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One Killed, Many Wounded After Shooting Breaks Out Between Ukraine Special Forces And Pro-Russia Separatists

Tyler Durden's picture




 

"Ball is in Kiev's court." That is how we concluded our article yesterday reporting that Moscow won't accept force against demonstrators after Kiev warned it would use special forces to quell ongoing "terrorist" uprisings across cities in east Ukraine.

Predictably, Ukraine couldn't wait to shoot the ball right back at Russia and re-escalate (in hope that the west will finally stand up and side along the acting government in what continues to be a very foolish gambit) and early this morning local time, units of the Ukraine special forces started an anti-terrorist operation in eastern town of Slavyansk, where police station was seized yesterday by separatist protesters, as reported by the Interior Minister Arsen Avakov posts on Facebook, who also warned local residents to stay inside, saying separatist protesters have opened fire in direction of approaching special police units.

Moments later the operation turned deadly after at least one member of the special forces was killed and as many as 9 wounded, as well as an unknown number of casualties on the "separatist" side. But most importantly, Russia now has a pretext to step in and "defend" its ethnic population just as it warned it would do.

WSJ reports:

A Ukrainian special forces officer was killed and five others wounded Sunday in a gunbattle with heavily armed pro-Russian forces who had commandeered a police station in the eastern city of Slavyansk, Ukraine's top police official said.

 

The firefight erupted early Sunday as Ukrainian forces moved to clear the building where approximately 20 men dressed in camouflage had seized control the day before. Interior Minister Arsen Avakov said an unspecified number of the pro-Russian activists had been wounded in the exchange.

This wasn't the only casualty as other firefights broke out in close proximity to the first one.

In addition to the dead and wounded at the police station, Russia's Interfax news agency reported one person was killed and four others wounded in a gunfight at a checkpoint along the road leading from Slavyansk to the regional capital of Donetsk. The Slavyansk operation, dubbed an "antiterrorist action," involved Ukraine's state security service and military and police units from across the country, Mr. Avakov said. "May God be with them," Mr. Avakov wrote on his Facebook page early Sunday, announcing the operation had begun.

 

A short time later, he said that the men holed up inside the building had begun firing at the Ukrainian forces and urged residents in the center of the eastern Ukrainian city to remain indoors and away from their windows.

 

Residents reported seeing armored personnel carriers approaching the city and helicopters flying overhead. Russian television station Rossiya 24 reported that tires that had been used as a barricade in front of the building had been set on fire and black smoke could be seen above the city center.

 

The clash comes after pro-Russia protests spread Saturday in eastern Ukraine, with armed men, some in unmarked, military-style uniforms, moved to commandeer more government buildings.

So now that Ukraine has had its official warning by Lavrov, which it openly ignored, and commenced a crack down on the separatist forces, who may well have been camouflaged Russian army units just like in the Crimea scenario, Kremlin now sees itself fully in its right to cross the border and "defend" people in the east. To be sure, NATO and the west will hardly share Russia's interpretation of events which only means that the situation will further escalate some more.

And if not in Slavyansk, there are more than enough other cities that allow both sides to escalate into lethal gunfights. Reuters reports:

Separatist protesters on Sunday seized control of the mayor's office in the town of Mariupol, eastern Ukraine, on the Azov Sea, local media said.

 

The protesters entered the building following a rally involving about 1,000 people demonstrating in favor of the creation of a separate republic in eastern Ukraine, a local journalist for the newspaper Priazovsky Worker said.

 

Police did not try to stop them. They entered the offices, took down the Ukrainian flag and were erecting barricades outside the building, the journalist said.

A photo from Mariupol:

As we said earlier, if this is merely a gambit by Kiev to provoke western nations into action, it will likely fail. Poland PM Tusk explained why earlier when speaking on Polish radio Zet on events in the Ukraine, when he said that he’s “concerned” there is “relatively little will” in EU, other countries to “strongly support Ukraine. Nobody accepts Crimea annexation, but nobody wants to head for sharp conflict. Which also means Poland itself is isolated in a potential expansion next: Tusk said it’s important Russia doesn’t threaten Poland’s security "we need to know how to mobilize international community." Hopefully it will have more success than Ukraine.

Sure enough, the best the west can mobilize was and continues to be nothing more than harsh language.

Something Putin knows too well and continues to capitalize on.

 

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Sun, 04/13/2014 - 08:40 | 4653582 ApollyonDestroy
ApollyonDestroy's picture

Time to roll that gear across the border! This should accelerate the market fall this week. Finnaallyyy

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 08:52 | 4653598 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

I suspect Putin will not invade or escalate since incorporating South West Ukraine into Russia would be a huge burden on its economy.  Better to let the US and EU digest this shit sandwich, bail out and restructure the local economies, and then swoop in.

Having said this, Putin is a nationalist and truly cares about Russia, and Russians.  He just may be willing to take on the burden for the sake of the collective Russian peoples.

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:01 | 4653627 Arius
Arius's picture

The Facebook War!

 

obviously intended for international audiences ...

dorothy we are not in kansas anymore ...

WHAT's NEXT?  we will see ... but obviously the World is the target

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:15 | 4653670 SilverIsKing
SilverIsKing's picture

Obama and Kerry hold Putin's kryptonite in their respective pockets.

It was reported that the White House recently ordered a Sharpie two pack thick point and guess the color...yup...RED.

So Putin better watch out. If Obama or Kerry reaches for the marker, when the cap comes off, it's game over.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:27 | 4653700 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

A ukrainian acquaintances said something very interesting about the difference between Putin and Obama.

To him, Putin is a russian nationalist, who unequivocally loves Russia.  Obama, on the other hand, does not feel a similar love for the US. 

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:43 | 4653729 EINSILVERGUY
EINSILVERGUY's picture

Thats because Obama is not an American.  I don't mean he wasn't born in the United States but that he does not identify as an American.  He understands America as well as he he understands the "African American" experience. He is a foreign raised half white man child who embraced the marxism of his philandering communist drunkard of a father and reinforced by his marxist mother and grandparents.

