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Russia Fires First Retaliatory Salvo, May Limit Ukraine Food Imports

Tyler Durden's picture


Russia represents over 25% of Ukraine's exports and is the divided nation's largest trade partner. As Ukraine remains deep in its self-described "pre-default" state, the economy languishes vainly in the hopes of a trade deal with 'someone' and a bailout from 'someone' else. However, the IMF's first move to bail the nation out has now been met by a subtle punch to the country's kidneys as Interfax reports that Russia threatens to limit food imports on the basis of "veterinary and phytosanitary risks."


Via Interfax,

Russia and the Customs Union could temporarily limit increased-risk food imports from Ukraine, given fears of loose safety control, said Sergei Dankvert, head of the Russian veterinary and phytosanitary oversight service Rosselkhoznadzor.


"My Belarusian colleague and I are extremely concerned about the situation in Ukraine. We do not rule out that curbs could be introduced on the imports of products of high veterinary and phytosanitary risks from Ukraine," Dankvert told Interfax after talks with his Belarusian counterpart Yury Pivovarchik in Bryansk, and telephone talks with Ukraine's Deputy Agrarian Policy Minister Ivan Bisyuk.


Restrictions could also be imposed on transit shipments, he said.


The conditions in which Ukrainian experts are working arouse queries and doubts that their work is being done properly, especially amid reports of African swine fever infections, he said.


Cooperation between veterinary and phytosanitary experts is largely based on trust, Dankvert said. If the conditions in which the Ukrainian service is working do not improve, moreover, if its leadership is replaced, the business contacts, built over the past few years, may be affected," he said. "They were not always cloudless, but our Ukrainian colleagues were trying to work for expanding trade between our counties," he said.

It might seem like an odd reason to suddenly do this but of course the timing is perfect - especally as the anti-Russian provinces tend to be the most agricultural and farming based - as opposed to the eastern (more industrial) regions that are wealthier and more pro-Russia.


But as a reminder, a great deal of the nation's wealth resides in non-pro-Europe eastern Ukraine...


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Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:44 | 4471694 Joebloinvestor
Joebloinvestor's picture

Time for a symbolic air lift again.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:47 | 4471715 gafgroocK
gafgroocK's picture




Whew!...good thing he didn't decide to implement Obamacare on the Ukraine, then it would be an economic gun-to-the-head !

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:58 | 4471742 Cult_of_Reason
Cult_of_Reason's picture

Please "Tyler Durden" tell me you were joking and Putin is not planning Stalin-like Holodomor in Russia by banning/limiting food supply from Ukraine to Russian citizens.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:10 | 4471809 blackholes
blackholes's picture

The Holodomor was caused by a lack of food within Ukraine, not a lack of a purchasers of Ukrainian food outside of Ukraine.

Edit: I re-read your statement, my bad.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:13 | 4471836 max2205
max2205's picture

Damn. Thought they actually fired a salvo. Springs coming

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:15 | 4471839 Looney
Looney's picture

Just wondering... What OUR reaction would be if some other country would be interfering in our neck of the woods, say Mexico or, even better TEXAS?  ;-)


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:15 | 4471848 Cult_of_Reason
Cult_of_Reason's picture

Putin consulted Bernanke and was recommended a parabolic spike in food prices inflation as a "stimulus" for Russian economy.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:26 | 4471900 ThirdWorldDude
ThirdWorldDude's picture

That made me lol... Read and cry, bitch!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:32 | 4471914 Chupacabra-322
Chupacabra-322's picture

Three countries where the Criminal central Banksters do not have a central bank. Russia, China & Iran. Hate to be right but I predicated last week that to wait for a Putin response at the close of the Olympic Ceremonies. Let the fireworks commence.

Tue, 02/25/2014 - 14:25 | 4471960 Thought Processor
Thought Processor's picture

Spot on.   Putin has rolled his sleeves back up.  

I think the chess game is about to speed up.


(edit)  Except for the central bank comment, as Russia and China's fall under the BIS.   Iran?  Has a central bank and is listed as part of the BIS commumnity but, it is an outlier in the way it operates:

After the Islamic Revolution, the Central Bank was mandated to establish an Islamic banking law. In 1983 the Islamic Banking law of Iran was passed by the Majlis.[20] According to this law, Iranian banks can only engage in interest-free Islamic transactions (interest is considered as usury or riba and is forbidden by Islam and the holy book of Qur’an). These are commercial transactions that involve exchange of goods and services in return for a share of the assumed "profit".

Iran has some very restrictive laws that tie the hands of the Iran central bank, thereby relegating it to a basic utility.  Now you understand why the NWO is pressing so hard to hit Iran.   Can you imagine if the whole world ran like this?   At the vey least I think compount interest should be outlawed (interest charged on the interest itself).  

Food for thought.


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 17:05 | 4472262 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Ummm, China and Russia both have central banks...

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 17:10 | 4472285 Chupacabra-322
Chupacabra-322's picture

Yes. Independent from the Criminal IMF, World Bank & Fed.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 17:27 | 4472331 Sean7k
Tue, 02/25/2014 - 14:01 | 4476287 Thought Processor
Thought Processor's picture


True, the central banks might as well be under one banner (BIS).


But there is still a chess game being played by various world leaders.  Or perhaps it's all just for show.....


Does anyone really know anything for sure at this point, given all of the lies and manipulation?



Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:20 | 4472548 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Not the same....

Head of Russian Central Bank is Elvira Nabiallina, of Tatar heritage. Before the appointment to head Russia Central Bank she was trusted Aide to President Putin..


