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California's New 'Dust Bowl': "It's Gonna Be a Slow, Painful, Agonizing Death" For Farmers

Tyler Durden's picture




 

"It's really a crisis situation," exclaims one California city manager, "and it's going to get worse in time if this drought doesn't alleviate."

 

For the state that produces one-third of the nation's fruits and vegetables, the driest spell in 500 years has prompted President Obama to make $100 million in livestock-disaster aid available within 60 days to help the state rebound from what he describes is " going to be a very challenging situation this year... and potentially some time to come."

 

As NBC reports, Governor Jerry Brown believes the "unprecedented emergency" could cost $2.8 billion in job income and $11 billion in state revenues - and as one farmer noted "we can't recapture that." Dismal recollections of the 1930's Dust Bowl are often discussed as workers (and employers) are "packing their bags and leaving town..." leaving regions to "run the risk of becoming desolate ghost towns as local governments and businesses collapse."

 

 

Via NBC,

"The truth of the matter is that this is going to be a very challenging situation this year, and frankly, the trend lines are such where it's going to be a challenging situation for some time to come," Obama said Friday during a meeting with local leaders in Firebaugh, Calif., a rural enclave not far from Fresno.

 

Obama promised to make $100 million in livestock-disaster aid available within 60 days to help the state rebound from what the White House's top science and technology adviser has called the worst dry spell in 500 years.

 

...

 

"A lot of people don't realize the amount of money that's been lost, the amount of jobs lost. And we can't recapture that," Joel Allen, the owner of the Joel Allen Ranch in Firebaugh, told NBC News.

 

"It's horrible," Allen added. "People are standing in food lines and people are coming by my office every day looking for work."

 

Allen — whose family has been in farming for three generations — and his 20-man crew are out of work.

 

He said: "We're to the point where we're scratching our head. What are we gonna do next?"

 

At the local grocery store, fruit prices are up — but sales are down. The market was forced to lay off three employees — and many more throughout the town are packing their bags and leaving town.

 

McDonald said farming communities like Firebaugh run the risk of becoming desolate ghost towns as local governments and businesses collapse.

 

"It's going to be a slow, painful process — but it could happen," McDonald said. "It's not going to be one big tsunami where you're gonna having something get wiped out in one big wave. It's gonna be a slow, painful, agonizing death."

 

...

 

The problem is not just in California. Federal agriculture officials in January designated parts of 11 states as disaster areas, citing the economic strain that the lack of rain is putting on farmers. Those states are Arkansas, California, Colorado, Hawaii, Idaho, Kansas, New Mexico, Nevada, Oklahoma, Texas and Utah.

 

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Sat, 02/15/2014 - 21:31 | 4440917 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

 

 Obama promised to make $100 million in livestock-disaster aid available within 60 days to help the state rebound from what the White House's top science and technology adviser has called the worst dry spell in 500 years.

 

85 bil a month goes to the banks balance sheets, the worst dry spell in 500 years, 100 mil (but we need 60 fucking days to get it available)

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 21:36 | 4440925 mjcOH1
mjcOH1's picture

Let it rot on the vine. 

Surely failure is impossible in the worker's paradise.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 21:40 | 4440945 steve2241
steve2241's picture

Raisins, bitchez!

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 21:44 | 4440955 malikai
malikai's picture

Can someone please explain to me how printing money will make it rain?

Or has Zero watched too many shitty rap videos to know better?

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 21:45 | 4440959 FredFlintstone
FredFlintstone's picture

Think strip club.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 21:50 | 4440976 DaddyO
DaddyO's picture

Sorry Fonz, why should the .gov backstop this in the first place?

DaddyO

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 21:52 | 4440982 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

I'm not saying they should. I am saying as long as they are going to piss away all our money, we may want to consider how we prioritiize.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 21:54 | 4440987 DaddyO
DaddyO's picture

At some point we need to let them eat their bullet trains and other social engineering projects.

Until there is pain from poor management, there will be no change, let alone hope.

DaddyO

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 22:02 | 4441005 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

This is exactly where government (to the extent there is any "us" still left in government) should intervene.  We all benefit from CA agriculture when we buy food.  One problem is that the money isn't available because it was given to oligarchs, so we're left printing it and stealing more from the middle class.  The problem is not all of us getting together during a 500 year drought and helping out.  The real problem is that such things are so far down the priority list for government spending that it is a tiny footnote on a footnote.  And of course that most CA farmers are big ag so once again big ag is going to get "help" from the middle class.  

I don't understand why libertarians pick shit like this to get pissed about when it is such a tiny, fractional part of the budget compared to the Fed printing and other waste intended to benefit the real rulers.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 22:17 | 4441053 Seer
Seer's picture

Thanks, Rand.  I knew that a bunch of folks would jump on the old tired shit of beating on CA despite the fact of CA's importance to meeting one of the ONLY TRUE requirements: ->Food<-, Shelter and Water.  Broad brushes.  Throwing the baby out with the bath water.  Small-brained folks can never grasp the Big Picture.  Ag is one of the few areas that actually produces anything anymore.

This issue is one of the few that actually has REAL meaning.

Yes, like Rand puts it, it's likely Big Ag that'll get the help, but there are likely small farmers as well.  We would be best to help get through this with the commitment to alter our farming methods so that we're less susceptable to these things.

NOTE: As a farmer myself I have a personal bias.  And, I have a good friend in CA who is a small farmer.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 22:25 | 4441074 Blano
Blano's picture

I don't care if they grow 100% of the food.  That state has gone full retard for so long in so many ways I hope it rots in hell and takes a good portion of this country with it.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 22:32 | 4441096 greatbeard
greatbeard's picture

>> I don't care if they grow 100% of the food

Spoken like a man who's never been hungry a day in his life.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 22:41 | 4441122 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

None of this "aid" will grow even one more fruit or vegetable.  Only water will do that.

Plow money at the problem till the dehydrated cows come home, it doesn't do anything but temporarily save the unsavable.

Let it wither.  When it rains, it will come back.  Until that time, it's pushing more taxpayer money at a problem that money won't solve.

 

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 23:59 | 4441300 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

It isn't about food at all: it is about propping the politically connected agricultural concerns, salvaging bank loans that will wither on the vine as the crops do, and promoting the statist interventionist agenda.

 

I grow food in my own yard.  I've been ripping out the lawns here little by little every year.

We already have sprouts in cans inside the house even as the temp is well below freezing and the snow contines to pile up -now over 2 feet deep- out back.

My neighbors ALL spend $$$ on their damned manicured lawns.

Dirty noisy ride mowers and blowers run by illegals, chemicals and fertilizers, sprinkler systems running from 6am to 8am everyday up and down the street, etc.

We grow 100% clean, no chemical no gmo fresh FOOD.   

How about a tax abatement for US instead of propping these land rich bastards on the other side of the continent who will never share their food or their profits after being subsidized, let alone cease pushing their local immigration agenda on the rest of the nation?

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 00:28 | 4441345 knukles
knukles's picture

Hows about some water?
No he/they cannot make it rain (but will take your money under some horseshit premise related thereto)

The Federal Government Can Allow More Water Allocated to the Farmers.
Let LA fucking parch.

I live close to the heart of where most of America's Green Shit, Cattle, etc., are grown
And it ain't gonna get any better with a buncha Fucking Promises

 

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:10 | 4441429 cifo
cifo's picture

I'm sure the Apple farm will survive.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:24 | 4441455 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

You guys do understand how Cali gets its water.................................................right?

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 04:39 | 4441641 The Vineyard
The Vineyard's picture

The government should help these people out.  Bitches.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 08:36 | 4441771 Arius
Arius's picture

"85 bil a month goes to the banks balance sheets, the worst dry spell in 500 years, 100 mil (but we need 60 fucking days to get it available)".

 

The difference i believe is that the 85 bil a month is Funny Money, just numbers in the computers that dont really go anywhere.  Greeces 1 or 3 trillion dollars debt comes to mind (it grew from 2.5 bil in less than a decade go figure)

100 million is Real Money that got to go out of cash register into people's hand and will be actually SPENT!

 

Please correct me.  There are here better qualified financiers/economist (ooppss a dirty word) than myself the self proclaimed internet guru, but i think this is a big difference

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 10:13 | 4441881 johnQpublic
johnQpublic's picture

the growth rings of trees in the area are actually telling a tale of an area just coming out of 500 years of unusually wet weather

before then, drought was the norm

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 10:59 | 4441972 Its_the_economy...
Its_the_economy_stupid's picture

that which is unsustainable.....

