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"Fed Has Fingers & Thumbs On The Scales Of Finance," Grant Tells Santelli And It "Will End Badly"
In a mere 140 seconds, Jim Grant explains to an almost stunned into silence Rick Santelli how we all "live in a valuation hall of mirrors" as the Fed manipulates everything. Thanks to it's "fingers and thumbs on the scales of finance," Grant continues, the Fed "insists on saving us from 'everyday low prices'" - what they call deflation - and by doing so it manufactures "redundant credit" which "does mischief" in and out of markets. Grant, ominously concludes, "there is no suspense as to how [this will] end... [it will] end badly."
Must watch... (especially for EM asset managers)...
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“For Socrates, all virtues were forms of knowledge. To train someone to manage an account for Goldman Sachs is to educate him or her in a skill. To train them to debate stoic, existential, theological, and humanist ways of grappling with reality is to educate them in values and morals. A culture that does not grasp the vital interplay between morality and power, which mistakes management techniques for wisdom, which fails to understand that the measure of a civilization is its compassion, not its speed or ability to consume, condemns itself to death. Morality is the product of a civilization, but the elites know little of these traditions. They are products of a moral void. They lack clarity about themselves and their culture. They can fathom only their own personal troubles. They do not see their own bases or the causes of their own frustrations. They are blind to the gaping inadequacies in our economic, social, and political structure and do not grasp that these structures, which they have been taught to serve, must be radically modified or even abolished to stave off disaster. They have been rendered mute and ineffectual. “What we cannot speak about” Ludwig Wittgenstein warned “we must pass over in silence.”
Chris Hedges, Empire of Illusion: The End of Literacy and the Triumph of Spectacle
Socrates valued the laws of society over his own life. So much for morality. More telling is his student's teachings and that student's student's teachings:
1. Plato begets mysticism.
2. Aristotle begets reason.
Point is we have allowed our system to be managed by crony lunatics. We have it coming, simple. You won't see me crying in despair. Economics isn't nature, it's a corruptible system. In the end nature doesn't care about humanity. We are still self destructive organisms that have barely left the dark-ages. Testament to what is happening today. We bow out of reality, it will be just a vapor in time. No one will miss us.
I agree. It is not the Metaphysical versus Manmade but instead the Manmade is dependent upon the Metaphysical. However, where we may disagree is that I think that what is manmade can also be man-unmade.
Chump everyone on here worships carlin and you have 3 down arrows?
"We're goin away, pack your shit folks"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjmtSkl53h4
I know Fonz, I gets no respect. Maybe it's the 666 thing or something...
Anyways "pack your sh*t folks" Love it!
I have read your post 3x and I am baffled moar each time that it got the treatment it did. I guess some people can't handle a reality sandwich...and yet I thought this site was one big reality sandwich. Oh well....
I'm toying with the philosophical idea that maybe man is not of this reality/world. That we are kinda a mistake, not in a nihilistic way. That we have to now overcome our predicament. Fight nature. I guess I have respect for the ones who challenged the world and win. Finance and economists is not a victory and now Obama, who is a disgrace, who is no leader but a stooge.
I am not too sure what would take you down that road. Start with the facts and then go from there. If you start by contradicting the facts, then all your conclusions thereafter may be screwed. So, man is of reality; and therefore must act accordingly in consonance with reality. Or, as Francis Bacon put it, "Nature, to be commanded, must be obeyed." Right? But you are referring to those that apparently delude reality but succeed like the Fed or despots. Return to fact one; since man is of reality than he too can be commanded. The Fed, despots, know how to manipulate the herd (hint: See Julian Jaynes, The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind. All authoritarian societies are structured on this model; from the smallest unit of family, to classroom, a village, a state, a country, a civilization, even a website...)
Man made up the term "Nature". What we create is man-made, challenges our natural environment, so we can survive, shelter, medicine, technology, foods etc. You can obey nature, but like I said, it doesn't care about you whether you live or die. The death of humanity will occur from our own hands, within this natural environment. I remember two geologists debating with an environmentalist over the topic of "humanity is killing nature, earth etc" They eloquently argued, that WE cannot kill nature, but only ourselves. To the point that we as a species create that extinction, "nature" will always be here.
Now, the markets are not natural. Show me economics and finance in the natural world. Doesn't exist. Show me corruption, cronyism, greed. None exist in nature. If they did the natural system would implode. For the sake of our own survival, we need to reject our predicament. Rebel against the so called natural order, it's bullsh*t. We are not manipulated, that is the depressing aspect. Information is there about our dire self-destructive situation. No mystery. We are the cause and the solution. Obama is just a reflection of our collected stupidity. The FED exists to maintain that illusion. We buy it. Stocks all time highs, no correction, while everything is falling apart and people fight over a new pair of Nike shoes.
