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Chinese Yuan (And Copper) Tumbles As Money Supply Growth Plunges To 13-Year Lows

Tyler Durden's picture


Today's 'bounce' in US equity markets is not translating into Asian equity market strength as China, India, Indonesia, and Thai stocks are fading. Copper is crumbling and just stopped out Dennis Gartman's long. In China, the PBOC withdrew 172bn Yuan (highest since Feb 2013) and pushed the currency back towards its weakest since Feb (which is the weakest since the PBOC began its erstwhile carry-killing-policy. Lots of odd moving-parts in Chinese data tonight with M2 YoY growth tumbling to 12.1% (missing expectations) - its slowest since Jan 2001 but Total Social Financing smashed expectations at 2.07tn Yuan (vs 1.86tn expected). It seems, try as the PBOC might to control it, credit creation continues to balloon in China.

China's Yuan is rapidly heading back towards 15-month lows... (despite Jack Lew's insistence that it strengthen)


Copper futures plunged below Dennis Gartman's long stop - closing out another losing trade (or winning if you faded him?)


M2 Growth tumbles to its lowest since Jan 2001...


But Total Social Financing soared above expectations...


And the PBOC pulled 177bn Yuan liquidity from the market via Repo


The most since Feb's lows in Yuan...


Charts: Bloomberg


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Mon, 04/14/2014 - 22:51 | 4659402 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Currency wars.  We already know who loses this war (us, ordinary citizens who don't belong to the oligarch class).  What we don't know is whether the new old money or the old, old money will win.

Mon, 04/14/2014 - 22:52 | 4659413 Vampyroteuthis ...
Vampyroteuthis infernalis's picture

The PBOC will do fine until the day they don't. Centralized banking fails as always. Fed, watch and learn your fate.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 00:09 | 4659558 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

We're in major global contraction mode.

It's so obvious & clearly provable if one is just willing to be objective when looking at ACCURATE DATA, yet the financial media will continue to completely ignore this major development/process until it's so blatantly obvious that cnBSc can no longer not admit this to its 9,000 remaining viewers.

Like the late 20s and the 30s in the U.S., we're now at a point where the top 1/2 of one percent are doing quite well, the top 5% are doing relatively well, even if they're now just starting to get hammered by unfair and dramatically increasing income and other taxes, the top 20% is struggling to maintain their living standards and going into major debt to do so, and the top 60% to 80%, which used to be referred to as "the middle class" when it was a much more stable and vibrant, is getting absolutely eviscerated (food costs are rising 19% YoU, as just one of many, many examples of this) since it is seeing declining purchasing power, massive increase in debt load, more red tape & higher taxes (to support the massively growing SNAP-EBT/AFDC/MEDICARE-MEDICAID/OTHER TAKERS Army).

And the American Economy does very poorly under the above-described conditions - especially since -

- Globally, things are getting extremely depressed economically & socially while heating up militarily & politically.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 00:13 | 4659588 Tinky
Tinky's picture

No question about it. The momentum, both real and perceived, has shifted dramatically, and no amount of MSM spinning and lying will be able to stop the acceleration.

I'm never inclined to predict specific dates, but I'll be shocked if the impending crisis doesn't unfold in earnest well before Martin Armstrong's "2015.75".

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 00:22 | 4659603 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

I meant to write "top 40% to 21%" above instead of "top 60% to 80%."

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 04:12 | 4659811 X_mloclaM
X_mloclaM's picture

the phrases the 'tyranny of the masses' and 'the dole' are helpful

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 07:11 | 4659908 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



China will be happy to take all the free copper they can get....thanks in advance.


If you have any gold.....go ahead and ship that too.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 01:44 | 4659696 divingengineer
divingengineer's picture

You're just shittin your pants Truth.

It'll be fine, by the way I like the Reduced Sodium Spam, It has all the classic Spam flavour with 25% less sodium.

Feel better now?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 02:11 | 4659728 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

That salt/sodium is bad for most people (barring a chronic medical condition such as kidney disease) is a myth.

Salt is harmless, for the most part, even in quantities far in excess of the FDA's (another inept government entity) recommended daily allowance.

