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"Putin Did The Right Thing" Says Marc Faber, But Fears China Implications More

Tyler Durden's picture




 

While Marc Faber is adamant that "there’s lots of funny things that are happening in China. And when the whole thing unwinds it will be a disaster," it is his comments with regard Ukraine (and Russia) that are worth paying significant new attention to. As The Gloom, Boom & Doom Report editor notes in this brief Bloomberg TV interview, if you put yourself in Putin's shoes "he did the right thing from his perspective," given Crimea's strategic importance. However, as Faber concludes, "Crimea moving to Russia gives essentially a signal to China that one day they can also move and seize some territory that they perceive belongs to them."

 

 

Faber On Russia, Ukraine and its signaling to China...

Mr. Putin did the right thing from his perspective. We have to look – put ourselves into his shoes. He did absolutely the right thing at the right time.

 

...By that I mean that there was interference by foreign powers in Ukrainian politics that were unfavorably from the perspective of Russia.

 

...The Crimea is strategically most important for Russia. It has practically no meaning strategically to the United States or to Europe. But for Russia it’s very important. I don’t think that Russia will move further into Ukraine unless there is serious provocation. But I doubt it will happen. But I think the wider implication is that we have now border lines. In other words, the US would intervene if a foreign power would establish bases in Haiti and in Cuba and so forth and so on, and the Chinese will react if foreign powers threaten Chinese access to resources.

 

...

 

This is very important because the occupation or say the referendum (ph) in Crimea and Crimea moving to Russia gives essentially a signal to China that one day they can also move and seize some territory that they perceive that belongs to them.

Faber confirms his perspective on China...

...we had a colossal credit bubble in China and that this credit bubble is now being gradually deflated and will bring about problems in the real estate market and among some major players in the commodity markets as well. So overall, if I look at export figures from China, and they are very closely correlated to overall economic growth, then there is a huge discrepancy between what China reports and what China’s trading partners are reporting.

 

So if you look at the figures of China, exports are still growing. If you look at the trade figures China exports to Taiwan, so China records exports of so and so much. The Taiwan report imports from China at a much lower level. So which figures are more reliable? I think the figures of the trading partners of China are more reliable. And they would suggest that growth has slown down considerably.

 

...

 

Governments will always publish the statistics that they wish to show irrespective whether that is in China or in other countries. Governments control basically the statistical offices, so they can show whatever they want. As Stalin said, it’s not important who votes but who counts the votes. And the government counts the statistics.

 

...the fact is simply that Chinese stocks have been just about the worst performing stocks since 2006. Now analysts will dismiss that and say everything is prefect in China, but the stock market does not seem to believe everything that the government is saying about the economy. And clearly there are strength signs in the Chinese economy. In particular, as I said, we have this huge explosion of debt. Debt as a percent of GDP has increased in the last five years by more than 50 percent. Total debt is now over 215 percent of GDP, and a lot of it is trade finance that is being rolled over.

 

In addition to that, there are lots of funny deals. A friend of mine who analyzes China very carefully, Simon Hunt (ph), he pointed out that trade finance between one state-owned enterprise and a private company has amounted to over $5 trillion by continuing to roll over the same collateral several times. There’s lots of funny things that are happening in China. And when the whole thing unwinds it will be a disaster.

 

...

 

I think that investors are not sufficiently aware that the Chinese economy is far more important for other emerging economies than the United States because China is a large importer of resources. In other words, iron ore, copper, zinc (inaudible). And at the same time, they are a huge exporter to commodity producers of their own manufactured goods, as well as Korean exports. The commodity producers are much larger than Korean exports to the US or to the U (ph).

So if the Chinese economy slows down, commodity prices – industrial commodity prices are likely to remain under pressure. They already come down a lot. They remain under pressure and the resource producers have less money. In other words, the Brazilian goes into recession. The Middle East does not grow as much as before. Central Asia, Africa and so forth all contract, and then they buy less from China and you have a vicious cycle on the downside.

 

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Mon, 03/17/2014 - 22:53 | 4561709 butchtrucks
butchtrucks's picture

Mr. Putin did the right thing from his perspective. We have to look – put ourselves into his shoes. He did absolutely the right thing at the right time.

Yeah sure.  Just like Hitler did the right thing from his perspective when he invaded and annexed the Sudentland from the Czechs in the 1930s - using exactly the same excuse that Putin is using in Crimea - protecting his fellow country men.  Remind me again how that turned out...

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:03 | 4561747 adeptish
adeptish's picture

Well at one point the Wermacht were 20 miles from Moscow.

Get it?

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:18 | 4561787 WayBehind
WayBehind's picture

Hitler's biggest mistake was to fuck with Russians. Helloooooo Obama!

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:33 | 4561823 Overfed
Overfed's picture

Not exactly. His biggest mistake was overestimating the Wehrmacht and trying to fight a three-front war. Had he concentrated solely on Britain/Western Europe, finished that all up, taken a few years to regroup, and then gone on to the Soviet Union, I think the world would be very different place today. Perhaps we should be glad he tended to not listen to his generals.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:43 | 4561847 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

plus there was the whole "master race" thingy. talk about a "club and you ain't in it."

No one denies Russia's "historical claim to the Crimea" (dating back to Catherine the Great actually)...and something completely denied as meaningful by of all people BOTH Kerry and Lavrov... "this be the wrong island, bro Putie."

Needless complications in a place (Mother Russia) that is almost impossible to govern. (the SSR folks did in fact do a good job by historical standards.)

My personal view is that as with Hitler (who delayed...and never made it...to Moscow) so with President Putin. "A quick shot straight to Kiev" to deal with the "trouble makers"...over and done.

Instead it's like watching the bad guys try and kill James Bond again.
"The could simply kill him...BUT INSTEAD!....

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:12 | 4561895 Overfed
Overfed's picture

I'm mostly Danish with no "mud blood" so I would probably be OK. Regarding Putin, I think he knows exactly what he is doing. He masterfullly counters every move Washington makes, in Ukraine as in Syria, and makes the West look foolish, simple, and barbaric. He may be a despot, but he is brilliant, and he has absolutely studied history and is determined to not make any stupid mistakes.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:21 | 4561916 GoldSilverWolf
GoldSilverWolf's picture

Obama, McCain, and Kerry make themselves look foolish, simple, and barbaric.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:22 | 4561921 Overfed
Overfed's picture

True dat.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 02:53 | 4562047 zhandax
zhandax's picture

Faber usually comes across as reasoned and sensible, but here he diverges.  First, I have problems casting 'Russia moving to Crimea'; with a 95% vote from 73% voter participation to re-join their former sovereign; in a bad light.  I can't equate this to 'seizing'.  Secondly, "So if the Chinese economy slows down, commodity prices – industrial commodity prices are likely to remain under pressure."  While this is undoubtedly bad for speculators, Aussies, and real estate prices, it is not necessarily bad for businesses outside the mining, shipping and shadow banking ventures, and is certainly not bad for consumers.  It is, however, bad for the status quo locally, and possibly globally.  Wonder if he is really trying to say that helping consumers is useless if their bank deposits get vaporized.  IOW, does he still see a way for us to protect ourselves, or has he now joined Hendry in chearleading the ponzi?  Hendry has at least hinted he is looking for the fifth blow-off wave of a bubble.  I wish Faber would expound more on his new view.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 02:57 | 4562073 Independent
Independent's picture

http://www.m2netlab.wlu.ca/directions-links/ukraine.html

Indoeuropeans have been in Crimea since at least 40,000 years ago.  Turks (tatars) are not Indoeuropean though by now they have mixed in pretty heavily.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 07:32 | 4562273 Marge N Call
Marge N Call's picture

I believe the tatars mixed heavily with the Mongols during 10th and 11th century. Crimea was once part of the Golden Horde of Batu Kahn. Seem like people you didn't want to fuck with at the time.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 07:46 | 4562297 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

There is a lot of history between Crimean Tatars and Russians--The Tatars being the bigger historical aholes almost 100% of the time.  Their days of Moscow burning, slave raiding, and selling Russians to the Turks are over.  But as long as they identify themselves as seperate and Muslim, they will be viewed with hostility. 