Present Ukrainian Central Bank Head  from Donetsk (Russian side) is removed and replaced by new appointee  from Lviv (EU pole territory)

Anyone suprised?

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:49 | 4472668 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

You slay me with your command of the facts...Putin is a zionist you fool, but I think you already knew that...

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 19:33 | 4472851 Not Too Important
Not Too Important's picture

A Zionist is someone that wants the Jews to have Israel back and build another Temple, Jewish or otherwise. That's it. Are you saying Putin wants to see the Jews build another Temple?

Semitic is a group of people that speak certain Middle Eastern languages, a subfamily of the Afro-Asiatic language family that includes Hebrew, Aramaic, Arabic, and Amhari. Anti-Semitic means you are against people that speak these languages. It covers a lot of people, so it would help to be specific.

Or are you referring to the Jews who share the desire of others to rule the world? They don't live in Israel.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 20:13 | 4473032 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

A zionist is a modern day talmudist, whom seek to enslave all of humanity. Have you not studied the Talmud or the secret teachings? Putin works for his masters, just as Obama, Cameron and all the rest.

Where is the semitic language lesson coming from. I never mentioned semitic or anti-semitic, though that would be high praise, indeed. 

As for what the jews in Israel want, how can we know? Your own teachings allow and encourage you to lie to gentiles, that this is pleasing to yahweh. Or are you ignorant of this teaching as well?

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:30 | 4471924 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

For some reason every time I read one of the (many) Ukraine stories, the phrase "ping pong ball in a hurricane" comes to mind.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:33 | 4471938 MarsInScorpio
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Please, Cult of Reason, tell me you are not going to continue your Brussels' sponsored trolling on ZH . . .


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:01 | 4472471 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Mother drop you on head as infant?

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:14 | 4471843 Headbanger
Headbanger's picture

I think it's great news for the Ukraine people cause they have more food for themselves now.

And I bet they can sell more food to other nations.  So what's so bad about this news?

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:41 | 4471963 Missiondweller
Missiondweller's picture

Indeed, given that we have a drought in CA we may want that food.


Ukraine should tell Russia that given the corruption of the pro-Russian regime they ousted they can nolonger guarantee Nat Gas will make it through their pipelines.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 16:44 | 4472183 fockewulf190
fockewulf190's picture

I doubt all the EU farmers are going to be happy with a deluge of cheap Ukrainian commodities flooding the market.  The last thing they want is more competition.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 17:16 | 4472300 TheMeatTrapper
TheMeatTrapper's picture

The problem with that scenario is that the EU will not allow Ukrainian agri products to undercut French farmers. 


The EU wants to sell the Ukraine debt, not buy their wheat.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:14 | 4471846 Cult_of_Reason
Cult_of_Reason's picture

The man-made famine, Holodomor, was used by the Soviet Stalin leadership in 1932-33 to crush Ukrainian nationalism, and fall under the legal definition of genocide.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:48 | 4471994 blackholes
blackholes's picture

Yes, but in this scenario, Ukraine will have a surplus of food.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:59 | 4472044 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Stalin was a peasant Georgian.  Most Russians cannot stand Georgians.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 17:01 | 4472242 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

Ah, by the way, the guilt through association scheme, overused by neocon shills.

Won't get any answer from the commentator as this guy is your typical neocon shill, that is a propagandist.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 17:58 | 4472459 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Actually was done to Russian farmers also, Grain sold to pay for industrialization for planned wars.

Tue, 02/25/2014 - 04:20 | 4474396 silvermail
silvermail's picture

Only WH Trolls, or representatives of western Ukraine, or a fool, or a graduate of Yale University can claim that: Holodomor, was used by the Soviet Stalin leadership in 1932-33 to crush Ukrainian nationalism, and fall under the legal definition of genocide.

Today, the propaganda lies to us about the events of those years, in every letter.

1. Stalin never struggled with the Ukrainians, it is not necessary to repeat the nonsense for morons on Faux News propaganda. Stalin fought with the class of prosperous peasants, independed of any nationality of them.
Think about this: Stalin fought with the class of wealthy peasants, regardless of their ethnicity. Therefore famine in 30 years was not only in Ukraine, but in Russia, too.
2. Famine in Ukraine in the 30s was in areas inhabited predominantly Russian people. It is south and south-east of Ukraine. Most people died of starvation, were Russian, not Ukrainian.
More than any other, today scream and whine about the hunger, only WH Trolls (as you) and representatives of western Ukraine. But on the western Ukraine famine was not. This is called political prostitution.
Because WH Trolls today are very eager to sow discord between the Russian and Ukrainians. So they constantly repeat as a mantra, their lies about the alleged genocide of Ukrainians. So, they every year grow up numbers of Ukrainians died of starvation. LOL.

3. Note the toll trolls such as for example Cult_of_Reason. This paid WH Trolls are constantly trying to raise the issue of famine 30s.
Therefore, they very much want to sow discord between Ukrainians and Russian. This is their main goal - to push two Slavic people into mutual enmity and hatred. They want to divide this Slavic peoples and after rule over both of them.
Therefore, in any discussion Cult_of_Reason as classic WH troll, always says about "golodomor" and claiming, that it was "genocide of Ukrainians."

Dear WH troll Cult_of_Reason:

I myself have given birth there, where was this events about which you know nothing.
My ancestors lived there, where was this events about which you know nothing and about the which and you so unsuccessfully trying to lie.

Therefore, I in each topic where you will attempt to lie about hunger 30s, I will write the truth.

