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The Futures Of Countries: A Look At The Secession Movements Around The World

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Submitted by Jeff Thomas via Doug Casey's International Man blog,

The world is abuzz over Crimea. 95% of the Crimean people recently voted to reconnect with Russia after a twenty-three-year hiatus. Although Crimea had been Russian for over 200 years, Western powers hollered "foul!" over the re-unification.

In addition to Western pundits commenting nightly that such an occurrence is an international disaster, the world seems to be taking up sides over the possibility that any other former Russian territory may also choose to re-unite with Russia, and sabres are already rattling all round.

We tend to forget that, although the world map has looked more or less the same since the end of World War II, it has been the norm, throughout history, for large parcels of property to change hands fairly often. Boundaries move. Countries become larger, smaller, or disappear altogether. Large empires are created, swallowing up smaller countries, sometimes lasting for 200 years or more, then inexorably breaking up into smaller remnants.

Certainly we are heading into a period of dramatic change—economic change, social change, and certainly political change. Whenever such a period occurs in history, changes in the lines on the map inevitably also occur. And, although no major changes have taken place recently, early rumblings can be heard all over the world.

Breaking Away

  • Venice

Venetians send €71 billion to Rome annually, yet only €50 billion returns in services and investment. As they have become "tired of supporting the poor and crime-ridden south," 89% of Venetians have recently voted to create their own sovereign state. Following the vote, Venetians declared independence from Italy. Already, this decision has sparked an interest in Sardinia to have a referendum. Discussions are afoot for Lombardy, Trentino, and Friuli-Venezia Giulia to possibly join them.

  • Scotland

Scotland was an independent country until the 1707 National Referendum, when it became a part of the UK. However, in September 2014, they will vote to decide whether they will leave the UK and become independent. The UK has, since the 1950s, taken a passive position in relinquishing its colonies, and the majority of them have gone independent since then. However, if a colony (now called a British Overseas Territory) wishes to remain a colony, the UK firmly defends that choice. This "let the people decide" stance is extremely admirable and may well be unique in the world.

  • Spain

Spain lost Gibraltar to the UK in 1704, and they want it back. Understandably, Gibraltarians have a great deal more faith in a tie to Britain than to Spain. The Spanish would also like to have Andorra once again. To add to the drama, Spain is having problems over Catalonia and the Basque provinces.

  • Falklands

Across the Atlantic, sabres are also being rattled in Argentina. President Cristina Fernández de Kirchner seeks to retake the Falkland Islands, despite a recent overwhelming (99%) vote by Falklanders to remain a part of Britain (and despite a decisive victory by the UK only 30 years ago over the same islands).

In much of the world, small countries are hoping to retain their independence, whilst portions of larger countries are trying to establish their independence. Understandably, they're meeting with resistance, as it's usually the areas that are the net-contributors to the larger economy that seek independence, whilst the areas that are the net-recipients wish to take the conglomerate approach (and to continue to eat their neighbour's lunch).

This is evident even in the US, where those states that are net-contributors are experiencing the same frustration as Venetians and are making noises about secession. Not surprisingly, net-recipient states have no desire to secede. The central government, of course, has a singular goal, and that is to continue to dominate them all. This particular conflict is in its earliest stages, and it will be some time before we see whether secession in the US gathers any real momentum.

A move to break away is invariably a bottom-up effort—created by the people. A move to create a conglomerate state tends to be top-down—created by the political class. Political leaders invariably have an insatiable appetite for gobbling up as much real estate as possible. In other ages, this was almost always achieved through warfare, but today, this is increasingly being attempted through treaties with other political leaders.

Joining Together

The US is most certainly the original model of this type of agreement, and since 1992, much of Europe joined together in a sort of "United States of Europe." This hasn't worked out too well at all, but that hasn't stopped political leaders elsewhere in the world from wanting to imitate the European leviathan.

Each of these groupings follows the EU model to a greater or lesser extent, and in each case, the "unification" is desired, not by the public, but by the political leaders.

In South America there are a myriad of organizations: Mercosur, Unasur, the Andean Community of Nations, ALBA, CELAC, and others. Each country, save poor Suriname, seems to have multiple memberships in the assorted organizations. If some of the associations seem contrived and even arbitrary, they are. All of them are attempts to maximise the level of power through association. Some of the relationships are acrimonious, as each nation strives to maximise its own importance.

To this, we can add the famed BRICS and ASEAN, also notably top-down alliances.

What we see here is the desire by political leaders to construct conglomerates that are as large as possible, whilst the general populations seek to create smaller, more manageable entities. Clearly, the smaller model provides the greatest potential for self-governance (as in the Cantons of Switzerland) and limitation of the size of government, together with a greater opportunity to create economic competition between states.

But, of course, this is the absolute antithesis of what provides power and control to the political class. So, what will the outcome be: the end of the nation state, as libertarians would hope, or something akin to George Orwell's Eurasia, Eastasia, and Oceania?

It may well be that neither will be fully realised.. Human nature being eternal, the world will always have the libertarians on one end of the spectrum and the dominators on the other. The struggle will be unending, and we shall continue to see empires and associations rise and fall, whilst smaller nations break away at intervals.

The real question is how we choose to deal with this eternal condition. Do we as individuals take comfort in being a part of a conglomerate, with its promise of full equality, security, and cradle-to-grave care, regardless of how insincere (and impossible) that promise might be, or do we choose the smaller, more independent state, with its goals of productivity, greater opportunity, and self-determination?

If the latter, we should examine such smaller states and those that are emerging. Some, like Hong Kong, Andorra, and the Cayman Islands, are well-established. Others, like Venice, bear watching, for they may provide the future of free-market self-determination.

 

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Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:35 | 4662609 Buzz Fuzzel
Buzz Fuzzel's picture

Texas, what about Texas?  Texas should be on the list.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:41 | 4662628 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

This guy is being played like a fiddle.

Am I the only one who understands how the "end of the nation-state" is NOT a libertarian utopia, but rather, the absolutely necessary step to create a global government?

That he doesn't even think of it as a possibility in this article displays massive ignorance for someone who writes this shit for a living.

