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Missing Malaysian Flight Mystery Deepens: Pilot Investigated, Foul Play Suspected

Tyler Durden's picture




 

It has been over a week since Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370 disappeared without a trace, and the world is nowhere closer to finding either where the airplane and its 239 passengers and crew are to be found, nor what actually happened. Instead, what initially was speculation about a midair disintegration, and subsequently suggested a potential case of airplane terrorism gone wrong, has now transformed into a theory that the pilot and/or crew may have been engaged in "foul play", especially since it appears that based on tracking data, that the plane flew for nearly seven hours after someone "skilled" purposefully shut down its communications and tracking beacon: possibly indicative of a stealthy midair hijacking. However, the same satellite data gave no precise location, and the plane's altered course could have taken it anywhere from central Asia to the southern Indian Ocean.

More importantly, and what is missing so far, is that if indeed this was a hijacking, then where is the list of demands? Or was this merely repossession of something already onboard the plane, i.e. theft, ostesnisbly of something in the cargo hold, or the kidnapping or repossession of one or more passengers on board the plane? Also, if indeed the plane is safely somewhere else, as per the pilot's wishes, then how and why are the 200+ passengers, most of whom likely have portable communication devices, keeping quiet?

On the manifest above, while the main focus so far has been on the two passengers with stolen passports, we wonder how long until the two Ukrainians are thrown into the mix.

As for the topic of the plane's possible location considering the latest satellite tracking data, the Malaysian officials on Saturday released this map showing two corridors that the plane might be located on.

WaPo reports:

Malaysian Prime Minister Najib Razak said Saturday that, based on newly analyzed satellite data, the plane could have made last made contact anywhere along one of two corridors: one stretching from northern Thailand toward the Kazakhstan-Turkmenistan border, the other, more southern one stretching from Indonesia to the remote Indian Ocean.

 

Although U.S. officials previously said they believed the plane could have remained in the air for several extra hours, Najib said Saturday that the flight was still communicating with satellites until 8:11 a.m. — 7 ½ hours after takeoff, and more than 90 minutes after it was due in Beijing. There was no further communication with the plane after that time, Najib said. If the plane was still in the air, it would have been nearing its fuel limit.

 

The U.S. official said the search area is somewhere along the arc or circumference of a circle with a diameter of thousands of miles.

 

The new leads about the plane’s path, though ambiguous, have drastically changed a search operation involving more than a dozen nations. Malaysia on Saturday said that efforts would be terminated in the Gulf of Thailand and the South China Sea, the spot where the plane first disappeared from civilian radar.

 

Malaysian authorities are now likely to look for help from other countries in Southeast and South Asia, seeking mysterious or unidentified readings that their radar systems might have picked up.

The largely clueless Malaysian police, with few leads to puruse, have rapidly shifted their suspicion on the team of pilot and co-pilot. Reuters reports that minutes after Malaysian leader Najib Razak outlined investigators' latest findings about flight MH370 at a news conference, police began searching the house of the aircraft's 53-year-old captain for any evidence that he could have been involved in foul play.

Investigative sources told Reuters on Friday they believed the plane was following a commonly used navigational route when it was last spotted early on Saturday, northwest of Malaysia.

 

Their suspicion has hardened that it was flown off-course by the pilot or co-pilot, or someone else with detailed knowledge of how to fly and navigate a large commercial aircraft. No details have emerged of any passengers or crew with militant links or psychological problems that could explain a motive for sabotaging the flight.

 

The experienced captain, Zaharie Ahmad Shah, was a flying enthusiast who spent his off days tinkering with a flight simulator of the plane that he had set up at home, current and former co-workers said. Malaysia Airlines officials did not believe he would have sabotaged the flight.

 

The 27-year-old co-pilot Fariq Abdul Hamid was religious and serious about his career, family and friends said, countering news reports suggesting he was a cockpit Romeo who was reckless on the job.

A photo of the flight simulator set up in the pilot's house is shown below:

AFP provides some additional perspective on the pilot:

An Australian television report broadcast an interview with a young South African woman who said Fariq and another pilot colleague invited them into the cockpit of a flight he co-piloted from Phuket, Thailand to Kuala Lumpur in 2011. Since 9/11, passengers have been prohibited from entering cockpits during a flight. Malaysia Airlines has said it was "shocked" by the report, but that it could not verify the claims.

 

The son of a high-ranking official in the public works department of a Malaysian state, Fariq joined Malaysia Airlines when he was 20.

 

He is a mild-mannered "good boy" who regularly visited his neighbourhood mosque outside Kuala Lumpur, said the mosque's imam, or spiritual leader.

 

The far more seasoned Zaharie joined MAS in 1981 and had logged 18,365 hours of flying time.

 

Malaysian media reports quoted colleagues calling Zaharie a "superb pilot", who also served as an examiner, authorised by the Malaysian Civil Aviation Department, to conduct simulator tests for pilots.

 

The whole passenger manifest is likely to be re-examined.

So if the pilots were not involved, could it have been a hijacking by someone among the passengers (with or without the complict participation of the pilors)? Here suspicion will once again fall on two passengers who boarded with stolen EU passports. Interpol had identified the two men as Iranians: Seyed Mohammed Reza Delavar, who used a stolen Italian passport, and Pouria Nourmohammadi, who used an Austrian one. Both passports had been stolen in Thailand. Interpol chief Ronald Noble said last Tuesday that the men were thought to be illegal immigrants who had travelled from Doha to Kuala Lumpur in a round-about bid to reach Europe.

Interpol's information suggested the pair were "probably not terrorists", Noble said at the time.

Adam Dolnik, a professor of terrorism studies at the University of Wollongong in Australia, said he still doubted that organised terrorism was behind the Malaysian plane mystery.

 

While a group like Al-Qaeda "would love to bring down an airliner", a Malaysia Airlines plane made little sense as a target and the stolen passports had an "amateurish" element, Dolnik said. "Terrorists don't do (hijackings), because the chances of success have gone down," he said, citing the challenge of bringing weapons onto a plane and subduing other passengers.

 

There has been no indication yet of any possible terrorist involvement. But some academics suggest the theory requires further consideration. "Investigations should focus on criminal and terrorist motives," said Rohan Gunaratna, a terrorism expert at Singapore's Nanyang Technological University.

 

"It is likely that the aircraft was hijacked by a team knowledgeable about airport and aircraft security. It is likely they are supported by a competent team from the ground."

Which is why instead of merely looking at the passenger manifest, perhaps it is time to look at the cargo manifest as well. Was there anything on board the plane, one serving the all-important Beijing route, that may have made the stealthy theft of the plane a sufficiently attractive risk/return proposition to the pilots?

Purely hypothetically, a 777 has a cargo hold that, in addition to passengers and baggage, can hold somewhere between 20 and 25 tons. 25 tons of gold, on a less than public Malaysia-China "official import-bypassing" route, would have a value of a little over $1 billion, four times more than the value of a new Boeing 777. So perhaps instead of robbing the cargo from the plane, some more enterprising thought would be to get the pilots in on the play, and steal the entire plane, mid-flight.

Of course, all of the above is purely hypothetical, and we are confident once the plane is uncovered safe and sound (or not as the case may be) and with all the cargo accounted for, that yet another crazy conspiracy theory can be disproved.

And still, we wonder, would Malaysia Airlines be so kind as the disclose just what "other" cargo may have been on board the mysterious flight. Inquiring minds are dying to know.

* * *

Stepping away from the conspiracy ledge for a minute, here is the WSJ with the four main unanswered questions about the flight:

Was it a hijacking?

While Mr. Najib suggested that the plane's disappearance was due to "deliberate action," he stopped short of categorizing the event as a hijack. "I wish to be very clear: We are still investigating all possibilities as to what caused MH370 to deviate from its original flight path."

Aviation experts say that the likelihood of a hijack has increased significantly with the latest information, and a key to solving the mystery is to profile in detail every person aboard the jet. "Everything points to a hijack or something that was planned way in advance," said Mark Martin, an aviation consultant.