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 10:27 | 4562910 rubiconsolutions
rubiconsolutions's picture

Ron Paul wrote an op-ed for USA Today in which he said - "the purpose of the U.N. is to “develop friendly relations among nations based on respect for the principle of equal rights and self-determination of peoples.”" Note that the U.N. is devoted to "self-determination of peoples." Not people, but peoples. As in plural. The individual doesn't count. Unless you are part of a collective then you are simply marginalized in the minds of many including the United Nations. The individual who speaks uniquely and separately has no real power. Frankly I couldn't care less about what is going on in Crimea. I don't care about the 95% who voted for secession (allegedly), what I do care about is the man or woman who voted against it or didn't vote at all because they saw the folly of it all. Those are the people we should be concerned about.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 02:00 | 4562023 lasvegaspersona
lasvegaspersona's picture

'mostly Danish' news flash, after the Vikings finished raping their way across Europe, everyone from Ireland to N France to Russia is 'mostly Danish'...m'self likely included...

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 04:24 | 4562128 August
August's picture

The Danes, I believe, specialized in raping and looting to the South and West, while the hearty denizens of Småland, with a few hangers-on from further north, dealt with the Eastern peoples, ably assisting in the founding of the Rus, and looting northern Persia all by themselves.

Wed, 03/19/2014 - 13:52 | 4568489 Overfed
Overfed's picture

My ancestors probably stayed home raising cattle and making beer.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 03:36 | 4562100 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

When come under pressure, Russian will concentrate.

Russians are very clever

and not scared of much

Putin is no despot..Russia is more free in many ways...Russians are better off than ever

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 06:20 | 4562203 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

Russia has a flat tax.
Amurika has a graduated income tax.

Say, one of those is the second plank in the 10
Planks of Communism. Hmmmm, which one though? Sure is a puzzler.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 06:48 | 4562222 Serenity Now
Serenity Now's picture

Russians are caught in a demographic crunch.  They are dying out.  There is nothing they can do about it.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 07:34 | 4562275 Optimusprime
Optimusprime's picture

Russians are caught in a demographic crunch.  They are dying out.  There is nothing they can do about it.

Silly comment.  In the abstract, there is a simple solution--have more babies.  In the concrete, it is happening.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 07:40 | 4562284 Sandmann
Sandmann's picture

Americans are dying out but having more Hispanic babies

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 08:08 | 4562374 flapdoodle
flapdoodle's picture

TPTB have decided that Mexican immigrants make more docile and productive consumers than the white folks they are replacing in the US.

No doubt TPTB also see the Mexican immigrants, particularly the illegal ones who have the threat of deportation keeping them from questioning things very much, as much less of a threat to TPTB power as they do not carry around the historical meme of the "Constitution" or "American Freedom", only the weak, hollow shell of those memes force feed to them by the MSM propaganda apparatus and neo-con Deep State.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 11:57 | 4563480 Muppet Pimp
Muppet Pimp's picture

Plus 1000

This is a most excellent and accurate observation. May I steal this to share with others?

I would like to point out the US ptb choice, while foul and certainly shows the highest level of disrespect for natives, is no match for thr disdain the UK ptb show towards their natives, as instead of docile mexicans they have imported some of the most aggressive, hostile humans around, primary sponsors of terrorism, record holders of most suicide bombings of any race, the dreaded sand people.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 05:59 | 4562184 negative rates
negative rates's picture

Now I feel like i'm driving down a dark road at night and i'm not even sure where i'm going too, or where I am, but i got 6 friends to pick up and party with.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:47 | 4561949 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

If he hadn't been on the Meth that his MD prescribed, he'd also have been a more stable and rational Hitler.

Bet ya didn't know THAT. And TPTB are not likely to want you to know.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 01:43 | 4562011 known unknown
known unknown's picture

I don't think Stalin was going to wait for his turn. Germany was an ally at the time but if he allowed Hitler to finish off Britian he knew he was next. He was prepping for war  massing his troops on his border with Germany. Even so I believe Hitlers mistake was diverting his armies to seize Stalingrad. This prevented him from taking Moscow and allowed the weather and an ivigorated Russian army to finish him off.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 03:01 | 4562075 Independent
Independent's picture

Not really Stalingrad was a big place of war production and a choke point for oil shipments up the Volga.  He did the right thing but still lost cause he fought a two front war,and Russia is so vast that it swallowed up his armies and his supply lines, also factor in one of the worst winters on record and being low on gas, those Germans always low on gas supplies lol.  Dont forget Napoleon got Moscow but still lost the war.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 04:51 | 4562142 mrdenis
mrdenis's picture

"one of the worst winters on record" ...so did they call it global warming or climate change   in 1941 ?

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 03:23 | 4562088 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Victor Suvarov "Ice Breaker" or "The Chief Culprit"

not perfect, but as far as I know, no one else has presented full writing that Germany made preemptive attack, as Stalin moved forces into offensive positions for planned offensive within weeks.

This one of two reasons why more numerous and heavily equipped Soviet force was damaged so badly.

Other was superior German tactics.

I have met participants who confirmed Suvarov's claims.

 

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 03:53 | 4562113 ILLILLILLI
ILLILLILLI's picture

>> Perhaps we should be glad he tended to not listen to his generals.

You make a very good point there. Churchill was -very- lucky that Hitler did not listen to his generals when the British Army was trapped at Dunkirk. The generals wanted to wipe out the British since they had them trapped on the beach. Hitler held off because he believed that the German people and the British people had something in common...a shared bond of some nature.

Churchill gets far too much credit and admiration...he was a gambler and an adventurer (in the worst possible sense). He's simply lucky he didn't get his ass handed to him by the Germans.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 04:11 | 4562122 Sandmann
Sandmann's picture

He almost did in May 1940 because there were discussions with the British Ambassador in washington about removing Churchill. There were also moves by RAB Butler at the Foreign Office to engage in peace talks with Dahlerus.

Churchill started bombing German cities starting with Berlin to prevent peace overtures

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 04:25 | 4562132 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Churchill was a war criminal.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 07:17 | 4562251 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

LOL, and you are an idiot!  Hitler was the war criminal (so was Stalin and Mao), you carnival barker you!

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 09:07 | 4562575 effendi
effendi's picture

Churchill wasn't just awar criminal. He was involved in war profeteering. About 10 years ago in BBC Peoples War (recollections of the war) one of the writers recalled how he investigated a case of substandard surfacing by a contractor of a RAF airfield. He was called off by his superiors when it was foundout that Winston was one of those involved in the rip-off. The firm contracting had a name that was made up of the initials of its owners with the first letter being W (for Winston).

