This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.

Feds Probe GM Over Ignition Problem Bankruptcy Fraud

Tyler Durden's picture


Not only is GM facing record high inventories of slow-to-sell cars and the recall of million sof its cars (and a sale halt), Reuters reports that the terrible ignition switch problem - that has caused 13 deaths - may have been known about (and not disclosed) prior to the bankruptcy (and subsequent taxpayer bailout). The Justic Department is investigating whether GM understated (or hid) the information from regulators and committed bankruptcy fraud.



Via Reuters,

Federal authorities are investigating whether General Motors hid an ignition switch defect when it filed for bankruptcy in 2009, The New York Times reported on Saturday.


The Justice Department's investigation of the automaker includes a probe of whether GM committed bankruptcy fraud by not disclosing the ignition problem, a person briefed on the inquiry told the Times on Friday, the paper said.


Authorities are also investigating whether GM understated the defect to federal safety regulators, the Times said.




The investigation is being run by FBI agents and federal prosecutors who worked on the fraud case against Toyota that ended in a $1.2 billion settlement last week, the paper said.


On Wednesday, GM was hit with a lawsuit demanding that the company be held liable for allegedly concealing ignition problems before its 2009 bankruptcy.


GM is a different legal entity than the one that filed the 2009 bankruptcy that shook the U.S. economy. The so-called new GM is not responsible under the terms of its bankruptcy exit for legal claims relating to incidents that took place before July 2009. Those claims must be brought against what remains of the "old" or pre-bankruptcy GM.


But the proposed class action, filed in federal court in California, said plaintiffs should be allowed to sue over the pre-bankruptcy actions "because of the active concealment by Old GM and GM."


The lawsuit also said GM was responsible for reporting to the federal government any safety-related problems for cars made before its bankruptcy.

How long until we see May Barra plead da fif?


- advertisements -

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Sat, 03/22/2014 - 20:43 | 4581264 Newfie
Newfie's picture

GM is a dinosaur and should be extinct.


Sat, 03/22/2014 - 20:50 | 4581278 smlbizman
smlbizman's picture

heads are gonna roll now......christ that made soda come out my nose....bonuses for everyone...

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:06 | 4581315 economics9698
economics9698's picture

GM should be merged with Chrysler but the smartest government in the world intervened. 

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:16 | 4581343 Surly Bear
Surly Bear's picture

bankruptcy fraud...sounds like me ex-wife....

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:44 | 4581423 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

So what if they committed bankruptcy fraud?  They are TBTF.  This episode will justify more money to the UAW.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 22:44 | 4581540 MontgomeryScott
MontgomeryScott's picture

Just to clarify:

The GOVERNMENT is going to sue GOVERNMENT MOTORS, using GOVERNMENT attornies, with GOVERNMENT hearings (and the subject of the GOVERNMENT-sponsored bankruptcy will also be a topic, I suppose).

No one will go to prison. No one will lose their jobs. The cost of GOVERNMENT MOTORS vehicles will rise, to pay for ther GOVERNMENT settlement.

Mussolini and Hitler are both rolling over in their graves with burning jealousy.

HHRs and Ions are pretty crappy cars, anyway, so the public actually will be relieved of a burden, and will be ever dependent on the GOVERNMENT to keep protecting them... from GOVERNMENT MOTORS...

The shitting ignition switch isn't made in the United States. Would anyone care to place wagers as to the location of manufacture?

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:00 | 4581569 Vampyroteuthis ...
Vampyroteuthis infernalis's picture

This is just an excuse for the Obummer administration to dump GM and say, "Hey, they were fraudulent in their dealings with the gov't". This instead of fessing up that saving this POS was a waste of taxpayer money and padding their cronies' pocket. Disgusting to the core.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:35 | 4581629 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

At least 13 people died while these corporate fucking facsists pocketed billions.  And the government already unloaded its GM stock for a loss.  

I own a small business.  If I decide that a few people have to die to increase my profit, I go to jail.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:40 | 4581642 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

If I rob a Chase branch for 10K, it's off to Leavenworth...turning big rocks into little rocks.
Professor Black was wanna rob it...own it first.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:00 | 4581682 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Unsafe at any speed. Even standing still.

The US auto industry has had it's nuts stripped from it since 1971. The 66 Mustang....tch....

Also, corporate personhood means GM is a machine building a machine, neither has a conscience...... humans are just....


Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:10 | 4581695 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

So what about the Japanese?  Those corporate facsists just entered into a $1B no prosecution agreement.  "Saying the case 'demonstrates that corporate fraud can kill' a Manhattan federal judge Thursday approved a $1.2 billion settlement that Toyota Motor Corp. ironed out with the feds over the giant Japanese automaker’s handling of a spate of sudden accelerations in its vehicles.  The settlement between the Justice Department and Toyota announced Wednesday followed a four-year criminal probe."

Tell the families of the victims that it was a Just result.  Just Us.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:11 | 4581705 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Toyota is a corporate person too.

It cries tears of lead. ALso noteworthy though, is that many things point to sabotage when it comes to the Toyota sudden acceleration story. Toyota was getting too good to be true. 

The machine needs to keep on killing...I call it th egreat machinery death cult...



Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:14 | 4581707 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Corporate person-hood is a sham.  I have a corporation but if my small business kills someone to increase my profit I go to jail.  Size matters.  The U.S. Supremes know this.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:21 | 4581718 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Corporate person hood is not a sham. It is central to the larger sham...

And check this out, good resource:

US is a corporate person. Right at the top.

Trouble is you do not have enouogh money to pay fines as a small biz guy. It's all about monetary value to a ledger...


Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:23 | 4581719 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

I don't mean to nit-pick, but the fine paying has nothing to do with it.  It has to do with funding the politicians who appoint the prosecutors and regulators.