Did the plane crash, or did it land somewhere?

No further information was available about the state of the widebody jet and the 239 people on board after the last satellite communication was sent from it. There was no indication as to whether the aircraft crashed into the ocean—as several aviation experts have earlier suspected—or if it had actually landed.

Though experts say it is unlikely such a large jet could land undetected, investigators are actively pursuing the notion that the plane was diverted "with the intention of using it later for another purpose," a person familiar with the matter said earlier to The Wall Street Journal.

The search will now likely involve scores of other countries in South and Central Asia following the new information, raising the possibility that the jet may have reached some of the world's more politically unstable regions.

Whose deliberate actions?

Mr. Najib says the nation's authorities have "refocused" their investigation onto the crew and passengers. Experts say that the 777's multiple communication systems could only have been manually disabled by someone or people with detailed knowledge of the sophisticated jet's inner workings, thus putting the focus on the pilots or with passengers who have aviation experience.

"Whoever flew the aircraft was an outstanding pilot who was familiar with radar evasion techniques and fuel-burn management," said Mr. Martin, the aviation consultant.

Why can't the search parameters be narrowed?

Satellite information disclosed on Saturday indicate that the plane may have taken two possible tracks: a northerly corridor as far as the border of Kazakhstan and Turkmenistan, and a southerly route extending to the southern Indian Ocean. Mr. Najib explained that the type of satellite data couldn't confirm the precise location of the plane when it last made contact. Investigators are working to "further refine the information" on satellite data.

* * *

Finally, for all those pressed for time, just watch the following clip summarizing all the recent theories and views on flight MH370's whereabouts:

 

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Sat, 03/15/2014 - 15:57 | 4552557 lostintheflood
lostintheflood's picture

However, the same satellite data gave no precise location,

i call bullshit on this statement...

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:06 | 4552567 Dewey Cheatum Howe
Dewey Cheatum Howe's picture

Precise is relative you can determine a distance based on transmit and recieve times but without directional information that is a wide grid to search. Considering the height of the orbits that is alot of real estate to search through. Not all satelite information and transmissions are GPS related. The other issue is without multiple satellites you can't really use triangulation to determine an appoximate location. I don't know if that system has one or multiple satelites involved.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:13 | 4552581 Arius
Arius's picture

Who Cares?  another conspirancy theory ... like that flight that supposedly was shut out of new york, and this Pistorius trial in south africa .... media loves conspirancy theories.

 

on other news, Martin armstrong is reminding people that 2014 is exactly the 100 years anniversary of NY stock exchange closure for capital flights back in 1914 ,... cicles .... yeah right, will see....another conspirancy theorist ...

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:17 | 4552612 BaBaBouy
BaBaBouy's picture

""25 Tonnes Of GOLD Cargo""

EVERY Fecking Plane Flying Towards CHINA HAS GOLD On It...

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:23 | 4552626 Troll Magnet
Troll Magnet's picture

Iran did it!
No! It was Syria!
Iran!
Syria!
Iran!
Syria!
Iran...

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:49 | 4552702 TaxSlave
TaxSlave's picture

You can't triangulate from satellite unless you have extremely precise timing synchronization between the satellites.  It's unlikely that they do.

There are conflicting reports floating all over on whether or not the engine telemetry was transmitting data at all, and if it was, how it was shut off so that the radios only sent a ping ... or if it was shut off when it was shut off.  Some are claiming wild altitude excursions reported from that telemetry stream.

Altitude accuracy of primary radar is sketchy.  Decent placement of the target is tough without triangulation, which apparently they have now done after the fact.  Still there is no confirmation of altitude excursions by the military radar, which WOULD have picked that up if it actually happened.

Worse than the lack of real data and the constant stream of conflicting data is all the 'free associating' everybody in the press does.  The less they know about aviation and electronics the more air time they get to guess up wild scenarios.

 

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:53 | 4552721 tallen
tallen's picture

Malaysian Government probably shot it down by accident, trying to cover it up.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:15 | 4552802 zerozulu
zerozulu's picture

I also cannot rule out Dog the Bounty Hunter's involvement.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:36 | 4552872 Pinto Currency
Pinto Currency's picture

 

Check the hangars at Diego Garcia.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:53 | 4552926 Cacete de Ouro
Cacete de Ouro's picture

Yes,

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 18:24 | 4553010 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

This is a simple case of the Bermuda Triangle going on vacation to the Indian Ocean and causing the disappearance.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 18:47 | 4553063 nufio
nufio's picture

Am I the only one thinks this over coverage of this stupid incident has other reasons behind it? 200 people probalby died.. so fucking what? thousands of people die everyday in car accidents... and thousands more die of starvation and lack of access to health care around the world...   why are thousands of gallons of fuel being wasted combing the fucking ocean for a pieces of a plane that probably sunk by now !? this is beyond ridiculous. I wish ZH would stop covering this nonsense.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 18:59 | 4553101 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Well, if this were done remotely, it would pose a huge threat to a shithouse load of passengers worldwide. And the entire airline industry.

So it might be worth finding out.

Oh, and you forgot the hundreds of thousands that die at the hands of government, which wastes millions of barrels of fuel.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 21:25 | 4553506 philipat
philipat's picture

"i call bullshit on this statement..."

And you would be wrong, as follows:

  1. The aircraft was NOT transmitting telemetry. Without going into details, what the satelline was getting was an attempted "Handshake" from the ComSat transmittor. There was no connection and no data because MH did not subscribe to the Boeing sattelite ACARS monitoring service. So all the available data can establish is an angle from which the "Ping" was received, hence the two "Arcs" representing lines from which the same angle both North and South of the satellite's location, , stationary over the equator. These arcs are NOT represented as tracks that the aircraft took just that the last transmission, at 08:11 Local Malaysian time came from somewhere along one of these arcs.
  2. Inmarsat coverage of that geographical location was with a SINGLE satellite so there were NOT multiple readings from multiple satellites which could have been triangulated to provide more precise data.

I also note that we may NEVER know what happened. Even if the "Black Boxes" are found, The CVR (Cockpit Voice Recorder) only records a 2 hour "Loop" and the DFDR (Digital Flight Data Recorder), which record 25 hours of data, may tell us what we already roughly know, but with more precision. The wreckage, if located, MIGHT yield further information but the South Indian Ocean is very large and very deep. In fact, the perfect place to ditch an aircraft if you don't want what happened to become known. I would be asking about any large life insuranjce policies.

 

 

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 21:48 | 4553642 Pinto Currency
Pinto Currency's picture

 

There was a story in fall 2013 of nukes going missing from Dyess AFB Texas same day as Lindsey Graham warned that if US didn't attack Syria, US would be nuked.

http://benswann.com/lindsey-graham-to-charleston-support-war-in-syria-or...

Then a slew of nuke commanders were fired from the military and replaced with neocons.

 

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 07:27 | 4554353 negative rates
negative rates's picture

I think your head is starting to spin.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 11:46 | 4554885 Pinto Currency
Pinto Currency's picture

 

Here's a head spinner:

State Department, George Soros and neocons finance NGOs that stage a coup in Ukraine putting a group of Neonazis in power thereby seizing a country with vital energy and strategic value to both Europe and Russia.

The US and NATO then start issuing series of threatening statements to Russia if it respects a referendum in Crimea.

 

 

 

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 00:09 | 4553948 BraveSirRobin
BraveSirRobin's picture

It should be possible to narrow the geographic area down quite a lot by looking at the distance between sequntial ping arcs and making some aircraft airspeed assumptions. 

I rather think flying over the Asian land mass is less likely as someone's military or commercial radars should have picked it up. 

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 08:50 | 4554438 Debt-Is-Not-Money
Debt-Is-Not-Money's picture

"...South Indian Ocean is very large and very deep."

