.  Smart kid. To smart.  He's too far ahead in the learning curve from the rest of the class and spends most of the time sitting in class bored and without challenge.  School in this area is little more than publicly paid for daycare so that "Shaniqua" can get some alone time and get her nails painted and her weave done.  It's so bad that my relative will ask his son's teacher if he can come in only 4 days a week during the winter so that he can take him up north for skiing Friday thru Sunday.  Teacher has no issues with it.  It's just one less kid to worry about for her. Besides, she recognizes that my relatives kid shouldn't even be in this school.

 

 

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 09:26 | 4374575 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

Did they ever think of not going skiing and putting money away to send this kid to a private school (boarding if necessary)?

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 01:24 | 4374065 nothing can go wrogn
nothing can go wrogn's picture

I got my law degree from Costco.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 07:10 | 4374367 laomei
laomei's picture

Of that number, 3.3 million would be employed – and would make about $10k more a year than they would have without a diploma, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics earnings data.

Sadly, this is a frequently passed around piece of fantasy.  It simply just doesn't work that way.  Someone's gotta be stuck doing the grunt work and that grunt work doesn't pay shit.  A high school diploma is already basically worthless.  An undergrad is also fairly worthless.  The only thing worth anything is experience, meaningful experience at that.   Online degrees? You might as well just photoshop a cert and be done with it, it'll be just about as useful in the real world.
Tue, 01/28/2014 - 08:23 | 4374431 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

We, Americans, are able to overcome the environment. The more learned Americans we are, the richer the world will be.
Infinitive growth, here we come.

Signed: an American.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 09:24 | 4374565 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

You're back!? How is your country's economy doing? What is with all these false rumors of collapsing debt bubbles?

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 09:00 | 4374511 Billy Sol Estes
Billy Sol Estes's picture

Ask me how I got into DeVry.

You walked in the door.

Tue, 01/28/2014 - 09:21 | 4374559 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

If I had to choose between an online HS graduate and one that went to school daily, I would pick the one who went to school daily. This sounds like one of those 'alternative education school types (where the fuckups go to get their GED). Before you know it HS will turn into a business and they will become diploma mills. This idea is shit.

Fri, 02/21/2014 - 20:21 | 4410031 Chief Wonder Bread
Chief Wonder Bread's picture

Not a panacea. Just part of the changing fabric. Education is not a commodity. People are not commodities, not "factors of production" (exclusively).

Fri, 02/07/2014 - 07:43 | 4411004 Melody7773
Melody7773's picture

Personally I have nothing against online education. I think that it is going to become primary method of getting a degree in time. Though I would have wanted for actual school to exist. I understand why people choose distant learning. It is all about time and money they think of. And you know, even home assignment can be prepared online. Like, you know those college papers on bullying in schools can be easily bought via Internet. We live in time where technology rules the world.

 

 

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