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Putin Warns Europe "No Alternative... Will Cut Gas Supplies"
European partners have left Russia with "no alternative" but to halt supplies of gas to Ukraine and Europe, according to a letter from Russian president Putin to European leaders.
- *EUROPEAN PARTNERS LEAVE RUSSIA 'NO ALTERNATIVE,' PUTIN SAYS
- *RUSSIA TO HALT UKRAINE GAS IF PAYMENT VIOLATIONS GO ON: PUTIN
- *PUTIN: RUSSIA UKRAINE GAS SUBSIDY WORTH $35.4B IN PAST 4 YEARS
The remarks, as Reuters reports, were the strongest sign yet that Russia could curtail supplies of gas to (and through) Ukraine affecting supplies of gas to Europe (as they fear Ukraine will siphon off Russian gas meant for Europe). Russia is already reducing its delivery through Ukraine but it stil represents 39% of Europe's demand. Gazprom has also been forced to move to pre-payment terms on any future deliveries (there's your IMF bailout).
President Vladimir Putin has told European leaders a dispute over Ukraine's gas debt to Russia could affect supplies of Russian gas to Europe and proposed urgent discussions on the matter, his spokesman said on Thursday.
The remarks were the strongest sign yet that Russia could curtail supplies of gas to Ukraine, which could increase tension between Moscow and Kiev and aggravate the worst crisis in East-West ties since the Cold War.
"The situation is urgent," Putin's spokesman, Dmitry Peskov, said after Putin sent a letter expressing deep concern about Ukraine's $2.2 billion gas debt and warning of a possible impact on the transit of Russian gas to the European Union.
In the letter, Putin proposed "mechanisms of dialogue for urgent discussions of the situation that has developed," Peskov said. He did not give any details about the proposal or say which leaders were addressed.
Putin also added that Ukraine is in trouble...
- *PUTIN SAYS UKRAINE IS HEADING TOWARD DEFAULT
- *PUTIN URGES TALKS WITH EU MINISTERS ON UKRAINE GAS DEBT
- *PUTIN: RUSSIA UKRAINE SUBSIDY INCLUDES $18.4B TAKE-OR-PAY FINE
- *GAZPROM FORCED TO MOVE UKRAINE TO PREPAYMENT DUE TO DEBT: PUTIN
Reuters further adds that:
- IN LETTER SEEN BY REUTERS, PUTIN SAYS THERE ARE RISKS UKRAINE WILL SIPHON OFF RUSSIAN GAS DESTINED FOR EUROPE
- PUTIN SAYS IT IS NECESSARY TO PUMP 11.5 BCM OF GAS INTO UKRAINE GAS STORAGES TO SECURE UNINTERRUPTED RUSSIAN GAS TRANSIT TO EUROPE
- PUTIN URGES EUROPE TO URGENTLY DISCUSS MEASURES TO STABILISE UKRAINE'S ECONOMY AND ENSURE DELIVERY AND TRANSIT OF RUSSIAN GAS
We are sure any new sanctions that Obama and his motley crew are coming up with have all of this in mind...
In sum, Russia is saying that Ukraine must build its own gas reserves to guarantee that there is enough for Europe, and Ukraine is saying no. Russia is thus implying that European gas supplies are at risk because Ukraine will take the gas supposedly traveling to Europe.
The math, as performed by Gazprom, via Bloomberg:
Ukraine needs ~18bcm of natgas in underground storage facilities for future winter consumption, to ensure uninterrupted transit of Russian fuel to Europe, Gazprom Deputy CEO Vitaliy Markelov says at govt meeting outside Moscow. Ukraine has 6.5bcm in storage now, ~0.65bcm are in Crimeanunderground storage facilities. Markelov adds that 11.5bcm needed before winter to cost $4b-$5b, if history is any example gas in storage before last winter was 19bcm, and currently has 7.2bcm in underground storage, according to Naftogaz Ukrainy.
So to paraphrase: Gazprom is saying it demands that Ukraine build up its gas holdings to assured it won't syphon off gas with a European destination, gas which will cost Ukraine up to $5 billion, money which Russia is now demand be paid up front. Or else Europe gets it.
* * *
Full Putin letter is below via Itar-Tass (highlights ours):
Ukraine’s economy in the past several months has been plummeting. Its industrial and construction sectors have also been declining sharply. Its budget deficit is mounting. The condition of its currency system is becoming more and more deplorable. The negative trade balance is accompanied by the flight of capital from the country. Ukraine’s economy is steadfastly heading towards a default, a halt in production and skyrocketing unemployment.