Obama used every opportunity to learn his radicalism at the feet of Frank Marshall Davis and honed his Saul Alinksy tactics while working as a "community organizer" lawyer for Acorn.

Obama is closer in mind to the old Soviet russians than Putin is. Obama is a marxist who governs as a Fascist

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:58 | 4653760 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

Looks like the Ukrainian's do have a set of balls after all!  Good for them, fvck russia....even if they do get their asses kicked, at least the stood for something besides communism.

fvck all communists and those that support them...

I sure wish we had a real president in the oval...bathhouse barry, is the 5th column!

I don't care where he was freaking born (Kenya/Hawaii??), his mother renounced her (and his) citizenship to move to Indonesia, to marry the Sotero fella...he could not have attended a madras if he was not Indonesian.  So no, bathhouse barry is something of an inigma, why do you think he spends millions to hide his college records.  It would show he applied to those schools as a foreign national...pure and simple.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:06 | 4653795 MeMadMax
MeMadMax's picture

You don't have to censor yourself here... fvckin dumbass....

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:14 | 4653817 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

lol, ok fvck you, how's that...

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:42 | 4653887 Bindar Dundat
Bindar Dundat's picture

Putin and Obama have a lot in common --  they both love Mother Russia! 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:53 | 4653898 Manthong
Manthong's picture


Is it my imagination, or are most threating looking/armed and/or masked Ukrainians members of the >42 inch belt club?

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:56 | 4653912 Looney
Looney's picture

The next Red Line will be drawn with Wookie’s bloody tampon. ;-)

Looney

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:33 | 4654001 Keyser
Keyser's picture

False Flag tactical nuke strike in Ukraine in 5....4....3....

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:39 | 4654014 johngaltfla
johngaltfla's picture
WAR! Ukraine claims Russian Invasion has Started

 

This isn't going to end well for the US....

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 12:45 | 4654149 Manthong
Manthong's picture

Geez.. I gotta’ change the furniture on the WASR.

When fat Ukrainians have better looking pieces than me, I’ve got to get in fashion.   


..but OMG what don’t these bozos know about mixing camo with white tape on magazines ???????

 That is a fashion no-no.

 

BTW.. I think I understand the green tape on the forearms (although still dangerous) but I can't figure out the wisdom of the flourescent orange or white gloves.

From my perspective the optics are good.. maybe not so much from theirs.

 

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 12:52 | 4654187 johngaltfla
johngaltfla's picture

Care to wager if Russia's "red line" will result in action? I'll bet we see Russian armor in the Ukraine by dawn tomorrow....

 

04.13 1215 Ukraine Update: Ukrainian Military to Counterattack against Pro-Russian Forces
Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:06 | 4654222 JimmyCDN
JimmyCDN's picture

Was wondering what the green tape on the forearms was for myself?  What do you think?

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:35 | 4654276 Thanatos
Thanatos's picture

The Green and Yellow tape around the wrists are expedient identification "badges". Likely to identify either Status (i.e. Militia, Former Police, Merc, Specwar Operator [Spetsnaz], etc), Area of responsibility or something along those lines.

You get a lot of civvies wandering in and out and need to identify quickly who is who if shooting starts.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:51 | 4654317 Manthong
Manthong's picture

hmm..  anybody want to help fund an Android app that marries 512 kbit encryption, Wi-Fi, and the camera for IFF?

maybe even a pulsed IR for S&G's?

we can even add Bluetooth and NFC for the last minute decision process.

side benefit: we can keep the iPod recognition app proprietary and charge a premium for those who do not want to be flagged in the battlescape. 

 

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:54 | 4654350 Thanatos
Thanatos's picture

MK1 Eyeball is hard to beat once things get busy.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 14:07 | 4654380 Manthong
Manthong's picture

I am not so sure..

a set of goog glasses with an overlay could come in handy.

.. at least for flagging friendlies.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:58 | 4654351 Thanatos
Thanatos's picture

Anybody notice Interpetermag.com is offline? Cyber-warfare victim?

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 14:08 | 4654384 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

.

mixing camo with white tape on magazines

And before Easter at that!

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 12:16 | 4654117 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Is it important to you?

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:48 | 4654196 Manthong
Manthong's picture

not really, but I am notappreciative of excessive size or mass except from a holdover or MOA perspective.    

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:49 | 4653900 Invinciblehandaxe
Invinciblehandaxe's picture

@Abi Normal you retard dont understand the fact that there is more capitalism in russia then in the ufsa??

heck even the fucking EU is the prototype of socialism

i wish the russian tanks liberated us from the EUSSR as well

oooh and fuck you dumb moron

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:04 | 4653939 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

If you could just put a point across you would be dangerous eh, invincible?  Your incoherent ramblings show your ignorance.  More captialism in Russia, LOL, there is no capitalism ANYWHERE dumb ass.  fvcking morons, all you stupid assholes can do is hit the green or red arrow and spew ignorance, go fvck yourselves, you know NOTHING, but what you are told to believe.  You believe everything you read and hear, but trouble is you have been disinformed...only a handful here get it, the rest of you bobble heads have no fvcking clue what is going on, nor of the history of the world, and you certainly have no idea about current events. 

Keep the bags over your heads, cause where you are going, will not be pretty...sleep on little sheeple, to the slaughter you go now!

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:31 | 4653998 Ifigenia
Ifigenia's picture

how about some Nulland cookies?

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 15:57 | 4654681 silvermail
silvermail's picture

Imagine the U.S. response if Lavrov arrived in Donetsk now and started handing out cookies in the town square!
Russia correctly was perceived U.S. actions in Kiev - it was an open political rudeness.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:32 | 4654000 nightshiftsucks
nightshiftsucks's picture

Yeah Abi there are a lot of people on this board who love Russian cock,don't worry about them just them them suck it.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 12:04 | 4654080 bigkahuna
bigkahuna's picture

There are also a bunch of trolls who have recently increased their ad hominem bs and agressive rhetoric. They need to be ignored.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:42 | 4654016 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

Aw, either someone is butthurt about Russia or they are butthurt about Obama being a fraud. I doubt it is Obama fanboys.