So he might of praised those gallant few airmen who saved Britain in the Battle of Brittain but he also sold them out. 

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 18:21 | 4565386 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

oh, really?  And one anecdotal case and he is a war criminal? Was he actively running the company then? Day to day decisions? No, just had his name attached to it as an investor...roflmao, that was WEAK stuff you put out there fluffy!

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 06:14 | 4562194 Harrison
Harrison's picture

Stalin was planning to betray Hitler, just as Hitler was planning to betray Stalin. Their timing differed by only a few days; if Hitler hadn't moved when he did, Stalin would have moved in a week or so.

There was no option to finish off western Europe first.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 08:15 | 4562400 flapdoodle
flapdoodle's picture

The British were of course doing everything they could with their intelligence services to accelerate Hitler and Stalin going after each other - they saw that as perhaps their only real hope since US entry into the war was still problematical - remember that the Nazis declared war on the US first!

 

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 08:50 | 4562516 zionhead
zionhead's picture

Obama only fucks with Reggie, to think that Obama had a thing to do with UKRAINE is a stupid narrative.

Look at Samantha Power, and her Hubby Cass Sunstein, they got Obama dressed up a sock-puppet.

AIPAC from Chicago, put Obama in the white-house, and so long as he smiles and play's the part he gets to 'play prez' if he break's role, then BIDEN takes over.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 04:19 | 4562126 MythicalFish
MythicalFish's picture

This "China implications" talk is MSM B/S. When the Russians moved into Crimea they were greeted with flags and cheers. If Chinese boots come to, say, Taiwan I do not expect a similar welcome. The Chinese know this, their society is not law based but relationships based, which sometimes makes common sense come easier.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 08:21 | 4562427 kita27
kita27's picture

seriously, the Chinese have just been good global citizens because they are trying follow international law?  Now like monkey see monkey do they may sieze territory also?  give me a break! This is the Chinese we are talking about.  They know full well that when their military is strong enough they will pump it fair up the ass of US influence until it hightails back across the Pacific. They will then dominate the asia pacific and who knows where else,  oops, maybe they will copy what the US has done over the last 60 years.

 

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:04 | 4561749 whotookmyalias
whotookmyalias's picture

If only Taiwan had the natural gas fields the Crimea does, you could expect the US to react with the same time proven harsh words as the Chinese invent protests and fix an election.

You know this story jumped the shark when Marketwatch headlines announce that stock markets around the world are up now that the situation with the Ukraine is settled.

Maybe the Ukraine doesn't know it's settled yet, but the financial markets have taken them out of the decision

Yippee Ki Yay Mutha Fuckers!

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:06 | 4561758 JuliaS
JuliaS's picture

Does referendum count as an invasion or did I miss something?

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:24 | 4561802 butchtrucks
butchtrucks's picture

LOL.  You've outed yourself as a Kremlin sock puppet.  Or maybe all those Russian troops and tanks in Crimea the last few weeks are just a hologram?

I'll give credit to Putin - he's good at creating 'facts on the ground'.  He knows the US and EU have no effective way of responding.  Wonder how the Ukrainians feel now about giving their nukes back to the Russkis in the '90s.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:14 | 4561908 in4mayshun
in4mayshun's picture

Your comment is somewhat comical because you speak with such disdain about Putin/Russia, like the US is not as bad or worse.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 01:02 | 4561967 TungstenBars
TungstenBars's picture

Keep drinking the MSM American cool aid. The cold war ended ya know, the Ruskies aren't coming for your kids. 

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 06:17 | 4562197 SunRise
SunRise's picture

The U.S. Debtliner #777 beat the Russians to our kids futures. 

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 04:35 | 4562136 August
August's picture

The Ukrainian nation has nothing to gain from trying to slug it out with nuclear weapons, toe-to-toe with the Rooskies.

Of course the Ukraine is upwind of Russia, so maybe that would give them an edge....

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 05:09 | 4562152 Bearwagon
Bearwagon's picture

Did you just call for "venting"?! As if there isn't enough being vented at fuckushima! ;-)

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 08:03 | 4562354 jerry_theking_lawler
jerry_theking_lawler's picture

You obviously haven't walked into an airport lately and seen the USSA gestapo, or the SWAT team enforcing a warrant for pot smokers (which is legal in  some states), or you haven't been issued a citation from a robot (red light camera) that can't prove or disprove you were the driver, or you haven't been recorded and proscecuted (yet) by the FBI/NSA/CIA for your thoughts and actions regarding how you are governed.....

but you will see it all soon.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 08:19 | 4562414 flapdoodle
flapdoodle's picture

Nudelman, is that you? I expect your boss Netanyahu is pretty pissed right now since his Iranian bombing run is getting nowhere...

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:07 | 4561760 Manthong
Manthong's picture

Crimea never truly left Russia.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:08 | 4561764 whotookmyalias
whotookmyalias's picture

WTF does that matter in any of this?

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 01:20 | 4561978 Manthong
Manthong's picture

Not any more than East and West Germany re-uniting... historical geographic, cultural and language unity temporarily interrupted by politics.

Ukraine's claim on Crimea goes back to a maneuver by Krushchev (an ethnic Ukranian) handing it over for administration in 1954.

Russia's claim goes back to the 1700's.

..and another little issue..  the people who live in Crimea are mostly ethnic Russians.

 

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 10:09 | 4562842 whotookmyalias
whotookmyalias's picture

Sorry I thought I was on ZH, not in line to blow Putin through a glory hole.

Putin is no better or worse than any other egotistical blowhard saber rattling greedy self proclaimed savior.  I'm not here to sing his praises

Friends, Romans, Countrymen, lend me your ears.......

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:15 | 4561772 tony wilson
tony wilson's picture

eyes agree butch putin is der new hilter is rubbing his hands wanting to make thousands of anne franks hiding in dere attics writing books.

putin will den burn der books all over again.

if only spielberg and bono abd bob geldoff and geroge cooney and matt demon good hold a simon weasel centre fund raizor to help der new jewish hollow cause .

remememmemmember butch that putin says only 6000 jews are left in crimea he is a filthy dog liar the bbc counted 6 million and they managed to do the count 30 mins earlier than was in the script.

these are dangus times for jewish oligarkes

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:50 | 4561851 Bonapartist
Bonapartist's picture

Don't forget all of the looted Crimean artwork Pooty-Poot has- Matt Clooney and George Damon are aleady working on a script about returning it to its "rightful owners" and Queertin Tarantino will be bashing some evil Ivans' heads in while inbred 'Muricans skweel w/ dee-lite.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 03:04 | 4562077 Independent
Independent's picture

You Know Tony Wilson, speaking of Anne Frank I always wondered when she grew up which leading Jewish woman she would of become?

Victoria Nuland, Diane Feinstein, Barbara Boxer???

I am sure they were all lovely little girls at that age until their Bat Mitzvah.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:49 | 4561859 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

that's funny. no wonder the market rallied today.

who knows...maybe this is the real Butch Trucks?!!!

Monuments Men is a good book actually. "many a German City was prevented from English Carpet Bombing" because of those guys.

Whippin' Post and Government Mule! Whippin' Post and Government Mule!

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 06:02 | 4562188 negative rates
negative rates's picture

But the pain in my body seem to get worse everyday and I don't know why, we found the fountain of youth inside, all was good after that team rally.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 09:54 | 4562777 Pseudonymous
Pseudonymous's picture

I remember you trolling in clear English just a few days ago. What happened?