Russia and the EU member states are Ukraine’s major trading partners. Proceeding from this, at the Russia-EU Summit at the end of January, we came to an agreement with our European partners to hold consultations on the subject of developing Ukraine’s economy, bearing in mind the interests of Ukraine and our countries while forming integration alliances with Ukraine’s participation. However, all attempts on Russia’s part to begin real consultations failed to produce any results.
Instead of consultations, we hear appeals to lower contractual prices on Russian natural gas – prices which are allegedly of a “political” nature. One gets the impression that the European partners want to unilaterally blame Russia for the consequences of Ukraine’s economic crisis.
Right from day one of Ukraine’s existence as an independent state, Russia has supported the stability of the Ukrainian economy by supplying it with natural gas at cut-rate prices. In January 2009, with the participation of the then-premier Yulia Tymoshenko, a purchase-and-sale contract on supplying natural gas for the period of 2009-2019 was signed. The contract regulated questions concerning the delivery of and payment for the product, and it also provided guarantees for its uninterrupted transit through the territory of Ukraine. What is more, Russia has been fulfilling the contract according to the letter and spirit of the document. Incidentally, Ukrainian Minister of Fuel and Energy at that time was Yuriy Prodan, who today holds a similar post in Kiev’s government.
The total volume of natural gas delivered to Ukraine, as stipulated in the contract during the period of 2009-2014 (first quarter), stands at 147.2 billion cubic meters. Here, I would like to emphasize that the price formula that had been set down in the contract had NOT been altered since that moment. And Ukraine, right up till August 2013, made regular payments for the natural gas in accordance with that formula.
However, the fact that after signing that contract, Russia granted Ukraine a whole string of unprecedented privileges and discounts on the price of natural gas, is quite another matter. This applies to the discount stemming from the 2010 Kharkiv Agreement, which was provided as advance payment for the future lease payments for the presence of the (Russian) Black Sea Fleet after 2017. This also refers to discounts on the prices for natural gas purchased by Ukraine’s chemical companies. This also concerns the discount granted in December 2013 for the duration of three months due to the critical state of Ukraine’s economy. Beginning with 2009, the total sum of these discounts stands at 17 billion US dollars. To this, we should add another 18.4 billion US dollars incurred by the Ukrainian side as a minimal take-or-pay fine.
In this manner, during the past four years, Russia has been subsidizing Ukraine’s economy by offering slashed natural gas prices worth 35.4 billion US dollars. In addition, in December 2013, Russia granted Ukraine a loan of 3 billion US dollars. These very significant sums were directed towards maintaining the stability and creditability of the Ukrainian economy and preservation of jobs. No other country provided such support except Russia.
What about the European partners? Instead of offering Ukraine real support, there is talk about a declaration of intent. There are only promises that are not backed by any real actions. The European Union is using Ukraine’s economy as a source of raw foodstuffs, metal and mineral resources, and at the same time, as a market for selling its highly-processed ready-made commodities (machine engineering and chemicals), thereby creating a deficit in Ukraine’s trade balance amounting to more than 10 billion US dollars. This comes to almost two-thirds of Ukraine’s overall deficit for 2013.
To a large extent, the crisis in Ukraine’s economy has been precipitated by the unbalanced trade with the EU member states, and this, in turn has had a sharply negative impact on Ukraine’s fulfillment of its contractual obligations to pay for deliveries of natural gas supplied by Russia. Gazprom neither has intentions except for those stipulated in the 2009 contract nor plans to set any additional conditions. This also concerns the contractual price for natural gas, which is calculated in strict accordance with the agreed formula. However, Russia cannot and should not unilaterally bear the burden of supporting Ukraine’s economy by way of providing discounts and forgiving debts, and in fact, using these subsidies to cover Ukraine’s deficit in its trade with the EU member states.
The debt of NAK Naftogaz Ukraine for delivered gas has been growing monthly this year. In November-December 2013 this debt stood at 1.451,5 billion US dollars; in February 2014 it increased by a further 260.3 million and in March by another 526.1 million US dollars. Here I would like to draw your attention to the fact that in March there was still a discount price applied, i.e., 268.5 US dollars per 1,000 cubic meters of gas. And even at that price, Ukraine did not pay a single dollar.
In such conditions, in accordance with Articles 5.15, 5.8 and 5.3 of the contract, Gazprom is compelled to switch over to advance payment for gas delivery, and in the event of further violation of the conditions of payment, will completely or partially cease gas deliveries. In other words, only the volume of natural gas will be delivered to Ukraine as was paid for one month in advance of delivery.