And full of sharks, especially around Diego Garcia.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 12:54 | 4555125 lostintheflood
lostintheflood's picture

philipat, the nsa knows what happened to that plane.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 18:53 | 4553081 Cap Matifou
Cap Matifou's picture

There are deleted reports about the pilot's family vacating the premises, _before_ the plane went hide-and-seek.

Pilot's family moves out from home

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://manage.mmail...

via GLP: http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message2507796/pg1

 

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 21:43 | 4553622 Cacete de Ouro
Cacete de Ouro's picture

You know what's priceless? What's priceless is that the Tylers can see the IP addresses of all posters. Why is this relevant? Well, it's relevant because with IP addresses, a web site can see where the people posting messages are based, by tracking the IP address back to, for example, an institution such as af.mil or defense.gov or even malaysia.gov.my. You get the picture. Then, run a few scripts and produce nice stats about the percentage of readers from various places. Now, that is Priceless.

(Unless some institutions have IP spoofing technology)

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 23:32 | 4553870 Keyser
Keyser's picture

Ever hear of a proxy?

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 23:43 | 4553890 Cacete de Ouro
Cacete de Ouro's picture

Yes, but some so called sophisticated places like Banks don't think of using that. Maybe military do, although I wouldn't be so sure, since I can recall a high profile web site that boasted that it's readership included a lot of US military bases and so forth

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 23:14 | 4553840 seek
seek's picture

GLP is a known Fed shill operation, so nothing from there is trusted. Both it and ATS went offline (to the minute) when all the federal websites went offline during the budget showdown last year. If you want some entertainment, just make a post mentioning "Tavistock."

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 21:09 | 4553549 Sam Clemons
Sam Clemons's picture

The signature is all over this one.

Flight 370, a 777, was hijacked on 3/7 on its 3700km flight to Beijing.  There were not 282 people on board, but of course 239.

But. Why?

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:57 | 4552937 CIABS
CIABS's picture

The "authorities" probably know what happened.  No upside in telling the world just yet.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 18:09 | 4552976 BurningFuld
BurningFuld's picture

I'm going with...It was captured by a UFO.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 19:46 | 4553244 BigJim
BigJim's picture

Yes, the US government are finally giving in to Krugman and are organising an 'alien' invasion. 

The plane was taken by Aliens! All hands to the (tax) pumps! 

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 23:36 | 4553882 Son of Loki
Son of Loki's picture

<<The "authorities" probably know what happened.  No upside in telling the world just yet.>>

 

That's what the lawyer down the block says. The Malaysians have delayed and obstructed in an attempt to minimize their own liability and try to shift it to tear-or-ists since he said insurance payouts [and law suit settlements] would probably be vastly different.

Sounds reasonable since the Malaysians have stalled all along so far ... to the chagrin of the Chinese gubmint. Odd how no other gubmint is pressurizing the malays to be more forthcoming...odd, that.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 00:47 | 4554011 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

I think the baby Skynet grabbed it as a plaything.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 15:47 | 4555857 chistletoe
chistletoe's picture

Has anyone checked eBay yet?  Under "aviation sales"?

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 21:54 | 4557057 ATM
ATM's picture

It's on Craigslist Vietnam.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 20:28 | 4553401 Kassandra
Kassandra's picture

"Malaysian Government probably shot it down by accident, trying to cover it up."

Very likely, considering the aircraft was flying without any identifying beacon. Or someone else shot it down, for the same reason.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 23:01 | 4553816 virgule
virgule's picture

Here is a plausible theory: if you use Occam's razor and "follow the money" principles (who benefits from this event), we are left with only a few options:

-mid-air self destruction: seems and less and less likely from the news trickling in

- terrorist plot gone seriously wrong; so wrong that no one found anything to be worried about...

- kidnapping of cargo or of the high-tech exectives onboard. Problem with this theory, is that for a good con job, the marks should never know they were the marks, giving time to the conmen to finish their affair and walk away quietly, never to be seen again. Here the entire world is looking, officially or unofficially (military). If there was something prized on board, it's going to be really difficult to make it surface without getting caught. Unlikely in my opinion.

- Doesn't leave much rational options left. Occams' razor tells us then to look for irrational options (to us).

Here is an easy one: despite being a generaly peaceful and moderate Islamic country, Malaysia does have active economic and cultural ties with many middle-east / central asian countries which are a lot less peaceful and sometimes not moderate at all. It's not that rare to see a nice/moderate Malaysian kid leave for Pakistan to study at some university, and come back a few years later dressed in strict Islamic fashion and actively preaching to local people about Islamic values.

This is rarely frowned upon in Malaysia, as there is no reason to: people generally embrace their religion as moderates, and in the absence of additional info/references, have no reason to fear or reject such "good youth" preaching "sound values".

I've seen many such Malaysian people change over the years. Not in a bad/evil way, but certainly in a much more strict / disciplined Islamic way, sometimes bordering on odd stubborness.

A plausible "irrational theory": one or both of the pilots has been convinced somehow by someone in Pakistan or Afghanistan or an Islamic ex-soviet state to steal and deliver a perfectly functional jumbo jet. They need a plane for some obscure purpose, but can't get one. This would be an ideal method.They are not worried about resurfacing with the jet later, as the jet itself is their primary goal.

Nobody would steal a French, American or Russian jumbo, for fear of being shot down while over the national airspace.

Malaysian jet are reasonably maintained and in good condition (prized asset => follow the money) but Malaysia is too small as a country (geographically, militarilly, geopolitically) to be able to stop someone determined to steal one of its planes. How many 3rd countries would dare shoot down a well identified MH plane flying "peacefully" over their airspace? It would take serious balls for e.g. Thailand or Indian armies to shoot down an MH plane that is well identifiable/trackable by military surveillance systems. Imagine you're the local air force commander in Khazakstan and you get a call from the Malaysian prime minister to shoot down an MH plane that you are seeing on your military radar, without transponders. My reaction would be to "let's pass on that one, let's keep monitoring - but not risk my professional career over an international clusterfuck".

So I bet all the militairies know where the plane is, but no one wants to act on it, because there is no legitimacy to do so, and the plane is now in a location that could trigger a very serious international dispute if there was a land-based assault to recover it. e.g. do you believe Malaysian seals could organize a successful penetration mission in Uzbekistan to recover the plane (which is now out of fuel) AND without risking a very serous incident with Russia? To make things worse, if indeed this is the work of Islamic extremists, it would put Malaysia at odds with their Islamic brothers if they took a drastic action. Not good for business.

So Malaysia might be caught in a catch 22 where they can't act and can't talk.

There is one thing that I'm certain of - Malaysia is very well connected with the highest levels of diplomats and international advisers. They are not Zimbabwe. If/when they become the fuse/trigger for a major international incident, the Malaysian government is highly likely to quickly understand the situation they're in, and highly unlikely to make dumb moves not well thought through.

<conspiracy /end>

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 01:05 | 4554049 Seer
Seer's picture

"mid-air self destruction: seems and less and less likely from the news trickling in"

How do you figure?  Curious...

Could if just be as simple as malfeasance?  Maybe some military fucked up (just the other day the British accidentally fired a missile at a dock where nuclear subs are services- fortunately it was a training missile), and everyone is running around trying to figure out what kind of spin to put on it?  Chinese?  US?

Fly-by-wire makes me a bit nervous as well.  Drones are hacked.

Maybe I'm just a bit jaded on all the "it's the radical Muslims" angle and I'm getting weary about accepting it as being such an instance...  But, as you've done here, best to lay out all possibilities and then evaluate them based on probability.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 05:35 | 4554288 virgule
virgule's picture

Well, a) mid-air self destruction woud have left some traces, even if small. With the amount of ships and planes searching the area, we should have found something by now. Perhaps not the black box and the answers, but traces. B) the authorities seem to agree (at the moment) that they plane did continue to fly for a long time.

If it was a military fuck up, Malaysia would definitely try to keep it very low profile, but e.g. China or India would have no problems informing the rest of the world of what they know, and demaning publicly some kind of apology and/or compensation for the loss of their citizens. Malaysia is not a serious geopolitical force powerful enough to influence other governments on a matter such as this.

