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Market Cornered: JPMorgan Owns Over 60% Notional Of All Gold Derivatives

Tyler Durden's picture


Perhaps the only question we have after seeing the attached table, which shows that as of Q3, 2013 JPMorgan owned $65.4 billion, or just over 60% of the total notional ($108.2 billion) of all gold derivatives in the US, is whether the CFTC will pull the "our budget was too small" excuse to justify why it allowed Jamie Dimon to ignore any and all position limits and corner the gold market?


And purely as a reference point, the chart below compares the total value of gold held in JPM's vault (registered and eligible) as of Friday's closing price with its reported gold derivative notional holdings.


Finally, for the purists out there, we realize that gross is not net... until there is a breach in the derivative counterparty collateral chain, and gross becomes net.

Source: OCC, Comex


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Sat, 02/01/2014 - 21:10 | 4392352 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

counterparty is not a problem for tbtf

if it moves against them they will either aig it or bust the trades. jpm and the squid don't lose.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 21:12 | 4392363 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

They must be net short, as they are with silver, but by how much?

Not a lot of content here.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 21:17 | 4392372 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Are you so sure ?

They talked it down all last year, and are they acting for the PBOC ?

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 21:26 | 4392387 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

Not sure at all, and I think the whole concept of paper gold is a species of fraud, but position size doesn't tell us much of anything.  Four companies are on one side or the other of nearly all grain trades.  Are they trying to corner the grain market?  I think not. 

"Derivatives" is too broad a term to have meaning, and no, net does NOT become GROSS under market stress.

That's why god made options and spreads.  Where's the beef?

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 21:32 | 4392404 strannick
strannick's picture

But what about position limits? What about all Ted Butlers emails to the CFTC? How could Bart Chilton not have seen this? Was his hair in his eyes?

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 21:38 | 4392416 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

I asked about that on another thread a couple of weeks ago.

As a rule, position limits do not apply to market makers, or hedgers.  They really can't.  Commodities are a different animal than stocks.  If ADM or Cargill own a hundred ships full of grain, they are damn well entitled to hedge that on the market. 


Sat, 02/01/2014 - 21:41 | 4392426 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

The truth behind the banker "suicides" has been revealed:

The three Western bankers targeted for elimination by Obama regime “black team hit squads,” this report says, were Deutsche Bank executive Bill Broeksmit, 58, found dead at his home in Chelsea, south west London, on 26 January, JPMorgan Chase & Company vice president in technology operations Gabriel Magee, 39, who died after falling from his London headquarters on 28 January, and chief economist at Russell Investments, and former US Federal Reserve economist, Mike Dueker, 50, found dead at the side of a highway that leads to the Tacoma Narrows Bridge in Washington State on 31 January.

The “common link” between these bankers, this GRU report continues, began this past year after two JP Morgan whistleblowers confessed that their bank manipulates the gold and silver markets, which led to this past weeks stunning announcement that Europe's largest bank, Deutsche Bank, would withdraw from the appropriately named gold and silver price “fixing”, as European regulators investigate the manipulation of precious metals prices by Western banks.

Deutsche Bank executive Broeksmit, called among the “finest minds” in his field, and Russell Investments Dueker, ranked among the top 5 percent of economists by number of works published, this report says, were at the forefront of the European investigation into JPMorgan gold and silver price manipulation and had as their “inside man” JPMorgan tech guru Magee who oversaw his banks computer systems built for this crime.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:01 | 4392470 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

Let me get this straight.  You're saying the Obama administration is the anti-banking anti-gold-manipulation vigilante?

I just became a staunch Obama supporter.  But let me sober up before I totally make up my mind.


Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:18 | 4392528 Soul Glow
Soul Glow's picture

Obama does what he is told and JPM can short gold whenever they want.

- Ben Bernanke

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:43 | 4392615 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

"Concentration is the litmus test for manipulation." - Ted Butler

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:01 | 4392643 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

As a non-professional student in the study of gold, in many forms, and for decades, I believe that I am comfortable with the below six assertions:

1) Everyone should own as much physical gold (and some silver) as they are comfortable with.

2) There is little doubt that severe manipulation is going on, but there are many MANY conflicting theories/conspiracy theories out there.  I am not sure which, if any, hold the most water

3) The enormous "paper gold"/physical gold ratios likely mean that some sort of a big crunch will happen when enough wake up and want their physical.  Around that time, the owners of physical will not sell until the price becomes very high ("$55,000").

4) Gold has been a Store of Wealth for around 5000 years.  I contend that it still is and will be for as far into the future as I feel comfortable making said judgement.

5) Gold has acted as insurance against financial malpractice for a long time.

6) The lack of regulatory action sure does look suspicious...


Is JPM acting in some nefarious illegal fashion?  It looks like it, but who knows.  We may not know for a long time.

Gold is the best investment, particularly if more buy it.  That lessens the ownership concentration.  When FEWER people own the gold, it is worth LESS, overall.

Buy gold!



Wow, that was a fast junk.  Serial junkers should show some courage and display their reasoning.  Unless they're banksters or Obama voters...

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:02 | 4392676 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

Good post DCRB. For a moment I thought you were gonna go long bitcoin. Reality does not byte. ;)

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:11 | 4392691 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

BTC is an interesting game that may work out, or may not.  My Au holding are well over an order of magnitude of my BTC.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 00:14 | 4392831 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

DCRB and Skateboarder...


OT but you have to see this. Best skateboarder...

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 02:20 | 4393004 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

My day is made.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 07:45 | 4393154 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



How could Bart Chilton not have seen this? Was his hair in his eyes?