Undoubtedly, this is an extreme measure. We fully realize that this increases the risk of siphoning off natural gas passing through Ukraine’s territory and heading to European consumers. We also realize that this may make it difficult for Ukraine to accumulate sufficient gas reserves for use in the autumn and winter period. In order to guarantee uninterrupted transit, it will be necessary, in the nearest future, to supply 11.5 billion cubic meters of gas that will be pumped into Ukraine’s underground storage facilities, and this will require a payment of about 5 billion US dollars.
However, the fact that our European partners have unilaterally withdrawn from the concerted efforts to resolve the Ukrainian crisis, and even from holding consultations with the Russian side, leaves Russia no alternative.
There can be only one way out of the situation that has developed. We believe it is vital to hold, without delay, consultations at the level of ministers of economics, finances and energy in order to work out concerted actions to stabilize Ukraine’s economy and to ensure delivery and transit of Russian natural gas in accordance with the terms and conditions set down in the contract. We must lose no time in beginning to coordinate concrete steps. It is towards this end that we appeal to our European partners.
It goes without saying that Russia is prepared to participate in the effort to stabilize and restore Ukraine’s economy. However, not in a unilateral way, but on equal conditions with our European partners. It is also essential to take into account the actual investments, contributions and expenditures that Russia has shouldered by itself alone for such a long time in supporting Ukraine. As we see it, only such an approach would be fair and balanced, and only such an approach can lead to success.
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Alea iacta est?
He should finish off all his statements with "Check."
pods
The Ukrainians are guaranteed to siphon off gas and then blame the Russians. They did it in 2006 and 2009. This is why Putin needs Southstream to be completed, to reduce dependence on the Kiev Kriminals for gas transit.
Mostly Putin just needs the Europeans to wake up to themselves and see where this is going, and tell Washington to piss off from EU foreign policy affairs, then the EU itself will encourage Ukraine to be nice to Russia and behave itself, and pay its gas bill, ... or else both EU and the bear will beat them up.
Unfortunately the EU will be very slow waking-up to itself, as to where its interests really lay, over the next 25 years.
+1000 Element !
Sounds pretty good, until you realize Ukraine HAS NO FUCKING MONEY.
Alas, time for Ukraine to go back to being a Russian satellite. No soup for you!!!
They can always pay with wheat and cheap labor. Or ask the Fed to give them their gold back, and see how 'true' their friendship is with the US.
Europe is laying low, knowing that if it hits the fan, the US will pay for it all. Russia wants that too, as the US bailout to Ukraine and therefore Euro will go straight to Russia...
What the EU doesn't realize is the ones who will actually pay for this are themselves because the US will simply print whatever this costs, which shifts the real costs to debt holders and countries trapped in the petrodollar system. EU countries own a lot of US debt and are forced to by oil with dollars, this means that if the US prints to pay for something, its really the EU who pays.
The key is to not have dollar exposure, if you aren't invested in dollars then the US printing to pay for nonsense only indirectly effects you.
Hence: "Gas/Oil for Gold"
ps. "Seller may also accept part payment in machines and machine tools & parts."
pps. Print all the greenback confetti you want. We're not taking any.
The only thing the US has is printing presses. Vlad is going to stop taking US paper money in the near future because he knows it's worthless.
Spot on Element! I think the EU will pay for it myself otherwise their grand plan of the Ukraine joining the EMU is done kaput! He who controls the spice controls the universe. Oh I meant natural gas!
Notice how the EU is keeping its mouth shut for now and during the now G7 conference.
His open honesty is quite refreshing, wouldn't you agree? Concise, and to the point as to what is required. He's not back-stabbing, he's pushing the knife in while looking you in the eye.
Sure wish the current US administration was as clear in their intentions.
Paul Craig Roberts most recent interview on the overall situation including gold & Russia:
http://usawatchdog.com/gold-us-dollar-fight-to-the-death-paul-craig-robe...
Jim Willies new interview https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AfPMgogwLxE
The current administration's feeble skills are no match for the true power of the dark side. Now they will pay the price for their lack of vision.
The Current Administration IS the Dark Side.
They are just pawns of a darker hand. This country is being run by outsiders now. It should be plain as fucking day by now.
Obama is only half dark. Ditto Jarret. So who would they be referring to, if found to be gesturing at some group and saying in Yiddish, "they darker than us!" a la Mel Brooks? Who?
Ah, that would explain why Bush Sr. is getting into the election funds (war chest) for the GOOD Ole Party, even though he's close to 'Factory Recall'. /s
NoDebt...