Glad I don't give Casey my money any longer, as they are merely pandering to any fool who might listen. I swear, it's like they've never even heard of Hegel.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:44 | 4662642 Chief Wonder Bread
Chief Wonder Bread's picture

Their charts suck too.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:52 | 4662670 idea_hamster
idea_hamster's picture

I live in NYC.  Can I vote in favor of TX seceding?

Also, Spain has its own secession movement in Catalonia.  Barcelona doesn't even speak Spanish.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:05 | 4662725 headhunt
headhunt's picture

Can I vote in favor of NYC seceding?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:13 | 4662758 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

Yeah, you can vote, but it's not gonna count for shit.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:33 | 4662846 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

You have the nation-state concept backwards.

It is far easier for the world government control freaks to gain control of a handful of large regional nations than three hundred or even three thousand small states.

Installing a world currency, a world military, a world constitution of so-called human rights, a world court system, and world citizenship would be far easier with fewer but bigger states.

Ingroup-outgroup morality is a very powerful motivating force - most of these secessionist movements are based on that - and the continual process of subsuming smaller ingroups into larger ingroups is exactly the method of achieving world governance.

Smaller political entities means more outgroups, which is what will stop the drive for a world government.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:16 | 4662769 Berspankme
Berspankme's picture

NYC has already seceded to the globalists.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 20:40 | 4663535 Angry Plant
Angry Plant's picture

Do you have any idea what losing 3 million barrels a day in oil production from Texas + the gas production  + all the refineries (and good luck building new ones to replace those) would do to the US economy?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:17 | 4662774 rubiconsolutions
rubiconsolutions's picture

All fine and good but I'm just curious - how can I as an individual secede? That is, withdraw my consent? The declaration of independence talks to the "consent of the governed" yet it is impossible to withdraw consent. A person can stop voting which I did in 1992 and do all kinds of things to reduce their dependence on government in an effort to withdraw consent. Ultimately however, one can never fully escape the grasp of the state. A lot of this secession talk is nonsense. Take California as an example. There are those that would carve it up into six new states. In my opinion that would be like carving up a turd into six pieces because each of those new states would still be under the thumb of the federal government. Again though, what about the individual? How can an individual secede? Absent the individual being able to secede the nation state will continue to oppress.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:27 | 4662823 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

On God's Green Earth, you are a subject of at least one State. Everyone, even those loincloth-adorned tribal hunters and gatherers who haven't yearned to weild the iPhone just yet. Those poor souls just don't know yet, that they're breaking multiple rules every day just by existing.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 19:14 | 4663240 rubiconsolutions
rubiconsolutions's picture

So in essence what you are conceding is that all of us are slaves? Our slavery is just a matter of degrees, right? 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 22:11 | 4663788 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

Most certainly. You are only free in your own mind, but that's what they want to take away ultimately too.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 19:43 | 4663332 August
August's picture

Don't forget North Sentinel Island. 

Worthy of a an old Star Trek episode:  they no doubt think they are free human beings, bur are actually just living in an open-air zoo.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 20:14 | 4663465 old naughty
old naughty's picture

Earthlings (plants, animals, mines, rocks) wish to secess from non-earthlings / humans.

Rumbling is least we need to worry about...eruptions, torandoes, tsunami...

 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 21:36 | 4663696 idontcare
idontcare's picture

Can the rest of America vote for the forced relocation back to the Northeast of all Northeasterners who invaded the warmer Southern US?  Moreover, can we just all agree that any New Yorker found outside of NY, NJ, PA, MA, RI, CN, DE, VT, VA, or DC be shot on sight? [I'd have included ME and NH in the mix, but they don't like NY transplants much either.}

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 19:41 | 4663324 epicurious
epicurious's picture

All of their services are very limited and overpriced.   The usefullness  of their recommendation come with no alerts or any kind of guidance and a resulting track record of 50% bombs in their junior miner picks.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:47 | 4662655 The man with po...
The man with pointy horns's picture

We already have a shadow global government; an unholy union of banksters, zionists, wahabists and ancient powerful families (Royals, Rothchilds...). They greatly benefited from nationalism and the continued break up and wars of nations.

The sooner we end the nation state and bring in an elected global government with some kind of constitutional global republic the better. The people would control the planet and not the lunatics.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:15 | 4662766 headhunt
headhunt's picture

You would just have a bigger pile of shit.

The 'have-nots' would always outnumber the 'haves' and would always vote themselves all the shit that the 'haves' has, which would lead to secession and the start of another country.

The disintegration of the US is directly due to the promotion of the separation of people by culture instead of a 'melting pot' society where most everyone had similar goals.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:16 | 4662767 thelibcentury
thelibcentury's picture

Yeah because there is definitely no way that the "elected global government" would be compromised by the "shadow global government". 

 

 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 22:08 | 4663778 The man with po...
The man with pointy horns's picture

Well it's going to happen anyway in the next hundred years or so, there is going to be some attempt at world government with the globe being divided up into federal states, kind of like the US except instead of states it would probably comprise the old territory of former nations. There would be a global currency to, the much dreaded global currency, it would be fine tuned so that there is enough money for the global government, the state governments and other smaller branches of administration plus enough money for the rest of the economy.

There would be one major central bank, controlled by the global government, which would print all the money necessary for the world to function. A large portion of that money would go to private banks for the sole purposes of loans, private banks would then loan out money that actually existed and it would be a legal requirement that private banks could only loan money created by the central bank. Of course banks would have to impose a small rate of interest to make enough revenue to operate. There would still be deposits and stock markets to ensure basic capital functions, but these would be far more simpler and subject to far smaller levels of volitality.

Ideally taxes would be low to non-existant and the only purpose for taxation would simply be to reduce the money supply. But economic activity would be bounded by the money supply although there would have to be inert money for the sake of future growth. And if the inert money was quickly tending towards zero then the money supply would have to be increased by a certain small fraction of the total supply on a yearly or monthly basis.

Debasing the currency unnecessarily would only hurt everyone since, under this system, there is no other currency to turn to as legal tender. So if say the central bank was hijacked by private interests, or by powerful groups, it could not print with wild abandon since member states comprising this global government would simply leave -- irrespective of whether such a succession would be 'legal' -- and form their own block or international administration. Pretty quickly the world would be once more divided up into nation states or international groupings of states/nations, so a world government -- should it form -- would not be this unslayable monster should it turn tyrannical.