Look.....but don't touch the hair. Do you have any idea how much work goes into something like that?


Bart has a photo shoot for Teen Beat magazine in support of My Ra. He needs to look good.


Check the insert on how you can sign up your parents for Obamacare on and foil the identity hackers at the same time.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 11:16 | 4393325 BaBaBouy
BaBaBouy's picture

Ahhh, The Barbarous Relics JPM Et AL Make Surface Again ...

This Story Is Far From Over Bitchies.

Will "LONDON Bridge" Get More Ornaments???

Just Accumulate Physical AU And Watch It ALL Unfold With De Light...

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 14:47 | 4393723 FEDbuster
FEDbuster's picture

Physical gold and silver maintain their values to a certain point, I often times find myself contemplating a world past that point.  Beans, bullets then bullion.

Paper and digital gold will find the same fate as paper and digital currency. 

"If you can't stand in front of it and defend it with an AR-15, you don't own it".  Ann Barnhardt 2011

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 14:31 | 4393702 MayIMommaDogFac...
MayIMommaDogFace2theBananaPatch's picture

That cat can skate, yo!

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 00:17 | 4392845 Atomizer
Atomizer's picture

Nice job.\repeat post..


  • Bankers saved, currency take nosedive. Good for gold
  • USD Currency saved, (4) major banks go under. Bad for gold.

Derivative exposure with banks is 4 times the amount of GDP. ;)


Sun, 02/02/2014 - 01:37 | 4392966 fockewulf190
fockewulf190's picture

Dollar is destroyed...derivative timebomb blows and takes the entire fiscal system with it...good for gold.

Banks blow up (4x Lehman warhead)...derivative timebomb blows and takes the entire fiscal system with it...good for gold.

Either way, humanity gets an unhealthy dose of SHTF as the Great Reset commences to wreck havoc.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 06:50 | 4393078 Drifter
Drifter's picture

No "SHTF" and no "great reset".  Stop hoping for it. 

Gold derivatives are casino bets that can be paid off in dollars, and JPM has unlimited cash from the Fed to pay off any losing bet.

Dollar collapse won't be a "SHTF" moment either.   Dollar index won't show any collapse because all curriences in the index are manipulated to collapse together.

The only collapse will be in purchasing power, which isn't shown in the index. 


Sun, 02/02/2014 - 07:00 | 4393142 fockewulf190
fockewulf190's picture

I´m not talking about just gold derivatives, I´m talking about the entire $1 quadrillion+ derivatives market that is one black swan away from blowing up. When it goes (and four TBTF banks collapsing is easily a black enough swan to trigger such an event), it will take everything with it.  Lehman almost did it in 2008, and it was only stopped because of the monsterous amounts of fiat that were, and are, being printed out of thin air...but now the Fed´s ammo supply is almost gone.

I am not hoping for a collapse, because when it happens, it is going to be the death sentence for untold milllions of people.  I am only trying to prep and stack, and hope it will be enough to get through the Great Reset without ending up as another statistic.  I seriously doubt that the Fed is going to be able to maintain any type of control of this global fiscal system much longer, especially if the dollars they continue to print become worthless, and all international  trust in the dollar is lost

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 10:35 | 4393273 quikwit
quikwit's picture

"but now the Fed´s ammo supply is almost gone."

Could you explain why this is true?  Not a financial expert here.  My rudimentary understanding is: As long as the Fed can manage the bond market (so that US govt. has the credit it needs) and velocity of money supplied, or fudge the inflation numbers, they can print for a loooong time, right?

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 11:18 | 4393336 N2OJoe
N2OJoe's picture

Sheep exist to be sheared and slaughtered by their masters... as do sheeple. Do not feel sorry for them.

At least the 4 legged sheep didnt vote for their own shearing.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 18:45 | 4394280 Liberty2012
Liberty2012's picture

The value of work is a definite thing. It does not derive its value from what it is traded for. As long as people continue to trade their work, things will be relatively well, regardless of the payment system in use at the moment.

Things only have value because people working created that value. Numbers only have value to the extent they represent reality.

People first, things second, numbers third.

No one starves - unless we let thugs take over.

We the People create the world we live in with every choice we make.

Truth => Individual => Choice / Responisibility => Freedom

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:05 | 4392680 Soul Glow
Soul Glow's picture

Buy silver!

Ha, haven't written that in awhile.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:12 | 4392697 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Silver and platinum are both good.  For big money looking to play it safe, I would put the bulk into Au.

But, by all means buy silver if that's what you like.  Any PMs out of the hands of the banksters and in the hands of people who know value is all good.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:20 | 4392715 Soul Glow
Soul Glow's picture

PM is the only long term investment to make right now.  Buy a house and land if you can nail your deed to a banker's forehead.  Buy stocks if you think corporations are going to inherit the economy.  Buy bonds if you think the governments and municipalities will stay solvent.  But buy gold if you want to handle your own money.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 04:18 | 4393080 TheGoldMyth
TheGoldMyth's picture

If you are looking at taking gold out of the hands of the central banks who own 99% of the gold for the first time in history, only a people owned central bank that can print its own money might make a very small dint in the incredible ownership of gold purchased through endless money printing by the private central banks.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 12:21 | 4393431 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Um, no.  Some 53% of the world's gold is held as jewelry, just 18% or so by the central banks.  Please either get your facts right, or cite your sources.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 13:50 | 4393625 Payable on Death
Payable on Death's picture

While not agreeing with the criticism, I do wonder about a related point: Gold seems to be easily manipulated because it is a small market. These stats emphasize the point. Jewlery is not really a financial hedge as most who own it have very small quantities of low purity. Thus, the CBs own 38% of the remainder, which seems enough to dominate. CBs own more than half of "investment" stocks...

