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Bitcoin Exchange Mt. Gox Is Finished

Tyler Durden's picture


Just in case one was wondering for a reason not to take "Magic: The Gathering Online Exchange" too seriously, here is the latest news that has largely slammed the coffin shut on what was once the largest Bitcoin exchange. From MtGox:

Dear MtGox Customers,


Thank you for your patience this week while we are working on re-initiating bitcoin withdrawals. In addition to the technical issue, this week we have experienced some security problems, and as a result we had to relocate MtGox to our previous office building in Shibuya. The move, combined with some other security and technical challenges, pushed back our progress.


As much as we didn’t want to only provide an “update on an update”, this is the current status. We are committed to solving this issue and will provide more information as soon as possible to keep everyone in the loop.


We are very sorry for the delays and deeply appreciate your kind understanding and continuous support.


Best regards,


MtGox Team

This is what a dying virtual currency exchange looks like...


In summary, all BTC withdrawals re-frozen for another week...blamed on a small group of protesters hanging around out front of the offices looking for their money... another day in bitcoin land...

As we noted when they last froze withdrawals:

Bitcoin is no longer in Phase 1 of its evolutionary cycle. I believe Phase 2 for Bitcoin began in earnest back in November 2013, when the Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs held its first hearings on the topic. Those hearings made it clear that, at least for the moment, no significant roadblocks would be put in place to prevent people from transacting with one another using the crypto-currency. Phase 2 also saw the largest Bitcoin investment to-date, a $25 million infusion led by Silicon Valley VC firm Andreessen Horowitz, as well as acceptance by major U.S. retailers, with Overstock being the most significant. Bitcoin is becoming serious, and serious means serious accountability.


As a free market currency, the market will decide the products required to keep the Bitcoin protocol open and functioning to its highest potential. The disruption of Mt. Gox will be another test for Bitcoin. A test which certainly represents a psychological challenge, but probably not much more than that. Bitcoin will survive and come out of this stronger than it was before, just as it has done so many times in the past. However, I do not believe Mt. Gox will be so fortunate.


For Mt. Gox though, I think it’s pretty much game over.

As Max Pelham noted (Coinwatch),

"People will be leaving Mt. Gox either way, the trust isn't already very high, and with this now people are going to trust them even less,"


"I think Mt. Gox is going to lose relevance even more now, they're not very forthcoming in their public relations, their technical problems and their withdrawal problems aren't going away. Even if they fix it now, the withdrawal problem still remains with USD and Euro withdrawals."


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Thu, 02/20/2014 - 12:45 | 4457697 BTCTalks
BTCTalks's picture

Not a dying virtual currency.  A dying virtual currency exchange.  Still trading $580 elsewhere.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 12:46 | 4457704 fonestar
fonestar's picture


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 12:49 | 4457713 Ignatius
Ignatius's picture

Here already?  You were tipped off.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 12:51 | 4457722 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture

I'll buy my first bitcoin (or some other virtual currency) as soon as Fonestar turns bearish.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 12:53 | 4457740 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Well you could call fonestar bearish in the near-term.  Looks like Bitcoin should go down into $400s - $500s before something sends it rallying again.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 12:56 | 4457750 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

Look, this is stupid. Bitcoin is not selling for $100, or whatever. That is the quoted price on MtGox because they don't deliver, and have no trust - on virtually every other exchange, you're looking at paying around the $500 mark.


$580 atm.


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:01 | 4457796 Groundhog Day
Groundhog Day's picture

Is their an arbitrage somewhere in shit coin

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:08 | 4457838 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

Yeah, just as there's an arbitrage in buying physical gold on Honest Joe's Gold Exchange. They appear to selling totally legit gold at $240/oz. You can then buy this, and sell it on just about anywhere else.

But of course, Honest Joe's doesn't allow you to actually cash out your gold at present time. Please check back later.


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:15 | 4457886 BaBaBouy
BaBaBouy's picture

I Hope Some At Least Heeded The Warnings HERE, Months Ago.

USD HardDrive Virtual Fiat Currency Will One Day Will Also Have Its MT-GOX Day...

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:42 | 4458017 Stackers
Stackers's picture

Small group of protestors at MtGox ?


It was 2 guys in a lawn chair


MtGox got screwed out of double sending bitcoins because their exchange software was flawed. They now do not have the bitcoins to cover customer accounts. So they froze withdraws of bitcoin. What people are trading on MtGox are Goxcoins, because it does not have the BTC to send out into the blockchain upon request. They are probably trying to quietly buy bitcoins from miners and other exchanges in a last ditch effort to remain solvent. They've lost market confidence at this point though, so stick a fork in 'em.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:48 | 4458095 Pladizow
Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:16 | 4458286 BaBaBouy
BaBaBouy's picture

Anyone Know???