The United States is not a corporation, but it is owned by several.  

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:38 | 4581740 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

I've read all that stuff before.  It completely misses the point. 

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:47 | 4581743 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Actually, here is one more, edited my last comment...

This is via the Cornell Law site:

(15) “United States” means— 

(A) a Federal corporation; (B) an agency, department, commission, board, or other entity of the United States; or (C) an instrumentality of the United States. Check the rest out....
Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:55 | 4581758 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

You missed the "or".   The United States is not a corporation.  London is.   The United States broke away from said corporation and its King some years ago.  Now, the United States is ruled by corporations including London.  

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:59 | 4581763 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Maybe you just want to keep your blinders on?

It defines it right from the Get go, it is a corporation. see (A)

Now I'll rest my case.


Sun, 03/23/2014 - 01:25 | 4581767 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

EDIT:  sorry for the snark, but this is a pet peeve of mine.  Read the whole law.

Do they not teach you how to read in India?  Let me quote the part you are focused on:

(15) “United States” means—

(A) a Federal corporation;

(B) an agency, department, commission, board, or other entity of the United States; or

(C) an instrumentality of the United States.

Not to mention that this is a Chapter that defines the United States for a specific purpose, and not for general purpose.   This is part of the Chapter of the U.S. collecting debts:

28 U.S. Code § 3001 - Applicability of chapter



Current through Pub. L. 113-86, except 113-79. (See Public Laws for the current Congress.)


US Code


(a) In General.— Except as provided in subsection (b), the  [1] chapter provides the exclusive civil procedures for the United States—

(1) to recover a judgment on a debt; or

(2) to obtain, before judgment on a claim for a debt, a remedy in connection with such claim.

(b) Limitation.— To the extent that another Federal law specifies procedures for recovering on a claim or a judgment for a debt arising under such law, those procedures shall apply to such claim or judgment to the extent those procedures are inconsistent with this chapter.

(c) Amounts Owing Other Than Debts.— This chapter shall not apply with respect to an amount owing that is not a debt or to a claim for an amount owing that is not a debt.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 01:41 | 4581802 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

It;s okay LTER, you are generally rude, and accepted as such. Just like you snarked about law and india.

Chew on this, are you saying the definition of the United States will differ with every context it is used in the code? Eh?

Case closed from my end....



Sun, 03/23/2014 - 01:51 | 4581806 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Are you calling from Inriana?

Fuck, man.  If you want to tell us what our law means, at least read it first.  We're all ruled by corporations.  I'm sorry that India is still subject to London.  Especially since the U.S. is once again under the control of London bankers.  Let's find a common ground against a common enemy. 

India needs to man up and say fuck you to London (again).  As do we (again).

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 03:01 | 4581860 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

You've switched topics, so I'll take that as a tap out from you ;-)

Of course we are banded together, the great ZH keyboard brigade...


Sun, 03/23/2014 - 07:15 | 4581985 negative rates
negative rates's picture

Lets fix the problem and make sure it never happens again, works every time.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:27 | 4581720 wee-weed up
wee-weed up's picture



Feds Probe GM...

Ha! Who owns GM?


Chickens, meet fox!


Sun, 03/23/2014 - 01:21 | 4581779 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

The U.S. government no longer owns GM.  They sold their stock for a loss.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 01:29 | 4581785 wee-weed up
wee-weed up's picture

The U.S. government no longer owns GM.

And you really believe that?

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 01:37 | 4581794 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

The U.S. sold their G.M. stock.  For a loss.  What's not to believe?  If anything, GM owns the government.  What other situation can you imagine where someone would loan you money knowing they will take a loss.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 01:44 | 4581804 wee-weed up
wee-weed up's picture

What other situation can you imagine where someone would loan you money knowing they will take a loss.

This was never a normal situation...

When the "someone would loan you money knowing they will take a loss" (i.e. the gov't) knows they have access to the bottomless well of taxpayer funds...

Anything is possible...

No, correction... PROBABLE.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 02:01 | 4581814 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

The corporations and bankers are the ones with the endless well of taxpayer dollars.   Look at any chart of wealth distribution.  But keep preachin' Rand.   Worked for Greenspan.  Which religion were Ayn and Alan again?

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 17:55 | 4583333 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

At least the Nazis produced the beetle.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 20:05 | 4583730 RedHarley
RedHarley's picture

What will happen now is the FBI will raid the offices of GM  and take all the evidence, then say they cannot release it due to the "pending investigation".........ala Solyndra.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:06 | 4581317 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

Did GM immediately stop honoring warranty claims on 2008 cars when it went through bankruptcy in 2009?  No.

I beg to differ that "New GM" has no obligations to anything "Old GM" did.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:38 | 4581635 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

GM (not Chrysler) accepted liability for all vehicles built before the BK.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:14 | 4581336 RedHarley
RedHarley's picture

Your comment made coffee spray out of my nose, as well as this comment "The Justic Department is investigating whether GM understated (or hid) the information from regulators and committed bankruptcy fraud."

The whole bankruptcy was a frickin' fraud.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 08:53 | 4582053 Max Cynical
Max Cynical's picture

"What difference at this point does it make?"

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 20:59 | 4581288 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture


   I agree, but can we please keep the new Corvette Z-O6?

 The Nissan Leaf and Toyota Prius drivers are out today.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:08 | 4581322 economics9698
economics9698's picture

I loved my 3.8 Intrigue.  Damn thing was comfortable and had balls.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:09 | 4581328 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

Old racing saw:  "As racecars go, the Corvette makes a nice ashtray."


Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:41 | 4581417 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 No Debt why don't you read the article before commenting. I've owned (2) ZO-6s and currently drive a 599GTO as one of my stable of cars.  I also have an deep affinity for the new Porsche 911.

 For it's intended purpose, the new ZO-6 is a lot of bang for the buck!

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 22:41 | 4581496 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

If I told you all the Chevys I've owned, worked on and raced (yes, I race- drag, autocross and road course), you would probably back off that statement a little.  I've been at this since I was 14, when I built my first small block Chevy (for my friend who was 16).  I build them, I drive them and I race them- gound up, every damned nut and bolt.  So, yeah, I have some experience with this stuff beyond reading magazines and hanging out with the cool car crowd where dollars equal status.

Yeah, I've owned a Z06 before (no dash in Z06, BTW).  A 2003.  Bought it used.  For the buck, awesome.  In absolute terms, not so fantastic.  And a rattle-trap to boot, like all GM vehicles.

GM builds two things well:  Engines and transmissions.  They get PILES of performance out of them, depspite the antiquated design (the TODAY-CURRENT Z06 uses a 2-valve pushrod engine- the latest itteration of the 'LS' engine family that debuted in the 1997 Corvette).  The piles of crap they wrap around them ruin the experience.


Sun, 03/23/2014 - 03:08 | 4581589 ptolemy_newit
ptolemy_newit's picture

the questions have easy answers regarding product validation and Cpk?  what aboout tolerance stack-up calculation?  all of these are available for review?   This is obvious a design error with probable missing in-process inspection.

It would be impossible for the NEW president who WAS the most senior level product engineering director to not know of these issues.


Look at her aging in the last month alone, (she looks scared)?

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:28 | 4581614 post turtle saver
post turtle saver's picture

if you're basing your critique on your anecdotal experience with a used c5 z06, you'll pardon if I don't see things the same way you do...

if you think a c7 z06 with the z07 package is going to be a similar experience to a used c5 z06... well, let's just say you need to look up from your muckrake and get out more...

I wrench and tune my own stuff by the way, as I would expect most people on the Hedge to do if they truly want to claim they're prepped for the big one... my view on GM is very different from yours and we'll just have to agree to disagree on things like build quality & interior... on drivetrain we're in violent agreement, except on the point that LSx is antiquated tech... far from it ;)

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:37 | 4581735 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

Yeah, screw all that....

When I'm trollin through Naptown in my fly ass Pinto...bitchez make way!

Like I own the road. No bumper humping or getting cut off.

Worst case scenario, it's as close to a Viking funeral as a hick like me could expect.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:57 | 4581761 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

now all you need is a cool song.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 01:35 | 4581793 iamrage
iamrage's picture

My dad can beat up both your dads.  Trolls trolling trolls.  Good game.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 16:47 | 4583150 nofluer
nofluer's picture

Two replies in one...first - from waaaaay above...

The so-called new GM is not responsible under the terms of its bankruptcy exit for legal claims relating to incidents that took place before July

I bought a brand new special order a 4 dr '82 1T Chebby. With just 28,000 miles on it, it started backfiring and pretty much tried to die. Problem? Bad Camshaft.

GM tried to give ME the shaft by telling me that I hadn't used the correct oil (and then included what ammounted to suborning of perjury from an auto mechanic school. (I used the oil in the owner's manual.) I called BS on them. Then I found out that there was a government agreement on several years of cam shafts and transmissions - that GM KNEW when they sold the trk to me were bad! No... they did not tell me. Then they tried to get out of paying for the repair. I ended up paying for 30% of the repair. (Used after market parts.) 

In return for that 30% and the way they handled the problem, I called the GM "customer service rep" in KC, MO. The guy essentially told me to F***off. My response - I told him that for the rest of my life, I would never ever buy another new GM product. It has been about 30 years since I told him that - and I don't care if they want to sell me a new Super Car for a dime... I WILL NOT BUY IT!

So... GM may not be "responsible" for things after July, but the effects of what they did before will carry on and on and on into the future because they have consistently treated their customers like chumps, lied to them, cheated them, and generally screwed them.

My father bought a new 3/4 T pu in '65 - the cam lobes were off 5 degrees. They replaced just about every part in the engine but it still wouldn't run right, then when the engine shelled out a week after the "warranty period" ran out, tried to weasel out of paying for it. The judge ordered them to pay costs of the action my father brought, his expenses involved in havng the truck towed, and to replace the engine FREE of charge.

Second comment - this one in response to the comment:

GM builds two things well:  Engines and transmissions.

Sorry. Not true. GM builds CRAP! Just in my family we have 18 years of GM building crappy camshafts.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 20:55 | 4581291 666
666's picture

Even if the worst is found to be what transpired, what will the punishment be? Another taxpayer bailout?

What's the friggin' point...

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 20:59 | 4581296 Bonapartist
Bonapartist's picture

GM must be doing ok seeing as all of the cops and firefighters I know keep buying their wives $50K GMC Acadias.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:11 | 4581332 economics9698
economics9698's picture

It pays to be a government worker. 

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:32 | 4581393 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

 'It puts their money in the basket or it gets hosed again...' 

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:18 | 4581712 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

"It pays to be a government worker."

Says a government worker.  You work for the state as a teacher.  Save us all your fucking hypocrisy.

It pays to own the government.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:32 | 4581391 booboo
booboo's picture

whats a GM?

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:33 | 4581401 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

 Government Minion...

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:33 | 4581398 BlindMonkey
BlindMonkey's picture

Crap. Should I buy the corvette now or wait until there is no company left to back the warranty?

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:43 | 4581420 QQQBall
QQQBall's picture

Ignition problem... As in failure to launch Obomber's presidency?

