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The "Ukraine Situation" Explained In One Map
Sadly, everything you need to know about the crisis in Ukraine in one worrisome map which summarizes all the relevant "red lines."
Given this - is there any doubt this will not end with peaceful resolution.
As Martin Armstrong warned this morning:
BOTH the USA and EU will now fund the rebels as Russia will fund Yanukovych. At the political level, Ukraine is the pawn on the chessboard. The propaganda war is East v West. However, those power plays are masking the core issue that began with the Orange Revolution – corruption. Yanukovych is a dictator who will NEVER leave office. It is simple as that. There will be no REAL elections again in Ukraine. This is starting to spiral down into a confrontation that the entire world cannot ignore.
h/t JS
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I move we bomb Ukraine with Korean all girl pop bands. How angry can you be moments after having had to violently, suddenly masturbate?
[ They tend to come with fewer of the embarrassing problems you tend to get with your American all girl pop bands. ]
Then, we send in The Bieber to mop up.
I mean... wouldn't you just go home at that point?
Yep Ukraine is butted up against the Balkan Peninsula , home of what was used to start WW I. The European banking families are on top of their game it seems because most will choose not to see how manipulated this is. The debtor is SERVANT to the creditior and that's the way the creditor's want to keep it. Not many who are comfortable in their lifestyle want to sacrifice to make the needed changes so that all people wioll benefit somehow , not just a few.
Three words: WORLD WAR THREE
Negative. Large scale global conflicts with a clear end in mind are not as profitable as prolonged smaller conflicts that span decades.
It's all about ROI.
I may not really be an International Relations expert but I play one on ZeroHedge.
And I stay at Holiday Inn Express.
Very well said.
They read the paper, watch the news, and form an opinion based not on fact/history but a given .gov approved narative.
" Better to keep ones mouth shut, than to open it and remove all doubt of ones ignorance"
good call. They've got cleaner hookers there.
Long Ukrainian mail order bride industry.
History-
The Russkies have been butchering the Ukrainian population for about 300 years. The Czars and the "putins" (aka: the old royal thugs, then replaced by: Stalin & Lennin, Andropov, Kruschev, Putin et.) They have replaced the Ukrainian population with native Russians. Russians are allot easier to control you see. Then, Hitler stepped in and helped for a couple of years in the last century. He wanted to replace the Ukrainians and the Russians with Germans. He took the slaughter to an industrial level. Which is why there aren't enough Ukrainians to fight off these statist punks. Got it?
Well. Now because of all of this "depopulating" a significant percentage of the Ukrainian population, about 50%, are now native Russian speakers. They are obeying the great leader, Putin, and are willing to become part of the motherland again to avoid having their husbands shot, their wives gang raped, and their daughters sold into slavery. They understand their history unlike most Amerikans.
In western Ukraine, we have allot of newly freed Ukrainians, a generation now since 1989, who think being aligned with the west is a hell of allot better than being dead or a boot licking lacky of Russia. They see the advances in The Czech Republic, Slovakia, the baltic states, Hungary, East Germany and they want part of that action (I guess being run by an incompetent EU/US sounds allot better than being butchered for another 300 years and having your history and ethnicity erased. Probably a good decision).
These poor wretched souls have one shot at this. My prayer is that they go Beasty and truely beat the be-geesees out of the "reds" and send them packing. As someone stated on ZH a couple of days ago though, when the Olympics wrap up ole Putin is likely to send in the Spetznaz and wreak holy fracking terror upon the land.
God Bless these people and watch over them.
Remember the Holodomor
Great propaganda asshole, there were no Ukis.. 300 years ago, we were all Russian, Orthodox, Slavs... Ukraine was made up as a country by LENIN (a zionist Jew) and now is being instilled with dumbass nationalism to further destabalize Russia from growing strong again.. as part of the US Imperialistic Agenda.. Ukrainians and Russians are one and the same people our history is mutual (KIEVSKAYA RUS) and your history lesson is a propanda pile of crap.
Your a fucking idiot. You write your own history books dick. Fuck they made you stupid with your Soviet Education. You probably saluted Stalin every morning. What kind of whore gave birth to you Judas....
We could talk about the historical Jewish contributions to Russian society if you'd like. It is actually one of the bright spots. Where a sub-set of Russian people evolved market economics, technical advances, and an incredibly solid family culture that lasted for hundreds of years. Of course, the statists have been butchering them for over 100 years now. Most of the good that was the Russian Jewish community headed to Israel in the late decades of the 20th century. Where they are kicking everyone's ass at science, agriculture, and making vicious war upon their enemies.
Gosh, that might have had something to do with the hideous state of Russia today? Coincidence? I think not. Russia needs US help to clean itself of its great "Red" years. I can only imagine what the collapse of Russia will end up looking like. Whatever it is it will be worse than the pittiful remains of the USSR.
Some of US saw this coming.
That must be some serious weed.
"Russia needs US help to clean itself of its great "Red" years. I can only imagine what the collapse of Russia will end up looking like. Whatever it is it will be worse than the pittiful remains of the USSR."