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:20 | 4561792 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

Hey butchtrucks

Let me guess?...

You're either a NYC "dual citizen" or an evangelical "wannabe" from Little Rock!...

Here read "twice daily" and the brain infection you have should subside hopefully before America starts another one this time against an adversary that will kick it's ass!

http://www.thedailysheeple.com/washington-has-set-the-world-on-a-path-to-war_032014

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:54 | 4561874 Bonapartist
Bonapartist's picture

butchtrucks "hearts" Hasbara

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:22 | 4561796 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Hey Tyler(s) and ZH'ers - Kerry and Obama caved.

http://vineyardsaker.blogspot.com/

http://www.moonofalabama.org/2014/03/ukraine-us-pulls-back-agrees-to-rus...

http://www.moonofalabama.org/2014/03/ukraine-wet-noodle-sanctions-and-pr...

What a cool blogosphere world.  Saker is a guy from the region either Ukrainian or Russian and he is referencing another blog called Moon of Alabama.  LOL!  Cool.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:45 | 4561854 Freddie
Freddie's picture

More and this is pretty cool.  Venice or Veneto is voting not only to be independent of Italy but to also get out of the EU, ZATO and the Euro!  Wow!  Venice, like the north of Italy, is among the wealthier regions of Italy and even all of Europe.

 

http://www.moonofalabama.org/2014/03/ukraine-us-pulls-back-agrees-to-rus...

 

Strangely enough, in ITALY there is a poll as important as in Crimea; however, mass media has decided or been instructed to totally ignore it.

Four million Venetians will go to the polls and vote on whether Veneto, one of Italy’s three wealthiest regions, should secede from Italy and become an “independent and sovereign federal republic.”

They also vote on leaving the EU with their new republic, leaving NATO, leaving the EURO.

This must scare the EU leaders so much that they decided not to have it covered in the news, to not cause ideas in other regions as well.

So far only very little coverage in the media:

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/465108/How-a-vote-in-Venice-could-change-the-face-of-Italy

H/T: ZeroHedge

Posted by: Cynthia | Mar 16, 2014 7:49:24 PM | 50

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 01:20 | 4561983 Rock On Roger
Rock On Roger's picture

Very good Freddie, I bookmarked saker.

Veneto will vote si, Scotland is next, aye.

Stack on

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 07:06 | 4562232 waterwitch
waterwitch's picture

Did somebody say Texas?

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 07:09 | 4562237 Dugald
Dugald's picture

I think there are enough canny Scots who realise that when the oil runs out..they will be fucked

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 03:59 | 4562117 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

there is little coverage because it's more something like a poll than an official referendum. an online poll, btw, meaning that participation numbers will be more important than the result, and where participation will probably be not significant

further, there is a strange, strange assumption there: "Venice or Veneto is voting not only to be independent of Italy but to also get out of the EU, ZATO and the Euro!"

there is no indipendentist movement in europe that propagates for indipendence from other clubs than their national union. in fact, Veneto is a very good example for one region that does not want to exit the EU and does not want to exit the EUR

they just mull about exiting Italy, in the same way as Catalonia mulls over exiting Spain, Scotland about exiting the UK and Flanders exiting Belgium

in fact, it's the very presence of the EU and the EUR that makes those thoughts even possible

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 04:23 | 4562127 Sandmann
Sandmann's picture

Why is Scotland permitted to vote to leave the UK when the people of the UK are not consulted about splitting the Kingdom. Since Edward Longshanks captured The Stone of Scone in 1296 ALL Monarchs have been crowned in England with this Stone of Destiny in Westminster Abbey until John Major returned it to Scotland in 1996.

So any future King of England would not be crowned in the line of his forebears and that affects the Constitution of England. Yet EU nationals living in Scotland can vote in a Referendum where Scotsmen living in England and Englishmen cannot.

How can it be that a Lithuanian or Spaniard in Scotland can vote on the Constitution of the United Kingdom but people in England cannot ?

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 06:43 | 4562217 RadioactiveRant
RadioactiveRant's picture

Doesn't it seem odd to you that in 2001 the census put 58% of Crimeans as being ethnic Russians and 77% speaking Russian, yet you could get a poll result of 97% seeking to join the Russian Federation? Also interesting that the ballot had no option to maintain the status quo, or that OSCE weren't invited as international observers to the process, and that the only people that were were Russian speakers with a western axe to grind?

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 02:45 | 4562067 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

I think Saker has Russian ancestory, but from some years ago, I think he told he live in US..

From his current blog, I feel he is not in Ukr or RF

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:35 | 4561829 WillyGroper
WillyGroper's picture

After the war the Nazi's conquered the USSA.

And Mengele lives...

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:38 | 4561940 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Monday Night: Russia is calling for new elections in the Ukraine.   Very well played by Russia and Putin.  

Obama and Kerry caved because if South and East Ukraine provinces bail on the Ukraine like Crimea then there will be nothing left.   They should still bail on the Ukraine.

Nice:

http://www.moonofalabama.org/2014/03/ukraine-us-pulls-back-agrees-to-rus...

A bit late but AP is now catching up on what the Russians want:

Russia calls on Ukraine to be a federal state

Russia's foreign ministry is calling on Ukraine to become a federal state and call fresh elections.

In a statement posted on Monday the ministry urged Ukraine's parliament to call a constitutional assembly which could draft a new constitution to make the country federal, handing more power to its regions.

The foreign ministry said the proposals are part of its efforts to ease the tensions in Ukraine by diplomatic means.

Moscow insisted that Ukrainian regions should get broader autonomy and that the country should adopt a "neutral political and military status."

Posted by: b | Mar 17, 2014 7:31:14 AM | 99

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:49 | 4561944 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

butchtrucks said:  "Just like Hitler did the right thing from his perspective..."

Terrible comparison. 

Without the sacrifices of the Russian people the Nazi's would not have been defeated.

The U.S. is more like the Nazi's, what with our expansionist wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Panama, Grenada, Kosovo, etc. - and with military bases and hardware in nearly every corner of the globe - droning and bombing at will.

Not to mention our own military spying on citizen communications, the militarization of our police forces, and the crony capitalist merger of state/bank/corporation along the fascist model.  At least Mussolini made the trains run on time (Amtrak, anyone?).  Yes, we are free to drive and die in GM cars not recalled 10 years after a known fault - can't endanger the stock price now, can we?  GM Bondholders?  Out of luck.  Jon Corzine?  Living free and easy.

This meme that the U.S. is somehow not riddled with worse oligarchs than the East and is still the voice of democracy and freedom is laughable at best.  What a hive of hypocrites.  Lots of decent people here but we are under the boot of forces more sinister than those I see in Russia.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 10:56 | 4563071 Pseudonymous
Pseudonymous's picture

I think you are simply suffering from the "grass is darker this side of the fence" fallacy. It's a very common fallacy.

On the other hand, butchtrucks made absolutely no remarks favorable to the west. It is patently clear that all governments discussed are tyrannical. The only ones I see here who seem to be in disagreement with that assertion are the ones who say things favorable to the Russian government and to Putin.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 07:57 | 4562327 flapdoodle
flapdoodle's picture

Russia engineering its annexation of Crimea is

 

"just like Hitler's annexation of Sudentenland"

 

if and only if in 1938 there had been a English/French engineered coup in the rest of Czech/Slovakia a couple of weeks before where a virulently anti-German government had seized power...

Its really sad how people can no longer see things clearly...