Whats The MELT-VALUE Of The BTC Mining Servers Today???

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:25 | 4458369 wallstreetapost...
wallstreetaposteriori's picture


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:44 | 4458504 layman_please
layman_please's picture

whoever can get their bitcoins out of mtgox is making a killing. considered there is no regulation on bitcoin exchanges, guess who can profit most of this arbitrage? i'm sure they have to move again soon.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:26 | 4458698 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Come to think of it, has Zerohedge ever posted any bearish articles on Bitcoin?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:49 | 4458867 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

They don't need to, that is why the rest of us are here. To make sure everyone is aware that it's a scam.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:54 | 4458893 fonestar
fonestar's picture

It seems that you are doing a great job of just the opposite, letting everyone know you're morons as Bitcoin continues its heroic and parabolic victories against nationalist fiat!!

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:58 | 4458908 whatthecurtains
whatthecurtains's picture

Exchanging one worthless fiat currency for another is no fucking victory

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 17:12 | 4459228 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Learn what fiat means moron.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 23:17 | 4460630 mjcOH1
mjcOH1's picture

I do believe Mt Gox had a better business model being a Magic card middle-man.   The cards had a BTU value.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 17:12 | 4459231 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Learn what fiat means moron.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 18:33 | 4459527 akak
akak's picture

Learn not to spastically pound the "Enter" key like a meth-addled monkey with ADD.

Or don't they teach that skill in troll school?


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 16:28 | 4459043 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Is that why BTC still has not recovered from the last smack down?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 17:13 | 4459238 fonestar
fonestar's picture

BTC does not get smacked down.  BTC lays the smack down.

Fri, 02/21/2014 - 00:37 | 4460824 prains
prains's picture

fools rush love a good boning!!

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:57 | 4458901 zaphod
zaphod's picture

If MtGox happened with dollars or yen, the central bank would print money out of thin air to make customers whole. In the processes robbing from everyone else.

But in Bitcoin world there is no central bank to print. Instead customers who were dumb enough to leave funds with MtGox are the ones who lose there money, while everyone not involved remains uneffected. 

That is how it is suppose to work, that is how it worked with banks under a gold standard. 

TL;DR The bitcoin system is less of a scam than fiat and this MtGox situation demonstrates that.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 16:00 | 4458918 OpenThePodBayDoorHAL
OpenThePodBayDoorHAL's picture


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 16:27 | 4459040 dogbreath
dogbreath's picture

<----  have never traded BTC in any way

<-----  are a BTC Trader/user

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 17:14 | 4459247 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Your post (as is your reasoning) is squiggled.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 16:29 | 4459049 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Sorry, the first thing that says it is a scam is the fact that no one actually knows who created it.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 17:57 | 4459402 Pure Evil
Pure Evil's picture

Saying something is less of a scam than something else is like voting for a politician you think is less evil than another one.

There is no lesser of two evils, just like a scam is a scam.

Fri, 02/21/2014 - 00:16 | 4460785 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Nowhere have I contested that.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:35 | 4458789 Oldballplayer
Oldballplayer's picture

Ah huh...they cannot get the coins off the exchange. THAT is the issue.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 17:49 | 4459370 Miffed Microbio...
Miffed Microbiologist's picture

Now wait just one minute wallstreetp, I actually had a work associate put a sizable part of his retirement in Beenie Babies so have some frigging sympathy for crying out loud. He actually went on disability later with chronic diarrhea due to stress. We must not take joy in another's suffering..... Oh hell, I just can't do this, I'm laughing so hard I may pee myself.


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:08 | 4458660 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

About the same as the meltdown value of 5,000 Microsoft Office 2013 DVDs. Or 2,000,000 Microsoft Windows license code paperslips.

But they might not have any worth in your universe, either. Millions of business managers would tend to disagree, however.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:45 | 4458036 redpill
redpill's picture

As long as people expect to be able to freely transfer their bitcoins to dollars and vice versa, it will be a very volatile and vulnerable system.  The only way Bitcoin would work is if it got beyond the need for such large centralized exchanges that by definition have an identifiable physical location and thus not out of reach of government.  Unfortunately, government will never allow Bitcoin to get to that point, and if anything it will gladly play along with a little charade of letting people think it's gaining momentum all the while ensuring they get their hands on every bit of personal information that goes through these exchanges.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:17 | 4458295 wintermute
wintermute's picture

peer-to-peer decentralized exchanges are being developed.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:30 | 4458395 Jack Napier
Jack Napier's picture

Meanwhile the spooks are secretly very happy that people will have the false notion that they are one-upping the man with what they perceive to be their own free will, while the powers pretend to fight against a digital currency that is in actuality the slavery to the grid and the substitute for real money which they were going for all along.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:51 | 4458551 Supernova Born
Supernova Born's picture


Update to Windows 8.1 and then try to turn off Wifi (or new Android updates).