After people read this, I hope everyone will see that you are an imperialistic scum bag, and no one will take your history lesson serious after this. They are manipulating your mind in the west. I have nothing against the west, but the Western Elite worship the DEVIL. All I can say to you is I wonder how the American people will feel when their own government destroys their own Dollar currency and they'll have their own collapse... maybe then you won't have the time and money to screw up other nations on a daily basis...
We have our problems in the west to be sure Sasha but it is fair to say that the only export that Russia can brag about is Czarist/Soviet Style Tyranny. The Czarist/Soviet "Red" body count just since the conclusion of WWI is about a billion people right now. It makes it a bit sketchy for a world to make progress when rest of US have to spend so much time and resources protecting ourselves and others from the red "ORC"s in the east.
God bless the Ukrainians. I hope they go Lech Walesa and send ole vladimir back to his KGB sh*thole.
Ignorant post..
Czar body count since the conclusion of WW1? None.....the Reds killed the whole family including the little girls.
Soviet since 1917 thru Stalin was never Russians in control.
Useless talkings...You know nothing about the subject....
I'm not so sure that you have firm grasp on things...
A far better grip than you, little girl.
Russia is better off without these jewish emigrees -so would the USA. I'm not anti-semitic, but the Russian people suffered greatly due to the oppression by some very nasty jews -as did Germany and many others. Sorry but that's reality.
It is stunning how many racists are wandering around.
And in the West Bank, they arrive from Brooklyn, walk around with machine guns, and burn Palestinian crops with gasoline subsidized by the US taxpayer.
I'd say the JudeoBolshevik murder of millions and retardation of Russian/Soviet market development had something to do with it. Then losing millions and millions in WW2. Then having mostly Jewish oligarchs rob the country's wealth after the USSR collapsed...
So yes, I'd say {some} "Jews" have had a lot to do with the "hideous state of Russia today". I don't think you can make a colorable argument that they have done more good than harm to that nation, qua group.
As for science, agriculture and making vicious war. Sure is nice to have American money, tech and weapons provided for low or no cost, isn't it?
Anything Israel ever gave to the world it took from someone else, and any good it ever did is more than made up for the harm it has caused.
Great propaganda asshole, there were no Ukis.. 300 years ago, we were all Russian, Orthodox, Slavs... Ukraine was made up as a country by LENIN (a zionist Jew) and now is being instilled with dumbass nationalism to further destabalize Russia from growing strong again.. as part of the US Imperialistic Agenda.. Ukrainians and Russians are one and the same people our history is mutual (KIEVSKAYA RUS) and your history lesson is a propanda pile of crap.
Great propaganda asshole, there were no Ukis.. 300 years ago, we were all Russian, Orthodox, Slavs... Ukraine was made up as a country by LENIN (a zionist Jew) and now is being instilled with dumbass nationalism to further destabalize Russia from growing strong again.. as part of the US Imperialistic Agenda.. Ukrainians and Russians are one and the same people our history is mutual (KIEVSKAYA RUS) and your history lesson is a propanda pile of crap.
Great propaganda asshole, there were no Ukis.. 300 years ago, we were all Russian, Orthodox, Slavs... Ukraine was made up as a country by LENIN (a zionist Jew) and now is being instilled with dumbass nationalism to further destabalize Russia from growing strong again.. as part of the US Imperialistic Agenda.. Ukrainians and Russians are one and the same people our history is mutual (KIEVSKAYA RUS) and your history lesson is a propanda pile of crap.
What we got here folks is fascist Russian shill....
No need to linger, just move along, nothing to see...
BTW, how does Putin's cock taste?
Clean up your mess first though, before answering...
That was really gross.
However, why do I feel like I'm reading an NFL discussion forum every time I peruse one of these Ukraine threads? It might as well be about the Seahawks and the Broncos.
/Suck it, Denver.
Suck it, Denver
Hey! That hurts!
Why can't we all just get along?
because we're carnivores?
flak, I like your style!
remind us what sort of fascist shill you are, Flake?
Just as I figured, you don't even know what fascist means...
\facepalm...
Go ahead prove me wrong...
Really, dude?
After your semen-laced rejoinder to sashko calling him a "fascist", you're going to try to play the "you don't know what fascism really means" card?
The root is fasces, dickbag, not feces.
Why don't you pick and run with one of the many definitions of the word as used in English, and tell me which version you applied to the prior post, and a colorable argument as to why it was a fair application.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism
Then we'll discuss. Until then, you're just a dumb guy pretending to be smarter than the people you call "fascist" when you don't like their opinion on something. Which is about exhibit ZZZZZ in the case I'm building against you as one of this site's most inveterate, reprehensible cunts.
Giving yourself a greenie just shows what lame ass you really are...
Work on that file... we can hardly wait...
I seen fucks like you come and go here for 4 years... Francis Sawyer's fate awaits you....
We on the same page here
Many Lenin Statues toppled last 2 days
History, with heavy editing, sure.
Could you enlighten us as to the ORIGIN OF THE CZARS of the last 300 years?? .........................Please???
And how come they were related to The British lot??
Ron Paul: Ukraine Unrest ‘Their Business,’ Not Ours
Amen to that, brother.
So...