"I agree. It is not [Nature] versus Manmade but instead the Manmade is dependent upon [Nature]. However, where we may disagree is that I think that what is manmade can also be man-unmade."
Chump, we are at one. Now, what's up with that 666 stuff? Shall I rename as oc sure1776?
We may have made up the "term" nature, but whatever that term represents made us. We are, therefore and by definition, natural. And anything we do, to ourselves or the planet is also natural.
I've no doubt we'll end by our own hand. And nature, the planet, will continue without us. Whatever, scars mark our passing will fade and our memory perish. A fart in the wind. Sadly.
If we suffer from anything, it's an excess capacity for abstract thought.
Here we bemoan the lack of intelligence of our fellows. We call them sheeple. Others call them consumers. Or niggers, kikes, or jews. Welfare queens. Libertarians. But most of them are just people. Some smart. Some stupid. Some mean. Some devout. All just trying to get by. But all these labels separate us from each other. They are abstractions, and real people become phantoms in our minds. Something (not quite human) to be feared.
Sorry for rambling.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvGJvzwKqg0
excellent conversation.
thoughts to add to the stew: perhaps human beings are by nature rebellious creatures (e.g. the parable of the apple in the Garden of Eden). maybe this has something to do with the evolutionary development of the neocortex (the source of the "I"). all civilization since has reflected a struggle to come to grips with the "I" feeling itself as separate from the rest of its environment (the universe) and has expressed that struggle through its rebellious nature.
hence the word "dominion" to both counteract those rebellious tendencies in others and to reflect the mistaken understanding that the "I" is separate (and superior) to the environment in which it finds itself.
all civilization as we know it snowballs down from there. of course, as the snowball gets larger, the larger the chances that it hits a rock and explodes into pieces to melt back into water. regardless of the outcome, the rock still stands.
The blues don't care who got 'em,
Tears don't care where they fall....
I have to ask-Do you find one more preferable than the other, or is a changing proportion of both appropriate for over all well being of individuals and society?
Excellent Chump
Chump, managing implies conservation and growth. Goldman Sachs trains its employees to rape and pillage - hardly what one would call education, management or skill-teaching. Otherwise, I agree with you 100%. But you gotta call out the bad ones for what they are. ;)
Santelli only stunned how concisely Jim Grant is able to cut to the bone about the FED. Bravo!
Spidey senses say shiot is getting very close.
No more price discovery and spontaneous order for you proles, you get MYRA instead.
Interesting that just like in ancient Greek Theater, tragedy was often brought about by "hubris" and still today, men are the same, with their arrogance they destroy themselves....
Same story repeated and repeated for thousands of years..
That's 'cause humans are still assholes.
Yep; that pretty much sums it up. also they're about 1/4th. as smart as they think they are. Aside from that, I'm sure everything will be just fine.
Does Jim Grant have a toupee? Either way my admiration remains.
Somehow he always reminds me of Beaker from the Muppets.
No, but the next time you see him on CNBS he will, and a new name, the only way he'll get on that show again!
Grant's December 13th (or thereabouts) ass handing to Steve Liesman, I thought, was the smartest and yet simplest and absolutely spot on observation ever made about the FED on CNBC EVER: "The FED can change what things look like, but, the FED can never change what things are." Eventually the illusion will be seen for what it really is rather than what it looks like and then the FED's magic trick is over. Que Maria: "hey everybody good afternoon its 4 oclock on Wall Street, do you know...........ah fuck it."
"The FED can change what things look like, but, the FED can never change what things are."
If only it were posted on 10 billboards around every beltway of every major city and harrangued across the mainstream media outlet day in and day out.
+1 Great idea!! The clarity of that statement in 17 words - it explains it all dont it? At least it does for me.
Yes, sir. (its a spin on the old quip that you are entitled to your own opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts and also The Emporer's New Clothes.)
The whole world's gonna end up like the South Bronx, deepest Africa, the Sahara desert or rural Appalachia.
But then again, some people like Yurts, Yetis and Camels.
This is soooooooooooo fucked.
Hillbillary 2016 is Your Next president.
Imagine how she shall carry on the Obie Progressive Policies.
Fucking 16 years of this shit
16 years!
I don't think we'll last that long.
Agree. the prognosticators of gloom and doom who have been right in the past are once again long over due for the latest round of crack up boom.
ZH'ers = The Omega Men (and Women)
worse yet. Roger Stone suggests that Hillary won't run because of health and other reasons. Michelle will run. Think upon it.