Putin didn't become the richest man in Europe without killing people.  Do you really think he isn't interested in being the richest man alive?  How many people do you think he is willing to kill to attain that lofty perch?  If you put that much faith in a tyrant you are a fool. 

Just where did these "protesters" get those SBRs?  How come the protesters on the Maidan weren't similarly armed?  If you think about questions like that you cannot simply buy the Russian side of the story whole any more than you can the US version.

Russia still has propaganda and disinformation agents working throughout Europe and America.  One of them talks to the White House press corps every day.  Even if extremely detestable, the Obama administration (and more) has been one of the most amazing foreign intelligence operations ever run.  You think I'm lying or wrong?  Cui Bono? 

First consider Obama's background (above).  Next consider how he has presided over the destruction of the middle class, realignment of US Mil to personal loyalty, wealth and asset exportation (to where?), allowing vast amounts of secret intel to be stolen by Wikileaks, Snowden, Russians, and Chinese.  Finally consider the repeated bellicosity and resulting humiliation of this country on the world stage.  How on earth can you believe that the man who said he would have more flexibility after his election to a Russian President is not a puppet for the east?  Everything he has done has weaked this country and given space to Russia and China.  Who actually believes that the leadership in those countries isn't in on the gag?  

Ukraine, as in east versus west, is just a show.  They are all on the same team (tyranny).  They may fight each other to determine who gets to be the supreme leader but it won't benefit us the people regardless of who wins.  They are all bad guys and will do God awful things to us.

Please stop cheering for Team Satan against Team Lucifer.  Wake up.

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 12:23 | 4654133 Manthong
Manthong's picture

Beelzebub or Mephistopheles ??

CNBC or RT ??

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 12:28 | 4654148 moneybots
moneybots's picture

First consider Obama's background (above).  Next consider how he has presided over the destruction of the middle class, realignment of US Mil to personal loyalty, wealth and asset exportation (to where?), allowing vast amounts of secret intel to be stolen by Wikileaks, Snowden, Russians, and Chinese."

 

What is this "allowed"?  A plane thought to be carrying Snowden was forced to land, humilliating the leader on the plane.

Obama has presided over the destruction of the middle class.  So did the President before him.  It is a long ongoing trend.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 12:51 | 4654185 Citizen_x
Citizen_x's picture

Putin the richest man in Europe

When does his miniature giraffes start their world tour.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkB9OT2XVvA

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:18 | 4654254 Abitdodgie
Abitdodgie's picture

To be the CEO of the "UNITED STATES" the corporation sole you have to be related to the royal family and that he is , and so were all the other presidents ,sorry CEO it does not matter where you were born .

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:02 | 4653770 duo
duo's picture

Oh well

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:06 | 4653793 new game
new game's picture

 is a guy on a rope an easy target?

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:16 | 4653824 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Obama is not an 'american'.

One could wonder what the negro could do to be accept of one of theirs 'american'.

Obama is your typical 'american' president. He is an 'american' through and through. No matter the place he is born, by the way.

Being born in the US does not make you a proponent of 'americanism' automatically.

As to undestanding the african american experience, he does not care about that.

He was elected to serve the 'american' middle class that is by far predominantly composed with indo europeans.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:37 | 4653868 angel_of_joy
angel_of_joy's picture

Problem is, he is a moron too.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:38 | 4654013 Keyser
Keyser's picture

Sweet Jebus on a cracker. Where do you get this stuff? I mean the stuff you're smoking BTW. 

Barry Soetoro understands as much about "black america" as Oprah knows about being poor white trash in Mississppi. 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 14:41 | 4654467 crazzziecanuck
crazzziecanuck's picture

Oprah grew up poor and went to public school, Obama grew up in Hawaii with his grandparents who were bankers and went to an exclusive school and went to Columbia and Harvard.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:43 | 4654019 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

Jay Carney, is that you?

Why isn't he serving the middle class which has been dying harder and faster every day of his Presidency?

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 14:21 | 4654412 quasimodo
quasimodo's picture

Winner of quite possibly the dumbest fucking post of the month club.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:17 | 4653968 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

I don't think Obama is more Soviet than Putin.  Putin seems more intelligent.  Putin seems wiser from experience.  Putin has the advantage of not having to really deal with domestic pressures.  For the part of benevolent stongman, Putin is much better suited and Russia is much more compliant. 

But the gap has been closing until the Feds tried to take on the Bundi range in Nevada.  I thought that maybe they actually intended to go after the Bunny Ranch in Nevada but then realized the Secret Service was not involved.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 14:21 | 4654402 matrix2012
matrix2012's picture

Read about the Obama’s Pedigree at VT...who's his mother, grandmother, step father indeed, who were their paymasters...

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:17 | 4653823 yogibear
yogibear's picture

Obama is a globalist.

The meddling by the US is digging itself further in being irrelevant. 

It's as though Obama was brought in to destroy whatever nationalism the US had left. 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:18 | 4653828 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

'Americanism' by design has global goals.

If Obama was not a globalist, he could not be an 'american'.

Since 'americans' hijacked humanity through their 'american' natural rights theory, it cant be otherwise.

'Americanism' goes everywhere human beings are.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:42 | 4653882 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

ya we hijacked humanity alright, you moron, with liberty and freedon, then the fabian socialists took over about 100 years ago, and have been stripping that freedom daily...we are no longer America, we are now Amerika (USSA)...

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:44 | 4654021 Keyser
Keyser's picture

The truth is that the globalists have hijacked the US and the EU. Only now are a few awakening to this fact and it is all but too late to reverse course as they have seized control of all aspects of western society via the invisible hand. Everything from the monetary system to military, medical to social welfare, education to media, all at our expense. The matrix isn't that far from the truth in a metaphorical way. 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:55 | 4654058 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Liberty and freedom are the opposite of government.