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:44 | 4581421 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Shit Obama-UAW company.  This is probably some scam govt lawsuit shakedown like the phony Toyota accidental acceleration case.  

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 22:26 | 4581507 williambanzai7
williambanzai7's picture

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 01:12 | 4581774 Buck Johnson
Buck Johnson's picture

I know, but the govt. doesn't want to change the paradigm of a new manufacturing system for the US so we could be the first ones to profit from it.  Orbital manufacturing for new materials that can't be maid on earth, Maglev rail systems linking the main and secondary cities of the country, new types of propulsion for space exploration, colonization of the planets and an infrastucture for the 22nd century.  So we stick with the combustable engine and old dinosaur companies that won't change because our leaders in business and govt. want to stay in control and the same old paradigm.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 01:49 | 4581811 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

of interest your comments fit the Breakaway Civilisation Catherin Austin Fitts discusses - manu of the type you mention in robotics and space tech does seem to be doing OK but servicing a much smaller middle class and smaller geo graphic regions as we transition from the industrial economy as we know it via the 'slow burn' plus this is being capitalised by the often illegal/off book transfer of wealth from the current industrial model and boomers (which is kinda noticeable and faciliated by govt).

In essence we funded and built the capital and capability for the high tech but its being shifted into a small net of corp's who are leveraging and harvesting that capital and tech for the next leap forward.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 09:26 | 4582078 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

....and we should hang the fuckers for it.

Finish the paragraph with the proper tone.
Just a friendly amendment.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 20:47 | 4581275 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

This is why GM should have never been bailed out to begin with.

GM Bondholders should have been made whole, and the clunking fat management sent packing with nothing.

Ironic that .gov is "investigating" the Frankenstein it brought out of the grave with taxpayer money.

GM is rewarded for failure from top to bottom, while investors are ripped off and consumers killed.

Why does this sound familiar?

U.S.A. = Joke.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 20:57 | 4581290 Independent
Independent's picture

I disagree, I dont want to see manufacturing killed off in the USA, what we should do is besides fines to the company, go after the assets of the executives who broke the law and also hand out jail sentences.  The same should of been done with Toyota.  Otherwise its business as usual.

Look we bailed out the Squid, Goldman Sachs and all the other criminals on Wall Street, why punish a company that actually produces instead of one that steals

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:03 | 4581307 nmewn
nmewn's picture

And what are we to do with, Solyndra, Fisker, A123 etc.?

Are we to allow them to escape the guillotine simply because "their papers were in order"? And CCX, nothing to see there?

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:35 | 4581630 Independent
Independent's picture

At least GM has a track record of being around for decades, should definitely get rid of middle management.  Those companies you mentioned are not GM this article is about GM, please stay on topic.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:47 | 4581657 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

I don't give a flying fuck if the company has been around since the days of Methuselah, if they can't make a buck without robbing the rest of us blind...

Fucuuuuuk em....with extreme enthusiasm.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:16 | 4581709 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

And you were the one that said...

...Look we bailed out the Squid, Goldman Sachs and all the other criminals on Wall Street, why punish a company that actually produces instead of one that steals....

So you went of topic....then jumped his shit for listing other fraudulent front shams of as much if not more slime that we got stuck with the tab for?

Flush your headgear....

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 01:09 | 4581771 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

make the bondholders whole?  that's what the bailouts have done for the banks and it hasn't been helpful.

if the company is not profitable/solvent, the bondholders should follow the stockholders down the spinning water.  if not, it's not a free market and bad things will happen, as we see.


Sun, 03/23/2014 - 04:22 | 4581906 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

Right; if someone is going to be made whole it should be individuals FIRST.

Individual shareholders, pension funds for the employees who worked for 30 years; not the fucks in management and banking who as a group were sheltered from consequences and sat on their fat asses while cutting corners and collecting bonuses off of the workers and taxpayers.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 07:58 | 4582021 BidnessMan
BidnessMan's picture

Labor got overpaid for 100 years and fat pensions for slapping hubcaps on Buicks.  Everyone in the US subsidized high living in Michigan for the car industry through collusion between labor, management, government and the finance industry.  There are no innocents.  So everyone should share the downside they brought on themselves.    

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 17:22 | 4583253 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

I have much more sympathy for people who bolted motors in and got their hands dirty doing actual labor versus paper pushers.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:05 | 4581311 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

I don't want to see manufacturing killed off in the U.S.A. either.

Problem being that failure is rewarded and no one goes to jail; which leads to failed industries eventually.

U.S. Government and industry are unethical and immoral, and have abandoned the rule-of-law and the social contract.  Until that is remedied this kind of thing will happen over and over and over again.

Funny how the Feds go after Toyota but not Jon Corzine or the rapaciously corrupt and predatory financial industry, eh?

I'd bet you a Cobalt that the Feds make a lot of noise but won't do much to hurt Government Motors or jail one person.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:14 | 4581338 economics9698
economics9698's picture

Manufacturing will return when the bankers’ paper fiat is worthless.  Until then it is cheaper to print and import crap than to make crap.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:30 | 4581375 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

Independent said:  "Look we bailed out the Squid, Goldman Sachs and all the other criminals on Wall Street, why punish a company that actually produces instead of one that steals?"

That's the problem.  Why not bail out individuals and families?  The FED owes every taxpayer a minimum of a $3 million tax-free bail out.  Why not?  If we aren't going to allow failure, why not bail out citizens?