Fraud, Famine and Fascism - The Ukrainian Genocide Myth from Hitler to Harvard

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:37 | 4471950 walküre
walküre's picture

Maidan coming to Red Square. Putin is going the way of Yanu!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:20 | 4471874 Johnny Cocknballs
Johnny Cocknballs's picture

Jesus you are a fucking idiot troll.

Putin isn't a Jewish Bolshevik, is he, Cunt.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:23 | 4471889 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Welcome to the Skinner Box, Johnny.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:35 | 4471942 Johnny Cocknballs
Johnny Cocknballs's picture

I may be one of the few here that actually has used one.


My research proved rats like food pellets.


Cult should call in to Mike Rivero


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 17:35 | 4472364 Sean7k
Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:54 | 4471751 nuclearsquid
nuclearsquid's picture

'Veterinary and phytosanitary risk'

Add that to the growing list of reasons that will be given to you as you are rounded up into a chain-link fenced reeducation camp.


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:05 | 4471798 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

"Add that to the growing list of reasons that will be given to you as you are rounded up into a chain-link fenced reeducation camp."...

Like Gaza?...

 B.B. and Tzipi wrote the book on how to starve and build chain-link fences for the largest open air Ghetto since Nazi Germany!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:27 | 4471905 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

Perhaps you noticed the article is about Russia and Ukraine? 

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:34 | 4471940 ThirdWorldDude
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Do tell more, does Bibi get angry if his named is mentioned in public?

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:42 | 4471966 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

Anytime you want to include a link of a Gazan starving to death because there's no food in Gaza, go right ahead.  So much for the truth....

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 16:19 | 4472095 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

Like digging in a fricken boneyard...

When the Telegraph reports it you know it's bad considering the source who owns it.

Not to worry though FF.  Like Nazi Germany before you and the United States Government with Trail of Tears and Wounded Knee your among friends!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 17:39 | 4472375 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

Did you really include a link of Palestinians in Syria????    Congratulations, you're a typical ZH anti-zionist commenter!!!!!!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:24 | 4472565 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

Any why wouldn't I include Syria?

You've pushed that one to the edge just like Iraq with the united States military doing "all your heavy lifting".  I forgot Jordan and it's enormous steady influx of refugees because of the shrinking territory that they once occupied gets continually smaller.  Shall I pick any date in your history as a "starting point"?  Perhaps  the Sabra and Shatila massacres under Sharon would be a good reference point even if it only goes back to 1982?!

Sorry friend. As good as you try in your efforts to conceal the lies and deceit they catch up with all of us eventually no matter how hard you try. Just like the U.S.S. Liberty and 9/11 those are your albatross' that have turned on you too many times to count.

You won't win and you can't.  And neither will your partners in crime here in the U.S., EU and England.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:42 | 4472639 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

  You started this conversation with Gaza and you keep moving the goalposts since your argument is weak.   You use the typical anti-Israel tactic of changing the subject each time since the original arguments are all weak to begin with.  Liberty, 9/11, whatever.  Arguing with you would end up being like playing whack a mole.  You can't stick to the starting argument because the facts for each individual piece are always weak.  Even when you mention Jordan above, same thing, nothing to do with Gaza, your starting argument.  Changing the argument with another distortion is all you got.  You're not the first, you won't be the last.   All you need to understand is Israel is getting more popular and more powerful day by day month by month year by year and now that they have energy that Turkey and Greece want, wow.  Even Abbas in the West Bank just made a deal for natural gas with Israel and the P's got a good price. 

What you call lies and deceit in the real world is the exact opposite.  Israel keeps their word with Egypt and almost every time with Jordan (that Mossad thing was a doozy).  That's why Israel has more and more relations with countries around the world.  That's why Merkel shows up today.  More companies keep investing in Israel.  More tourists keep coming.  Calling every deal made someones makes with Israel as a partner in crime isn't how the real world works.


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:50 | 4472673 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

"All you need to understand is Israel is getting more popular and more powerful day by day month by month year by year and now that they have energy that Turkey and Greece want"...

Cyprus joining the EU so that it could be looted?

Such a Deal!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 17:45 | 4472399 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

This is from the first link you sent.  Thanks for proving my point!!!  Israel haters are lazy morons LOL.  You don't even read what you link to.  People like you make it easy to understand Zionists like me to get hired quickly :).  Now you know why everyone believes and listens to Jews LOL.

The existence of restaurants like Roots has therefore become central to a narrative that Gazan life, in the words of one Israeli official last week, "is good and stable".

Step into Hasan Hasuna's grocery shop in Gaza City, the territory's main city, and you could be forgiven for thinking that Israel has a point.

Mr Hasuna's shelves boast a surprising variety of goods, many of them banned from entering Gaza by Israel, from pasta to chocolate. There was even a box of Cadbury Creme Eggs, hard to come by in the Middle East, placed strategically at the check-out counter.


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:36 | 4472604 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

Of course those slimy theaving Arabs that live on "your turf" are finding ways around "your" boycott!

You and your's are all Nazis.  The only ones who I have any admiriation and respect for are the ultra-Orthodox Jews who tell the World like it is what you truly are.

Common "Khazar thieves" who stole a land and a religion and are at war with anyone else you can't control!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:44 | 4472652 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

My family bought land in Israel (British Palestine) from a businessman in Beirut.  Nothing was stolen.  No one cares about your technicalities and Khazar crap.  You're just showing your Aryan side when making that argument.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:51 | 4472681 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

And the friends in your neighborhood?  Of course?...