The US was founded as ant colony lite.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:48 | 4654037 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

I bet you learned that in college.  More proof of the intentional misundereducation of America if so.

What, pray tell, exactly is wrong with natural rights?  If you don't believe if it then you really should recognize that you do not have the right to say anything critical of it.  If you do believe in natural rights then you do have the right to criticize, even if you find no need.  Do you understand the irony?  No, didn't think so.  I'll try again.

Without natural rights (which you apparently don't believe in) you do not have the right to criticize anything.  Your betters will tell you what is right and wrong and how to live and die. 

Without natural rights you have no betters.  It can be hard to think for yourself but with natural rights that is your responsibility.  You should try it sometime.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:22 | 4654261 americanspirit
americanspirit's picture

Obama's storm troopers are far too busy at the Bundy Ranch to care about the Ukraine

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:57 | 4653773 Mine Is Bigger
Mine Is Bigger's picture

I am having difficulty believing any defense official is stupid enough to send a handful of soldiers, special force or not, to retake a fairy large building seized by hundreds of armed people.  Are there actual photos of wounded and dead soldiers?  Until I see them, I call a bullshit on this news.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:08 | 4653799 MeMadMax
MeMadMax's picture

That's because he knew they had no chance of winning... That's not the point...

 

The point is to drag in NATO and Barry into a real shooting war...

 

Wether it works or not is anyone's guess...

 

Doubt it, because barry is a pussy...

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:48 | 4654034 Keyser
Keyser's picture

Wag the Dog... It's all kabuki theater. 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 12:51 | 4654182 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"The point is to drag in NATO and Barry into a real shooting war...

 

Wether it works or not is anyone's guess...

 

Doubt it, because barry is a pussy..."

 

Last time i checked, Ukraine was not part of the U.S., nor was it part of NATO.  I also haven't particularly heard any common Americans clamoring to send American troops to Ukraine.

When Roosevelt ran in 1940, he said he would not get involved in Europe's war, as Americans had no interest in Hitler's war in 1940.

 

 

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:40 | 4653877 Son of Loki
Son of Loki's picture

I'm gonna guess GS will label this very Bullish for Wall Street.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:23 | 4653979 HardAssets
HardAssets's picture

"In war, truth is the first casualty." - Aeschylus - Greek - (525 BC - 456 BC)

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:04 | 4653650 sessinpo
sessinpo's picture

Latina Lover      I suspect Putin will not invade or escalate since incorporating South West Ukraine into Russia would be a huge burden on its economy.

---

How many empires in the past invaded areas that were actual burdens into their economy. Answer. ALL OF THEM.

Learn history.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:07 | 4653660 ApollyonDestroy
ApollyonDestroy's picture

Exactly. Not to mention securing the transit of his gas export

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:10 | 4653663 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

Friendly relations are better than armed occupation.  Notice that Russia never invaded the Ukraine to reclaim pipelines,despite many past provocations by the Ukraine government.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:46 | 4653893 Bindar Dundat
Bindar Dundat's picture

They will get the entire country back within six months and this is NOT a bridge to far. 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:50 | 4653901 813kml
813kml's picture

These are much different circumstances, the US is trying to inch ever closer to Russia's doorstep.  Also, you mentioned in other posts that eastern Ukraine would be a burden on Russia's economy.  How so?  It could be a boon since Russia might actually get paid for their natgas.

It should be done even if it were a huge burden, Russia needs a buffer zone.  It would not be an armed occupation, this isn't Iraq we're talking about.  The vast majority of eastern Ukraine is Russian and wants protection by the motherland.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:54 | 4654055 Keyser
Keyser's picture

To put things into perspective, what would the US do if Russia instigated a coup in Mexico, then flooded the Mexico / US border with subversives? I'm pretty sure the SWHTF long before now. Vlad holds all the cards and he knows it. He doesn't have to do anything except tighten the noose on the EU and tell John Kerry to fuck off. Russia's alliances with the BRICS and the fact the the US is in the shitter only strengthens his position.  The worry is a US false flag op in the region which will justify NATO troops. The US is going to drag the EU into this whether they like it or not. 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 12:07 | 4654095 813kml
813kml's picture

I think a false flag is a guarantee, Putin should secure the areas to keep that from happening.  If NATO is smart they will be sitting this one out or else it will be a very cold winter.  I think Germany in particular is tired of EU and US bullshit, look for them to help restore some sanity to the situation.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:42 | 4653725 EuropeanBankster
EuropeanBankster's picture

Putins strategy is to secure the areas Kharkiv-Dnipro-Odesa in order to control the sounthern pipelines (supply to romania, bulgaria and turkey).. the northern pipelines supplies western europe, and that would take a full-blown invasion which is not gonna happen now.

..a bonus is also securing the whole black-sea coastline.

Matter of days rather than weeks before the heavy war-machinery starts rolling across the border

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:45 | 4653734 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

This is a valid viewpoint. We will soon find out how audacious Putin really is.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:09 | 4653806 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

For those who are interested in a quickie, slightly western biased article that nicely lays out the geopolitical game played between Russia and US, check out the following link.

 

http://www.dailypfennig.com/2014/04/13/making-sense-crimean-conflict/

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:31 | 4653999 HardAssets
HardAssets's picture

@Latina Lover - thanks for the link.  Its a decent article, seems to have been written by a banker. It doesn't go deep enough into the neo-con angle and their positioning in the region militarily in order to surround Russia. F. William Endahl writes on both the energy and geo strategic aspects of the Ukraine issue. His interviews and articles can be found on the web.  Regards - - -

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:34 | 4654294 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

Correct. For those who wish to develop a deeper understanding, Engdahl does an excellent job of laying out the geopolitics and pipeline battles. He also has many good interviews via RT.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:10 | 4653807 BigJim
BigJim's picture

I suspect Russia will just support the separatists until they get their way and become independent, and then use them as proxies/clients to secure their pipelines.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:29 | 4653854 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

EB, I realize you may not be able to "confirm or deny", but if you're from Brussels, welcome back.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:32 | 4653859 Snidley Whipsnae
Snidley Whipsnae's picture

ApollyonDestroy... "securing the transit of Russian gas export"... yes

But, Putin has also stated that he would not stand by while ethnic Russians in the Ukraine were physically attacked. 