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 01:08 | 4392923 mt paul
mt paul's picture

6) The lack of regulatory action sure does look suspicious...


something to think about..

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 03:19 | 4393054 oooBooo
oooBooo's picture

You are correct that gold is best when more people own some. Gold based currency serves the rulers and bankers well when the gold is in few hands. That's why some reccomend silver based currency, it's in more hands. 

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 03:36 | 4393056 TheGoldMyth
TheGoldMyth's picture

DoChenRollingBearing, have you studied the fact that the central banks have become the "gold buyer of last resort"?

It is like real estate. When there are too many sellers during periods of austerity, those who default have to sell their assets and the banks lock the house and take it out of circulation to create an artificial scarcity. It is the same with gold. If the central banks do not buy thousands of tons to take it out of circulation completely then a massive gold crash/gold derivative crash.

Without the gold buyer of last resort, the price of gold would have crashed in a magnificent fashion ages ago. The Central banks have to work very hard to make sure the price remains high when people are selling their gold teeth to cover debt obligations.

In short there is no blood on the streets when for the first time in history the 1% own 99% of the gold and are working hard to prevent cheap gold on the streets.

Imagine what would happen to gold if there was no gold buyer of last resort. Or QE-Gold. ??

I advised my son to get out of gold at 1600 a couple of years ago from memory when i first caught onto this scam. That is why the central banks are buying thousands of tons of gold.

The margin calls on gold derivatives are another rant.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 05:06 | 4393100 bunnyswanson
bunnyswanson's picture

Don't be so sure all will end as planned.  There is more to it that.  The 1% have done nothing to earn what they now own.  NOTHING.  In fact, they've taken the ~low road~ at every intersection.  It doesn't settle right in this world knowing these pieces of shit have all the gold.  This isn't over yet.  Sleep with one eye open and don't give any more advice.  This house of cards stand that has been erected by the 3rd generation scoundrels who murdered their way to the top are not fit to run a popsicle stand.

I don't shop often but when I do, I refuse to buy Israeli-made products.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 10:58 | 4393303 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

You're boycotting matzo balls?

Why didn't I think of that?

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 12:46 | 4393490 chemystical
chemystical's picture

"I don't shop often but when I do, I refuse to buy Israeli-made products."

Since July 2011 it's been illegal in ISR to call for a boycott of ISR products & services (most particularly those from illegal West Bank settlements - the primary object of the legislation).

In the USA it is illegal to directly or indirectly boycott ISR goods & services (see: the Export Administration Act, the Ribicoff Amendment and its succedents), and in fact it is illegal for you to even ask whether some item of commerce is from ISR, and furthermore if the vendor fails to report you to the government (via reports to the Commerce Dept) then it too has committed a federal offense.  That applies to individuals and to businesses and to foreign subsidiaries of US businesses.

"the criminal penalties for each "willful" violation can be a fine of up to $50,000 and imprisonment for up to ten years."

* Abraham Ribicoff (Likud-West)


Sun, 02/02/2014 - 14:46 | 4393720 Beatscape
Beatscape's picture

If I could, I would boycott Palestinian products, but they don't make any.  Their contribution to the world was the suicide bomber. 

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 08:57 | 4393201 Al Gorerhythm
Al Gorerhythm's picture

Damn! The mind boggles.

Superlatives escape me.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 11:56 | 4393393 HungryPorkChop
HungryPorkChop's picture

@TheGoldMyth:  I freakin' knew it...  Those central bankers not only drove up the price of gold, since they were the buyer of last resort, but also did the same thing to oil, aluminum, copper, wheat, corn, oats and even cereal.   My gas and cereal have gone up exponentially during the past decade.

Could you do us all a favor and kindly ask them to quit buying up all the oil and cereal?  I'd really like for those prices to crash as well. 

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 23:32 | 4394783 TheGoldMyth
TheGoldMyth's picture

Thanks HungryPorkChop
In my capacity as a amateur self taught economic climate psychiatrist, i will ponder you question and hopefully provide an answer in the near future.

So far i have been working on your problem and this seems to address your need.

"You Can Buy A House For One Dollar Or Less In Economically Depressed Cities All Over America"


Sun, 02/02/2014 - 05:02 | 4393095 mumbo_jumbo
mumbo_jumbo's picture

The enormous "paper gold"/physical gold ratios likely mean that some sort of a big crunch will happen when enough wake up and want their physical.


sorry that makes me laugh.....has that ever actually happened?

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 05:33 | 4393108 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

dude, no - but for the very salient reason that they never rehypothecated gold to a 112:1 ratio before

thats why its never actually happened

or rather - it has happenned before in a way, in history when failing empires increasingly  diluted their gold coins with cheaper metals

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 06:23 | 4393124 eclectic syncretist
eclectic syncretist's picture

There will come a time when those who bought and paid for gold will call for physical delivery, but will be told that they will not be getting any actual gold, and will get a surrogate or nothing instead.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 12:50 | 4393498 chemystical
chemystical's picture

..or in the instance of countries seeking to repatriate their gold, they will be told that it will take decades and that the first installment will be only 5% of their expatriate holdings.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 05:59 | 4393116 TheGoldMyth
TheGoldMyth's picture

DoChenRollingBearing: you postulate: "When FEWER people own the gold, it is worth LESS, overall."

