This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.

Why Did BRICS Back Russia On Crimea?

Tyler Durden's picture


Submitted by Zachary Zeck of The Diplomat,

There’s been no shortage of reports and commentaries on the crisis in Ukraine and Crimea, and Russia’s role in it. Yet one of the more notable recent developments in the crisis has received surprisingly little attention.

Namely, the BRICS grouping (Brazil, Russia, India, China, and South Africa) has unanimously and, in many ways, forcefully backed Russia’s position on Crimea. The Diplomat has reported on China’s cautious and India’s more enthusiastic backing of Russia before. However, the BRICS grouping as a whole has also stood by the Kremlin.

Indeed, they made this quite clear during a BRICS foreign minister meeting that took place on the sidelines of the Nuclear Security Summit in The Hague last week. Just prior to the meeting, Australian Foreign Minister Julie Bishop suggested that Australia might ban Russia’s participation in the G20 summit it will be hosting later this year as a means of pressuring Vladimir Putin on Ukraine.

The BRICS foreign ministers warned Australia against this course of action in the statement they released following their meeting last week. “The Ministers noted with concern the recent media statement on the forthcoming G20 Summit to be held in Brisbane in November 2014,” the statement said. “The custodianship of the G20 belongs to all Member States equally and no one Member State can unilaterally determine its nature and character.”

The statement went on to say, “The escalation of hostile language, sanctions and counter-sanctions, and force does not contribute to a sustainable and peaceful solution, according to international law, including the principles and purposes of the United Nations Charter.” As Oliver Stuenkel at Post Western World noted, the statement as a whole, and in particular the G20 aspect of it, was a “clear sign that [the] West will not succeed in bringing the entire international community into line in its attempt to isolate Russia.”

This was further reinforced later in the week when China, Brazil, India and South Africa (along with 54 other nations) all abstained from the UN General Assembly resolution criticizing the Crimea referendum. Another ten states joined Russia in voting against the non-binding resolution.

In some ways, the other BRICS countries’ support for Russia is entirely predictable. The group has always been somewhat constrained by the animosities that exist between certain members, as well as the general lack of shared purpose among such different and geographically dispersed nations. BRICS has often tried to overcome these internal challenges by unifying behind an anti-Western or at least post-Western position. In that sense, it’s no surprise that the group opposed Western attempts to isolate one of its own members.

At the same time, this anti-Western stance has usually taken the form of BRICS opposition to Western attempts to place new limits on sovereignty. Since many of its members are former Western colonies or quasi-colonies, the BRICS are highly suspicious of Western claims that sovereignty can be trumped by so-called universal principles of the humanitarian and anti-proliferation variety. Thus, they have been highly critical of NATO’s decision to serve as the air wing of the anti-Qaddafi opposition that overthrew the Libyan government in 2011, as well as what they perceive as attempts by the West to now overthrow Bashar al-Assad in Syria.

However, in the case of Ukraine, it was Russia that was violating the sanctity of another state’s sovereignty. Still, the BRICS grouping has backed Russia. It’s worth noting that the BRICS countries are supporting Russia at potentially great cost to themselves, given that they all face at least one potential secessionist movement within their own territories.

India, for example, has a long history of fluid borders and today struggles with potential secessionist movements from Muslim populations as well as a potent security threat from the Maoist insurgency. China suffers most notably from Tibetans and Uyghurs aspiring to break away from the Han-dominated Chinese state. Even among Han China, however, regional divisions have long challenged central control in the vast country. Calls for secession from the Cape region in South Africa have grown in recent years, and Brazil has long faced a secessionist movement in its southern sub-region, which is dominated demographically by European immigrants. Russia, of course, faces a host of internal secessionist groups that may someday lead Moscow to regret its annexation of Crimea.

The fact that BRICS supported Russia despite these concerns suggests that its anti-Western leanings may be more strongly held than most previously believed. Indeed, besides backing Russia in the foreign ministers’ statement, the rising powers also took time to harshly criticize the U.S. (not by name) for the cyber surveillance programs that were revealed by Edward Snowden.

The BRICS and other non-Western powers’ support for Russia also suggests that forging anything like an international order will be extremely difficult, given the lack of shared principles to act as a foundation. Although the West generally celebrated the fact that the UN General Assembly approved the resolution condemning the Crimea referendum, the fact that 69 countries either abstained or voted against it should be a wake-up call. It increasingly appears that the Western dominated post-Cold War era is over. But as of yet, no new order exists to replace it.



- advertisements -

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Mon, 03/31/2014 - 22:57 | 4612810 FieldingMellish
FieldingMellish's picture

"However, in the case of Ukraine, it was Russia that was violating the sanctity of another state’s sovereignty."

So goes the Western meme.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:01 | 4612820 DeadFred
DeadFred's picture

Why did they back Russia? Matbe because they were the cleanest dirty shirt in the conflict?

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:04 | 4612830 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

They have experience with the IMF.  They have seen the face of evil.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:17 | 4612957 DeadFred
DeadFred's picture

What I really want to know is why I'm reading from multiple sources that Russia has just backed the Ruble with gold and I'm not seeing anything about it on my go-to gold site ZeroHedge? Bad reports or is Tyler working on the post as we speak?

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:25 | 4612971 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

They backed Russia because they are getting wiser to the destabilization techniques the US uses.

Breakaway movements, or an outright coup as in Ukraine, sponsored by the US.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 01:47 | 4613063 wee-weed up
wee-weed up's picture

Putin or Obozo?

Putin. No contest.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 01:58 | 4613074 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture


NEW WORLD ORDER now refers to BRICS as the NEW WORLD


America is the OLD WORLD


Europe especially PIGS are the new west Indies to be colonized by the Yuan.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 06:26 | 4613253 negative rates
negative rates's picture

It's over if the U.S. loses Holland.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 06:30 | 4613257 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

No. Its a game to bring forward the beakaway civilisation for want of a better term.

This game plays the people For the corp interests hidden behind NGO B.S.. We're thinking in nationality, they;re herding us into regionalism for the opposite reason and devestating effect.



Tue, 04/01/2014 - 09:27 | 4613488 GoldenTool
GoldenTool's picture

Yes, nationality is the new red team/blue team.


"Lorem ipsum dolor abire"

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 09:42 | 4613522 mickeyman
mickeyman's picture

It isn't nationalities. It's the master plan of the grains. Glutenfrei's theory is being proven before our eyes.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 11:35 | 4613839 Bankstein Swiss...
Bankstein Swissgoldberg's picture

Thank you for this one. Dr Glutenfrei explains it all, indeed.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 08:59 | 4613431 sessinpo
sessinpo's picture

New world, old world. It's all the same.


Meet your new boss. Same as the old boss.