“I would be willing to wager most of the people in the Ukraine would like to see the United States stay out, and they’d like to see the Russians stay out.” - Ron Paul
...when Russia intervenes directly, ZH is going to be a very interesting place to be I think!
You mean in like 4 days? That IS when the olympics end, right?
That is where Ron Paul's foreign policy falls apart. Ideally the US would stay out of this but the Russians won't. You can go back to the time of Peter the Great forward and see how Russia has treated their neighbors in the West and East.
Losers will be the Ukrainian people as usual. The most ardent and vocal critics of Russian policies by no accident has been Poland which is no surprsie. Other other EU foreign policy minister that has really spoke up is Sweden. Finland has been pretty vocal too but that isn't a surprise either.
if the Russians invaded canada, I'd support US intervention'. Ukraine is Russia's backyard -formerly part of the USSR -a barrier against US intervention. We are activley trying to encircle them-with a lot of success I might add. US NGOs are fomenting revolution -They are justified in intervenig. We are not.
Canada - Nyet !!
Alaska comrad - we will retake Alaska very soon - watch this space
I don't think anything is stopping you from hopping on a plane and picking up the first Kalashnikov you can find and jump into the fray.
Unfortunately we make just about everything that happens on this planet our business.
Yes...and to think that "we" weren't right there stoking those embers from the start is naive.
So on Sunday night/Monday morning Yanukovych makes a plea to Putin to send in the Russian troops who are no doubt massing somewhere near Sumy (on the map).
Hey, down-clicker: I'm not saying I want that to happen. I'm saying that's the option remaining to Yanukovych at this point. Do you see any others? Do you suppose Uncle Vladimir is willing to let Ukraine be taken over by whom he sees as Western-financed fascists?
Fuck the down votes.
Its a badge of honor now that ZH is a hangout for some huffpo trolls.
Never a reason why, no logical come back, cowards all.
."What we got here is... failure to communicate"
Iron Curtain 2 - coming to a theater near EU
Ukraine has a huge cultural divide. East of the Dnieper River, Ukrianians speak Russian. West of the river, they speak Ukrainian (sort of a 75/25 blend of Russian and Polish). The voting patterns are just as extreme. East of the river largely support the pro-Russian candidates, west largely support the pro-European candidates. I adopted a boy from near Luhansk. He thinks he is from Russia. The cultural tie is that strong.
The simple solution would be secession. But the pipelines and Putin's ego will not allow that.
Not without violence, I'm afraid. And violence fielded by copious amounts of vodka.
God bless the people of Ukraine
Looks like there is more than one red line.
Yes indeed, lucky for our mighty commander in chief they are not drawn in the sand.
I double dog dare you to step over it Putin.
Okay, enough's enough.
Martin Armstrong is suddenly the world's most important political commentator exactly why?
He doesn't have any *unique* insights into any of this. - you might as well be starting off these entries with "As my cousin Vinnie was warning us this morning..." - it would have the same level of authority. His much-vaunted market calls have been duds, and he's pretty much a nutter. When you read him claiming that in the 80s! (the time of the Amiga and Commodore 64) he had a thinking, talking computer, it becomes clear (to me at least, with a background in both computer programming and molecular biology) that he's probably, at the very least, suffering from mild schizoaffective disorder. Either that or he's of different astral-plane grade intelligence, and should be handing us the secret of over unity energy any day now.
We certainly can ignore it...what alternative other than droning recriminations and sputtering vague threats is really on the table here. As far as I can see, if Russian sent tanks in to quell the violence, there is no response. Get ready for a cold spring Poland, Hungary and Romania as that gas is going to get shut off any hour now.
I DO love how the US Stock market is so blissfully uncaring of anything that goes on in the world...seems to be anticipating a tapering taper as things go from bad to worse...
I DO love how the US Stock market is so blissfully uncaring of anything that goes on in the world...seems to be anticipating a tapering taper as things go from bad to worse...
Comoditys are popin off.
Excuse me for saying so to the fellow Koolaid drinkers on zeroheadge.com
But BERAKING NEWS; Europa regina is defending Ukrainian Koolaid suplys in Kiev as we speak.
Person A; Its good to see all those Europeans protesting in Kiev.
Person B; Ya, they must have all bought a one way bus ticket to get there.
Is this the Anarchist spoon/phase coming out of the Swizz army knife of tricks?
What you got in dat koolaid???
you start with some brevity and freshy grown Sabines, prefurably Alpha–beta pruned, that are beat biastly into 2 seperate peices that resemble a fine dichotomy. This Heterocyclic compound with 2 bags of sugar and a pinch of Ecumenism. There are some other ingredients but there secret.
You can put some fertile Cresent or fruit of the holy spirit on the side of your plate incase the Sabines are out of season.
The lobo brothers, they tent to spike the Koolaid to effect its Transcendentalism and electrifying effect on the blood.
I DO love how the US Stock market is so blissfully uncaring of anything that goes on in the world...seems to be anticipating a tapering taper as things go from bad to worse...
This map is not complete. There two major Nord Stream pipes via the Baltic sea and one by Belarus. There is number of pipes going south as well, so please do not spread panic. Ukraine is still important but not a major route anymore.
There's always the XL pipeline...