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 09:48 | 4562754 Pseudonymous
Pseudonymous's picture

Wow, I didn't know we had 154 Kremlin bots and trolls on ZH. Now I do.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 10:55 | 4563077 Ifigenia
Ifigenia's picture

"Yeah sure.  Just like Hitler did the right thing from his perspective when he invaded and annexed the Sudentland from the Czechs in the 1930s - using exactly the same excuse that Putin is using in Crimea - protecting his fellow country men.  Remind me again how that turned out..."

or Bush jr. in Iraq using an excuse of WMD in Iraq. Or occupaying Afghan without any reason, not even giving any prove in a judicial procedure to ask for extradiction of Bin Laden. Just compare this case with the case of David Headley, which India made a formal procedure to ask for extradicition with due evidences.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 22:55 | 4561711 Rukeysers Ghost
Rukeysers Ghost's picture

The Chinamen may think they now have a green light to take control of whatever land they see fit, but I think the Japanese may have a different reaction over that than Obummer did in the Crimea.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 22:59 | 4561733 suteibu
suteibu's picture

Japan would do well not to depend on the US for help.  The Ukraine situation gives China some additional leverage over the US who would be overjoyed to see China remain neutral on the issue.  The trade-off might just be the South China Sea islands.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:07 | 4561759 whotookmyalias
whotookmyalias's picture

I'm not sure what Japan could do against China these days.  Print more Yen?  Ship radioactive waste from Fukashima to Beijing?  Close their borders to Chinese goods?  None of that scares China.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:45 | 4561855 suteibu
suteibu's picture

The danger is not really to the Chinese.  But any action taken by Japan would force the US to choose sides.  I think it's better than 50% that the US will choose China.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:04 | 4561886 zionhead
zionhead's picture

Japan, Okinawa, Taiwan are all USA colony's won during WW2, and the USA still has bases that show who is boss, just like in GERMANY.

The USA fiat courtesy of ZIO has pretty much bought off the Chinese Oligarchs.

This only leaves PUTIN as the last man on the planet standing.

They bought off GORBY, they'll buy off PUTIN.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:20 | 4561915 Overfed
Overfed's picture

Bzzzzzt. Wrong. Putin has a higher calling. He's already as rich as anyone. He is a Russian, not a globalist. He cares about Russia, cares about Russians, and he truly wants to restore glory to Russia.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 01:48 | 4562012 fxrxexexdxoxmx
fxrxexexdxoxmx's picture

Restore glory to Russia? Russia already has the most intelligent, compassionate, and strongest leader the world has ever seen; Putin.

Russia is glorious as it is. The people of Russia love Putin. He has never made a mistake, he only works for the common citizen, and he respects political differences.

God put Putin on Earth so the rest of the world could see how a real leader is suppose to be. 

Russians are perfect, Putin is perfect, and anyone who disagrees just does not understand the superior minds which true Russians know can only be found in Russia.

 

/s

 

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 02:11 | 4562037 zionhead
zionhead's picture

Help me somebody but how does it go..

"Those the GOD's make perfect, they also make MAD"...

God forbid if PUTIN himself start's believing this bullshit,... let's all be honest, PUTIN is one lucky fucking MOFU,

That said, he's got the KGB,CIA,MSS,MOSSAD, MI6 all zero'd on his back.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 02:09 | 4562035 zionhead
zionhead's picture

Funny we heard that about GORBY too, anybody care to explain how much GORBY got by USA/ISRAEL for selling out Russia?

It was MILLIONS, and back then a million was a like a BILLION now.

*

I agree that PUTIN is above this shit, ... that's not my fear, my fear is that the KGB/MSS are full of RAT's that have already gone on the ZIO-NEO payroll.

MSS - is chinese mossad
KGB - is russian mossad

Mossad is Israel CIA, all came out OIL mafia

*

PUTIN has already restored RUSSIA to its glory,.. no better time to retire than NOW.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 07:22 | 4562253 Element
Element's picture

Hey brainfart-master:

 

Crimea’s referendum corrected Soviet-era mistake - Gorbachev 

The people of Crimea fixed a Soviet-era mistake with the Sunday’s referendum and the will of the people should not be punished by sanctions, said former Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev. “Earlier Crimea was merged with Ukraine under Soviet laws, to be more exact by the [Communist] party's laws, without asking the people, and now the people have decided to correct that mistake. This should be welcomed instead of declaring sanctions," he told Interfax on Monday. Gorbachev praised the referendum, stating that it “reflects the aspirations of Crimea's residents. He criticized the use of sanctions against Russia in retaliation to the referendum. "To declare sanctions you need very serious reasons. And they must be upheld by the UN," Gorbachev added. "The will of the people of the Crimea and the Crimea's possible unification with Russia as a constituent region do not constitute such a reason.”

http://rt.com/news/mistake-fixed-crimea-gorbachev-422/

So how's Gorby a zio-aligned Russian traitor again?

 

No, don't try to speak coherently, you'll just hurt yourself.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 08:46 | 4562507 zionhead
zionhead's picture

Google Raygun era, "CALIFORNIA PRESIDIO" GORBY, it was a long time, probably before you were born.

Gorby is a bought and paid for traitor.

Raygun, once he made Gorby his bitch praised GORBY to the max. It was a long time ago.

*

Your quote above is from GORBY this week on his death bed, so now it's like baby jeebuz at the last supper GORBY is going to talk the talk.

GORBY ain't no PUTIN, on the other HAND they did "GET TO GORBY".

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 02:37 | 4562062 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

VV Putin was never about money.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 03:14 | 4562083 Independent
Independent's picture

You have to have money to run political campaigns, otherwise the dual citizens run all over you with their control of big money and the media corporations. Dont forget they work together via the World Jewish Congress, even its president Ronald Lauder started his own european media empire

http://www.cetv-net.com/en/about-cme/ronald-s-lauder.shtml

http://www.cetv-net.com/en/about-cme/company-overview.shtml

Putin needs to concentrate some wealth in his hands, and also allow other native Slavic oligarchs to rise up to compete with the still large number of Jewish oligarchs.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 03:11 | 4562082 Independent
Independent's picture

Putin will be know in history as one of the greats among Peter the Great and Catherine the Great, I dont know about Obama's legacy as far as US history except just being the first you know what.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 09:31 | 4562686 flapdoodle
flapdoodle's picture

Hmmm...

Obama the Small?

 

Obama the Insignificant?

 

Obama the Clueless?

 

Obama the Teleprompter?

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 08:07 | 4562366 jerry_theking_lawler
jerry_theking_lawler's picture

I tend to agree....the 'weak' can be bought and manipulated....the 'strong' take what they want and stand their moral ground.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:11 | 4561899 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Stop exporting inflatable dolls to China.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:46 | 4561947 drendebe10
drendebe10's picture

Radioactive waste works for me. LMAO.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:05 | 4561754 TrustbutVerify
TrustbutVerify's picture

You mean Taiwan.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:18 | 4561788 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

Dude, I don't think Chinamen is the preferred nomenclature.

Unless one of them pee'd on your rug...and didn't help build the railroad.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:55 | 4561875 Let them eat iPads
Let them eat iPads's picture

You're right, it's actually "chinks".

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:58 | 4561881 Let them eat iPads
Let them eat iPads's picture

Hang on, I've just been informed that "locusts" is also acceptable.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 01:42 | 4562008 The_Dude
The_Dude's picture

 I promise you that they use worse names when talking about you.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 07:45 | 4562293 Marge N Call
Marge N Call's picture

That rug really tied the room together, did it not?