The U.S. as much admitted it was a fascist kleptoligarchy when it bailed out banks, insurance companies, and corporations - yet hung citizens out to dry while instituting ZIRP and QE.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 22:07 | 4581475 YHC-FTSE
YHC-FTSE's picture

Yep. If there's one thing I learned from my years of visiting here, it is this: You do not enable those in power to make grandiose gestures of largesse with the public purse, no matter how worthy the recipient. We are not serfs begging from their bowl, and businesses should not be run like giant charities to employ as many labourers as possible.

cynicalskeptic posted a mammoth story about Davy Crockett early this year that should be essential reading which will be better than anything I can post on the matter, found here:

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:35 | 4581631 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

I can't thank you enough for sharing that.

Wow. Giants used to live on this land...and I don't speak of the ones buried under mounds or the ones that haunted Genesis 6 and there after, but a much stronger and wiser sort.

But there were of renown.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:38 | 4581638 Independent
Independent's picture

OK that would be fine if the world was a level playing field, but car companies in other countries get a lot of backing and protection from their govts.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:51 | 4581668 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

Then smack the fuckers with a big ass tariff right as they roll into the port.

But for fucksake, don't change our Gov to mirror theirs.

If you want a level playing field...we can level it right here.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 03:04 | 4581861 Independent
Independent's picture

IndyPat for president....Ok so you close down your car manufacturers but now you slap only producers of cars with big tariffs lol, and what will you end up driving then if they say remove the tariffs or we wont import to you.

Gosh you are such the smooth talking politician Indy, lol IndyPat for president.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 09:39 | 4582093 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

Oh. Sorry bout that.
You're right, the State Owned Automotive Manufaturing Collective is kicking fat ass right now...and creating this utopian "level playing field" unicorn you seem to chase.
My bad. Carry on.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 04:52 | 4581916 hot sauce technician
hot sauce technician's picture

Good share. This Horatio Bunce character is interesting, the wise man of the "proletariat".

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 22:41 | 4581530 Ifigenia
Ifigenia's picture

punish the people responsible not the shareholders nor the taxpayers

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 20:52 | 4581284 Newfie
Newfie's picture

U.S.A. = No Joke

The States still have hardend steel.  You just have to light the blast furnace to burn off all the rust.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:12 | 4581330 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

A fair majority of Americans are no joke, and good people.

The states can't do a thing because they are dependent upon the .gov teat.

Both state and federal governments are run by the banks and financiers, not the electorate.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:15 | 4581342 economics9698
economics9698's picture

"Both state and federal governments are run by the banks and financiers, not the electorate."

Since 1913 and counting. 

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:40 | 4581415 post turtle saver
post turtle saver's picture

yeah, there's that way... or you can do things like Nucor...

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:04 | 4581293 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

Tyler why does this story get no love from ZH?


'We are only at the Big Bang of the movement - but revolutions are born of hunger and we are now hungry. Venice can now escape.’


Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:05 | 4581314 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

   Vatican City has always been considered an seperate country from Italy Fonz. I agree it's worth watching though.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:15 | 4581337 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

I hear you Yen. I kinda feel like this story is what ZH is (was?) truly about. Venice, Scotland....eventually it will be Texas. They will all be met with the logic in the quote below, and when they push past that, they will be met with an iron fist. Then they will truly understand where things are at.

"Pietro Piccinetti, who heads the “no” committee, tells NBC News the referendum is anachronistic, and dangerous for the region.

“Veneto can’t survive by itself,” said Piccinetti. “If entire nations these days struggle to cope with the economic crisis, what would happen to an independent region? It’s a contradiction.”



Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:32 | 4581397 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

Don't forget Catalonia in Spain.

Czech this out!  A list of separatist movements in Europe.  On freaking Wikipedia, no less.  I totally stumbled across it because I couldn't remember Catalonia so I typed a question into Google to find it.

That's one long-ass list.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:36 | 4581405 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

  Whole different concept with Catalonia. Catalonia wasn't founded on a religion.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:57 | 4581676 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

I don't see Balkanization as a sound tactic.

Sounds like Soros play book to me, divided we fall and whatnot.

Fiefdoms....easier to push us around that way...

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 03:06 | 4581864 Independent
Independent's picture

Disagree, easier for the Tribe to control politics and politicians the bigger the country and the further the politicians are from their constituents.  Look at how they have integrated and completed their control of large media.  Balkanization is better.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 09:50 | 4582107 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

Looks like I gotta break out the Crayons and draw it out for you.

I was speaking as much in the geographic sense as the control system sense.

May I present as Exhibit A: the Former Yugoslavia

Now rendered powerless, disarmed and neutered into convenient bite sized pieces for NWO rapid consumption.

Exhibit B: Ukraine. Disarmed under the same doctrine. Now left in the tug of war, along with other former Eastern Bloc satellite countries, ripe for the raping.

I say again, this is Spooky Dude and Kissinger play book.

Coming to a state/fiefdom near you....

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:00 | 4581566 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Ventians are tough and independent bastards.  The city state was founded by people fleeing the Visigoths or Mongols.

Francesco da Mosto is a Ventian who did two documentaries that I think you can get on You Tube or on DVD.  Italy Tip to Toe and one just on Venice.  Many tried to conquer Venice but the swamps and water stopped them all.  Venice was also very important in beating Erogans crap Islamic Ottoman at the Battle of Lepanto.

The Ventians are some of the tallest Italians I ever came across and the women are pretty nice too.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 03:07 | 4581866 Independent
Independent's picture

Maybe because they have a lot of German blood in them.  The Lombards were a Germanic tribe that settled in large numbers in northern Italy

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:04 | 4581575 Blano
Blano's picture

"eventually it will be Texas."

That's actually one reason why I came here.  I'm curious though how the governor's race will turn out.  I think it will be a tell.  If Abortion Barbie loses but makes clear Texas is turning purple, then there's no hope. 