Thought that was the case - thanx for clearing that up
I guess I'm too busy to have followed up the subject here but as one of the few open Zionists here at ZH, I can't tell from above which side you think I'm supposed to be rooting for which of course means that you're on the opposite side. Let me know....thanks.
oh that's easy, you're rooting for Nuland, which means her husband Kagan, and the World Bank, IMF, and Nato. You're rooting against Russia and Eastern Ukraine.
Not sure what "zionism" has to do with it. It's more international banking which is, if we can be honest, disproportionately owned and managed, but not completely controlled, by European Jews, who are less than 0.01% of the global population.
Zionism is just Jewish colonial nationalism - the word is misused with great regularity to refer to what is more properly organized/international Jewry...
if you believe in that sort of thing. Personally, I don't even think there are any banking family dynasties, let alone Jewish ones. It's a canard!
Now as to Zionism per se... Likudnik Israel would certainly want to weaken Russia, facilitate a renewed theft of its wealth [most of the oligarchs post Yeltsin were Jews and several fled to Israel] all of which would lessen its ability to support Iran and Syria, which are two countries which provide support to the occupied indigenous population of Israel/Palestine, as well as the people of Lebanon, which Israel plans to reinvade and annex up to the Litani. More acute ethnic cleansing of the indigenous people of Israel/Palestine is also a goal for some.
Hope this helps.
THANK GOD!!!! Obama is in the white house. This would be a real shit show if not...
I am getting the vibe that Klitschko and the "German clique" have outlived their usefulness for their transatlantic friends...good luck dodging the swedish snipers.
So I'm thinking - if we can get hot, proxy wars going in Eurasia, Venezuela and Africa we can smash USD/JPY higher and get the S&P to 2000 by the end of the month. Who's with me?
how does soros,jacob and edwyne rothschild rockerfella skank,kissinger,daddy bush,bresinski or however you fucking spell it.
how do they go on living?
the blood of children for food the screams of kids for psychic energy charging.
fucking demonic vampyres all.
This story will not have any legs until one of the 200 missing Russian nukes that went missing in the Ukraine a few years ago suddenly detonates deep in Russian soil. The assasination of archduke Franz Ferdinand in 1914 started WW1, the detonation of a missing Russian warhead from the Ukraine back deep in Russia in 2014 will start WW3.
BTW, that's what Obama WANTS TO HAVE HAPPEN NOW. He wants to be the new FDR as his legacy. The moment the warhead detonates, Obamacare, the IRS investigations, the corruption of the White House and even Hillary become irrelevant footnotes to history in deferrence to Obama and Kerry.
You mean they're mis-handling of foreign affairs and sheer incompetence couldn't provide a solution.
well SEALs are trained to deploy suitcase nukes, which do and have existed for some time.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/russia/suitcase/comments.html
If such a weapon is utilized in the US or Israel and blamed on Syria, Russia or Iran, there is a very high probability that it will have been done by Israel and/or the US.
Best not to think about it, but it is likely that the Israelis have nukes hidden in the US.
While Russia and world attention were focused on the terror threat on the Sochi games, NATO was quietly preparing to set loose its army of thugs and mercenaries on Ukraine, in the form of the Svoboda neo-Nazi party which enjoys an extensive support base in the country’s western districts.
Since Obama, in his usual mode of operation during early phases of globalist color revolutions , has already warned the Ukrainian government “not to cross red lines” (anyone having a Libya \ Syria flashback ? ) , the smart thing to do would be to take a look at those “red lines” as seen vividly on this map of Russian gas pipeline routes to European markets. Most of the pipes go precisely through the aforementioned western districts. The NATO-Nazi apparatus will try to cut off those routes, thereby suffocating Russia \ Gazprom economically (exploiting Russia’s dependence on Gas exports for much of its economy).
It seems like NATO conducts a scissors maneuver aiming at the Caucasus, which is energy rich and extremely important Geo-strategically. Thus western Ukraine would be a steeping stone towards the entirety of that country incl. much of the Black Sea,which itself partakes in the pipeline strategy.Iran may be a party to the NATO maneuver. Turkey definitely is.
DETAILS HERE
Psst...
Lay off the hash pipe...
This supposed to be what an average store shelf looks like in Kiev
http://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/jesus-watch-kiev-burn-live.286670/page-36
http://gazeta.ua/articles/np/_kiyani-v-panici-zmitayut-tovari-z-polic-supermarketiv/543114
at the State Defense Agency's Cherkasy oblast headquarters, employees started a little book BBQ
http://youtu.be/Niof3OpvWUM
Something" is being burnt inside the interior yard of the Ministry of Internal Affairs in Bogomolets Street Kiev
http://youtu.be/Zj8LI0x4y9I
http://oi62.tinypic.com/2pzisnk.jpg
Somebody expecting tanks?
http://icdn.lenta.ru/images/2014/02/20/23/20140220233617495/pic_7f03b7e664e864cd3251fee436b8051a.jpg
Kiev on 18 Feb
http://varlamov.me/2014/-/rev_2014_02_18_6.jpg
Kiev on 20 Feb
http://oi61.tinypic.com/96yqdf.jpg
More maps
http://zyalt.livejournal.com/
The globalists occupying the US are greater enemies of the United States than they are to the Ukraine.