So now i can wait patiently for DCRB's/ZH's of any ilk  analysis of 'what happens when the central banks make up 99% (Figuratively speaking) of the demand ?', approximately. I call them, the central banks, "gold buyers of last resort".

If you can adress this question, it wil be the first time on ZH the matter has been taken up that i know of. I followed ZH for years before joining and think i might know a thing or two by now in a hobyist capacity. I joined just to find someone here with the intestinal fortitude to reason an answer to this very scenario we all face.

Maybe gold marketing has fossilised opinion so it cannot be questioned?

I am sure the JPM question will look after itself efficiently after this in my case

Thanks in advance..

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 11:02 | 4393306 funthea
funthea's picture

@ GoldMyth, I think you confuse the aggregate demand of paper gold for that of the actual physical, that you contend is being bought by the CB's to save the market (as a buyer of last resort). For one who professes to be an astute follower of the market and avid reader of ZH, I am perplexed that you have settled on this conclusion, as it shows a rather lack of understanding of the market and how the disconnect between paper and physical distorts the market. This price discovery method works only to the extent it allows for certain entities to manipulate the market in the direction of their choosing. One only needs to reconcile the existence of motive to complete the circle... for that we look to the FED, and motive be a plenty.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 23:08 | 4394709 TheGoldMyth
TheGoldMyth's picture

funthea.....Thankjs!!...Another way of putting it is to compare the 1% who are not born into debt slavery and avoid it using QE, derivatives/etc with the 99% who are debt slaves in most cases before they are born.

These are the 1% or less who are the gold buyers of last resort. Generally, this species/class can print money or leverage assets. The problem for the 1% are margin calls, and maintaining scarcity of their chosen asset, gold, houses, or any other asset away from the 99%.

This 1% class have mastered and fine tuned the art, discovered quite by accident, of turning gold into lead. Or any other hard asset into lead.

In my opinion as a hobbyist economic climate psychiatrist.


Sun, 02/02/2014 - 11:09 | 4393316 GoldenTool
GoldenTool's picture

Trade wars, then real wars of course.  Nobody else wants gold which is why Germany has theirs and India dropped most of their import barriers and taxes on pms.  Libya, IMHO, is a very interesting case study on modern day pirating and how it never pays to advertise your holdings or run counter to the patch as you will be corzined.  This will go on for a very long time and most people don't have a clue even who the real players are.

"saltus in demonstrando"

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 11:26 | 4393344 Bendromeda Strain
Bendromeda Strain's picture

which is why Germany has theirs

Is it 2020 already?

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 12:29 | 4393446 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture


I addressed your comment about the central banks owning 99% of the gold above, they do not, they only own some 18%, see link.


Re your present question, the CBs will NOT be the 99% of any demand.  You need to understand that there are many, many of us out here who want and do buy gold.  When there are economic problems, many of us will buy MORE.  I will.

The only central bank that is a buyer of last resort that I know of is The Central Bank of DoChenRollingBearing.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 12:49 | 4393496 i_call_you_my_base
i_call_you_my_base's picture

I was thinking the same about that post. If you think CBs own 99% of the gold you are operating with very bad information. It's hard to take any of that argument seriously when its core precept is so clearly flawed. I'm not sure where you could find such hogwash other than simply making it up.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 22:41 | 4394550 TheGoldMyth
TheGoldMyth's picture

Thanks for the reply "Central Bank of DoChenRollingBearing."

I am speaking figuratively when i use these numbers. And have said so often enough in my other comments here on this very interesting question.

In my opinion, This is why the central banks/government in China have asked for help from the 99% of the population there. Buying physical gold is hard work, even if you can print as much money as you like (Figuratively speaking.)

By taking gold out of circulation, this increases scarcity.

Here is what happens when there is no scarcity. (Even if it just a regional phenomena.)

"You Can Buy A House For One Dollar Or Less In Economically Depressed Cities All Over America"

You yourself, are a  central bank as you admit, and  are asking for help here at ZH to make gold scarcer by taking gold out of circulation. Just like the 1% who do this every day. It is hard work.



Sun, 02/02/2014 - 10:16 | 4393256 g speed
g speed's picture

At DCRB ---my contention is that the fewer that want gold the less value it has--(as opposed to the fewer that own it) A small but quite significant difference --- just saying--

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 11:08 | 4393320 funthea
funthea's picture

The difference between "Want" and "Have" becomes increasingly poinent when in times of crisis, like when the FED devalues the currency.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 12:30 | 4393452 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

@ my buddy g speed!

I worded poorly my remark.  My point is that the more gold is spread around, the more likely it will be worth more.

And I think that if the chips are down, more people will want gold.  I hope I explained my view better.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 22:35 | 4394613 TheGoldMyth
TheGoldMyth's picture


In this quote of yours previously, is magnificiicent, and, i know you are just making a joke, but it is brilliant because it explains the dillema of central banks ending up with 99% of the gold (Figuatively speaking.) that they cannot sell back to the public who have become debt slaves (The 99%) recently, or at some point in time.

"The only central bank that is a buyer of last resort that I know of is The Central Bank of DoChenRollingBearing."

In the case of the article i linked in my previous reply to you,

"You Can Buy A House For One Dollar Or Less In Economically Depressed Cities All Over America"


This is what happens to houses when the 1% own 99% of the real estate via money printing. This is why i postulate the central banks have perfected, and fine tuned the method of turning everything including gold into Lead.

The psychology of PM's enthusiast is to be like a central bank, or in some way to get others to immitate what the central banks are doing. "OHHH, look!!, the central banks are doing!! If i do what they are doing, then i too can be amongst the 1% who own gold. Maybe i too can learn how to leverage my physcial asset like JPM??

