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It All Begins With This: U.S. Middle Class Is No Longer The World’s Richest
Over five years ago, when we first dared to make the "bold" claim (a tangent of which now serves as the basis for bestselling books that paraphrase Karl Marx) that all Bernanke's idiotic assault on the average American, known as Quantitative Easing, would achieve, would be to crush the US middle class, it was ridiculed - perhaps we too should have charged a perfectly capitalist $23.97 for this profound assessment to be taken seriously. Still, we are gratified to learn, some five years later, that indeed, the US middle class, well on its way to extinction, just took out the first and most critical milestone, to wit - the US middle class is no longer the world's richest. And yes, "it's all downhill from here."
Sadly, mostly for America's chauvinism, the distinction of the world's richest middle class now goes to Canada, while the poor in much of Europe now earn more than poor Americans.
From the NYT:
The American middle class, long the most affluent in the world, has lost that distinction.
While the wealthiest Americans are outpacing many of their global peers, a New York Times analysis shows that across the lower- and middle-income tiers, citizens of other advanced countries have received considerably larger raises over the last three decades.
After-tax middle-class incomes in Canada — substantially behind in 2000 — now appear to be higher than in the United States. The poor in much of Europe earn more than poor Americans.
The numbers, based on surveys conducted over the past 35 years, offer some of the most detailed publicly available comparisons for different income groups in different countries over time. They suggest that most American families are paying a steep price for high and rising income inequality.
Much more in the full NYT article which in many words says what we said in a very few words back in 2009. Here is Pew's take on it too:
This week’s chart of the week (our screenshot doesn’t capture the interactive version)shows how after-tax incomes at different levels grew between 1980 and 2010 in the U.S. and 10 other advanced economies. (The data come from the Luxembourg Income Study Database.) Besides showing how steep income growth was at the upper levels relative to the lowest ones, the graphic shows how much different tiers of Americans have fallen behind their peers in other countries.
For instance, Americans in the 20th income percentile earned less in 2010 than Norwegians, Canadians, Dutch, Germans, Swedes and Finns in those countries’ respective 20th percentiles. Three decades earlier, 20th-percentile Americans earned more than everyone except Canadians. American and Canadian median per capita incomes were about equal in 2010, at $18,700, according to the LIS data. But other, more recent income surveys, “suggest that since 2010 pay in Canada has risen faster than pay in the United States and is now most likely higher,” the Times wrote.
But the American rich still make considerably more than other
countries’ rich. At the 95th percentile, U.S. per-capita income was nearly $60,000, more than $10,000 ahead of Canada’s top earners.
Enough words, here are the charts.
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another Obama sucess story....
Hardly, not that BHO has helped matters....
This is more like the triumph of supply-side economics being finally realized...
This recovery has almost wiped out the Middle class.
Layoff / Business Closing List:
http://www.dailyjobcuts.com
-
Thank the private sector.
Where are we if you throw out Detroit NJ and W Virgina and Cleveland
Sorry, Max. Those places may be piles of shit, but they're OUR piles of shit. They stay.
Jersey has a lot of good earning workers and families. It would make our overall look worse if you excluded them. It's just that in New Jersey none of those people are allowed to KEEP any of their income.
Did this analysis only consider income (most likely) or quality of life? Making $60,000 per year in Los Angeles mean your poor while $60,000 per year is a good living in say Oklahoma City. Cost of everyday items means quite a bit.
and just think of what $60,000 is in Arkansas. Yee haw!
60K per year in Joisey ,means your entitled to low income housing ,state healthcare ,SNAP cards ....and meals on wheels daily .
These stats mean very little, apart from the fact that QE is widening the income gap between rich and poor. Canada's middle class may have slightly more income but the cost of living up here is way higher than the US, assuming you don't require a lot of trips to the hospital. Once Canada's housing and personal credit bubble finally pops, we will see Canada's middle class shrink further in both size and income.
"Middle class" is such a vague and misleading term anyway. The terms we should be using to describe social strata in Western countries are are poor (on welfare), working class (wage/salary earners), rich, super rich, and uber-riche.
Canada median home price = 9x median Canadian Income.
At the height of the US bubble it was 7x here.
As China slows and the need for Canadian natural resuources slows that bubble is going to pop. Bye bye number one ranking.
Most Canadians have as much idea of what's really going on as most Americans.
I decided a long time ago not to take part.
No debt, no credit card, no car, no cellphone.
I think things will get interesting fairly soon.
I hear your trepidation, but ... don't hold your breath.
We are a resource rich country that doesn't think twice about raping our environment for a buck. The demand for energy is not going anywhere anytime soon. Also, living without transportation, communication, or credit cripples your options if things do go south. No debt is excellent, but keep options open.
Keep options open indeed. No Cellphone? Damn dude, that's not necessarily a luxury, it's survival, not just if you get stuck in a pickle but to inform information to the ones you care about of potential problems.
I grew up in the 70s and 80s and survived without a cellphone. I remember making a mental note to call again later. Maybe they just weren't home. i suspect my knowledge of alternative routes may come in handy again, without a cellphone tweeting me a roadblock is there
the phrase Tyler used to freq. use regarding QE that he hasnt used for a while is that it is the largest transfer of wealth in history.
and he didnt mean from the top down
It's kinda hard to hold the top spot with 29.5 hr/wk jobs. It's just math basically.
Flakmeister above said it best.