I think WE will pay the price for the lack of vision in DC and the Fed.
WE have been thrown under the bus in an attempt to save a few large banks.
Can't understand why people expect Russia to be a charity. I mean, just because the west doesn't pay off shit they owe to others in the west, it doesn't have to be that Russia behaves this way.
And this is not some conjured loan of banker funny money. This is payment for a commodity.
Big difference.
Wonder if Vlad is a fan of Goodfellas?
Had a bad week? Fuck you, pay me!
pods
demand for natural gas is deminimus in Ukraine...especially if you're gonna push all the women and children into Kiev...or further East.
Those gas pipelines are of enormous value...anything happens to those things and all of Europe has an instant energy crisis.
That would make the Netherlands the richest country in Europe over night actually.
Great news for Tesla.
Great news for fuel cell companies too.
Bad news for peace of course. In order to respond to the unprovoked attack all other Eastern States with "mushy borders" will have to secure those borders and start forward deploying.
I think Russia is terrified of going hungry and needs that massive food production of Ukraine. Of course so does the rest of Europe.
I do agree "still no comment from the White House."
You display a remarkable ability to get nearly everything wrong.
Down vote if you must..., but I didn't see too many mistakes there.
He doesn't just have an opinion problem. He has facts wrong over and over and over again -- like so:
-- Those gas pipelines are of enormous value...anything happens to those things and all of Europe has an instant energy crisis. --
No, it doesn't. The UK doesn't use any Russian gas. Germany uses Russain gas from the Nordstream pipeline that doesn't even pass through Ukraine. Norway has its own. The Dutch and Danes have their own.
Or....
"Next time you think before you start a revolution in a country I control; Now - No lube for you..."
But the spice must flow...
Do you hear that sound, Mr. Anderson ? It's the sound of inevitability.
You mean "Mr. Yats".
He added, dense woods burn for a longer time than pine.
See furniture. GO VLAD!
Meanwhile, Obama called costco to see if they could send a bulk shipment of small propane grill cannisters. Leadership at work.
YOU, definitely did not sing tune that Milli!
Girl, you know it's true.
It's all or nothing now. Just keep on running. Maybe you can blame it on the rain.
You didn't sing that !!!
..."and No more Beluga Caviar for You either." Now You will see Euro elite jump and pay up.
Yellen to funnel funny money to ECB to funnel Euro's to Ukraine banks to funnel them to Russia and back to banks.
Europe warm, Ukraine warm, future US taxpayers freeze.
The tables have turned. First time I was in Russia was in the waning days of the USSR. You could buy tins of Russian buluga caviar from waiters and other folks for $ 5 US (then considered primo hard currency). In the airport stores they were going for 10x that.
When this dollar fiat fraud finally shakes out, look out for the impact on prices in the US for imported goods.
I was there then too! You are 100% correct!
Putin was just trying to be nice.
Europe mistook his kindness for weakness and decided to create a mess in Ukraine.
This will probably go down in the history books as one of the biggest geopolitical misjudgements EVER.
They're about to find out what an angry Russia is capable of.
The ULTIMATE irony will ne when Western scientists and engineers (the smart guys with a useful skillset) start defecting TO Russia, to have jobs and freedoms.
They can keep their other "intellectuals" and army of "Service Providers": lawyers, accountants, PR people, pop-psychologists, hermaphrodites, pedophiles, troglodytes, political advisers and fluffers, bankers...
/ Retired starship captains and officers should still be useful, eh Mr. Chekhov? / [wink]
Don't forget solar panels and wind turbines.
Words, words are all...
http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com/2011/02/14/oil-crisis-in-a-thousand-words/
Who runs Bartertown?
It's a "debt is money" world folks where all that matters is your full "faith and credit".
In other words, no faith means no more credit motherfuckers...
There's a problem though... for whatever reason, Auntie is able to keep a lot of thugs at her disposal.
Well, one thing is for sure. If no one in the world has any faith in you, then you better have the strength (i.e. military might) to acquire what you need by "other" means...
oh wait...
nevermind...
We all know how wars on two fronts work out,let alone maybe four.
Can you spell F U C K E D in Chinese or Russian.
Time to learn.
I suppose, by any rational human being's definition of it, the USA pan-OPTI-conic military is stretched a little "thin".
Interesting, all the new FED three letter agencies need "experienced" goons for hire.
The social engineer's dream outcome is the common man's night-mare.
Neighhhh...
People here following the Cliven Bundy story in Nevada?
Any of you packing heat and going Nevadawards?
Whats up Libertarians?