Which comes first... chicken or egg?

In addition Lavarov said that any attacks by the Kiev faction might hamper or cancel 4 party talks on Ukraine.

Check.

Did the group in charge in Kiev learn nothing from the recent mistakes of Geogia?

Exactly what were those naieve folks in charge in Kiev promised if they attacked ethnic Russians in Eastern Ukraine? ... Same as Sakishvelli (sp?) in Georgia was promised? Same as Suddam was promised?

One thing we know for sure; Putin does not want China as his only customer for gas/oil... and he is meeting in China to negotiate gas price exports to China very soon. If Putin loses Western Europe as a gas/oil customer, even for a short time, this could have a big impact on gas price negotiations with China. This a very unlikely scenario imo. 

Putin still holding a very good hand even if he invades Eastern Ukraine or all of it.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:53 | 4654049 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

Why would he have to do that?  His gas export is secure.  Ukraine's bills will get paid or Europe will get cold.  He has all the leverage in the status quo. 

Perhaps he really wants the frack fields and farmlands of eastern Europe.  Is Russia still a net importer of food or are they self sufficient now (I really don't know about now but they used to be an importer)?

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:08 | 4653661 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

I agree, and so would Putin. 

 

In a past speech, Putin was mis reported by the western media as saying that the fall of the USSR was a tragedy.  What he really said was that if you did not regret the fall of the USSR, you do not have a heart. But, if you wish to restore the USSR, you do not have a brain.

Better for Putin to have friendly neutral neighbors trading between each other than to try and control  sullen subjugated populations.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:28 | 4653705 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Have a source link please ?

I've been reading a lot of Putin's speeches, but all I can find on this speech is neocon

translations.A bit like the supposed"wipe Israel off the map" was really

the"the regime in Jerusalem will fade from the pages of history" type of propaganda.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:49 | 4653743 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

 

 

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/v/vladimir_putin.html

 

The original quote is in russian, and I do not remember the link. 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:46 | 4654024 HardAssets
HardAssets's picture

I haven't been able to find the original source.

Here's an interesting article on Putin from 7 years ago:

 

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2007/dec/23/russia.tomparfitt

 

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:34 | 4653862 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

That line is a variation on an old one: 

"If you're not a communist in your youth, you have no heart.  If you are still a communist as an adult, you have no brain".

Which probably was a variation on the Churchill quote: “If you're not a liberal at twenty you have no heart, if you're not a conservative at forty you have no brain.”

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:08 | 4653942 813kml
813kml's picture

Putin is not trying to restore the USSR, he is trying to keep shitbag Americans away from his doorstep.

Your posts in this thread have been all over map, the only certainty is that you do not have a brain.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:45 | 4654023 HardlyZero
HardlyZero's picture

and...by owning the distribution points Russia will not have to deal with skimming and middle-man costs.  EU will probably get cheaper and more reliable energy from Russia.   On the other hand, this hands Russia more political power and control.

But, overall it is probably more stable arrangement to have Russia manage the energy/cash flow and zero out all Ukraine debts.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:20 | 4653685 OceanX
OceanX's picture

Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't Russia divest itself from the Ukraine alreaedy?  My understanding is, that Russia kicked the Ukraine out (broke up) the Soviet Union...

From my perspective, it appears it is the West that is persuing an imperialistic, expansionist agenda.  Doesn't Chevron have gas contract with the Ukraine?

Honestly, I really don't know what is going on ...does anyone?

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:43 | 4653723 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

As you know, our scumbag government never does anything for only one reason, but to attain multiple objectives. In this case,  one of the critical objectives of the the US financed, Nuland led coup was remove the Russian Fleet from Sevastopol Crimea.

Notice how the US had warships stationed in the black sea, and how Russia scuttled ships blocking the Ukrainian navy in port? Did Russia really fear the ukraininan navy, or were they more  worried that the illegal government in Kiev would invite US warships to station themselves in Crimea?

Sevastopol is the Russian Navies only major warm water port in Europe, and is critical to controlling the black sea. Look at crimea on a map, and it is literally a super carrier occupying the upper third of the black sea, and able to control the entire region. Moreover, the resupply of Syria, and Iran, is primarily via russian ships stationed in the black sea.

Had the nulandites succeeded in ejecting Russia, they would have severely weaken Russia's ability to project power, and support Syria's Assad against the US led rebels. Were Syria to fall, then pipelines from Quatar could be built delivering cheap gas to europe, also destroying Gazproms european monopoly.  The potential profits were in the hundreds of billions per year.

By Putin capturing Crimea, he now controls the black sea, protects his southern flank, protects the Gazprom monopoly, and pokes a great big stick up the US state departments ass. Why do you think the western echo chamber media is so shrilly anti Putin? Their controllers are extremely angry over being outmanuvered by Putin.

 

 

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:06 | 4653794 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

hey latina lover, since you have your head so far up Pukin's ass, why don't you move over to the motherland and live there, so you can kiss your god's feet every day.

Russia can do whatever it wants, but America, the evil American's cannot defend their interests?

You have no idea what Pukin wants, but yet you praise him for his folly?  Epic critical thinking fail on your part...

America is now run by communists, an oligarchy, so we are not much better, but we can fix this, whereas, in russia, there is no way to fix that mess.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:15 | 4653818 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

Tell me something, Abi Normal, do you want to Rich, or to be right?

Putin is a KGB colonel, a ruthless assasin who would boil his own mother in oil should the "Plan" require it. 