If you are sucessful and can imitate the central banks (JPM) and leverage the physical gold you have, then you also need to be on the lookout for physical gold on the streets and very quickly take it out of circulation to preserve the scarcity of your own gold. If you do not buy up excess gold in circulation, you might get a margin call when the gold you leverage loses value, like the houses that only cost 1 dollar.

Using your power of printing money, you can achieve that, but it is hard work and you constantly need to be on the lookout. That is why governments who are owned by central banks need to ask for help amongst the 99% like the government in China asking its 99% to buy gold.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 10:26 | 4393267 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

"Is JPM acting in some nefarious illegal fashion?"

it's like breathing

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 10:31 | 4393269 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

Gordon_Gekko would be proud. Good post.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 12:34 | 4393460 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture


Sun, 02/02/2014 - 10:43 | 4393286 Chupacabra-322
Chupacabra-322's picture

I have one name for you all.

Andrew McGuire.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 11:27 | 4393346 Bendromeda Strain
Bendromeda Strain's picture

To the serial junker above - I have some "junk" for you...

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 11:51 | 4393384 _ConanTheLibert...
_ConanTheLibertarian_'s picture

$55K ? Care to elaborate?

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 12:36 | 4393469 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture  

I would read the article that is up there right now, and then go back to his work starting in late 2009.  FOFOA is long and difficult reading, but he is the best gold observer out there, IMO.

There are many "paper" claims on each ounce of gold.  The day will come when people will want their physical that they "think" they own, but it will not be there.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 14:01 | 4393643 OutLookingIn
OutLookingIn's picture


Keep your eye on the ratio.

JPM; Physical to Notional = 65:1

Put another way? 65 paper gold ounce chits, for each ounce of physical.   

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 04:42 | 4393090 TheGoldMyth
TheGoldMyth's picture

very informative:

"You can’t print gold — but you can buy it, and take it out of the marketplace."

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:19 | 4392537 holdbuysell
holdbuysell's picture

That's not what the article is saying...check out the link provided in the thread start. Here's the punchline:

"Critical to note, GRU economic analysts say in this report, is that if the price of gold and silver were to achieve their “honest” level, JPMorgan would collapse as it does not have the reserves needed to equal the “paper” gold it has already sold, and a JPMorgan collapse would then, in turn, implode the entire global economic system."

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:04 | 4392670 nope-1004
nope-1004's picture

Kid dynamite is a cubicle working banker, probably for JPM.  The gay-wad has infected almost all the blogs with his insane comedy, now trying to start a "crash JPM, sell your gold" campaign in an attempt to get as much of your physical as they can.

You are either him, working with him, complicit in the fraud, or a total idiot posting shit like this.  Stop posting links to one of the most intentionally misleading bloggers on the net, Kid Dynamite.


Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:08 | 4392687 Soul Glow
Soul Glow's picture

JPM may have $65m worth of a position, but the majority of their position is likely short gold, and a vast majority.  So "Crash JPM, sell gold"would likely not work.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:24 | 4392727 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

what total garbage kid dynamite is spewing. 'sell gold to crash jp morgan' he recons?

selling gold strengthens jp morgan

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:44 | 4392770 holdbuysell
holdbuysell's picture

Nope. No affiliation.

I read that quote from the link as a 'buy gold, crash JPM' point. WTF am I missing?

I'm already skeptical of the link's info, but would like to hear the board's thanks for stepping up.


Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:48 | 4392783 holdbuysell
holdbuysell's picture

Whoah, big time apology are correct that the link ties to selling, though I interpreted the text as opposite the intention. Never pushed through that link.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 02:09 | 4392997 lasvegaspersona
lasvegaspersona's picture


Kid D is being sarcastic. I read his piece and it was mocking the 'Break JPM' effort of 2011. I think he is a good writer.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 13:28 | 4393083 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

No, he's a douchebag and Wall St bankster ball licker who was ridden off of ZH a few years ago.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:23 | 4392723 ArkansasAngie
ArkansasAngie's picture

I've got my fingers crossed that JPM crashes and takes Jamie with it.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 15:29 | 4393830 spine001
spine001's picture

If you think that you haven't seen "Wolf of Wall Street" yet. Jamie has HIS own money in hard assets not paper garbage.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:30 | 4392745 andrewp111
andrewp111's picture

Collapse?? JPM routinely pays $20B fines to the Obama Regime. They can certainly afford to lose $65B if the entire gold market went against them. It would take a loss of trillions to take down  something as big as JPM. Only massive loan losses or a massive move against them in interest rate derivatives could do that.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 00:30 | 4392872 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

how about both, 2014 to 2016?

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:24 | 4392550 BoNeSxxx
BoNeSxxx's picture

The House Always Wins.

Jamie is a lot smarter and a lot richer than you. Remember that.


Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:45 | 4392623 Goldilocks
Goldilocks's picture

"Thou shalt not steal."

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 00:51 | 4392698 BoNeSxxx
BoNeSxxx's picture

What's up with the Hedge tonight Goldi?  Serial Junker(s) out in force, noobs who don't recognize a /sarc tag, and Sorcha Faal articles collecting greenies like a three-tittied stripper.

Feels like the Twilight Zone.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 01:13 | 4392924 bunnyswanson
bunnyswanson's picture

House always wins because they beat the odds.  Win a few hands in LV and find yourself being invited back over and over again as a smart gamblers who aren't there for the adrenaline rush.