This is the collapse of the Supply side construct! About time...
Hurrah!
ori
Bingo!
Exhibit A: http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/04/24/cme-gold-asia-idUSL3N0NF2D320140424
Exhibit B: http://twoshortplanksunplugged.blogspot.com.au/2013/05/gold-weak-hands-shake-out-terrence.html
Exhibit C: http://twoshortplanksunplugged.blogspot.com.au/2013/10/gold-us-sovereign-coup-detat-and.html
Nuff Said!
Reading Fernando Ferfal Aguirre's book Surviving the Economic Collapse is forcing me to re-think my hatred of mobile phones (dumped mine as soon as my new job allowed it). BUT they seem to have value when TSHTF to ensure you can get hold of family when emergency services is slow or reluctant to service your neighbourhood, and more as social life decays etc.
Now just gotta persuade my Mom to carry one!!
"The demand for energy is not going anywhere anytime soon."
Soon? As in how soon?
Careful about making assumptions. One need only look at Ukraine to see that demand is a bit less than the full story of things. That is, while there may be demand that don't mean that there is the ability to fulfill that demand. Prices are likely going to have to be reduced, well, to be more accurate, "margins" will have to be reduced, and at some point margins will suffer as volume drops and you end up in a vicious circle. When one is circling the drain is no time to look back and go- "oh, shit! I didn't see That coming!"
Resources are good. And Canda's resource base is why I figure that Canada will be one of the top three countries to "survive" (US and Russia being the other two). Don't, however, expect to be doing a lot of trade (who you going to trade with when everyone is broke? can you get enough of a price/margin to offset transport costs? from broke people?).
Interesting, and scary. And if that's the median, there are many in much worse shape. I cannot fathom having a mortgage that was 5 times my yearly income.
If we say "The economy is recovering" we have a problem.
it's like winning the war but saying all the soldiers were killed.
Killed? Ha! It's only a flesh wound!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKhEw7nD9C4
Yeah, that's pretty much how this guy maps it:
http://geroldblog.com/2014/03/23/canadas-next-great-recession/
I'd been figuring that the pull-out of Chinese students creating a vacuum in the rental markets would take out a big leg from the rental markets, sending the overall RE market reversing course. (I've got firsthand experience, as my wife had had a home up there and was renting to students [though none of them were Chinese- I think they were more high-end] in order to meet mortgage payments).
That's funny, but no one should think there's any truth to what you've written.
A target?
If you don't blend in...
You mean the crony capitalist part of the private sector, right?
Get rid of the private sector and you have North Korea. How's that working out?
North Korea doesn't have any resources. THAT is why they're in the boat they're in.
Ideology has very little to do with collapse. Sir John Glubb's paper on 3,000 years of empire collapses pretty much proves this point. Read it here: http://www.rexresearch.com/glubb/glubb-empire.pdf
Just looking to defend logic and facts...
DEBT SLAVERY
This goes back much futher than the current (horrible) administration. It goes back before any current economic theories that are often debated.
This comes down to debt slavery & it has been discussed for thousands of years.
The oldest known word for Freedom was 'amargi' and it was also used in reference to the cancellation of debts in ancient Sumeria. Many have recognized how debt is used to enslave people, and how it destroys the population.
It can be argued that, in reality, the current economic/political system is nothing but a system of slavery.
The banksters have perfected the slavery debt model. Now, they don't even have to loan out any real money to buy a new slave. (In the old days they loaned out gold & silver notes in amounts greater than the physical metal they had in their vaults.) Now the banksters create fiat no-thing 'money' out of thin air with a few computer keystrokes and loan 'it' at interest. And if they make a bad derivatives bet, those very same debtors/taxpayers paying 20% credit card interest, are on the hook for the banksters bad bets. - Even if you have no personal debt, they put you on the hook for the government 'debt'.
The information on all this has been available for a very long time. Many great thinkers have spoken about it. Of course, they don't teach this in the so-called 'schools' today. Much better to get people arguing and fighting about what are nothing but Divide&Conquer distractions. "Right" vs "Left", D vs R, . . one 'ism' vs another 'ism'. None of it reflecting reality at ground level. All bullshit.
Its a rather clever system of slavery, where most people don't see their own chains.
Clever . . . but evil.
http://georgewashington2.blogspot.com/2011/08/first-recorded-word-for-fr...
"The oldest known word for Freedom was 'amargi' and it was also used in reference to the cancellation of debts in ancient Sumeria. Many have recognized how debt is used to enslave people, and how it destroys the population."
And it was the Summerians who came up with "interest." Coincidence?
As far as being a slave... not everyone can be the/a "master." I think that it's more mental than anything else. Even the "masters" are slaves, they're slaves to the system: and in this case they're subject to the system melting down due to it being ponzi-based; such melt-downs often see a rise in guillotine use...
Again, it's the SYSTEM. "Masters" come and go, but what stays is the SYSTEM. And, clearly, the SYSTEM, no matter what it is dressed up as, be it capitalism, socialism, communism, whatever-ism, is, underneath, founded on the notion of perpetual growth on a finite planet- the BIG LIE/deceit. And the power of the lie is that when buys into into it then liars [the "masters"] can pretty much take full advantage.