But it is impossible to make good investment decisions if you allow the western echo chamber media to distort facts.  I am interested in truth, wherever it may lead, even if I don't like the answer.  If you want to make money, I suggest reading material that does not comport with your pre conceived conclusions, starting with foreign media.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:27 | 4653846 Wahooo
Wahooo's picture

He apparently wants to see Americans in body bags from engaging in a war that's none of our fucking business.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:30 | 4653855 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

listen, you you little wahooo, go fvck yourself, you have no idea what I want or not...you obviously have poor reading comprehension skills to have that takeaway from my post.

Stick it where the sun don't shine dumb ass!

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:48 | 4653897 angel_of_joy
angel_of_joy's picture

Why don't YOU go fuck yourself ?!

Less trouble for everybody...

Besides, your ignorance is lacking while your rudeness is striking

(here, a little rhyme for ya...)

Your "new American education" at work

Unfortunately.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:08 | 4653945 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

hey joy to the world, dont you have a unicorn to go ride?  Then at the end of the trail of tears, you can eat all the skittles you want.  The ignorance is yours, and you can have it.  I know what I am talking about, but sadly, most people have no idea what is about to happen...good luck with that LOL!!!

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 14:28 | 4654428 angel_of_joy
angel_of_joy's picture

I like to identify idiots on this board AND tell them that they have been identified.

Of course, is just my opinion but I like to look at it as a civic duty too...

In your case, it only took about 3 of your posts to qualify.

Here's a little secret for free: arrows (green or red) measure not only the popularity of your ideas (showing how much others agree with them), but also their efficiency. A controversial idea would usually show a balanced number of green & red arrows, while a truly stupid one will collect reds in a hurry. Even better, once people start seeing you bleed a lot of red, they tune you out for the foreseable future. Some of them would keep giving you reds for the kicks of it (and because you piss them off, not as much through your expressed ideas as through your expressed character and language).

If you want to be a clown of this board, be my guest... just don't expect people to take you too seriously.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 21:30 | 4655484 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

LOL, and I could care less what you, or anyone else on this board thinks.  I will express myself as I see fit, choose to read, and respond or not.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:28 | 4653850 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

I just want the truth...and the truth is this...Pukin is a murderer, every bit as as much as any other leader of nations...they play a game in blood, lust and money.

I do not support ANY world leader at this point, they are all a bunch of fabian socialists, or marxists, with not much in between.

I am for the little guy, with the boot on his neck, like we ALL are right now.  I praise no murdering asshole ANYWHERE!

BTW, this has nothing to do with investment decisions, it is about Liberty and Freedom, which is being snuffed out around the globe, by corrupt govt officials at all levels, and BANKERS!!!

fvck them all...got that?  hope so...

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:59 | 4653929 Invinciblehandaxe
Invinciblehandaxe's picture

you sir better pull your head out of that place where the sun does not shine

why dont you go help the maidan nazis against that evil russia?

if Putin can overtake land without a shot being fired what does that say??

Have you american assholes ever resolved anything without murdering thousands of innocent people??

go fuck yourself 

very sad seeing the product of american propaganda and deducation

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:12 | 4653958 Abi Normal
Abi Normal's picture

ROFLMAO, see what I mean, this type of shit is funny to me; problem is one day you won't be laughing in your ignorance any more!  You will see, just give it a bit more time you dumb fvck!

You eurotrash idiots are the ones fvcking things up too!! So point your little finger at 'evil americans', three are pointing right back at ya.  The USA will not save your sorry little butts again, so fvck off!

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:50 | 4654041 nightshiftsucks
nightshiftsucks's picture

WTF Abi,is the KGB propaganda team taking over this board ?

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 14:28 | 4654426 Phuk u
Phuk u's picture

Yes it is, wherever there is anti Usa sentiment the KGB propaganda team is there.

No doubt where there is anti Russian sentiment the CIA are there too. There are plenty of uninformed

arseholes around the world and the %age is no different on this board. Read between the lines, your lines.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 12:14 | 4654112 HardAssets
HardAssets's picture

@ Latina Lover - - - excellent strategic summary. Thank you for taking the time to write it.  Regards, - - - -

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:39 | 4654307 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

Thank You, HardAssets.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:52 | 4653753 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

The situation was very complicated after the breakup of the USSR.  Russia wanted to maintain a smaller CIS union but the Ukrainian president prefered to be more independent, to make it easier to steal from his populace.  Russia was too weak to do anything, and didn't necessarily care since the Ukraine was a pro russian, or at least neutral state.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:38 | 4653721 fxrxexexdxoxmx
fxrxexexdxoxmx's picture

When sociopaths leaders of Russia steal other nations land it is because they have a desire to take on burdens. But when other countries sociopaths do the same thing they are evil. What in the bell do Russians ingest that make them so blind?

Perhaps the always being ruled by dictators has simply confused them.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:28 | 4653852 Wahooo
Wahooo's picture

Maybe those nations should pay for the natural gas they purchased from Russia at very low "let's have a friendly breakup" prices.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 14:35 | 4654445 Phuk u
Phuk u's picture

Maybe if they get a chunk of their country back they will pay. Whilst that is going on

they should increase the gas transit price to Europe ten fold. That should decrease the debt

a bit. Let Russia increase the price of gas to Ukraine, no problem Sir but our transit pipelines

need updating that will be a 100 fold increase in transit prices. Fuck you Putin.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:44 | 4653891 813kml
813kml's picture

I know that Russia can't print funny money like the US, but I'm having a hard time imagining how it would be much of a burden on Russia's economy.  It needs to be done even if it was a huge burden, Russia needs to secure a buffer zone to keep the US as far away from Moscow as possible.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:50 | 4653902 angel_of_joy
angel_of_joy's picture

Most of Ukraine's industry is located in the Eastern region.

Now, if that's a "burden" for you...

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:44 | 4653962 813kml
813kml's picture

Excellent point, I'm having a hard time believing that some others in this thread can be so completely clueless.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:45 | 4654324 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

Ukraines real debts are over 80 Billion, and counting. Moreover, their infrastructure is in horrible shape and will require tens of billions to moderize.  Think West Germany assuming East Germany's economy and debts, and you get the idea.  Absorbing, say 20 million more people into Russia (pop 145 million) will result in a substantial economic shock. If Ukraine ws to default on their debts, however, Russia could acquire them for much less.