They made deals the Palestinian couldn't refuse!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:54 | 4472694 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

Arabs had no problems selling to Jews thinking they were going to kill them later and get their land back for free. 

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 19:17 | 4472781 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

And why the hell wouldn't they?  If you threw me off my own land and killed members of my family over 65 years I'd say you'd have a problem!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:50 | 4472002 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

I know. 

It's amazing how someone "out of the blue" mentions "chain-linked fences" and that image of an apartheid fascist state that systematically kills off the indigenous population through starvation, torture and murder just pops into your head automatically! Especially when the race of people perpetrating those crimes have Holocaust museums everywhere to furnish the "double standard" feigning crocodile tears for everyone to see how maligned a race they are!

Don't get me wrong the United States and England made it easy by writing the code book for what Israel is using in the genocide department today and much of the blame rests at their feet as well.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:58 | 4472033 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

I think the double standard is  Christians who have no problem slaughtering people of other religions whining about jews causing genocide.  36 Palestinians were killed in 2013.  That's hardly a genocide, that's not even half of who died last week in the Ukraine.  The Palestinian population has tripled since 1967 but to Israel haters, that's somehow a genocide.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 16:04 | 4472053 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture


Don't know where you keep your records on the numbers of disappearing Palestinians by date, but when you come across those books I think the UN's been looking for them since around 1949 along with the Hague -that is of course to say a UN and Hague not owned by the U.S., U.K. EU and Israel!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 16:40 | 4472174 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

I think you can find my numbers at Human Rights Watch, not exactly a Israel-loving group.  As for the UN, which spends half of its time investigating Israel and condemning Israel every other vote, big deal.  Hundreds of thousands die in Syria and Rwanda and millions raped everywhere else in Africa and they don't move their hands off the tea cups and martini glasses paid for by Saudi Arabia and the UAE.  And we all know Obama can threaten anyone now and no one listens.  And Putin, well it's been almost two years since visiting Israel.  He won't mind returning.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 17:59 | 4472468 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture 

Sorry, I couldn't find your numbers here, but I did find a whole lot more. However, you could provide source material for your Syria, Ruwanda and Africa numbers. Wouldn't want you zionists getting sloppy. 

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:47 | 4472664 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture


just due to lack of time, the offenses and murders in Rwanda can be quickly found on any search.  I may just be showing my age by bringing up Rwanda.  Syria for the last year is also well documented.  Feel free to counter my numbers though.


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:53 | 4472686 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Well of course, why should a liar provide justification? You have already lied once, now you do the work. I agree the numbers in these countries are worse than in Palestine 2013, but your gift for exaggeration requires a response.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:58 | 4472705 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture


I have no idea which comment was a lie or exaggeration so here's  the basics of the three.

Here's Gulf News, not exactly Israel-friendly. 

Here's Rwanda:

Here's Syria:


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 19:32 | 4472841 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

You stated one: 36 deaths according to Human Rights Watch, my citation shows this to be false. Two, your citation for Syria refers to 70,000 not hundreds of thousands as you claimed. Three, the citation for Rwanda has exactly zero citations or proofs. While I know of the war in Rwanda and the atrocities committed there, there is nohng to support your claims. Fourth, you provide no citations for rapes in Africa. Thus, every one of your claims was either false or an exaggeration. 

I do appreciate the effort. 

P.S. The Russian Holocaust carried out by the Bolshevik jews has never been approached in recorded history. You might want to tread lightly in this regard.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 20:01 | 4472985 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

Hey prettyboy, the 36 number true. Over a hundred thousand dead in Syria true, a million killed in Rwanda true, rapes in Africa true. You're just being petty. No reason to call anyone a liar when all the above are true. How about getting off your ass and disproving one of them? Oh wait, I'm the Zionist and I live in the real world and I already gave you the facts which are all true. You're not even denying them to be true but nitpicking a year old link when only 70k were killed at that time. You can act this way cuz you know the truth and facts are on my side whether the above or nine eleven or USS Liberty or whatever. Shalom!!!!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 20:05 | 4473003 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

By the way, not sure I'll spend much time of you if all you care about is grading rather than history or facts. I've dealt with people like you before where no link or citation will ever be enough but in your case even when given the facts you didn't care.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 20:05 | 4473004 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

By the way, not sure I'll spend much time of you if all you care about is grading rather than history or facts. I've dealt with people like you before where no link or citation will ever be enough but in your case even when given the facts you didn't care.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 20:29 | 4473105 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

History and facts are interesting constructs. Source material is important ( and remember, I used YOUR source material). However, since much of the history concerning judahites and their experiences is exaggerated and lies, especially as they have a tendency to have alternative views censored the world over, it behooves us to double check "facts" and "history".

Can I suggest, "The Controversy of Zion" by Douglass Reed or The Curse of Canaan" by Eustace Mullins. Segue into "Hitler's War" by David Irving. 

I doubt if you have ever "dealt" with people like me. I expect accuracy, otherwise msunderstandings develop which are detrimenal to us all.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 20:21 | 4473063 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

AW, getting upset? The 36 number is a LIE, based on YOUR source material. Over a hundred thousand is NOT HUNDREDS of thousands, one million killed in Rwanda is heresay until you can provide a credible source as are the rapes in Africa, I might give you from the beginning if time, but then, that could be anywhere.

I disproved the ones you attempted to source. Can I help it if you love hyperbole? Your throwing a temper tantrum? How old are you?

