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Guest Post: Gun Control In Nazi Germany

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Submitted by Audrey Kline via the Ludwig von Mises Institute,

There is no shortage of theories or writings related to the rise of the Third Reich and the subsequent Holocaust. Stephen Halbrook’s 2013 book, Gun Control in the Third Reich offers a compelling and important account of the role of gun prohibition in aiding Hitler’s goals of exterminating the Jews and other “enemies of the state.” While much of the early gun prohibition was created with supposedly good intent, Halbrook carefully and meticulously details how a change in political regime facilitated manipulating some well-intentioned gun registration laws and other gun prohibition to be used in inconceivable ways.

Students of history as well as Second Amendment enthusiasts will find this a fascinating book and will find parallels between gun prohibition in pre-Nazi and Nazi Germany, and attempts to prohibit types of gun ownership and implement other forms of gun prohibition in the United States today. The current climate in the United States surrounding gun prohibition combined with a president who uses his office to impose executive order in ways not historically common gives many citizens pause, especially when looking at the era of the Third Reich. While certain states have imposed gun registration laws recently, enforcement of the laws remains unclear.

While Halbrook is careful to point out that a combination of factors led to the events of the Holocaust, there is no denying that many of the pre-war activities contributed to Hitler’s ability to disarm targeted groups, particularly the Jews. The rapid pace with which Hitler disarmed the populace in Germany is startling. Halbrook’s account is gripping, thorough, and full of legal documentation, leading the reader through the sometimes-daily changes in gun prohibitions that furthered Hitler’s agenda. Ultimately, the prohibitions enacted by the Nazi regime led to monopoly control of firearms by the Nazis and eliminated the ability of many groups in society to defend themselves. A similar progression in contemporary society related to government control of firearms and the firearms industry is a concern of many gun owners in the United States today.

In Part I of the book, a chaotic post-WWI Germany is the backdrop, a time when there were no established policies or laws pertaining to firearm ownership. Concern about firearms not being turned in after the war and conflict between extremist groups and the government led to the implementation of gun control laws. However, well-meaning clauses in the laws were subsequently used to provide the government with complete control over gun ownership, creating registries of gun and ammunition ownership, which ultimately fell into the hands of the Nazis. These lists were methodically used to disarm citizens. Through the first three chapters of the book, Halbrook does a masterful job of detailing the ever-changing gun control policies, ranging from the most extreme (execution on the spot) to the postured ‘relaxation’ of gun control laws that allowed possession of very expensive long arms that would not be affordable for the majority of the population.

Part II of the book opens with the naming of Hitler as chancellor of Germany at the end of January 1933, and the immediate utilization of the Weimar gun control policies to begin the Nazi campaign to seize arms and eradicate the so-called “enemies of the state” (all of whom were tagged as Communists). As a result, less than a month later, Hitler and Göring convinced President Hindenburg that an emergency decree was needed, which ultimately gave the Nazis the ability to eliminate constitutional assurances of liberty and free speech, a free press, the ability to assemble, and the right to privacy in personal communications. Furthermore, search and seizure of homes was authorized. This carte blanche for search and seizure essentially became the modus operandi of the Third Reich.

By the end of March, Hitler had succeeded in passing the “Enabling Law” which gave him the ability to create laws as he wished, with no requirement for consultation. Following this, the confiscation of weapons escalated. Municipal governments were informed that military weapons and ammunition had to be surrendered by the end of March. The Jews were targeted next, with a large raid in East Berlin on April 4, 1933. Jews were not forbidden to own firearms until 1938, but the raid led to confiscations and arrests. The 1928 Firearms Law was utilized to identify the so-called enemies of the state, locate them, interview them, and subsequently confiscate their weapons, thereby increasing Nazi control and eliminating private ownership of firearms from the majority of society.

