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Russian Fleet Gives Ukrainian Crimea Forces Ultimatum To Surrender Or "Face Storm", Ukraine Defense Minister Quoted
Just out from Reuters:
- INTERFAX UKRAINIAN DEFENCE MINISTRY AS SAYING RUSSIAN FLEET HAS GIVEN UKRAINIAN FORCES IN CRIMEA UNTIL 0300 GMT TOSURRENDER OR FACE STORM
More from Reuters:
Russia's Black Sea Fleet has told Ukrainian forces in Crimea to surrender by 5 a.m. (0300 GMT) on Tuesday or face a military assault, Interfax news agency quoted a source in the Ukrainian Defence Ministry as saying.
The ultimatum, Interfax said, was issued by Alexander Vitko, the fleet's commander.
The ministry did not immediately confirm the report and there was no immediate comment by the Black Sea Fleet, which has a base in Crimea, where Russian forces are in control.
"If they do not surrender before 5 a.m. tomorrow, a real assault will be started against units and divisions of the armed forces across Crimea," the agency quoted the ministry source as saying.
And the response from the Ukraine:
- Head of Russian Black Sea Fleet demanded Ukrianian ship give up weapons and surrender, Oleksiy Kirchkov, deputy commander of Ukraine Navy vessel Ternopil, tells Ukraine’s Channel 5 by phone.
- Russia set 5 a.m. deadline for 2 Ukraine ships near Sevastopol to capitulate: Channel 5
- Ukraine ships “declined to meet the ultimatum, will stay till the very end”
It appears Putin is still unaware of the "costs" he is facing.
Meanwhile:
#Crimea The Russian deadline of 4 o'clock for Ukrainian troops to vacate Belbek base has passed. No sign of Russian military eviction force
— Elizabeth Palmer (@elizapalmer) March 3, 2014
Interpreter notes that Ukraine’s first president, Leonid Kravchuk, who served between 1991 and 1994, wrote in the Russian publication Snob.ru today that this crisis could spark World War III:
“I call on the Russian authorities to stop. Between our peoples should not be war. Does Russia not understand that this is the beginning of World War III?” he warned.
He vowed to defend the land of his forefathers despite his age.
“My great-grandfather and grandfather fought in World War I, along with Russia. I am 80 years old, but I’ll take a gun and I will defend their land. Every citizen will defend their territory as their home.
“We knelt and Russia sat us down. Czechoslovakia, Poland, Afghanistan, Hungary. Now Ukraine is on the line?” he continued.
If the Russian troops try to take these bases, and the soldiers inside resist, is it possible that Kravchuk’s warning could come true?
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Good cons always work in 3's. Gas interests Germany(EU) to the West, Joooos to the South aka the Nabucoo which both are being played off against Russia to the East with the US in the middle using Ukraine. US plays the German against the Jooos at the same time using 3 opposition groups within the Ukraine to force regime change. Then play the world off against the US.
Muslims, Jooos and Christians with a Muslim running the con playing jooos off against ChristiansChristians against Jews and Christians (EU/NATO) off against other Christians (Russians). Bathhouse and his crew are truely evil manipulative grima wormtongues and the rest of the world is too fucking stupid to see it or cowardly to doing anything about it. He is playing everyone like the bunch of suckers and cowards they all are. You fuckers made the deal with the devil and these are the consequences of it.
3 cons played in 3 ways just like you and your other 2 personalities you like to use..........
You surely have a go DCH ! But as others before you in previous centuries you are dead wrong in respect of those Germans. They are perfect in a sense, but limited to just their own affairs and otherwise useless. Just like those
best of Americans of German descent, they might have the prettiest daughters but will not fight for true freedom.
Today`s Germany is ruled by the worst of traitors even
the benevolent dictatorship of the US over Germany cannot
get rid of. The whole of Europe awaits a great cleansing of her temples.
KFC (Kiev Freiheit Chicken) is what's for dinner in Brussels and DC.
What will KFC deliver: Sieg* or Heil**? ROTF, LMAO.
* Victory ** Heal!
Some Ukraine naval and air force assets have already gone over to Russia. Others will likely follow.
17 year old boys stand guard against Russian THUGS.
"Putin orders their SURRENDER."
WOW....what a tough guy...
Surrender is such a harsh Word.. he should have used something More Diplomatic Like Stand Down...
Or pretend you're French...
Vet , don`t mean to mug you as you are kind of headed out of here anyway. Nazis out of Germany sent 15 year old`s against
real live Russian thugs (and tanks) that would just about rape and kill anything on their final promise to victory.
Long timer, what happened to you ? Posting out of jail ?
What happened to disabledvet? They would ask.
Got himself into a corner of his former online fight club self.RIP.
America "protects it's interests" around the globe and it's done in the name of "freedom and democracy".