So how about using the term globalists that are in occupation of the US or some such distinguishing identification when writing these articles.
Can Ukraine close the spigot to Europe? 'We see your sanctions and raise you a gas embargo?'
Soft targets! Awesome.
There's a lot of ignorance on here about Ukraine (although I AM glad to see people have stopped saying "The Ukraine").
Anyone who says this is "only about gas and oil" or "it's a divided country, Russians and Ukrainians, east/west", or "it's a CIA-instigated rebellion and they are all paid shills" etc. is over simplifying the situation.
First, a couple points:
The governments of both countries is utterly corrupt and run in large part by the mafia/oligarchs (same thing really). In Ukraine, the average monthly wage is $250-$300. Life there is the aweful with very little opportunity to better yourself and your socioeconomic situation. If you know the right people, you make it, if you don't, you don't.
To address a few recent claims:
CIA-inspired/funded
I don't really know what is going on there. I don't think anyone really does. It could be CIA inspiured and in some part funded, but a LOT of people are dying there, a LOT of people are helping (taking injured people to their own homes for treatment, volunteering medical aid, medicine, etc.). This is a "revolution" by the people, even if instigated by the CIA. They are REALLY unhappy with their government. Also, this uprising is across the country in all the major cities. This isn't just Kiev. People across the country are mad at their government and see an opportunity to express that and try to force a change.
The country is divided between resident Russians and Ukrainians
Again, this is REALLY oversimplifying. First, a LOT of the people there are MIXED Ukrainian and Russian (my wife is Russian, Ukrainian, Modovan, and Polish). Second, those "Russians" who are there have had their families there in large part for nearly a century under the USSR. They may identify as "Russian" ethnically and by blood, but they don't give 2 shits about the Russian government. Ukrainians and Russians are not neatly divided between the West and East of Ukraine - they are mixed and spread all around.
The real wild card here for me is the support of the U.S. government of this rebellion and condemning the Ukrainian government. That concerns me. I wonder what their involvement in it is.
In the end, all we know is there is a rebellion brewing, and the people are SERIOUS about it. They are dying and still rebelling. They need our support and prayers.
Let's stop the speculation and just try to discern what is going on from the facts (and not facts you read somewhere on the internets, facts that have some real basis in credibiliy).
My credibility - my wife is Ukrainian, born and raised (there until 2 years ago) and we are in daily contact via skype with her family, I was there twice last year.
Thanks and good luck to your family.
No one in Ukraine supports the Russian Government is bad enough...but..
No one in Russia supports the Russian Government?
You lost all credibility with that one...
nonsense
Every Russian knows their government is run by oligarch mafia. Do you think they support that? Joker...
CIA or not, the USA has been meddling in Ukraine. We're shilling for the EU, the IMF and we have sent at least $5 billion into the opposition. Don't believe me? Well, believe Victoria Nuland:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2y0y-JUsPTU#t=476
If we're successful, Ukraine is going to trade one set of corrupt rulers for another, and they're going to get gangbanged by the IMF and the EU while the US gets NATO bases right next to Russia. Combine that with the "fuck the EU" phone call:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qv7qy7jot30
So, we want Ukraine in the EU, but we don't want the EU to set up the new government. This fucking stinks.
Fucking DC cocksuckers.
Zhytomyr and Boyarka monuments of Lenin statue were pulled down
http://static.gazeta.ua/img/cache/gallery/543/543344_1_w_590.jpg
http://youtu.be/Wb-cIt4o2QQ?t=10s
This is what I'm talking about - it is across the country, not just some rabble-rousing paid CIA shills in Kiev.
snipers the bbc says it is the government killing the people just like mad dog gaddaffi.
they allways have the chatham house specialists on talking up the freedom and democracy.
not a squeek on the bbc about libya today nothing about freedom or democracy.
cos all the gold is gone and the country is covered in ge depleted uranium.
today innocents with molotov cocktails are shot in the heart and head the bbc say the army.
nobody talks of frank kitson and his concepts,his books.
low level violence,concepts of pseudo gangs.
nobody talks of the british snipers and the jewish ones remember the sas was captured in iraq.
British special forces caught dressed as Arab 'terrorists'British soldiers have been caught posing as Arabs and shooting Iraqis in the occupied city of Basra in southern Iraq. A group of them was caught yesterday by Iraqi police. They were driving an Iraqi car, wearing Arab clothing, and carrying weapons and explosives.
low level operations gaining momentum in ukraine now worked in kenya long ago.
Frank Kitson explained in his 1960 book Gangs and Counter-gangs:
The Mau Mau Uprising resulted from a grievance that was made up from the whole cloth. As Frank Kitson explained in his 1960 book Gangs and Counter-gangs: "The people of a country can only be made to rise up against the authorities by being persuaded of the need to do so, or by being forced into doing it. Usually those involved in organizing subversion envisage replacing the authorities ultimately, and ruling in their stead...",
Another side to the snipers story
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2PTeUBCPAQ&feature=youtu.be … …
It's for the EU, the mind boggles why the US should care. The EU is an abomination, the Libyan conflict was all about pumping the oil into Italy. I have to be honest but Europe should be thrown to dogs, enough propping up their corrupt, crony and pointless economies.