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 20:24 | 4473079 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

I think you know what temper tantrums can be like here. I'm older than you. The facts are true and you're just nitpicking not discussing.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 20:30 | 4473116 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

How do you know you are older than I?

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 21:50 | 4473393 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

I'm married two little kids full time job and a shitty commute. I don't have the time to deal with your perfection when doing this piecemeal between work and the rest when you know what I wrote is fact and you're jerking around with little crap. I get it, you like to fuck with Jews based on the above. Big deal. Your "lies" are facts and realities everywhere else.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 21:52 | 4473403 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

Thanks for the recommended reading though. Right now, trying to finish a patriots history of the modern world by schweikart

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 23:03 | 4473723 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

I'm willing to bet I'm older than you. 

When you enter a debate, you marshall your support. The "facts" you use are important, for they influence the weight given to your unsubstantiated statements. Failure to admit mistakes does not strengthen your position. No, I don't like to fuck with jews, but you seem to be willing to fuck with everyone else, so I figure you're fair game.

Now, that being said, your unwillingness to recognize the brutality of the Israeli regimes cannot be excused by pointing out the transgressions of others. I think most of us learn this as, "two wrongs do not make a right". As hard fought for is the sense of jewish victimization, I don't buy it for a second. While not every jew is a monster, there are enough, including those that enslave there own people in Israel, to see a pattern of abuse being heaped on all the gentiles in the world.

Jews are not safe with power and influence. Never have been. I'm not suggesting holocaust, but see the benefit of jews in Israel ONLY. Want to trade? Fine, but leave us alone to live in peace and prosperity.

Tue, 02/25/2014 - 00:13 | 4474011 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

Spelling aside, what is your proof israelis enslave their own people? Shoe's on the other foot now, isn't it.

Tue, 02/25/2014 - 08:12 | 4474592 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Keep in mind, the Rothschilds are jews. Spelling aside? 

Tue, 02/25/2014 - 00:41 | 4474105 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

Interesting that you lied to make a point. I never said Israel hasn't acted brutally. I think they like the US need to figure out what kind of country they're going to be but as you seem to be a studies of history, you should realize they're young and insecure. So why would you need to lieabout what I said?

Tue, 02/25/2014 - 09:47 | 4474614 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Not being on the site to answer a post does not equate to lying. As a liar, I would think you know that. There are many citations, but the one posted above should do. Israeli brutality towards the Palestinians entails much more than the numbers of deaths. You also fail to realize or admit that the Arabs know judahite methodologies used on foreign peoples (from the torah) and rightfully fear how they will act.

Is "lieabout" a word? See how fun that is. 

Israel has always acted above te law, as they see fit. They care not for international norms or even the lives of allies (USS Liberty). I could care less what kind of country they are going to be, because this is obvious. I care more FOR getting our country out from under the financial and media oppression they inflict, day in and day out. Need a citation? Look up Jack Lew, The FED, Hollywood or Sam Zell.

Tue, 02/25/2014 - 23:43 | 4478816 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

Thanks for a late response but don't you see the hypocrisy here? You ask me for links and I give some while I ask you for links and you tell me to look them up myself. You' don't come across as the genus that you think you are. And lying about our soldiers who died on the USS Liberty makes me question your patriotism. I suggest you be more proud to be an American than to lie and distort about what happened to those sailors

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:45 | 4472646 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

Hundreds of thousands die in Syria and Rwanda and millions raped everywhere else in Africa and they don't move their hands off the tea cups and martini glasses paid for by Saudi Arabia and the UAE

Africa?  Lot's of wealthy diamond merchants in Africa from Belgium and the Netherlands -No!... Yes indeed.  You guys are the best in the business. Who owns those mines and the black workers that dig it out of the ground?

And as far as those government(s) you mention are concerned. You should know, as you run , or shall I say "subvert" our Government among most of Europe's and pretty much have since 1913. 

We're all going down the toilet together ths time and it will be you with the front row seat to "Yaway".

Make a wish!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 18:50 | 4472674 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

Not sure if you're being sarcastic or not because yes, I would think there were plenty of Dutch miners in South Africa.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 19:06 | 4472734 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

No, I was actually referring to the Corporations that own and operate those diamond mines and your Dutch (Jewish and otherwise ancestory) descendent(s) that take extra special care of their Kaffir (also indigenous) employees.  Just like the Ethiopians in Tel Aviv and Haifa who try to give blood to a hospital!

Notice how I said "Jewish and other" when I was referring to being Dutch. 

You certainly don't have to have it in the blood to be a Zionist but you'll always be less than perfect without the blood even when you sell your soul to it for money.

Am I right?

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 19:13 | 4472763 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

I heard about the blood story and I remember years ago, I couldn't give blood due to an overseas trip that I made.  I have a co-worker who couldn't give blood because she didn't weigh a certain amount so there's always reasons to turn down blood.  The difference between Israel haters like you and Israelis is that they're having discussions above what to do going forward.  Here's an article regarding this and unlike you, I actually read the articles before I send them out.  It's a complex issue that happens here in the US too, especially years ago during the AIDS crisis.

Still not following the Dutch thing but I'm out of time.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 19:27 | 4472820 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

Gotta go?!  Completely understand.

I'm sure you are more than busy these days throwing Palestinian children in jail for throwing a rock, or crushing an activist under a bulldozer for protesting your beloved Government. Not forgetting of course setting off a tactical warhead here and there in Syria or Iran -whenever you can of course...

Your methodology seems to be working out quite well here in the U.S. (sure you're a dual citizen) although many Americans are getting kind of fed up with the knock at the door in the middle of the night violating their civil liberties and are starting to dislike it so much they are fighting back.