A certain percentage of the population are psychopaths. Those with financial resources, intelligence, and drive can inherit positions within the habit of thinking called 'organizations'. Many such 'organizations' make up 'the system'. These organizations aren't real in the sense that a rock or tree is real. They are nothing but the habitual ways that people think & act toward one another. It is primarily mental - since this is what determines how people act. And, the way that people think about themselves is of central importance. Those who think as slaves, - will enslave themselves.
The masters of groups of people thinking/acting habitually - are enslaved by their own greed, lust for power, fear of overthrow, and hubris. Often in history, things end up not working out very well for them.
The co-dependence of those who think as slaves and the 'masters' , isn't a pretty picture.
It is a success story, really. The more people dependent on government handouts, the more Democrat voters. Long term it isn't sustainable, since the tax base is drying up and hitting the wealthy hard will just make them move - yeah, they can afford that. Then comes the revolution. But for now, it's going according to the playbook, and who said politicians take a long-term vew?
Military-deployed weaponry can nullify any advantages of moving away.
Not in the history on humankind has that ever been true.
Long term it isn't sustainable, since the tax base is drying up and hitting the wealthy hard will just make them move - yeah, they can afford that.
Lol wth, did you miss the article above?
Yeah, because all of history's empires collapsed because of "Democrat voters."
"But for now, it's going according to the playbook, and who said politicians take a long-term vew?"
Politicians are NOT the planners. Further, those in power retain power by way of the status quo. WTF would anyone holding power and wealth "plan" on fucking it all up?
Do you really think with that brain? (and all those up-voting- WTF?)
It's way too convenient to place all the blame on President Obama, despite what dittoheads strive to believe. The middle class has been systematically destroyed over the course of fifty years or longer. who knows when the last honorable President held office.
I wouldn't vote Republican again for a dogcatcher. Nor would I vote Democratic. They offer no alternatives, no hope, no vision. those who continue to participate in this charade deserve what they get.
I still don't give passes to people who make bad siutations even worse.
America needs a 3rd party. But where would you get the votes and the media when your message would have to be, "everybody has to pitch in and Too Big to Fail is Too Big to Exist."
Politics is barbaric, no matter how many parties.
So long as there's one group who gets to control and punish everyone else, the insanity will continue.
Government is organized crime.
corporatewhore
"I wouldn't vote..." Me too.
I will vote for the person who's solemn vow is to dismantle the federal government, flat tax of 10% and assrape Bernanake in public ala Ghaddafi
I never said it would be easy or even possible; given the vested interests of the predators and parasites that live generously off the government tit. The problem still is, there are more eaters than producers.
Democrats and Republicans won't be giving up the public trough without a hellova fight.
There's been no plan to destroy anything. The ONLY plan is for those in power to stay in power. As the world's resources diminish the per-capita wealth that they enabled declines- and those in power ensure that they retain their wealth (if not do what they've been lead to believe is the right thing to do- increase it), only further stresses the per-capita (for the non-wealthy) wealth.
The SYSTEM has a built-in self-destruct. It is built upon an entirely impossible premise- perpetual growth on a finite planet. We bought a lemon and we refuse to admit it! We play these little games within this larger doom-cycle as "inflation/deflation cycles," always, seemingly, able to generate "new" cycles by concocting various soliutions (more and more it's based on trickery than being able to extract more resources from the planet), making us believe that it can continue forever; and when it seems shaky we start looking around for scapegoats.
Wait till the full onslaught of Obamacare taxes kicks in....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKfupO4ZzPs
unfortunately you are probably right. the full scope of all the hidden fees taxes etc will deal a crushing blow to those valuing traditional definitions of what constitutes is necessary in life--you know... the lexus, the bmw, the jag, land rover, etc. ; the country club; the private school for chip and bitsy.
i believe martin armstrong had a piece recently that revealed not only will you pay increased health insurance premiums, but you will also be taxed on the contribution assisting you which is made by your employer.
what a clusterfuck
You assume that middle class Americans are going to pay them willingly.
Down-arrowed because it's no more than a distraction. It's like pointing at someone lighting up a cigarette in a burning building and screaming that they're going to burn everyone to death! Yeah, it most certainly can add to the situation, but the building was on fire a LONG time ago.
I'l grant you that Obamacare promotes arson. Fire, however, exists, and perhaps we would be better off admitting that we're trying to save a house of cards: having systems predicated on perpetual growth on a finite planet is NEVER going to end well.
US sheeple need more unregulated markets!
More free trade!
Lower taxes for the multinationals and the rich!
The market solves everything!
What is good for the economy, is good for the people!
[/sarc]
Believe strongly in the Republocrats false propaganda, that Obama or Bush or any other president from the two party system would matter.
Incredible how easy it is, to control you, sheeple.
Lots of down-arrows, lots of unicorn-believers...
People just refuse to understand the TRUE fundamentals. It's about resources! Give me your perfect "economic system" and if it's aim is to generate growth then it WILL FAIL! (only those believing in unicorns and a flat earth believe otherwise- finite planet, deal with it).
That ol' giant sucking sound after all
Yeah, because we KNOW that Nixon's taking the USD off of the gold standard was such a brilliant move!
Ignorant Paaarty Pussy!
BTW - Here's the peak, where we can trace the start of the decline (which was inevitible anyway) all from that magical year 1971:
1) USD dropped gold-backing;
2) US oil production peaked (US to become net importer of oil);
3) Trade relations with China opened up.