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:09 | 4457839 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

my first double post! how exciting!

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:04 | 4458210 firstdivision
firstdivision's picture

You got Mt Goxed

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:08 | 4458233 fonestar
fonestar's picture



So help fonestar understand this.... 

Silver goes from $12 - $21 in five years.

Bitcoin goes from $0 - $500 in five years.


So fonestar should get rid of his Bitcoin?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:14 | 4458262 jcaz
jcaz's picture

You only have one?   I thought it was three.....

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:15 | 4458270 fonestar
fonestar's picture

One what?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:21 | 4458326 HyBrasilian
HyBrasilian's picture

molecule in your brain ~ which happens to be located in your ass...

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:33 | 4458442 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Reccomend you read up on the divisibility of Bitcoin.  You'll need to figure out how many satoshi you can get for your copper pipes some day.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:20 | 4458710 HyBrasilian
HyBrasilian's picture

Frankly ~ I'm more interested in my copper pipes [especially the ones LESS buried, uninsulated, &/or exposed to this BRUTALLY COLD winter]...


But I'm sure YOU'RE so clever [in the BASEMENT you live in], that you'd already advised your mom to upgrade... [Which will prevent your 'hotpockets eating' SHIT from busting loose & spilling onto your keyboard, & will ensure you have enough FARADAY CAGE wire from nuking your 'wallet']...

Thanks MOM!

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:33 | 4458771 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

Perhaps you should spend more time playing online XBox games, rather than attempting to engaging in debate? Your juvenile selection of words and sentence construction frankly fit right in.


Fucking pathetic.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:41 | 4458788 HyBrasilian
HyBrasilian's picture

@ EK ~ Got anything relevant to add on the viability of BITCOIN & how it's ABSOLUTELY the future we should inWest the accumulated, & fractionally represented [notwithstanding 'technical' hurdles] holdings of the 'LABOR' that we've produced over the past "X" years?... [mother's notwithstanding]...


Here I was HOPING somebody would :-(

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:41 | 4458828 fonestar
fonestar's picture


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:51 | 4458847 HyBrasilian
HyBrasilian's picture

Keep 'channeling' your wisdom dweebZOID... [You're helping Zero Hedge to be the #1 financial blog on the planet based on your INSIGHTS ~ & because ZH <3's YOU & HATES others ~ whom are summarily BANNED]!... The world NEEDS MORE dewwbs like you!... ALAS ~ sigh! :-(


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:38 | 4458460 Jack Napier
Jack Napier's picture

So help fonestar understand this.... Silver goes from $12 - $21 in five years. Bitcoin goes from $0 - $500 in five years. So fonestar should get rid of his Bitcoin?

Pretty simple. Past performance is no indication of future results. You didn't take econ 101 apparently.

In the future, do you really want to be holding something that only has value as long as you have Internet access (executive order controllable) and electricity (semi-executive order controllable), or do you want something that you control? Again, pretty simple.

The only question I have is whether you're a shill or a sheep.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:39 | 4458485 fonestar
fonestar's picture

You didn't take econ 101 apparently.

There's fonestar's lulz for the day, thanks! 

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:42 | 4458499 Jack Napier
Jack Napier's picture

I am the Joker after all ;]

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:23 | 4458730 g speed
g speed's picture

sell high --buy low---duh

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:50 | 4458558 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Arguing that the internet is going to be shut down and therefore you shouldn't own bitcoin is like thinking that "The Road" was a documentary and that there is a way to shut down all human commerce permanently.

Also, your bitcoin is still there when the electricity and internet come back on.  Hell, it's still there when you flee the country as its economy collapses from the executive doing something extraordinarily stupid like shutting down the internet.

Have fun crossing borders with all your gold shoved up your ass.  Might want to get some nice rounded taels for that purpose.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:19 | 4458703 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

An oz of gold up the arse might be enough to bribe the border guard.  How will you do that with btc up your... oh wait.  Nevermind, you can't.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:25 | 4458741 tmosley
tmosley's picture

>Implying you can't own both gold and bitcoin

>Implying I'm not the most wildly bullish PM owner on the planet

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:52 | 4458887 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

To own something requires posession. You can't own something that doesn't really exist. ;-) Someday you children will figure it out Mosley.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:27 | 4458752 HyBrasilian
HyBrasilian's picture



That's your SUMMARY 'bitcoin' argument?... Are you stuck in 201o?... When your ZH posts were relevant?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:51 | 4458880 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Haha, oh wow, are you that homeless name changing PM troll guy from back then?  You sure sound like him.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:56 | 4458900 HyBrasilian
HyBrasilian's picture

nope... not THAT one...


Actually ~ my question would be this... If you were NEVER kicked off of 'ZH' ~ WTF good are your comments anyway [when the s*** REALLY hits the fan]?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:21 | 4458276 akak
akak's picture

Fonestar, forgive them, for they know not what they are trading.