Honestly, I can't say how it should play out, but I think Putin will not risk substantial damage to Russia's economy.

 

 

http://www.indexmundi.com/ukraine/public_debt.html  (note figures are for 2012)

 

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 15:11 | 4654515 813kml
813kml's picture

Debt in dollars don't mean shit.  If the dollar collapses, Ukraine will be able to pay that off for an hour's wage of babysitting once hyperinflation sets in.  Putin doesn't want all of Ukraine anyway, just enough to secure his borders.  Actually, he really doesn't want any of Ukraine other than Crimea but his hand is being forced.

The hope of recent financial actions by Russia, China, and Iran is to free the world from the grip of dollar extortion.  The dominoes have already been set in motion, you don't seem to have a grasp of the current state of affairs.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 12:25 | 4654138 MrPalladium
MrPalladium's picture

"I suspect Putin will not invade or escalate since incorporating South West Ukraine . . . "

The separatist violence is occurring in South East Ukraine dominated by ethnic Russians. Putin has no intention of annexing West Eukraine.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:21 | 4654239 caconhma
caconhma's picture

 

If Putin is a nationalist and truly cares about Russia, and Russians then why is his own government  flooded with Zionists with dual citizenship? Putin is a gangster, a thug, and a thief.

Under Putin Russia lost 15% of its Russian population. Almost all his own money is managed and hided all around world by Jews like Vekselberg and Abramovitch. At the same time, Putin put Russian nationalists in prisons. He is for NWO. He is only pissed off  because other gangsters are moving on this territory. 

This is all about international oligarchs/gangsters like the USA, Britain, France, Israel, and Russia who are trying to screw up and enslave everybody else including their own people.

 

This fight between Putin vs NATO is like Republicans vs Democrats in America. They are all working for the same masters!

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 14:30 | 4654435 yatikto
yatikto's picture

options are to intervene now, or intervene later.

EU and US wont do shit to fix this.

 

no fly zone, coming up.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 08:51 | 4653603 knukles
knukles's picture

Why can't we all just get along?
Oh yeah, that pipeline thingamajig....
I forgot

Are we having fun, yet?

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 08:53 | 4653610 negative rates
negative rates's picture

One is after life, and another is after death, to each his own.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:22 | 4653691 intric8
intric8's picture

The u.s. better take a cue from what happened in nevada with Cliven Bundy and gtfo the region before shit escalates. Nothing gets nerves going more than enemy warships in very close proximity. We dont need war with russia! Damn central bankers will profit on both sides! More THEFT, OPPRESSION AND WAR and we are already tapped out!

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 14:36 | 4654450 Phuk u
Phuk u's picture

You got it Sir, follow the pipeline, follow the money.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 08:51 | 4653605 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Doesn't feel like that even though everythign is pointing in that direction.

If anything, mid-week this week, something will give, something will take and there will either be a detente for a few months while the focus shifts back to Syria or South China Sea or MH 370 or whatever.

What we have to do is get used to constant state of tension somewhere or the other in the world.

Unless we do something about it,

ori

Blues...

Aaaaaahhhveeee Bi Ladennnnnnnn..... ;-)

http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com/2011/05/02/aaaahhhve-bin-laden-see-i-ave/

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 08:55 | 4653618 knukles
knukles's picture

Certainly Not News (CNN) 370/24/7/365
Can you spell distraction?
I knew you.could!

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:23 | 4653694 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Zigackly! The whole MH 370 thing is beyond understandable.

it feels like we'll still be talkng pings and dings come September!

ori

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:54 | 4653913 Snidley Whipsnae
Snidley Whipsnae's picture

ori... "What we have to do is get used to constant state of tension somewhere or the other in the world."

Wars and rumors of wars... It's been this way for a very long time. Tension really stepped up with nukes and MAD. 

It's estimated that about half of all European debt was wiped out during WW2, more than that during US civil war (slaves were the single largest asset class in the US), etc.

Human nature doesn't change and imbedded in human nature are a certain per centage of type A psycopathic murderers who have reached positions of great power... Nothing has changed iows.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:01 | 4653935 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Yes SW, all too true, a quote from Dune says it best re. psycipaths...

  • All governments suffer a recurring problem: Power attracts pathological personalities. It is not that power corrupts but that it is magnetic to the corruptible. Such people have a tendency to become drunk on violence, a condition to which they are quickly addicted.
    • Missionaria Protectiva, Text QIV (decto)

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:28 | 4654252 Manthong
Manthong's picture

And there is a dynamic of implied or assumed approval that radiates down an ethically unsound organization which amplifies violence as it descends.

The least powerful in the chain become powerful as they act out and are not restrained by authority or innate morality. 

In politics, finance and ethics..  the key to ultimate goodness and success is understanding and exploiting the difference between power and control.

..it is understanding the difference between empiricism and human knowledge.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 14:01 | 4654367 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Very true...funny, empire and empiricism....

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 14:25 | 4654411 Manthong
Manthong's picture

yep.. empire/empricism is all about controlling, coercion, and predicting that which is known by control...

and not a bit about the powefullness of intrinsically owning or empowering.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:25 | 4653829 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

The Kyiv post is a shill propaganda tool,  funded by a Danish NGO, and BBC.  I read them occasionally but find their tedentious opining to be tedious.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:49 | 4654036 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Kyiv Post is full slobbering hate for Russia..

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:05 | 4654220 mtndds
mtndds's picture

MSM her in Los Angeles this morning said nobody died and sounds like its really not that bad in Ukaraine at the moment.  I suspect the market will open in the GREEN tomorrow and we will be near record highs.  The NY Fed I am sure will do what it can to make it look like the market will be the place to be.  

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 13:32 | 4654289 HardAssets
HardAssets's picture

What's needed is intel.

Hard proof that one side or the other is trying to escalate this and their motivatioins for all to see.