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 11:44 | 4442054 MontgomeryScott
MontgomeryScott's picture

Lots of talk, but no discussion of the root causes.

http://csat.au.af.mil/2025/volume3/vol3ch15.pdf

Don't look up, and if you do, be assured that the crap in the sky is 'natural' (because WE say so!).

How about that snowfall in Japan, huh? Pretty neat...

The concept of the total destruction of a nation by protracted and covert means is one which seems to be foreign to most people. That pesky Constitutional Republic is (soon to be WAS) the only thing standing in the way of global conquest. Destroy a nation's currency, take all the gold, gut the industries, cause the infrastructure to crumble, destroy it's FOOD SUPPLIES,...

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 12:57 | 4442182 Kayman
Kayman's picture

Arius

The Fed's purchases shore up the undisclosed losses for the criminal banking cartel.

And yes, real cash money (not credit) is hard to find.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 17:31 | 4442847 Arius
Arius's picture

i thought so ... thanks for the confirmation.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 18:02 | 4442943 Truthseeker2
Truthseeker2's picture

MUST READ in order to understand the California drought!

*

Geoengineered Weather Patterns Wreaking Havoc Across The Planet
Chemtrails and HAARP are the Smoke and Mirrors behind the fabricated ‘Global Cooling’ events

http://cosmicconvergence.org/?p=6184

Tue, 02/18/2014 - 02:28 | 4447123 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Oh my...

A whackadoo on the loose...

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 02:14 | 4441540 lewietheparrot
lewietheparrot's picture

eat less

there was never enough water in cal, but no matter how much more was taken from other states

the farmers just over developed more alkaline flats into orchard

speculating that they could squeeze more water out of that turnip called wash., d.c.and they were right

so overfarmed with chemicals that the great valley of california's water table is toxic---salted up

how much more?

for a population that is so obese, 'eat less' is viable-----or maybe,

just cut a fifty to a hundred pounds off those that have too much and feed it to the hogs and cattle

one of the reasons i left cal 20 years ago

 

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 10:10 | 4441874 derek_vineyard
derek_vineyard's picture

problem is that vegtables and fruits are what some of us prefer to eat

so fucking mcD's and jack in the crock are the winners

 

 

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 10:15 | 4441883 johnQpublic
johnQpublic's picture

you eat vegetables and fruit?

STOP EATING MY FOODS' FOOD!!!!!!

Mon, 02/17/2014 - 00:05 | 4442279 lewietheparrot
lewietheparrot's picture

Derek,

Preferences may have to be put on hold for awhile-----

Or you could keep your preferences and change lifestyle as many here say they are doing/have done---

I have no problem obtaining all of the fruits and vegetables that I want, but I won't say where I live

Too many, obese, angry, hateful, intolerant boomers are already here---

I've never seen such anger freely vented by an immigrant population on their hosts----

These are the ugly people---boomers each and every one that I came here to escape

But, I can't escape myself, so I'll just have to learn to live with them as best I can

Preferences, at times, simply have to be put on hold.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 11:41 | 4442047 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture

 

 

THE FARM BILL IS AN EXAMPLE OF MORE WELFARE (REAL WELFARE WHERE IT TAKES FROM ONE TO GIVE TO ANOTHER) FOR BOTH THE RICH AND POOR at the expense of the middle class.

 

The Farm Bill vs. America
Sun, 02/16/2014 - 13:49 | 4442298 DaddyO
DaddyO's picture

Something that occured to me while fixing lunch.

Do the insurance providers who covered the lost crops get to claim Force Majeure?

This would make sense out of Obamaclause dolling out the funds he did.

DaddyO

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 22:40 | 4441123 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Or someone who knows how to feed himself?

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 22:47 | 4441139 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Yes, everyone who has ever been hungry had himself to blame.  I get so tired of hearing this "I'm okay so fuck you" bullshit that tries to pass as a political ideology.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 23:00 | 4441169 nmewn
nmewn's picture

"Yes, everyone who has ever been hungry had himself to blame.  I get so tired of hearing this "I'm okay so fuck you" bullshit that tries to pass as a political ideology."

WTF are you talking about? Only some freak of nature would be unconcerned.

What troubles me about you is, you seem to feel someone knowing how to feed themself without depending on something or someone else is considered a crime of nature.  

You just don't fucking get it, we sit here, allowing ourselves to be taxed into serfdom to feed the fucking world because we are compassionate. And you sit there saying we're not giving enough.

Go fuck yourself and survive on that, Got Galt?

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 23:13 | 4441193 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Go fuck yourself and survive without the society you deplore, asshat.  You'd be mauled and raped by a gang in 5 seconds and Ayn won't save you.  We're being taxed into serfdom because the gang has taken over and you are too fucking stupid to see it, and you want to give them the fucking keys because you can't get over a book you read in highschool.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 23:47 | 4441284 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Survive without society? A society of control freaks like you who can't even balance a simple checkbook? Who argued with me on the finer points of the Communist Manifesto?

(Yes, I do remember that)

"You'd be mauled and raped by a gang in 5 seconds and Ayn won't save you."

ROTFLMAO!!!

Listen to me very carefully LemmeEatYours, I will kill the first motherfuckers who try it, all of them or they can have my lifeless corpse to with as they will. You know why? Because I can. I won't call 911. I won't need your police. I won't need their paper work. I won't need their depositions. I won't need their courts. I won't need my lawyer.

Again, you know why?

Because there was a gang attempting to "maul & rape me". Its called justice and I have a front end loader for the proper burial with all the dignity & grace they deserve.

You however, will be "raped & mauled" while on the phone with 911.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 23:55 | 4441294 DaddyO
DaddyO's picture

I have already marked out the burial ground across the raod from my front gate as a deterrent to any miscreant that thinks he can help himself to my hard gotten gains.

May even leave a head or three on the fence posts just for grins...simply chilling!!

DaddyO

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 00:09 | 4441317 nmewn
nmewn's picture

I've gone even further.

I put up a sign that says "I'm For Gun Control" out by the gate.

Yeah I know, I guess it would be like shooting over a baited field in some areas (like where LemmeEatOthers lives, cowering in a corner) but my neighbors know my sense of humor and how much control I have over a tool ;-)

(Ok, its a great thought provoking joke though...lol)

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:17 | 4441413 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

And yet I'm an advocate of the 2nd.  Small-minded Assfuck.  I know, let's fuck ourselves in the ass and alienate reasonable people with our fucked up view of me.  By which I mean you.   You fuckholes want a society without society because you have no idea what it means to be human, and you are incapable of playing with others.    You know when your (former) friends and (reluctant) family tell you that you have something wrong... they are right.  Ever had that converstation?  You are a personal failure, and you blame everyone else but yourself, while you preach personal responsibility.  Sad.  

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:26 | 4441462 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Rand these guys may be goofballs, but sometimes you got to chill the fuck out. You're gunna have a heartattack over there typin' so furiously. 

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:32 | 4441467 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

He's dead, Jim.

 

Coonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:55 | 4441509 Seer
Seer's picture

Rand, I appeaciate both of you guys, so in no way am I "picking sides."  I don't think that stooping to name-calling is required here: reserve it for the trolling punks!

We're running over-capacity on this here planet.  There is NO way that we can "save" everyone even if we wanted to.

The selfish gene exists, and there's nothing wrong with that (as it provides a drive for life- works for nature).  There is no "solution," neither of you are "correct" here: some bits right, some bits wrong.

"You fuckholes want a society without society because you have no idea what it means to be human, and you are incapable of playing with others."

Just what is "society?"  I'm afraid that there are differing notions and, again, no one is fully right on what that is.  And when the society itself is fucked up?

It's a matter of what methods are most likely to provide for a continuance of a population.  Of course, if there's too much success (and given that humans have little in the way of visible threats [mostlyh microscopic]) we run into the issue of surpassing the ability of our environment to sustain us.

Adjustment.  Change.  That's how nature works.  Seems that we here realize that we're long overdue for an adjustment.  It's the "solutions" part that we cannot agree on; and, really, "solutions" don't exist because nothing is permanent- so, best means going forward is to advocate for the greatest diversity possible in the hopes that by so doing we'll evolve the best way forward.  I have my doubts that the way forward will be made clear from folks isolated in caves.  Likewise, everyone signing up to a sngle dogma ain't going to do it: it's been proven that entire populations/societies can succumb to delusions.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:34 | 4441473 Seer
Seer's picture

nmewn, do you really have to put out a sign like that, really?