There would also be this fusion of capitalism and socialism under a global system. So on the one hand all companies are bound to market forces; including the private banks. Companies would not have to pay any taxes but they would have to abide to a few government regulations: minimum wage, work place safety and environmental safeguards. It would not be a mammoth amount of regulations but just enough to ensure that capitalism does not run completely unfettered and so that the workers do not become cogs to the corporate machine. While there would be no bailouts of companies, no matter how big they become.

But there would be the socialist side to. Everyone is entitled to the essentials of modern civilization: a home, electricity, water, warmth, food, healthcare, security and education. But the more rewarding aspects of life can be obtained by all, but only by there own volition. The state isn't going to tell you how to live your life, that is your own responsibility. This is a government which is small and unobstrusive, its function is to keep civilization stable and functioning but without infringing on the rights of the individual.

Thus this would be a system where most of the responsibility resides with the individual to live a fruitful and honest life, although there would be safety nets to ensure that people who become destitute do not become homeless. As for those who have a lot of money which hasn't been invested in something, there would be a societal expectation that they should use such money to provide services to others and to not hoard for themselves or to spend only on personal luxuries.

The danger though is that people abuse the basic services and standards of living which government provides and those individuals who possess huge amounts of money use it only for themselves. Of course where a substantial minority of people abuse a system, any kind of system, it begins to decay and then eventually collapse.

///

But that's about the best I can come up with for some kind of solution or improvement to the current situation. I don't know how it is going to come about and I'm certain there are far better ways of going about it. Nevertheless it is more conducive to be thinking about remedies to this mess rather than just pointing out about all the shit this world is covered in. Yet some kind of deeper unity amongst nations is inevitably going to happen.

The irony is we're halfway there towards a unified global system, we have all these trade agreements, the UN, a global currency (the dollar) and half the world speaks one language: English. We're halfway there towards one world, one race, one currency and one global language. Nevertheless I don't believe this current setup will be the one which eventually morphs into a global system.

The dollar's days as a global reserve currency are numbered and there are players on all sides who are going to fight tooth and nail during this transitional period. If Russia, China and Germany cannot devise a new global reserve currency then -- with the dollar gone -- there is going to be whole host of trade disputes and hot wars as developed and developing countries fight for resources which are essential for modern civilization: plastics, oils, metals, ceramics, rare earth materials and a whole host of other compounds. Every citizen, from every country, uses everyday items whose components come from a few dozen foreign countries, and no country is truly self-sufficient in either resources and/or the resources needed to maintain current living standards.

You can sneer and deride at globalisation all you want, but for the most part you are benefitting from it and without it you would not be here posting on ZH. And lest we forget civilization is more fragile than ever since only a tiny fraction of people in developed countries are farmers and of those countries some have to import food. If the international scene goes to pot, and it looks pretty close to doing so, and when energy and food prices go through the roof; food security is of the uttermost priority here.

I hear so many here talking about the time when the western governments are overthrown by the people when SHTF, but when shit hits the fan -- and when during this situation oil hast to be rationed and economies grind to a halt -- everyone will panic and all the food will be taken from the supermarket shelves. The supermarkets will not be able to restock fast enough because the global trade networks are FUBARed due to all the wars and trade disputes, once we reach that stage we move on to a long period of food rationing and starvation. The starvation may be bad or catastrophic depending on the size of the countries agricultural sector, so countries like the US and the UK are going to be in a far stronger position.

At any rate you better pray to God that the government holds it together and ensures the agriculture sector is able to produce the food required for people to survive. If not then a country like the UK will go from sixty million to a few hundred thousand in the space of several years. This ain't like in the past where most people were farmers and/or possessed the skills needed to survive, even if a government totally collapsed and a nation became factionallized there would still be enough farmland to remain intact from the chaos and thus ensure the people would not starve to death. There were far fewer mouths to feed and it was not dependent on advanced technology like that of today.

Yeah western governments are definitely overextending their reach and the fractional reserve banking system is becoming ever bolder as it transfers wealth from the people and into the hands of a select few. And yes it is pushing the world into a very precarious place where a huge amount of death and suffering could occur. However it is utter folly to not only wish for such a collapse but to not consider any solutions for the aftermath; solutions which will probably require a huge amount of rethinking about key things: government, money, morality, human rights and responsibilities.

I don't claim to have a definitive solution, but I look at the historical trends of the last one hundred years and from what I see, I see this world coming together and for the West at least it has given us unprecendented luxuries, freedoms and possibilities. I see the long term trend continuing towards deeper globalisation and integration, although we could hit a colossal stumbling block on the way towards a united, just and harmonious world.

Consider also the changing climate, it doesn't matter if its manmade changes or natural ones, the point is some countries and areas could be devestated by global warming and other natural catastrophes. Large parts of Bangaledesh could be flooded, countries once green and lush could become far more arid due to changing rainfall patterns. Now this is going to cause huge exoduses of people who are going to come flooding into neighbouring countries and these countries will not be able to support such a huge influx of refugees. Why is that? Because there is no global system to help support a country devestated by natural events and there are no means of relocating the citizens affected. No instead they are left to fend for themselves and receive aid nowhere near adequate enough.

Without a global trade system, and a certain degree of global organization, countries hit by major natural disasters (think Eithopia) would be totally fucked and millions more would have died. Or consider this; large parts of Japan may have to be evacuated due to the Fukushima contamination. We're talking about tens of millions of people here. Where do they go? China? The Chinese despise the Japanese and would probably love to see their foes slowly die from radiation poisoning. Which countries are capable of supporting a few million more people, are there enough countries which have the capacity to acommodate for so many refugees?

Now these are global problems and ones which both the nation state and the current system are not equipped to handle. Do other countries, and other peoples, just wash their hands of such problems and just watch as tens of millions either die or endure atrocious living conditions.