Rush Limbaugh say's she will have to drop out, when her medical records show that she had a sex change years ago, to become a MAN
When the MSM finds out she's not a woman, then she can't be America's First WOMAN PREZ and its game-over.
I don't believe Rush Limbaugh, I think Hillary will find a doctor that call's her Camel Toe a Vagina.
HILLARY-2016 America's First Woman President and the World's First NAZI New World Order Bisexual.
Let partisan BS go buddy. This shit has been going downhill fast since Kennedy got whacked. Team Red shoulders equal responsibility. Nixon makes our bankruptcy official and takes the first steps in selling us out to China. Ronnie signs the Amnesty bill which gives CA to the leftists forever (and doomed my own area of SoCal, the San Gabriel Valley, to a Chinese invasion). Bush the Elder fast tracks NAFTA. Bush II, do I when need to say anything??? What's the difference who wins?
If after the next major stock market crash they pass a law to 'derisk' IRAs that eg 25% of your IRA must be held in gov bonds, that will bring in 4 trillion, and liquidations will be hit with a special liquidation tax.
Twenty-four years, man. You forgot about Chewbacca!!!
We live in a disgraceful WORLD OF DEBT!! Juse See Video Below -- MUST SEE:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=99xsqxzJnXs
most intelligent thing from being toasty around the edges is duck a fuck. snybody get that feeling like fuck it all? like i really need to check out of the roach hotel of thoughts?
Let it burn. The scum hidden in Regierungsbezirke of Columbia [Washington DC] will seek shelter. Mark my words
Jim Grant said in a few seconds what I spent considerably longer writing on the "Mendacity" thread, but at least I appear to be in good company.
Pain does confer priviledge at some point. Bring the Fed pain.....endure until the priviledges arrive.
Not a good time in the forecast.
Reading ZH for years
But this time I think it is different
Too many countries are involved. Pain for many mortals insofar as the economy is concerned and frustration rarely has patience.
It will happen by summer or before.
coming to us starting March 2014!
http://astrolos.blogspot.com/2013/10/21-april-2014-usa-meets-with-nemesi...
ragnarok three winters without summer battle between the fire giant and asgard woohoo good times the vikings rise from the grave to fight
mythology is great
@ Seal
thanks for the link. Will recall it for next three months to check it back in time... to see whether it's something or just nothing.
I don't think "summer" is coming this year, here. It is going to -23F tonight, and that does not feel like "summer" to me. Seriously, after this brutal, and I do mean BRUTAL winter, I expect a long, very hot, very dry summer. Beware, as what is happening in CA will probably spread eastward. If it does, all hell will break loose, as hungry and thirsty people are desperate people. It will not end well.
another "Year Without a Summer"?
wow, that would a global mindfuck, wouldn't it?
#moonlanding
Of course they'll fuck it up.
An honest economist is one who will tell you to your face that they don't know what the fuck they are doing.
I am sorry, I still don't understand how the Fed caused Justin B.'s DUi. Are they a boy band or something?
Someone tell me this is the system that all those men and women have fought and died for,the flag,the country,in countless wars.Yes,the hundred year charter is up.The Fed is a failure.We could have managed things better and cheaper without it.Interestingly,the Fed has pretty much plundered the FDIC with all the bank failures that have occurred.
SSI was also a depression era legacy which has been plundered many times when there was a surplus.Makes one wonder what Congress does all day....
there is no suspense as to how [this will] end... [it will] end badly."
Ya-think?..... Dah!!!
OT: wow. doing my quarterly browser reset gave me a glimpse into how many freakin ads you poor plebes have to suffer through even on ZH. from car ads to skinny pills, i almost feel pity for those of you who don't Tor or adblock.
It's commendable that you have the concern to supply mindless editorial on issues of such importance.
This is to "sunny". Think of the old Roadrunner vs. Wiley Coyote cartoons. Wiley would go off the "cliff" and be spinning his feet as fast as possible to avoid falling to the ground many, many feet/miles below. How long could he do that: as long as the cartoon masters wished him to do it. How long can this shit keep going?: as long as the "cartoon masters" keep spinning their feet. When they stop, it's a long, long way down. Keep on stacking, and carry a Kimber .45 cal in your waistband dude.
"Fed Has Fingers & Thumbs On The Scales Of Finance," Grant Tells Santelli And It "Will End Badly"
True? Yes.
News? Hardly. [Yawn]
“We waited and waited. All of us. Didn’t the shrink know that waiting was one of the things that drove people crazy? People waited all their lives. They waited to live, they waited to die. They waited in line to buy toilet paper. They waited in line for money. And if they didn’t have any money they waited in longer lines. You waited to go to sleep and then you waited to awaken. You waited to get married and you waited to get divorced. You waited for it to rain, you waited for it to stop. You waited to eat and then you waited to eat again. You waited in a shrink’s office with a bunch of psychos and you wondered if you were one.”