Jamie Dimon is a scoundrel and a thief.  His network has given him the ability to be where he is.  Shark loan business is what he runs and it is right next door to the Pawn Shop, drug dealers and addicts.  Sleaze rarely rises to the top but in this environment, where shell games and fine print designed to destroy not only entire families but entire nations.  Three card monte - Jamie Dimons approach to banking.


Is there anyone beside you?  If there is, tell them to slap you once, very hard, across the face, for the Gipper (in this case, America as she lies dying).



This originated in American football. Knute Rockne was the coach of the US Notre Dame team in the 1920s and George Gipp was his star player. The story goes that Gipp fell ill and when dying he asked Rockne to promise that, when things were going badly for the team, he should inspire them by asking them to 'win one for The Gipper'.

Ronald Reagan played the part of Gipp in the 1940 film Knute Rockne: All American. The screenplay has the line:

And the last thing he said to me, "Rock," he said, "sometime when the team is up against it and the breaks are beating the boys, tell them to go out there with all they've got and win just one for the Gipper.

Reagan was given the nickname Gipper, which lasted throughout his life. Reagan later used the quotation when seeking election as US president."

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 01:27 | 4392947 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

He's a lot richer than me; but he's a lot dumber too.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 00:17 | 4392838 Obama_4_Dictator
Obama_4_Dictator's picture

Um, the post said Obama killed them, they were whistle blowers (a good thing).  Not sure where you got that anti-banking anti gold mani from....

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:02 | 4392476 lincolnsteffens
lincolnsteffens's picture

Anybody have comments on stories by Sorcha Faal???


Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:39 | 4392588 Rockatanski
Rockatanski's picture

sorcha faal = sucha fail

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:38 | 4392601 fockewulf190
fockewulf190's picture

That guy has one link after the next in that story...except for a link to the alledged GRU report he is "reporting" about. 

Here is Sorcha in action.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:01 | 4392627 BoNeSxxx
BoNeSxxx's picture

Yes.  They are all unmitigated bullshit.  Ignore them.

Here is just a taste of some reality for the hard of thinking.  Internet Hoax 'Queen' doesn't deserve any of your time or attention...


Sun, 02/02/2014 - 10:49 | 4393292 toothpicker
toothpicker's picture

The Black Eagle fund & Project Hammer are interesting things to read up on thou

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:09 | 4392499 Crawdaddy
Crawdaddy's picture

The weak link on this group is the IT guy. Anyone in finance IT can tell you the VPs are mostly bureaucrats who have no idea what actually goes on inside their area of responsibility. Now if a couple of senior Email admins, DBAs, Network admins, Sysadmins and InfoSec guys come up suicided, now we have a relationship that has teeth. With IT being included in the suicide party, as a measure of relationships to a conspiracy, at least pick people who are actually likely aware of the problems..

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:13 | 4392515 holdbuysell
holdbuysell's picture

Taken at face value, seems to me this might be a more important data set (if true) from the link:

"A grim report circulating in the Kremlin today prepared the by the Main Intelligence Directorate (GRU) of the Ministry of Defense is warning that the assassinations this past week of three top Western bankers coincide with Snowden Documents detailing a 15 February 2014 “catastrophe” being engineered by the Obama regime in order to establish some type of “new world economic order” prior to the coming global meltdown of markets and massive bank failures, some of which have already begun.

Edward Snowden is a computer specialist and former Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) agent who with his yet unidentified US military backers obtained nearly two million highly classified top-secret documents from the United States Department of Defense (DOD) run National Security Agency-Central Security Service (NSA/CSS) and was granted temporary asylum in Russia in 2013 after his designation by the Obama regime as the “most wanted man on earth.”"

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 01:21 | 4392936 greased up deaf guy
greased up deaf guy's picture

on a saturday? not sure if it would get the bang for the buck our dear leader or his handlers are looking for, but i'm game regardless. bring it!

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:59 | 4392658 AllWorkedUp
AllWorkedUp's picture

Interesting stuff, definitely worth an up vote. Wouldn't surprise me if this conspiracy turned out to have some facts mixed in.

Super Bowl falls within the Feb 15th window no?

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 03:56 | 4393072 resurger
resurger's picture


Sun, 02/02/2014 - 06:19 | 4393122 trader1
trader1's picture

anyone know what kind of weed those bloggers are smoking?

must be a high THC low CBD strain...

the paranoia levels are comical ;-)

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 08:56 | 4393198 aleph0
aleph0's picture

@"Sorcha Faal" link


"Sister Maria Theresa is the 73rd Sorcha Faal of the Sorcha Faal Order, Elected as Mother Superior 3 February 2007."


... & the plot thickens ....


What a Crazy Internet  world .. or Matrix.


Sun, 02/02/2014 - 09:45 | 4393228 Gordon Freeman
Gordon Freeman's picture

It's on the internet, so it must be true...

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 10:18 | 4393260 roadhazard
roadhazard's picture

Did you hear the one about the little winger that cried, "black man" over and over and over.


Sun, 02/02/2014 - 11:42 | 4393369 HamFistedIdiot
HamFistedIdiot's picture

Extraordinary truth sites. Thank you very much for the link.

Wed, 02/05/2014 - 16:23 | 4405199 papaclop
papaclop's picture

Wow! I knew JPM were the scum of the earth and among the world's biggest crooks, but murder represents a new low for even that scum.
(My apologies to legitimate scum everywhere.)

Wed, 02/05/2014 - 16:23 | 4405200 papaclop
papaclop's picture

Wow! I knew JPM were the scum of the earth and among the world's biggest crooks, but murder represents a new low for even that scum.
(My apologies to legitimate scum everywhere.)