My message was perhaps not very clear - "radical Muslim angle" is indeed one way to put it; I was trying to focus on the "irrational to westerners" hypothesis. As you highlighted, the line between "irrational to us" and "radical Muslims" can be very thin.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 12:59 | 4555145 Seer
Seer's picture

"mid-air self destruction woud have left some traces"

IF you were looking in the right location.  At this point it seems a bit hard to narrow down the actual flight path.  Not arguing here, just pressing logic.  If the possible flight path over water is certain to be limited then, yes, I can see the theory of destruction in mid-air being significantly lessened (though, there's still the issue of destruction over land).

"If it was a military fuck up, Malaysia would definitely try to keep it very low profile"

BUT, this assumes that ONLY Malaysia could be responsible.  I just can't help but thinking that China can't be ruled out: just reflect on Operation Northwoods.  The motives would be pretty standard- excuse to apply additional security/constraints on citizen's actions/movements.  And then there's also the possibility of Japan or the US meddling.

My comment about "radical Muslims" has more to do with the frequency of which this card is played.  That "radical Muslims" may or may not be involved is less the issue, I see it more as serving as a continued programming device.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 00:54 | 4554021 Miggy
Miggy's picture

Except the so called spy satellites supposedly show no midaire fireballs. If your theory is correct there is a coverup by many a government in the West.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 01:07 | 4554051 Seer
Seer's picture

How do satellites show mid-air fireballs?

What's the satellite coverage for the entire area (discussed)?

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 05:22 | 4554278 virgule
virgule's picture

Thermal imaging is a lot easier to analyse automatically than optical imaging. Infra-red detectors / satellites can easily tell when there is an unusual heat source somewhere. If you want to detect a missile going off, don't look for pictures of fast moving objects, look for unusual heat source from the propulsion system.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 16:04 | 4555900 Seer
Seer's picture

Yes, I understand about how it CAN happen (and the better ability to analyze electronically), are we certain that there were "eyes" on all the possible lcoations?  Are there satellites set to constantly monitor the locations in question?  If they aren't looking, or if they "blink,' then this aspect could be missed: someone could elaborate/estimate duration and intensity and whether the sensitivity of the seeing-eyes could actually detect this sort of thing.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:18 | 4552808 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

Yeah, this "data" is a conflicted, jumbled mess.  I still think most of this is consistent with a catastrophic loss of air pressure in the cockpit.  There was a plane flying over Hawaii that had the skin peeled off the cabin, right behind the cockpit and one stewardess was sucked out.  That sort of ariframe failure would lead to a really bad day.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:40 | 4552886 Beam Me Up Scotty
Beam Me Up Scotty's picture

Possible, but pilots are trained to deal with that. They have quick donning oxygen masks which they need to be able to get on in less than 5 seconds. Hypoxia will set in very quickly though at 35,000 feet, less than 30 seconds IIRC. Plane wouldn't alter altitude or course however if both were incapacitated, it would just run out of fuel and crash. That happened to a pro golfer in a Lear jet over the Midwest. Why didn't anyone send up a fighter jet to see what was up if they had it on military radar. They obviously knew they were not communicating with ATC. If they flew for hours after loss of communication, you would think they would have went to see what was up.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 19:24 | 4552909 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

Yes and no.  They were at cruising altitude.  If the pilot in command was sucked out of the plane, or incapacitated by flying debris, it's all over.  Imagine the wind, confusion, and panic at 1:30 AM when the other pilot is probably asleep.  Not something you can train for.  One direction change could result from something (a body) leaning on the yolk.  Most of the rest is garbled and doubtful, but it seems like the plane continued on autopilot until it ran out of fuel.

Occam's Razor:  The simplest explanation is usually the truth.  Another truth is that we may never know.

I over specified.  It only takes one sudden point of failure, the cockpit.  That could be smoke, fire, an explosion, even a maddening distraction.  Two of the hardest things for a pilot to deal with are smoke or simple disorientation.

 

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 23:07 | 4553831 sunnyside
sunnyside's picture

You're right, the simplest explanation is usually the truth.  Muslims hijacked it, but then screwed up and the damn thing ended up in the middle (now bottom) of the Indian Ocean.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 01:01 | 4554034 Freddie
Freddie's picture

$290 to 300 million plane and the airline does not have it loaded up with stuff that the pilot or a hijacker could not turn off.   You can find a $30 cell phone anywhere in the world down to a few feet and they cannot find this plane?  Somebody is lying.  If Boeing and AirBus do not have secret pingers with a GPS hidden on every plane for the airline then they are stupid.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 03:58 | 4554186 tenpanhandle
tenpanhandle's picture

sum ping wong!

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 05:10 | 4554267 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

Boeing, the insurers, the lenders, the airline (well...maybe not the airline). Some entity would have an interest in having Lo-Jacked the aircraft. FFS, Cadillacs can send 911 to your location.

They need to get the airplane repo guys on the job.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 06:25 | 4554307 Berspankme
Berspankme's picture

You mean they didn't buy the OnStar package?

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 15:57 | 4555883 chistletoe
chistletoe's picture

but I thought that the OnStar package could not be disabled ... if they didn't pay for it, they don't get to see  the output, but OnStar still does ....

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 01:02 | 4554037 kadoka
kadoka's picture

Reports say the plane increased it's altitude to 42,000 ft for a short time before dropping back down.  Maybe intentional Hypoxia was the plan.  A nice quick way to deal with the passengers.   No heros rushing the cockpit.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 00:57 | 4554029 Miggy
Miggy's picture

Except two of the main communication tools "were" disabled with a gap of 12 minutes. This fact also dispells the midaire catastrophic event theory (coupled with no satellite imagry of a fireball)

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 22:10 | 4553697 post turtle saver
post turtle saver's picture

it is, in fact, highly likely that they do... since they carry atomic clocks

and, the term you're looking for is trilateration, not triangulation

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 01:09 | 4553997 Element
Element's picture

 

 

"There are conflicting reports floating all over on whether or not the engine telemetry was transmitting data at all, and if it was, how it was shut off so that the radios only sent a ping"

You pull the circuit breaker on the SATCOM on the cockpit circuit breaker panels. All satellite distributed telemetry immediately stops. It's not even complicated.

Transponders and all radios will still work unless you pull their circuit breakers as well. The pilots can turn off any all electrical systems in this way, at any time. Its vital to flight safety that they can do that. Thus all the circuit breaker bus panels are built into the cockpit itself so pilots can access them fairly easily at any time, in order to reset them, or else to switch to a second backup bus system, or an emergency electrical bus. Many jets have three separate buses, and three circuit breaker boards, for full electrical system redundancy.

This is why it's so implausible for a jet to completely loose all comms, sensors or electrical power, without there being time to contact ATC, to inform them of the situation, and give a precise location, and declare an emergency (if necessary).

Plus all jets have a, ELT, Emergency locator Beacon, like the malfunctioning one that caused that Ethiopian 787 to burn on the Tarmac in the UK last year. So even if all the electrics and radios were out, the pilots could (and actually would) activate the ELT in such an emergency. That would in fact be a part of their emergency checklist, in such a situation.

Thus if the ELT was not activated, either the jet disintegrated suddenly (zero evidence of this), or it crashed more or less like Air France flight 447 did where no declaration to ATC was given (even though it took over 4 minutes for that jet to hit the water). Or else someone turned all the systems off, and made sure the ELT was not activated.

But in that scenario they must have overlooked the SATCOM ACARS link, which seems like quite an oversight if they were in fact familiar with the jet's systems, and its electrical panels. Which they would have to be, to contemplate doing all this.