I'd rather it all happen in my lifetime, but I'm kinda doubting it at this point.  Still happy to be here though.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:59 | 4581679 Arkadaba
Arkadaba's picture

As someone who lived in Montreal for a long time and still considers it home in many ways, would love to see this:


Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:19 | 4581359 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

Provinces across eastern Europe joining the Russian Federation (or at least not willing to fight to stay out of it).  Meanwhile various provinces throughout the "western world" voluntarily rise up and clamor to go independent of their deeply indebted nations.

Just an observation.  No witty comment to go with it.


Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:23 | 4581369 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

That is what is really interesting to me. We are used to seeing this, but not in developed countries...or maybe we have and I'm just not paying attention. 

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:27 | 4581378 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

No, you didn't miss anything that I can see.  This is different.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 03:09 | 4581867 Independent
Independent's picture

Eh simple, Russia is BIG has tons of oil and natural resources, the Euros just have debt and no oil or natural resources.  Who the heck wants to ride a bike in wintertime lol

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:35 | 4581404 cherry picker
cherry picker's picture

I wouldn't mind seperating from a few governments myself as I am wondering where all the money is going and the number of laws and regulations are ridiculous.

We need roads, police, fire departments, etc, but 90% or more of what the so called governments offer in the way of services I never see or use and I buy gasoline so I figure the tax on that pays for roads.

I don't need government, they need me and I don't want to play anymore.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 08:27 | 4582039 Nimby
Nimby's picture

You do need government.  Government is what keeps me from killing you and raping your daughter.  They maintain a monopoly on the initiation of violence.  
That said, you don't need THIS government.  This government is killing you and raping your daughter. 

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 09:53 | 4582111 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

Raping the fuckin dog too...and eating all the fucking Doritos.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 20:58 | 4581299 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Osama's dead & GM's still alive? ;-)

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:02 | 4581303 Newfie
Newfie's picture

GM is coming out with a 2015 Osama mid size sedan.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:12 | 4581334 nmewn
nmewn's picture

With cameras in the steering wheel, microphones in the cabin lights & OnStar baby!

Meglomaniac despots can never be too careful ;-)

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:35 | 4581632 BlindMonkey
BlindMonkey's picture

Don't forget about the convertible option: the top doesn't go down but the security does.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:01 | 4581687 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

Or the ever popular with reporters....the Boston Breaks feature.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:31 | 4581730 willwork4food
willwork4food's picture

Comes with annual blow jobs from Hillary.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:46 | 4581422 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

Just so they don't come out with the 2016 M'Obama Sedan, tons of room in the huge trunk, gets 1 mile to the gallon (but it's subsidized by the taxpayer so who gives a shit?), 16 speaker 'Shrill' sound-system with SubwookiesTM for earth-shattering bass, can go from 0-Bitch in 3.2 seconds, only comes in 'Downtown Chicago Brown', has 24/7/365 NSA monitoring, and you don't even have to pay for it, your neighbor does.... 

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:03 | 4581305 Independent
Independent's picture

I didnt like bin Ladin but I like my GM cars, so no problem there.  Lay off the American car companies, the new Japanese cars are comparable in quality, this is not the 80s and early 90s anymore

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:18 | 4581355 nmewn
nmewn's picture

I drove Chevy's for 20 years.

Until they got taken over by Car Czar (Wall Street crony/financier) Rattner, got a 2012 four door Ford p-up now.

Wish me luck ;-)

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:29 | 4581385 Newfie
Newfie's picture

My first car was a 1986 Mustang, it burned to the ground 6 months later while waiting for it to warm up in -38C.

My father yelled your car is on FIRE! We both went to the driveway and laughed our asses off. There was nothing else we could do.

My father is passed 3 years this week. That day he taught me a valuable lesson. If you have your life and health, material possessions mean nothing.


To this day when bad things happen and I still have my life, health and loved ones the best thing to do is laugh.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:46 | 4581426 nmewn
nmewn's picture

You were brought up well, without life, health and family/friends, all the material things in the world mean absolutely nothing.

But I got a big ass chip on my shoulder when being forced to pay for others mistakes, especially when I said it was a mistake from the start and they didn't listen.

Now, not only was my advice unheeded, I was mocked & ridiculed by people without anyones best interests at heart but themselves, who are (and remain idiot slaves) and I've been stolen from by issuing to me devalued dollars as compensation...again, all done by force.

Its not something I take lightly.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 22:18 | 4581490 Newfie
Newfie's picture

I'm as sober as three judges right now.

nmewn, I agree.

I'm tired and worn. I'm a small business. I pay taxes till I shit blood and I see shitpumps get everything they want and appear to do better than me as I try not to have debt.

I'm a fool an idiot. I work my ass off to be abused and taken advantage of by dicktrees who do fuck all.

I'm drunk and ending my rant here.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 22:37 | 4581526 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

When you're trying to do the 'right' thing in the 'wrong' environment, no amount of sacrifice is going to change things.  I gave up a few years ago and just let it all go. What's the use? Better to let the beast starve than feed it because it's going to die at some point. If you're hanging on to the carcass it's just going to take you down...

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 08:24 | 4582034 Nimby
Nimby's picture

Ford sedans are still hit or miss (don't touch a Fiesta or a Fusion with an automatic transmission), and don't buy anything that comes out of their Hermosillo plant.
F-series trucks are pretty damn bulletproof.  They aren't idiotproof, however.  You try to pull 10,000 pounds with a 3.10 rear end and a V6 and you're going to be disappointed. 