Sat, 04/19/2014 - 20:25 | 4676377 beefman
beefman's picture

ask putin what he thinks about you. you would be surprised. your best bet is with OBAMA.


Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:27 | 4612974 SilverIsMoney
SilverIsMoney's picture

Maybe cause it's a totally bogus report?

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:52 | 4613012 Wraith
Wraith's picture

It's April 1st.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 02:02 | 4613078 Philalethian
Philalethian's picture

This is just up on the line, Fred.

Covers the rafters of wonders and illusions in the grand matrix.:

No doubt there will be a fine full coverage ZH report here later today.

Who said single digit silver, and double digit gold?

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 06:31 | 4613258 negative rates
negative rates's picture

No you are way behind, others who also back by gold are Arabs, Indians, soon to be Chinese and quite possibly many others. But one thing we know for sure is that the modern U.S. won't ever be on the gold standard again. World cruise anyone?

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 10:50 | 4613701 Luckhasit
Luckhasit's picture

I wonder the same thing.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:48 | 4612972 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Because Rooshia is Just Another Brick in da Wall Street.....right?

Edit: Just noticed thsi was another DiPOOPlomat piece. Urgh! Whassup ZH?



Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:11 | 4613133 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Sure. The last thing the G-20 wants is the West (read USA) taking over Ukraine.

Food prices will skyrocket globally and living standards will suffer a material setback beyond belief.

No one is supporting Russia here...and of course the tell is Xi's visit to Germany "asking for a tour of the death camps."

Russia is not anyone's "friend" right perhaps the USA's.

The only question is "will Putin go for it?"
Turkey's economy has already collapsed...the table has been set. Does he just "walk on in their"? That's a trillion dollars worth of infrastructure...brand spanking new, top of the line.

We shall see...but that sure looks like a "G-2" if he does.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 07:52 | 4613322 CharlieSDT
CharlieSDT's picture

Are you smoking something?

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 08:01 | 4613333 BearClaw
BearClaw's picture

Actually the reason for Xi asking to tour WW2 concentration camps was to hit Japan for its own atrocities and the "tell" was Frau Merkel's declining to accompany him ahead of the EU parlimentary elections in May.



Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:56 | 4612991 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

Crash, everyone has seen "The Face" and has experience with "The Face".  Yet most seem content to let the actors change costume and pretend they a new characters in a different play.

"was to support a foreign policy within a new world order that was to feature the United States as the leading power – a programme defined by the Rockefeller Foundation as ‘disinterested’, ‘objective’ and even ‘non-political’…"

a.k.a. the Breakaway Civilisation??? see Cath Austin-Fitts

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 02:37 | 4613107 dirty belly
dirty belly's picture

"200,000 people signed up to go to Mars last year, where as in the first month or two of Obamacare, only 60,000 signed up.  A one way to Mars was more popular than Obamacare."  Cath Austin-Fits

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 05:29 | 4613227 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

IMO the point is to stop thinking about nations - they have and are being F'd beyond all recognition.

Its micro-cosims hiding behind "nations" running this shit.

These microbes will not be destroyed by war nor reset nor ....... anything. You and I most likely will be.


Tue, 04/01/2014 - 07:03 | 4613277 Reptil
Reptil's picture

hear hear... any country "helped" by the IMF is doomed economically.

please watch this long but interesting video about Argentina?
it correctly identifies the stages in a takeover and dismanteling of a country.
an "IMF model" if you like...

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 08:08 | 4613340 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

"Gentlemen, we must hang together, or we most assuredly will hang separately." -- Ben Franklin

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:46 | 4613004 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

They looked at Natalia Poklonskaya and realized she was with the good guys.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 15:32 | 4614696 daveO
daveO's picture

Oil and Gas. Russia is far more stable than the Arabs.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:37 | 4612893 tsuki
tsuki's picture

This is where this piece of propaganda lost me.  To spend 5 billion dollars to violently overthrow a country's democratically elected government to install a puppet does not violate another state's soveregnity, but standing by while a democratic election of the people of a section of that country decides whether to acknowledge a takeover by a foreign entity does.  Hmmmm. 

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:51 | 4612919 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

You have captured the situation perfectly tsuki, now all you need to do is fly your third rate diplomats around the world demanding sanctions for daring to give the people of a state the right of self determination, its just so damn anti democracy and against the American 2 part dictatorship to allow the peasants to make these kinds of decisions, that's what Goldman Sachs is for..

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:13 | 4613135 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Goldman Sachs is bank rolling this invasion.

Move along...

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:46 | 4613002 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

That's why Kirk is packing his bug out bag.

As a cosmic disciple of TRUTH, Kirk finds the odious stench of bullying, corruption, fraud, hypocrisy, lies, and violence as unacceptable and intolerable.

One to beam up, dammit!

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 04:49 | 4613199 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

If what the west had to offer was so fucking cool, it would not take 5 billion $ to persuade them.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 15:34 | 4614710 daveO
daveO's picture

That $5 Billion is like a $2000 rebate on an over priced Ford Escort. They'll live to regret it!

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:43 | 4612902 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Why do the Tylers post NeoCon shit like this?   We all knew exactly how things really went down because we learned the news here on ZH!   aka "F**k the EU!" Nudelman, Yats, Klitchko, McCain with Soros plus links to sites like Vineyard Saker, Dimitry Orlov, Dr. Jim Willie and Moon of Alabama plus RT.

Tylers should be more careful or point out NeoCon BS before posting it. 

Please note - I am NOT blog pimping but this is some of the best coverage on the Ukraine.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:55 | 4612923 francis.sawyer001
francis.sawyer001's picture


This is the 'rhetorical' WHY?

Why can you ask such a question and have a 3 year life on this forum, when mere mortals ask such questions and have a life of just days?

Why can the BBC go where ZH fears to go??

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 12:53 | 4614082 emersonreturn
emersonreturn's picture that you?

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:06 | 4613127 Federizzle
Federizzle's picture

Cheers for the links bro. 

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 09:12 | 4613451 sessinpo
sessinpo's picture

Freddie         Why do the Tylers post NeoCon shit like this?   We all knew exactly how things really went down because we learned the news here on ZH!   aka "F**k the EU!" Nudelman, Yats, Klitchko, McCain with Soros


Perhaps we have different definitions of neocon (NeoConservative)

I see nothing conservative about udelman, Yats, Klitchko, McCain with Soros. These guys are either progressives, liberals, socialist or commies like Putin himself!

It's not about whether the left side or right side wins. They are the same side these days, which is not truly conservative. It's about who gets power.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:51 | 4612917 peter4805
peter4805's picture

"However, in the case of Ukraine, it was Russia that was violating the sanctity of another state’s sovereignty."