Odd, that Russia can't do the same...
interests?
this becomes a LAND GRAB.
The only thing that the United States and the West have demanded is that the territorial integrity of Ukraine be upheld.
"After that...what's yours is now mine."
Nothing odd, this is an 'american' world.
And Russians are not 'american'. 'Americans' have a long story of denying to others what they grant to themselves.
The story has been running from 1776, July, 4th when they declared human rights inalienable to human beings and kept slaves.
Nothing odd. The 'american' way.
Would be odd if one day, 'americans' did not act the way they are used to.
Would be even odder if duplicitous and insanitational Chinese Citizenism citizen trolls did not mouth the same bigoted, stale and inane propaganda bits as they are always used to.
Alas, alas, three millenia of roadside crapping alas, nothing changes in scrapegoating and ananonymystical Chinese Citizenism. Same anti-American tired song and dancing as always, audience has long ago left the theater but the solo actor keeps repeating his lines. Make us laugh.
Welcome to the Ananonymous Chinese Citizenism world, it's a Mobius-strip roller-coaster of insanitational blobbing-up and forcing it to the exterior, you'll see.
At the risk of stating what should be obvious (but isn't for most):
US "Interests" or "National Security" is a matter of definition and DC Double-Speak. What it actually means to TPTB is: Their interests and their security, i.e. the wealth and lifestyle of the 1% and the 'Power of God' of the 0.01%.
For some reason (cause sheeple are sheeple), the masses seem to think that it is their interests and security that DC and Wall St is "protecting". LOL.
Kalashnikovs vs. Kalashnikovs. Both Russian made. Maximum suspense.
The new guns are good, many argue better than the American rifles.
Seems that some here and on Daily Caller, Fox and Drudge are rallying in support of Putin. Really?
Almost like that crowd hates Obama or something.
But man do they love them some shirtless Putin. Has it occurred to anyone that Obama and the US aren't interested in getting involved in this? Afterall, it seemed as if the rank and file of ZH were against Afghanistan and that fuckload of fuckup... Why double down on fuckery? I get it though... Just hate Obama no matter what, as a default even if 'murcins have to die to prove the point.
My guess is that if the Obama administration wasn't interested in getting involved, they wouldn’t have backed the coup.
Just my guess.
The US has backed lots of coups. Nothing new there. But do we have to invade Ukraine to make a point? I assume no one here would like that but you can't really tell. Instead the Fox crowd says Palin was right or that Romney would have saved us? Haven't really seen any detailed analysis on what should be done here, just complaining about how Obama is a pussy. I can live with comment downvotes. I'm just trying to make sense of what Obama should be doing according to ZH, take his shirt off and go elk hunting?
No (and I'm not down voting you). There is nothing that Obama can do to save face with his detractors at this point. I'm one of them, but neither a Fox watcher nor a Palin fan.
Personally, I don't believe this has a whole lot to do with Obama, anymore than Iraq had to do with Bush the Lesser. As a practitioner of advanced schadenfreude, I do find Obama's predicament entertaining.
Very entertaining indeed. Interesting how the rules change when you're dealing with a nuclear power. Let that be lesson for everyone and every country who aspires to govern themselves without outside influence. Hold the hammer and everyone tends to listen.
What about a shirtless Palin Elk hunting?
I am with you on why people hate the pres. It is because they hate their government but cannot admit it. The POTUS is the top of the shit heap, so when they realize he cannot change things, he gets it.
pods
Palin is in my age range, and she's definately sexy. Her choice of eyeware and her voice just kill the deal for me, though. I would probably watch her hunting elk topless.
Last logical answer before ignoring...
ZH - pissed off group of people that have watched our nation become destroyed by sociopaths in DC/Banks/Corps. Anyone that is a politician, banker, or corrupt type has had their time on here and we have probably all dismembered them and everything there about.
What should Obama be doing? Well how about stop nation building around the world. Stop messing around in other countries business. I don't know MAYBE fix some of the monstorous issues we have going on stateside, instead of worrying about and spending money on other countries. He should stop issuing warnings and statements and making himself look like an ass, and he should stop half guaranteeing countries support and then change his mind.
Have you yet to see that the upper politician/banker/owner class cares not of the health and well being of our nation but only for themselves? When you realize that you know that you are the only one that cares about you and better do all you can to protect that.
I knew we were in trouble in the 80's, when the financial parasites were buying up our companies, breaking them apart and selling the pieces....
Agreed and well said.
Would just like add that congress may wish to stop focusing on party differences and raising re-election cash so they could get some actual work done.
"should stop half guaranteeing countries support and then change his mind. "
Poland might have a tale to tell...
And she had full guarantees from England and France
to mindlessly provoke disarmed Germany and Reichswehr limited to 100 K and Poland threatening with 400K soldiers
mobilized on her borders whenever the weak German Weimar Republic would not do her bidding. Talk about destabilizing
a fucked up country of sorts, absorbing all the jews you and your neighbors feel free to kick out.