Like it or lump it we're going to need a better form of global government or adminstration to handle such situations and to ensure security for all. Would such a world government be hijacked by the groups I mentioned in the above post? I think it is unlikely for two reasons:

1. Not one group: the bankers, the zionists, the wahabis, the Rothschilds etc... globally dominates and controlls the whole world. The bankers are divided by corporations and nationalities and they just as brutal to each other as they are to us in their quest for hoarding the wealth of the world.

2. While these groups cooperate to a certain degree for mutual benefit, like theives they just as quickly turn against each other when the moment is right. They don't want a global government or a united world, they need the world divided and they need nations to ensure there are both wars and new currencies and money to exploit (the last three things are especially needed for bankers). But if they could have global power they would share it with nobody. If Goldman Sachs could corner every single financial market and thus rule the world, do you really think they're going to share it with their rivals; JP Morgan for instance? Yes there are monopolies, but there does not exist an absolute monopoly and there is wriggle room for change.

///

It's one thing to recognize what is going wrong and to unveil the deceptions and falsehoods currently prevailing. Yet it is even more important to think of solutions beside the obvious. I mean sure imagine if say there was a revolution, the US government was removed, the bankers kicked out, the dollar replaced with a new currency, the constitution restored, fractional reserve banking was abolished and the new US government actually controlled the creation of money. 

Just how long do you think it will be before the banksters return, the US becomes embroiled in a series of nation disputes concocted by the real masters of the world, and the complacency of the US people returns? Before you know it we're back to square one again because the world is so fragmented and disorganised. My point is one nation cannot go it alone in this day and age whilst at the same time possess a government of integrity which is not comprised by Zionists, bankers and other shadowy forces. The world is simply too interconnected.

Consider the declaration of independence, for about a 150 years afterwards the US was free of the shackles of imperialism, monarchy and crony capitalism. And then came 1913, the Federal Reserve and the income tax. The rest is history. If even the US cannot escape the clutches of these dark forces by going it alone, what other country can?

We need a more united world and a world government, we need people to actually want those things and to care more for the wellbeing of others. Otherwise this crony capitalism and the dark powers who are enslaving us are going to continue to do so for a very very long time.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 23:37 | 4663995 Jeff Cosford
Jeff Cosford's picture

I'm going to have to do some real thinking about your thesis. Nevertheless it is well thought out and logical.

However the complexity of the world goes beyond any analysis. Again well done wether it would actually work is a whole different kettle of fish.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 23:51 | 4664008 Lore
Lore's picture

Interesting. Your posts seem a curious blend of insight and innocence.  A deliberate provocation?

"The people would control the planet and not the lunatics."

That seems naïve.  You refer explicitly to the Families, yet fail to see their causal and coordinated role in world affairs?  You think hijacking and corruption of institutions would be alleviated somehow by MERGING THEM and distancing them even further from the people?  Do you not see oligarchical collectivism as the growing source of imbalance and strife in European Union and United States?  Yes, you do, further in your post.  You're conflicted, so maybe it's unfair to be too critical at this point, especially if you base your research on their writings.  Psychopaths are dreamers and destroyers and rationalizers, a cunning, charming subspecies that never takes responsibility or feels guilt over broken eggs or scorched earth. Their aubiographies are pictures of humanitarianism and 'nobility.' Some apparently brilliant and well-intentioned exceptions appear to be the 1% among the 1%, and their efforts are frustrated. 

Political Ponerology

Your utopia -- the ancient dream of control freaks -- would see all the mistakes of history repeated on a grander, more devastating scale: a dominant minority controlling a global plantation in absolute dictatorship, the masses completely subjugated and disempowered: a higher Top sucking harder from a lower Bottom.

"The bankers are divided by corporations and nationalities and they just as brutal to each other as they are to us in their quest for hoarding the wealth of the world.

It doesn't stop 'em from trying.  However you spin it, the Top is the Top.

Your nickname seems appropriate.  Rgds

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 10:18 | 4664887 marathonman
marathonman's picture

Pleased to meet you. Hope you guess my name.  But what's puzzling you is the nature of my game.

Sympathy for the Devil - The Rolling Stones

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:20 | 4662790 negative rates
negative rates's picture

The trend line bitches.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 19:48 | 4663354 Balanced Integer
Balanced Integer's picture

Your first paragraph was a lot of nothing. Your second paragraph, though...you get it.

The trend throughout the history of our species has been an ever-expanding association. From tribes to clans, from city-states to kingdoms to nation-states, to supranational associations like the EU and NAFTA. Human progress demands a one-world government, whether it takes the form of loose confederation of nations, or a constitutional republic, or a totalitarian regime minted directly from the collective nightmares of the libertarians.

If the march of human history sees the disintegration of nations into smaller and smaller associations, then we are not really marching; we are retreating.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 20:27 | 4663510 Psquared
Psquared's picture

"We'll be fighting in the streets
With our children at our feet
And the morals that they worship will be gone
And the men who spurred us on
Sit in judgement of all wrong
They decide and the shotgun sings the song"

 

~ "Won't Get Fooled Again" (The Who)

 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:49 | 4662664 Omegaman2211
Omegaman2211's picture

There's no such thing as 'libertarian utopia'. Libertarians are intelligent enough to know utopia does not exist.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:24 | 4662814 AlamoJack
AlamoJack's picture

Yeah, but there's plenty of Demo's looking for Udopia.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:37 | 4662869 jefferson32
jefferson32's picture

Full individual sovereignty, as drawn by nature.

(I still +1'd you)

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:32 | 4662837 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

moved

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:59 | 4662990 Dick Buttkiss
Dick Buttkiss's picture

Sorry, NA, but Hegel is so at the wrong End of History:

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/guest-post-end-history

That's right, we are heading into a post-historical Era of Biography, as the individual attains his true status as a sovereign unto himself, empowered by the galloping advance of technology that now includes "the Internet of money" — http://theumlaut.com/2014/01/08/bitcoin-internet-of-money — and the means, therefore, for him to secede on his own, the state not only powerless to stop him but to prevent its own extinction on account of him.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 19:25 | 4663278 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Bullshit.  The state can buy as much bitshit as it wants.

Don't overthink this fucktard;

 

When fraud is the status quo, possession is the law.

That is all.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 22:19 | 4663813 Dick Buttkiss
Dick Buttkiss's picture

No arguing with a defeatist.