Part III of the book details episodes of enforcement and expansion of gun prohibition by Hitler’s regime. To mark the one-year anniversary of Hitler’s power, the Law for the Reconstruction of the Reich was passed in January 1934, which centralized control over police and led to the replacement of the SA (Sturm Abteilung or Brownshirts) with the SS. Upon President Hindenburg’s death, Hitler assumed the presidency as well, allowing him the ability to rule by decree. Hitler could now declare laws at will and there was no right of appeal for those arrested. The military pledged allegiance to Hitler and the citizenry was instructed to follow Hitler’s decrees.

Confiscated firearms were redistributed to the police and concentration camp guards. The number of searches and arrests continued to escalate, and with the adoption of the Nürnberg Laws in September 1935, Germans or those with ‘kindred blood’ were decreed as citizens, leaving the Jews without citizenship and consequently, without civil rights. A new weapons law was drafted in November that would also forbid Jews from operating in the firearms industry. Though not yet enacted, the draft opened the door for the stealing of the gun manufacturing company, Simson & Co., by Hitler, who claimed that the Jewish owners were guilty of fraud. Additional accounts are given of exploitation of various incidents to further the Nazi campaign against the Jews.

Nazi Party control of the use and ownership of firearms was quickly implemented and far-reaching, with refinements to the Weapons Law continuing over the next few years. Eventually, in April 1938, Jews were required to register their personal assets if valued at over 5,000 marks. Just a few months later, Jews were required to register at local police stations to receive identification cards. Jews began to flee Berlin and other parts of Germany, as they were able.

In the concluding section of the book, Reichskristallnacht (Night of the Broken Glass) is detailed. Jews had been systematically disarmed, and their identity and locations were now on file with local police. It was simply a matter of time before the full shift into deportation and extermination of the Jews would begin. Records support that a campaign to arrest legally registered Jewish owners of firearms was now underway, along with the push by the Nazis to pressure Jews to flee Germany.

The complete confiscation of weapons held by Jews at this point was sparked by the November 7, 1938 assassination attempt of a German diplomat, supposedly by a Polish-Jewish teenager at the embassy in Paris. The Night of the Broken Glass came in the following few days. All Jewish weapons (including such things as letter openers) were confiscated, and all Jewish organizations were deemed illegal. With the Jews disarmed, Hitler’s plans could proceed with a defenseless populace. The majority of the non-Jewish German population was stunned by what had transpired but too afraid to protest. Isolated cases of resistance remained, such as the now well-known case of Oskar Schindler. When deportations commenced in October 1941, the possessions of the Jews were searched by the Gestapo for anything of value, and completed the disarming of the Jews. The dangers of silent witness are now well known.

As has been well documented, Jews were methodically attacked, their homes, businesses, and synagogues ransacked and burned. Upward of 30,000 Jews were arrested. Any Jews resisting arrest were ordered shot on the spot. Attacks on the Jews were to be carried out by the SA, with no interference by police. Jews arrested were to be sent to concentration camps for up to 20 years. The pogrom was so thorough that nearly all age appropriate, Jewish adult males in Stuttgart had been arrested. With the population afraid and disarmed, Hitler could proceed with little worry about resistance. The Court reinforced that there was no judicial review needed for activities of the Gestapo.

Halbrook concludes by noting that less government regulation and a tradition of rejecting tyranny could have led to a different outcome in Germany. Instead, systematic creation and manipulation of firearms registration and regulations, coupled with the decimation of individual citizen’s rights, enabled Hitler’s dictatorship and the slaughter of millions of innocent Jews and citizens of Nazi-occupied countries, as well as tens of thousands of Germans. It remains for all of us to wonder what might have been had people refused to register their firearms. Indeed, we should all take note and never forget.

 

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Mon, 05/12/2014 - 21:26 | 4753073 stinkhammer
stinkhammer's picture

this is my rifle. there are many like it, but this one is mine

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 21:35 | 4753090 TeamDepends
TeamDepends's picture

And there is only one reason why someone would want to take it.

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 21:39 | 4753122 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Scheiss!  I lost mine, unless it's still under the bed.