Yeah, Obama... (I did not, nor ever would vote for him, but that's not the point- the point is about identifying the factual reasons for why we're where we are, well, except if one is more interested in spouting off Party Pussty shit: I could probably make a post stating that Obama and the anit-Obama folks are ALL idiots and it would probably cause the lot of you to fry your brains trying to figure out whether to up-vote or down-vote)
+1. That was the moment Bretton Woods began to roll over. Ever since has been a steady transition away from organic growth towards leverage (synthetic growth... paper growth).
Nate at the now shut down Nathan's Economic Edge had created a chart once that displayed the phase transition point at which "debt saturation" occurred. Wherein any further leverage results in negative growth. While I can't really confirm his crossover point because it is sensitive to baseline assumptions, I have no doubt that somewhere in the 2000's was that crossover... explaining why "bubblenomics" is the flavor now. They really are trying desperately to shock the economy back to life.. trying to jump to some new steady-state of normalcy. Sadly, it is toast. So, we are in a Bernie's Weekend sort of existance now.
Of course, moral hazard went out the window along with everything else. So, we now have an outright free for all. Ironic that while some desperately try to hold onto power... trying to keep the system running (centralization resulting), we have all sorts of asshats destabalizing it for massive personal gain. Add in all the geopolitics... naturally over resources and dollar hegemony, etc. and what results is a massive clusterfuck just waiting to explode.
centerline
And the Theory of fiat currency in the "modern" world does make sense; that limiting economic growth to the growth in gold production constrains the economy.
But once the seed of "money creation" morphs falsely into "wealth creation" then the economic wheels start to slip. When central banks gift newly created money to their friends and their friends front-run the general public during the initial buying spree, they and the media try to pawn stock/bond price rises as actual economic growth. Nothing could be further from the truth.
But truth is the first casualty.
We have now dug such a rut
"And the Theory of fiat currency in the "modern" world does make sense; that limiting economic growth to the growth in gold production constrains the economy."
At most the mapping of currency to a physical item such as gold can only DELAY the inevitible. All physical items representing wealth will be under pressure for mining/extraction/harvesting etc.. And coupled with "interest" (which I have nothing against the intent of it- to promote prudence in the use of capital) GROWTH is necessary. Unless we figure out how to make earth's resources infinite (which would kind of break the whole scarcity constraints on currencies) growth is going to stop.
I don't have so much a problem with us admitting that all we know to do is to re-rack the same game. My ISSUE is that we continue to pretend that there's a way of re-racking that doesn't contain the flaws of the game (most delude themselves that that's the case by not acknowledging the growth problem).
Seeing that others actually "get it" takes a lot of frustration off. I'm all about seeking "solutions," but, we have to be careful that we actually know what the problem is FIRST!
TPTB aren't in any position that we ought to envy. They've got a lot farther to fall; and, they're pretty much marked: I won't shed a tear if/when they become target practice, but such action will NOT rectify our PROBLEM.
As expected, progs always tiptoe past this one, and once they're onto to those broad, sunlit, uplands of their bogeymen, never fail to spout "It's the supply side, it's the supply side!"
It gets even more depressing:
Canada rates in the Top 5 for Education in the world, and its education system or health system won't bankrupt you.
Alas, they suck as the World's Police or as hostage targets.
Much of their infrastructure is supported by wealthy Chinese/Asians.
In Vancouver the cracks have been forming. Their public transportation (which is really good) is under constant strain: the stupid Olympics didn't help their financial situation- every time I see one of those stupid license plates I want to rip if off the vehicle it's attached to!).
As China's economy starts really tanking there will be a big sucking sound. This despite all the stories of the wealthy looking to get their money out of China: far more will retract their tentacles; consider how things will go as the China+Russia connection strengthens, most of the West will have established a big demonization of the Chineses, so much so that they'll beg to face The Party rather than the worked-up (propagandized) populations in the West.
That's how I See it...
"another Obama sucess story...."
Uh.....dickhead (oklaboy).....who was in power right as the Dot Coms rolled over ? Who was in charge during 9-11 ? Who told everyone to go shopping to support the war on terror and to buy as many houses as they could ? Who approved and signed TARP ?
George W. Bush.
Obammy just inherited this shit pie from Shrub. But yes.....Obammy hasn't done a damn thing but made it worse. Not by more socialism.....but through fascism and the continuation of sucking bankster cock.
And there was George H.W. "there will be a new world oder" Bush.
Of all the recent POTUSes it is H.W. that actually was always plugged into it. TPTB, however, couldn't afford to assume that they could land such folks anymore so they started to pick folks who could just act the part. Not saying that any of them are innocent victims, but one should consider that it's more than just a possibility that TPTB have some pretty good "photos" by which to change the "mind" of POTUS.
Here is a success story, 17 year old girl dumps insecticide into grandma's food because granny took her cell phone away. Do you think this will be recognized as a sign that she is too dumb to live? That this is just nature at work leaving clues that the gene pool needs cleaning. Nah, consequences are now considered old fashioned. They only apply in the real world, which is no longer this world.
http://www.oregonlive.com/today/index.ssf/2014/04/north_carolina_teen_tr...
Canada ain't no Shangri-La. Importing wealthy Chinese, Indians, and Iranians and calling them the new Canadian middle class isn't really an accurate depiction of what the typical Canadian wage-earner earns. Plus the oil patch has skewed the wage average considerably. I see these guys in Vegas all the time. They burn $1000 at the pool buying jello shots and yelling drunkenly about how awesome it is to make so much money turning a wrench in Fort Mac.