A healthy human with healthy kidneys and a healthy liver can efficiently process and excrete (through the urine) large amounts of salt daily without any harm or risk.

Refined sugar/fructose syrup, refined flour, excessive carbohydrate intake, & just about any processed/boxed/prepackaged food, on the other hand...

Give me clean meat (beef, venison, elk), clean (not factory farmed)
seafood, clean dairy, olives, legumes, nuts, fruits & brightly colored vegetables, and plenty of salt, whether from the sea (iodized) or otherwise, and they can shove the processed, refined, sugar-loaded shit they call "food" directly up their ass.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 03:08 | 4659767 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

Yep, I have a pan full of bacon and eggs, toast,tomatoes and cheese for breakfast everyday, generally my diet would be considered junk, I eat whatever I feel like when I feel like it, the only rule I have is no soda drinks of any kind, nothing wrong with water and no takeaways, I am in my fifties and can still get into clothes I had when I was 20. that processed crap is the problem , but the industry will try and tell you its good for you by slapping on labels of low fat, low salt etc, they want you to buy it to make themselves wealthy, not for your healths sake.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 07:33 | 4659942 Seer
Seer's picture

I'm basically in the same boat, only I couldn't possibly wear the clothes that I did when I was 20, out of fear of being laughed at: actually, my body-building days made that a non-option.

I have good genetics.  I also have a bunch of property that keeps me very busy, so lots of physical work (I'm glad that I had invested in bulking up, as it's holding me up pretty well for all the physical work).  Don't drink alcohol or soft drinks, and I don't smoke: do drink too much coffee though.

People could observe whatever food guidelines to such a degree that they'd die prematurely from stress.  If you let you body drive your heart (physical activity) instead of your head (worry- stress) then that'll go a long way.  Having a great partner is also big.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 03:41 | 4659789 john39
john39's picture

>salt is harmless

in fact, it is vitally important to consume more salt...   same with healthy fat like butter or grass fed meat fats...  raw milk etc.  the truth is they want us sick and dead (not to mention broke and powerless).  the sooner people wake up to that reality, the sooner it can all be stopped.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 04:12 | 4659808 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

The overwhelming majority of food-induced illness is the result of people consuming a) more calories than they expend, b) highly refined/processed foods, many containing literal chemicals and edible non-food constituent components (many of those being carcinogenic or mutagenic, such as aluminum phosphate, not to mention emulsifiers & other chemicals commonly found in processed food that are also used as fire retardants and anti-foaming agents), and c) sugar (whether refined fructose or sucrose) laden foods.

Consumption of these foods, especially when coupled with a sedentary lifestyle, dramatically increases the risk of pre-metabolic & metabolic syndrome, diabetes, heart & circulatory disease, obesity, pulmonary illness, dementia, and a litany of other chronic and fatal diseases.

An active person consuming natural foods containing high levels of nutrients, fats and salts is far less likely to suffer disease than an active or sedentrary person consuming highly refined/processed foods that contain low levels of fats and sodium.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 04:12 | 4659810 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

>salt is harmless

in fact, it is vitally important to consume more salt...same with healthy fat like butter or grass fed meat fats...  raw milk etc. 

One does wonder where y'all get your intel sometimes.......

Unprocessed, fresh foods, such as fresh fruits, most vegetables, lean meats, poultry, fish and unprocessed grains are low in sodium. The availability of low sodium foods is increasing.  Due to the difficulty of finding low sodium versions of processed foods that are naturally high in, or contain medium levels of, sodium (such as cereals, soups, and canned seafood), food markets and distributors have recently started opening online businesses that focus on marketing low sodium products.

YES... current avg dietary level of salt intake in the US is bad for you. Next basic fact of life...

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 04:19 | 4659814 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture


It's Time to End the War on Salt
  • The zealous drive by politicians to limit our salt intake has little basis in science
Jul 8, 2011 |By Melinda Wenner Moyer

For decades, policy makers have tried and failed to get Americans to eat less salt. In April 2010 the Institute of Medicine urged the U.S. Food and Drug Administration to regulate the amount of salt that food manufacturers put into products; New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg has already convinced 16 companies to do so voluntarily. But if the U.S. does conquer salt, what will we gain? Bland french fries, for sure. But a healthy nation? Not necessarily.