And this was the point where I quit reading this thinly disguised piece of propaganda.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 04:46 | 4613198 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

me 2.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 11:44 | 4613872 Bankstein Swiss...
Bankstein Swissgoldberg's picture

When a russian tank enters your backyard, maybe you'll change your mind. It's normal to say that Russia violated international law on this matter, (Neocon) propaganda is more like saying: "USA is not violating sovereignty, it just implements freedom and hope and security."

At least that's my opinion.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 12:18 | 4613967 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

We have a trillion dollar security state here.

That's what I worry about, not Russian tanks.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 13:25 | 4614190 Zerozen
Zerozen's picture

I just checked my back yard...still don't see any Russian tanks.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 15:38 | 4614723 daveO
daveO's picture

They only have one 30 yr. old Aircraft Carrier to park in the Black Sea. I wouldn't worry, either.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 04:51 | 4613200 DavidC
DavidC's picture

It WASN'T Russia violating the sanctity of another state's sovereignty, it was the USA going in with $5bn to destabilise a democratically elected prime minister (whether he was a 'nice' person or not) and the mess that has ensued since then as a result of the USA's actions.


Mon, 03/31/2014 - 22:58 | 4612813 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

Another deep-thinking article by the 20 lb. brains at 'The Diplomat'

The US still thinks it's shit don't stink.  The rest of the world disagrees.  Questions?


Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:16 | 4613136 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Only one. "Why are the Russians and the Americans who actually run things in agreement here?"

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 09:17 | 4613467 sessinpo
sessinpo's picture

So you are a junky. You have a dealer "USA", For what ever reason, he raises your prices so you go to dealer two ." Russia."

Now look at your situation if dealer USA and dealer Russia collude.

I used this analogy because I think you are smoking something and you might actually get it.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:01 | 4612821 DrData02
DrData02's picture

All hell is going to break loose now.  Who the hell let the BRICS know what we were up to??  It's going to be damn difficult to continue to screw them over if they pursue this course.  Someone better call Nuland to set up a few coups.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:30 | 4612874 SunnyDD
SunnyDD's picture

Just call in the NGOs and an other $5B that would show'em who is de Boss.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:08 | 4612836 kchrisc
kchrisc's picture

The corollary to the "Golden Rule" is, "That those with the gold also get the friends."

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:12 | 4612842 socalbeach
socalbeach's picture

No mention of the West funding the overthrow of the Ukranian government.  Article fail.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:20 | 4612965 shutdown
shutdown's picture

And orchestrating it, right down to the snipers. 

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:12 | 4612843 WTFUD
WTFUD's picture

Tut tut Australia ; it's criminal.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:30 | 4612875 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

An article one expects from the Diplomat, but I got stuck in the 3rd paragraph - Australia has some serious delusions of its place in the world and Julie Bishop has some serious delusions about her place in the world. Hence her need to plagiarise repeatedly; guess now she has a teleprompter.

"..Julie Bishop is embroiled in her second plagiarism controversy in a month, last night telephoning a New Zealand businessman to apologise that his words have appeared in a new book under her name without attribution.

Some parts of Ms Bishop's essay are lifted word-for-word from a speech the businessman made in 1999.."

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:46 | 4612908 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

Who the fudge is Julie Bishop and why does she matter?

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:26 | 4612921 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

That goes for the lot of them, unfortunately they provide good infotainment on Q&A. Very serious important stuff mate, hey.


edit: For non-Aussies. Qand A is a govt infomercial on serious topics that worry about splinters on the deck chairs of the Titianic. Yes, Fabian Soc is alive and well and policy!!

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:58 | 4612924 BigJim
BigJim's picture

She is a mattering puppet of the moment for Australians attempting to spread US citizenism... or something.

Where's Akak when we need him? 

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 04:45 | 4613197 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

poor guy was droned or rendited, probably.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 07:39 | 4613308 swmnguy
swmnguy's picture

Actually you sound a little more like AnAnonymous than Akak.  But I miss Akak, and I don't miss AnAnonymous and his blobbing-up.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 14:19 | 4614400 kchrisc
kchrisc's picture

Australians better work on their Chinese.

Start with figuring out how to say, "Thank you master."

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:42 | 4612904 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

mmm, we try, but when we look at what the rest of the world is doing we are looking virginal.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:01 | 4612931 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

No virgins in Oz. We've played our part in Africa and Asia and M.East.

Sod Fraser.

"The centrality of Fraser's part in the process leading to Zimbabwe's independence is indisputable. All the major African figures involved affirm it."

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:17 | 4612848 palmereldritch
palmereldritch's picture

Because they didn't want to be next in the IMF rape room?

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:33 | 4612884 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

We know which side our butt is buttered on, hang on I mean, bread margarined, or buttered on, something like that.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:18 | 4612850 Thorny Xi
Thorny Xi's picture

Sadly, the Aussies love being a USA bitch.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:35 | 4612888 ubjay
ubjay's picture

They love not to be shot at.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:35 | 4612889 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

Excuse me Thorny, we're an Anlgo-American bitch.

"Between 1955 and 1963, the British government conducted secret nuclear tests in Maralinga, an area in the west of South Australia....In 2001, Dr Sue Rabbit Roff, a researcher at Scotland’s University of Dundee, uncovered evidence which suggested that troops had been instructed to walk across the detonation sites within hours of detonation, and then return to these sites in the days following the detonation to expose themselves to radioactive materials. This was later confirmed by the British government, contradicting previous statements made that said than no humans were used in experiments related to nuclear weapons testing."

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:48 | 4613006 Ecclesia Militans
Ecclesia Militans's picture

Sweet Jesus!  After Gallipoli, you would have thought that the Australians would have stopped following instructions from the British MoD!!

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 01:00 | 4613019 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

I know who feeds me!


Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:36 | 4612890 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

Every country is somebodies bitch, the people of the US are their military's bitch.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:46 | 4612906 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

To how many masters can we be a bitch to?


We have been or still are a bitch to HRH/England, USA, Japan, China for "defense" for "economics" etc. Then our pollies are running off to the UN every 5 min sprouting that we're behind them and are willing to mess our Constitution for them, send our tax dollars to them and innovate ways to help them implement their soverign destroying agendas, treaties and policies.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:42 | 4612968 adeptish
adeptish's picture

The Aussies did coin the term "Seppo"


Here it is

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:20 | 4612857 Reaper
Reaper's picture

What the US and Obama do to Russia, they can do to you. Don't empower the bully.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 02:49 | 4613118 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

Imagine if we and everyone else had a real choice and a real chance at controlling our own soverign nation state?

Would we really vote to let anyone of these "super powers" or supra-nationals have a say in our state of affairs?

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:20 | 4612859 MaxThrust
MaxThrust's picture

If the Australian Government had any balls they would have abstained in the UN GA vote. But they cannot because they are lackeys of the USSA and ( their Israeli Masters ).