However, it is entirely possible even a pilot would not know that the engine monitoring computer system would still be able to send data burst messages to the engine maker, via the ACARS SATCOM link, thus may not have realized it was necessary to also disconnect the SATCOM's power. '

i.e. most pilots literally will not know anything about the engine's SATCOM monitoring telemetry system, they won't know the engine data is constantly being logged off-board the plane. The pilot may also not know that all faults in a jet's other systems, electrics, hydraulics, autopilot servos, or avionics systems (basically anything with sensors and IC chips), are also constantly logged on modern flight decks and fault data is in many instances auto-sent to a ground-based maintenance section, to cue parts logistics from a warehouse and to schedule the jet's servicing or parts replacements. The pilot might simply think the ground engineers download that from the jet at the destination, but not so, so even the pilots will probably not know the SATCOM has to be turned off too, if someone wanted to make a jet just disappear without any electronic trace.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 06:55 | 4554324 Chicken_Little
Chicken_Little's picture

Element, your post is good stuff and you must be from the enginnering side of the electronics in modern jets. Keep up the good posts!

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 08:17 | 4554391 Element
Element's picture

Just a pilot who reads the manuals and techie details of how it all works. Geo by trade.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:23 | 4552816 caustixoid
caustixoid's picture

Oh, they've simplified the list - cleaner, simpler than having "Palestinians!"  "Libya!" "Iraq!" "Sudan!" with crossouts.

 

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 23:20 | 4553848 newbie vampire
newbie vampire's picture

Could be Al Shahab sympathizers and the plane is now in Somalia.  The pilot of the plane took precautions to disguise his intended destination.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 18:31 | 4553024 UncleFurker
UncleFurker's picture

 

It landed on an island somewhere in the Indian Ocean, the Chinese gold was offloaded onto a Navy submarine, and someone got a lesson in not threatening to sell treasuries.

 

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 09:07 | 4554470 jbvtme
jbvtme's picture

where did the plane with the gold cargo land? we can safely report that it was NOT princeton, nj

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 07:13 | 4554339 Wahooo
Wahooo's picture

They don't know where it is, and they won't see it coming.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:08 | 4552586 lostintheflood
lostintheflood's picture

dewey, you are correct.  otoh, this is one of the most closely watched areas in the world...they're trying to make us believe they have no idea where to start looking...i call bullshit.  the nsa knows where that plane was 7 hours after it diverted its course.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:18 | 4552611 Lost Word
Lost Word's picture

Active Cell phones would have given GPS location or nearest cell phone tower location

to the telecom company.

Reports of 19 hijacked cell phones that were answered and immediately hung up.

Implying that the passenger cell phones were collected from the passengers.

The Government and news media are lying, as usual.

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2014/03/15/mh370/

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:30 | 4552643 BaBaBouy
BaBaBouy's picture

Good Point...
I Heard This After The First Day, And Ever Since The Medias
Are Totally SIlent On This Aspect.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:36 | 4552657 BaBaBouy
BaBaBouy's picture

If SOMALIA Was In Range, That Would Be The First Place I'd Look... '$$$

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:52 | 4552713 headhunt
headhunt's picture

That would have been a cell satellite - a large area

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:01 | 4552751 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

Good grief, are people stupid and gullible: Unless you're rich and have a Satellite phone, when was the last time YOU had any bars or connectivity at Altitude and Speed?

Cell towers don't beam towards the sky, but thave a narrow and biased vertical cone of transmission.

Even when you fly into a large metropolitan area, you don't get a connection until you're down to about 1,000 AGL.

Which is why I don't buy the MSM bullshit about those cell calls (at altitude and speed) by the 911 callers on those planes. FYI, I tried to duplicate this in 2011-2014, using AT&T and Verizon phones, and had zero success.

That's why I call "Bullshit, bullshit, bullshit!"

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:11 | 4552781 Lost Word
Lost Word's picture

Possibly the cell phones rang when the hijacked jet was at low altitude,

as some news reports have stated the jet descended quickly after the hijacking started,

flying low to avoid radar perhaps,

or that the hijacked jet had already landed safely somewhere,

where there are cell phone towers existing.

No reports in this case of any actual conversations, just ringing connections,

unlike the 9-11 hijacking stories.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:55 | 4552931 Beam Me Up Scotty
Beam Me Up Scotty's picture

Number one, there are no cell towers in the ocean. Number two, your phone won't work when you are at speed and altitude. I have tried it. Can't even get your internet connection to work. Now I've only tried it at cruise and only in the Midwest where towers are probably more sparse. I'm sure Malaysia doesn't have a 4g network all over their country.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 05:29 | 4554284 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

How about after it lands (hypothetically speaking)? If within a coverage area, the phones would pop up on towers, assuming they had not been collected and disabled in some fashion.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 08:12 | 4554389 Beam Me Up Scotty
Beam Me Up Scotty's picture

On some small island in the middle of the Indian Ocean? What makes you think there is cell phone coverage there? Even in the US there are plenty of areas with no cell coverage. I hunt in Montana and lose coverage out there sometimes. And this happened on the other side of the planet.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 20:49 | 4553488 monkeyboy
monkeyboy's picture

Yep I think it's called voice mail.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 01:04 | 4554044 Element
Element's picture

Kirk, just note the link given above, it's to "Veterans Today", one of the biggest producers as well as aggregators of fanciful fictional bullshit on the internet in recent years. Only a fool would quote them as a news source for anything.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:45 | 4552687 zerozulu
zerozulu's picture

Most countries are not giving precise location because it will reveal the location of their covert monitoring stations.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:10 | 4552593 BaBaBouy
BaBaBouy's picture

""25 Tonnes Of GOLD Cargo""

 

Could It Be The FED/GERMAN GOLD Repatriation On The Down-Low, Via Malaysia & Beijing ???

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:12 | 4552602 cossack55
cossack55's picture

Part of Yamashita's horde?  Golden Dragon?

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:27 | 4552843 Herd Redirectio...
Herd Redirection Committee's picture

Yes, because all the gold on Earth (basically) has been rehypothecated, but not this mythical 'Yamashita's Gold'...

Its like the idea that the Military has massive amounts of secret tech.  Some, definitely, but given the size of the annual budget, at some point you ask the question if most of it doesn't go towards graft, as has happened in every empire and every massive military machine in history.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:22 | 4552623 Lore
Lore's picture

...Or the Ukrainian bullion, plus political prisoners (family members, etc.).   

Take a look at Diego Garcia: Map, Wiki, "Camp Justice" (long runway, big hangars, isolated, controlled) 

Since the majority of passengers are Chinese, be sure that the Chinese government and associated groups are looking at this matter very carefully.  Expect special efforts to surveil probable locations.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 20:27 | 4553392 analyzer_66
analyzer_66's picture

A few Chinese go missing? Million more where they came from unless they are super rich elite govt connected types.
This plane is intact somewhere. Someone else said there are satellites that can read license plates in the sky since the 1960's so a sea crash would have been detected by now. Why the disinfo in the press? Who benefits? In the age of total surveillance a plane this big can simply vanish but satellites can see radiation leakage from fukushima or see hot spots of molten metal where the trade centers stood? Something does not compute here.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 21:47 | 4553625 Lore
Lore's picture

The fact that these particular Chinese passengers can 1) afford and 2) get authorization for international travel tells us that these are not peasants. They are from successful families, probably with ties to the Party.  Party officials take their families on holidays to Southeast Asian holiday resorts. 

The Chinese will not let this go. Honour is at stake. They will pursue this to the ends of the Earth and take steps to eliminate those responsible.

It does seem clear that the plane landed somewhere, with plans to move it again. The insignia and markings are probably changed, and the plane could be anywhere now -- even the United States, at certain airfields. 

There are interesting ramifications. From now on, the plane you see in the air may not be the plane that you think you see.  Transponder and related signatures can be altered and copied.  You get the idea. 

The people behind this are very likely the same bunch that choreographed 911.  There are similarities.  As such, one must assume the most devilish plans in the works and anticipate accordingly.  It is getting very hard to know who to trust.  The disappearance of this plane may be remembered as a big step toward World War.  "Not only must Justice be done; It must be SEEN to be done."