This week a meta-analysis of seven studies involving a total of 6,250 subjects in the American Journal of Hypertension found no strong evidence that cutting salt intake reduces the risk for heart attacks, strokes or death in people with normal or high blood pressure. In May European researchers publishing in the Journal of the American Medical Association reported that*** the less sodium that study subjects excreted in their urine—an excellent measure of prior consumption—the greater their risk was of dying from heart disease.*** These findings call into question the common wisdom that excess salt is bad for you, but the evidence linking salt to heart disease has always been tenuous.

Fears over salt first surfaced more than a century ago. In 1904 French doctors reported that six of their subjects who had high blood pressure—a known risk factor for heart disease—were salt fiends. Worries escalated in the 1970s when Brookhaven National Laboratory's Lewis Dahl claimed that he had  "unequivocal" evidence that salt causes hypertension: he induced high blood pressure in rats by feeding them the human equivalent of 500 grams of sodium a day. (Today the average American consumes 3.4 grams of sodium, or 8.5 grams of salt, a day.)


Tue, 04/15/2014 - 04:35 | 4659830 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

OMG one author in scientific american reads some studies a certain way and thus we must toss out the countless studies linking high sodium diets to bad health outcomes. 

Having a few drs in the family to yours.

High blood pressure is a leading cause of cardiovascular disease. It accounts for two-thirds of all strokes and half of heart disease. (1) In China, high blood pressure is the leading cause of preventable death, responsible for more than one million deaths a year.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 06:38 | 4659889 Cheduba
Cheduba's picture

I'm sure that the blue bloods at Harvard absolutely have our health in mind and have zero connections to the industrialized food cartel. 

Just because there were countless studies doesn't mean anything.  Who funded these countless studies?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 07:21 | 4659922 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



I'm very worried about the tortoises......hope someone is on that one.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 10:57 | 4660931 Ariadne
Ariadne's picture

Drink more Brawndo: its got electrolytes. Brought to you by the openly technofeudal mob spy factory that produced Obama

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 04:22 | 4659817 laboratorymike
laboratorymike's picture

Something most people don't know about RDAs is that the RDA is the minimum amount you need to eat in order to avoid deficiency-related diseases.

For maximums, you often need to do your own research, or look into the medical literature.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 04:25 | 4659820 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

@James_cole -

Since you at least appear, on the surface, to buy into the salt myth, James, let me add some additional alternative information that may be of some use to you as to why you shouldn't necessarily (I'd argue definitively NOT) buy into the Great Cholesterol Scam (sponsored by Big Pharma, intentionally confusing people, including doctors, with the correlation-causation scam since the advent of prescription medications):


Let's not forget the followimg:


Sugar, and all of its forms, from corn syrup, to refined white sugar, to fructose, is in just about all products that are processed in extremely large amounts (especially when processed foods are eaten in high volume, which has an aggregator affect).

Sugar is probably a larger constituent cause of disease (inflammatory issues coupled with insulin resistance bred pre-diabetes and diabetes) than dietary salt and fat combined. For those who wish to read more about how sugar is the most understated dietary hazard in American History & how the demonization of cholesterol (which is a symptom of inflammation, not a cause of it) by Big Pharma as a causative agent of poor cardiovascular health is an intentional or reckless deception:

Many dietary toxins, such as refined sugars in many forms (including "corn sugar," the cute new name Big Agri want to replace "high fructose corn syrup" with) are subsidized by taxpayers (involuntarily). This makes it even more profitable for Big Agri to grow these constituent crops, cheaper for Big Food processors to use these ingredients in just about everything (thus raising profit margins), and gets the consuming public sicker and fatter faster, all at the same time! Win-Win-Big Lose!

Americans derive 33% of their calories (in the form of refined sugar) from sugar-saturated beverages, on average.

Sugar and simple carbs are far more a health threat than saturated fats are, given that regular intake leads to the dreadful pancreatic stress known as the insulin spike roller coaster, where your body has to produce more and more insulin, at more frequent intervals, in order to regulate blood sugar levels, which leads to insulin resistance (and then Type II Diabetes as well as other serious, adverse cardiovascular and even pulmonary conditions).