All Putin has to do, is conscript a huge Russian army and march into Ukraine ala a proper invasion, not quagmire US style war like Chechnya. Which is the West/Russia's paranoia of a dark ages religion like Islam
The next major conflicts will be on mass invasions and stand up fights.
China/Japan conflict any-day now:
http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/687e31a2-99e4-11e3-91cd-00144feab7de.html
http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=uk&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=pl&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fgazeta.ua%2Farticles%2Fpolitics%2F_v-kiyevi-masovo-zakrivayutsya-banki%2F543105
http://gazeta.ua/articles/politics/_v-kiyevi-masovo-zakrivayutsya-banki/...
http://www.donbass.ua/news/region/2014/02/20/v-donchan-nachalas-panika-bankomaty-ne-rabotajut.html
http://yablor.ru/blogs/bankomatnaya-panika-v-donecke/4183645
http://www.segodnya.ua/regions/donetsk/v-donecke-panika-bankomaty-opustosheny-ili-ne-rabotayut-497238.html
https://twitter.com/novostidnua/status/436516186592141312/photo/1 !
http://diepresse.com/home/wirtschaft/international/1565470/Ukraine_Angst-vor-BankRun
Bank run in Kazakhstan
Kaspi Bank depositors withdraw $212 million in a bank runhttp://en.tengrinews.kz/companies/Kaspi-Bank-depositors-withdraw-212-million-in-a-bank-run-26197/
http://www.rferl.mobi/a/kazakhstan-bank-run-information-source-identifie...
http://rapsinews.com/news/20140220/270768117.html
China To Lease 3 Million Hectares Of Ukrainian Farmland
http://www.rferl.org/content/ukraine-china-leases-farmland/25114812.html
junkers gonna junk...
My company and I have long interactions and connections with both Ukraine and Russia. My Ukranian American secretary is skyping with friends in both countries now. THis is what I have heard today. Everyone in Kiev is either trying to get out or is trying to support the protesters. Not only is Kiev's airport impossible to get a ticket out, but they can not get to the airport the road to it is backed up. Today she told me of our closest Moscow family friends reaction was one of dispair at what they see on TV. The Russians that she knows support the Ukraine protesters not Russias public stand. My take is that Putin has boxed himself into a no win position with Yankovitch. So many sad stories. one lady she knows is a mother of a child and still feels compelled to go to the protest to support her country. My previous trips to Ukraine has always shown a people with a painful past and a desperate desire to be a separate country from Russia because of the stallen ordered starvation in their history that killed so many millions. One of my past trips there I was in one of the hotels in the 'maiden square' pictures so I can picture the drama and public pashion there. Another note, the corruption really is rampant there with public officials in obvious and subtle ways. Once my Ukranian speaking secretary went on a business trip there and had a toothake and found that drug stores had counterfit fake pills for antibiotics, and pain. Selling counterfit pills make more profit. So she was in misery until she could return early to the US. Countless such stories in every Ukranian's life there. All Ukranian's not in the government or crime, hate their government leaders as criminals, but strangely are very deeply loving of their country in an abstract nationalistic way. Such a combination of love their country and hate of their leaders has been there for a very long time and is what sets the stage for this emerging revolution. I predict the following with clarity from what I know of Ukranians. Yankovitch can not possibly govern or appear in public. As a public offical he is permanently toxic and uncredible to his population. The Ukranian parlament still has credibility with the public, but their executive branch is seen as a criminal overreach. I also make an easy prediction that Yankovitch will not make it to an early election. Another easy prediction is that Putin can not tolerate looking like a limp di-k politically. His political self image needs to look strong, clever, and commanding, which puts him against the wall with no exit if he continues to align whth Yankovitch. .... note the winter olympics end feb 23 this sunday. Something is likely planned by Russia then.
If You Believe That The Cold War Is Over, Just Look At What Is Happening In UkraineIt's funny how many trolls even in discussions outside of ZH and in various languages are saying that they are have been doing business in Ukraine. Is it a new patterns you got from your masters or what?
How's Ukraine's economy?
Ukraine's western economy is totally fucked, the state is bankrupt and living off of Russian cash handouts. The East has a vibrant economy that trades with Russia, this is where the industry is located. East is industrial the west is agricultural. The economy is in recession, the state is BK. They are about as well off as Greece, except for that part in the east that is intigrated into the Russian economy. They are relatively, well off compared to the west of the country.
Agree again...you are one of few who post here with knowledge and common sense..
S&P just downgraded Ukraine to CCC
Well, clearly the revolution has begun. We do know the game plan by now, as this is nothing new. The USA has already spent 5 billion dollars on the Ukraine revolution. Revolutionary fighters are paid by the EU and USA. In fact, a video at Kievs airport showed a US diplomatic flight loading bales of what could only be money into a steel plated truck. This is the pay for the fighters. Each used to get around 25-30 Euro a day, I believe the they are getting combat pay now that they shooting has started.