Mt. Gox, Mt. Gox, why hast thou forsaken me?

Fonestar, into thy hands I commit my bitcoins.

(B)It(coin) is finished.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:22 | 4458339 HyBrasilian
HyBrasilian's picture

blobbing down...

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:07 | 4458641 akak
akak's picture

Ah, in US 'american' bitcoinism, the pump-and-dump is all.  Monolizing of the fonestardational means to the nth degree and duplicitously seeking symmetry with precious metals, that is the mattering thing, the crustiest bit of it.  Make me laugh.

But hey, when the parangong of bittrolling is on the loose, watch where you step on the virtual roadside.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:36 | 4458456 fonestar
fonestar's picture

A little butthurt about your underperforming shiny metal?  An intelligent investor might re-examine their position, not that fonestar is accusing you of that or anything....

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:44 | 4458512 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

I wonder if you ever think about the people who take you seriously about this stuff and get hurt.  I know it's all fun and games being an internet troll, but I'm wondering if it ever bothers you.

Somewhere out there you HAVE hurt people.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:08 | 4458657 fonestar
fonestar's picture

If $16 to $550 BTC is your definition of "hurt", please hurt fonestar some more and he will hurt others!!

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:57 | 4458904 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Except at one point it was at what level with the hype, so how many people are in the negative now listening to your idiocy?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 17:47 | 4459360 chemystical
chemystical's picture

"$16 to $550"

If you truly bought in at $16 (and I am skeptical because while you claim to have been touting Btc here for years - plural- - you have NEVER answered the challenge to post a link to those touts)...then you need to consider the other perspective:  $1250 to $550. 

You sound lke the degenerate gamblers who hit a little win streak and then claim they're playing with house money.  That is complete bullshit.  The moment it's in your hand it's YOUR money that YOU'RE losing.

Of course, you're a true believer, and would never sell your precious.  Oh, wait, you once posted that you sold at $200 to pay some bills, and then a few months later bought in at $800.  Sell low; buy high.  What an astute investor.

Later you posted that you'd never sell and wil only buy buy buy.  After that "..never..." post, I had to remind you and ZH that you are full of shit, and I'm doing so again.

Not a pot to piss in.  Utter failure to back up your claims.  And such an astute investor.  Also let's not forget that you've posted multiple time that you don't give a fuck what the avg Joe or Jane thinks about your precious - completley ignoring the fact that precious' value and future prospects depends on a larger user base.  You've also posted that you wish everyone would sell their that you could buy them.  Insert same logic re how markets work, and how you are oblivious to logic.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 22:59 | 4460553 jcaz
jcaz's picture

Pretty much sums up Foney-  you left out his various claims of working for Cisco and possessing some form of financial sophistication,  neither of which is remotely apparent from his childish rants-

Classic story-  dude invests $200, turns it into $1100, and he pees himself....  Now he deludes himself into believing that he can single-handedly pimp the valuation of BitCoin and never have to leave his parent's basement ever again.

Sad part is tha most of the ZH'ers understand and respect the theory of BitCoin- but we have NO respect for just another pump-and-dumper, looking to make a quick and easy buck;

Get to work, Foney-  your 15 mins are almost up,  you aren't seeing the big picture with MtG.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 17:52 | 4459377 chemystical
chemystical's picture

"Bitcoin Foundation Opens Nominations for Empty Board of Directors Seat."

Nominate yourself!  What could possibly go wrong with having you as a de facto spokeperson?  Let us know when they accept you.  Shorting opportunity deluxe.  Now THAT'S a get-rich-quick scheme with rock solid foundation.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 18:01 | 4459414 sheikurbootie
sheikurbootie's picture

With a name like Magic: The Gathering Online Exchange the whole thing was going to fail from the start.  What a bunch of bridge buyers.  Bitcoin was the stupidest idea on the planet.  Mining!? , no it was a sucker get rich quick scam.  I have no sympathy on this one.   None. 

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:44 | 4458513 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:22 | 4458726 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

Metal prices are still low.  The crisis hasn't hit.  Btc high, by it's own historical standards.  When the crisis comes will metal or btc appreciate?  Probably both.  When the crisis comes and the internet is locked down which will be useable?  If both are useable then will TPTB be able to track you down by your purchases?  If you use metals, probably not.  Since I know what a sniffer trace looks like, I won't say the same about btc.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 18:05 | 4459427 chemystical
chemystical's picture

"Btc high, by it's own historical standards."

Jesus Tap Dancing Christ you folks have extremely selective and self-serving criteria.  Yeah, and I'm older than I was when I was born.  Do you people seriously believe the bullshit you spout?  Here, have some objectivity.