Enjoy what's left of your life.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 18:53 | 4663173 Totentänzerlied
Totentänzerlied's picture

If by "end of the nation-state" you mean the agglomeration of all nation-states into a single super state, then it is not the end of the nation-state at all. If on the other hand you mean something akin to the Marxist (Young Hegelian, utopian communist) idea of the state withering away, that logically entails the impossibility of a global government. And according to whom exactly is this "the absolutely necessary" step to create a global government? If you can't conceive of a situation where multiple nominal nation-states are effectively governed by a single entity, you're just lacking in imagination (and knowledge of history). "End of the nation-state" therefore "global government" sounds like a textbook instance of unconceived alternatives.

The proliferation of (heavily armed) nation-states is the best weapon against globalist centralization. It's also a good recipe (and prerequisite) for world war.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:43 | 4662638 83_vf_1100_c
83_vf_1100_c's picture

2nd that. Secede Texas!

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:52 | 4662942 oklaboy
oklaboy's picture

In Galveston, would love to.

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 03:56 | 4664248 Nick Jihad
Nick Jihad's picture

That would trigger a rush to move to texas.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:45 | 4662649 Buzz Fuzzel
Tue, 04/15/2014 - 18:30 | 4663103 messymerry
messymerry's picture

What, the Texas Naturist Movement???

;-D

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:47 | 4662653 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

California is ripe to split itself into statelets. Three or four FSA infested backwaters where physical production still occurs, plus Silicon Valley and SiliconE Valley(or Faketitsia maybe).

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:22 | 4662799 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

You got:

- Humboldt / Mendo / Trinity and vicinity
- Lassen and vicinity
- Tahoe and vicinity
- Sacramento and vicinity
- Central Valley
- Silicon Valley
- Coastal Central Cali
- Forgotten folks east of the 395
- Sierra Nevadas
- Death Valley and vicinity
- Los Angeles and vicinity
- San Diego and vicinity

And that whole south eastern portion of Mexicali.

They're pretty much statelets already, if you ask me.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:53 | 4662950 Black Warrior W...
Black Warrior Waterdog's picture

Word.

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 02:14 | 4664160 Quantum Nucleonics
Quantum Nucleonics's picture

Will never happen for one reason most people don't consider... water.  California water rights are mind numbingly complex.  It took a century to sort out to the point that people would stop killing each other over water rights.  Splitting into multiple states would bring it all crashing down.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:53 | 4662681 doctor10
doctor10's picture

Always follow the money. Its about trying to escape fascist debt.If I were a Crimean I'd take the debt-GDP ratio of Russia over the EU-any day -hands down.

In fact, since the USA seems to have decided that the Constitution and rule of Law are an impediment to the goverment, its time to  look more closely at debt to GDP ratios elsewhere in the world.

 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 23:38 | 4663998 Scarlett
Scarlett's picture

amaze yourself with Chile.  Net creditor w/ less than 10% debt/GDP.  Rich people will be flocking to it during the collapse.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:23 | 4662804 AlamoJack
AlamoJack's picture

Last time I checked (uh, coupla' years?) Texas had the 9th largest economy IN THE FREAKING WORLD.  But then Texas also has Gov Perry, definitely NOT a successionist, no matter what he says so he can catch some clap.  I think the next Texas governor should be either Ron Paul or Daniel Miller.  Yeah, check out texnat.org or com.

I'm punchin' dem crude oil doggies down the line pardner.

BURMA SHAVE

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 22:37 | 4663856 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Statehood for Mooselvania! :>D

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 21:29 | 4663679 idontcare
idontcare's picture

Texas vs. the Federal Govt.... I'd watch that "match up" on CNN any day.  If I had to lay odds on the outcome, I'd say Texas would be favored to win.  

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 22:37 | 4663848 emersonreturn
emersonreturn's picture

quebec?   tibet?  and malibu?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:36 | 4662614 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

Rising nationalism against the bankster NWO.

Globalization sucks for most individuals and families.

It benefits the banks, corporations, and politicians they bribe to ignore their constituents.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:38 | 4662621 q99x2
q99x2's picture

It will be like in William Gibson't Snow Crash.

 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:49 | 4662666 FrankDrakman
FrankDrakman's picture

Neal Stephenson wrote Snow Crash. William Gibson wrote Neuromancer. Get your cyberpunk authors straight, will you?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:38 | 4662622 NOTaREALmerican
NOTaREALmerican's picture

Like, epic fail dude...   How did you leave out the most important Seccsionist movement?   KaLiFoRnIa, like, breaking up into 6 annoying states?... instead of just one?  It'll be, like, totally awesome, dude.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:50 | 4662669 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

The coastal liberals that control sacramento invited in the illegals that make the central valley dodgy, and now they would like to cleave their bit off from the hellish hinterland they screwed over.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:04 | 4662722 NOTaREALmerican
NOTaREALmerican's picture

Re:  The coastal liberals

Honestly, the coastal liberals (in the new state of Liberfornia) could care less about illegals; except when they feel the guilt at voting time or over a fine glass of Chardonay. 

The people who invited the illegals in are the farm owning patriots (in the new state of Methifornia) who love Merica and love the slave labor wages they can pay.  

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:18 | 4662775 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

You could use a few doses of reporting from hinterland, by people who live there. Farmers' wiring, well pumps, and equipment are constantly being scavenged for sale by the illegal segment of the FSA. When they or loved ones have a health emergency the closest emergency room is packed with illegals. Aaaand then there are the schools. Schools in california lag some de south states in performance, despite(maybe because) they're spending more than any state, per pupil. Guess where the worst ones are. The ones that pull down the average so dismally low.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:27 | 4662824 NOTaREALmerican
NOTaREALmerican's picture

I didn't say there weren't any illegals.   I said the patriotic farmers wanted them there.    The limosine liberals don't care as long as their wine grapes get picked on time.