If I am correct did't most of the pepple in Crimea vote to join Russia?? Hmm seems some one out there does not want people expressing their free will.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:30 | 4612876 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

Yes, I was also obviously under the false impression that there was a fair referendum in line with UN charters on self determination in which an absolutely massive majority voted to become a part of Russia, but I guess that was all just Russian propaganda and no such referendum took place, must rush of to correct Wikipedia.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:43 | 4612905 Nexus789
Nexus789's picture

No chance. The Australian PM is an idiot. Even brought back Knighthoods and all that bullcrap. We are merely an offshoot of the US and going backwards in many ways.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:50 | 4612913 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

US and HRH (UK) hence Knighthoods. He's a Rhodes boy and Cecil Rhodes was one nasty freak with a clearly structured legacy for the HRH.

Edit: yes I agree with you Nexus.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 01:10 | 4613022 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

Note that the Anglo countries of the British Commonwealth (UK, Australia, Canada, and NZ) are all perfectly aligned with the US -- as they have been for the past 100 years, since WW1 in 1914.

The extent to which they accommodate Israel's mere wishes, are indicative of the degree of leveraged control the Imperialist Zionist lobby controls the US, and by extension also control the aforementioned countries (that pose no language or cultural barriers to TPTB in DC and NY).

The centennial anniversary of the start of WW1 is near. Look it up.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 04:37 | 4613189 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

Hey, I did see the post about the ballot.

Now, I will admit, it did not have 1) join Russia and 2) stay in Uk as the choices. It had join ruussia and go back to old constitution.

I do not think Putin has Imperial Ambitions, or a desire for economic world hedgemony. I may be wrong. I do know the western governments are ass-raping us financially.

So, right now,today, Putin looks less evil to me. I just hope he stays on a narrow course of defending his country and does not go Ivan on everyone. I really miss being overseas where a country would have 8 papers of many opinions. You could tell the dicktasterships, all the papers had 1 opinion.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:23 | 4612866 SunnyDD
SunnyDD's picture

Yet China won again. eat me. hehe.....

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:32 | 4612879 ubjay
ubjay's picture

After the fall of the wall NATO violated the treaty that the former soviet countries will not join NATO.

Then they said that you have to join NATO in order to be able to join the EU.

The BBRICs want a new world currency and the black Satan is trying to figure out how to

spoil their party. He desperately needs a war and he is going to get it.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:39 | 4612899 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

What treaty?

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:22 | 4612964 socalbeach
socalbeach's picture

Apparently not a treaty, but "political obligations", in writing, signed by Western leaders:


Russia has no intention to send troops into Ukraine – Lavrov

'It is wrong for NATO members to be protected with indivisible security and for everybody else to be treated as second-rate nations, so NATO can act as a magnet to attract new members and keep pushing the dividing line further to the east.

We were promised that this would not happen – and we were cheated. We were promised that NATO would not bring its military infrastructure closer to our borders – and we were cheated. We were promised there would be no military installations on the territory of the new NATO members. At first, we just listened to those promises and believed them. Then we started putting them on paper as political obligations, and serious people, Western leaders, signed those documents. But when we asked them how come those political obligations were ignored and whether we can make them legally binding, they told us, “No, political obligations are enough, and anyway, don’t worry, whatever we do is not against you."'

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 02:26 | 4613098 bradya
bradya's picture


Really summup 7 jets for 3 new NATO members with 7million of population total, is a huge threat for Russia.

Especially taking into account the reduction by magnitude of 10 tanks and other military equipment in Europe since fall of Soviet Union.

Should I list how many times Russia violated treaties and legal obligations since WWI, WWII or since Soviet Union fall?

Should I mention that new NATO members already been under Russia's occupation since WWII? Do you really think it was reasonable for NATO to deny defense for them?

You can see in Crimea, exactly why 70% of Ukranians and Georgians wants into NATO.


Let's take one recent example - treaty Sarkosi-Medvedev regarding Georgia meant to be obligatory - forces must have been moved on positions before war.

Never happend on Russia's side.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 11:52 | 4613895 gallistic
gallistic's picture

Should I list how many times Russia violated treaties and legal obligations since WWI, WWII or since Soviet Union fall? (sic)

Yes you should. Go for it troll.

Do it; you will get your ass handed to you with truth here.


Tue, 04/01/2014 - 01:37 | 4613055 ubjay
ubjay's picture

It was called 2+4.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:40 | 4612900 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

just got to laugh when people use words like 'Black satan' in a post, only a hop step and a jump from ' evil infidel'

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 04:30 | 4613187 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

IMO, Black Satan=Bath House

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:32 | 4612880 SubjectivObject
SubjectivObject's picture

"However, in the case of Ukraine, it was Russia that was violating the sanctity of another state’s sovereignty. "


History is what he thinks it is, without any reference beyond the State Dept.

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:47 | 4612881 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

"However, in the case of Ukraine, it was Russia that was violating the sanctity of another state’s sovereignty. Still, the BRICS grouping has backed Russia."...

Here "The Dip(shit)lomat Let me provide some context that you obviously deliberatley omitted...

"However, in the case of Ukraine, it was Russia that came to the aid of ethnic Russians in Crimea that had no means of defending themselves when a coup was orchestrated by the U.S. and EU to serve it's own "strategic interests" and not the people of Ukraine... Good thing that Russia came to Crimea's rescue not only by virtue of the fact that the Russian Government had a lease agreement to 2046 to it's port(s) but that the people could take refuge with a military that was the ONLY one that would protect them, in addition to a referendum to ensure that this psychopathic cunt would have killed them if Russia hadn't intervened after the legitimate government was overthrown with financial assistance from Western oil Corporations.


Fixed it for ya!  Please try harder to get your story right for a change! 

Zachary Zeck is a Douchbag!

Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:50 | 4612916 Freddie
Freddie's picture



Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:42 | 4612939 francis.sawyer001
francis.sawyer001's picture

Would Johnny CockNBalls' FUCK Zachary Zeck? and how much would Zachary have to pay CockNBall's?

That is the only question of merit WRT to this OP-POST.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:23 | 4613145 bradya
bradya's picture

As ethnic Russian:

Ethnic Russians in Crimea never had issues and real need to defend them with additional military or police forces from something more than regular criminal in Crimea.

They suffered no more than Ukranians in Russia, or Ukranians or other nations in Crimea.


Moreover in Crimea majority is Russian and that never been a problem until most of Ukranians citizents revolted against Putin's protege - Yanukovich.

Notably Yanukovich in Russian-speaking regions of Ukrain Yanukovich is really unpopular, polls saying something about 70% not supporting him.

So what kind of coup it is when unpopular in whole country bloody dictator escaping into country that sponsored his election?

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 04:57 | 4613203 Global Observer
Global Observer's picture

Wasn't Yanukovich elected in a popular election? Isn't there a provision in the Ukrainian constitution to impeach a President?