Where I live that's like putting up a sign saying that I breathe.

I'm still amazed at how many people think "gun" first.  Unless you're packing on your property there's a chance that you don't have the "cure all" available when you might need it most.

Security is ALWAYS best in layers.  My frontline security doesn't require batteries or ammo, and it works even when I'm sleeping... getting enough sleep is a good thing, it makes for a better aim.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 08:48 | 4441781 snr-moment
snr-moment's picture

does it eat a poisoned steak?

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 09:19 | 4441808 nmewn
nmewn's picture

lol...the sign comment was a barbed joke fired for effect...

(Ok, its a great thought provoking joke though...lol)

Yes, clarity of mind and layers are the way to go, gate...dogs...gun. And I usually only leave one (occassionaly two) of those things behind when I leave ;-)

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 13:17 | 4442233 Kayman
Kayman's picture

 nmewn

Good morning my friend. You sure are stirring the pot....

My rotties are trained to never eat anything but what I give them. And I keep an excavator on the property.

 

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 15:44 | 4442589 snr-moment
snr-moment's picture

Excellent training if you can keep them to it.

I keep my 'layers" either on my peron at all times, when away, or the more acccurate version within a rooms length. Always

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 00:02 | 4441303 willwork4food
willwork4food's picture

Damn, Is there a full moon out tonight?

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 09:59 | 4441857 cherokeepilot
cherokeepilot's picture

One of the benefits of my 50 acre farm is the number of places that can contain bodies of those that would attempt to harm any member of my family and take what is mine.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 11:06 | 4441984 headhunt
headhunt's picture

never shit where you eat - no matter how big the plate

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 06:25 | 4441693 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

The "Gang" that's taken over has your Big Brother and his guns to back them up!  Sure you wanna blame someone other than the supporters of Big Borther, such as yourself?

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 19:56 | 4443281 AchtungAffen
AchtungAffen's picture

"He who can live outside of society is either a beast or a god" - Aristotle

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 11:30 | 4442024 Never One Roach
Never One Roach's picture

nmewn, there is little or no concern for 'your neighbor' because communities no longer exist. Many areas are saturated with rentals where people come and go and have zero interest in their "community" since they'll be gone in a few months/years.They don't own, cannot afford and don't care.

The Landlords are "Absentee Landlords" in California or similar so they don't give a hoot about local conditions as long as they receive some $$$ each month.

The ones who are there for the long haul are too busy iPadding or watching Jason beeper and Kim K when they get home. The last thing they want is to say "Hi!" to their neighbor.

The foreigners who moved into this country are also not too interested in "fitting in" and/or making friends. They're too busy making money and/or hanging with their own Habeebs.

It's a new world of strangers from what I see. For the good or bad, it's all different and Globalozation is just picking up steam.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 13:05 | 4442201 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Well, there are elements of truth in that, IMO.

I guess with me "society" starts at the family level, then flows outward to friends from there, then to the community at large. I don't believe you can have a society without family first as the anchor...its sorta like college without it...transient.

Then we get to what I believe separates people like me from LemmeEatYous. It boils down to, when in Rome do as the Romans do.

Because we allow people to come in among us, it does not give them permission to steal from us or change what we have built here, into what they left behind.

There are good & bad among them, so I don't generalize much. As a matter of fact, I wrote a letter to an immigration judge on behalf of one (a Mexican national) who came here (illegally), has worked the entire time, got married, has children.

Again (societally) he started his own core here that will contribute his values & ethics to society at large (regardless of his legal status) he is a good and decent man, he started a family and all he asks from the state is to be left alone.

My kinda guy ;-)

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 12:32 | 4442132 Icantstopthinki...
IcantstopthinkingaboutNINJAs's picture

Err...

 

Let's go back to the numbers again:

 

What percentage of the US population is Overweight?

What percentage of the US population is Obese?

 

You've never met a hungry person unless you went to another country.

 

If California is drying up, let it dry up and start importing food from somewhere else.  Earth is a closed system, California's missing rain is arriving somewhere else.  Start buying food from somewhere else and they will start planting more of it.

 

OR....

 

Monsanto will just have to take that free govt money to research even more drought resistant crops to plant!

 

If Mother Nature wants it dry in CA, it will be dry.  Get up and fucking move.  Once upon a time, Lake Chad was huge, but the Desert won. 

 

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 23:04 | 4441178 zerozulu
zerozulu's picture

There will be a long long Ramadan in California.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 05:15 | 4441665 Motorhead
Motorhead's picture

So this time it really IS the weather....

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 11:07 | 4441987 headhunt
headhunt's picture

They are used to this crap

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 22:40 | 4441125 chemystical
chemystical's picture

They don't have 100% of the arable land.  Supply is portable.  Wait a while and the would-be farmers in other states might get equipment at firesale prices.

A shakeout might be what's needed.  Make sure, however, to keep the measures intact to prevent freeloaders from shopping for the most lucrative teat, and those who vote for their living might not overwhelm those who work for a living.  Bigger problem is getting rid of: 1) those who bribe and blackmail for a living, and 2) those whom accpet the brines and capitulate to the self-inflicted blackmail

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 00:57 | 4441400 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

actually, there's a lot that's needed and you've hit on a number of points. Centralizing food, like centralizing anything is nuts. Creating systems economic or agriculutral that rely on the fantasy of never ending (false) supplies of money or water is insane, especially in "dry" times. California gets plenty of sunshine but it has never received the amount of water we have lied into the system. THis day was innevitable with or without the global warming debate. There's a reason mankind has taught most of its people food raising skills for all of its existence except the last 100. THe Australians, the permaculture crowd and most "primitive" people know you work with the natural systems, directly hold and absorb water, make the land fertile and spongelike with natural plant waste material. and, most important, do not grow one crop especially toxic genetically modifed shit that harms humans and the soil it sits in. There are lots of nutritious and edible plants on this earth. Modern Ag has us down to GMO soy and corn syrup. Different plants can handle differnt environments including dry ones. It's so complex it's simple. Mother nature's system of checks and balances is still the greatest guidebook.     

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 02:32 | 4441555 lewietheparrot
lewietheparrot's picture

nice post, davey

where were you in the 1980's when we needed your voice?

never mind----where was i?

all of was known then, but nothing changed except that the greed grew faster than the water

i'm too old for this same old discussion

sorry--i'm off to bed     we've gone over this so many times

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 10:46 | 4441943 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

"nothing changed except that the greed grew faster"

sadly the story of every industry 

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 11:13 | 4441997 headhunt
headhunt's picture

Mother nature is a ruthless bitch and just does what she does.

In spite of what people would like to believe we are a part of mother nature and shit just happens.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 02:05 | 4441518 Seer
Seer's picture

"Wait a while and the would-be farmers in other states might get equipment at firesale prices."

Some of the problem lies in the very equipment itself.  Lots of equipment is highly specialized.  Can't take almond harveting equipment and ship it to livestock farmers in another state.  There's also the issue of pushing tools of unsustainability from one place as we face issues of sustainability.

And, again, this isn't just about CA.  The last paragraph (which a lot of people seemed to skip over in their quest to shit on CA here) notes that there are several other states facing similar situations.

It was good of you to include the word "might."  This is a very complex situation, the ramifications are likely much larger than people can imagine.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 22:51 | 4441150 JR
JR's picture

This gives the liberals a chance to blame Jerry Brown’s incompetence on the drought. When it comes to devastating effects from the weather, it can hold no contest to the rule of the ironclad chokehold the Democrats have over California.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 22:55 | 4441153 Meat Hammer
Meat Hammer's picture

When people are shooting each other for berries the libtards here will blame the guns.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 22:59 | 4441164 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

Hey meat, you are out in CA right? You see any effects from this yet? I spoke to a buddy outside of San Diego tonight. he said they took water off the table in the restaurants, you have to ask for it now...but that's about it. food prices are normal. 

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:26 | 4441459 Seer
Seer's picture

When spring is pushing hard and summer is lurking is when the real test will be.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 03:16 | 4441594 LosOsos
LosOsos's picture

Very true. We won't really feel the full force until the lack of snow melt hits us.

 

I'm out in SLO County where some of the worst of the drought is. Drinking water supply is still Ok in the southern portion but up in north county we have some lakes at around 5% and the risk of salt water intrusion into the ground table is getting pretty close. My friend's dad manages a strawberry farm in town and I know they were short a harvest this year because of the lack of rain. Until last week we hadn't had a drop of rain since early December. It's pretty crazy even the chaparall is dead back in the hills.