Sick Simmer WHAT?
Ill winds.
Another time to act, another opportunity lost. Talk of revolution is always muted during showdowns with The Empire.
Bring on the collapse.
Or maybe it's a trap.
Or not.
Read it recently elsewhere...
Something about when goods (trade) stops crossing borders troops do.
Oooo, lots of bad news, that should be good for a couple of thousand points on the dow
S&P to the Blood Red Moon, Alice!
Sorry IR, Alice is in chains...
Merkel in Chains
Merkel in chains....hmmmmm
With one of those bite balls in her mouth?
Release the Hillary!
She was overhead moaning in her sleep: "Phil McCracken, Phil McCracken!". ;-)
Ruh Roh!
Putin got them all by the nuts
No worries, neocon Nuland is on the job.
I am wondering how long it is gonna take those idiots in EU and USSA to understand that talk is not strength. And when deplomacy fails, they will probably over react. Typical stupidity.
A reminder to "pay to play"? Ante up.
Wakeup Euro heads. Join the Anti-Bolshevik Federation, purge the globe of the scurge of the New Bolsheviks, join the human race and send the alien khazars to hell. The world economy will grow infinitely.
Cut it OFF! Russia should reduce that crazy trade surplus.
This is pure bluff for the Russian voters. Has Chavez or Maduro ever stop supplying oil? Big NO! While would Putin do the same and risk lower revenues? This is all pro-russian propaganda and I am surprised how easily it is accepted by the ZH readership....
He is currently negotiating a delivery price with China for gas..so he wants to get a little competition going. He can surely slow it down to Europe.
No, this is econ 101. Supply and demand muthafucka!
Putin has leverage right now and he's using it.
"Has Chavez or Maduro ever stop supplying oil? Big NO!"
That's because Venezuela does not have a captive market, like Russia does; nor other natural resources that Russia does. Venezuela's economy is in shambles, unlike Russia.
Russia is not Venezuela. Those are facts, not propaganda. Don't let the bullshit the media has fed you cloud your view of facts.
LMFAO!!! Russia is not south america moron....
halarious.
"While would Putin do the same and risk lower revenues?"
Since you asked...
The Russians saw this coming a mile away, with Ukraine's ability to actually pay of the energy that they got highly in doubt. Europe, which is pretending that they're going to help bail out Ukraine, is also broke. For a better understanding of why Russia is questioning the economic capabilities of Europe:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5QwKEwo4Bc
Stupid...Russians don't bluff in real.
Banksters need to pay Putin and up my FAFSA or we are going to start sending them bills and have debt collectors call them on their cell phones.. They are debtors. That's what debtors do.
they done fucked with the wrong mother fucker...
"you best protect your neck"
Wu Tang Clan
More talk.
Wake me when GProm turns the tap.
**Never**
Go back to sleep. Your "contributions" are of little value here.
Zzzzzzzzz....
Upvoted, ode to 4' 33"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gN2zcLBr_VM
;-)
You must really like Chinese trinkets & collateral, Putin.
Just pick up your threats and go sell some ice in the north pole.
Good luck with that. Long euro-utilities.
Hey...those aren't trinkets! Those are US backed king Dollar$
I have a baaad feelings about Ukraine and the next 48 hours....Here in Europe we almost had a fist fight between the Russian delegation and other delegates...These things always happen right at the start of weekend (well DUH..), so stay tuned...
Pooteen has examined the field, long n hard. Hell, I'd not be surprised if he did not gain full access to Snowden's files. Anyway, it does not take a genius to figure out his potential adversaries are playing w/ a weak hand, and .... this might even go a long way in further dividing NATO/G7.
As I posted on another thread, the west side of the former Iron Curtain countries - x E Germany - should have formed their own neutral "sub-block", even if with a west bias, just to play it safe, and act as a buffer. I think they could have gained from both sides. OTOH, after having been under russian boots for better part of 45-50 years, they were all eager to bolt, and turn on the former master, just as are many of America's "allays".
Obama & his gang, are not a match for Putin. Obama is a flame thrower, not a problem solver. Destruction is his forte, not, mediation and moderation. The state of this nation will vouch for that.
"Obama & his gang, are not a match for Putin. Obama is a flame thrower, not a problem solver."
This isn't a wrestling match.
Ukraine and Eurupe are on Russia's borders. Russia has actual exportable resources. And, they're tired of the West's continual attempts at destabilizing Russia. Blowback is not a mystery. And, well, this is a shift away from customers who are becoming more and more unable to pay. Business and political reasons. Seems plenty rational.