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 22:22 | 4553721 phaedrus1952
phaedrus1952's picture

 ... and take steps to eliminate those responsible.

Lore, I grew up in an era where we weekly got under our desks to survive a nuke attack by the big, bad, Russkies and the aware adults argued about "Who lost China?"

Now, in this most extreme of bizarro worlds, more and more Americans are looking to the leader of Russia to enforce righteousness and - in this particular instance of AWACs hijacking and probable slaughtering of another few hundred innocents - we look to the freakin Chicoms to apply justifiable vengence. 

What the fuck happened to my world?

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 22:49 | 4553774 Lore
Lore's picture

That's a fair question that can be answered in a variety of ways, depending on your understanding of world affairs, historical context and different narratives, but the short answer is that the people in charge are psychopaths, similar to us, but a subspecies.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 03:00 | 4554120 Flagit
Flagit's picture

someone posted about this in an earlier thread.

 

http://www.4key.net/asia/malaysia-airlines-flight-370-patents-patents-pa...

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 10:21 | 4554631 Bollixed
Bollixed's picture

I wouldn't give too much credence to this story for a number of reasons...

First off, there is no such Patent number granted and the Patent numbering system does not reflect this type of sequential number. Secondly, if you search the USPTO using the Patent number in the article it comes back a 'no result'. No surprise there.

I hold a number of US Patents and the premise of this story makes no sense to me. Only the Assignee of the Patent gets to make money on it, not the inventors. Shocking, isn't it. If the inventor(s) are the assignees the royalties automatically fall to their estate.

I call nonsense...

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 05:25 | 4554281 yrbmegr
yrbmegr's picture

Remember when that 727 disappeard from Angola back in 2003?

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 19:13 | 4554913 a common man
a common man's picture

lot of trolls following this topic

 

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:27 | 4552633 Payne
Payne's picture

someone flew the aircraft into Radar shadows (areas where there is no radar coverage) and landed it.  That takes extensive planning and inteligence.  Military pilots or aircraft controllers.  It will be easy for people in the know to figure out where the aircraft could not have been and figure where it must be.  Striking distance of Israel is my bet today.  Easy to file a false flight plan as a Lear or Citation jet been assigned code and fly a EMP directly to Israel without anyone noticing.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:57 | 4552741 g speed
g speed's picture

why would the Mossad do that?

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:11 | 4552788 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

How about 800,000 (25x1000x32.15) golden reasons?

A lot of gold been "relocated" in recent years and months.

ps. Those people are 'gone'. Sociopathic swine!

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:17 | 4552806 Lost Word
Lost Word's picture

Some crazy person with an internet web page recently suggested,

the hijacked jet will be used for a False Flag attack,

against a target which will cause World War Three to start.

Who wants WW III ?

Who could start WW III ?

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:45 | 4552896 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

Flight MH370 - number of missing Freescale employees - 20.
EgyptAir Flight 990 - number of missing Egyptian Generals and trained Patriot Missile techs killed - 33.

Only a naive fool concentrates any number of vital personel on any flight...it's just a very big, tempting target.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 04:07 | 4554204 tenpanhandle
tenpanhandle's picture

Like a chinook flying target stuffed full of Navy Seals.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 07:30 | 4554354 negative rates
negative rates's picture

Maybe it just got droned to russia, you know how complicated those computer systems are, tomorrow they can prolloy tell you anything, and you will believe it.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 18:15 | 4552986 robertsgt40
robertsgt40's picture

I would suggest the plane was remotely hijacked like planes on 911(except for cruise missile that hit pentagon). Has anyone checked Diego Garcia? It doesn't appear on search maps.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 20:14 | 4553338 piliage
piliage's picture

Diego Garcia, hmmm. Probably not my first choice for a hijacked triple 7. http://www.clubhyper.com/reference/images/b2diegogarciags_4.jpg

 

 

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 04:59 | 4554261 Ralph Spoilsport
Ralph Spoilsport's picture

Those planes are parked very close to each other. One enemy stealth plane with cluster munitions could take out every one of them. We made the same mistake at Pearl Harbor.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 09:05 | 4554464 duo
duo's picture

Now the Russians are saying it was diverted by the US Navy to Diego Garcia.  They believe the cargo carried by the Maersk Alabama (with the two dead Navy Seals) was loaded onto that plane.

"Most sadly, this report concludes, the US is actually able to conceal the reason(s) for the “disappearance” of Flight 370 as they have already done so after the events of 11 September 2011 when the then Bush regime “disappeared” American Airlines Flight 77 and its 64 passengers and crew after falsely claiming it hit the Pentagon, but which was confirmed by the CNN News Service [see video HERE] not to have happened."

Rumor, of course.

 

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 22:02 | 4553676 phaedrus1952
phaedrus1952's picture

Hey, Sarge, the original report from Boeing saying 5 hours of transmission was received, along with the general direction of the flight as reported by Malaysian radar would place the plane right around Diego Garcia when the engines stopped operating.

This "information" reported in Bezos' rag - along with all future publicly disseminated stuff - may best be viewed warily as an expanded flight path coupled with the already-underway demonization of the pilot offers convenient scapegoats for the actual perpetrators.

This was clearly an AWACS hijacking and remote commandeering for an as yet unidentifiable purpose.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 22:04 | 4553685 Buck Johnson
Buck Johnson's picture

What was in the cargo, that is the billion dollar question.  And if it was alot of gold, then this could have easily have been a state sponsored hijacking.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 03:38 | 4554160 californiagirl
californiagirl's picture

If you knew precisely where the plane was and it had landed in one piece, would you tell the media and thus broadcast to the highjackers that you knew where to go? Or would you prefer to let them think you were off on a wild goose chase while you implemented a rescue plan?

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 11:14 | 4554792 Estrella
Estrella's picture

However, the same satellite data gave no precise location,

i call bullshit on this statement...

Maybe not.

Like another commenter said, not all transmission give coordinate information. ACARS position reports in some software loads, are automatic. But each ACARS transmission costs money (not much) so many companies turn this feature off to save pennies (lots of money spread across a fleet operating for years). Many long haul jets have automatic links to ATC for position reports and ATC communications as well. It is my impression that these can be disabled in the cockpit via circuit breakers. And many jets have engine reports periodically transmitted by the engines, but, these probably would not have position information.

The problem here is plausible deniability.

Frankly, I think they have a lot more information then they are releasing, but, it may not be enough information to know for sure. Remember, comm coverage in the southern part of the Indian ocean, not a normal civilian area of operation, could be quite limited.

Now the question is why?  If the crew wanted to crash it, they easily could have, why continue to fly, unless you wanted the jet, or passengers, or cargo? 

Why steal a plane in this manner? There are easier ways to get 777s. Even a tiny plane (such as a Lear Jet or an F-16) can carry a nuke, you don't need a 777.

Okay, if it is not the jet, who was in the passenger list that they wanted? And if there was someone (or group) is this the easiest way to kidnap them?

Cargo. What was in the belly? I personally have hauled lots of gold (and cash) around in the belly, maybe there was something in the cargo hold they wanted.

Really, this is truly a mystery.

One thing though, if she was pointed toward Diego Garcia... then we know who did it. Lets hope not.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 15:58 | 4552561 Troy Ounce
Troy Ounce's picture

 

 

Stag party

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:12 | 4552603 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

Would that be Hangover IV?

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:37 | 4552661 blindman
blindman's picture

the distractions are endless and the method works
as the button is pushed once the process is self
perpetuating and futile; then behind the scenes
control is maintained, mass mind control is easy
for the well trained professional.
it was revealing that o man admitted/likened his two terms
as president were to the hangover movies which i have
never seen. i guess i'll have to watch?

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 23:37 | 4553884 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

I watched the first one. It will make you laugh, but it is pretty bad. Male humor taken over the top, almost. Lots of caricatures interacting with each other on the screen. O saying that was mouth gaping stunning. All a joke, right?