So 5,000 hosers from Ft. McMurray are able to skew the socio-economic demographics of a 33 million person population??
BTW, remind us just how many Asians have emigrated to Canada?
Not sure what you are complaining about. Yes, when the working class earns a lot of money, they have fun the way the working class does. Jello shots don't worry me as much as meth at a drilling site or in a SAGD boiler room.
As for non-whites earning lots of money and getting permanent residence status, my experience in many of these sectors is that the foreign workers use less drugs and are more likely to be married and stable than the Canadians who move from other parts of the country, expecting to earn twenty bucks an hour to work at 7-11.
Salaries of engineers in Alberta are great, and lots of great on the job training is available. That said, the most troubling is the town (Ft Mac, but also Edmonton and Calgary see it) has too many hookers, too much drugs, and needs more people ready to start lives and families there. My experience is the asian immigrants are more likely to do this. Flame away if you disagree, but I don't care what somebody looks like as long as they work hard.
I agree with you completely. I am just stating that there have been massive influxes of capital from other nations that have boosted the average income in Canada. If things go south, a lot of this capital will flow back out and take the middle-class with it. That's all I'm saying. I have no problem with immigration. After all, Canada, the USA, and the rest of the western world have aborted an entire generation of people that need to be replaced.
Capital and income are NOT the same thing. How does some guy coming from India with $1million in capital (doesn't happen that often - more likely, it's the one Indian engineer working here bringing over his mom and dad under 'family reunification') skew average income? it ain't from interest income, that's for sure, since thanks to ZIRP, $3 million brings in little more than average earned income.
I think you're ruining the narrative that Canadians of "proper DNA" - and by inference, Mericans of "proper DNA lineage" - are morally superior. If that assumption isn't true, it might cause some confusion down here about what will happen after the "great reset".
The first thing to happen after the great reset will be: ethnic cleansing.
When tallying up your rounds,
be sure you have enough to cleanse the area in which you plan to live in
after the great reset.
Ethics cleansing is what is needed in Washington DC and Wall Street, no matter the ethnicity. (never gonna happen)
it knows no color or creed or status or need. crime is such a beautiful thing
Word.
The first thing to happen after the great reset will be: ethnic cleansing.
Projecting a bit?
Ethnic hatreds ain't what they used to be.
"my experience in many of these sectors is that the foreign workers use less drugs and are more likely to be married and stable than the Canadians"
I don't bash Canada (though I will speak only of what I know to be true of it), it is where my wife came from after having arrived from the Philippines: she also became a Canadian citizen. I am eternally grateful to Canada for giving her the opportinty: she's the most awesome person I've ever met (and I'm married to her, and living with her too!).
"I don't care what somebody looks like as long as they work hard."
There are two kinds of people: 1) good people; 2) assholes. I don't trust assholes (they've got ego issues and are overly-deceptive, most likely trying to cover up their insecurities).
They are also far more likely to be statists who want to tell YOU what to do...not so much themselves.
"They are also far more likely to be statists who want to tell YOU what to do...not so much themselves."
You're confusing the horse with the cart.
I do NOT promote statism, or govt at all, because I see it as being a target for the power-hungry. I'm smart enough, I think, to recognize that removing govt won't make power-hungry people disappear: it will only make them less able to do widespread damage.
Nearly all Canadian immigrants arrive with little more than enough wealth to buy a used car and make first and last month's rent on an appartment rental. Including the Chinese, Iranians, and Indians.
And a lot of the Brits.....
I speak from personal experience.
Never had to rely on gov to make a living though.
Adrenaline has a point. Last time I visited Vancouver it looked like Kabul or Bombay on the pacific. Very 'diverse.' Lots of delicious restaurants, however.
And there's the "C" word:
Canada’s Tidal Wave of Credit mises.ca/posts/articles/canadas-tidal-wave-of-credit/US median household income is $55K, 75% of americans make less than $85K. W/o wage inflation no recovery. Obooger is keeping his promise. US media public enemy #1.
Income is just half of the story. After income comes outrageous expenditures on taxes, licenses, fees, tuition, medical, and all manner of government imposed expenses. What's left is not good. Many people who earn $75K live like paupers.
"Many people who earn $75K live like paupers."
My wife would laugh at that statement. She's from the Philippines: yeah, I keep dragging her into these discussions, and anyone who has ever met her KNOWS exactly why this would make sense- she's the antithesis of "entitled" (the very word isn't in her dictionary). There are 750 MILLION people in India living on $0.50/day! Something like 2/3 of the worlds' population (that's over 6.5 BILLION people) live on $3/day or less.
Remove all the taxes. Remove all the govts (yeah!). We STILL have 7+ billion people all on a planet that's rapidly depleting the very resoruces that it relies on. Perhaps things could be a bit better, but only for a while, until our perpetual quest for growth shoves us back up against the wall.
Good point.. I believe that at some point, the earth will burp, and several humdred million will be simply washed away. Mayhem will ensue, wiping out many millions more, and earth will have righted its own ship. Unfortunately, we've all but eliminated natural selection from the process, so the many of the strong won't survive, and many of the weak will. I just hope the righting of the ship begins in the center of downtown DC.