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 21:59 | 4753175 TungstenBars
TungstenBars's picture

Still a pretty shallow article tho. Germans of that era loved the nazis. The nazis did wonders for them apart from losing the war. It's not like gun control made a difference they would never fight against a system that let them regain self respect as a country. 

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 22:07 | 4753201 BobPaulson
BobPaulson's picture

The fault of logic is that the US has the most lax gun laws of developed world. I think their nazi tendencies are more due to grasping to stop the decline in global hegemony. (btw, I am a gun owner so don't flame me).

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 22:21 | 4753242 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

Regulation
Registration
Confiscation
Liquidation

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 22:25 | 4753256 Mistress Raindrop
Mistress Raindrop's picture

My father used to own a Bazooka.  He got drunk and used it to kill a rabbit.  The police sent him to jail. Bitches.

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 22:40 | 4753310 sodbuster
sodbuster's picture

My father in law lived in Holland when the Nazis came. They made everyone register their guns, but also their radios. When everyone had done so, they came around and picked them all up. (They didn't want anyone listening to the BBC) He was staying by an Uncle when the invasion came. He wasn't allowed home until after the war. His uncle wrapped up his rifle and buried it in the garden. Guns and radios- now it's guns and control the Internet and media. Scarey how it's the same tactics.

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 23:23 | 4753434 Seize Mars
Seize Mars's picture

sodbuster

Of course it's the same. It's always the same.

Paper Money--> Bubble--> Recession--> Stimulus--> Inflation--> Price Controls--> Shortages--> Riots--> Troops on Your Streets

Mass murder is harder to do when everyone is able to defend themselves, man by man, house by house.

And it's always about mass murder.

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 23:56 | 4753556 fonestar
fonestar's picture

They are not going to get control of the internet.  They are failing.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 09:44 | 4754363 fonestar
fonestar's picture

Can't stand the perfectly obvious, hey pussies?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 09:57 | 4754453 DutchR
DutchR's picture

I hope to never have to page Richard C. Carrington.

 

May the bitcoin fall where they may

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 09:58 | 4754454 DutchR
DutchR's picture

dup

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 07:46 | 4753978 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Because it is always the same people in charge. Politicians are convenient facades erected by the true rulers. They know what works and what to control and when. The problem is not guns nor will guns solve it. It is particpation and acceptance. You cannot rule people whom refuse to acknowlege your right to rule. 

The right to rule is every individual's and his alone. If you give someone your proxy, don't be surprised when it is used against you.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:00 | 4755724 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

clever book report relating a certain narrative while simultaneously invoking the "gun control" fears.

very very clever, Ms. Kline.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:16 | 4756481 Monty Burns
Monty Burns's picture

Well spotted! Very clever, Mr. Aura.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:55 | 4757083 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

not a missed-er, but thanks for acknowledging my species inherent acute sense of smelly. . .

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 03:12 | 4753785 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

How lax the gun control laws are is largely dependent on what state you are in.  I can walk into my state's capital building with a rifle locked and loaded slung over my shoulder.  Try that in NY.  Then again, there is the 1934 NFA and the little clause in the 1986 firearm owner's protection act.

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 22:37 | 4753294 DocinPA
DocinPA's picture

It's reasonably accurate.  This is probably a more authoritative treatise, though:

http://www.stephenhalbrook.com/article-nazilaw.pdf

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 23:30 | 4753461 BustainMovealota
BustainMovealota's picture

Not realy,  In fact Hitler lost the first election because the Germans thought he was way too radical (which he was of course).  Then came the Reichtag fire which Hitler blamed on terrorist, most likely a false flag event but never proven.  Hitler promised to protect the German people from these "terriost".   Germans were scared and they bought what Hitler was selling.  Any of this sound familar to whats happening today in the US??   Study a little history,,  you will see other interesting parallels.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 03:17 | 4753788 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

Don't forget that Hitler predicted that relying on borrowing from the US would end in a bad way before 1929, and it did, in fact, end in a bad way.  Germany wasn't an angel by any means, but the treaty of Versailles, coupled with some serious economic bullshit on multiple occasions made it quite a bit easier for Hitler. 