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 22:55 | 4561714 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture

I think this is the great example of why so many pin their hopes on the "as-yet-unknown-future-technology-fix". We just pop together the as-yet-unknown free energy device into the as-yet-unknown spaceship and fly to the as-yet-unknown destination and *wham!* populate the galaxy.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 22:59 | 4561731 Independent
Independent's picture

Just hope the Aliens looking for a place to populate dont find Earth first lol.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:22 | 4561795 Jorgen
Jorgen's picture

Just hope the Aliens looking for a place to populate dont find Earth first lol.

They already did (according to David Icke)

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 22:58 | 4561724 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

I respect Marc and always like to hear his point of view, though the China disaster it has been a long time in coming. As to Russia, yes, Putin would be a madman to let the Kiev revolution stand unanswered, and really, how hard is it to incorporate a 200 year old Russian territory back into the Russian Federation when most people who live these vote to join. Obama and his masters just can't accept that their funded revolution is not delievering all the goodies they expected, like the US Navy taking over Sevastopol Naval Base, and batteries of missiles set up east of Karkov withing a few hunded miles of Moscow itself.

Sadly, the revolution is not what is advertized and the west Ukrainians will soon know just how hard  the bankers and IMF are going to fuck them. EU membership? Dream on. Austerity and IMF loans that make every redsident a debt slave for life. Ukraine is number 80 on the list of world economies. Under Iraq and others. The threat of real war is, I suspect about an 8 on a scale of 1-10. Because the revolution has not won the east or south and the only way to subjegate these peoples is with a nazi occupation or military campaign, either way, Kiev must kill and kill in large numbers. If you think Russia will stand by and what Karkov leveled or worse occupied by the new 60,000 man fascist guard being formed, well, think again. Local residents do not lack courage, they already turned back armored convoys and military transport trains.

Obama and the EU are playing their Iraq cards, they think Russia is Iraq, they have fucked up, drunk on their own dreams of world glory. My guess, "This will get one hell of a lot worse before it gets better".

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:03 | 4561746 Independent
Independent's picture

Agree Jack, I have a feeling a lot of swastikas tattooed on dead arms are going to end up under the rubble of bricks from these cities as the Russians once again fight in the cities hand to hand with the Jew financed neo nazis.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:07 | 4561887 Bonapartist
Bonapartist's picture

I would hardly compare a bunch of drugged-out Ukranian punks to an army that brought Europe to its knees.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:08 | 4561763 FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

I find it hard to believe Obama has any strategy on any foreign policy issue. He doesn't like it and he has no formal authority once he gets outside the USSA. He has limited leverage.

He wants to get back to his core issues like student loans and minimum wage and screwing up healthcare.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:49 | 4561954 drendebe10
drendebe10's picture

And his grand imperial golf lifestyle @ tax payer expense to buy the wookie 17K dresses to misdirrct her attention from his fudge packing.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:13 | 4561774 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

That's well laid out, but the PRISM is not well cleaned.

Assuming for a while Russia continues to care about money rather than Ukraine's calories, their optimal procedure is to wait until all EU and IMF aid arrives in Kiev, with the same promises of reform that Greece gave.  Then fly in 750 parachute troops and capture the government.  Replace them and reset the board back to what it was 8 months ago.

The difference would be they have the IMF and EU aid funds.  Ukraine can declare default on that debt and proceed to trade food for gas and oil with Russia. 

The overall point being, money doesn't matter in the long run, but for the time being the EU and IMF can be stolen from very nicely.  All while Russia drains $400 billion PER YEAR from the EU in gas and oil money.

All this time we thought it was Germany who had forbidden Draghi from buying bonds and printing Euros.  Maybe it hasn't been Germany issuing those orders.  Russia doesn't want cheapened Euros for its items of actual value.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:39 | 4561840 jaxville
jaxville's picture

The IMF funds that will be lent to Ukraine will be loaned into existence (created out of thin air). The creation of those funds is vital to the global credit based money system in general and the US dollar in particular.

  Credit based money is a ponzi scheme which requires new blood in the form of debtors. Most Western nations are saturated with debt and increasing levels of debt threatens the fragile credibility their money schemes currently enjoy.

  We are witness to the end game for fractional reserve banking and it's corrollory; crdit based money. Get ready for something really scary as those who enjoy power as a result of the old system seek new means to exert their twisted values on humanity.

 

 

 

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:13 | 4561906 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

The amount of funding being proposed is in the low teens of billions. That's hardly a blip on the west's funny-money radar. If this is your conspiracy theory to create more credit for the west, you're going to need about 1000 more Ukraine crises.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:41 | 4561917 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

I disagree. The optimal procedure is to have the west bail out Ukraine, then Putin manipulates the elections to have control of the country without firing a shot. This also gives the coup the air of legitimacy, as the Ukrainians will have "voted" for it.

 

But the way things seem to be heading, it's unlikely anyone can be convinced that Ukraine-proper will vote to install another Russian puppet like Yanukovych.

Putin can probably peel off a couple more provinces bordering Russia, but the resistance will increase the farther in he goes. Also, each province that leaves will increase the likelihood of Ukraine responding with force.

 

As I've said before, from the Ukrainian point of view, they should probably start blowing sections of the pipeline. Just a small section or two to get Vlad's attention, with the implicit threat that if he keeps this shit up, the whole thing will be attacked.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 03:32 | 4562096 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

What, just anonymous negatives? Nobody's man enough to give a proper rebuttal?

Pussies.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 06:30 | 4562207 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

The Ukrainians mostly own the pipelines and blowing them up would deny themselves most of their energy supply. kinda like cutting off your nose, ears and lips to spite your face.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 10:01 | 4562806 Dollarmedes
Dollarmedes's picture

Ukraine reduced imports of Russian gas by 80% before the coup. The question is: who will be hurt more by sabotage? And if you don't like destroying the pipeline, then how about charging Russians high fees for transporting their gas across Ukraine to Europe.

The pipeline is the only leverage the Ukrainians have in this mess.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 08:02 | 4562332 Element
Element's picture

Why should the West bailout Ukraine just to have the Ukrainians then blow up the lions-share of Europe's major energy supplier's infrastructure, punching the core of Europe into a depression. You realize Europe might want to carpet-bomb Kiev for doing that to NATO's heartland, right? Can you see how that might be construed as an indirect strategic-attack on NATO's stability?

Did you think this up yourself?

If so, be nice to your boss and don't give up your day-job.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:46 | 4561821 JuliaS
JuliaS's picture

I always say that the reason it's called a "revolution" is because after a full turn you end up exactly where you started.

Kiev has had that exact event. The citizenry is already disillusioned in the 4-headed hydra that replaced the old corrupt talking head. The nationalists are going to have to vent their anger somewhere. They were supposed to target ethnic Russians and they did. Only now there's a place called Crimea - a proverbial lifeboat were Russians could segregate in order to gain new citizenship and protection. There is the entire Eastern border towards which they will undoubtedly retreat before the flanks are fortified and new land divisions established.

Crimea lacks essential land connection between itself and the mainland. A bridge is being planned across the canal, but that ain't going to cut it, so the best option here would be to encourage separation of Donetsk, which as far as I can tell, needs no encouragement.