"Destruction is his forte, not, mediation and moderation. The state of this nation will vouch for that."
What is there to mediate/moderate? That is, what position is there (regardless of who could be sitting in the POTUS chair)?
"As I posted on another thread, the west side of the former Iron Curtain countries - x E Germany - should have formed their own neutral "sub-block", even if with a west bias, just to play it safe, and act as a buffer."
How "safe" can you expect to be when you don't have resources? And they'd export to Europe because Europe is such a strong market?
Yeah, after all all that Russia gets from Europe in exchange for raw materials, gas & oil is services, machinery and transport equipment, chemicals, medecines, agricultural products, and 75% of their foreign investment.
But hey, they invented Tetris, Vodca & Balalaikas, so i guess that evens things out.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmEEwy6devY&list=PLD842A89F3CB766A9
Korobushka, bitch!
I am uncertain if you are looking for an argument, or you just missed the points of my comments?
Who stated so, and how did you arrive at that brilliant conclussion?
Among other things, non-complicance with a contract which Russia signed back in '94, as well as, an invasion of a sovereign nation .... unless you buy into those non-military military who moved into Crimea, in which case, you clearly are confusing this with a WWE - or whatever the hell it is called today - match.
You should do your homework, before attempting to engage in a pissing match. I'd love to spend more time but I must split. Realy do some studying of that area.
lazy fucking socialist europeans waiting for the US to intervene
let them freeze in europe - maybe that will wake these fuckers up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Hey, stop confirming you're a stupid American with this sorta comments. Read before..oh wait..
Wake up so that they can be aware that they're freezing, and then what? Invade Russia to steal energy?
Drug addicts always blame everything/everyone else for the problems their habit gets them in to.
This is the future, Seer.
Imagine a future where you pay those billions in arrears and the gas still doesn't flow.
You demand the oil or gas flow. Russia says . . . we're saving it for our grandchildren.
No one else has any to spare.
Then what?
Like I said, addiction is the problem of the "individual." No one put a gun to the heads of the Ukrainians and told them they had to use/buy NG.
Pretty certain that we'll hear the story line that the benvolent West has been looking to create alternate gas flows for this very reason of Russia holding other countries hostage. Never mind that the West (US) has esssentially been provoking it all along by way of trying to destabilize Russia.
It's all one big cluster-fuck. And it's not going to get better.
The Germans will make high-quality widgets for the rich in Russia and China in exchange for energy. Rest of Europe will freeze. And none of this has anything to do with my personal preference.
which is why lng export to europe will become a profitable venture
Methinks what used to be backroom negotiations are now carried out via the screaming headliners of th ecountry-wise owned and pwned MSM.
CNN/NYT Vs. Pravda/RT Vs. MURDER ROCK inc......
ori
http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com/2010/09/21/meet-the-press/
Nah! Negotiations are kept simple through Twatter NewSpeak now.
Always been that way.
No probs! US Asst Sec of State extraordinaire Victoria Nuland (nee Nudleman) Kagan on her way to hike up her skirt to blow all the butt methane the EU needs!
Anyone remember a 3 Billion Aid package by the US that was suppose to go to Ukraine so that Ukriane could pay off Russia for past due payment for Natural Gas?
Yeah well, the fuckin bill is due today.
And I seem to remember the House stopped the Aid package with Rand Paul coming out saying exactly that.
Ukraine is in collections now...pay of have yor shit turned off. He was nice enough to wait until after winter.
Rand Paul is a smug twat. That is all.
He's in the senate....They're all smug twats....what's your point?
My point is that the only thing Rand has in common with his father is their last name. I've seen his name thrown about on ZH as a possibility for Prez in 2016. He would get most if not all of all the independent vote by riding on his father's coattails, but he would be more of the same. If not worse, he takes arrogance and smugness to a whole new level. It's all very calculated, don't think this fact is lost on Republican party "leadership".
More importantly, he has a punchable face.
But the "point" has absolutely NO point with regards to Rand seeking to block the money. Message. Messenger. (and fine for you if you wish to punch him in the face- I cannot argue there)
My "point" did have a little to do with blocking the money, Rand does the party's bidding because he has designs on the White House.
Sorry if my opinion of that entitled douche offends you.
I'm of the opinion that cleaning house is in order....that would include Rand, but I have more respect for him in the senate than just about every other douche in there.
That being said the US's duplicitous "AID" package was nothing but a payoff to Russia. Had that gone through Ukraine would have paid its debt and this stupid financial war could go one for a few more years for all we know.
I dig Nigel Tufkin btw.