Poles left under the Russian boot for good measure as
their "allies" added insult to injury.
"I'm just trying to make sense of what Obama should be doing according to ZH, take his shirt off and go elk hunting? "
How about not getting involved? The U.S has once again helped to destabilize a government and backed a coup in a region where we have no business. If Russia had done this in Mexico then you would be screaming bloody murder. Maybe MSNBC would be a better fit, since critical thinking seems difficult for you.
Is hypocrisy even considered a negative attribute, anymore?
We've lost:
Everything that was once a virtue, is now a weakness.
That didn't start (or end) with Obama.
Oh, no.
I blame Edward Bernays.
I blame Joe Citizen
But you see, joe ciizen was a vitim of edward bernays...
One could argue that Edward Bernays was merely a pawn of Philip Morris.
I wouldn't argue that, myself.
The West is so fucked up. The world needs something to replace decadence and profligacy.
If you add hypocrisy to the mix, the value of whatever combination of virtues exists- is destroyed.
I can at least engage reasonably with excessively pretentious, arrogant, extravagant and reckless liars. With hypocrites- not so much.
Unfortunately, I find hypocrisy (or lack of reason) to be the most prevalent vice, and the most challenging to expel (even from my own repertoire of vices).
I am all in agreement with you... We should NOT get involved. That's the point. So why the "Obama is a pussy" for doing just that? Instead, the right WANTS Obama to send carriers and troops and invade CRIMEA?! And yes, if Russia did invade Mexico, I think you and everyone else SHOULD scream bloody murder. But hey, Drudge loves how Putin doesn't have a shirt on, so let's back him instead.
The only one around here that seems fixated on the shirtless Putin is you. If you want to take some time out to google those pictures and fixate more, everyone here will understand.
Democrats and Republicans are all DICKTARDS! They have been pushing the same agenda for decades and pretending that they are enemies. When the public gets too pissed at one party in charge they allow control to pass to the other party promising change. Nothing but bullshit.
"Instead the Fox crowd says Palin was right"
Saw the headline, got lost in my fantasy of her as fender fluff on the back of my MC. Never got around to reading the article. Am sure I missed something of great import.
It's not about what he should do, its about what he has done.
He's made a mess of this, his administration has been shown to be up to its ass in creating this debacle. He's lost any credibility he may have had, with his Syrian blunder. He's pissed off potential allies with his NSA exploits. Yet you expect us to take this pussy seriously?
This administration, has done more to demean what it means to be American than any other in history. And that is pretty harsh considering his predicessor. And you ask, What can he do?
Well, I'll tell you. Fuck off and die! That's what.
Are FOX & Friends being foxy and getting a jump on 2016?
Just sayin'... Don't let a foreign crisis stop you from exploiting it at home for personal/career gain. It's all a House of Cards anyway. ;-)
Excellent shallow light weight slogan throwing analysis of the situation. Is this John Kerry here?
some of us muricans see that theres no good guy here. we are stuck in the stands watching this shit show and the cocanut sented force field sp rating is not high enough.
How long have you been on ZH?
"Has it occurred to anyone that Obama and the US aren't interested in getting involved in this?"
Right, they just want to threaten and give financial relief to them at a "cost".
"I get it though... Just hate Obama no matter what, as a default even if 'murcins have to die to prove the point."
No you don't get it. Yes I'll give you that it seems like it's a Putin cheering anti-American ring sometimes, but that's so far from the message. The bashing of DC is because, well honestly, look at them they can give a straight answer on domestic or foreign policies, been caught lying numerous times about anything, look into all the countries we "liberated" in the past decade and let me know how those are doing, DO YOU WANT ME TO CONTINUE?
Most people on here would agree that Putin is not some amazing, peaceful person who was given to us to save our free world, but regardless of his past...in today's world he is the only one making logical moves in regards to foreign affairs. People here on ZH are tired of the bullshit nation building....liberate liberate liberate....not to even get starting on the MASSIVE amounts of other things our politicians/banks/corps have done stateside....
Also don't take things so emotionally, it's fight club...
Man, I see in fight club the strongest and smartest men who've ever lived. I see all this potential, and I see squandering. God damn it, an entire generation pumping gas, waiting tables; slaves with white collars. Advertising has us chasing cars and clothes, working jobs we hate so we can buy shit we don't need. We're the middle children of history, man. No purpose or place. We have no Great War. No Great Depression. Our Great War's a spiritual war... our Great Depression is our lives. We've all been raised on television to believe that one day we'd all be millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars. But we won't. And we're slowly learning that fact. And we're very, very pissed off.