That's what happened in Nevada when the Reid-China deal connection came out.

Bullets are often less effective than information.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 08:42 | 4653585 Zerohedge fan
Zerohedge fan's picture

Feds Forced to Surrender and Release Cows

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_4N0q7LB6k

the best part is from 3 min

 

more:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vj7h2W4H5TM

 

spread the message!!

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:00 | 4653633 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture
United States Grazing Service - now known as...wait for it...the BLM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Grazing_Service

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:25 | 4653698 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Hey Rusty, a very dear friend came to me  with a proposal for a mining (gold) investment in Ghana. Are they still viable/safe there?

Thanks in advance.

Serious Q....

ori

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:48 | 4653742 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

Was it pitched as get rich quick deal, or with the caveat that one needs almost patience with red tape in Ghana as in India?  The political and legal situation with the dominant party seems relatively stable (especially compared to the F/X volatility), again sort of like India, just swap IMF for Gold in the MSM headlines...   

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:16 | 4653820 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Actually as a slow and steady, with a known person on ground, red-tape and all.

Trouble is, mining is always messy at many levels (shady .gov, pay offs, rules and regs, exploitation of poor humans).....

ori

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:31 | 4653857 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture

Yes, it's still on the table ORI. I've got several good contacts and will be making another trip to Ghana this November.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCIne2Q67hY

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 10:55 | 4653918 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Thanks Rusty, If you don't mined (!!!) can we connect off-line? 

chaturv on google's mail platform, if you know what I mean.

Much appreciated.

ori

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:12 | 4653955 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture

Absolutely ORI, here is my youtube channel, send me a private message there, and exchange emails etc.thanks!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAaOYjHb9K0

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:22 | 4653977 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Done.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:38 | 4654004 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture

Well, youtube is screwed beyond six ways to hell. I sent an email...not sure if I got it right, Rusty Shorts in subject line...does ZH have PM service???

 

edit - added you to ZH contact

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 11:48 | 4654017 Manthong
Manthong's picture

Ghana used to be a nice place.. build a hut.. grow/catch some food..  swim, get a nice tan.. make some music..  until the City of London Corporation forced wage/credit money in there.

If you did not work on the plantation and pay tax to the bankers, they would burn down your hut.


note: the crown was only the intermediary.

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 16:40 | 4654813 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

If you do it the right way, the regulatory risk is relatively low.  The current .gov focus is on non-permitted operations and legal entities that take full advantage of all the NWO tax dodges available in Ghana (and there are plenty).  Land titles are a mess, even if you miraculously find an apparently clean one -- do the meet and greet with the locals and gather testaments, and then have it properly surveyed and marked and submit the surveys with the final title paperwork.  Most of my experience with gold in Ghana is more downstream which is where the big headaches are/were.  PMMC used to have a tighter monopoly on legal exports which affected pricing for smaller players, PPMC decided @2009? (old timers' setting in) to loosen up and make up for it on volume.  Since I'm in Switzerland -- Metalor, Argor et al. are very particular about the paperwork and source of raw gold shipments to refiners for GDB casting , and they rarely deal with anyone outside of the majors, the PMMC, or on occasion- the Assap Vassa refinery in Accra (reputable management and I can vouch for the EU sourced machines they use - up to 99.99% pure product).  If you are exporting to Dubai or Hong Kong they tend to be a bit more lenient with provenance and custody (of course there are high priced whores/middlemen in Switzerland who will pimp their reputations and relations with the local refiners should one's paperwork not be in order).  Spreadsheets can be goalseeked to say anything (and I plead to that one myself), more important are the management CV's do they collectively have the qualifications, experience, track recored, and connections to get the operation off the ground smoothly- specifically are there retired senior personnel from the relevant government Ministry(s) on the board (revolving door heresy here at ZH, but the assclowns who answer the .gov phone aren't going to get you copy of supposedly "public" policy documents in this lifetime or free of charge, but they will do it for their old boss or co-worker...)  If you're looking for help with gold suppositories to get past Indian border patrol, I can't help you, but I hear Blythe might be looking for work these days... (just my GHS .02)

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 17:40 | 4654959 trader1
trader1's picture

^^^^^this  (green'd)

kids, if you want to get rich, listen to the urban redneck.

 

(i was impressed by the wealth of info in your post.  what's your take on goldenstar resources?)

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 23:07 | 4655683 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Yeah, thanks for that Urban Redneck...

Mon, 04/14/2014 - 10:16 | 4656645 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

It's a publicly traded equity in a manipulated market. On a really long (geological) timeline it focuses on a good neighborhood to find real gold.  Thanks for the compliment, but I am not particularly familiar with Goldenstar.  FWIW the person responsible for managing my fiat savings/gambling must not dislike it, as they park some of the over-weighted "gold" allocation in Goldenstar. 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:00 | 4653637 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

That's a lot of fancy wheels.  And not a single "flat tire".

So much for "resistance".  Bah, humbug!

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:45 | 4653735 Whoa Dammit
Whoa Dammit's picture

Good videos, particularly the second one with the cowboys on horseback & the BLM cowering behind their vehicles. 

 

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 08:44 | 4653588 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

Well crap.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 08:50 | 4653600 overmedicatedun...
overmedicatedundersexed's picture

good luck ukraine, you let in millions of russians, now they own the land... don't worry about millions of illegals crossing into USSA, they love America, and would never try to take the land, La RAZA.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 08:57 | 4653621 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

RE: letting Russians into Ukraine, this is their land, they were forcibly incorporated into the Ukraine by the Russian Politburo.  15 minutes of research could have told you this.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:00 | 4653638 overmedicatedun...
overmedicatedundersexed's picture

latina, and so? the land always is, who owns it changes thru time, a nation is what the population thinks it is, a ghost an illusion..call me russian call me ukrainian call me american call me azlatan, never call me serf, slave, boot licker.

Sun, 04/13/2014 - 09:03 | 4653649 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

Please, dude, cut back on you meds, really.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!