If a popularly elected President is removed from office is a manner other than is provided for under the constitution, it is a coup.

No one knows how popular or unpopular Yanukovich was when removed from office, as there was no election. Just in case you don't know, approval or otherwise of a representative in a democracy is determined through elections, not street protests,  opinion polls or claims from personal experience. Unless there are constitutional procedures specified for removing them from office, they continue in office till they resign, die or their term is over whichever is earlier. So next time you vote for a representative, remember you may be stuck with that person in office till the end of the term.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 05:37 | 4613232 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

Dipshitlomat LOL brain freeze


Mon, 03/31/2014 - 23:37 | 4612894 Nexus789
Nexus789's picture

Not hard to understand why they would not rush to support the US after decades of perfidious behaviour by the Washington degenerates and the idiots in the other Western capitals.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:03 | 4612934 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

Its is hard to tell from my posts, but I am a huge fan of the US, well, I am a huge fan of how the US used to be when it had integrity and was run by people who had the best of intentions even if things did not work out as planned and actually cared about people instead of seeing them simply as collateral damage on the way to obtaining more wealth or power.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:10 | 4612948 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

You're posts are not anti-American but IMO anti-MIC (for want of a better expression that I can think of right now). You're quite realistic and realise where the US goes so does Aust, if its in the direction we suspect, then we'll all share a lot of pain.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 12:07 | 4613937 gallistic
gallistic's picture

This is a wet dream come true for the MIC. They finally have a new/old boogeyman to scare you with and Cold War II is upon us.

NATO just came out with a (April fools???) declaration. Here is the entire NATO declaration for my fellow ZH'ers and critical thinkers to ponder and dismember with truth.

I truly hope you haven't been drinking some good, strong homemade.

Please try not to puke.


Statement by NATO Foreign Ministers 1 April 2014
  1. We, the Foreign Ministers of NATO, are united in our condemnation of Russia’s illegal military intervention in Ukraine and Russia’s violation of Ukraine’s sovereignty and territorial integrity. We do not recognize Russia’s illegal and illegitimate attempt to annex Crimea.  We urge Russia to take immediate steps, as set out in the statement by the NATO-Ukraine Commission, to return to compliance with international law and its international obligations and responsibilities, and to engage immediately in a genuine dialogue towards a political and diplomatic solution that respects international law and Ukraine’s internationally recognized borders. We support the deployment of an OSCE monitoring mission to Ukraine.
  2. Our goal of a Euro-Atlantic region whole, free, and at peace has not changed, but has been fundamentally challenged by Russia.  We support the sovereignty, political independence, and territorial integrity of all states within their internationally recognised borders.  An independent, sovereign, and stable Ukraine, firmly committed to democracy and respect for human rights, minorities, and the rule of law, is key to Euro-Atlantic security.
  3. In order to demonstrate our commitment to Ukraine, we will intensify our cooperation in the framework of our Distinctive Partnership. Today NATO and Ukraine have agreed, as set out in the statement by the NATO-Ukraine Commission, to implement immediate and longer-term measures in order to strengthen Ukraine’s ability to provide for its own security.
  4. We have also today agreed a package of measures aimed at deepening our cooperation with other NATO partners in Eastern Europe, in consultation with them and within our existing bilateral programmes.
  5. Over the past twenty years, NATO has consistently worked for closer cooperation and trust with Russia. However, Russia has violated international law and has acted in contradiction with the principles and commitments in the Euro-Atlantic Partnership Council Basic Document, the NATO-Russia Founding Act, and the Rome Declaration. It has gravely breached the trust upon which our cooperation must be based.
  6. We have decided to suspend all practical civilian and military cooperation between NATO and Russia. Our political dialogue in the NATO-Russia Council can continue, as necessary, at the Ambassadorial level and above, to allow us to exchange views, first and foremost on this crisis. We will review NATO’s relations with Russia at our next meeting in June.
  7. As stated by our Heads of State and Government at the Chicago Summit in 2012, NATO is based on solidarity, Alliance cohesion, and the indivisibility of our security. In the current situation, the Alliance has already taken steps to demonstrate solidarity and strengthen its ability to anticipate and respond quickly to any challenges to Alliance security. We will continue to provide appropriate reinforcement and visible assurance of NATO’s cohesion and commitment to deterrence and collective defence against any threat of aggression to the Alliance.


Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:04 | 4612938 news printer
news printer's picture

It's easy; they stick together they survive

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:08 | 4612942 Grom Hellscream
Grom Hellscream's picture

BTW, Putin has put implementation of PRO100 ( their own internal credit/bank card service ) into overdrive.


Expect the BRICS countries to honor it when it goes international. I, for one, am will to put up with Putin in order to have a credit card that does not send data to the IRS on a mere request.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:42 | 4612996 luckylongshot
luckylongshot's picture

It seems the cost to the US and EU of regularly raping the rest of the world has been to lose the support of the majority of the people on the planet. We now have the bizarre situation where, in its attempt to isolate Russia, the US and EU have managed to isolate themselves. Furthermore, if the opinion polls are to be believed, most of the people in key EU lands are opposed to the actions of the EU. Yet even in the face of isolation both internationally and domestically the deluded narcissists in charge of the West, continue to blunder on.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 01:46 | 4613061 bradya
bradya's picture

You looks funny - how is 11 countries with dictatorship vs 100 independend democratic countries is a loose of support?

China and Idia doesn't not support Russia in that matter. Neitrality from India and hostility from China toward Crimea annexation is telling completely different story from what you said here.


Polls in EU opposed to the sanctions is a very weak argument. Sanctions and act of war never popular in democratic society.

However very popular in dictatorships like Russia, when 90% supporting Crimea annexation and 80% supporting it even if it means a war.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 05:54 | 4613238 luckylongshot
luckylongshot's picture

The 100 so called independent democratic countries you mention all share a Rothschild owned central bank, making them neither independent nor truly democratic. The power in these countries sits in the same hands. The core issue in the Ukraine was always the eastward expansion of the Rothschild banking empire, not the welfare of the Ukrainian people. In terms of the Crimea the West has made itself look stupid. Either the unconstitutional coup that occurred and the annexation of Crimea are both illegal or they are both legal. Claiming one is ok and the other is not is straight out hypocrisy. The point you make about war not being popular in democratic society makes me wonder if you have followed any of the stream of US instigated wars that have occurred around the planet over the last 20 years, if so then you are a hypocrite. A good question to ask yourself is whether, in any of the wars in the last 20 years where a remote land has attacked other countries, the agressor has not been America or Nato. The answer is no as the only disputes other countries get involved in are territorial ones on their borders. 

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 00:46 | 4613001 jtg
jtg's picture

" the case of Ukraine, it was Russia that was violating the sanctity of another state’s sovereignty"? No, it was the US that by pulling off a coup had invalidated the Ukraine constitution.