Separation of the island from Ukraine is just a beginning and that is why it's such a big deal for the west. With neo-nazi's being pushed closer to the EU there's going to be instability, but the kind that is going to hurt them a lot more than it will hurt Russia.

I've been watching a lot of BBC lately. They don't hesitate showing portraits of Bandera decorating government buildings in the West, yet not a single reporter dares to explain who that person is and what made him famous. I guess that is one subject they haven't yet figured out how to put a spin on.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:52 | 4561869 adeptish
adeptish's picture

Excellent comment, the downvotes just mean you are on target btw.

The Beeb is the quintessential NWO mouthpiece, I don't hate it but i feel better when it's not around.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 02:05 | 4562026 zionhead
zionhead's picture

Yes, here on ZH, green means circle-jerk, and RED means your telling the truth, and here on ZH the truth really does hurt a lot of folks.

*

Great fucking comment that 'Revolution' just means a 360 degree circle jerk.

*

We all live short lives in the geologic sense, just make sure you exit all shit-holes before the gun's start blasting cuz if you stay in these combat zones you die, and its coming to the USA too, ...

Trouble in the USA folks aren't fighting for anything cuz there never was a time in USA 'history' where the little guy meant meant shit, ..

*

If you can handle cold go to Alaska, if your a summer bunny then head to Mexico, before THEY 'CLOSE' the exit's.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 03:18 | 4562084 Independent
Independent's picture

In your case red means you are on your perpetual period, we are all waiting for you to die from the blood loss :D

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 05:11 | 4562154 zionhead
zionhead's picture

Fascinating, so I guess that red/green can mean anything you it to mean here on ZH.

Green could mean $$, and RED mean blood. Moar FIAT, or more blood, I can see it,

In general most here that go for the red are blood thirsty ZIO's, and they can never get enough.

*

Still my paradigm holds those demanding blood are doing so because the truth gives them conniptions.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 09:39 | 4562715 Tale2cities
Tale2cities's picture

I just hope you made it out already

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:33 | 4561825 palmereldritch
palmereldritch's picture

They had to paint Putin as Hitler to project and distract from the real Hitlerian NeoCon/NeoNazi IMF looting centred in Kiev

http://bperet.wordpress.com/2014/03/13/whats-next-for-ukraine/

 

The March of Austerity into Ukraine

“The parliament’s primary task is to ask countries that are guarantors of our security to fulfill their commitments,” he (The Kiev regime’s unelected president, Oleksandr Turchynov) said.

The announcement came amid talks in Kiev with the International Monetary Fund (IMF) mission to impose deep cuts on Ukrainian workers to plug Ukraine’s 50 billion hryvnia ($5.4 billion) budget deficit. The vast wealth of Ukraine’s oligarchs, which has been left untouched by the fascist-led putsch, is not to be harmed. Rather, plans are for workers to pay with cuts to pensions and energy subsidies that are critical to keep home heating affordable.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/civil-war-looms-in-ukraine-proxy-regime-calls-for-military-mobilization-imposition-of-imf-austerity-measures/5373200?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=civil-war-looms-in-ukraine-proxy-regime-calls-for-military-mobilization-imposition-of-imf-austerity-measures

The Looting Of Ukraine Has Begun:

According to a report in Kommersant-Ukraine, the finance ministry of Washington’s stooges in Kiev who are pretending to be a government has prepared an economic austerity plan that will cut Ukrainian pensions from $160 to $80 so that Western bankers who lent money to Ukraine can be repaid at the expense of Ukraine’s poorhttp://www.kommersant.ua/doc/2424454 It is Greece all over again.

http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2014/03/06/looting-ukraine-begun/

The article below breaks down the looting in greater detail.

Crimean leaders blame Kiev for selling Ukraine off for IMF loans, from The Voice of Russia:

…the country’s entire gas pipeline system will be handed over for free in the American company Chevron’s ownership the moment the basic agreement is signed, while the owners of the Mariupol, Zaporizhzhya and Dnipropetrovsk steel mills will be obliged to surrender their 50% stakes to Germany’s Ruhr.


The Donbass coal industry will be handed over to Ruhr’s subsidiary in Finland…


Kyiv has pledged to make territory available near Kharkiv to host US missile defense systems and a wing of American fighter jets to provide cover for the missile defense installations…


Ukraine’s interim prime minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk has assured the West that Kiev will fulfill all of the IMF’s terms in order to secure a loan, Kovitidi said.

 

Gas prices for municipal companies will have to be increased by 50% and for private will double.


Electricity tariffs will be raised by 40%, housing utility tariffs will be raised, too, gasoline excises will go up 60% and transportation tariffs 50%, while state support for childbirth will be cancelled, the free distribution of textbooks will be annulled at schools and the VAT relief will be scrapped in rural regions…


VAT will be introduced on medications, which will push up prices and bring citizens’ living standards down,” Kovitidi said.


“The planned annulment of the moratorium on the sale of farmland looks appalling. The selloff of Ukraine’s black soil zone, including to foreign countries, may have disastrous economic and social consequences,” she said.

http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_03_09/Crimean-leaders-blame-Kiev-for-selling-Ukraine-off-for-IMF-loans-1082/

http://tarpley.net/danger-of-nato-false-flag-ops-grows-as-crimeans-vote-in-referendum/

Washington’s Man Yatsenyuk Setting Ukraine Up For Ruin, from Forbes:

“Yatsenyuk was saying that what the Greeks did to themselves we are going to do ourselves,” said Signorelli. “He wants to follow the Greek economic model. Who the hell wants to follow that?”

http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2014/02/27/washingtons-man-yatsenyuk-setting-ukraine-up-for-ruin/

If conditions persist, Ukraine will soon no longer be able to pay public pensions and salaries.

http://www.activistpost.com/2014/02/the-winners-of-ukraine-revolution.html

http://www.forbes.com/sites/markadomanis/2014/02/27/7-reasons-why-you-should-be-pessimistic-about-ukraine/

 

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:04 | 4561885 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

"Everyone is looting Kiev" dude. It's like "the in thing to do right now." But the're still an independent State...though clearly not Soveriegn as they "want their Island back."

The Socom guys who trained Affhanistan's Army have now showed up...and these guys already have Staff Colleges, command and control, missiles, rockets, mortars...a verifiable goody bag of dirty tricks.

Klitchko is handing out the boxing gloves as it's "smash mouth time" in Crimea. "Sending in the Crazy Bezerkistani's" does not settle down the place either. Ukraine is Crimea's food supply...let alone economy...and Putin knows it.

Once the dockworkers don't get paid...then they have "peaceful co-existence sit down" and "management migraine."

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:19 | 4561907 Bonapartist
Bonapartist's picture

"Socom guys" -LOL- you watch too much 'Murican tee-vee. If the dockworkers don't get paid will Marlon Brando take on the longshoremen union's mob bosses? dumbass

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 02:34 | 4562059 Lin S
Lin S's picture

I think I read your analysis in Newsweek.  Or maybe it was USA Today... 

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 06:04 | 4562189 negative rates
negative rates's picture

But no second coming??

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 03:36 | 4562099 Independent
Independent's picture

Nice links Palm, it sucks cause Ukraine naturally would be a rich country, but when the Jewish Mafia parasites suck out hundreds of billions of dollars offshore via shell companies, the Ukraine gentiles become slaves again like they were under the Tatars

As my beady eyed little buddy Rabbi Ovadia Yosef said..."Goyim (gentiles, non-Jews) were born only to serve us. Without that, they have no place in the world – only to serve the People of Israel," he said, according to the Jerusalem Post. "Why are gentiles needed? They will work, they will plow, they will reap. We will sit like an effendi and eat. That is why gentiles were created." An "effendi" is a lord, or a master, in Arabic.