-Charles Bukowski
For a moment their, I didn't think Grant was going to get his mental engine started, but started it did !!!
God dammit Hulk it is "there" not "their"!!!
Jesus and I love you but you must get these two straight so we can communicate in Engrish!!!
Have Dr. Banner do the grammar check next time will 'ya?
Grammar Nazi out.
p.s. - "Thieir" as in "their car" or "heir to the familly fortune". "There" as in "over there" or "here are the Gold coins".
LOL, I k-new I made a mistake, but alas, I was too (got that correct) damn lazy to edit it...
I have stumbled as well, despite my own anal standards and admonitions to others.
Gave you a +1 for the comment regardless, now go smash the FED!
;-)
Haha I was cursed with an mother who taught English. But the funny thng is, even though I can easily pick up typos when other people write, I often miss them in my blurbs. Hence, I never correct other people.
You mean, like "an mother"---which is completely illiterate?
The plan is take out competing interest through emerging markets theme. The inside joke, Apple took out phone, video, camera, GPS. All US industrialized markets. Now they plan to release a watch (build in smartphone features) and a TV to grab private marketing information. Bye bye Apple
What I like about numbers is that when they are not jockeyed, jerked around, and falsified they tend to tell the truth. Looking down the road the numbers do not work. Allen H Meltzer is viewed by many economist as America’s foremost expert in monetary policy, Meltzer is the author of the three-volume “A History of the Federal Reserve.” For over 25 years he was the chair of the Shadow Open Market Committee, a group that meets regularly to discuss the policy of the Federal Reserve. “We’re in the biggest mess we’ve been in since the 1930s,” he recently stated. “We’ve never had a more problematic future.” From these statements we can assume Grant is not the only one thinking it will all end badly, more in the post below,
http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2013/07/it-will-all-end-badly.html
Trying to squeeze out the small payers to capitalize on ZIRP lending protocol will fail. The government dick licks will soon find people demand choices, not mandates.
Extremely late to the thread but I was playing pool and drinking beer, not necessarily in that order.
Grant: "...we all live in a valuation hall of mirrors..."
YES.
The polecats aren't guns for hire! We're not for sale!!!!!!!
I should not even tell you about this but I will but for the fact that you will not be able to get it done at cost. These 2000's Russian one kopeck coins are rare. There is no PM in them at all but that is not the point. I ordered a whole roll of them from that woman over there but I doubt I will ever see them. Woman said that this is sending money overseas and she could go to jail. What?LOL I would buy all 2000 series Russian 1 kopecks for base metal alone.(like the pre 82 US penny) The coin sucks if you ask me.
http://english.pravda.ru/business/finance/29-01-2013/123608-russian_kopeck-0/
yep. anyyyyyyyy day now.
How could ransacking the future to boost the present pose a problem? It's not like the present is going to become the fut.. uh oh.
OT: Canada has a spy agency???
A: Best ever 'til today!
http://video.cnbc.com/gallery/?video=3000241004#eyJ2aWQiOiIzMDAwMjQwMDAy...
http://www.thenational.ae/business/industry-insights/economics/libyan-we...
Gong xi fa cai zhers. I am full of jiaozi, jin jiu gai, abalone, roast suckling pig and a big old steamed grouper. Burp. Life is good. Tomorrow is another day. For now, I wish you health, happiness and prosperity in the New Year!
One can only hope. That is the true sum of value.
Grouper? Pervert.
OK arsehat.
Groupers are fish of any of a number of genera in the subfamily Epinephelus of the family Serranidae, in the orderPerciformes.
Delicious.
The primary sin was not the loss of heavy manufacturing in the 70's when they left for better distribution and lower wages. Wages are better balanced now internationally. Why haven't they come back? it's our Federal Government! Partnered with the legal industry we have Class Action! That's one. The second is hostility to heavy industry by our central government proven by a myriad set of regulations by our Federal Agencies. There should be discussion NOW! Without that we will become completely non-competitive internationally! Let's debate. hedgemastermb.blogspot.com
He sure got dat right! http://shutupnsing.wordpress.com/2014/01/31/of-kristallnacht-and-long-knives/
Whose dick is Jamie Dimon gonna suck when Yellen takes over the Fed?
"Whose dick is Jamie Dimon gonna suck when Yellen takes over the Fed?"
Yellen's?
Was that a trick question?
A very optimistic conclusion "there is no suspense as to how [this will] end... [it will] end badly." Nowadays it can actually be easily refered to any sphere of our life.
Jull from sterling store