You make great points and I'm not taking anything emotionally. Just the last 15 years have showed that nation building and bullying and invading does NOT help so why promote it? By saying Obama is a pussy, you are all saying that he SHOULD invade and fight Russia in a war. This isn't Iraq or Afghanistan so it wouldn't end well for anyone so why promote it? What else should the US do? More sabre rattling? Send in a carrier that wouldn't be used?
Ukraine was part of Russia not 20 years ago and the majority there seem to want to reunify with them now so... LET THEM if that's what happens. Call it the business equivalent of a hostile takeover in this case, but if that is what happens, who cares if they do it. Given that we are in agreement that the US has completely fucked up its foreign policy for the last 15 years, its obvious we should NOT be invading and attacking other countries so why complain that we should by inferring that Obama is a pussy for not doing so?
I upvoted you for this one...
Yes it seems confusing that we call him a pussy and you would think that we all want him to invade. Here is the twist, we call him a pussy because he has no convictions, he talks out of both sides of his mouth and has yet to stand for whatever he says he is going to do. Don't even take this situation, use ACA Reform, how many times has he changed his own damn law? We are making fun of the fact that he can't make decisions as the "leader" of the USA, it's maddening. Transversely this does not mean we want war with Russia, quite the opposite on that one, we want him and the rest of them to shut up and butt out of their business.
Your second part is right, I agree to simply let Russia take over Crimea and stay the fuck out of it. I am not for wars and think it's hilarious we are ready to issue sanctions on Russia.....which I don't really truely understand what those would even be, but we need to stay the fuck away and focus on home.
At the risk of being redundant he appointed Jeffery Immelt Job Czar. Said it all for me anyway.
If the USA provoked this
IT'S PUTIN THAT HAS MADE THE MISTAKE.
He's calling all Ukrainians "enemies of the State and enemies of Russia."
We will INVADE?
This doesn't sound very neighborly...
No no no no no.
We (I) don't want obama and Amerika to invade. Hell no!
Kerry and obama are douche bags. That's it. They are scared and even though these are difficult circumstances, it's funny watching Putin push the 2 idiots around.
How can I ridicule our leaders? It's easy.........we have NO leaders! Wasn't it the annointed one that said 'lead from behind'? Fuck that.
this is very aggressive foreign policy, i agree with that.
Normally we would just let Vlad "have at it."
I can't say I understand the change...but hey, that's the way things go sometimes.
"Everyone agrees" (even Putin) "that Ukraine's territorial integrity must be respected."
How do you figure that the majority wants to reunify with Russia? The people took to the streets and ousted the pro-Russian government. That does not support your assertion at all. Hundreds of people died to send a message to Putin and his lackeys. I don't think this ends peacefully at all. Wisfhul thinking!
Putin is showing restraint, he is only going after the pro-Russian Crimea, which is the sweetest part of the country, probably.
Obama is not just a pussy, he is a dumb pussy, or at least a short sighted one. He started some shit that he doesn't seem to be willing to finish. He is dumb because he shouldn't have started the shit in the first place. If you want to talk about what Obama should do with regards to Ukraine, it's too late for that, because we'd have to go back in time to before the US started stirring shit up over there.
I'm a long-time ZH listener, bur relatively recent poster. ZH kills it on finance, economic and market analysis. Some of the best out there. It's the suvival/preper/anti-everything crowd (not to mention the flat out free-republic-style racists) that give the site it's reputation. Someone just say what should be done here. My point is that nothing can (or should) be done in this case in terms of military intervention that will end well. Obama is a pussy. Fine. Should he start a war with Russia to prove otherwise? Bush the Lessor tried his hand at such fuckery then landed on a carrier and played dress up to declare he won. Great job. Still a fuckup.
""I'm a long-time ZH listener, bur relatively recent poster. ZH kills it on finance, economic and market analysis. Some of the best out there. It's the suvival/preper/anti-everything crowd (not to mention the flat out free-republic-style racists) that give the site it's reputation."
BINGO! Use to send links out to ZH posts to friends because, my thinking, it was shit they should know other than MSM crap. Then it became the home of the , "suvival/preper/anti-everything crowd (not to mention the flat out free-republic-style racists)". So I no longer send the posts out knowing that after reading many of the comments many will automatically discount the valuable info.
Every blogger reaches a point where they must ask themselves, at what point in time do I sell my soul for page views.
There is the freedom of speech thing though. It's just frustrating when you see it perverted to freedom of lies to propagate hate.
You said "propagate hate" in your last sentence.
Will you settle for "Righteous Indignation" by the majority and "hate" by a small minority?
p.s. I didn't junk you.
"And we're slowly learning that fact. And we're very, very pissed off. "
And prove by beating the shit out of each other.
if all methods of crowd control fail, legalize marajuana to keep them in euphoria.
If politicians need more revenues without taxing the rich, start more and more lotteries and tax marajuana sales.
If economy falters, print more money.