Mon, 02/17/2014 - 13:28 | 4445083 fedupwhiteguy
fedupwhiteguy's picture

they (Cali) have water conservation measures implemented any time the government declares a state of emergency. and yes, not providing water at your table in a restaurant is standard. If you want it, you must ask for it. NBD....

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 00:39 | 4441372 HardlyZero
HardlyZero's picture

Wall street wil se safe and their bonuses.

The rest of the country will go to rot.

It might cost $10 for an orange but the FED will pay for that on Wall Street.

Ghosts of Soylent Green.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 02:09 | 4441528 Seer
Seer's picture

And the liberals control Texas (which, if you'd read the entire article mentions that it and other states, clearly NOT blue states, is facing similar problems)?

Party Pussy shit...

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 13:23 | 4442249 Kayman
Kayman's picture

JR

Good Morning !  Time to revive NAWAPA. Maybe Obama can persuade Canada to build Keystone to pump water to California !

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 23:13 | 4441204 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

1. Will the food be sold cheap when the harvest is again bountiful or will depressed prices be the mantra of another bailout and/or propping of foodstuff prices to 'save the farmer!' then too?

2. Will the Chinese be buying up this food with printed yuan and exporting it next year leaving the taxpayer in effect subsidizing foreign consumption?

3. How long shall we subsidize failed farms before calling what might be a mismanaged depleted zone a desert and telling the farmers to forget it and move on?

4. How exactly will money make water appear where it isn't?  Are we gonna truck in the poland springs for cattle?

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 02:10 | 4441533 Seer
Seer's picture

So much easier to just bailout the bankers, don't ya think?

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 06:33 | 4441700 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Ever heard of NAWAPA?

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 22:30 | 4441081 sylviasays
sylviasays's picture

Government has already "intervened" to make the water crisis worse! California's system of aqueducts and storage tanks was designed back in the 1960's to take advantage of rain and mountain runoff from wet years and store it for use in dry years. But it's now inactive — by design. Environmental special interests managed to dismantle the system by diverting water for their pet projects, such as saving delta smelt, a baitfish. That move forced the flushing of 3 million acre-feet of water originally slated for the Central Valley into the ocean over the past five years. Meanwhile no new dams or water reservoirs have been built since the 1960's while the state's population has exploded by millions of people!

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 23:22 | 4441230 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

even worse actually.
as FDR mandated during the Great Depression "all water resources were to be prioritized for land agriculture."
PERIOD.

This got shoved into the ground by Nancy Pelosi and her "vote getting machine" as simply put "you farmers don't have the numbers against my real estate lobby."

No problem with the Colorado River.
https://www.usbr.gov/uc/water/crsp/cs/gcd.html
The resevoir is down 50% though.
hmmm.
wonder why that is.
You could throw a trillion dollars at this problem and not solve it at this point.

Absolutely created by the one party system in Cali.
Move along...

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 02:16 | 4441542 Seer
Seer's picture

The grow-or-die Party.  The SW has ALWAYS been a battleground for water.  It ain't new.  What IS new is that it's a lot tougher to just roll someone for the water.

Again, this ain't only an issue in CA (sorry CA-bashers, much of your "logic" falls apart when we look at what's going on in other farming states).

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 07:46 | 4441739 snr-moment
snr-moment's picture

First this is a great time to be seling arable land in the midwest.

Second, this is a great time to buy previously arable land in California, if your name is Pelosi and you know you can change the rules back the way they were.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 14:11 | 4442353 Rafferty
Rafferty's picture

Nobody is saying anyting about the fundamental problem, the almost doubling of the population through mass immigration in the space of a few decades.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 16:00 | 4442627 snr-moment
snr-moment's picture

A problem that will be massively increased when Preznit Dufus pushes as many people back into cities as possible.  More complex systems require a much higher per capita degree of infrastructure.

 

Remember when the libtards were all about infrastructure?  That was before the smelt.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 15:00 | 4442487 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

"even worse actually.

as FDR mandated during the Great Depression "all water resources were to be prioritized for land agriculture."

Even WORSE than worse: this was also the same FDR that mandated the as-hoc buring of food-crops and the destruction of livestock in order to prop up prices of food during a depression, isn't it?

FDR and his central planning and corporatist cronies starved American Citizens: men, women and children.

Are we also supposed to believe that the farmers that had their property destroyed were paid for it or provided with funds to cover their costs and debts and meet their personal consumption needs?   Of course, the particular farmers who's property was designated for confiscation/destruction were chosen entirely at random and not to achieve political goals of any kind be these goals local, regional, national or trans-national?

Governments are often the very mechanisms by which evil speculators and delusional ideologues starve pople into submission to their will...

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 13:07 | 4442210 jerry_theking_lawler
jerry_theking_lawler's picture

My dad was in CA during early to late 60s building dams. When that 'dried up' and the huge influx of people continued to roll in....he moved back home to the South. Thank God.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 22:29 | 4441089 DaddyO
DaddyO's picture

 LTER, I disagree and would put forth the notion that decentralizing food production is a far better solution than taxing everyone into oblivion which by all accounts has led to gross mismanagement. I produce much of my own produce and am not dependent on SoCal for my sustenance. Droughts historically have been regional and we should not be penalized on the East Coast for a West Coast drought. Food production can be ramped up in other locales to fill the gap left by shortfalls in the San Joaquin Valley etc.

DaddyO

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 22:45 | 4441135 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

It's like explaining color to a blind person.   Or empathy to a narcissist.  Waste of time.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 02:22 | 4441545 TheMeatTrapper
TheMeatTrapper's picture

It's like explaining self reliance and personal responsibility to a libtard. Waste of time. 

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 12:48 | 4442161 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture

 

LET THEM EAT RAND IS HYPOCRITICAL LIBERAL FASCIST just like his leader obummer he wants us all to do as he says but not as he does.

Here he is the other day speaking of the elderly.

"...but eventually the motherfuckers are going to want to eat."

Let them eat Rand.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-02-11/22-facts-about-coming-us-demogr...

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 13:00 | 4442191 shovelhead
shovelhead's picture

Now if you can get all those "I feel your pain" empathizers to cry copius amounts of tears, you can fill up those reservoirs tout suite.

Empathy never brought a dead cat back to life but it certainly makes the empathizer feel better about themselves.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 14:13 | 4442362 MrSteve
MrSteve's picture

Wow, When I updated, the down arrows leaped -34 to 1, so I don't need to say what everyone is thinkng about your "inaccurate" statements. I do congratulate you for now being an official "Internet Tough Guy"; disrespecting the blind takes immense ITG personal resources, like thought and courage which you so ably display here.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 23:12 | 4441199 OC Sure
OC Sure's picture

DaddyO is correct regarding this argument.

Aside from his explanation, the principle itself is that this, stealing from citizens (no matter for what "noble" purpose), is not the function of government. 

 

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 23:18 | 4441216 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

DaddyO is wrong regarding this argument. It is the function of government to assist people in need with shared resources.  

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 00:02 | 4441247 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

USDA is propping up how many agricultural concerns presently?

Does the US really need to prop beef or corn or sugar for fuck's sake?

How about each of us that gets off our asses and puts a garden in their yard and gets some exercise working it every day gets a tax abatement.  -THAT would leave a cool $100 Million dollars in the hands of individuals that do things for themselves and who are healthier for it, wouldn't it?

Isn't healthy exorcise and fresh clean no gmo no pesticides food cultivated by my hands right out of my own yard better than propping land-rich people that will never share their profits in the good years a far better economic and health solution?

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 08:13 | 4441753 snr-moment
snr-moment's picture

Didn't the SCOTUS rule against a grower many years back for trying to be self sufficient because it affected interstate commerce?

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 13:11 | 4442223 jerry_theking_lawler
jerry_theking_lawler's picture

You are oh so close on this one...self reliant people (like many here on ZH) already farm their own food....what we don't want or need is any government regulation involved in it...taxes, etc. They can just stay the fuck away and leave me alone because once that can of worms is open then they may regulate what, when, how I can grow and then it will be trouble as Ruby Ridge will look like a fucking swat vacation to the fucking carnival shooting gallery if they come after me.....

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 15:16 | 4442537 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

I'm not advocating for any sort of taxation regime relating to individuals who grow their own foodstuffs.

A better way to say what I meant is: Govenment should not be propping large agricultural concerns.   People should not be penalized and/or discouraged from/for being more self-sufficient where food production/security is a concerned.