 

Know yourself, know what you stand for and be ready to defend it, whether that defense be verbal or through violence, for we are approaching times when we will be susceptible to a similar dictatorship.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 00:32 | 4753617 Antifaschistische
Antifaschistische's picture

I agree...sort of a shallow article because it only goes 1/3 way.  I don't know how many guns the Jews in Germany had at that point.   The real point, is that every single adult (over 13) male Jew in Germany SHOULD have had, and should have known how to use a rifle.   The same can be said of every male in Nanking during the Nanking massacres of 1937.

That gets you 1/3 way there.  The other 2/3 is the willingness to use that firearm knowning that it will ultimately result in your own death.  But you do it anyway because you know...there's more of you, than there are of them...and if every man in Nanking had been willing to shoot the man wanting to rape his wife...many lives would have been spared. 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 06:32 | 4753883 outofideas
outofideas's picture

By the numbers, Americans love their government too. Maybe not you and I but the free shit army and all the government employees and all their dependents and so on, I'd say the average American loves his or her government.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 08:48 | 4754122 cossack55
cossack55's picture

But are they willing to die for that gubmint?  They may be willing to risk it all for the check they receive from the gubmint, but I doubt they really give a shit who is signing the check.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 08:54 | 4754143 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Brimming with optimism today. I hope you are right.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 08:15 | 4753937 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

Shallow is the understatement of the year.

This article is BS². White is Black, lie is truth.

The truth: Hitler ARMED the German people. The possession of weapons was ENCOURAGED.

But only the Jews were disarmed. And also here this article does not mention why.

Were the Japanese in the USA allowed to carry weapons? No, they were put in concentration camps.

And what did the Jews in 1933? They declared war on Germany. Why doesn't the article mention this fact? Not of interest for the sheeple?

 

No word about the Jewish hostilities against the new Germany, and German businesses all over the world. Especially in the USA very interesting things happened, how Germans were put under pressure by the Jewish lobbies. In 1961 a Jewish insider, Benjamin Freedman, gave an interesting speech what REALLY happened. Everyone with internet can google it. No need to stay uninformed and eat the turbo capitalist bankster propaganda BS from the "Austrians".

 

"The rapid pace with which Hitler disarmed the populace in Germany is startling"

Maybe the reason of this article full of lies is much simpler:

Austrian economics is in support of total liberation of the markets. Just one example: Pornography is good, because it generates money.GMO food is great. Eating more garbage and poison is good! Because sick people create revenue! A state which educates people? Evil! The market and the banks take care for you! Was the Wild West the paradise for the people in America? It seems someone is interested to make you believe that the unlöeashed market is your best friend.

National agencies controlling the banks, the money trust, as it was called before WW1, observing the markets and enforcing insider restrictions, are bad and should be disbanded! The market regulates itself! That's Austrian economics!

Well, Austrian economics even rejects insider regulations!

Has any "Austrian" ever told you, that insider trading was much worse around 1900, than it is today? You are angry about the banksters not being put in jail? Then the last thing you want, is to get the early 20th century back.

Know what one of the most popular reasons for the creation of the FED was? How it was sold to the public? Control of the money trust! Wall Street NEVER had a good reputation. Now ask yourself, why do "Austrians" suggest the opposite when they were that extreme, that the people demanded the destruction of New York's "Money Trust"?!

The Austrians will never tell you about this "glorious" past of "free" markets!

What about international trade? It must be liberated!

Laws that protect the workers from dumping prices? Very bad in Austrian economics theory!

The US worker shall compete with the Chinese or Indian slave worker! That's Austrian economics!

 

This truly EVIL economic school has so much supporters nowadays, because it is in support of Gold as money.

But the clue is: Gold as money does no good to the one who owns no gold.