I have some friends in D.C. that will be joining you for the AIPAC Conference March 2nd.  Sure hope you can make it!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 20:10 | 4473021 Frostfan1
Frostfan1's picture

Never been. But as you know, if I did, I wouldn't be worried about your friends. After all, that's my home turf :)

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 21:56 | 4473418 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

I foresee a day brother where "the thieves that are the thickest" will turn on each other as it has always been Old Testament, New Testament -Doesn't matter.

At the end of the day the one who is the most obsessed with coveting the world and insane with greed always goes down the hardest!  Best part of all they always do it to themselves!

Keep sticking that chin out. Cause Yahweh's a comin soon...

Prepare Ye!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:58 | 4472035 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

Pardon me -what I meant to say is that Israel is

An apartheid fascist theocracy that hijacked a religion to systematically kill off the indigenous population of Palestine through systematic torture, starvation and murder.

Fixed it!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:31 | 4471930 fxrxexexdxoxmx
fxrxexexdxoxmx's picture

I wonder how much of the suffering that is happening in Palestine could be solved if only somewhere on Earth there was a Muslim country who had access to a sovereign wealth fund that got its money from hydrocarbons.

Just think of how much could change if this was a reality.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:37 | 4471952 MarsInScorpio
MarsInScorpio's picture



Excellent post.


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:59 | 4472042 KnightTakesKing
KnightTakesKing's picture

'Veterinary and phytosanitary risk'

Veterinary? You mean we are now animals to be herded up in camps?

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:09 | 4471807 waterwitch
waterwitch's picture

...economic Nail gun...there fixed it for u


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:28 | 4471908 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

Did somebody say nail gun?

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:17 | 4471722 Cult_of_Reason
Cult_of_Reason's picture

This is a very "smart" move for "stability" inside Russia to starve angry and not happy with Putin regime Russians.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:39 | 4471958 MarsInScorpio
MarsInScorpio's picture



Do you get paid by the word, the post, or by the down arrow?


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 17:23 | 4472334 TheMeatTrapper
TheMeatTrapper's picture

I think people like Cult and foneboy have an innate need to be noticed, and since they cannot achieve the respect and importance that they 'deserve' in real life, they turn to the internet. It's safe, it's easy and there's no possibility of an ass kicking involved. 

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:56 | 4471763 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

Once a Russian after Communism.....always a Russian.  Such transparent bullshit.

Not a PEEP before and even DURING the Revolution about these concerns.....not even years ago during the Orange Revolution.

But days AFTER they lost another satellite........"OH, you're meat and vegetables might be tainted".

Putin is simply showing his labia here.  Poor little bad-ass KGB guy......can't get his way so he goes all tinhorn totalitarian on their ass.


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:10 | 4471826 SgtShaftoe
SgtShaftoe's picture

Just because Putin is comparably sane vs US foreign policy, doesn't mean he's not a fucking narcissistic bastard.  Every national leader at this point is a psychopath, sociopath, or both!  God help us!  We're going to need it. 

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:15 | 4471850 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

i love your posts Sgt

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:17 | 4471863 TahoeBilly2012
TahoeBilly2012's picture

Sounds like Iphones versus Nat Gas to me....can't stay warm with a loan for an Iphone!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 16:04 | 4471965 walküre
walküre's picture

Putin's regime is totalitarian. Sending anti government (aka anti Putin) protesters to 4 years labor camps North Korea style should wake everyone up now.

Russian court hands prison sentences to seven anti-Putin protesters

A Moscow court has sentenced seven people to up to four years in prison for their part in a mass protest against Russian President Vladimir Putin’s return to the Kremlin in 2012. An eighth avoided a jail sentence.


Mass arrests

Riot police detained more than a hundred protesters gathered outside the court. Many shouted, "Shame" and called for a rally to be held near the Kremlin later on Monday.


Junk away Putin lovers.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:56 | 4472027 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Drop Monsanto GMO poison food and Archer Daniels Midland high fructose corn syrup poison.  They are probably more leathal than agent orange.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 16:56 | 4472221 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

My concern is that Putin/Russia is simply REacting, rather than acting from a strategic plan.

The Neocons/Globalists are clearly taking the fight to them, one country at a time.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 17:53 | 4472439 Czar of Defenes...
Czar of Defenestration's picture

"Time for a symbolic air lift again."


"<Units of the Russian forces which formed a steel ring around the Olympic Winter Games that ended in Sochi Sunday were flown and shipped Monday, Feb. 24 to Russian bases at the Ukrainian Crimean port of Sevastopol, as Moscow refused to recognize the legitimacy of the new authorities in Kiev."


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:44 | 4471696 Meat Hammer
Meat Hammer's picture

This is one of those days when I wish I had a hot tub time machine so I can see how this all plays out.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:52 | 4471740 rsnoble
rsnoble's picture

Just get drunk everyday for a month straight, don't go anywhere and don't watch the news.  It has a similar affect as time travel once you snap out of it.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:19 | 4471872 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

...AND you'll talk like a Morlock

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:34 | 4471939 BKbroiler
BKbroiler's picture

or Stallone.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:07 | 4471806 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

Don't worry Meat Hammer

You'll be getting that "wish" in spades like an involuntary enema from the ugliest nurse with 25" forearms you've never seen.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:54 | 4471697 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

This is not a done deal, and is reversable at any rate. This announcement simply increases the pressure for a bailout from *someone.*

Putin is playing the west into paying for Ukraine's bailout. He'll then rig the May elections and install another puppet like Yanukovych (if not Yanukovich himself).