FFCS, if farmers didn't need these guys they wouldn't be here.   Who in the hell do you think picks all the crops in KaLi,  unemployed college students?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 18:33 | 4663112 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

The farmers dont control shit in Sacramento or DC. If the coastal Ecotards want to "save the delta smelt" the farmers get fucked, by the dem controlled state government and EPA. If the coastal fucktards and dem traitors and RINO fellow travelers wanted to enforce immigration law, it would be enforces. And there would a serious set of barriers on our southern border, years ago. The farmers in all this? Do you think they want fruit pickets to settle down, or just to pick fruit in season? The libtards want them to multiply the dem voting FSA. That's the governing coalition in Cali: wealthy coastal libtards, the FSA, and unionizedgovernment permajob leaches. Hollywood chimes in too, for their tax treatment and bleeding heart image.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 21:43 | 4663715 DaveA
DaveA's picture

Farmers didn't need illegals until the 1960s. Before Johnson and his Great Society, farm states routinely suspended welfare benefits during harvest season. As soon as our fruit-pickers are able to go on the dole year-round, we have to import new ones.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:51 | 4662671 Canucklehead
Canucklehead's picture

I bet one of those new states will ask William Shatner to sing their new state anthem.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:13 | 4662757 Seahorse
Seahorse's picture

Can't wait.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:57 | 4662969 Emergency Ward
Emergency Ward's picture

Hey.  Mister Tambourine Man.  Play a song for me.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:40 | 4662629 youngman
youngman's picture

I bet by the end of this decade there are 5 new countries and 3 new states....

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:43 | 4662639 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

I think every state except Hawaii probably could break into 2 separate states and be much better off. 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:49 | 4662668 NOTaREALmerican
NOTaREALmerican's picture

Probably wouldn't make much difference.  As long as the loot flows directly from the peasants to Feds the Feds are the most important entity.  

Now,  if the Feds got their loot from the states then it would be different, but then we wouldn't be able to afford all the cool wars, sooo...    I think people love the cool wars and the war toys.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:22 | 4662803 negative rates
negative rates's picture

All the more ways to tax you more.

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 02:17 | 4664166 Quantum Nucleonics
Quantum Nucleonics's picture

And why not Hawaii.  Kauai and Oahu are worlds apart.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:22 | 4662798 negative rates
negative rates's picture

I bet by the end of next year, you are wrong.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:41 | 4662631 crunchyfrog
crunchyfrog's picture

Can we ditch Alabama and Mississippi? Redneck welfare queens. Good riddance.

 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:44 | 4662644 Suisse
Suisse's picture

I don't think it's the rednecks in those states consuming the majority of the welfare. 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:49 | 4662660 Buzz Fuzzel
Buzz Fuzzel's picture

When these states get ditched their welfare queens will have to move to where you live.  Alabama and Mississippi are only puting up with this collectivist insanity because they lost the War of Norther Aggression.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:17 | 4662773 MeBizarro
MeBizarro's picture

MS is a $hithole and bar none the worst state to live in the US.  It is Bottom 5 (often even Bottom 3) in almost every conceivable state ranking.  Yeah the Gulf is nice and there is pretty country but there is little human or physical capital worth a damn in the state. 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:29 | 4662833 AlamoJack
AlamoJack's picture

Jimmy Buffet likes it.  I lived there at the Air Force base back in the late 60's.  Didn't leave anything there though.

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 02:20 | 4664172 Quantum Nucleonics
Quantum Nucleonics's picture

Eh, MS is #49 in ratio of taxes paid vs. benefits received.  They get almost $3 in benefits for every $1 in taxes paid.  Only WV is worse.  AL is near the bottom too.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:53 | 4662682 Monty Burns
Monty Burns's picture

You need to check out who the welfare quuens are in those states.  Hint:  It's not the rednecks.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 18:09 | 4663036 messymerry
messymerry's picture

You're right.  It's the "poverty pimps".  ;-D

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 20:01 | 4663404 Loucleve
Loucleve's picture

Thank you.

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 00:04 | 4664038 Kprime
Kprime's picture

we know how to deal with crunchyfrogs.  let me just file this gig a bit more.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:41 | 4662633 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

As much as I like ZeroHedge, I don't want to live with all of you. Local. Local. Local. 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:46 | 4662652 pods
pods's picture

Well, there is a chance we will end up in different FEMA camps.

They might stick us all together just for shits-n-giggles though.

pods

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:23 | 4662809 negative rates
negative rates's picture

That's only if you live through the flood.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:30 | 4662839 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

Our forefathers told of creation myths. We call them creation conspiracies.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:48 | 4662658 MeMongo
MeMongo's picture

I hear you seasmoke! Can you just imagine sharing the bathroom privliges with the likes of fonestar, Million dollar bonus, and fukushima sam. Scary indeed!

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 19:03 | 4663196 agent default
agent default's picture

And who is going to supply you with your daily dose of sarcastic, cynicaly objective, pessimistic bile?  You need us. You know you do.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:42 | 4662636 1000yrdstare
1000yrdstare's picture

California or New York doesn't have welfare queens?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:44 | 4662645 NOTaREALmerican
NOTaREALmerican's picture

Well,  who cares about the Trash Class welfare.   You want REAL welfare; the Big-MIC, Big-Ag, Big-FIN, or Big-ED kinda welfare.  

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:59 | 4662703 NickVegas
NickVegas's picture

That's it baby. The welfare crowd is getting the short end of the entitlements. Based on the animosity, the slaves on the hedge still cling to their cherished notions.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:43 | 4662641 Argieboy
Argieboy's picture

Im argentine and I don't give a toss for the falklands... However I must represent only 10% of my country

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 18:18 | 4663041 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

Why does Argentina want the Falklands anyway? Unaccountably, the Falklanders and their sheep seem to prefer to remain under the umbrella of Great Britain (probably Great Britain's distance makes it that much more attractive. I too would prefer my rulers to be half the world away). Insulted, yet undeterred, Argentina claims the recent vote was illegal and the UK's refusal to come to the bargaining table highly provocative. I understand the UN, the Pope and no doubt Jesus Christ and the Virgin Mary favor Argentina's claim, but apparently the residents prefer the status quo. There is no accounting for taste. The nuclear sub Argentina says is lurking in those waters probably means that once again, Argentina ought to close its eyes and think of England. 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 18:48 | 4663153 tsuki
tsuki's picture

Oil. 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 20:11 | 4663229 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

Holy shit! I just looked that up. No wonder Kirchnir is having a hissy fit with all that oil beyond her grasping harpy reach. The Brits would fight to defend the sheep dung in the Falklands; imagine the lengths they would be willing to go to for all that oil. Don't be fooled by that civilized veneer, underneath it they're brutes with 2000 years of experience in war under their belts.  