And it also does not solve the REAL problem of enforced exponential growth due to compound interest: If I lend you 10 ounces and you must pay back 11 ounces of gold, compared to lend you 10.000 fiat and you need to pay back 11.000 fiat, slave! You must pay back more than what is in existance! And that makes you work harder, slave. That's the TRUE hidden secret of modern slavery. Gold does not solve this problem. It only reduces the amount of leverage, but does not touch the problem for the working people and the accumulation of all wealth for the money lenders!

 

That's the tragedy, that people in support of the hard working people and against the parasitic financial industry are falling victim to the turbo capitalists of the "Austrian" school.

Social security in National-Socialist Germany was the best in the world. The standard of living before the war increased that much, the the German holiday cruisers from the KDF-fleet, were forbidden to harbour in Great Britain. The Brits should not see, that German workers could afford to go on a cruise with their family.

German couples were given interest free credit to build a house. But contrary to the plutocracies, not the credit for the banks was sponsored, but it was for the families: with every born child the loan was reduced 25%, so with the fourth child the house was completely paid off.

Or the National-Socialist laws that respected and protected the market economy but on the other hand forced the companies to share their profit with the emplyoees? Pure evil in the eyes of the Austrian economists! But I doubt that the average ZH reader is part of the 1% that profits from unleashed casino capitalism.

All that is incompatible with the Austrian school of economics. And probably that's the reason for this article full of lies. So the sheeple are kept in their misbelieve that there were only two alternatives: the current evil system of the international oligarchy and Communism.

The third way, the Social Market Economy, must be kept out of their focus. It supports binary thinking: you reject the Communist developments, here you have an "alternative": Austrian economics!

For Austrian economics the liberalization of the 1980s, that brought us into this mess, is even too less!

According to Austrian economics government agencies would be made even weaker! Or in the best case disbanded completely! Mac jobs are so great! Why not have three jobs to feed a family? Peter Schiff, Doug Casey and Sprott can explain to the ordinary worker how great this world is he just needs to work harder, while company profits are at ATHs!

It's stunning that ZH readers do support these people, only because they are holding a golden carrot in front of your nose.

But they are also pumping their mining shares to you at high prices, while they get them cheaply with private placements...

Yes, Austrian economics is great. One just needs to understand for whom...

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 08:22 | 4754025 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Pretty good rant, but it is diminished when you bend the facts. The Austrian school does not think pornography is "good". If you have read Walter Block's work on this subject, it concerns the effects of intervention and the costs to society. Same with GMO or any other item. There are no value judgements here, just a recognition of the costs.

There are problems with Austrian economics, however the effects of partial liberty wihin a State apparatus are not a true market. It could be said the Austrain school presents itself as opponent to Keynes and Marx for the purposes of the dialectic. The jewish background of it's most famous proponents should raise suspicions alone. Though Rothbard did eventually move farther afield of Austrian economics to consider anarcho-capitalsm.

The education provided by the State is self serving. Designed by corporations, it turns out compliant workers and citizens, not educated people. 

While there were aspects of the State of Germany which were beneficial to most of the population, there were clearly actions taken which were the very definition of tyranny. The generous actions of any State are no defense for totalitarian rule. Hitler himself rued the actions of his leutenants, knowing they were committing actions he neither wanted nor approved of. However, he could overlook these in order to continue the "greater good" of his leadership and policies.

The evil here is not Austrian economics, the savior is not an enlightened State, the means to tyranny is LAW. It is the justification for every depredation against the people. The means to liberty is the strength of The People wise enough to refuse to accept rulership from a small elite and energetic and responsible enough to recognize we all have a duty to maintain our liberty. There are benefits from people acting in concert for a united purpose, these benefits are always spoiled by giving them over to others.

I agree this article fails as a lesson in history, but it succeeds in demonstrating the dangers of capitulation.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 09:10 | 4754138 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

Sean7k,

 

I upvoted your comment because it is honestly argued (contrary to this BS article), although I do not agree with your analysis and clonclusions.

For example: the rule of law is only possible with a strong state. In the Wild West the rule of law was NOT existant. The "Austrians" also lie about the US history to make the people who are in support of personal freedom, reject any laws, that restrict the 1%.