Google Gary Taubes if you want to learn more about how the medical establishment and big pharma have either unintentionally or intentionally led people down the causation/correlation trap with their conventional theories on LDL cholesterol causing cardiovascular disease, rather than being a consequence of it. Cholesterol is produced in response to high C-reactive protein levels, aka inflammation. Statins?  They reduce inflammation. They do not prevent it.

Inflammation is the most under-appreciated cause of disease, whether cardiovascular or otherwise, in current times, and it's the primary cause of that which is mistakenly attributed to high LDL cholesterol levels.

Cut out the sugar and do moderate exercise and you'll do more to improve your health than 100 years of taking statins and cutting out saturated fats will ever accomplish.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 04:41 | 4659831 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

I doubt anyone recommending to watch salt intake would advise eating high amounts (any?) of refined sugar lol

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 07:40 | 4659953 Charles Nelson ...
Charles Nelson Reilly's picture

Do you have to be such a fucking prick all the time?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 08:14 | 4660024 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



Well.....he's under contract.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 05:54 | 4659868 negative rates
negative rates's picture

Sugar was not meant for human consumption, not sure where we went wrong though, though I am sure we went wrong, somewhere.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 06:20 | 4659881 Seer
Seer's picture

Nature has us programmed to be attracted to sugary substances as a means of survival (quick grab of calories).  Problem is is that Madison Avenue and Wall Street understands this connection and has made it Their survival technique to give us LOTS of sugar.

I'd add "stress" into the mix as things that are harmful in large doses: and, once again, what nature provided for us for our survival has been milked by Madison Avenue and Wall Street, as they've ensured that we get large doses of stress as well.

I have to wonder what the real design for human longevity was supposed to be...

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 07:17 | 4659917 Seer
Seer's picture

The financial media's role is to pat the "uppers" on the back and make them look good as they continue to step on everyone else.

No energy means no growth, which means, as you call it- contraction.  We're going to have to learn to do less with less...

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 05:28 | 4659853 Seer
Seer's picture

Now you've done it!  I'm trying to figure if one can have New "old money"...

Perhaps we ought to just simplify and say that "money wins?"  Go money!

Mon, 04/14/2014 - 23:00 | 4659433 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

The greatest easy-money carry trade in the history of the world (USD/CNY) has hit a speed bump.  That's NOT insignificant.  There is a PILE of money that's been betting on an appreciating CNY for YEARS.  I don't know who or how, but this is HURTING somebody bigtime.

Mon, 04/14/2014 - 23:04 | 4659448 Ifigenia
Ifigenia's picture

Jack Lew and his kins?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 01:15 | 4659672 Two-bits
Two-bits's picture

OT:  Had to bring this back up by Chupacabra-322:


Chup-Goat bearded BLM spokesman at cattle gate is a Green Beret. Took me two days to finally find this. At 3:42 first appearance in video - Afghanistan:

Federal Agencies deploying mercs on US citizens. I out the merc here:


How about in this video?

 Same guy handling the dog at :11? This fucker gets around.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 01:49 | 4659704 divingengineer
divingengineer's picture

Are you suggesting that the "Ranger", isn't a ranger? That he is a mercenary?

I don't know if Federal LEOs work that way.

Curious thought though, please elucidate with further investigation.  I think that would be unprecedented. 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 02:04 | 4659721 Two-bits
Two-bits's picture

I suggest that when your profession of choice is to wade through a river of  blood of those who stand in the way of American interests, you wear many hats.  


Tue, 04/15/2014 - 02:19 | 4659734 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

That sure looks and sounds like the same man. My bet is that a voiceprint will confirm your suspicion.


Tyler Durden...This is a story in and of itself. 


If they are deploying mercenaries then we have a major problem.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 05:30 | 4659855 Seer
Seer's picture

Stop thread-jacking!

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 07:42 | 4659958 Seer
Seer's picture

It's thread-jacking!  You've got your playgounds for this shit elsewhere (there's current articles here on ZH)- GO THERE and post this.   Would you want constant injections of topics related to the Chinese Juan being pushed there?

Discourteous bastards.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 01:46 | 4659700 divingengineer
divingengineer's picture

This country is turning into a shit-dump, but betting against OUR psychopaths is still a bad idea.