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 10:09 | 4582124 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

What's missing is a decent light truck.
Case in point.
My wife's grandpa, right before he died, made it very clear he wanted his 2003 Ranger extended cab to go to me. He used it only on rare occasions to pull and launch his bass boat. 20k miles when I got it in 2012. It's was cherry. He gave it to me because he had a huge family of cry babies and didn't want them chewing each other to pieces over it and he knew I was big enough to tell them all they could blow me if they had a problem with it. I also think he did it cause he was in pain...and he thought it would be a funny stunt to pull. He was right about that, you gotta give it to the old man. I was getting shitty comments before they even had a chance to plant him.
Anyway, like I said, it was cherry when I got it and I put a little more cheese in her....flat black wheels, more aggressive tires...and a real nice topper.
It's a great truck.
I got about 8 offers a week for it. It was a real head scratcher. I finally asked one dude why does everyone want this truck.
He said medium sized businesses that need to haul light stuff or need a decent maintenance vehicle now are shit out of luck and under served for this type vehicle.
Minivans are the only alternative...and they just don't make the nut for some companies.
I sold it to my pop for a song because I live in an urban area and didn't have room in my garage for it. Kept having to replace cab glass on it from pricks breaking in it....he loves it as much as I did.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:41 | 4581644 surf0766
surf0766's picture

2013 Camaro 24000 miles and 3 torqure converters, heater fan noisy as shit and was molded in the dash and needs to be cut out to be replace. Gas sloshes around when you are driving.

2004 Monte Carlo  40000 miles transmission hard shift. Not coverged  even though many have the hard shift. Traded it in because of it.

 I also had a 2003 Trailblaser ( cyl leak issues), wiring issues , plastic shit breaking issues, 

GM blows. I will never buy again.


Sun, 03/23/2014 - 01:39 | 4581795 Curiously_Crazy
Curiously_Crazy's picture

1996 Mitsubish Magna. 410,000kms and not serviced in around 75,000kms apart from wacking in a bit of oil in it when I start hearing the adjusters or tappets. Decent on fuel and still doesn't blow any smoke.

Previous car: 1990 Honda Prelude. That ol girl got to over 300,000 before I needed the bigger car.

One thing about the Japs, they really do build bloody good cars.

Edit to add: Yes, I'm well aware of Toyota being dragged though the cleaners and why thankyou very much.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 03:45 | 4581875 Independent
Independent's picture

Yeah keep talking crazy...

The Honda Civic is known to have transmission problems in the model years 1999 to 2004. This issue is well known with the automatic transmission version of this vehicle with the 2001 model year being the worst. At least 50 percent of the transmission issues are occurring well before the car hits 90,000 miles, with one in five having issues before the odometer hits 70,000 miles. The best thing to do is to watch for transmission issues and immediately take the car to get serviced if there are signs of a possible transmission issue.

 The 3rd gear of my Mitsubishi Magna Auto Transmission does not work. What's the problem and how to remedy it?

I am having my automatic transmission repaired and wonder if others have experienced a similar problem. It appears the reverse spring is disintegrating and the mechanics claim this is a problem with the Magna as the spring is a faulty component and should be replaced with a stronger version. I am having problems with Mitsubishi acknowledging this as a warranty repair – I am the original owner.

What they mean is the wave spring has eaten itself. This is a very common (and catastrophic) problem with the Magna autos up to the TL/2004 series. Once the wave spring has failed, the transmission will need to be rebuilt as loose parts of the broken wave spring destroy the innards.

The wave spring can be replaced by a stronger 3 coil item rather than the single coil spring thats in there now in pieces.

However, are they sure its the wave spring? I assume they have dropped the transmission fluid and found particles in it?

keep talking sucka.... by the way what point are you trying to make asswipe?

Maybe you should whack some oil in your empty skull I have a feeling the gears in there are dry and need some lubrication you little turd

One more thing punk

On some models the manual transmission fifth gear can grind on upshift due to a misaligned fifth shift fork. The transmission will have to be removed and disassembled and the fifth gear, the fifth sleeve set and the fifth gear shift fork will have to be replaced to repair this issue.

The ball joints in the front suspension may prematurely wear out. The ball joints could break in severe circumstances, which may cause an accident. <LOL right in Japan severe circumstance is driving straight on the road > Dealers will replace the front suspension lower ball joints. This recall is expected to begin by May 17, 1999. (this one will be great at 75 mph having your steering go haywire and you cant control you car as it suddenly veers to the right, in your case crazy too bad you didnt find a tree to crash into so I wouldnt have to hear your crap)


i bought a 01 prelude about 8 months ago.. its ATX but has tiptronic. .. 

when i bought the car it had 66,000 on it . now it has just under 80,000 on it. I only driven the car in tiptronic about a handful of times.

Now just today i go to start my car - start fine .. Put it in D .. shifts into gear jerks and the car dies ... THis happens in every gear including Reverse..


Worst case scenario - how much to get this transmission replaced - do u know any shops around Etobicoke area .. Any help will be appreciated .. im in a major jam


No biggie man.... Sorry to hear about your situation...... Theres a guy on here as well going through the same thing and he was quoted like 3500 to have it fixed I think !

Hey crazy why dont you do suicide yourself by jumping off of an embankment in Washington state, a banker has already verified the place as good for you.

"One thing about the Japs, they really do build bloody good cars."  What Japanese car executive dude are you dropping your pants for Crazy, word in Tokyo is you like giving Japanese guys blow jobs in their Japanese Cars... ah stop crying and wipe the cum off your face you little biatch

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 11:10 | 4582249 homiegot
homiegot's picture

You must be one of those car guys.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 21:52 | 4583997 Independent
Independent's picture

Yeah love the little Japanese Geisha BOYZ downvoting me.  Hey keep swallowing chumps

Sun, 03/30/2014 - 01:02 | 4607155 Curiously_Crazy
Curiously_Crazy's picture

Well I didn't down vote you, and though you were a bit bloody rough on the way you got your message across I still take it in. Water off a ducks back really.