 

What is also very important to understand, that those societies that promote individual freedom not necessarily have it, while governments that do not promote it, could have much more freedom!

For example in Hitler's Germany politics in school was taboo. Today even kindergarten children are indoctrinated.

In Hitler's Germany nobody was forced to join the Hitler-youth, or the BDM, the girl's youth, or the party. Highest ranking officials were not party members. Hitler's personal was not pressured to join the party.

 

Or let's take another example:

In the FRG (federal republic of Germany), which promotes individual freedom, it is claimed that 700.000 public officers were missing.

The 2nd German Reich, which was much bigger, had 500.000 public officers - including the postal and train jobs!

The FRG has 5.500.000 and needs 700.000 more!

 

So there is a huge difference between the propaganda for individual freedom and real existing freedom.

Today the regime controls every word you say, but it claims to respect freedom of speech!

 

And what also must be understood, there is always a target conflict: either individual freedom or freedom of the community.

Either you can have a family, or you are the centre of the universe. One excludes the other.

 

While in a huge country like the USA and on a farm with 100 hectars, the ideology of maximum individual freedom had some foundation, in densly populated regions, like central Europe living together is turned into HELL with individualism and without a strong state and monocultural rules that enforces a social individual behaviour.

 

If you argue that the "Austrians" are not in support of pornography, then this is wrong: if I support  economic measures that put the market over the protection of traditional values (which only can be protected by the state), because of individual freedom at the cost of the freedom of the community, then ofcourse I accept businesses that will exploit the weakness of the people!

Who are you, that you want to dictate grown up persons, that they can make porno movies?

And this goes on and on...

Who are you, that you want to dictate persons, which sexual orientation is good?

 

Community is the opposite of individualism.

Traditional values can only survive in a community. Because a functioning community needs rules. And if one does not follow the rules, he either must be forced to leave the community or he will destroy it.

 

That's what the Jews know so well and the sheeple have no clue about.

Therefore they wherever they live as minority, they promote individualism. Knowing that it is incompatible with the cohesion of the majority's community. I find it very interesting, that in Israel they suddenly know very well what is damaging the community and there they reject these community destroying ideologies.

Or why is George Soros promiting the legalization of drugs in the USA and not in Israel? Why is he not fighting for easier divorces of marriages in Israel? Why is he not fighting the racially selected settlement program? They only promote this deadly individualism for the gentiles.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 09:23 | 4754256 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

The rule of law is only possible with a strong state, which equates to: the rule of law will power tyranny. Please post an example if you wish to refute this idea. I am not willing to trade liberty for tyranny nor do I believe tyranny is the only means to protect "traditional values". It may protect YOUR values, but your values may be in direct opposition to mine, for example, the Puritans. Further, your dilemma is a canard. Individual freedoms and goals can co-exist with community freedoms and goals. The community will not be able to FORCE your behavior to comply, but they can ask for your participation. Who doesn't prefer being asked to being told?

If people like pornography, law will not stop this. It merely creates a black market. Sound familiar? Block's arguments merely point out the inefficiencies, it has nothing to do with morality. The bigger question doesn't involve economics: why are people so interested in pornography? Or prostitution? Or criminal behavior?  Perhaps the promise of something that seems better than what you have, even if you know not what it is. Which brings us to the topic of temptation in all things.

Which in turn brings us to the value of community as a source of wisdom and strength. Does this wisdom flow from the law? No, if flows from the good intentions of leaders whom wish to safeguard their loved ones. Do all loved ones accept this wisdom? Does a bear shit in the woods? 

We cannot force people to be "good", especially when the definition is subjective. There are truly evil people in the world- most of whom work in government, law and religion. To give them the power to influence and bend community to their own devices is folly. It is liberty we retain the freedom to protect ourselves from the wolf in sheep's clothing.

Your values are not my values, but our values may not be so different we cannot agree to be tolerant towards each other. If not, should we make up the same community? Is there not a community somewhere we could move to? The State IMPLIES violence as a solution to all problems, then defines the problems through the machinations of a small minority- regardless of the trappings of acceptance and how they are manipulated (votes). 