The author betrays his Western automatic bias.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 01:52 | 4613064 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

Agree JTG, and Russia had a referendum in the Crimea which resulted in a massive majority in favor of Russian rule in accordance with UN criteria for self determination, plus managed to do it without killing anybody as opposed to Iraq which had no referendum when the US went in and they managed to murder about a million Iraq's the vast majority civilian men woman and children, all for freedom and democracy and have left the country with a strong Al Qaeda presence which was not there before, hurrah for democracy.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 02:10 | 4613089 bradya
bradya's picture

First let's ask who compiled the questions for the so-called "refferendum".

That was criminals with Russian citisentship, who took control of Crimea parliament using "polite armed force".

Those criminals got 3% on the previous election in Crimea.

Few people were beaten and never since then parliament's decisions were public or democratic.


Have you seen the questions on that refferendum? Because I actually did.

Question 1 - do you want to join Russia?

Question 2 - do you want to return to the constitution of 1992?

If you choose both options or none - that will be illegal choice, won't count.


Constitution of 1992 is constitution that gives enourmous power to the local Crimea authorities, including authority to join Russia.

So opponents of annexation had no choice on that reffrendum and massively ignored it.

Notably ballot counting wasn't independently checked, and there was no real rules on that elections.

e.g. tens of Ukranian activists wanted to visit Crimea and agitate people, majority was badly beaten and robbed, kidnapped and so on.

So you do support it? Peacefull?

Think again, that is a huge timebomb and new refugees and blood, even if this time it seems to be peacefull it is not.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:16 | 4613138 Manipuflation
Manipuflation's picture

What language is spoken in Crimea bradya?  Those are Russians in Crimea.  I just sat with a Ukranian Russian on Friday who was beaten on the knee.(He had joined a civilian patrol)  He was visting his family there.  Even he said to me, "We are Russian".  He said the vote was fair.  It's what Crimea wants.  Be careful what you wish for to be sure.

I even spoke with my Russian Mother-in-Law and I said "You will have more mouths to feed."  She replied, "Then we will feed them." She was not kidding either.  That's it for me.  It's all over.  Crimea is now part of Russia as far as I am concerned just as it once was.

And no, the predominant notions of Crimeans were towards rejoining Russia before the vote.  It is what they wanted and no shots fired by Russians.   

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:45 | 4613160 bradya
bradya's picture

Not even every Russian supporting that annexation and was ok to vote in those conditions.

Dont call that race/ethnic issue. Mostly division is USSR generations vs young people.

People of "West vs USSR" and people of "Russia plus EU and USA".


Once again, I can't call it "referendum", for many stated reasons. Sometimes people fooled by cogger and even didn't notice.

Sometimes they are under influence of propaganda.


I dont know where you looked for numbers, I saw multiple Crimea pols for many years, 30-40% max for joining to Russia.

I dont trust 97%, neither 80 or 50%. I dont trust elections when opponnents are beaten, and agitation is with Russia or with Swastica (with Nazi).


BTW no shots fired - is not exactly true. At least one Ukranian soldier died, and many were beaten, some soldiers still kidnapped not even getting POW status.

Yes, Ukranian military decided not to use force, for many reasons, including fears of massive Russian invasion in eastern regions.

But major issue was political unclarity - nobody placed an order to attack, eventually Ukranian soldiers were surrounded and beaten on their bases, because of no orders from Kiev.

Do you want to call it peacefully? I don't.


Once again, Russian population is brainwashed tens of times more than Western, that is really dangerous for everybody.

"We will feed them" with same fanatism they will horaay if atomic bomb will destroy couple of cities in the US, just because of some new Putin's agenda, or because of USA dropped bomb on Japan in WWII.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 04:09 | 4613181 Manipuflation
Manipuflation's picture

What is your skin the game then?  Why do you care?

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 12:53 | 4614084 gallistic
gallistic's picture

OK bradya, congratulations on your new subscription to ZH.

I know I shouldn't feed trolls, but I will a little, so it can survive until he is impaled.

You are a pathetic shill for an agenda. Unfortunately that agenda is not the truth.

One soldier was shot and died. Moot point- more murders than that happen in American and world-wide cities every single day.


I have never done so, but I will re-post something, because I am tired of weak-ass propagandists.


There have been Russian forces in Crimea for centuries. Are you really arguing that Russia had to pull out all its forces in Crimea, hand everything over to the crazy putschists in Kiev, and then hold the referendum, for it to be valid?

You have thrown up this impossible standard with the implicit assumption that there was fraud and coercion.

Facts are a tricky thing.

The EU was represented with a delegation of observers. There were international observers from 23 countries, including Austria, Belgium, Bulgaria, France, Germany, Hungary, Italy, Latvia and Poland.

Nobody, not even the US State Dept (who is not er... averse to fabrication), has said the results were manipulated. As a matter of fact, they admitted openly beforehand that the vote was going to be a majority for annexation.

The .gov argument and talking points are:

  • is against the "Ukrainian constitution" (oh the irony!)
  • is against "international law"
  • is a threat to international peace and security
  • is a "land grab" that will not be recognized

If you are going to be an effective shill, you should get with the program.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 04:09 | 4613180 sethstorm
sethstorm's picture

"We are Russian".  He said the vote was fair.

Two things that completely cancel out each other.


Crimea is now part of Russia as far as I am concerned just as it once was.

What you say and what the civilized world(read: not BRICS) recognizes are different things.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 04:11 | 4613183 Manipuflation
Manipuflation's picture

What are you going to do about it Seth?  Got any bright ideas?

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 05:30 | 4613228 tsuki
tsuki's picture

What other option could be place on the ballot?  They were not recognizing the illegal coup.


And violence?  I did not see anyone beat up on National Television by thugs.  I did not see any Molotov throwing "freedom" lovers.  I did not hear Crimean leaders wanting to "nuke" 8 million of their own population.


There is a timebomb waiting for the Ukraine.  It is called the IMF. 

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 01:54 | 4613067 bradya
bradya's picture

Coup? Really? Tell me please do you support this law?

Do you really think that change of constitution done by Yanykovich was legitimate?


November 30 is when goverment forces beat bunch of reporters and demonstrants.

Then hundred protestors were killed, two hundreds were kidnapped and never found, 900 - wounded, some of them heavilly.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 02:09 | 4613085 PowerPlayer
PowerPlayer's picture

I thought parliment voted to remove him from office.  Are you saying that if a US president was impeached it would be an illegal coup?  Even our constitution has a mechanism for congress to legally remove a president.  

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:56 | 4613171 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

Perhaps you should read up on what the actual procedure of impeachment is under the various constitutions of Ukraine before writing such drivel.  