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 19:26 | 4663283 First There Is ...
First There Is A Mountain's picture

You must not know any Argentinos. I lived there a good spell and still have an apartment in BsAs. They are, without a doubt, some of the most hubristic people on the planet. The Falklands or Malvinas as they are fond to call them could be completely devoid of any material wealth WHATSOEVER, and those people would still make it a matter of national pride (what shreds remain them) to recuperate it. And they certainly think they know better that the Falklanders themselves. 

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 21:38 | 4663497 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

Last time they tried to take the place by force, inadvisedly believing that they could present the Brits with a fait accompli and acquire the place at little cost (maybe have to pay a little reparation or something), the rest of the world watched with great amusement and laughed as they got their asses deservedly kicked. That has to hurt right in the hubris. I suspect Argentina's military, not unlike my youngest daughter, is more decorative than functional. 

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 10:50 | 4665017 Argieboy
Argieboy's picture

Foreigners shouldn't own flats in my country. As well as Argentines, like myself, shouldn't claim the faklands from Britain.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 19:04 | 4663208 smacker
smacker's picture

Well, under Cristina's governance you're probably lucky to even have a country still.

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 10:44 | 4664997 Argieboy
Argieboy's picture

And you probably want Argentina to end right? Like most of foreigners...they don't like us to have the bth largest country in the world.

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 10:51 | 4665026 Argieboy
Argieboy's picture

8th that is..

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:46 | 4662651 Vampyroteuthis ...
Vampyroteuthis infernalis's picture

We going to see Falklands part 2, the ass kicking of a commie?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:49 | 4662663 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

   Look no further to the reasons why people are fed up, when you rotten douchebags like this that cheat,rob and buy their way out of responsibility.

  Silvio Berlusconi given community service for tax fraud | World news | theguardian.com

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:53 | 4662680 NOTaREALmerican
NOTaREALmerican's picture

Please,  the poor man has suffered enough.   We've simply got to let go, and realize that mistakes were made and lessons were learn from this unfortunate and isolated experience which has made our nation stronger than ever.  

We've got to learn to forgive - and, most importantly,  forget.  

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:21 | 4662792 Nigh Eve
Nigh Eve's picture

Wouldn't forgive and LEARN be a better option?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:29 | 4662836 NOTaREALmerican
NOTaREALmerican's picture

Well,  we wouldn't have the society we have now if people could learn anything.

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 04:09 | 4664260 Nick Jihad
Nick Jihad's picture

Beatiful words - you should be a defense attorney.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 16:59 | 4662707 Spectre
Spectre's picture

It's time for us ass clowns in the USA to overtake Cuba.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:06 | 4662728 NOTaREALmerican
NOTaREALmerican's picture

Re:  overtake Cuba

That might work...    invade Cuba.   Let's wait until the NBA season is over first.  

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:00 | 4662711 centerline
centerline's picture

This is a massive central planning fail on a global scale.  Fracture is what is coming.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 23:43 | 4664005 AdvancingTime
AdvancingTime's picture

 What is happening in Ukraine and the unrest in many areas in the world brings into focus the many conflicts that develop when a region decides to change governments often outside the recognized democratic system of voting. In some cases even after an overwhelming vote such as in Crimea the whole process is called into question.

Unfortunately the American civil war did not resolve the issue of succession forever and definitely was not a template for a solution that should be used in countries across the planet. Bottom-line many in politics are slow to give up control and this will not change. Borders are a creation of man and not visible to the birds flying above. For more on this important issue see the article below.

http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2014/03/the-issue-of-sovereign-borders.html

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:15 | 4662755 smacker
smacker's picture

"However, if a colony (now called a British Overseas Territory) wishes to remain a colony, the UK firmly defends that choice"

This is certainly the official British position regarding Gibraltar, The Falklands and one or two other pieces of rock scattered around the world. But when it comes to other countries (eg: Ukraine, Crimea), the British government has an exactly opposite stance. You really could not find a better example of peak hypocrisy than William Hague calling the referendum by 95% of the Crimean people to leave Ukraine and rejoin Russia as "unconstitutional" and "illegal".

Hague should have been hauled into Parliament and ordered to explain himself. A vote of no confidence should have followed.

And now we have the Scotland situation where the Tory coalition government and Labour Party opposition are going round the country making pointed threats to Scottish people of all the ghastly things that will happen to their economy and jobs etc if they dare vote to leave the United Kingdom. This too is a direct contradiction of government policy towards Gibraltar and The Falklands.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:20 | 4662787 AlamoJack
AlamoJack's picture

Last time I checked (uh, coupla' years?) Texas had the 9th largest economy IN THE FREAKING WORLD.  But then Texas also has Gov Perry, definitely NOT a successionist, no matter what he says so he can catch some clap.  I think the next Texas governor should be either Ron Paul or Daniel Miller.  Yeah, check out texnat.org or com.

I'm punchin' dem crude oil doggies down the line pardner.

BURMA SHAVE

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:26 | 4662806 Reptil
Reptil's picture

yes. every action has an equal reaction. only fools wouldn't see that one coming.
the EU gobbeling up Spain's territorial gov. (e.g. Madrid) only helped to cement the individual regions' independence.

who is going to survive the coming storm (if anyone is)?
no fucking idea. I wish I knew.
a world made of smaller managable city-states would be great. diverse like a patchwork that can only work out for the better.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:27 | 4662828 kchrisc
kchrisc's picture

They forgot the "reverse secession" by the American people: We will allow the DC US on the Potomac to secede and go their own way.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:32 | 4662851 Cyrano de Bivouac
Cyrano de Bivouac's picture

We The People has a petition demanding that Alaska become part of Russia again.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:43 | 4662898 lamont cranston
lamont cranston's picture

Mississippi & Alabama Shitholes? I grew up in Chicago then in Jackson/Starksville/Tuscaloosa from the mid 50s through the mid 70s. I'll take MS or AL any day, especially now. And Birmingham has one of the top 5 restaurants in the US (Highlands Bar & Grill). 