Btc has a whopping 5 yr history, and the only real history in terms of today's market is at most 6 months old (when it hit $100).  History?  That's a crock of shit.  99.999% of the world never heard of it until 6 months ago.  The market and the players have changed, the dynamics have changed, and "history" is as laughable as the maroons who can't stop posting: "It will rebound; it always has" or "we've seen this pattern several times".

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 16:13 | 4458981 sleigher
sleigher's picture

I will take them



Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:19 | 4458300 Citxmech
Citxmech's picture


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:34 | 4458448 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

"So fonestar should get rid of his Bitcoin?"

Yes before he losses everything.  Harbanger got in at 300 and milked the waves all the way to 1100 for many ounces of PM's which he now owns.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:37 | 4458467 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Harbanger needs to meditate on the fundamental reasons why Bitcoin is $550 today, what that means and where this is going?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:24 | 4458733 Crash Overide
Crash Overide's picture

"So help fonestar understand this....

Silver goes from $12 - $21 in five years.

Bitcoin goes from $0 - $500 in five years."


The only thing you need to understand about this is Gold and Silver have 6,000+ years of history behind it and it doesn't require electricity or an internet. We will see where Bitcoin is 5,995 years from now.

Just saying...

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:27 | 4458753 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Or you could, I don't know, use your brain to figure it out.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:28 | 4458756 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Where are you going to be in 5995 years?  Did you talk to your financial planner about this and your cosmic-reincarnational investment plans?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 16:00 | 4458917 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Yes, show everyone your true colors. Demonstrate that you are in reality a Keynesian Fatalist like the monetarists.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:49 | 4458552 firstdivision
firstdivision's picture

no, i think you should sell all your possessions and put it in bitcoins so that in 5 years you'll be the wealthest person on the face of the earth

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:30 | 4457860 BaBaBouy
BaBaBouy's picture


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:02 | 4457807 johnQpublic
johnQpublic's picture

Well you could call fonestar bearish in the near-term.  Looks like Bitcoin should go down into $400s - $500s before something sends it rallying again



like what?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:06 | 4457831 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Bail-ins.  Capital controls.  QE.  Devaluations.  War. 

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:09 | 4457848 Big Corked Boots
Big Corked Boots's picture

All of those are good for gold and silver.
Sorry, it was fun while it lasted.... too bad I missed out on that ponzi.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:11 | 4457859 fonestar
fonestar's picture

So when did Bitcoin end shitsferbrains?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:14 | 4457881 Big Corked Boots
Big Corked Boots's picture

Credibility, dude. Gone.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:18 | 4457900 fonestar
fonestar's picture

How about just answer the question?  What happened to Bitcoin?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:48 | 4458090 bonderøven-farm ass
bonderøven-farm ass's picture

 What happened to Bitcoin?

Perhaps a loss of faith? 

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:10 | 4458195 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Do you follow Bitcoin?  Participate in any development of online projects?  Contribute anything?  Code anything?  Do you have a clue what goes on in Bitcoin?  Face it, you're the ZH equivalent of the alpha-waved CNBC viewer.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:50 | 4458561 bonderøven-farm ass
bonderøven-farm ass's picture

Oh, I've struck a nerve.  

Mama's upstairs if you need a Hot Pocket or a shoulder to whine on.

I do believe you are falling apart..... 

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:00 | 4458614 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Why would fonestar be falling apart moron? 

fonestar has never even traded on or used MtGox before.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:27 | 4458749 ThirdWorldDude
ThirdWorldDude's picture

It's never too late to start.
Foneystar should buy, buy, buy bitcoin like crazy while Mt. Gox is relocating the servers and BTC's price is so artificially low.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:32 | 4458768 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Bitcoin's price is only down about 7% from yesterday.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:38 | 4458807 ThirdWorldDude
ThirdWorldDude's picture

That's what I'm talking about, man. Back up your Lego trucks now, all of them!

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 17:41 | 4459339 jcaz
jcaz's picture

"Bitcoin's price is only down about 7% from yesterday."

Then why aren't you buying instead of pimping on this site?

Only fools talk their book, Foney-  or maybe they didn't cover that in the Cisco janitorial school.....

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 18:14 | 4459457 chemystical
chemystical's picture

"..only down 7% from yesterday". 

The problem that you choose to ignore is that if you said the same thing every day for the last 14 weeks you'd be correct much more often than not.  That slide from $1250 to $550 over that same duration is what you need to pay attention to...unless of course you're here simply trying to lure more children into your gingerbread house.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:35 | 4458454 Lionhearted
Lionhearted's picture

Fonestar = Deer in the headlights. SELL! SELL! SELL! Show me the money.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:20 | 4457916 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

You seem unable to comprehend the difference between Bitcoin, and a Bitcoin exchange.

Just as there's essentially no difference between a supermarket and a tomato.