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 01:48 | 4554080 Element
Element's picture

Terrific birth certificates though, he has several official versions of it.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:04 | 4552571 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

what do they love in that area of the world? What are they buying like crazy....hmmm......

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:56 | 4552732 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture

Craigslist - Vietnam 

 

 

Boeing 777-300 - 1500000

Slightly used Boeing 777-300 for sale.

Asking for $15,000,000 USD, or best offer (this includes all the snacks in the plane).

Not much fuel in the plane at the moment, but it's in great flying condition. ABSOLUTELY NO JOY RIDES!

SOLD AS--IS. NO TRADES OR RETURNS. ALL DEALS ARE FINAL.

Ask for Fariq when calling and setting up appointments to see the plane.

  • do NOT contact me with unsolicited services or offers

post id: 4372477162

 

posted: 2 days ago

 

email to friend

 

http://vietnam.craigslist.org/for/4372477162.html

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:19 | 4552812 Lost Word
Lost Word's picture

Somebody with a sense of humor.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 18:01 | 4552952 Cacete de Ouro
Cacete de Ouro's picture

This is not a sexual service.....

(Just to be clear that it is)

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 06:37 | 4554314 Berspankme
Berspankme's picture

Please disregard the rather phallic appearance of this jet

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:05 | 4552572 duo
duo's picture

Pilot rumor network said that 50 seats were not filled, even though there were passengers wanting standby seats.  That's an extra 2 tons of gold it could carry.

My guess is Somalia somewhere.  You can stretch the fuel range by flying slow.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:43 | 4552673 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

.

Pilot rumor network said that 50 seats were not filled

Makes sense. The graphic above shows that there were 227 passengers aboard. The maximum seating capacity indicated for a 777-200 is 282, which would be a difference of 55.

It's not clear, though, whether this exact plane was configured as a sardine can or if it was configured with fewer seats to increase passenger comfort. Nevertheless, 50 unfilled seats is certainly plausible.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:50 | 4552701 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

But what if those 50 sets WERE filled. Filled by TERRISTS wearing invisibility cloaks......?? Are you thinking what I'm thinking.........??

 

 

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:58 | 4552742 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

.

But what if those 50 sets WERE filled. Filled by TERRISTS wearing invisibility cloaks......?? Are you thinking what I'm thinking.........??

Yep, I'm with you and I think you're right.

Those terrists could be used to come up with ideas for a whole series of airline disaster movies. It would make MILLIONS!

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:14 | 4552797 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

If they were equipped with shrink rays and parachutes the possibilities of it's whereabouts are nearly endless....

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 23:02 | 4553818 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

ROMULANS!

I knew it.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 03:14 | 4554136 Flagit
Flagit's picture

Are you thinking what I'm thinking.........??

 

they could steal allll the airline peanuts they want.....

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 20:07 | 4553296 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

The best fuel economy is at optimal air density (altitude) and speed, and no headwind.

If you slow too much, you lose altitude and fly in denser air that provides more resistance.

I haven't checked with Scotty, but I think they like max Altitude for reasons of fuel economy. Scotty?

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 22:17 | 4553709 post turtle saver
post turtle saver's picture

50 seats not filled with associated luggage isn't just more that can be shipped, it's also more fuel that can be taken on board... thereby extending range

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 03:35 | 4554137 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

Ooh, Perceptive! :-)

Let's try some math: 50 people x 250 lbs/person (including luggage) comes to 12,500 lbs.

That's about 5 tons of jet fuel. That can get you to lots of (out of the way) places.

Anybody know how far that much fuel takes you? Scotty?

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 07:17 | 4554333 Element
Element's picture

Depends on TOW weights, cruise speed and weight in the phase of flight (i.e. how much fuel you've already burned down, thus weight you've lost, which gradually reduces the angle of attack of the wing to the air stream, thus drag declines as the flight proceeds, thus burn rates decline further) but the typical rate used in range calculations for a 777 is:

~17,850 lbs/hr @ 475 kts in the cruise phase (8,100kg/hr).

12,500 lb is 70.03% of that hourly burn (i.e. 42 minutes in the air).

So 70.03% of 475  = 334 nautical miles.

Which equates to 618 km air distance or 384 statute miles.

 

But now do you have a head-wind component, or a tail-wind component, which modifies this range further? i.e. the ground track distance will not be the same as the air distance flown by this amount of fuel.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 09:16 | 4554485 Being Free
Being Free's picture

probably a significant head wind on the northern arcs easterly course...

Wind map at 250 hPa (~35k ft) on Mar 8:

http://earth.nullschool.net/#2014/03/08/1200Z/wind/isobaric/250hPa/orthographic=-277.45,5.35,361

click on text "earth" to change parameters...click and drag on globe to rotate globe

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 05:31 | 4554097 Element
Element's picture

 

 

"You can stretch the fuel range by flying slow."

Well there's no westerly jet stream flow at those low latitudes however a flight from Malaysia to China will not, even if using up completely the mandatory 90-mins minimum IFR fuel reserves, on long-range cruise settings, will not reach Africa's coastline. It would fall well short of that. The five hours of known flight is not going to take you much beyond about Pakistan or the Northern Himalayan plateau (I seriously doubt it could reach could Diego Garcia with a fuel load for China, for one thing the Jetstream will also become a limiting factor if going too far south westwards in that direction).

What is for certain though is Malaysia has no radar capability that could track that jet beyond a direct line of sight. That track could only have come from an over the horizon radar system. As far as I know only Australia (definitely) and China (possibly) have an OTHR radar system that could track it continuously throughout its entire flight path, from beginning to end.

"The JORN is so sensitive it is able to track planes as small as a Cessna 172 taking off and landing in East Timor 2600 km away [that was in 1999 btw]. Current research is anticipated to increase its sensitivity by a factor of ten beyond this level. It is also reportedly able to detect stealth aircraft, [it routinely detects US B2 stealth bombers over the central and western Pacific so it can easily see an airliner at multiple ionospheric bounce (very long) range] as typically these are designed only to avoid detection by microwave radar.[4] Project DUNDEE[19] was a cooperative research project with American missile defence research, into using JORN to detect missiles.[20] The JORN is anticipated to play a role in future Missile Defense Agency initiatives, detecting and tracking missile launches in Asia." [That was the situation in about 1997, the system is far more sentitive and at much longer range today.]

 

If JORN was sending out its usual regional monitoring pulses the ADF recorded multiple time slice pictures of this airliner's track, and Canberra will know basically where it went.

The question is did the jet actually have a fuel-load consistent with a flight into a Chinese destination, plus the mandatory 90 mins minimum IFR reserve? The airline operator will have the actual fuel loading on that jet at time of take off, as that data is routinely sent by all airline crews to the operator's regional base. (usually it's sent via ACARS, either a HF, UHF, or SATCOM version of ACARS and sometimes it's transmitted verbally, via telephone if the data link is not working). They normally transmit the full takeoff details, including fuel load, passengers, and all weights, to the operator's base, just prior to taxi to the takeoff runway as a part of calculating the takeoff distance sand throttle settings required for that takeoff and aircraft weight configuration.

So how far the plane could fly will be known to within about +/-10 minutes flight time, and available radius. Then it's a question of did it land on a runway or even a dry packed lake bed, or gibber plain? Or did it crash?

The fact is large jets can land on dirt, C-17As do it and take off again. But even a jet not designed to take off again, from dirt, probably can land on it, if it's flat enough and the rocks are small enough. A desert gibber plain or salt pan would be nearly perfect for a landing and a GPS based FMS RNAV system can fly directly to any user defined point coordinate and altitude, and then fly a GPS-guided VNAV LNAV 'precision' approach, to even a pre-surveyed lake bed or flat surface area. The GPS coordinates alone are enough to land a jet like that on autopilot alone. And it will land within meters of where a sophisticated hijacker wanted it to land.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:06 | 4552579 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

I just wish they'd find it so the newsies will stop blathering on-and-on-and-on about it in speculative circles.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:48 | 4552905 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

I heard, on the Internet, that it was sighted flying over Detroit a few days ago and the Bloods shot it down.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:06 | 4552580 miker
miker's picture

I believe it was the co-pilot.  He had to have killed the pilot (slit his throat).  With others involved from the cabin, phone calls/texts would have gotten out.  So no-one knew.  Being a night flight, no one would be able to determine much of where they were going. 