If all else fails, start a war.
sorry dude the us sent tanks 2 months ago back to europe the austrians deployed armour on thier eastern boarder about 3 weeks ago or so. we are well involved in this. looks like a big miscalculation to me
Putin ain't telling me how to live my life. Putin ain't recording all my phone conversations. Putin ain't reading all my emails. Putin ain't taking 50%+ of my money and using it to bomb brown people.
Obama is a piece of shit, and I reserve the right to laugh at him when his hypocracy finally comes back to bite him in the ass and make him look like a total sissy in front of the world.
Sorry dude, but Putin is an even bigger piece of crap gangster and you would not like life in Russia. People in power are all the same, and so far in the states, we don't have to worry about being hustled off in the dead of night if we dare speak out. That is a reality of life in Russia. Speaking out is far more dangerous there than it is here. So I'll take the bs MIC spying on us any day because it is toothless.
I tell you what. The second Putin starts trying to tell me what to do, or tries to interfere with my business, then I will dislike him too.
And you are right, here in America we only need to worry about no-knock SWAT raids for unpaid parking tickets (or just plain having the wrong address), having your dog shot because it barked at a police officer, having the IRS target you for audits/harassment if you are on the wrong "side", being arrested under the NDAA, getting thrown in prison (of which we have the highest prison population in the history of any country) for some meaningless victimless crime. Things are great here.
I've been to Russia. Have you? Many parts are better than many parts of the US.
Have you spent much time in the US inner cities? / Detroit looks so good that it makes Russia look bad, right? / sarc
A for effort, F for tact. Re-read your training materials.
Oh, I get it. Says so right here on page 4 of the manual... Hate Obama, hate Fed, hate Clintons, hate stocks, love/hate Bitcoin, love Bush, love war, love Ron and Rand Paul... Love Putin. Got it.
WTF books or manuals are you reading?
Just hate everything. Sheesh.
It is so much easier
Its simple.
Us ( people ) vs Them (freeloaders human parasites)
Fuck O'boy, Fuck Bushs, Fuck Zionists, Fuck Central bankers,
They only win when you pick a jersey and fight against US.
Schiit.
RIPS
Perhaps you should consider changing your handle to Saran-Wrap.
Love Bush?
Love war?
Maybe a few isolated TEOTWAWKI freaks from survival blog. They only come out for the Armageddon porn.
My page four is in agreement except for Bush and war. Your copy must be a fake
Don't push it boy! Fight Club went full retard on Putin. Pick your side, you can't sit this one out. Tyler says so.
I'm trying hard not to but it is so hard not to love 0bama looking like a complete ass no matter whom it comes from.
well it is what it is.
What worries me is what he tries to do not to look like a complete ass
I don't give a rat's ass about Putin, but I do care about the blatant hypocrisy coming out of the west who drone people across the globe and invade any country where they feel their national interest is at stake.
" where they feel their national interest is at stake."
Where they feel a profit oppourtunity lies.
Problem is, war only consolidates hypocricy. If this escalates, nobody will remember who funded the coup and every journalist and sheep will mobilize for the cause. Everybody else will be labeled traitor and in the best case scenario gets forgotten in between nonstop slow-motion flag waving, eagles and other shit you americans are good at
russian storm will eventually be followed by western rhetoric shitstorm
All I can say is the EU better STFU or the gas will be turned off. It may happen anyway with the bankers meddling with the ruble.
Problem with that being there are two sides to that transaction and Putin needs someone to sell that gas to.
Putin has balls. If he percieves that this is an economic war waged against Russia he will do what it takes to fight back.
So maybe George Soros should be careful of what's in his tea.
Putin better watch out or Obama will send him a letter telling him how angry he is.
Poland mobilises tanks to its border with Ukraine
http://www.news.com.au/world/russian-troop-invasion-encircles-crimeas-ca...
LOL OBAMA WAS THE ANTI CHRIST. This shit house is going up in flames.
"Poland mobilises its tank and both of its soldiers to its border with Ukraine"
There I fixed the headline for you....
Poland is a member of NATO.
If you're unsure of what that means...If military action against or by Poland occurs all 28 NATO member states become involved militarily....
NATO:
Or NATO falls apart as they review their sources of energy.
Aside from the US, UK, and Germany, I think any local skeet shoot club could take on the rest and stand a good chance.
Ah they intend to print more of those funny notes to fund their wars?
Not to worry - The French will act as the rearguard. The Poles will be poleaxed. The Greeks will be drinking Ouzo, The Spanish having their seista, The Italians pinching the bottoms of the woman soldiers and so on.
And while the other fodder in Nato tries to be in front, Reggie will be taking Obam's rear.
Many of those fell in line in Afghanistan after the 9-11 False Flag attack.
Did they know in advance of 9-11, or did they learn anything later about False Flags?