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:04 | 4471792 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

Dollarnedes.....I like your line of thinking and there is a rough logic to it.  However....I think this is beyond any too obvious machinations on Putin's part at this point in time.  This is why the people are revolting....because Putin did what you think he will do now back after the Orange Revolution.

Sorry....had to downvote you for that.....but I'll symbolically upvote you for your cynicism.  Like minds....and all that, mate.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 21:26 | 4473323 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

"...but I'll symbolically upvote you for your cynicism."


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 21:32 | 4473345 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

LOL !!!!!

Ok,,,,that made me laugh so hard I had to go back and give you an upvote to your original post.  And for this one as well.


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:55 | 4472016 bentzn
bentzn's picture

I believe Yanu is already gone. As in 'actually gone'. Putin had no use for him anymore.
Considering the possibility of getting another muppet as president in Kiev... I believe it will be difficult given the public sentiment right now.

This is (IMHO) a 'nice' Putin. He is playing nice to begin with. He does not want to be the aggresor and just invade - like the Russians say the US does in other comments.

But when the Eastern provinces start crying loudly about [whatever] he will be 'forced' to go in.  And he will. Nothing really to stop him. The EU are a bunch of wet puppies and the US will have more than enough to handle elsewhere.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 16:27 | 4472120 Mountainview
Mountainview's picture

Don't overestimated the voting public!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:45 | 4471700 Sofa King Confused
Sofa King Confused's picture

Come on Ukraine print your own money and tell the Eu and Russia to fuck off

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:49 | 4471728 agent default
agent default's picture

I think the problem is they have printed so much of their own money than nobody wants it anymore.  Coming soon to a country near you.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:57 | 4471765 Sofa King Confused
Sofa King Confused's picture

Ukraine needs to default on their debt and start over. They are an export country of agri products.  They will be fine.


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:08 | 4471790 john39
john39's picture

EU would never allow that.  the rest of the serfs might get some crazy idea to follow suit.  that can never be allowed.  debt is wealth, freedom is slavery.  Forward EU comrades.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:45 | 4471702 ZH Snob
ZH Snob's picture

doesn't that mean more food for the west? it's gotta go somewhere.  I'm thinking this is the wrong time to turn your back on sustenance

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:54 | 4471750 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

Food doesn't work that way.  You have to preserve it.

These folks in Kiev don't understand where their interests lie.  They will, or the EU will have to pay all their bills and my recall is they are several billion dollars in arrears for nat gas. 

The EU will be paying that?  Assuming Russia will take paper Euros (or yellow metal) in return for something valuable like nat gas or oil.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 16:30 | 4472133 Mountainview
Mountainview's picture

Has only one of normal (Not government linked) European Union citizen be asked about his opinion (by officials) ?

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:45 | 4471703 SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture

Import restrictions today. Tanks by the end of the week .... we'll see.  


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:48 | 4471718 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

Putin does not want to roll tanks into Ukraine...that is the last resort, and will happen only if the situation can't be manipulated to his advantage. Invasion not only costs him money, but it risks retaliation from the west and exposes him as a dictator. That increases his risk.

Putin also does not want to "shut off the gas." He may increase the prices somewhat, but there are two problems:

1) Spring is coming, so the point of maximum leverage is passing away.

2) If gas prices go up too much, it will incentivize the west to frack in Poland, Romania, et al. That would be a mortal blow to Gazprom.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:55 | 4471759 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

You're out of date.  Eni and Exxon have pulled out of Poland.  They looked, and found nothing to frack.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:04 | 4471793 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

Per Bloomberg, dated January 23, 2014:


"Natural gas flowed from the vertical Lewino well in a shale formation in the Baltic Basin in northern Poland at as much as 60,000 cubic feet per day during tests, Dublin-based San Leon, a natural-gas explorer backed by billionaire George Soros and Blackrock Inc., said today in a filing. The company will start drilling a more productive horizontal well no later than July, said Dennis McKee, the chief executive officer of United Oilfield Services Sp. z o.o., which worked on Lewino" (empasis mine)


What was that you were saying?

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:15 | 4471852 Tracerfan
Tracerfan's picture

60,000 cubic feet is very little.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:20 | 4471875 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

1) "during tests."

2) As stated on ZH often enough, fracking wells deplete so you end up drilling lots of them. 60,000 may be "very little," until you drill 100 more wells just like it.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:28 | 4471909 oddjob
oddjob's picture

6,000,000 cubic feet is very little.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 16:34 | 4472151 Mountainview
Mountainview's picture

And lifetime of these fracking holes isn't very long. So pay back time for your investment most be fast. Otherwise!?!

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:36 | 4471944 Rock On Roger
Rock On Roger's picture

The test always has the highest flow rate of the well's history.

That 60,000 cubic feet would sell for $368.40 on Fridays close of March 14 contract.

It is going to take a while to pay for that hole.


Stack On

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 17:39 | 4472376 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Still very little.

If one at 60.000 won't pay for costs..(not even  close) .drill 100 and losses are really  in the to speak

You have any idea of what total cost to bring a well to production is?



Mon, 02/24/2014 - 23:08 | 4473728 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

"You have any idea of what total cost to bring a well to production is?"

"A typical Bakken or Three Forks well in North Dakota or Eastern Montana costs between $6 Million and $9 Million dollars to drill and complete (frack)."