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 05:13 | 4613219 tsuki
tsuki's picture

If the vote failed and he was removed, yes, it would be an illegal coup. 

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 01:40 | 4613057 bradya
bradya's picture

Well, zerohedge seems ridiculously populated with Kremlin propaganda, seems like Kremlin really do spend tonns of dollars on it.

First BRICS never supported what Russia did in Crimea, please read BRICS's statement carefully, not just few words cited in by Russian TV.

Yes, bunch of countries voted against - namely all 10 dictatorships, that usually voting against any normal decision.

US-EU resolution backed by 100 of countries and international law.

58 obstained countries, including China and India ... well they really do support Russia?

Let's take China: (Reuters) - China denounced Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe on Friday for drawing an analogy between Russia's behaviour in Crimea and China's actions in the disputed East and South China Seas, accusing Abe of hypocrisy.

So China dont like to be compared with Russia in Crimea, does it support Russia?


Let's take India even if you read whole RT compilation on that:

India never do express support for what happend in Crimea - best word to describe it - indifference, and some level of concern.

They never did recognise Abhazia/South Osetia as independend courtries, despite political pressure from the Russia.


Regarding amount of pressure put by both sides: West and Russia into that issue.

Assume that importance of event is extremely high from Russian side - annexation is a war-crime, and is a direct road into Haague Tribunal.

Stakes are very high for Russia, and Ukrain is news number 1 in Russian TV for several month's.

How much of those have you seen in CNN/FOX/BBC? Is it every day on front page since November? It is in Russian TV and other media.

Latest internet censorship in Russia was directed on,, - all sites with independend opinions on that.

Have you seen Ancle Sam censouring RT in USA?

For West stakes are high as well, but only in case if Russia will continue on Hitler's path and will try to expand war into whole area controlled by USSR after world war II (including Western Europe).

Amount of people that really think that way in our optimistic "peacefull" era is very low.

So is the believe that events like in Georgia and Ukrain can happen in Moldova, Azerbaijan, or Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania.

However some worries started and developed, based on Russia's actions.

So my perception is that "funny sanctions" is just a start of the road to understanding of Putin's danger.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 01:55 | 4613068 Serenity Now
Serenity Now's picture

GREAT comment.  

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 02:13 | 4613091 ubjay
ubjay's picture

Putin just drew a red line, not more.

After Libya, Syria and whatever next he says njet.

Putin does not pay 300 NGOs to raise trouble in foreign countries.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 02:48 | 4613116 bradya
bradya's picture

Nope, that is annexation, not a red line and the difference is beteen Putin and US-EU is huge.


West is paying NGO to provide and support humanity in society and democracy.

You can tell me I am wrong and actually they are paying for a coup, that is a lie.


Moreover, Russia is paying to NGOs also and contribution to NGOs is no much to West (whole West, e.g. Canada, US, EU) but concentrated on Russian political agenda and supported by Russian warfare.


In additional to that If you take Ukranian example - it is not a secret who elected Yanukovich and who sponsored his few attempts to get elected. Now this "refugee" bought a palace in the most expensive area close to the Moscow.

Spectacular "turn-off-pipeline show" on New Year, was driven by whole Russian govermental machinery, including TV, other media and so on - just to send a message that some Ukranian authorities are better, because they can get gazoline cheaper for Ukrain from Kremlin.

That is no match to funny 5bln$ to support democracy in Ukraine since 1991. That is including such projects - like helping all the political parties to educate members, observing elections, making polls, supporting media and so on.. No way those public money can go into opposition's pocket without knowlegde from Ukrain and US goverment and public.


Number of parties sponsored by Russian government in Ukrain, including extremists like ones in Crimea, most sponsors of "Party of Regions" (PR) and Yanukovich are oligarchs tied to the Kremlin and Putin personally.

So funny claim about 300 NGOs with 500k annual bugdet each, is no match against real pressure from the Russian government on Ukranian establishment.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 02:38 | 4613108 Manipuflation
Manipuflation's picture

You sound like my almost wife with your syntax.  You do realize the original Tyler is from Bulgaria right?(or so it is said)  So yes, one could expect a fair amount of Eastern European coverage here.  You have been here two weeks, so what is your deal?  Most folks would not know where Abkhazia even is but I caught that reference.  ZeroHedge is not a mainstream news site and never has been.  I'm not sure what you thought you were signing up for if you are offended.  There are a lot really bright people here; we call bullshit here everyday and we do it 24/7.

You were headed towards a point about Putin but you never quite made it there.  If you want to make a point about Putin then please do so.  I am sure ZHer's will forgive any grammatical errors.  This place is not always the most friendly evironment.  I know that Putin is not popular with many Russians.  Tell us why.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:09 | 4613130 bradya
bradya's picture

I can kind of understand wish to be non-mainstream. However it is really annoying that after not buying complicated BS from FOX and CNN you folk really trust liars in Russia Today and other dictatorships.

Really I hate that libertarians are trying to repeat and distribute propaganda from Russia Today.


What do you like to hear about Putin? Criminal and KGB agent, liar, with mentality that forces almost every country to be setup against Russia.

He raised his raiting three times using wars: War in Chechnya, War in Georgia, War in Ukraine.

He got all the political benefits on NATO wars as well.


We almost got into huge war with our closest ally - Ukraine, that wont be forgiven for another decade in Ukraine.

We got censorship upgraded in Russia recently, we got all kind of anti-free speach laws and so on.

Russian media are huge hate speach industry - one example they managed to forbid adoption of kids from Russia into the US, on basis that US citisents are evil and will torture kids (based on few examples of atrocities out of tens of thousands positive examples).


We got now real war-time progaganda in media in Russia and trust me that is really destoying souls.

I argued with my mom over that for 6 hours in row, and convinced her, but it was really hard.

We are getting information from any source we want - they can't.

Propaganda in Russia is not a one-time solution (for Georgian or Ukranian war) that is a system of complicated, well orchestraited lie.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:47 | 4613163 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

Frustration and limited options - like voting in a two party state!

When overseas RT gives me a headache, its fairly obvious in its "objectivity".

Most here get it, but posts are short and sweet (or sour!). This is a game and games have rules agreed to before hand.... rinse and repeat a little more history. We'll work our way through this discourse very slowly as usual (sadly the horse would have bolted).

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 04:45 | 4613196 Manipuflation
Manipuflation's picture

That's a good comment for the most part.  I must ask though, if it is a game, how do you win?

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 05:11 | 4613217 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture

If its a game? Neither you or I invented nor set it up.

You work it out just to use it temporarily, corrupt it and/or to escape it.

Its not your game and your life means something more.

I do not know you and I care more about you than these gamesters.


Tue, 04/01/2014 - 06:20 | 4613250 UselessEater
UselessEater's picture


In Australiass they're either married to or worked for Rothschild/Deutsche Bank/Gold.Sachs/Rhodes/Jesuit/Fabian.....