Same this time, or different this time?
only after installing back up lights on the tank
"I say we blow the fuckers up" Booger, Revenge of the Nerds
Ukrainians who don't like Russia should just move to Europe or America and take their government handouts like Africans and Mexicans respectively.
and others
http://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2012/12/18/a-bipartisan-nation-of-benefic...
Putin better watch out, or Obama will promptly cut off imports of Vodka and Russian tractors, and suspend banking activities with them. To which Putin will respond by cutting off all natural gas and oil to europe, and sell all US debt it holds (and convincing its ally China to do the same), crashing the bond market... oh wait, that didn't work out as well as Obama thought it would...
Stupid Putin! He fails to understand the overwhelming power of a concerned to angry phone call from Obama!
This is going to get fucking interesting, a bankrupt nation propped up by worthless paper, foreign owned treasuries and threats of frozen assets, and a talking horse named Mr Ed...
Got Gold ???
He didn't do anything wrong.
Putin is the hero Gotham deserves, but not the one it needs right now. So, we'll hunt him, because he can take it. Because he's not our hero.
Release the Kraken !!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjCC0Kcsvig
"has given his expert evidence that it would have been physically impossible for Boeing 767s, like Flights AA11 and UA175 to have hit the Twin Towers on 9/11, particularly when flown by inexperienced pilots:
‘No Boeing 767 airliners hit the Twin Towers as fraudulently alleged by the government, media, NIST and its contractors’, he stated in the affidavit. ‘Such crashes did not occur because they are physically impossible as depicted, for the following reasons: in the case of UAL 175 going into the south tower, a real Boeing 767 would have begun 'telescoping' when the nose hit the 14 inch steel columns which are 39 inches on center. ‘The vertical and horizontal tail would have instantaneously separated from the aircraft, hit the steel box columns and fallen to the ground. ‘The engines when impacting the steel columns would havemaintained their general shape and either fallen to the ground or been recovered in the debris of the collapsed building.".... http://beforeitsnews.com/eu/2014/03/ex-cia-pilot-gives-sworn-testimony-t...Bullshit,you're obviously a fucking idiot and a blind one at that. Yeah it's a fucking conspiracy and there are 1 million people in on it.
Indeed, not a single one of the 10s to 100s of thousands of people who saw the plane flying low over Manhattan, nor the the thousands who actually visuallly witnessed the plane hit the south tower could actually prove they weren't part of the conspiracy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFods1KSWsQ
Disinformation? Distraction from Inside Job controlled demolition?
500 mph jets have a lot of kinetic energy and momentum
striking steel that has zero kinetic energy and zero momentum.
Physical law of conservation of energy and momentum.
Another consideration,
Explosive Shape charge "soft" molten copper cuts thru hardened steel armor.
Posted in 2008
FromWSWS : News & Analysis : Europe : The Balkans
Camp Bondsteel and America’s plans to control Caspian oil
By Paul Stuart
29 April 2002
According to leaked comments to the press, European politicians now believe that the US used the bombing of Yugoslavia specifically in order to establish Camp Bondsteel. Before the start of the NATO bombing of Yugoslavia in 1999, the Washington Post insisted, “With the Middle-East increasingly fragile, we will need bases and fly over rights in the Balkans to protect Caspian Sea oil.”
The scale of US oil corporations investment in the exploitation of Caspian oil fields and the US government demand for the economy to be less dependent on imported oil, particularly from the Middle-East, demands a long term solution to the transportation of oil to European and US markets.
In 1992 Dick Cheney, as Secretary of Defence in the senior Bush administration, awarded the company a contract providing support for the US army’s global operations. Cheney left politics and joined Halliburton as CEO between 1995 and 2000. He is now US vice president in the junior Bush administration. In 1992 Brown & Root built and maintained US army bases in Somalia earning $62 million. In 1994 Brown & Root built bases and support systems for 18,000 troops in Haiti doubling its earnings to $133 million. The company received a five-year support contract in 1999 worth $180 million per-year to build military facilities in Hungary, Croatia and Bosnia. It was Camp Bondsteel, however, that was dubbed “the mother of all contracts” by the Washington based Contract Services Association of America. There, “We do everything that does not require us to carry a gun,” said Brown & Roots director David Capouya.......................
http://www.bigbendbikersforfreedom.com/2008/08/last-december-we-warned-y...
It is about oil/power. It has always been about oil/power and will continue to be about oil/power. We have been operating in that area trying to create more instability for years. Anyone that thinks Putin will back down on this is freaking insane.
Russian official on Obama's threat to not attend G8: "There is Russian saying which goes, you can't scare a hedgehog with a naked ass."
learn something everyday
This S-O-O-O-O 19th century. Uncool!!!!
you sank my battleship lulz
if the new kiev government is to gain legitimacy it must appoint governors who are clearly on the side of the Ukrainian people...
http://rt.com/news/ukraine-oligarch-rule-governors-512/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ihor_Kolomoyskyi
Of course, another way they could go would be to just go balls out on the whole "NWO" conspiracy angle by appointing guys like Kolo in an eastern province.