Confiscating my money/assets which I can and do use to generate healthy food and gifting it to commercial agricultural interest does not enhance MY health or provide ME with better health or more clean food or with economic security.

IMHO, large scale commercial farming and large scale statist distribution schemes and the contemporary health care system are in aggregate NOT resulting in better health or enhancing food security for the populace any more than simply encouraging exorcise and small scale localized/personal agricultural initiatives are likely to.

People need to get off their asses and work.

People need to eat healthier foods.

Over-taxing the poor, using the funds extracted to prop corn syrup and sugar industries, and distributing ebt/rationing cards to the over-taxed poor so that they can afford the un-healthy consumables being produced while protecting commercial profits -is simply lousy health/econimic/food security policy.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 23:32 | 4441249 OC Sure
OC Sure's picture

@ lter

I may be mistaken then so let me clarify. It is not the function of the government that TJ, Benny, and Mr. Adams helped found back in the 1770s. You are referring to Rousseau's incorrect conception of community that gave way to the French Revolution.

 We are concerned here with America.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:19 | 4441444 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Fuck.  You.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 08:16 | 4441757 snr-moment
snr-moment's picture

Last resort of a winning libtard argument

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 09:27 | 4441825 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

That or Nazis.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 13:12 | 4442225 jerry_theking_lawler
jerry_theking_lawler's picture

OC must be a racist.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 11:08 | 4441990 OC Sure
OC Sure's picture

If you mean lter's spouting expletive, then:

"Last resort of a [losing] libtard argument"

There, fixed it.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 14:22 | 4442389 Deathrips
Deathrips's picture

SNR..

yup..another confused controlled oposition tail chaser tried the same shit with me yesterday...makes it even better when i calmly walk away, as they are about to pull their hair out because the thought of being responsible for ones self and choosing (not being forced) to work as individuals together is too frightnening to dependents. Grow up lib kids.

Quit up thumbing yourself, while your at it rand.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 23:32 | 4441250 DaddyO
DaddyO's picture

So let see, just for the sheer convenience of being able to go to the grocery store and get your food instead of your garden, you're willing to steal money from me to fix a problem that is unfixable with money, namely drought.

California has been using OPW(other peoples water) to irrigate land that normally wouldn't be tillable. And now the vultures are coming home to roost and everyone else should pay..

I say Bullshit!!

DaddyO

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 23:52 | 4441290 OC Sure
OC Sure's picture

This is great empirical evidence but please don't let go of the jugular; it is the fundamental principle that matters most.

Not defending the principle now just invites later arguments and dillydallying over some other empirical evidence tomorrow.

Principle is: What is the purpose of government?

 

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 00:02 | 4441305 DaddyO
DaddyO's picture

What is the purpose of government?

It is certainly not to continue to perpetuate the waste, fraud and abuse that is the Peoples Republic of Kalifornia.

Certainly an argument can be made that we should stop starvation and suffering. But that is not happening yet.

Obamaclause has no problem going out and giving away yours and my money to gladhand a bunch of fat cat cronies for the MOPE.

The sheer idiocy of saying we should all chip in so a bunch of cattle ranchers can get a .gov hand out is bullshit, plain and simple.

DaddyO

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 00:11 | 4441320 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

The legitimate purpose of Govenment is to combat fraud and repel foreign invasion; and not much else.

Stealing from Me to salvage others from deserved failure is not a proper function of government.

Don't these people have insurance -and guaranteed government insurance at that?

Didn't Congress just pass a fucking trillion dollar farm/ag bill with literally hundreds of billions in insurance guarantees that cover Ag losses just last month???

 

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 00:33 | 4441361 OC Sure
OC Sure's picture

You are very close.

 But to be more precise, the purpose is to defend every individual's right to their own life, their own freedom of action, and the ownership of their property.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:08 | 4441420 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

Yes. Pretty much.  I basically accept that wording.

IF .GOV has a purpose it should be quite limited.

Confiscating MY property to prop failures and frauds and funding foreign ventures and adventures is unacceptable.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:53 | 4441501 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Jesus, are you fuckers in highschool, or junior high?

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 06:42 | 4441707 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Better than being in kindergarten (where everything is always fair).  Please grow up and realize that robbing Peter to pay Paul ALWAYS has the support of Paul, but it's completely immoral.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 08:20 | 4441761 snr-moment
snr-moment's picture

What do you give a shit.

Let them eat rand.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 00:29 | 4441347 OC Sure
OC Sure's picture

@ DaddyO

"Certainly an argument can be made that we should stop starvation and suffering."

What is this argument?

You will find that supporters of this argument will contradict your argument against Kalifornia drought bailouts.

It is "Either - Or" and thats why you need to stick to the principle. You would be against one action of the government that steals to give to those affected by drought but then you would be for an action of government that steals to give to those affected by starvation and suffering.  Without focussing on the principle you are caught in a contradiction.

This will not do.

Simply solve the starvation and suffering problem the same way you would the drought.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:21 | 4441450 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

You people are truly fucking pathetic  Fuck all of you and your fucking sophomoric excuse for self-interest.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 10:56 | 4441960 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture

 

 

AND YOU ARE RAND ARE A HYPOCRITE! Just the other day you were on here whinning about old peoples Social Security which they along with their employers paid for - so zero government money but when it comes to what money YOU think should be taken from others to give - boy you are the first pig at the trough to take it away. You Rand are the epitome of a LIBERAL FASCIST.

 

YOU RAND THE HYPOCRITE (all throughout this article)

"...but eventually the motherfuckers are going to want to eat."

Let them eat Rand.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-02-11/22-facts-about-coming-us-demogr...

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 00:59 | 4441405 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

nice posts DaddyO

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:11 | 4441430 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Nice ode to self, DaddyO.  

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 06:15 | 4441686 Element
Element's picture

Oh man, that's cold, just think of all those poor lawns and golf courses.

In other news, if the Cali guvna is worried about revenues he, er, it's a he, right? Are they sure this time?

Well, anyway, he should start a hot buttered popcorn stand on zh.

He'd make about a 3 gigakasquillion bits.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 00:21 | 4441328 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

Shared Resources

Who's resources are going to be shared for what purpose?

MY resouces.  -For whatever purpose YOU think appropriate...

Not YOUR resources, oh no...

WHY should MY resources be shared off to someone else if there is never any reciprocation?  

WHO decided I had to share and when does the sharing pay for what I want and/or need?

 

This so-called sharing of resources never ever seems to result in what I call sharing; but, in actuality MY resources being effectively confiscated.  

I don't recieve ANY share later.  Somebody likes sharing what I earn/have; and NOT what they earn/have.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:12 | 4441433 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

The bold really helps.  Rand fuck. But you fuckers always yell the loudest while being the biggest fucking SHEEP.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:30 | 4441466 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

"Rand fuck. But you fuckers always yell the loudest while being the biggest fucking SHEEP."

I'm NOT into Rand, NOT into any of the past of present Rands or Greenspan or Kissenger, etc.  

I'm also not into being robbed to prop failures and theives.

Look, I get it: bail out farmer means bail out a chain of People from Bankers to fertilizer salesmen to .gov bureaucrats to local police to migrant workers to EBT card holders to etcetcetc.

The probem is that I'm one little self employed for 25+ years fuck who has been getting the bills for this shit and never seems to get a break from them -or from the intrusions and inflation and repression.

I don't want a hand out.  I'll eat the dandelions out of my back yard instead of calling up the welfare office.

I want privacy.  

I want a job interview where I am asked about my skills and experience instead of a racial profile questionaire.

I want not to be forced to pay for services I will never ever use.

I could go on.

I was abandoned as a child by my parents.  I was socially demoted in the public schools.

I've be a victim of identity theft and had my wages garnished for YEARS.

I just want an end to the bullshit; -to be left in peace to fend for myself.

WHY is that unacceptable to You?

WHY do You think I owe Other People -& YOU in particular- anything?

& while YOU are at it: WHAT DO YOU OWE ME?

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:35 | 4441476 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Fucking pathetic sheep.   Fuck you you fuck.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:45 | 4441487 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

You want everyone to think You want to help people but You don't want to hear that leaving some people alone is what they want and need.

Sheep?  Me?

You've never seen such a wayward creature as I.

I've been on my own and don't owe You or anyone else anything.

I'm what scares You.  I'm not interested in being part of your global village.  

Your system has never been kind or reasoned to Me and I am not interested in anything but a seperate peace or WAR.