I'm more than aware of the various issues facing vehicles from most Manufacturers and pointing out a few faults doesn't take away from the fact that in "faults per thousand cars" the Japs win hands down, followed by a coupla German manufacturers. I mean heck lets point out the cracked head problems Ford got way back when they introduced the alloy head, yet was still going on 20 fucking years later on the EL.... or the fact the transmissions shit themselves because they don't have a bloody trans cooler unless the tow kit is fitted.

I could go on and on but since you'll probably never see this I won't bother.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:05 | 4581312 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

Nationalize that piece of shit company and then sell it to the Chinese. 


Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:18 | 4581356 RedHarley
RedHarley's picture

Too Late. Gm is already selling ITSELF to the Chinese.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:36 | 4581406 PT
PT's picture

That's what I said a long time ago:  First they use Chinese blue-collar workers because it is cheaper.  Then they use Chinese white collar workers because it is cheaper.  Then Chinese CEOs because they are cheaper.  Then Chinese politicians because they are cheaper!

It's starting.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:05 | 4581313 TheRideNeverEnds
TheRideNeverEnds's picture

Good thing the government sold out the last of their long GM stock a couple months ago.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:09 | 4581325 fxrxexexdxoxmx
fxrxexexdxoxmx's picture

Government Motors being investigated by the Government. Wonder why Government Motors had not already be investigated after so many deaths related to this ignition problem. I do not remember but how many people died from the problem with Toyota's? The Government has been all over them and just a got a billion dollars. Why the difference in dilligence?

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:21 | 4581364 drinkin koolaid
drinkin koolaid's picture

Well, duh.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:25 | 4581374 SillySalesmanQu...
SillySalesmanQuestion's picture

The big differencence is, before bankruptcy, GM was Generous Motors. After bankruptcy, they are now Goverment Motors.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:18 | 4581600 MrSteve
MrSteve's picture

Graveyard Motors

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:29 | 4581382 Dewey Cheatum Howe
Dewey Cheatum Howe's picture

If they didn't lose money on the bailout the JustUs Department wouldn't be investigating this.....

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:42 | 4581418 QQQBall
QQQBall's picture

Yeah Eric Holder is gonna make Obomber look bad on the bailout.... Pull my finger

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:51 | 4581439 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

It's not that GM committed fraud, it's how often and how high the smell goes that's interesting. If we could just start hanging 10 Dimon's, 10 Holder's, and 10 'Corporate' lawyers a week, publicly.  At some point they'd stop this shit or we'd just run out of all three. Win, win, win, bitchez...

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 00:44 | 4581749 willwork4food
willwork4food's picture

Long CO hemp rope.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 21:58 | 4581456 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

Think they'll be as punitive with GM as they were Toyota......??

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 22:14 | 4581481 YHC-FTSE
YHC-FTSE's picture

This story is straight out of the pages of Fight Club. It's amazing how portentous the film was (1999!), and how it captured the mood of a generation of people sick of the corporatist bullshit and lies. No wonder Tyler started this site.

"A new car built by my company
leaves somewhere traveling at 60 mph. The
rear differential locks up. The car crashes
and burns with everyone trapped inside. Now:
should we initiate a recall? Take the number
of vehicles in the field, A, multiply by the
probable rate of failure, B, multiply by the
average out-of-court settlement, C. A times
B times C equals X. If X is less than the cost
of a recall, we don't do one."

Business woman on plane: "Are there a lot of
these kinds of accidents?"

Narrator: "You wouldn't believe."
Business woman on plane: "Which car company do
you work for?"

Narrator: "A major one."

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 22:45 | 4581544 Manipuflation
Manipuflation's picture

Well played YHC.     

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:17 | 4581598 YHC-FTSE
YHC-FTSE's picture

Hello! I enjoyed your post on CD's thread. Since your kind words the last time, I always look out for your posts. Hope things are going well with you mate.

Sun, 03/23/2014 - 17:07 | 4583194 mkkby
mkkby's picture

That rear differential lock up is EXACTLY what happened to my father's early 80s GM model car.  Nobody was hurt that time.

But my first purchase was a 85 toyota that would be running today had it not been hit by a stupid teen driver.  30 years later and I'm still only on my 2nd car... a honda.  Obviously nobody in my family, or anyone we know, ever bought another American car.

Ralph Nader wrote "Unsafe At Any Speed" about GM cars in the 60s.  They were doing that math back then.  I feel sorry for the workers who are out of jobs, but nobody buys an American car unless they want to be scammed out of their money, and possibly their life.

Sheeple need to wake up and read Consumer Reports before making large purchases.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 22:35 | 4581520 Dr. Hannibal Lecter
Dr. Hannibal Lecter's picture

It is technically impossible for GM to have committed bankruptcy fraud, since they never actually went thru and formal bankruptcy proceedings to begin with.

They were carved up, part and parcel, and given to the Clown Prince's buddies.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 22:49 | 4581553 El Hosel
El Hosel's picture

Feds have been "Probing" everybody... bent over Bitchez unite already... Bitchez

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 22:52 | 4581557 Cabreado
Cabreado's picture

"The Justice Department is investigating whether GM understated (or hid) the information from regulators and committed bankruptcy fraud."

It reads like a bad joke.

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 22:52 | 4581558 stewmint
stewmint's picture

Final Result - X hundred million dollar fine, no admittance of guilt.


Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:00 | 4581564 palmereldritch
palmereldritch's picture

Here's the math on how they determine if a car is recalled

EDIT: It's the audio clip to the transcript posted by YHC

Sat, 03/22/2014 - 23:41 | 4581643 syntaxterror
syntaxterror's picture

Too big to fail. Too big to jail. Welcome to America.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!