Cute.
Obama hasn't pulled out the big one. He should threaten to give them free healthcare.
Soviet Union win WWII Soviet Union win WWIII bitchez
former soviet union didn't win jack shit
No one wins dumbfuck.
I'm pretty sure that the only winners will be the bankers. It sure won't be the sons and daughters of either side.
Bobby Gates has some advice for Obama:
Robert Gates, President Obama's former defense secretary and author of a book that was critical of the administration, has weighed in on the crisis in the Ukraine. His message to Obama: Watch the rhetoric. "The stronger the rhetoric, the greater expectation of strong action," Gates told Reuters.
"From Putin's standpoint, he's in the catbird's seat," Gates said. "He's put himself in a position where we need him in terms of the Syrian chemical (weapons) deal. We need him in terms of the Iranian nuclear program. We need the Russians in terms of getting our (military) equipment out of Afghanistan."
Asked how he would advise Obama in the crisis in Ukraine, Gates pointed to lessons from Russia's war with Georgia in 2008, when he said Washington wanted to react with more forceful economic and political measures than EU allies did.
"We ran the risk of being the ones who would be isolated because we favored a much more aggressive response than any of our (European) allies did," said Gates, who was President George W. Bush's defense secretary at the time.
"So that's one of the things the president's got to look out for."
gates is full of crap. they want two things and two things only from russia, oil, and natty. they would sell the rest of the world into bondage for those two things.
"George W. Bushes" anything means I'm really not going to pay attention to pretty much anything they have to say. Maybe his mom. I kinda like Babs.
After our Georgian ally shelled Ossetian civilians, and the Russians moved in, there was some talk of how the responding USUKNATO planes seemed to have experienced some problems flying over the territory. Is there any reliable chatter - I know, that's an oxymoron - regarding the Russian use of previously unknown EMP-type weapons at the time? I seem to remember that the explanation for the failure of the flyover was pretty weak.
you can see putins position. without a mediating force its likely that prorussian demonstrators would lay seige to the newly (unelected) president of ukraine, and that he would use force to put that demonstration down. the Ukranian military itself is divided along pro-russian pro-western lines, so it might not even show up, or it might devolve into chaos. from that point there is no going back. if the russian troops can keep a lid on things there is a chance to sort all this out, have parliamentary elections, and everybody has a seat at the table, not the american winner takes all political solution. gwb barely (lost?) the 2000 election but he immediately set out to govern by mandate. the result was a shitstorm of social and economic proportions. the ff called them checks and balances, we call it gridlock, but parliamentary government is a solution in their case anyway. the europeans should understand this (and so far none of them are making much noise). i think the leadership of the west know that this is probably a better solution than allowing ukraine to devolve into a bosnian style civil war, neighbor against neighbor. we saw how a nato response to the bosnia problem works, if the us took a close look at their own actions they would see this isn't much different, and the russians are so far standing around and watching, before the problem gets past the tipping point. privately the us is fine with this, don't kid yourself.
Were I a Ukranian, I would choose the civil war option at this point. It is the only chance for any kind of freedom from being just a tooth on a gear of a giant machine. The Ukranian people already suffered terribly under Stalin. I don't think they will let this go so easily. Stalin starved those people to death and had no compunctions about it. Nothing weighs so heavily on a person as being hungry.
and how many died in americas civil war? we sometimes project our own values onto these things. americans are hungry for some kind of change, obama was going to serve it up but he pulled the dinner dish back faster than a carpetbagging preacher. lets not judge this mess by our own. we traded hopiium for food stamps and rent assistance, and mandatory healthcare insurance. it was a bad deal, why either bush or obama got a second term is unfathomable to me, but for now its good that ukranians aren't killing each other over EU economic membership.
It is not unfathomable. The candidates are rigged. Gore would have been a shitty president. Kerry would have been a shitty president. McCain would have been a shitty president. Romney would have been a shitty president. Bush was a shitty president. Obama is a shitty president.
See the pattern?
Pro russian demonstrators laying siege in the newly elected president of Ukraine?
They failed to take over an official building in an area that was overly russian.
And they should advance to Kiev?
In the West, nazis are running the show, a lot of them were drilled in urban warfare by 'american' military advisors for over a decade now. They keep humiliating the Police by stopping cars, asking cops their id and ousted them, telling they have nothing to do with them.
Currently, in the Western Ukraine, proeminent russians are hunting down, beaten down, their families threatened to death.
'Americans' have gone prepared in this crisis, they have a civil military force on the ground (the kind 'americans' love, a militia)
Russians have nothing of the sort. If they had, Putin would not have taken the invasion move and simply let the civil russian movements do the trick.