I've been outside too long.  I'm not interested in being domesticated on any terms but those I might impose.

-Things have already been taken way to far with Me for Me to give a shit about civility and mutualism.

IF I don't find value in what You are offering I am under no compulsion to cooperate.

I'm not interested in your terms any more.  It's way too late for that.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:48 | 4441490 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

I'm snapping my fingers at your hipsterness.  Fuckwad.  Is that a Playstation thing or is that above your pay?  You pathetic fuck.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:57 | 4441502 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

I'm not a hipster fool.

I'm one of the ones that got fucked over and left out.

I went hungry man.  Not just for a while either.  

I went hungry like Americans don't think happens in America -for a long period.

I Slept in parks and on porches and beaches.  

& it wan't fucking groovy or fun.  

I'm not faux angry.  I'm really actually really fucking angry and don't want any more bullshit.

You think that becasue I'm inside tonight that I've been domesticated?

Your wrong.

You need to actually consider that I might be an honest angry motherfucker that doesn't give a damn about You or your value system or your fraud of a social order.  At ALL..

I've been shit on too many times.

I'm not vested in this system.

I want to see it fail.

I'm here for the Operation Mayhem whether everyone else was joking or bragging or not.

I'm not down for a restoration.  I want to see the present order destroyed because it has been very cruel to Me.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 02:01 | 4441514 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Sell your fucking computer for food then, liar.  Or just shut the fuck up.   Anyone with an IQ over 60 knows what you are.  Fuck you.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 02:14 | 4441529 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

Calling Me a liar isn't persuading Me that your sytem is just or suitably concerned with MY well being to respect it.

I make my living hustling with tech.  I found my way to parley my intelligence for sustainance.

That doesn't change the fact that I don't share your value system precisely because I have been serially abused by the practicioners of it.

What are you gonna do when the plug is pulled?

I know how to be hungry.  I know how to be lonely.  I put up with pain as I have to although I don't like it very much.

You are mistaking aggression for machismo.  That might be a costly mistake to make as some point.

What are you gonna do if I really have already decided that there is nothing to lose if your big centalized interconnected sytem of repression is destroyed?

 

In your claimed mutualized system You own Me just as much as I owe You.

What happens if I have already concluded that Your system is not in fact mutual and will never perform in any fashion with respect to adressing my issues, needs or concerns?

What if You forgot to respect the other and the other has lost faith in your sytem and now has concluded to suspend it and punish it's progenitors for their repressions?

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 06:36 | 4441702 Deacon Frost
Deacon Frost's picture

Take away ‘LetThemEatRand’ four letter words, he can’t form a sentence. Some pseudo-intellectual.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:11 | 4441431 Toxicosis
Toxicosis's picture

Ideally this might be the case.  But supposed function and actual function do obviously differ.  Before we used to have charity, which might have worked better since those offering charity do so out of the goodness and kindness of their hearts.  If the government wishes to aid it should not be a forced distribution but literally one of requesting the public to contribute.  But since virtually every government intentionally and  fraudulently misuses and disuses funds and resources, the less they 'contribute' to the problem the better.  In fact human communities and society would be far better off devoid of government-"mafia"- involvement and be left with communities deciding to be interdependent on a local, regional, and even national level.  Self-sustainment is great, however, since most of us do interact and interrelate with many other people, our need to eventually see others survive becomes for many an innate human intention.  There are others, however, usurped by greed and self-absorption that obviously throw a wrench into the problem.  And the vast majority are politicians at any level.  Thus government is a destructive, NOT constructive entity.

 

 

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 05:01 | 4441653 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

" If the government wishes to aid it should not be a forced distribution but literally one of requesting the public to contribute."

Indeed.

What You did NOT see was Obama and a cadre of rich congresspersons standing shoulder to shoulder writing out checks to farmers FROM THEIR OWN ACCOUNTS and publicly ASKING that Other Citizens follow suit with charitable donations.  

You didin't ven see Obama emploring congress to vote on a drought aid package.

You didn't see Obama emploring Californian politicians to vote on conservation measures or even simply emploring Californians to voluntarily stringently conserve water.

NO LEADERSHIP; just softserve bullying and unilateral allocation of taxpayer funds.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 08:40 | 4441775 dizzyfingers
dizzyfingers's picture

ThroxxOfVron

" If the government wishes to aid it should not be a forced distribution but literally one of requesting the public to contribute." Indeed.What You did NOT see was Obama and a cadre of rich congresspersons standing shoulder to shoulder writing out checks to farmers FROM THEIR OWN ACCOUNTS and publicly ASKING that Other Citizens follow suit with charitable donations.  You didin't ven see Obama emploring congress to vote on a drought aid package. You didn't see Obama emploring Californian politicians to vote on conservation measures or even simply emploring Californians to voluntarily stringently conserve water.NO LEADERSHIP; just softserve bullying and unilateral allocation of taxpayer funds."

#1 Danger to our society. #2 criminal banks.

 

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 02:28 | 4441551 Seer
Seer's picture

What you're advocating for is resiliency.  Exactly!

The thing with our existing systems is that they're sustained by economies of scale.  And with CA, its scale allows it to net export (out of the US) to create tax dollars for the Federal govt..  Not all that much different than anywhere else: check out the numbers on Bob Dole's state.  That in turn gets it special status (just like the big aircraft manufacturers, like all the big manufacturers).

The mantra is BIG, and, as it goes for Ag, that was put forth during the Nixon administration by the then Secretary of Ag Earl Butz ("Get big or get out.").

As a small farmer I am well aware that I cannot realize the cost breaks that larger farmers get.  In a way the larger farmers help support me through their ability to draw volume and keep the supplier stream open.

So... I just do what I feel I can sustain, and what I think that those following after me will be able to sustain.  No one will ever be "there," it's in the "direction" and seeing when the need to alter direction is necessary.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 13:39 | 4442282 Kayman
Kayman's picture

"sustained by economies of scale."  If that were true, why would they need subsidies ? Just another government/cronyism smokescreen.

Sat, 02/15/2014 - 23:01 | 4441170 Greenskeeper_Carl
Greenskeeper_Carl's picture

I see where you are coming from, but the main reason I get pissed about it is because decades worth of evidence tells me that 90 cents on the dollar that the govt spends will be pissed away and wasted. Just like the stupid stimulus bill. the govt spends the money to 'help the people', but typically ends up handing money, taken from whats left of the middle class tax payer, and handing it to their likeminded cronys. the vast majority of the money will go into peoples pockets, and very little of it will actually be used in beneficial manner, other than enrich a select few that sit close to the thrown

didnt down vote you, BTW

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 00:57 | 4441377 SilverDOG
SilverDOG's picture

LetThemEatRand,

 

 

We all do NOT benefit from CA agriculture when we buy food.

Buying local is self beneficial, local beneficial, environmentally beneficial, and fresh.

Buying a natural resources depleting food supply is F-ing Randtarded.

The problem is you blaming above and beyond yourself.

When the problem is you, ALL of you.

This is from a person who grows years supply of vegetables in one 20' x 100' garden, including the walkways.

The years supply for 4 people; and sharing with others, in NORTHERN New England w/out greenhouse.

I laugh gleefully harvesting beets, carrots, parsnips, KALE, etc etc last week. Got STRAW?

All organic all cost reducing health expanding, zero pesticidal dna altering radiated CA shit.

Wake the fuuuk up.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:03 | 4441411 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

Exactly.

Stuff likes to grow!  It really doesn't take that much to decide what you want where and let it loose to do it's thing.

-& it almost always tastes way better than what's in the stores.

Ground is a little hard so the next lot of jerusalem artichokes and carrots will have to wait a few days.

 

I just don't get it; it's as if People are scared of nature, of dirt or something.

They sure love wasting money and water on their lawns though...

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 07:01 | 4441712 Adahy
Adahy's picture

I think they are scared of it.  They've been trained to be fearful of nature if it is not strictly regulated by man.  And dirt?  They are completely terrified of it.  Hell, you've seen the hand-sanitizer overkill; these people are afraid of the very air in an open environment.

My nextdoor neighbors, with their immaculate lawn, HATE my garden with a passion, even though I still offer them fresh fruits and veggies every year just like the rest of the street gets.  They always refuse and give a snide snort or some under-the-breath comment.  How can you turn down free fruits and veggies?  Craziness.  Even the fresh figs....FIGS damnit!  I just don't get it.