My rant about Rand was somewhat off-topic, just wanted to point out that he is yet another stooge trying to keep in his party's good graces for a shot at the big prize. The Republican decision to block the package is all about politics and undermining Obama to make him look weak(er). Just another example of gridlock and disconnect from the reality of anything beyond the Beltway circle jerk.
The ignorant children of Congress will still be arguing about parliamentary procedure as the mushroom clouds appear outside their window. That's the only sure way to clean house.
Are you down-arrowing me? Should I look to do the same? (That is rather punkish, no?)
I didn't downvote you.
You're right that my extreme dislike of Rand Paul didn't have much to do with the original post, I just get nauseous whenever I hear his name and had to get it out.
What's the problem with his approach? He's pumping nat gas but not getting paid! Shut it off, you maintain your reserves and aren't giving them away for FREE and as it is with gas stations, SEE the cashier before you can PUMP...Putin is no chump unlike our Barry and Putin's babes don't look like a Wookie....
Maybe I will add a few Ukrainians to my Greek order....
Yup, here it comes, ... EU, meet cliff and abyss.
Now, who runs barter town?
i'm not so sure of the bluff, because if he does turn it off, they will pay pretty fast, and then it flows again. what other option does euro(germnay) have? unless this escalates into a hot conflict by none other than mercenaries doing the work of their employer...
There is no other option. The bitch in Germany looking towards the West and asks "now what?"...Than they say women are bad drivers.
I think Germany is tired of the headaches from the EU and US, I would look for German and Russian pragmatism to find common ground very soon. They would be a premium addition to the BRICS.
I also think that the US dragging their heels on repatriating German gold was a desperation move to keep Germany under the US thumb. Germany has to know by now that they will never get it back if the US even has it.
Germany is literally fighting for their survival but their oppressor is the US, not Russia.
+ 1000 for 813kml. WOW !!! I am so glad that you are here ! I agree with you totally ! Keep it coming ! Germany put is's trust in the U.S.A. and again it got shafted -
There are lots of reasons why Germany it's pissed off at the U.S. ( NSA spying, Gold repatriation delays, etc.).
Germany is waiting for exactly the right moment to tell the U.S. to fuck off.
I can't wait for when that happens!
Thanks for the love, eurogold.
And good point about the NSA, getting caught spying on your allies is the death knell of trust. Americans living under their propaganda biodome have no idea how disgusted US allies are about the NSA. I think that was the final straw for Germany, and the US stirring up Ukraine is the final final straw.
Germany's gas supply doesn't transit Ukraine. They aren't affected by all this.
"They aren't affected by all this."
Well, it IS a global market. And, Germany ought to be concerned with a ramped up number of cold, starving masses around its borders (as it does business with the country that turned off the gas to those cold and starving masses).
Russian Gas to Germany does transit through shit-hole, extortionist Ukraine, that's the issue here.
So now the poor Ukranians can recycle all that pipe...there is some cash there somewhere..long LNG tankers and small LP tanks
Two possibilities to keep the gas flowing.
1. EU literally invades and takes over Ukr to 'police' the flows.
2. Russia does the same.
If Russia does the takeover then all Ukr debts are null and void.
I know which one the IMF wants....what will happen today ?
Long-term Europe is moot. Russia is shifting markets, as well they should.
Natural resources are scarce. Stupid to drain your country's resources so that they can be frittered away on the cheap, by people who work to destabilize your country.
Diet rich in sauerkraut should go a long way in helping. Joymans are ingenious in exceptional engineers & problem solvers.
Ha-Ha. So, Putin is proposing that Europe/IMF send in truckloads of money to Ukraine to pay off its debts to Russia, else it only gets more gas via pre-payment, but also sends in people to manage the flow of gas thru Ukraine intended for Europe in case Ukraine pilfers it on its way thru their country (which of course it would do).
That ought to hit the EU & IMF right where it hurts: in the printing press.
Hey why not just print up a few trillion Euros and hand them to Putin? Oh....he's not buying that central bankster stock pumping bullshit?
Uh oh,
In this case I think Putin may demand GOLD as payment. heh. there it is.
Would you gold wackos PLEASE stop corrupting adult threads?
Gold has no function in Russian society. Russia isn't EVER going to decide that all future oil or gas transaction be for gold because there's no point to it.
Now, they MAY do deals for food. Or semi slave labor shipped to Moscow from Paris to do toilet cleaning and general maid service.
See? Food has purpose. Labor has purpose. That's what you ask for instead of Euros.
Here we go Europe sells the Ukraine to Russia for $100 billion, land deal of the century.