No problem, slum lord, Valerie Jarrett will use her communist associates to see how everything can be calmed down.
The saddest truth of all is that the ones doing the dying on all sides will never be the ones who deserve it!!!!
Isn't that always the truth.
Actually, Russia let this happen.
1. Russia clearly is listening into US/EU communications. They release a very clear phone conversation between the US Ambassador and an Asst. Sect of State who are talking about who they are going to put in charge of Ukraine in early Feb.
Russia knew and let the world know they knew, and embarrased the US as a result. They could have jumped in earlier, they could have stopped the protests, or dampened them down but they didn't. Don't give me any crap about Russia having it's hands tied by the Olympics and having to wait until they were over.
The real question is why did they let this ramp up to begin with? What has Russia won, or what are they about to win?
What are you talking about? Russian definitely could not move during the Olympics, the people of Ukraine knew this and used it as their one advantage. The world's eyes were focused on Russia. It was the most important concern of all!
@Poundsand
"Actually, Russia let this happen.
1. Russia clearly is listening into US/EU communications. They release a very clear phone conversation between the US Ambassador and an Asst. Sect of State who are talking about who they are going to put in charge of Ukraine in early Feb.
Russia knew and let the world know they knew, and embarrased the US as a result. They could have jumped in earlier, they could have stopped the protests, or dampened them down but they didn't. Don't give me any crap about Russia having it's hands tied by the Olympics and having to wait until they were over.
The real question is why did they let this ramp up to begin with? What has Russia won, or what are they about to win? "
I also heard that they were aware of all the $$$ coming to the organisations who were to be the forces of destabilisation, so in the interest of intellectual honesty, it does merit asking WHY they did not attempt to nip it in the bud?
The answer is simple and clear.
Because Putin is a chess master. He knows better.
Signed: an American.
talking about who they are going to put in charge of Ukraine in early Feb.
and if you compare that list with who has actually been installed since then, you'll discover that those two lists pretty much line up perfectly.
what a co-ink-eee-dink.
lets hope dempsy comes and takes the football away again
Tell them now that, if the first shot is fired, all assets of Russia and Russians in the West will be frozen pendng the result of an assessment of the legitimacy of Russians' expressed concerns, with confication to follow any result adverse to Russia. Meanwhile, cut off everything with Russia: no trading, no banking, no anything. Bring back all Western personnel from Russia and expell all Russians from the West. Bring all Western military assets to a higher level of alert. Remind them that assault on any NATO country will mean real war. Get China into it. Penalites for laggard Western countries that do not get into the program right away. Draw a line somewhere that is drawable and mean it. This shit has to stop. Now would be a good time.
Percy - you are a fool.
Glad to dust it off for you. You might be interested in http://www.cbsnews.com/videos/white-house-considers-sanctions-against-russia-for-actions-in-ukraine/ , not read by me before my flame on this.
Or maybe the Banksters are controlling both sides.
Go down to the store and get yourself a "Geo-Political-doodle-art" kit and draw up some red lines. Then you can enter the Obama world "draw a red line contest". It's fun and all the kids are doin it! And remember our motto:
"We really mean it this time!"
Funny
I'll wait util they 'really,really' mean it.
I double dog dare you!
we're going to quaratine them with our fiat based weak dollar policy? thanks for taking my dollar, would you like eighty cents worth of us goods, (not that me make anything any more) we freeze assets, they stop gas. the us is okay with this russian occupation, no more nato efforts to restore order in places like bosnia, so ignore the rhetoric. if it blows up the russians will look bad, again. if they manage to keep the peace obama can say they are repressing a democratic movement. its win win for obama. he just needs to posture about it, and move on the next thing, which is increasing NSA surveillance of american consumers in order to hand the responsibility for their welfare off to the wall street corporations.
For Leonid Kravchuk to say this pantomime could spark WW III is a tad OTT in my view, although a confrontation between US/West <-> Russia/China is on the cards.
The lies and hypocrisy spewing out of Western politicos is breathtaking...Obama, Kerry, Hague.
Well, it's 4:00PM GMT and no storm...
It's probably another red herring to stir up trouble
“I call on the Russian authorities to stop. Between our peoples should not be war. Does Russia not understand that this is the beginning of World War III?” he warned."
Another poorly crafted sound bite containing an idle threat from the makers of mayhem and destruction at the B.B.C. and Reuters...
The ones who told you about the collapse of a 47 story building in lower Manhattan that you didn't know about until 6 years later!
New alarm system installed at the FED -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pKG3DhjPQw
Janet, put the tuna sandwhich down. Save us!
Up to 10yrs’ jail for dual citizenship: Ukrainian bill targets tens of thousands
Not much to say about this...unless it is meant to inspire certain people in the "West".