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:31 | 4457984 superflex
superflex's picture

Or a flower shop and a tulip?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:39 | 4458042 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

Or that, yeah.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:37 | 4458473 Lionhearted
Lionhearted's picture

Google "Tulip Mania" and compare Bitcoin. LOL

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 16:32 | 4459060 sleigher
sleigher's picture

The best part of bitcoin has been lost on so many at this site.  Yes it appears a fad and rose very quickly, but Bitcoin versus bitcoin are 2 different things.  The bitcoin itself being a unit with some value attributed to it is interesting, but it is Bitcoin that is really cool.  A protocol that allows developers access to an API to come up with all sorts of new and interesting ways of using currency.  It isn't just the satoshi or bitcoins that are the rage.  It is the other side, the programmable side that is what is important.  

Yes if they turn off the internet or the power then it is useless.  But if that happens, all (most) of you will have much bigger problems to contend with.  I doubt many will worry much that they lost their bitcoins in that world.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:48 | 4458102 donsluck
donsluck's picture

Escape and Super, the idea that the exchange does not affect the currency is whistling in the wind. It's like thinking the open bankruptcy of BofA will not affect the value of the dollar. Think back to 2008 and the extraordinary efforts to prop up the banks to defend the dollar (still ongoing). BTC does not have the backing of the most powerful nation on earth.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:51 | 4458128 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

I seem to recall the USD surviving the demise of Lehman Brothers.


Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:01 | 4458193 donsluck
donsluck's picture

Please see the last sentence of my previous post.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:02 | 4458201 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

To think there should be some sort of central authority standing idly by, ready to "prop up" failing bitcoin institutions is MASSIVELY missing the point of bitcoin.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:29 | 4458411 donsluck
donsluck's picture

Escape, we are not discussing what SHOULD be. We are discussing what IS. We are talking about power. Raw, killing, torturing, bombing, destablilizing, starving POWER. That is what currency relfects. And the ones who control the currency, control the power. BTC will not be allowed to continue.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:51 | 4458567 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

The problem with women and manginas is that they confuse the terms of "should be", "would be", and "could be" as if it were when it is so apparent that...




They live in a fantasyland and not in reality. That is the reason that women NEED men.


But if only...

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 16:05 | 4458945 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Most wouldn't know a man if one beat the piss out of them.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 17:22 | 4459272 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

You got that right!!!

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:04 | 4458629 EscapeKey
EscapeKey's picture

Fiat money has been defined variously as:

  • any money declared by a government to be legal tender.[1]
  • state-issued money which is neither convertible by law to any other thing, nor fixed in value in terms of any objective standard.[2]
  • money without intrinsic value that is used as money because of government decree

Congratulations, you're describing fiat currency. Again, a total whoosh goes over your head in regards to bitcoin.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:26 | 4458744 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

BTC will not be allowed to continue unless it it proves useful as an intel tool.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:16 | 4458277 firstdivision
firstdivision's picture

Don't confuse illusion with reality.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:25 | 4458364 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Don't confuse virtual with fake, or tangible with real.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 16:11 | 4458970 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Pretty sure if I have my hands around your throat it means you are real.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:17 | 4458288 tmosley
tmosley's picture

MF Global failed.  Does that mean gold and silver failed too?

Bitcoin, like gold, doesn't need backing.  It's value is in its use as a trade token in commerce.  The ability to transfer huge sums of money for pennies without a trusted third party or any government intervention is the strength of bitcoin.  It will survive, and it will gain further adoption.  The genie is out of the bottle.  Fiat will be displaced. 

Gold for saving, bitcoin for transacting.  Governments need not apply.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:33 | 4458438 donsluck
donsluck's picture

tmosley, PMs are not currency. You probably aready know this. Hard assets always have a value, and are rarely used in exchange, except when exchanged for currency. Currency requires faith. And goverments do not need your permission to "apply".

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:55 | 4458590 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Clearly not a student of history.

Most of the time the hoarded savings asset is the same as the currency.  Currency does NOT require faith.  Only fiat currency does. 

You need to think about the nature of the faith that fiat currency requires.  What is in question about it?  Two things: 

1.  Will the merchant take it?

2.  Will the purchasing power be stolen by reckless issuance?

And yes, the government does need our permission to apply.  If it didn't, there would still be circulating Zimbux.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:09 | 4458661 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

Currency requires Faith as it is a promise to pay. Money does not require faith as it is a realization of the payment in full.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:06 | 4458637 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

I agree that PMs are not currently currency. When the currency dies then PMs will not just act as the Final apex of Exter's Inverse pyramid but that they will function as a currency again.


You are correct that Currency requires faith. You are correct. And Government does not have the power to force faith down people's throats. They can try. But people will eventually overthrow Tyranny...sooner...or later.