Gold is the preferred method of pre-payment!
it sure as hell won't be USD. Will NG be the 1st commodity to be officially priced in yuan or even: Euro, USD and Yuan?! After all, EU was formed to counter US' (former) strength.
From the looks of things, Globalization is turning out to have far different effects than those counted on ... at least openly and by some. The major proponent, forgot that while the US is a young country, all others have deeeeeep nationalistic roots, which are now surfacing, more than ever. Throw in religion, over-population, shortages, etc etc and you have one explosive mix.
The US could not have been in any worse of a leadership position .... as well as financal and economic.
"We dont need no stinking gas, you are a fucking dictatorship! GTFO of Crimera!" ... 3 weeks later ... "Sirs, here is your money. Nice doing business with you. Tell Mr. Putin we didnt mean it".
I think most in here oversee the burning factor: Russia never said they wanted those payments in dollars, remind you. There's a bigger plan behind this move. The chess guy is moving his Bishop and he's going for the heart. Cool down now Vlad, we see you.
Germany and Russia should form an axis, game over !
This must bring Angela back to her days with the Stazi!
Echhhh....echhhh...echhhh...
"what's that noise"
" I don't know but it's getting cold in here"
" turn on the heat"
"..... It's on"
Knock-knock, someone at the door....
"I give you one log for, heat, I take you wife for my heat.
It's called "the smart meter"
So it seems that Silk Road into Duisburg idea is less of an offer, more of a demand. Europe will turn pro-Russia and the US in opposition will fall. Necessity will win out. Can't see it happening any other way really.
That would be the logical course of events, and the US will fight it all the way. The question is whether that fight will be fought with dollars or bullets.
"Americans can always be counted on to do the right thing…after they have exhausted all other possibilities." -- Churchill
10 out of 10 for quoting Churchill.
If it comes down to fighting with dollars or bullets, I predict they'll throw sackfulls of dollars.
the eu now has the upper hand in the ttip negotiations
kiev is israel now.
the germans gave 5 nuke subs to israel as a gift as tribute.
putin must give the nazi kiev jew yats tribute with free gas.
israel demands it so it must be so.
everything must come to the jewish folks cheap or free.
the debt must be repaid remember
you stood by and let the hollow cause happen.
you are all guilty and you must all pay compensation
pay for the crimes against the jew
pay into saturn pay forever into demonic masonic infinity
Tony, it's just the Jewish history in Europe, in the midst of repeating itself right in front of your eyes...we go waaaay back, like medieval way back. They "rent" a place for a while, and move on when they screw up the joint and their lease contract is revoked...
Tony Wilson, you are such an anti-semite troll.
By the way,the 5 subs are not "nuke" powered, were not "given" to Israel.
check the facts before continuing to discredit yourself.
eurogold
subs are nuked up you fool
nuked missiles upped
4 subs now i believe as syria sunk one that is why they got low yield nuked from a sub funny enough
i am semite
and yet i am anti semite
i am simply anti evil
anti saturn
anti cern
anti zion
i have no credit to discredit you fucking dolt : )
Read your own comment you douchebag !
If Israel wants to arm the the subs with nukes, then that is their business and not what you wrote,
you douchebag !
Did Israel pay for the subs? If so, where did that money come from? (US "aid?")
The building of ( in Germany ) and financing was a German Government deal involving the full payment by Israel
for ( I think 2 ) and partial payment for the others, another 2 or 3.
Who cares who pays for them? Does the U.S. pay or do they print for everything ?
The subs are of the quietest most modern generation ( fuelcell powered ) They could be up your ass and you wouldn't know it.
If Vladdy keeps this up he will be odds on favorite to win the Nobel Peace Prize for Economics!
In the middle of winter what would you prefer to have ? A fist full of Euro's or US$s, or a bountiful supply of nat gas at a reasonable price. Irony is that
Western nations are willing to print for Banksters, Polititians and Empire Preservation, but reluctant to print for Russian nat gas. In essence, Russia is demanding equal rights and access to Fiat currency in exchange for energy-----which they will succeed in obtaining.
'Jumpin' Vlad Flash is a gaz, gaz, gaz'
Well, Obama can just back up the tankers to all of those LNG plants we have. We will have gas to Europe in no time.
Wait, what? No plants? No way to get gas to Europe?
Can we fly it, I mean, its fucking gas, right?
Oh, look over there...there's a rancher with a gun. EVERYONE look at them!
And look, more people want to sign up for Health Care!
Everything thing is easy peasy lemon squeezy.