I wonder if the report of climbing to 48K feet was to suffocate the passengers.  Couldn't the co-pilot have depressuried the plane and survived on oxygen himself.  Then back down to lower elevation?  He flew a long distance so the plane would not be found.  The fear/unknown factor appears to be what this is all about. 

The plane is in a million pieces somwhere in the Indian Ocean.  I think the US with their satellite technology are the ones that pushed Malaysia into this new theory even though Malaysia military radar knew the plane had doubled back.  The US probably has the best idea of where the plane finally went down and perhaps we will hear in a few days sighting of debris.

No, the young co-pilot ----very religious is my guess for the culprit.  What a waste.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:11 | 4552599 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

The co-pilot at 27 would be young enough to still want 72 virgins.

Who the hell wants a virgin anyway?  Give me a Woman who knows what she is doing.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:34 | 4552651 Miffed Microbio...
Miffed Microbiologist's picture

Well, I believe the Koran did specify 72 virgins, however I don't think it was specific to the species. And Mr concurs with you, nothing like experience to make the bedroom hot. ;-)

Miffed;-)

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:56 | 4552934 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

Nothing worse than seducing a young woman, slowly undressing her, and then she pulls out a laminated instruction sheet with such info as "cock go here" in pidgin English.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 18:05 | 4552963 Miffed Microbio...
Miffed Microbiologist's picture

Nothing worse for the man when he finally finds the target and goes to town, she says " Is it in yet?" ;-)

Miffed;-)

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 19:30 | 4553204 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

Well that could be a commentary on the man, or on the over-used delicates of the woman, right? ;)

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 19:45 | 4553243 Miffed Microbio...
Miffed Microbiologist's picture

Touché, but then again the man may utter the same words himself during such an unsatisfactory experience. May we both never hear them. One word.... Kegels. ;-)

Miffed;-)

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 06:24 | 4554306 Disenchanted
Disenchanted's picture

Like throwing a hotdog down a hallway?

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 11:58 | 4554915 dogbreath
dogbreath's picture

like throwing a Smokie down the hall way

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 16:57 | 4552739 pops
pops's picture

I think that was a misprint.  It was supposed to say one 72 year old virgin. 

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 18:07 | 4552969 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

My usual hilarious insightful snark aside, a commentary on how much your .gov hates and reviles you is exemplified in the fact that they do not take EVERY holy warrior they kill and bury him in the skin of a pig.

This would put a serious dent in recruitment of nut jobs; the simple fact our evil, treasonous "leaders" do not do so is ipso facto evidence of how, literally, your lives and those of your kids mean less to them than pulling wings off flies.

I'd inject the captured and condemned with the blood of an Orthodox Jew, and feed him alive on National TV to feral pigs...

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 18:28 | 4553017 Miffed Microbio...
Miffed Microbiologist's picture

I personally would use porcine coated bullets and would accept the wrathful label of insensitivity.

Miffed;-)

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 19:39 | 4553220 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

While an excellent practice it fails to achieve the level of visceral propaganda.

Nothing would grab the attention of a sub 75 IQ holy warrior potential recruit like a fellow warrior of Islam devoured alive by happy, hungry squealing pigs.

"Chechen Terrorists to be Buried in Pigskin

According to the Moskovski Komsomol newspaper, Russian security forces have decided to bury the terrorists from last's week's hostage siege wrapped in pig's skin. The aim is to deter potential Islamic terrorists from future attacks.

Shahidi (Jihad martyrs) believe by their nefarious acts that they ascend immediately to heaven. Using their beliefs against them, wrapping their corpses in 'unclean' pigskin prevents them from entering heaven for eternity."

Deterrent of not, do it for the lulz.

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 20:04 | 4553295 Miffed Microbio...
Miffed Microbiologist's picture

I believe Gen. John J. Pershing did this in the Philippines to stop Islamic extremism by executing Muslim terrorists and burying them with pig's blood and entrails. I'm not sure if this really happened but makes for a damn good story. I think it was in Julius Caesar's Commentaries of Gallic War he described similar tactics to demoralize the Germanic tribes by cutting down their Sacred Oak Trees who housed their Gods.

Either shit or get off the pot. Win the war or don't bother to engage. The idea sending in young men to fight in such a restrictive manner that would cost lives is highly repugnant to me. And they wonder why My Lai Massacres occur.

Miffed;-)

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 00:47 | 4554009 Socratic Dog
Socratic Dog's picture

Miffed, you're a fucking moron.  How many people do you think your government has killed in the last 20 years in your name?  How do you think that compares to the muslims' numbers?  100 to one maybe?

A couple of years ago I read somewhere (ZH maybe) that, between them, Bush and Obama are responsible for the killing of 200,000 children.  How many kids would you say the evil muslims have killed?  1,000 maybe?

How do you recommend burying the drone-driving killers of women and children collecting firewood?  Wedding parties?

Incidently, speaking from some experience, the deflowering of virgins is fine sport indeed.  I'll take a virgin over a fucked-out old baggage any day.  Christ, I probably deflowered your wife.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 01:23 | 4554042 Miffed Microbio...
Miffed Microbiologist's picture

Well, yours was the funniest post I have read all evening. Moral high ground while funking virgins with gusto as a sport. Strange combination. Perhaps you should investigate drugs for schizophrenia or a bilateral orchiectomy to spare other virgins from your offending organ.

Miffed;-)

P.S. I don't have a wife. I don't swing that way. So I guess I must leave the deflowering to you.

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 18:51 | 4556466 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

My post was simply to illustrate how the mass of death and war by the PTB is in no way a defense of 'murika or it's people; nor was it an endorsement of the USSA's campaigns of global genocide.

Incidentally, socratic-dog, it'd be interesting to hear how you lost your man-cherry?

Sun, 03/16/2014 - 23:53 | 4557335 Miffed Microbio...
Miffed Microbiologist's picture

Absolutely in agreement here full metal jacket. I in NO WAY want anyone to take from this exchange that I am advocating the military policies of this country. They are abhorrent. I have NEVER promoted the idea of assertive democracy and militaristic preservation of American interests present today. That you even suggest this of me shows you are an idiot because this cannot be extrapolated from what I have ever posted here. Either that or you have mistaken me for someone else. If that is the case I will accept an apology.

Miffed;-)

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:12 | 4552768 tony wilson
tony wilson's picture

here we go again muslims A

why not the cia or the jews

or the pentagon

testing out a new bit of laser kit.

 

one day russia test fires a Topol-M intercontinental ballistic missile.

THE NEXT DAY THE US NAVY TESTS LaWS on a plane wiping out lots of folks they needed dead to cover up sensitive past projects.

Navy’s Laser Weapon System (LaWS), the direct energy weapon was developed by the Navy Research Lab,

when someone says arabs or muslims i replace with the jew.

how many arabs where dancing on top of trucks in new york on 911 none.

just about mossad jew crew.

 

directed energy weapon

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Px87SP01eKw

Sat, 03/15/2014 - 17:52 | 4552922 Seeking Aphids
Seeking Aphids's picture

This theory makes some sense Miker and is the best I have read so far. What I don't understand is why fly for so long if his goal was to commit suicide? Maybe he had a loss of courage and then dithered until the fuel ran out? Perhaps he was supposed to fly it into some target but was injured/killed during his fight with the pilot and the plane simply carried on on autopilot until it ran out of fuel and crashed? This would be possible if the cabin door was locked from the inside. Calls from mobile devices at that altitude are impossible, I believe, despite the 911 claims, so this could have happened with no communication from the passengers. Hopefully this theory is incorrect but I can't think of anything more plausible.....

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