Mon, 04/14/2014 - 23:04 | 4659450 HyeM
HyeM's picture

Dennis Gartman rules!!!!

you can make a fortune taking the opposite side of this dumb ass's recommendations ... where do i subscribe to his news letter :-)




Mon, 04/14/2014 - 23:32 | 4659522 Xibalba
Xibalba's picture

pretty easy to pirate. 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 00:47 | 4659636 philipat
philipat's picture

The fact that only CNBS, and its 3 remaining viewers, takes Gartmasn seriously probably says it all

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 05:32 | 4659858 Seer
Seer's picture

And then one HAS to ask: does Gartman take Gartman seriously?  Oh, wait, there goes the rabbit!

Mon, 04/14/2014 - 23:13 | 4659481 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

So Russia is cutting off global oil and food supplies and China is good with this? Very confusing.

India as well?

Hmmm. "Gives new meaning to the term 'taking it to the man.'"

At a certain level...provided you exclude the bulk if not totality of the American People "US policy makes sense here" as well.

"Providing liquidity in the form of Armored Divsions"?

I think we all can agree that a Civil War in Ukraine is Forlorn Conclusion a this point.

Tis a truly terrifying thought indeed.

This does put a bid in the market...but I'm not sure I want to be a buyer on news of World War Z.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 05:55 | 4659870 negative rates
negative rates's picture

But you had to report on it.

Mon, 04/14/2014 - 23:18 | 4659497 FieldingMellish
FieldingMellish's picture

gold too apparently...

Now that Gartman has been stopped out, perhaps its time to consider going long copper. 

Mon, 04/14/2014 - 23:23 | 4659507 ActionFive
ActionFive's picture

Just the daily ZH drag on yuan or ruble to dollar takedown.

Later an article about petrodollar isolation by G20..

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 02:08 | 4659726 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

yeah we do have a serious "working at cross purposes problem" here. Is it the death of the dollar? Or yuan annihilation?

I think clearly China...or I should say the Chinese...are not stupid. They know 6-8 percent inflation "masquerading as growth" and hedge accordingly (buy treasuries....and every other dollar denominated asset out there.) these folks dot their I's and cross their t's. they'll pay...are in fact dollar for US based dollar producing assets...with a view to hedging the risk of a major market failure in China.

"Their buddy Putin is not helping matters" either. (Same goes for Japan...and all the rest of East Asia I might add.)

I think a lot of "top dollar numbers" will keep appearing going forward for otherwise far from valuable assets as these folks slowly wean themselves off "trophies" and more towards the real money makers.

Would have been nice to have been a fly on the wall of that meeting of US and Chinese Defense Chiefs.

The US is trying to keep trade flows open from Central and Eastern Europe. Everyone agrees the worst possible outcome is a Civil War in Ukraine.

In any case...c'est la vie. China I think has to and indeed does respect the interests of Great Britain and France in the well as Europe as a whole I might add. Their trip to Germany has been nothing short of a diplomatic catastophe.

I find the US Administration's "kibbutzing" here most perplexing indeed. Clearly they have lost Syria...and as a consequence have hung out the Lebanese Christians to dry. Is Tel Aviv next? What about Tripoli?

I can think of a lot of worse case scenario's now. Ironically "bad news in Afghanistan" or US relations with the Islamic World in general is not one of them. Clearly you don't want to be a Christian in Western Europe right now.

Unless your name is Hans Bjorksensonerheimer-verstater. of ABBA. They should be okay. Everyone else seems to agree negotiating a surrender without a fight is best right now.

I would imagine Jesus is a might teed off about this failure to even bother confronting "the evil doer's." That's God's only son. "And he was a loser who just got stomped on all the time"?

Are there any defenders of the Faith left anywhere in the West anymore? All these dead Christians simply go unanswered.

WTF over?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 05:37 | 4659861 Seer
Seer's picture

Yeah, WTF.  WTF should the US even be scattered around the globe?  Let's quit fucking dancing around here.  You want the US military to help you spread Christianity.  Onward Christian soldier!