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:53 | 4613168 Manipuflation
Manipuflation's picture

No, I don't think you do understand the wish to be non-mainstream.  What worries you so much about us?  Why do you care what we might think?  If you want, you can start your own website.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 04:55 | 4613202 Serenity Now
Serenity Now's picture

People like yourself who believe that consensus and groupthink equal truth or evidence are EXACTLY the same as people who believe the mainstream media.

Ridiculing someone who has an opposite point of view, whether they have been here three days or three years, is a tired Leftist tactic.  You think you're so clever, but you aren't.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 10:25 | 4613635 shovelhead
shovelhead's picture

I think that the US State Dept. spending 5 billion to 'NGO's' to 'influence' a foreign govt.s internal make up constitutes bribery to effect a desired outcome. That money wasn't spent on pencils and paper to send Yanko petitions.

Bradya thinks it consists of handing out cookies as a humanitarian gesture.

I guess he thinks that Putin shouldn't mind being surrounded by NATO missiles right next door and having a herd of Neo-nazis influencing who gets their finger on the button.

Maybe he's right and Putin is a just nervous nellie who over-reacts.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 08:58 | 4613429 BearClaw
BearClaw's picture

@Bradya... Kindly fuck off back to the US State Dept. or whatever neocon 'think-tank' you're auditioning for.


Tue, 04/01/2014 - 02:15 | 4613080 NuYawkFrankie
NuYawkFrankie's picture

re Why Did BRICS Back Russia On Crimea?

Hmmm.... because this whole Ukrainian debacle was orchestrated by the USSA - the world's leading Thugocracy?

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:12 | 4613134 bradya
bradya's picture

You got a typo - USSR, not a USSA...

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:31 | 4613151 LongOfTooth
LongOfTooth's picture

No, they got it right.  Unfortunately it was USSA.


Tue, 04/01/2014 - 04:17 | 4613184 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture


Tue, 04/01/2014 - 02:05 | 4613081 PowerPlayer
PowerPlayer's picture

It isn't surprising that these countries all supported Russia.  They are relatively large and powerful countries.  It isn't shocking that large powerful countries would support a might is right strategy that just allows more powerful states to gobble up territory.  It is smaller countries that China, India, and Russia will gobble up that have issues with this.  That is all this was, was a stronghanded forceful move.  If it was truly about self determination do you think for a second India and China would support such a thing?  Ask China if they think Taiwan or Tibet should be able to determine their own futures.  What China does believe in is that if they have a bigger military they should be able to take whatever territory they want.      

Maybe we should join in and send troops into Mexico to acquire some new territory for ourselves.  It isn't worth it to China or Russia to stop us.  If you can't beat the Russians and Chinese then you might as well join them.  

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:20 | 4613142 Global Observer
Global Observer's picture

Russia didn't take in just territory, it took the territory along with the people, who are now Russian citizens. Do you want some Mexican territory with the people? Just propose that any Mexican state that through a referendum secedes from Mexico and votes to become a state of the USA wiill be accepted. I am sure there are a lot of proud Mexicans that would want to remain an independent country, but quite likely they are a minority. Entire Mexico may just decide to join the USA. That will solve the illegal alien problem.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 02:47 | 4613112 q99x2
q99x2's picture

Stazi like fascism is really easy to, publicly go up against. When the NSA was busted and Holder placed Western bankers above the law and the FED stole Germany's gold and the DHS was revealed as a domestic army to be used against the citizens of the US and drone terrorism, and killing millions under false pretense and on and on the rest of the World had rallying points. They had a plausable public position to be against such criminal behavior. Now the Western oligarchs appear worse than Sadam Housein, Gahdafi, Iran and are considered rouge and they have the power to destroy the World. Thei citizens of the Western nations know they need to arrest their oligarchs and bring them to justice. The rest of the world is taking the same side as Western nation's citizens. The timing for defeating the Western criminal oligarchs could not be better. It is a win win situation except for the NWO globalist M'Fers.

But the CNN diplomat still sucks.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:04 | 4613124 Debugas
Debugas's picture

after bombings of Yugoslavia international law is dead

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:09 | 4613129 Global Observer
Global Observer's picture

When less than 5000 of the 18000 Ukrainian military personnel stationed in Crimea chose, after the accession of Crimea to Russia, to join the Russian military or stay on in Crimea as civilians, no rational observer has any doubts about the validity of the referendum in Crimea.

While the BICS countries may not be big on self-detrmination rights of people, democracy etc as a matter of principle, they know, like any rational observer, that Russia's actions regarding Crimea were just and proper.

What is interesting is that instead of coming out in open support of Russia, they chose to stay neutral on resolutions aimed against Russia. Knowing fully well that the resolution in UNSC would be vetoed and the resolution in UNGA is not in anyway binding, by abstaining from voting, they are keeping their options open regarding any similar events in future.

What this has demonstrated is that the world is fast losing interest in granting the West the leadership role in international matters. They may cut them off completely by making a complete break from using Western currencies in trade not involving the West. When the West loses both the military and financial leverage against the rest of the world, they can whine all they want, but no one will be listening to them.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 04:05 | 4613179 sethstorm
sethstorm's picture

The problem is that you assume that the West will lose those.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 05:28 | 4613218 Global Observer
Global Observer's picture

The West has already lost the military leverage. That the West had to backtrack after publicly committing to invade Syria once Russia strongly opposed it and that they can do nothing after issuing grave threats to Russia are a testimony to the  loss of their military leverage. Yeah, sure they can threaten some tiny country, if Russia and China have no intentions of interfering or don't come out in open support of. But that's about the only military leverage they have left.

As for financial leverage, there will be none left once the IMF reform is complete or when the BRICS launch their currency, one of which is a done deal before the end of the year.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 06:18 | 4613248 Global Observer
Global Observer's picture

When less than 5000 of the 18000 Ukrainian military personnel stationed in Crimea chose, after the accession of Crimea to Russia, to join the Russian military or stay on in Crimea as civilians, no rational observer has any doubts about the validity of the referendum in Crimea.

The above should read

When less than 5000 of the 18000 Ukrainian military personnel stationed in Crimea chose, after the accession of Crimea to Russia, to return to Ukraine while the rest chose to join the Russian military or stay on in Crimea as civilians, no rational observer has any doubts about the validity of the referendum in Crimea.

I realised, quite late, that the phrase in blod italics was missing in the original.

Tue, 04/01/2014 - 03:47 | 4613162 hookah
hookah's picture

ZH is getting worse day by day. When US invaded Grenada, in UN 108 voted in favour, 9 against, 27 abstentions for all foreign troops must be removed from Grenada. Most of the closest allies of US voted against US.

Only reason why Brics abstained now cause Russian presussure.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!