I guess most people would know little about Ukraine. I have seen this all before. the history of that region is being repeated. But I can't give a history lecture on a ZH post. I am not an expert, but I have studied Russia history for decades, and that naturally includes Ukraine. Ukraine has been an east west battle ground for centuries and the south, the muslim south of Ukraine has fought there too. All I can say is this is nothing new, just modern actors playing out what has happened numerous times before.
This time you have the USA playing an end game against Russia and Germany is in the lead. Invading the Ukraine twice in 1918 and 1941, they were thrown out both times by the communists. Now Ukraine is an independent state, a very rare situation. I understand the western part wants to join the EU, I think that is a good idea, the people will get screwed, but hey, they want it. The East and Crimea should take their Russian majority and join the RUssian federation.
If the Kiev revolution trys to take RUssian Ukraine, the East and Crimea, they will be defeated on the battle field. If they try with the aid of Western forces, then Russia will not remain on the sidelines.
Split the nation, it never was united, it has always been split east versus west. South versus North.
The EU will get a failed state an economic basket case, which is what the west Ukraine is. Russia will get the much more modern and industrial regions which are populated by Russians and pro Russian Ukrainians, plus the Crimea, never a part of Ukraine proper and itself pro Russian.
If the USA and EU attempt to take it all, they risk nuclear war. Are they that geedy and insane? The 1/2 of Ukraine that is Russian or Pro Russian has been silent, because they have no revolution on their territory. Should the USA send it's revolutionary fighters east, they will die.
Agree...good post
another map for your consideration:
http://data.worldbank.org/country/ukraine
This one will likely also be of some interest:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/77/Ukrainian_salary_map...
A good read about the inner politics of goings on in Ukraine
http://euromaidanpr.wordpress.com/2014/02/21/imagine-you-are-ukrainian/#...
Oleksandr Suhonyak, the chairman of the Association of Ukrainian Banks, addresses the President of Ukraine Viktor Yanukovych in an open letter.
Viktor!There are various reasons for addressing you informally. First, I cite the fact that we are the same age. Second, my wealth affords me that privilege, for I, thank God, am much wealthier than you. Let me explain: my physical needs are met, and I am not concerned with their enlargement.
Why am I writing? I’ve had enough for a long time, as have all citizens.
What do I mean? You have committed many fatal errors.
1) You did not understand that the parasite cannot consume its host. For example, a bug or a tick cannot swallow a bull. You will not swallow the entire Ukrainian nation on which you feed. In language that you understand: greed will destroy the thief.
2) After a review of the Association of Ukrainian Banks by the State Tax Administration in 2013 wherein no theft was found, your corrupt guards quoted your exact words to me: “That miserable Syhonyak considers us thieves, but we’ll show him that everybody is a thief.” God has shown you for three months that there are people who not only do not steal, but who will sacrifice for the common good of the Ukrainian people, which today means release from your parasitic government. They give food, medicine, money, health, and even their lives. You cannot understand this because you are a victim of the criminal environment where you grew up, lived, and worked. Ukraine is home not only to thieves, among whom you have lived, but benefactors, whom you have probably never had occasion to meet.
3) You want to clear out the Maidan with bullets. But Maidan is not behind barricades. It is in our souls, and bullets cannot touch it. It is a spiritual phenomenon. You do not know what that is. You will disperse the people, but Maidan will remain, and the Maidan Council will remain. Ukrainians yearn for a society where thieves are punished and benefactors are encouraged by the government. You did the opposite. Therefore, you shall no longer rule the country.
4) You are a pathological liar. Yesterday, you spoke about setting the date for civic peace, and today you issued the order to fire on the people. Flip through your election advertising leaflet “Ukraine for the people.” Read: “I promise to control the recession and achieve growth of the national economy. I will protect and maintain the stability of the hryvnia. I will safeguard the stability of the state and ensure the execution of justice.”
A liar, people say, is worse than a thief. And here we have both. The trouble is that you don’t even know that this is unacceptable behavior. Negotiations with a liar are impossible. You claim that people are taking over government agencies. No, they are liberating them from criminals, from the overseers, from those who harm the Ukrainian nation with their theft, falsehood, injustice, and now blatant murder. The honest government officials are moving to the side of the people.
What can I advise? You became the head of state and did not become a successful businessman. A different kind of talent is required. You became a parasite on the national body. A huge parasite. A parasite is pulled out when it does not fall off by itself. But you did one great service for society. Being consistent as a real criminal, you gave birth to a true alternative to yourself: the people of honor and conscience that you did not know existed. I pity you. Wake up, Viktor. A different Ukraine is outside your window. Resign!
Party of Oligarchs, wake him up, if you have awoken yourselves. And don’t be afraid. If you are honest, then Maidan will be able to begin negotiations with you. The agenda: what kind of Ukraine we will in live tomorrow.
Oleksandr Suhonyak
This might be graphic - (I dont have good internet to view it)
Radio intercept of snipers sitting on the roofs in Kiev
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IcMmpXhRIw&sns=tw …
all gubmints are corrupt, ukraine, russia, eu , us. so its just a matter of choosing whose corruption u like better. or radical thought screw them all and establish a state based on real values of freedom and independence . now we know that the ptb certainly dont want that . houston , we have a problema
O/T
today's Krugman: http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/21/opinion/krugman-the-stimulus-tragedy.h...