By the way. It is the people whom empower Governments. So actually their power rests upon the willingness of the people to comply, the sanction of the people, the support of the people. (There is a word for this and it escapes me at the moment.)


But the idea is clear. We live under a Constitutional Government and not a dictatorship...supposedly. But the Government has overstepped its boundaries to the point that there is an underlying Civil War brewing. That is a reality that you, as a statist, cannot escape.


So yes...Government does need my permission.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:36 | 4458463 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Appears to be where commerce is going.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:00 | 4458188 booboo
booboo's picture

I think you may want to clue escapekey in on your vailed swipe at Buttcoin.

Sun, 02/23/2014 - 01:18 | 4467204 Lionhearted
Lionhearted's picture

If I buy a tomato from a supermarket I better get the tomato when I pay for it. If the supermarket can't give me my money back or the tomato why should I trust anyother tomato supermarket to deliver? Madoff could not return his 'investments' either.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 13:38 | 4458016 tocointhephrase
tocointhephrase's picture

War. Ok Fonestar, answer me this, What do I do when they hit the power stations and I cant log onto my puter? What do I do then, what value does it have at that moment?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:03 | 4458206 Straw Dog
Straw Dog's picture


You get on your smartphone, which you have kept charged using your solar array recharger, and continue as usual.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:28 | 4458345 TheMeatTrapper
TheMeatTrapper's picture

Depend upon your Smartphone?

I've lived and worked in war zones and have experienced civil unrest, third world realities and hyperinflation. 

Money that evaporates when the electricity fails is not money. If your wealth and ability to engage in commerce is dependent upon a free and functioning worldwide global computer network - you are making a serious mistake. 

The problem is not with the BitCoin algorithm, or any of the myriad technical issues that the BitCoin supporters love to yabber about. The problem is that in an uncertain future, people are staking their wealth upon bits, not ounces. 

I lived in Bolivia in the mid 1980's. At one point inflation was 20,000 percent per year. You could go to a restaraunt at night and eat your meal. The waitress would calculate the bill as of that moment, then they would add to the bill an amount to cover the inflationary losses that would occur overnight.

The next morning, the Bolivian pesos got converted into dollars, emeralds, guns, shotgun shells, or anything else that would hold value. 

When cash was needed those hard assets were traded for paper, the transaction was performed, and both sides then reconverted their paper back into physical goods as soon as possible. 

Paper money was used to carry out transactions. Physical goods were the store of value. 

It worked whether or not the electricity worked or not. 

The problem is that we have a generation of kids that can't imagine life without the internet, a smartphone or an XBox. They cannot conceive of such an existence and they will be clueless when those conditions return. 

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:00 | 4458612 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Except it doesn't "vaporize" when the power goes down, or the internet is off.  The ledge exists on every computer on the network.  Your bitcoin returns the second the network comes back on, or when you go somepleace where the power and internet are still on.

If you are seriously worried about a WORLDWIDE loss of internet, nevermind electricity, then you might as well put a bullet in your brain because the only things that cause such things on an ongoing basis will also wipe out the entire human population and most life on the planet.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:12 | 4458680 akak
akak's picture

Tmosley, the pertinent issue is not the potential permanent loss of the internet (although that is a very real possibility), but the likely increasingly centralized (i.e., government) CONTROL of the internet.

To believe that governments will ever allow a real competitor to their fiat currency franchise to exist and expand via the very means over which THEY can (and most likely eventually will) exercise total control is naive at best.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:33 | 4458776 tmosley
tmosley's picture

You seem very willing to bend over and allow yourself to be fucked by TPTB.  Why?  You just love the banks that much or something?

You can make your same argument against gold and silver. 

Governments, despite all their attempts to pretend otherwise, and NOT more powerful than the people, and the internet IS the people.  A truly decentralized internet is under development now, in any event, using the lessons learned from bitcoin.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:53 | 4458871 akak
akak's picture


You seem very willing to bend over and allow yourself to be fucked by TPTB.  Why?  You just love the banks that much or something?

That is a strawman as well as an ad hominem argument and you know it, but it seems par for the course lately for you here in your extreme dickishness. 

The simple fact of the matter is, if it is done over the internet, or electronically, it is trackable by those with the means and the will to do so.  Period.  And NOBODY has greater means, or will, to track every electronic action than our ever-more-authoritarian governments.  You can offer nothing but wishful and head-in-the-sand thinking to counter that reality. 

So, my dear FORMERLY sensible tmosley (who apparently falls for every major "get rich quick" investment scheme), it is YOU who are playing into the hands of TPTB --- by attempting to steer everyone into an omni-trackable cybercurrency scheme. 

Lenin had a name for people like you: "Useful idiots".

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:59 | 4458913 tmosley
tmosley's picture

lol @ akak accusing ANYONE of being a dick.

If you are arguing against bitcoin, you are arguing for fiat currency, since that is the ONLY think it is intended to replace.