God's "law" was unable to restrain Sodom and Gomorrah. Do you think we are wiser or more capable? Man is a complex creature, influenced by actions outside the control of any State. Tyranny is not a tool of compassion not understanding nor wisdom. It is a hammer in a world of nails. We cannot legislate righteousness, but we can be a light to our community and engender acts of compassion and understanding and wisdom through liberty. 

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 10:16 | 4754490 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

"The rule of law is only possible with a strong state, which equates to: the rule of law will power tyranny. Please post an example if you wish to refute this idea."

No it doesn't imply this. You equate a strong state with tyranny. But you do this, for a very understandable experience: you see, that htis hostile regime enforces an ideology on you, that you reject. So your reaction is to reject the state.

But instead you should analyze what is the force behind this regime? It's a tyranny of a minority.

 

So instead to recognize that it are the hidden money powers that took over and control everything, you reject the ONLY entity that could restore the freedom of the average people: the state.

Why? Because the Money Powers exist. They are real. They never before were more powerful. Does living on a farm reduce their power? No, their power grows every day! And they continue to liberalize everything that brings them more profits, while on the other hand, they continue to destroy the societies with their TYRANNY OF MINORITIES, by brainswashing the majority to accept every perversion as being "tolerant".

 

Their power is not because of a STRONG state! Their power is because the state is WEAK. The state is hollow. The politicians that are elected do not decide and rule!

 

So by rejecting a strong STATE, you reject the medicine!

 

"Individual freedoms and goals can co-exist with community freedoms and goals. The community will not be able to FORCE your behavior to comply, but they can ask for your participation. Who doesn't prefer being asked to being told?"

 

You are argueing that being asked was important, although the voice has no influence, because there are lobbies and hidden forces ruling.

That's insane.

 

And ofcourse individual freedoms can coexist with community! But only if the proportions are correct!

The National-Socialists summed this up in one sentence:

Gemeinnutz geht vor Eigennutz.

The good for the community beats the good for the individual.

This sentence has everything in it, that you demand:

Striving for personal good is good! IT is encouraged! The Nazis freed the economy from many useless burocratic rules.

But the individual freedom has it's limits, where the good for the community is being affected negatively.

 

For example: making business and profit is good. But the workers must get their fair share from it and not the shareholders.

But promoting promiscuity? Destroy's the nation's culture, values and families. And therefore is forbidden.

Another example, that is often turned from white into black: marriage of partners with genetic defects. It is a huge burden, an egoisitic crime against the children and burdens the community for many generations severely, if such persons have children. Therefore a health check is demanded.

Or eugenics: imagine: implemented for only two generations, and the nation becomes almost free of genetic deseases for hundreds of years! With humane methods without anyone suffering. If humanity means being empathical and using sanity to reduce suffer, then this is humanity in it's highest form. contrary to following individual tribal instincts and creating misery for the children and suffer for generations to come. Today it is even more perverse: sick children are kept alive with all technological measures, while healthy children are aborted just for fun of the woman! Now tell me: what is perversion and what is highest form of humanity?!

 

Oh, misery for generations to come: Ofcourse Sprott or Casey with their nuclear mining shares would have a hard time. This technology endangers the genetic health, just like GMO, for many generations to come. Thousands of years. Therefore the possibility of the individual to make money from it, would better be declared illegal. That would be the Nazi politics. The "Austrian" politics is: it make smoney and therefore is good!

It's really not hard. But ofcourse it depends on the personal position. If you are a pervert, then you will reject it. If you are a Jew, then you will reject it. If you want to make business and profit on the cost of others, then you will reject it.

But if you are an average healthy and normal person, which respects the tradition of the majority and want the best for the community over GENERATIONS to come, then you can only support this principle that respects individual freedom as long as your community is not being negatively affected by it.