I don't cheer for any outcome. Things will be what they will be, and I believe that our fates are little different than all other lifeforms on this planet, many of which are certain to outlive our stay. I figure that the next glacial period, which WILL come, is going to have quite the corrective influence. It's a physical world, we've only briefly defied it by promoting the virtual (weak) over the real (physically able to adapt). NOTE: I don't speak these things knowing that I'm physically superior, I'm pretty good, I am pretty sure that nature isn't eyeing my genes... not going to live forever, but not going to look for an early exit either.
Obooger is clone to Oboosher, clone to OClintooter, clone to Oboosher Snr, clone to Ronnie the genitor...there, time line now clear as crystal.
All pushers of the System.... the System that's predicated on a false premise (perpetual growth on a finite planet). Our "leaders" are no more than tour guides on a train whose tracks have always led to the edge of the cliff- at best one could only think that there might be a brake handle (if old "Charlie" didn't steal it).
All I have heard for the past 20 years is that we need to get poorer so the Chinese, Indians and Vietnamese can climb out of poverty. Competition and shit like that. Why is the United States the only one to get this message? Hmmmmmm. And there is that thing about our rich being wealthier than anytime in human history. Could the 2 be related? And just to clarify. I'm not jealous of the ultra rich; I'm furious. There is a big difference!
Why do you hate Merica so much?
Because it sucks,
Naaa, if you're a member of the top 25% (or so) it's the best place on the planet.
If you're one of "those people" in the Trash Class, infested with the losers, lazy, and malcontents - who hate Merica, and the troops - then it's not great but that's a motivation for you to become a member of the top 25%; and it's motivation like that which makes Merican the greatest place on earth. See?
The 1% aren't really wealthy, all they have is money.
25%? Pfft!
http://www.gizmag.com/go/6571/
Raise your hand if you're in the top 10% (my hand is raised, though it falls long before the 1%).
Seer, are you saying $61k in assets as net worth? Let's see...if I sold my kids I might come close! Anyone in the market for some college going males? Cheap! (They do eat alot).
I believe that that is how the report is stating it.
Again, when you've been to the places that I've been and when you've been exposed to someone who KNOWS what "poor" is (though has an indestructable smile) you gain an appreciation of what it means to have the true fundamentals of Food+Shelter+Water covered/addressed, and that excess above this brings a cost (constant inventorying, safeguarding etc.), one that one must be prepared to defend (and should, pardon the harshness here, STFU about it).
I'm only in that 10% because I spent MANY years w/o credit cards, w/o vacations, w/o all the "latest" trinkets, w/o buying any new vehicles, and, well, w/o kids (my fears that my ex would be a shitty mother were pretty much proven; had I met my current wife this would have been different, and her having ready-made kids kind of fills the vaccum- I do a LOT of thinking, and I look to make the best of what is made available).
I hope that your kids are learning useful stuff. If I'd have had any ability to influence I'd have pushed farming/ranching: Food, Shelter and Water); I'm a shitty carpenter; no idea how to produce revenue via water (though I've learned a LOT about it); so, that left me with Food). Eventually both the cows and kids return to the barn(s)...
Don't hate the country. Hate the REGIME.
Big difference. And that should be obvious, I think.
+10. If a nuke went off in DC during the State of the Union, I would go out and buy everyone a drink to celebrate. FUCK DC.
Why spend precious energy and time hating?
Create the life you want (and stop trying to control that which is outside your power to control). What matters is the land, always has been the case, always WILL be the case: this is why I'll stay put- plenty of water; nice views; able to produce food. "Regimes" and whatnot come and go. Survival is always about having a better system- create your own better system.
Totally predictable. Make China a most-favored nation trading partner, and outsource all manufacturing, the engine that drives real wealth; and what have you got left?
Fries with that?
We're number #2 .... we're #2 ....we're #2
+ we are #1 in the #2 business
I saw a realtors ad that claimed she was #1 in no #1 claims.
That's a sh*tty old plumber's joke.
What middle class?
Nothing their RE bubble popping won't rectify.
That changes wealth, not income.
This is 9-to-5 stuff, and a whole lot of people are swiping EBT cards 9-to-5 these days instead of time cards.
Not so sure about that.A lot of their income is related to that bubble, directly or indirectly.
Their FIRE sector is huge as well.
Yes! WAY too many people think that they're "productive." Never a realization that on the other side of that coin is "destructive." At the core of everything there is minining/extraction/harvesting of PHYSICAL resources. We've deluded ourselves into thinking that we're "adding," when in reality we're subtracting. Even as a farmer I realize that it's ultimately a negative: I, however, carry on under the belief that I'm helping tread water until folks are better able to figure things out (though I have my doubts that people could even attain some level of awareness necessary, should it even be physically possible).
Bottom line: growth is a bubble. Ouch!
i found this latest article on reuters and find it kind of disturbing
New report calls U.S. a 'rising star' of global manufacturinganyway, here is a quote from it
"Also contributing to the country's attractiveness, according to BCG, is "stable wage growth" - a euphemism for the fact that, in inflation-adjusted terms, industrial wages here are lower today than they were in the 1960s even though worker productivity has doubled over the same period of time."
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/04/25/us-usa-manufacturers-costs-idU...
Well, come on, in the 60's the Trash Class was unionized. Now they know their proper place and harbor no resentment that the benefits of their productivity improvements have gone to the Job Creator Class. How ELSE would our nation prosper?
Now that was truly snark-tastic....