A typical well in the Marcellus formation will produce about 1.2 billion cubic feet over its lifetime (according to HuffPo!). At the rate of $368.40 per 60,000 cubic feet quoted, that would be $7,368,000.

Chesapeake energy claims the production can be 4 or 5 times higher than that, but estimates seem to be all over the place. I would suppose some of that is due to ideosyncracies of the formations being drilled.

In light of average figures, it seems 60,000 cubic feet is not a lot. Maybe this is only the initial stage and they expect more. If they're continuing to drill, it seems they think so.

If Russia cuts supply, and prices go up even 10%, that would open a lot of wells up to being profitable.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 23:07 | 4473734 Rock On Roger
Rock On Roger's picture

In my part of the world $250,000 for a simple vertical coal bed methane gas well to $15,000,000 for a multi stage fracked horizontal shale gas well.

The little well will produce 100 mcf/d for a long, long time. The big well will produce 6,000 mcf/d along with 600 bbls of premium condensate for a short while.

Longer payout for the little well but it will produce gas forever. Short payout for the big well  but who knows if it will last long enough to pay for itself?

Stack On

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 23:13 | 4473760 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

My main point without getting into figures is: Blackrock and Sorors' advisers must have as much knowledge as we have here, and almost certianly more.

*They* think it's worthwhile to drill.

I don't think they'd be throwing their money away if they didn't think they could profit from it.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 23:31 | 4473834 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

By the way, I just noticed that the news story I quoted referred to "the vertical Lewino well in a shale formation."

At the rate of $368.40 per 60,000 cubic feet, that's about $135,000 per year (assuming production 365 days a year). At that rate, the well would pay itself off in two years, assuming a cost of $250,000 as you state.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:23 | 4471890 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

Once you have to start drilling horizontal, you're just proving the point that the cheap shit is gone.  Like looking for spare change between the cushions of the couch.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:29 | 4471916 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

"Cheap" is relative; and there probably never was any "cheap" oil/gas to begin with, or we would be discussing the decline of the Polish oil industry instead.

As the original post stated, if Russia cuts gas, which would raise prices, it would incentivize fracking. That's all I was saying.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 21:34 | 4473350 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

Cheap is never relative when your wage has been stagnant for 30 years.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:33 | 4471934 Lost Word
Lost Word's picture

Fracking has Lowered the price of natural gas,

so any cheaper method of drilling would lower prices more,

not favorable to the natural gas producers.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 17:25 | 4472342 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

60,000 cubic feet per day?

You lost me...


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:08 | 4471814 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

Nice point Crash, I do so like when someone posts facts rather than deluded posts about which they know nothing. Poland was a dry hole, yet people still believe what  a certain news outlet told them,

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:24 | 4471884 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

And your particular expertise on this matter is what?

Are you a CEO of an energy company?


*edit* But you know who IS an expert? Blackrock. Oh, and I think it's pretty well established that Soros doesn't tilt at windmills.

But I guess you know better than them.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 20:28 | 4473104 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

Member for
2 weeks 3 days

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 20:58 | 4473228 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

No doubt you've been a member for a longer time.

And you're still an asshat.

If you have a problem with my arguments, please address those instead of making ad hominem attacks.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:05 | 4471804 SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture

I think you may underestimate how much Russia has already been provoked.  

Short of bombing Saudi Arabia; I couldnt think of anything more effective that literally ripping up the Ukraine's little putsch by tearing off a huge chunk of territory and lockiing the EU from the Black Sea coast permanently.

Putin facing down Obama and the EU AGAIN?   His citizens would eat that shit UP. 

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:17 | 4471859 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

Putin is certainly trying to spin it his way; and maybe a lot of Russians might eat that shit up...maybe not. But rolling tanks into Ukraine (however popular with Russian citizens) would be Sadaam-level provocation. The US and EU would be fairly obliged to sanction Russia if that happened. Note: this would of course be done through NATO, where Russia/China have no input.

If there's any validity to propaganda of US/EU agitation, the west might then respond by arming (western) Ukrainians. Then, you've got a real civil war...not this "let's occupy the square in Kiev" shit.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:50 | 4472003 MarsInScorpio
MarsInScorpio's picture



Sanction Russia - right.


NATO plays that card and it's lights out Europe.


As for all these hot-war lunatics - MAD still exisits. Nobody is going to a hot war with Russia, NATO, or China.


Mon, 02/24/2014 - 16:40 | 4472173 Dewey Cheatum Howe
Dewey Cheatum Howe's picture

Liver eaters playing pile on the jew in Israel and Shiitehead Saudi Spring 2.1 are possible blowback scenarios here. If you want to stick it to OPEC and heart of the USD/Power hedgemony you destabilize Saudi Arabia.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 20:24 | 4473081 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

I was saying "lights out Europe, then NATO plays its card."

As it stands, it's really a Mexican standoff: both sides have their responses prepared and neither side wants to suffer the consequences.

If that's correct, then nothing will happen.

As far as MAD and "hot war," this won't be overt. It will be a proxy war, just like in the bad-old-days of the cold war.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:37 | 4471949 Lost Word
Lost Word's picture

Someone has been trying to start World War Three,

provocations all around the world,

but so far, the shark bait has been resisted.

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:44 | 4471981 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

How has "Little Russia" been provoked here?

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 15:05 | 4471801 blabam
blabam's picture

"If goods don’t cross borders, soldiers will." 

Mon, 02/24/2014 - 14:46 | 4471704 semperfidelis
semperfidelis's picture

I guess this is not bullying, its bullying only when Obama does it. Talk about double standards.

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