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:30 | 4392564 strannick
strannick's picture

You can't see the diff between Carghill hedging their grain market, and JPM manipulating the silver market. What is essential about silver for JPM? If you say "their customers", we'll assume you are  Blythe Masters.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:31 | 4392571 SRSrocco
SRSrocco's picture

He who controls the New York Fed & JP Morgan control gold and silver.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:15 | 4392705 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

This is the first I have seen of "The Pilgrim Society".  It's going to need a lot more work and research to demonstrate any proof...

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:41 | 4392761 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

i dont care if its the pilgrims, the bilderbergers, the illuminati or the cult of cthulhu - they are all participants in the decades-long cycle of orchestrated see-sawing between paper and precious metals. 

if you had lock solid evidence of pilgrim society suppressing gold prices, so what?  they will switch direction when they are positioned correctly - unless other circles of TPTB flip the switch before they are ready

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 21:36 | 4392423 AlaricBalth
AlaricBalth's picture

"Here at JP Morgan, our fortress balance sheet is as good as gold. "

New JPM commercial slogan featuring Jamie Dimon and his presidential cuff links.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:22 | 4392544 Soul Glow
Soul Glow's picture

"Here at JP Morgan, our fortress balance sheet is as good as paper gold."

FIxed it for you.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:39 | 4392603 U4 eee aaa
U4 eee aaa's picture

...but the walls are paper thin

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 21:59 | 4392468 Stuck on Zero
Stuck on Zero's picture

Does this massive position explain why gold seems to be range bound?


Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:27 | 4392553 lasvegaspersona
lasvegaspersona's picture

Gold is range bound for now.

If it goes up it will be part of a commoditiy bull market which will be inflationary...and kill the dollar.

If it goes down it will deplete all the remaining physical as third wolrd folks will buy it 'on sale'. This will kill the dollar as an end to the gold derivative market will start a derivative crash.

It will probably remain range bound until it is revalued by the BIS or until GLD closes when all of its remaining inventory is scarfed up and the gold derivative market crashes which will start a derivative crash.

So for now it lingers. When it is done lingering things will get now....anyone else hearing stories of small volume gold getting hard to source? I have not made any purchases in a while. Can one still buy say 50 ounces in a timely manner? Anyone know any wealthy people who have tried to buy in larger quantities?
Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:31 | 4392573 Soul Glow
Soul Glow's picture

I know of a guy who bought $75m worth of physical a few years ago.  He has it held at a bank.  The bank called him recently and asked if he wanted to loan it out to a third party.  He said no.  The bank called again a few weeks later with the same question.  He replied, "No".

Word is that the third party was the Treasury.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:40 | 4392608 U4 eee aaa
U4 eee aaa's picture

And when he calls to collect that gold, they will say, "No!"

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:26 | 4392732 Keyser
Keyser's picture

It might be time for your friend to go visit his hoard, just to make sure it hasn't been wisked away in the dead of night... 

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:51 | 4392784 Soul Glow
Soul Glow's picture

The bars probably have multiple claims on them, as all bullion housed in banks do.  They always have, by the way.

The first banks learned quickley that they could fractionaly reserve assets (and this back when gold was considered money by the status quo).  Now we do it in the open, in the name of economic science.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 00:16 | 4392843 cifo
cifo's picture

About 1,500 chocolate-sized bars. One person can move it out of the bank vault in a year or less. That's what I would call "delivery".

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:58 | 4392799 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

who is the idiot wanker troll dickhead that thought it any way reasonably appropriate to junk you for that

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 01:16 | 4392932 BoNeSxxx
BoNeSxxx's picture

Serial Junker(s).  Been happening a lot lately... 2-3 junks on every comment all at about the same time.

Word on the street is that it's the Bernank and Yellen... Timmah joins in when the Turkish bath house is closed.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:44 | 4392599 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Getting very hard to find in much more than 15oz lots in gold coin.

Good delivery 1 oz swiss ingot seems to be still available in quantity,

but I prefer coin,less chance of tungsten inserts.

Don't leave it too long otherwise you will be SOL.

Good luck.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 01:32 | 4392949 mt paul
mt paul's picture

was going to list a price 

for 50 oz eagles or maples


but decided not to...

probably buy on monday instead



Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:24 | 4392555 Soul Glow
Soul Glow's picture

It explains a lot of things.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:21 | 4392722 Stuck on Zero
Stuck on Zero's picture

Is there a bot down clicking every comment?  Everyone in here has a -2.


Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:29 | 4392744 Keyser
Keyser's picture

It's just Bernanke trying to find a new hobby now that he's retired... 

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:15 | 4392524 SnobGobbler
SnobGobbler's picture won't be able to deposit cash unless you are named on the account, even then you need to show ID. personàl and business, i mentioned capitol controls and was met by the salesmàn manager asking how MY day was; answer: great! can i show my id to close my account! 74trill in exposure and they're worried about my "laundering".     old world theif morgan lost a sucker today!

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 17:09 | 4394064 logicalman
logicalman's picture

I doubt god made options & spreads - I'm sure GS doing his work is enough.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 21:20 | 4392377 MontgomeryScott
MontgomeryScott's picture

'I've got a brilliant idea. I'm hooked up with Micheal Kreiger, one of the guys over at Zero hedge,...'

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 21:52 | 4392452 MontgomeryScott
MontgomeryScott's picture

I see someone 'has it in' for Max Keiser links.

Fuck YOU, Buckley!




Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:31 | 4392578 Soul Glow
Soul Glow's picture

Keiser.  Ha.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 01:26 | 4392948 Keyser
Keyser's picture

We could use a dose of Max Keiser and Nigel Farage in the US. Much like trying to cure constipation by taking colon blow. It's not going to be pretty, but the needs to be done. 

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 21:34 | 4392414 Gringo Viejo
Gringo Viejo's picture

X O X is a loser anyway you cut it.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 21:37 | 4392418 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

publicly at least they're net long (now.)

still the idea of trying to corner the gold market is ridiculous right now because not only do you have the dollar as a reserve currency (wasn't true when JP allegedly tried to corner the gold market back in the late 1800's) but you also didn't have the IMF, the World Bank, SDR's, a National Grid, etc...etc.

Trying to corner ANYTHING in this market is a widow maker trade.

The Hunt Brothers were the last I know of to actually try...and they did hold that corner for a pretty good bit...but there's just too much "hidden" from us because of the size of the Federal Government and the resources available to them "against you." (let alone other Governments in the world.)

The collapse in energy prices in the 1980's was truly spectacular I might add.

In practical terms "given the sudden appearance of dollar shortages Citigroup is a competitive threat to anyone trying to put a corner in."

HSBC as well I might add.
Love the sentiment of course.
"Lending with zero risk and nothing but reward" is a wonderful concept.
Not even JP Morgan could pull that one off though.
interesting that this bust started in Argentina.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:06 | 4392484 BeanusCountus
BeanusCountus's picture

Thumbs up to you. Cant understand why anyone would do this. Unless you were being paid to. By someone that has to return somebody else's gold maybe?

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 10:53 | 4393299 Keyser
Keyser's picture

What better way to suppress the price of a commodity than to corner the market and hold the price down regardless of market sentiment. It makes perfect sense if you want to keep the USD as the reserve currency and prevent a flight to gold as a safe haven. If gold were allowed to find it's true value in the market, the USD would be worthless. 


Sun, 02/02/2014 - 00:30 | 4392870 All Risk No Reward
All Risk No Reward's picture

>>still the idea of trying to corner the gold market is ridiculous right now because not only do you have the dollar as a reserve currency (wasn't true when JP allegedly tried to corner the gold market back in the late 1800's) but you also didn't have the IMF, the World Bank, SDR's, a National Grid, etc...etc.<<

What, exactly, makes you think all these institutions aren't colluding on behalf the OWNER CLASS that controls all of the above?


Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:50 | 4392633 Uncle Sugar
Uncle Sugar's picture

How can they corner the gold market when I had more net allocated gold (before the boating accident) than they do?  They may have cornered the paper gold market, but that's it.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 00:29 | 4392867 All Risk No Reward
All Risk No Reward's picture

That's where the tread marks are laid down...  what is their net position and by how much?

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 03:44 | 4393068 russwinter
russwinter's picture

JP Morgan is not short. 

Will the Real Manipulator Please Stand Up:

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:06 | 4392487 midtowng
midtowng's picture

Doesn't JPM own 60% of all derivatives of everything?

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 00:04 | 4392812 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

indeed, pretty close to it.

I wonder if anyone knows: if their gold derivatives implode, does that daisy-chain throughout their other derivatives and shadow banking network?

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 22:21 | 4392546 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

@buzzsaw99: "counterparty is not a problem for tbtf"

Yeah, and "notional" is not a problem for them either.  Enter notions like... Fiat currency, fiat debt, FRB.

"What a tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deceive" -Shakespeare

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:04 | 4392675 National Blessing
National Blessing's picture

Harvard Business School is wonderful.  It gives you the right to rape and plunder.  Why follow the law.  It's easier to steal--especially with the government on your side.  Word.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 00:36 | 4392881 satoshi911
satoshi911's picture

The more corrupt a nation, the more laws it has.

The USA has more laws than any other nation on earth.


The USA is a nation of lawyers and judges.


A failed penal colony.

"How does it feel to robll/kill, with the governments arms wrapped around you?" ... "GOOD DAMN GOOD" WILD-BUNCH

This has always been the AMerian WAY,... move along.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:44 | 4392767 Canadian Dirtlump
Canadian Dirtlump's picture

pardon me while i channel bart chilton and bloviate some lyrics to an early 80s rock power ballad.

Sat, 02/01/2014 - 23:49 | 4392781 Everyman
Everyman's picture

It shows you what  COMPLETE bunch of BULLSHIT the Financial Industry is.  It also shows that when this all blows up.


Jamine "Because I M rich" Dimon ought to get a bullet in his head for being leveraged 65X in paper over the real asset.

What a fucking douche bag!

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 00:07 | 4392816 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

been on holidays for a cupla weeks? Comex inventory was last sighted at 112X

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 17:32 | 4394113 logicalman
logicalman's picture

he deserves something much less pleasant than a bullet.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 00:49 | 4392899 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

Wrong/ Counterparty is the "endless loop" of fractional inflation{aka} banking.

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 17:37 | 4394116 logicalman
logicalman's picture

I wonder what happens when there are so many counterparties that it gets back to square one.....

Maybe something along the lines of

Creative buggers, until it implodes (soon, please!)

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 01:16 | 4392900 RaceToTheBottom
RaceToTheBottom's picture

This explains why the Chase has indicated that it is exiting the PM business.  They are figuring that they will have the freedom to derivativise after they have exited....

Does this mean the bottom is in? and their game will soon close out, Jaimie scummm?

Sun, 02/02/2014 - 10:37 | 4393274 fxrxexexdxoxmx
fxrxexexdxoxmx's picture

When Jamie is not cornering the paper gold market he is sucking Obama's cock.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!