"who apparently falls for every major "get rich quick" investment scheme"

lol, so what, are you calling silver a "get rich quick" scheme now?  Your true colors are about as ugly as they can be.

Your dollar transactions are all tracked already, and there is NO way to avoid that, except for doing face to face transactions.  Bitcoin transactions, however, are only tracked to a wallet address.  If you use a fresh wallet for every transaction, you literally can't be tracked on the bitcoin side, because there is no way to correlate the transactions to a person.  Obfuscation services make it even harder.

But you view bitcoin as the enemy of gold, so no amount of logic will EVER sway you.  You refuse to learn new things.  You refuse to change in the face of new information.  You might as well program an akak bot and retire from the internet for all the good you are doing yourself or anyone else.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 16:11 | 4458968 akak
akak's picture


lol, so what, are you calling silver a "get rich quick" scheme now?  Your true colors are about as ugly as they can be.

No, probably for most silver buyers and holders, owning silver was and is simply a means of storing wealth.  But in retrospect, given your "moonshot" hyperbole and predictions of near-term $200 silver three years ago as the price of silver was spiking, for YOU silver in 2011 was clearly a "get rich quick" scheme, just as bitcoin was a couple of months ago.  The pattern is now clear. 

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 17:03 | 4459187 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

It is pretty obvious tmos has become a BTC shill and unsufferable prick here at ZH and over at Turds joint.

Time to tune him out, and keep stacking. Peace and Aloha from Maui my friend...

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:23 | 4458731 WillyGroper
WillyGroper's picture

Try telling that to the people in VZ last week.

Communications were cut off.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:19 | 4458304 tmosley
tmosley's picture

What do you do with your gold when they blow up your house?  Or when you are shuffled off into some camp somewhere?

WIthbitcoin, at least, when the power is restored, or you escape the country, you can still access your funds.  All you have to do is have your private key where you can get at it.  That key is much easiler to smuggle than gold.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:37 | 4458474 TheMeatTrapper
TheMeatTrapper's picture

The same thing the Confederates did. Hide it. Then recover it. 

The problem with your premise is that you expect things to return "to normal". 

In my opinion, that is a fatal assumption. The new normal may not include a free internet. 

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:42 | 4458501 piceridu
piceridu's picture

Confirmation bias is the tendency to seek evidence which supports your views after those views have hardened into religion or pure conviction. 

You must always actively seek out arguments against your own current views.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:01 | 4458618 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Of course.  That is how I went from being a PM purist to someone who values both PMs and crypto.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:34 | 4458784 ThirdWorldDude
ThirdWorldDude's picture

You should get rid of all your PMs and go full retard.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 16:02 | 4458929 tmosley
tmosley's picture

No, I think I'll stick with "Forrest Gump" retard.

Leutinant Dan told me thanks to bitcoin, we don't have to worry about money no more.  Which is great you know.  One less thing.

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 14:45 | 4458520 Herd Redirectio...
Herd Redirection Committee's picture

You escape the country using a goddamn 1/10 oz gold coin, not with some USB stick, and a promise to a prison guard you will transfer him some BTC when you are on the other side...

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:03 | 4458624 tmosley
tmosley's picture

"There is one situation where gold is preferable to bitcoin, therefore never have bitcoins and use dollars where you would have used bitcoins because Yellen's semen is yummy yummy in my tummy."

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 15:48 | 4458863 zjxn06
zjxn06's picture

"What do you do with your gold when they blow up your house? Or when you are shuffled off into some camp somewhere?"

Movie "Shawshank Redemption" comes to mind.


"Andy Dufresne: Red. If you ever get out of here, do me a favor.

Red: Sure, Andy. Anything.

Andy Dufresne: There's a big hayfield up near Buxton. You know where Buxton is?

Red: Well, there's... there's a lot of hayfields up there.

Andy Dufresne: One in particular. It's got a long rock wall with a big oak tree at the north end. It's like something out of a Robert Frost poem. It's where I asked my wife to marry me. We went there for a picnic and made love under that oak and I asked and she said yes. Promise me, Red. If you ever get out... find that spot. At the base of that wall, you'll find a rock that has no earthly business in a Maine hayfield. Piece of black, volcanic glass. There's something buried under it I want you to have.

Red: What, Andy? What's buried under there?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 16:04 | 4458944 tmosley
tmosley's picture

That's great, until those fields are burned and the tree cut down.  Then you can't find it again.

Which is something I always had a problem with on that movie.  They were locked up for a long time.  What if someone had torn up that field for an apartment complex, or a Walmart?

Thu, 02/20/2014 - 16:07 | 4458953 akak
akak's picture

It would appear that burning down a bitcoin exchange is quite a bit easier than tearing down a stone fence and ripping up a field --- which takes actual work.

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