Mon, 04/14/2014 - 23:36 | 4659528 siamtwin
siamtwin's picture

Thai stock market closed Monday and Tuesday for holiday.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 06:04 | 4659863 Seer
Seer's picture

<never mind- deleted>

Mon, 04/14/2014 - 23:37 | 4659530 STG5IVE
STG5IVE's picture
Shit Winds are a Comin

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 01:05 | 4659657 Bindar Dundat
Bindar Dundat's picture

I will take eating a shit sandwhich for 200, Alex.

What happens when you order Chinese at a trailer park?


Tue, 04/15/2014 - 01:10 | 4659663 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

Cup 'O Noodles + Sriracha.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 00:33 | 4659619 skree
skree's picture

So I leave for China next gold there with stronger dollars?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 00:41 | 4659627 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

Be sure to do a stopover in Singapore on your way back, to store your precious.  HK is not so friendly to Americans any more, thanks to the Fed's/IRS's arm twisting.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 01:44 | 4659695 Philalethian
Philalethian's picture

Grace at the End of the Day:

(new desktop background)

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 02:48 | 4659761 q99x2
q99x2's picture

Blood moon omen of Globalists destruction. End of Oligomopoly.

Pretty sure the western Globalists have cut a deal with Russia and the east to destroy the US, Europe and Japan.

But things seldom work as planned.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 06:08 | 4659872 Seer
Seer's picture

Sigh... None of these folks are looking to throw the world into chaos, as that would only make things worse for them.

The global system as we have come to know it is failing, and it's NOT failing so much because of subversions but of growth problems.  No matter how you look at it there is no other choice than to climb back off the fantasy wall of perpetual growth and come back down to earth.  It's going to turn into a more brutish world, which WILL necessitate that the upper-echelon of folks deploy mechanisms that support the new realities.

We are not privy to what they are saying behind closed doors.  And, frankly, I don't think that most would understand it, even if it were all perfectly sound/factual/the truth.  Carter tried to warn about the looming energy issues; people are still laughing at him, even though he was telling the truth: and for a politician to tell the truth about anything!  My point here is that no one is going to come out and tell us the truth because we wouldn't believe it even if we saw/heard it; all that would do is open that person up to ridicule, and worst case would expose an entire nation to attack (it's all a Mexican standoff, no one can trust anyone else to not shoot you in the back if you step forward to tell the truth).

The demise of the US, Europe and Japan have long been in process.  It was never necessary to "work" to do this, as the very nature of pursuing perpetual growth eventually leads to exhaustion of resrouces.  NOTE: for the US it'll be more about the demise of the USD; unlike Europe and Japan, the US does have resources- the test is what would happen to a given country if all paper were destroyed, where would that leave them.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 08:30 | 4660093 forwardho
forwardho's picture

Excellent, Seer. Its not personal, its just the way it is. The only reason there are 7 billion people alive right now, is because there were resourses to feed/clothe them. The resourses were available due to cheap, abundant energy.

That equation is now defunct. Without the energy, reality dictates the result.

The current human population is not sustainable.

Reality will always trump fantasy.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 03:13 | 4659774 MaxThrust
MaxThrust's picture


I agree with your salt rant. I have always eaten more salt that anyone I know with many saying I will have problems in latter life. Well, latter life is here and my blood pressure is as good as it has always been. I get a thorough medical every year and always pass with flying colors. One point I will disagree on though is I dont use Iodized salt, it usually include  aluminum calcium silicate or sodium alumina silicate in it to make it flow better. I'd prefer to limit my aluminum intake if I can. ( I am forgetful enough as it is )

I did eat a lot of sugar when young but was so active I never gained a pound. Now my sugar intake is almost Zero. Its the sugar that will get you

Cheers Max

By the Way Tylers. The Thailand stock exchange is closed for the Songkran (water ) festival.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 06:46 | 4659890 BandGap
BandGap's picture

I am with TruthInSunshine on this one. Salt highlights poor kidney function, it does not cause this. High salt intake in the absence of fluids to balance this electrolyte can impair kidney function but salt alone is not the culprit, and certainly not salt in ordinary quantities.   Like so many other things in life, enjoy, but understand the balance of your body.

Water in the proper amount  and a good 20 minutes walk a day to turn the engine over and I think you'll be fine.


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