They live 5 or 6 deep in a large house and are NEVER outside unless it is to wash their fleet of cars.  Never outside....in the Southeast.
Craziness I tell you.

You can't keep me in the damn house.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 17:48 | 4442896 akak
akak's picture

 

I think they are scared of it.  They've been trained to be fearful of nature if it is not strictly regulated by man.  And dirt?  They are completely terrified of it.  Hell, you've seen the hand-sanitizer overkill; these people are afraid of the very air in an open environment.

That reminds me of something Wally Hickel, the (in)famous former pro-'development' governor of Alaska. once said: "You can't just let nature run wild!"

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 00:49 | 4441389 Omegaman2211
Omegaman2211's picture

It is not the role of government to take money from me to give to others. No matter the circumstance. Sorry!

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:47 | 4441493 FreeMktFisherMN
FreeMktFisherMN's picture

Join the anarcho-capitalist club. ALL statism is coercion and theft. That is the definition of the state. It is not done on a voluntary basis like in the private sector; it is done at gunpoint. 

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 02:36 | 4441561 Seer
Seer's picture

I don't join anything, but if I did :-)

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 03:34 | 4441605 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

Joining the club means quitting ALL clubs.

You get into YOURSELF by getting out of the Collective.  It's not about selfishness; it's about escaping repression and discovering your ability to be self sufficient and happy with yourself without suffering under endless shifting expectations many of which cannot be met even if You tried... 

There is a point where it becomes a spiritual journey.  Really.

You will never be so free as when You realize that You no longer require that Other People sanction your actions.

You don't have to give up love either, on the contrary; just repudiate the social constructs and impositions of guilt usually associated with it.  You don't have to have love to exist.  Free will.  You can actually fall in love instead of being pushed around by it.  Nature stops being your stern mother and becomes a foolish little sister.  

-Chesterton was right as far as I'm concerned.  Even if You believe in Christianity You can set yourself free because Christianity is older than humanity.  God was there before the world began.  Goodness is older than social orders or collectivism.  Goodness is the Relic.  The joy does not require other people.  You can still have all that human interaction if it is functioning around You and works for You; but, You don't have to have it to be ok with yourself or with God.  God hangs out with abandoned babies and hermits, too...

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 02:35 | 4441559 Seer
Seer's picture

It pretty much became that when the "free army" turned into a "standing army."

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 06:57 | 4441710 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Someone else posted this awhile back:

[quote]

Submitted by Col. David 'Davy' Crockett, US Representative from Tennessee via The
Daily  Reckoning blog,

One day in the House of Representatives a bill was taken up appropriating money
for the benefit of a widow of a distinguished naval officer. Several beautiful
speeches had been made in its support. The speaker was just about to put the question
when Crockett arose:

“Mr. Speaker - I have as much respect for the memory of the deceased, and as much
sympathy for the suffering of the living, if there be, as any man in this House,
but we must not permit our respect for the dead or our sympathy for part of the
living to lead us into an act of injustice to the balance of the living. I will
not go into an argument to prove that Congress has not the power to appropriate
this money as an act of charity. Every member on this floor knows it.

“We have the right as individuals, to give away as much of our own money as we
please in charity; but as members of Congress we have no right to appropriate a
dollar of the public money. Some eloquent appeals have been made to us upon the
ground that it is a debt due the deceased. Mr. Speaker, the deceased lived long
after the close of the war; he was in office to the day of his death, and I ever
heard that the government was in arrears to him.

“Every man in this House knows it is not a debt. We cannot without the grossest
corruption, appropriate this money as the payment of a debt. We have not the semblance of authority to appropriate it as charity. Mr. Speaker, I have said we have the right to give as much money of our own as we please. I am the poorest man on this
floor. I cannot vote for this bill, but I will give one week’s pay to the object,
and if every member of Congress will do the same, it will amount to more than the bill asks.”

He took his seat. Nobody replied. The bill was put upon its passage, and, instead
of passing unanimously, as was generally supposed, and as, no doubt, it would, but
for that speech, it received but few votes, and, of course, was lost.

Later, when asked by a friend why he had opposed the appropriation, Crockett gave
this explanation:

“Several years ago I was one evening standing on the steps of the Capitol with
some members of Congress, when our attention was attracted by a great light over
in Georgetown. It was evidently a large fire. We jumped into a hack and drove over
as fast as we could. In spite of all that could be done, many houses were burned
and many families made houseless, and besides, some of them had lost all but the
clothes they had on. The weather was very cold, and when I saw so many children
suffering, I felt that something ought to be done for them. The next morning a bill
was introduced appropriating $20,000 for their relief. We put aside all other
business and rushed it through as soon as it could be done.

“The next summer, when it began to be time to think about election, I concluded I
would take a scout around among the boys of my district. I had no opposition there
but, as the election was some time off, I did not know what might turn up. When
riding one day in a part of my district in which I was more of a stranger than any
other, I saw a man in a field plowing and coming toward the road. I gauged my gait
so that we should meet as he came up, I spoke to the man. He replied politely, but
as I thought, rather coldly.

“I began: ‘Well friend, I am one of those unfortunate beings called candidates and –’

“‘Yes I know you; you are Colonel Crockett. I have seen you once before, and voted
for you the last time you were elected. I suppose you are out electioneering now,
but you had better not waste your time or mine, I shall not vote for you again.’

“This was a sockdologer... I begged him tell me what was the matter.

“‘Well Colonel, it is hardly worthwhile to waste time or words upon it. I do not
see how it can be mended, but you gave a vote last winter which shows that either
you have not capacity to understand the Constitution, or that you are wanting in
the honesty and firmness to be guided by it. In either case you are not the man
to represent me. But I beg your pardon for expressing it that way. I did not intend
to avail myself of the privilege of the constituent to speak plainly to a candidate
for the purpose of insulting you or wounding you.

“‘I intend by it only to say that your understanding of the constitution is very
different from mine; and I will say to you what but for my rudeness, I should not
have said, that I believe you to be honest.’

“‘But an understanding of the constitution different from mine I cannot overlook,
because the Constitution, to be worth anything, must be held sacred, and rigidly
observed in all its provisions. The man who wields power and misinterprets it is
the more dangerous the honest he is.’

“‘I admit the truth of all you say, but there must be some mistake. Though I live
in the backwoods and seldom go from home, I take the papers from Washington and
read very carefully all the proceedings of Congress. My papers say you voted for
a bill to appropriate $20,000 to some sufferers by fire in Georgetown. Is that true?’

“‘Well my friend; I may as well own up. You have got me there. But certainly nobody
will complain that a great and rich country like ours should give the insignificant
sum of $20,000 to relieve its suffering women and children, particularly with a full
and overflowing treasury, and I am sure, if you had been there, you would have done
just the same as I did.’

“‘It is not the amount, Colonel, that I complain of; it is the principle. In the
first place, the government ought to have in the Treasury no more than enough for
its legitimate purposes. But that has nothing with the question. The power of
collecting and disbursing money at pleasure is the most dangerous power that can be
entrusted to man, particularly under our system of collecting revenue by a tariff,
which reaches every man in the country, no matter how poor he may be, and the poorer he is the more he pays in proportion to his means.

“‘What is worse, it presses upon him without his knowledge where the weight centers,
for there is not a man in the United States who can ever guess how much he pays to
the government. So you see, that while you are contributing to relieve one, you are
drawing it from thousands who are even worse off than he.

“‘If you had the right to give anything, the amount was simply a matter of
discretion with you, and you had as much right to give $20,000,000 as $20,000. If you
have the right to give at all; and as the Constitution neither defines charity nor
stipulates the amount, you are at liberty to give to any and everything which you
may believe, or profess to believe, is a charity and to any amount you may think proper.  You will very easily perceive what a wide door this would open for fraud and
corruption and favoritism, on the one hand, and for robbing the people on the other.
No, Colonel, Congress has no right to give charity.

“‘Individual members may give as much of their own money as they please, but they
have no right to touch a dollar of the public money for that purpose. If twice as
many houses had been burned in this country as in Georgetown, neither you nor any
other member of Congress would have thought of appropriating a dollar for our relief.
There are about two hundred and forty members of Congress. If they had shown their
sympathy for the sufferers by contributing each one week’s pay, it would have made
over $13,000. There are plenty of wealthy men around Washington who could have given $20,000 without depriving themselves of even a luxury of life.