Most of urban Chicago, Detroit, Flint, Philly (outside of Rittenhouse), Cleveland, hell, most anywhere in OH (ever driven through Nelsonville?)...now there's some real shitholes. Even the NY Times had an article about how urban blacks were migrating back south in record numbers. 

Remember Richard Pryor's wise words - "If Hitler would have known about Alabama & Mississippi, he never would have started WWII."

Don't see too many people retiring to the North for that matter.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 20:06 | 4663421 Jam Akin
Jam Akin's picture

There's some shit and some good food most everywhere you go in these United States.  Have to say, tho,  the Cleveland bus station was perhaps the shittiest shithole of them all back in the 70's...

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 17:52 | 4662941 Peter Pan
Peter Pan's picture

Can Americans vote to have New York and Wasington DC thrown out of the Union?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 18:26 | 4662947 trader1
trader1's picture

great article until this "gem":

"The US is most certainly the original model of this type of agreement, and since 1992, much of Europe joined together in a sort of "United States of Europe." This hasn't worked out too well at all..."

then, you took a major credibility hit.  after all, it's an opinion piece.  what else should i expect?maybe someone qualifying such remarks...

what hasn't worked out?  what were the original goals of the EU, and have those been met followed by a continuing push to establish new goals?

 

operating system = social, political, and economic governance

the united states' operating system has gone through following evolutions: 1783 release 1, 1789 release 2, 1791 release 3, with a major crash (near death experience) between 1861-1865 and patched with v14. today, we're still on release 3 but at v28, an operating system built upon contextually dated paradigms&mythologies. when's release 4 coming out?  or, what about a completely new/different/groundbreaking operating system?

well, the EU's operating system is a synthesis of the US operating system with that of the united nations circa 1949-1951, at the dawn of the cold war era.  so it's much different in scope and in maturity over the united states.  although not new, it's certainly more "up to date".  

 

spoiler alert - an opinion: the quality of social, political, and economic life is (on average) higher in the EU/Single Market countries than in the united states'.according to someone who has experienced living/studying/working in EU/Single Market countries firsthand as well as in the US for roughly the same periods of time (at least a decade in each).

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 19:57 | 4663387 Loucleve
Loucleve's picture

yeah, we'll see how that works out for the EU after The Camp of the Saints plays out.  The african hordes are swarming the borders all along the Med as we speak.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 20:18 | 4663479 nikku
nikku's picture

"The quality of social, political and economic life is (on average) higher in the EU/Single Market countries"

Imagine how much higher our standard of living would be if we didn't have to worry about defending Europe from Russia. They have more resources because we're suckers. FYI, I own a home in EU and I disagree with your general statement. There are parts of the EU that rock--for instance in my second country Estonia, but then there are those countries that have lost their moral mearings and have fallen into the same coruption that pervades Brussels

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 00:48 | 4664085 Tulpa
Tulpa's picture

Does your "opinion" take into account the EU's hideous youth unemployment rate, hostile immigrant population, supreme governance by an unelected bureaucracy, total lack of gun rights, etc?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 18:00 | 4662993 Hail Spode
Hail Spode's picture

A good framework for how local governments or small states can unite together for defense yet keep the relationship voluntary, is found in this book http://www.amazon.com/Localism-A-Philosophy-Government-ebook/dp/B00B0GAC...

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 18:40 | 4663130 Lord Koos
Lord Koos's picture

Most of the "takers" are red states.  Most of the secession talk is coming from the south... see where this is going?  If you want to leave, good luck.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 19:10 | 4663226 First There Is ...
First There Is A Mountain's picture

Most of the pussies, i.e. metrosexual little bitches and assorted briefcase toting no real world survival skill possessing pieces of shit come from blue states. See where that's going?

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 19:55 | 4663376 Loucleve
Loucleve's picture

Lets not forget the Blue State financial fleecer types in NY and Chicago.  Just being specific, as they do fit with the metrosexual bitches and briefcase toters.

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 00:55 | 4664094 Tulpa
Tulpa's picture

Those stats are skewed by the prevalence of military bases (which on paper are "takers") in red states and important ports ("givers") in blue states.  The authorities in San Francisco and NYC, for example, know they can tax and regulate with impunity because businesses will put up with it to reap the geographic advantages.

The Democrats didn't make SF or NYC such a great place to do business.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 21:37 | 4663583 honestann
honestann's picture

My reply to all such discussions is:

I refuse to be governed.

Why doesn't everyone?

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 03:45 | 4664236 TPTB_r_TBTF
TPTB_r_TBTF's picture

the Sheeple are not seditionists.

Thu, 04/17/2014 - 01:29 | 4668387 honestann
honestann's picture

You don't understand.  The predators are the ones who claim we ARE slaves and ARE to be governed.  We are not willing parts of that, and were never willing parts of that.  So we are not leaving anything by refusing to be governed, we are not joining.

The predators are attempting to make us slaves.

THAT is the only operational dynamic.

Some of us simply refuse.

Even when sheeple comply with demands, whether they consciously realize or not, they comply under protest and duress.

Tue, 04/15/2014 - 23:37 | 4663994 AdvancingTime
AdvancingTime's picture

I recently wrote about the up coming vote in Scotland. In our modern world setting up your own independent nation is a formidable and complicated endeavor. If the UK Government is agreeable to allowing Scotland to go their merry way will Wales and Northern Ireland be inspired to move towards independence?

This might also encourage similar movements in Catalonia, Belgium, Northern League in Italy, Basques, Cornish, and among the Poles. Lots of problems could develop. As you may know Venice and the area around the city recently voted to separate from Italy. The article about Scotland can be found below.
          http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2013/06/british-pound-and-independant-sco...

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 03:27 | 4664222 hardmedicine
hardmedicine's picture

I don't know about you all....... but I see  absolute poverty and economic collapse taking place here in the South.  The "great Recession" and all the other lies told about the recovery is so laughable. 

Wed, 04/16/2014 - 07:49 | 4664471 kurt
kurt's picture

NWO claptrap

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!