You know, if we invade Ukraine and break all their windows, it will be great for the economy.
Jack "Orthodox" Lew on minimum wage, immigration and Bitcoinlegalizing 12 million people here who are already here {and continuing to maintain open borders and the importation of Indian engineers and coders} will magically help fix entitlements.
Because the economy.
"You know, if we invade Ukraine and break all their windows, it will be great for the economy."
Where would we be without Krugman's wisdom ;-)
oh and let me add, russia in one of the most corrupt pos gubmints in the world. the whole society is based on who u know not what u know. why do u think so many russians come to the u.s. they cant freaking take it anymore . not that the u.s. is some hotbed of democracy thats laughable buts its better than russia
Well, regarding corruption in Russia - the only difference from that in the US is that bribe receivers don't publish the amount of bribes they get and don't call them "political contributions", in other words, corruption is not legalized and publicized, in all other terms its pretty much the same...
Well, obviouisly this is a proxy war of the US & EU against Russia. US and EU are trying to take over control of the territory and gas pipelines, Russia is trying to protect it's zone of influence. Politics like this are as old as the humanity...
Looks like US & EU are using similar tactics in Ukraine to what Saudi and Qatar are in Syria...
And really, they couldn't find anyone with brains not turned into a jello by years of constant beating for a leader - other than Klichko? I guess he has one advantage - easy to control..
Klitschko has three advantages. He is easy to direct, he is a nice Jewish boy, and he is an athlete stud to counterbalance Putin's James Bond image. I think they are having some problems with his lack of on the ground IQ, he needs endless handholding and might not endure as a real hero type like Putin does.
So I'm guessing....
The Jews in Saudi Arabia (the Saudi Royals) don't like the Jews in Russia musceling into their Turf. You can replace Uktraine with Syria and it's exactly the same argument.
It's just like Mafia gang wars
Here's what I see going on:
Right now, the EU and the US are playing hot potato. The EU needs buyers for bonds, and the US snaps them up. In return, the US needs buyers for bonds (so as to pretend the fed is not the ONLY buyer) and the EU snaps them up. Obviously, this is absolute bullshit, but the notion seems to be that as long as they can keep the potato in the air, a solution might manifest, or someone else might fuck up first, creating a vacuum which can be exploited and solve all the problems. Well, the EU seems to think that gas is the solution for them, and seeing as apart from Germany, the rest of the EU is fucked, a great way to prolong it is to spread out that fucking to new partners. Ukraine with gas is just fucking ideal, especially after the whole Syria play fell apart.
Russia, values Ukraine as a strategic partner. Gas can come into Ukraine cheap and leave expensive, with Ukraine seeing a profit, or it can be expensive the whole way and fuck Ukraine entirely. This mainly depends on concessions and alliance to Russia. If the Ukraine joined the EU, it becomes much harder to do this, the lever is gone, the influence is gone. It's not in Ukraine's interest to actually join the EU either, as they are just another lump to add to a melting ball of wax as far as Germany cares.
Now, Germany, that's a good one. They basically blackmailed France into co-sponsoring the EU and sucked in all the easy targets around them with their grand ideas. In the end, who's benefiting from it? Essentially no one but Germany. Nazis all over again, but with economic warfare rather than hot war. Again, they are seeking the gas resources out of western russia, and again they are demanding some more lebensraum, but because they are buddies with the US (they practically were the first time as well), it's ignored and we get this wonderful fake news to explain to the sheep what's going on. The US and Germany conspired to con a bunch of people into buying the lie, unfortunately, as things do, once blood hits the street, the basis of demands shifts drastically and becomes great news. If I convinced 5% of america that something had to be done or it would destroy their lives, and the government refused, the truth no longer matters, there would be blood on the street, and as I said, that just grows to the point where the actual intent is even further obscured. Nothing new really.
So now the smear starts, because in for a penny in for a pound, sunk cost and it's politically impossible to back out and risk the truth coming out.
Well, at least Russia and China won't be wasting money on that black pit. People there will have to accept that it is no longer a gas transit route or an agricultural producer.
Also, it is quite charming that the Germans and Poles still believe that its territorial integrity can be preserved...the USA and Canada have a total destabilization in mind, otherwise the chaos can't spread to Russia.
The only question is to ask now is how long it takes for it to dissolve into an agglomerate with multiple private armies.
There are two parts to the Ukraine The Crimea and Western Ukraine. One is largely employed directly in Russia based industry and banking and the other wanting to be largely with Europe and develop ties there. The Russian component won the last election and will probably win the next. What happens then? Russia and the legitimately voted Ukrainian Government won;t allow interests against majority vote to occur? Will we advocate revolution and blood shed after a legitimate election? Probably. Is that the best thing to do?
Crimea is actually not part of Ukraine historically, the only reason it is now is because Nikita Khrushchev being a Ukranian himself, gave it as a "gift" from Russian Soviet Republic to Ukranian Soviet Republic in 1950s
The west is pushing its luck. Russia is the only country in the world with the means to sabotage the US. That's why they are giving sanctuary to Snowden; nobody else can. I don't get why the US is so intent on antagonizing a country which might take its revenge within 10-15 years under cover of the economic growth buoying East Asia.