“‘The congressmen chose to keep their own money, which, if reports be true, some
of them spend not very creditably; and the people about Washington, no doubt,
applauded you for relieving them from necessity of giving what was not yours to give.
The people have delegated to Congress, by the Constitution, the power to do certain
things. To do these, it is authorized to collect and pay moneys, and for nothing else.
Everything beyond this is usurpation, and a violation of the Constitution.

“‘So you see, Colonel, you have violated the Constitution in what I consider a vital
point. It is a precedent fraught with danger to the country, for when Congress once
begins to stretch its power beyond the limits of the Constitution, there is no limit
to it, and no security for the people. I have no doubt you acted honestly, but that
does not make it any better, except as far as you are personally concerned, and you see that I cannot vote for you.’

“I tell you I felt streaked. I saw if I should have opposition, and this man should
go to talking and in that district I was a gone fawn-skin. I could not answer him,
and the fact is, I was so fully convinced that he was right, I did not want to.
But I must satisfy him, and I said to him:

“‘Well, my friend, you hit the nail upon the head when you said I had not sense
enough to understand the Constitution. I intended to be guided by it, and thought
I had studied it fully. I have heard many speeches in Congress about the powers
of Congress, but what you have said here at your plow has got more hard, sound sense
in it than all the fine speeches I ever heard. If I had ever taken the view of it
that you have, I would have put my head into the fire before I would have given that
vote; and if you will forgive me and vote for me again, if I ever vote for another
unconstitutional law I wish I may be shot.’

“He laughingly replied; ‘Yes, Colonel, you have sworn to that once before, but I
will trust you again upon one condition. You are convinced that your vote was wrong.
Your acknowledgment of it will do more good than beating you for it. If, as you go
around the district, you will tell people about this vote, and that you are satisfied
it was wrong, I will not only vote for you, but will do what I can to keep down
opposition, and perhaps, I may exert some little influence in that way.

"If I don’t, said I, ‘I wish I may be shot; and to convince you that I am in earnest
in what I say I will come back this way in a week or ten days, and if you will get
up a gathering of people, I will make a speech to them. Get up a barbecue, and I
will pay for it.’

“‘No, Colonel, we are not rich people in this section but we have plenty of
provisions to contribute for a barbecue, and some to spare for those who have none.
The push of crops will be over in a few days, and we can then afford a day for a
barbecue. This Thursday; I will see to getting it up on Saturday week. Come to my
house on Friday, and we will go together, and I promise you a very respectable
crowd to see and hear you.’

“‘Well I will be here. But one thing more before I say good-bye. I must know your name.’

“‘My name is Bunce.’

“‘Not Horatio Bunce?’

“‘Yes.’

“‘Well, Mr. Bunce, I never saw you before, though you say you have seen me, but
I know you very well. I am glad I have met you, and very proud that I may hope to
have you for my friend.’

“It was one of the luckiest hits of my life that I met him. He mingled but little
with the public, but was widely known for his remarkable intelligence, and for a
heart brim-full and running over with kindness and benevolence, which showed
themselves not only in words but in acts. He was the oracle of the whole country
around him, and his fame had extended far beyond the circle of his immediate
acquaintance. Though I had never met him, before, I had heard much of him, and but
for this meeting it is very likely I should have had opposition, and had been beaten.
One thing is very certain, no man could now stand up in that district under such a vote.

“At the appointed time I was at his house, having told our conversation to every
crowd I had met, and to every man I stayed all night with, and I found that it gave
the people an interest and confidence in me stronger than I had ever seen manifested before.

“Though I was considerably fatigued when I reached his house, and, under ordinary
circumstances, should have gone early to bed, I kept him up until midnight talking
about the principles and affairs of government, and got more real, true knowledge
of them than I had got all my life before.

“I have known and seen much of him since, for I respect him — no, that is not the
word — I reverence and love him more than any living man, and I go to see him two
or three times every year; and I will tell you, sir, if every one who professes to
be a Christian lived and acted and enjoyed it as he does, the religion of Christ
would take the world by storm.

“But to return to my story. The next morning we went to the barbecue and, to my
surprise, found about a thousand men there. I met a good many whom I had not known
before, and they and my friend introduced me around until I had got pretty well
acquainted — at least, they all knew me.

“In due time notice was given that I would speak to them. They gathered up around
a stand that had been erected. I opened my speech by saying:

“‘Fellow-citizens — I present myself before you today feeling like a new man.
My eyes have lately been opened to truths which ignorance or prejudice or both,
had heretofore hidden from my view. I feel that I can today offer you the ability
to render you more valuable service than I have ever been able to render before.
I am here today more for the purpose of acknowledging my error than to seek your
votes. That I should make this acknowledgment is due to myself as well as to you.
Whether you will vote for me is a matter for your consideration only.’

“I went on to tell them about the fire and my vote for the appropriation and then
told them why I was satisfied it was wrong. I closed by saying:

“‘And now, fellow-citizens, it remains only for me to tell you that the most of the
speech you have listened to with so much interest was simply a repetition of the
arguments by which your neighbor, Mr. Bunce, convinced me of my error.

“‘It is the best speech I ever made in my life, but he is entitled to the credit
for it. And now I hope he is satisfied with his convert and that he will get up
here and tell you so.’

“He came up to the stand and said:

“‘Fellow-citizens — it affords me great pleasure to comply with the request of
Colonel Crockett. I have always considered him a thoroughly honest man, and I am
satisfied that he will faithfully perform all that he has promised you today.’

“He went down, and there went up from that crowd such a shout for Davy Crockett
as his name never called forth before.

“I am not much given to tears, but I was taken with a choking then and felt some
big drops rolling down my cheeks. And I tell you now that the remembrance of those
few words spoken by such a man, and the honest, hearty shout they produced, is worth
more to me than all the honors I have received and all the reputation I have ever
made, or ever shall make, as a member of Congress.

“Now, sir,” concluded Crockett, “you know why I made that speech yesterday.
There is one thing which I will call your attention, you remember that I proposed
to give a week’s pay. There are in that House many very wealthy men — men who think nothing of spending a week’s pay, or a dozen of them, for a dinner or a wine party when they have something to accomplish by it. Some of those same men made beautiful speeches upon the great debt of gratitude which the country owed the deceased — a debt which could not be paid by money — and the insignificance and worthlessness of money, particularly so insignificant a sum as $20,000 when weighed against the honor of the nation. Yet not one of them responded to my proposition. Money with them is nothing but trash when it is to come out of the people. But it is the one great thing for which most of them are striving, and many of them sacrifice honor,
integrity, and justice to obtain it.”

[/quote]

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 22:21 | 4443728 snr-moment
snr-moment's picture

Corbin Dallas. Lelu :-)

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 01:52 | 4441498 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

So you lean facist.  You want to bail out corporations that will cut their workforces and give bonuses to their CEOs.  Afterall, rich CEOs do not rain make.  What I'm saying is that you can make it rain dollars but water.  They need water.  How about something intelligent instead? 

How about a $100M program put together an inexpensive package of organic seeds from local suppliers around the country and a PR campaign to encourage Americans to step up and help themselves?  Suburbia can plant gardens for fresh and storable fruits and veggies to make up for the lack of production from California.  The local suppliers would likely see significantly increased demand and will need to hire workers.  The new workers could include those displaced by the drought in the southwest.  In this scenario the people who benefit would include those who eat, those who need a job, and local businesses around the country.  I guess that first category pretty much sums it up since everyone eats, even CEOs.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 02:40 | 4441566 Seer
Seer's picture

Kind of jumping in here (not sure of whom you are responding to)...

I'd made the argument to alternative energy folks that instead of lobbying for money they should lobby to kill tax subsidies for existing energies.

Seems we've pushed a bunch of bad practices.  Only so long before it bites us in the ass.

People need to put down the iShit and start adjusting.

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 07:15 | 4441722 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

A) It is not government's money. How will more of something that Government must steal, result in the one resource CA needs, but does not have....WATER. Is the Fed going to do a rain dance?

B) Water, and by extension, agriculture in CA are just another government "solution." Please..no more government "solutions."

Sun, 02/16/2014 - 09:20 | 4441810 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

Bullshit. That water shortages have come to a head should not be any surprise, even for the permanently semi-comatose population of the Left Coast. For decades, the motherfucking leeches in Californication have been sucking the water out of every nook and cranny they get their straw into to fill their swimming pools, run their water parks, squander in back-lot sound stage pools, wash their religious-icon cars, water their lawns and prop up the Mexican economy through ag-worker remittances. Using food fear to continue to prop up that failed social experiment is really scraping the bottom of the empty rain barrel.

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