I agree; not sure who loaded him with down arrows. Maybe the Walton family parasites woke up early and logged onto the 'hedge?
they should console themselves with a Hollande sport : petanque.
Got to have balls of steel to play that....
Just another pinko hippy who hates everything Merica stands for, and the troops.
Which NATION has the best slow-motion eagles and flags? THAT's not shown in any of these graphs.
And nobody, Nooobody has those patriotic halftime bomber flyovers like the good ol' US of A.
Bomber flyovers?!? Where do you go to football games?
it's always fighters.
Depends on whether there's an airbase near one's stadium :-)
I've got fucking fighters buzzing around my countryside quite often. Because of their noise it gives me a chance to practice my hand-signing.
didn't they do some B2 bomber flyovers? duckduckgo search brings up a lot of them // b2 bomber football flyover
Man I love those flyovers! I always imagine those bomb bay doors opening and disgorging beautiful black eggs over populations of browns and yellows, bringing them Fleedom and Demonocracy one beautiful orange-red blossom at a time.
America, Fuck Yeah!
Rubbish. The only Canadians whose incomes have been rising are the dumb overpaid grunts in oil, gas, fishing and forestry who are protected from competition by government, by union "recognition" laws and by their employers' government-granted monopoly access to "public" natural resources.
All you have to do is look who is doing the spending: on $50,000 F-350 pickups, boats, RVs, trophy wives, half-million dollar mortgages, granite countertops and NFLX subscriptions, cell phones for whole family, etc., etc....
The rest? Benefitting from a vast socialist entitlement system. Must be similar to Norway.
"Rubbish" accurately describes your opinin of Canada. How, exactly, is an oil patch worker 'protected' by government? And I have friends who've done that job - it's dirty, dangerous, and difficult. I'll bet you couldn't last an hour. And what is this 'government-granted monopoly access' that you speak of? Do you mean, for example, drilling rights, which are auctioned off to the highest bidder, and only for Crown land? What is your proposed solution: let anyone with a drilling rig set up wherever he wants; let no one drill on public lands; have the government run the show (shudder!)?
As for the 'vast socialist entitlement system' - yes, we have publicly funded healthcare (and it has serious problems, no question!) like dozens of countries. We have a pension system that's considerably more sound than Social Security, and which our government has made moves to strengthen (like raising the eventual age to claim full benefits to 67 from 65, taking back universal benefits from people over certain income thresholds, increasing contribution amounts, etc.). An able-bodied man in Ontario can get welfare if he can't find work - $600/month. That buys a lot of F-350's and granite countertops.
Have you ever even set foot in the country, or do you just pull your opinions out of your ass?
Nice avatar, though. Leni Reifenstahl as a teenage?
It's unskilled grunt labour. They're overpaid. There are thousands of young men (NOT me, I'm in my fifties) who would do that work for half the salary/benefits/pension...IF the resources and work were shared more equitably they could. And if it weren't for the fact that the governments grant public resources to favoured (always BIG) corporations, the public might get some return from those resources.
YES, let "anyone with a drilling rig" have a shot!
You don't know shit. Let's see you out on a rig in -20 weather, trying to get a bit changed while the foreman is shouting, the wind is blowing, and the snow's in your eyes. Oh, ya, 'unskilled'. You wouldn't last a minute, and neither would a lot of uneducated young oafs who go out West with $ signs in their eyes, and then come home a week later with their tails between their legs.
Where is your source - note, not 'proof', because you can't prove a fantasy - "And if it weren't for the fact that the governments grant public resources to favoured (always BIG) corporations, the public might get some return from those resources." There are hundreds of Cdn. juniors in virtually every resource field who raise a few bucks, and dig a mine/drill a hole; if they strike gold (yellow or black), they get bought out by the seniors. And clearly, you're unaware that billions of dollars in royalties flow back to the provincial governments, who (Saskatchewan is a noted and recent exception) turn around and spend every penny and then some.
Finally, what's the problem with people earning higher wages? "There's thousands of young men would do that work for half the salary" - so what? On the one hand, you're screaming about income inequality and on the other, you complain about people - who are actually doing work, mind you, not rentiers like Blankfein or Dimon - making a few more bucks about average.
Crawl back into your hole. You don't know a damn thing about Canada. You've never set foot in the place and haven't a freakin' clue what you're talking about.
And... it isn't going to last.
Yes, grunts work hard. I know it all too well: I'm a grunt- try the very same things, only earn FAR LESS- ah, the life of a farmer...
NOTE: I"ve stepped foot in Canada, MANY times, without you looking... (hauled my wife out of there)
NOTE2: Keep on keeping on; I need cheaper fuel to get a bunch of work done before TSHTF (make sure you're prepared!).
Yeah, you're actually pretty much right on. And, as much as people would think that the oil, mining and forestry industries are the top getters, they're not. I believe it's finance: and, last I'd checked, automotive. Yeah, I scratched my head too...
"$50,000 F-350 pickups"
I bet I've got just as many running around in my area (that and Dodge/Cumins rigs). And I was worried about shelling out $2,500 for my truck...
You're completely forgetting about the Canadian real estate sector. Canada has a gigantic housing bubble. People who earn their living from this sector, or in the case of real estate agents leech their living, are raking in the dough. A significant chunk of Cdn GDP is from construction/real estate right now and no doubt it's a key contributor to the boost our middle class has seen.