Guess the Ukraine oligarchs and the rest of the Jewish mafia are the Effendi

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:47 | 4561862 Azwethinkweiz
Azwethinkweiz's picture

Jack, I LOVE your posts! 1000% agreed!

IMO, watch China retake those islands in full mass. With the USA preoccupied with the Ukraine, Japan has ZERO allies. The USA will reneg on their treaty to protect Japan. China is watching and taking note. The world is about to change on a global scale. For better or worse. Also, IMO, can't get much worse.....also can't get much better. It's up to the people as a global force to decide. We're all the Jews in Nazi Germany now....hate or be hated, pick your side: good vs. evil, citizens vs. globalists (corporatists).

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 02:00 | 4562022 zionhead
zionhead's picture

Obama and the EU are playing their Iraq cards, they think Russia is Iraq, they have fucked up, drunk on their own dreams of world glory. My guess, "This will get one hell of a lot worse before it gets better".

*

"THEY" are drunk on the power of the USD FIAT to INFINITE, that they can buy off all in the MSS, KGB, CIA, MOSSAD, MI6, ... The TRILLIONARIES now are going for the MAX.

Why not soon the USD will have NO buying power, so best to BUY all the people you can while the USD is still trade-able.

Every PUTIN on earth can be made a BILLIONAIRE with INFINITE FED FIAT, so 'THEY' see it that way, "DRUNK" call it what you want.

'THEY' are smart they know once the USD goes down, only those who HOLD GOLD OR OIL will be king.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 05:56 | 4562181 Dollar Bill Hiccup
Dollar Bill Hiccup's picture

Moscow does not equal "Russia", whatever that is. It's a common view that Stalingrad was sacrificed, because it was too "Western". Moscow is its own insular world. It was a buffer and then over run by the Mongol Hordes. So Moscow in this sense is much closer to Asia. While the Ukraine is peopled ethnically by "Slavs", it was in power play for a long time, first as "Rus" w/ the center in Kiev, then under influence of the Duchy of Lithuania, which was never over run by the Mongols, the Lithuanian-Polish Commonwealth, and later brought under control of the new "Russian Empire", transformed from the Duchy of Muscovy, whence it tried to move westward under Peter the Great with the founding of St. Petersburg ...

History is long and winding. To reduce the current matter to us vs. them is hair brained at best.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 08:12 | 4562393 Element
Element's picture

 

 

"I respect Marc and always like to hear his point of view, though the China disaster it has been a long time in coming."

Remember that in 1988 everyone thought the Japanese economy and production was going to demolish the US economy and bring their GDP to parity?

The Japanese RE bubble, over-capacity and debt-bomb, followed by the 1992 global downturn/recession put an end to that entire trend. ;)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1d9TyJ04MeI

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 22:58 | 4561727 miro1a
miro1a's picture

Prague didn't get bombed out like the rest of Europe.  Nice place to visit.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:03 | 4561748 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

Neither did Moscow. Amazing place, St. Petersburg survived largely in tact as well. Both cities are amazing to see. Though their survival was paid for in the blood of millions of Red Army soldiers, the German war machine was one nasty and efficient killing machine.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 05:43 | 4562172 Dollar Bill Hiccup
Dollar Bill Hiccup's picture

Stalingrad?

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 05:13 | 4562157 Bearwagon
Bearwagon's picture

Neither was Basel. Nice place to visit, especially the very unremarkable bank that resides there ...

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 22:59 | 4561730 SgtShaftoe
SgtShaftoe's picture

The world is all going to hell.  I'm going to become a yak herder in Patagonia.  Send me a letter in 5 years and tell me how it turned out. 

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:04 | 4561752 Independent
Independent's picture

If one day you wake up and the sky is bright orange but its still the middle of the night, you know it didnt turn out well.

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:13 | 4561775 Miffed Microbio...
Miffed Microbiologist's picture

I have a very comfortable yurt. May I come along?

Miffed;-)

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:22 | 4561920 Philalethian
Philalethian's picture

Lol..

Have yurt...will travel!

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 03:51 | 4562102 Independent
Independent's picture

Gotta have some kumis if you are in the yurt

http://www.trivia-library.com/a/history-of-dairy-products-koumiss.htm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofMqmBZPzPI

http://rtd.rt.com/films/bashkiria-honey-kumis-paragliding/#part-1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVO8OikAHek&list=PL46tNPw4JvEiUUpOr5i9lC...

Bashkortorstan is a very cool province in Russia West of the Urals and including the southern part of them.  Its capital city UFA is one of the top cities in Russia. Very wealthy province with an interesting history.  The tie in is because the peoples there also lived in yurts part of the year and made koumiss, still a big koumiss making area in Russia.

And you can make koumis from yak milk also I believe, we will have to ask the Tibetans about that.

 

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:45 | 4561945 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Da, from east of urals...siber fish with potato make tasty dish..

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 01:01 | 4561966 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

Then you'll starve, as Yams are in Tibet, not Patagonia.

Hope your other Survival knowledge is better than your knowledge of each of these regions. ;-)

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 02:18 | 4562041 SgtShaftoe
SgtShaftoe's picture

They don't need to be native yaks.  There's huge yak operations in the rockies, but the yaks don't care.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 02:32 | 4562057 Serenity Now
Serenity Now's picture

I'm pretty sure you can grow Yams outside of Tibet.  ;)

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:00 | 4561734 Savyindallas
Savyindallas's picture

The Sudetenland was Germany's  -stolen from them at Versailles. Yes WW2 turned out bad. We gave the Bolsheviks an empire and didn't figure out allying with the Satanic murderous Stalin was a mistake until shortly after the war ended.  

Mon, 03/17/2014 - 23:14 | 4561776 FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

The Sudetenland was not Germany's any more than Southeast Europe belonged to the Austrohungarian empire which was also dismantled. You lose the war you lose lots of other things.

I like your point about the Bolsheviks. I believe it shows our limited ability to predict future events. In hindsight, Patton was probably right. The alliance with "Uncle Joe" Stalin was a friendship of convenience. Uncle Joe helped Hitler invade Poland and the Baltic States. He was Hitler's friend before he was our friend and we forgot that. In our hurry to find an end to the war we ceded 2/3 of Europe to Statist hell. It then spilled over to China and much of SE Asia and most of the land masses of the earth.

Tue, 03/18/2014 - 00:20 | 4561914 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

still...look at the great movies we got out of it.
"the Fifth Man"..."Dr Strangelove." With no Cold War you get no James Bond or Jack "what's his name" and that Russian Sumarine Captain who's actually Scottish not Libuanian.

Plus look at the stand up comedy. "Nobody makes people laugh harder than Russia." plus Rambo, Schwaraneggar...I mean how the SSR survived as long as it did with such withering "counter espionage" really is/was quite remarkable.

Now we have "Putie Pie." I'm thinking Dr Zhivago, Tolstoy, the 1812 Overture...something on a large canvas here, Grand...yet tragic. "the girl doesn't make it" but "she never really had a chance despite her complete and unwavering devotion." sleighs and horses, canon and saber...I think we've got some real possibilities here. "The Epic Returns!"

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