<RANT>Who the fuck in their right mind would want to live here in Canada? 13% sales tax (some places more, some less). Close to 50% income tax in the top bracket. Dreadful weather 6 to 8 months of the year. Garbage healthcare, my last time in an emergency room took 6 hours in the waiting room which was full of street bums trying to score some free meds (I saw the staff dole them out too, all on the taxpayer dime). I wound up having to drive myself to the U.S. to pay for a MRI as I didn't want to wait the 6 months it would take to get for free. In the case of at least Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver the traffic here makes LA's highways look good (at least it's sunny in LA).</RANT>
Yet there are fools buying up the condo's here as fast as they can build them. Within 200 meters of where I live in Toronto there are 5 high rise towers being built with cranes up and another 6 on the way within the year. I counted 16 cranes within view last summer from my balcony (that's the last time I've been on my balcony, thanks to our 8 month winters). I was in Miami in 2007 during the bubble there and things here now are at least as bad. Big difference between Toronto and Miami is people around the world actually WANT to live in Miami.
"Who the fuck in their right mind would want to live here in Canada?"
Well, when one thinks that it couldn't get any worse it's almost always the case that it CAN. And if one think that there's no worse place it's most likely the case that there IS.
Would you trade Canda for this:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/thehousekeeper/4656435881/in/set-721576240...
I believe that this was taken in the general area where my wife is from (though she and her family weren't dump-dwellers, and in comparsion could be thought of being "well off" [not really hard to do compared to this, even if one doesn't have electricity or toilet paper when growing up]).
I'd like to know if that second graph is adjusted for inflation, CPI or actual, or not at all.
"They burn $1000 at the pool buying jello shots and yelling drunkenly about how awesome it is to make so much money turning a wrench in Fort Mac."
I've been to Fort Mac. You don't want to go there. Think of a town that is 99% men. We seriously need to make a drug that turns people gay. Filling that place with gay relationships would probably cut down on the lonely douchebag factor. It might also solve the housing shortage because then you can put 2 men per bed instead of just 1. Did I mention that place is full of douchebags?
...or you could just move a bunch of women there, like has happened in every oil boom town (usually hookers and strippers).
Up-vote because it was funny (to me)- thanks!
"BTW, remind us just how many Asians have emigrated to Canada?"
You can't seriously be this lazy.
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=population+of+vancouver
I clicked my own link and I'm actually surprised by the answer. I thought it was at least a million.
They don't call it Hongkouver for nothing.
I'm not clear on what you're trying to say. Perhaps you could add italics?
Not sure why you think the population of Vancouver tells you the number of Asian immigrants....
But whatever...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_to_Canada
I clicked on the link. 5th story down from top... too funny.
Mayor Gregor Robertson’s promise to end “street homelessness” by 2015 appears to be in jeopardy with data released Wednesday showing Vancouver now has the largest homeless population in the city’s history.
As David and David once sang, "Welcome to the boomtown."
Great song!
I'm thinking that "Boom" needs to be replaced by "Bubble."
I remember stories of homeless heroin addicts getting run over in the streets of East Van....
When I lived there for ~4 years in the early '90s a place called No. 5 Orange was a notorious peeler bar...
Money printing disproportionately hurts the middle class. This is simply recognition of that historical fact.
Money-printing is the method by which resource scarcity is hidden. Resource scarcity causing collapses IS the rule (by which all other "facts" come from).
Globalization driven by American's political elite. American workers, pair of hands, are just a commodity competing with the world. Soon, all will equalize.
With housing prices now declining pretty much across Canada in the past year, I wouldn't expect Canada to remain on-top for long. Although the US probably will continue to weaken, so maybe Canada will be on top even as deflation of the housing bubble accelerates.
'housing prices declining across Canada last year'
Whachoo talkin' 'bout, Willis? "From a year earlier, prices were up 4.6%, a slowing from February’s 5.0% price gain. It was the first time in nine months that 12-month inflation has slowed." - National Post, April 21, 2014 Are you one of those people who counts a slowdown in growth rate as a 'decline'? Like the people who accused Mike Harris of 'slashing health care spending', when it went up every year he was in office? Or the people who accuse Harper of 'slashing social/arts funding', when again, it's gone up every year he's been PM?
Nope. What's happened is that the RE agents are selling at a higher priced segment of the market, rather than the average house price having gone up. The average house has actually declined in Canada.
I think that China's slowing down will have a huge impact on Canada. Some suggest that it'll be felt through declines in global commodities, but I think that it'll be the rich Chinese no longer being able to offshore their children to Canadian schools that'll light the fuse. The vacancies in the rental markets will increase, which then puts pressure on the entire RE market (and we know that RE in Canada, as it is in nearly all other countries, is a huge component of the economy. Canada's RE is scarily ARM-d. And mortgage loans, unlike in the US, are full recourse.
Just some things to add to the mix...
What counts as middle class? I know an individual in a small city who makes $30k and a family of four in a below average suburb who makes just under $100k and I would not consider either one middle class. I don't know their full financial situations but it seems like over 90% of their paychecks are claimed by basic expenses before they even get the check in their hands.
As a quick off the cuff definition, I think middle class would allow a family of 4 to have a fairly comfortable life with 2-3 "real" vacations per year (like Disneyworld) without having to put a dent into savings. No real money struggles, all their needs met with some toys and moderate (a couple years) savings.