 

But if you are that much afraid of any rules that may restrict you and therefore you reject it, then you should not complain about all the degeneration that is happening today. Because today we have the rulership of TOTAL INDIVIDUALISM, while the money masters grow bigger every day.

Never before in the history INDIVIDUALISM was that much established. To a degree, where even the biological reproduction capability is being destroyed. The total destruction of the European culture never before was closer. Crying for more indicidual freedom means crying for more of the same poison.

WE DO NOT LACK INDIVIDUAL FREEDOM WE LACK COMMUNITY AND UNITY. But as I had explained, commnity can only exist if individualism is reduced.

And since the sheeple are so indictrinated with lies pro individualism and against community, I have no hope for the USA or Europe.

Every entity that WORKS, is authoritarian and a community and rejects individualism:

Family.

Police.

Military.

Teamsports.

 

I find it strange that they are so successful to make White people believe by rejecting order and community, they will find heaven, while all their world is slowly sinking into the shithole of individualism.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 10:39 | 4754665 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Actually, your entire statement proves my premise. YOU would dictate what is best for all. You are a tyrant, hiding behind the promises of YOUR idea of great works. You would lift up the successes and hide the dirty laundry.

The communty being more important than the individual is communism in all its' glory. Is there a more tyrannical state? the State of the bolshevik jew? The ends do not justify the means if they commit atrocities in their pursuit.The dialectic of bolshevik communism and national socialism has left you confused with a false choice.

I believe individuals need rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness to ensure the greatest number of possible solutions to the greatest number of problems. We do not increase the chance of success by diminishing the odds. 

The family can be a horror, especially if ruled top down by an incestuous or violent leader. The police spend as much time abusing the law as upholding it, that is them, speeding by with their lights on for a donut stop or planting a gun or lyng under oath. The military is a means to corporate ends for the confiscation of resources and monopoly of markets. Teamsports are entertainment and introductions to group think and pressure. Ultimately, it is the undividual, as product of their family and community, whom is our best defense against tyranny.

You have exposed your hate and true goals of totalitarian rule for a "pure" population. You are the bolshevik jew and you don't even realize it. 

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:08 | 4754820 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

No need to become agressive.

Your rant against any sense of community cannot hide, that your individualism is ruling today. That your individualism is what makes the bankster tyranny possible.

And everyone living outside the community is always somehow liberal.

The Jew is you.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:13 | 4754899 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

What's the matter? Cat got your tongue? All my comments combined the individual within the community in liberty. So, you either are not reading for comprehension or attempting to create a lie. 

Bankster tyranny has nothing to do with the individual, but the control of the power of the State to determine money, legal tender and regulation.This is done with money, just ask the Rothschilds. 

Calling me names will not improve your argument. It crashes like a wave against the shore, attempting to erode the strong foundation of liberty beneath our feet. We merely must regain our contact and firm footing, then build a seawall against the tyranny in your heart.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:54 | 4755149 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

The Rothschilds built their wealth by lending Gold. Somehow Gold was not really a protection from their rise.

And didn't the USA even have Gold and Silver as money? And which country today is the most important base of the international Money Masters and Capitalism?

Somehow you thesis about Gold being the rescue doesn't work.

But Hitler's debt free barter economy worked! And the Red internationalists in Moscow and the Orange internationalists in New York could only overcome it by combining their forces and resources.

And since then they do everything that you sheeple will never look at the facts, how an economy begins to flourish, if it adopts a NATURAL economic order and removes interest slavery AND respects private market economic principles!

You sheeple may only believe there was Capitalism or Communism and not discover, that there is a third way.

So good luck with your stupid quest for even more individualism, while around you every social order and culture is disintegrating.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:36 | 4755351 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Actually, the Rothschilds built there empire with loans at interest(especially to governments), private postal service and the manipulation of the English stock bourse after Waterloo. However, I am curious, where did I mention gold? Red herring much?

Any debt free, barter economy will work, though that would be a mass oversimplification of the crony corporatism that inhabits all fascist regimes- Hitler's included. It will also fail in regards to international trade. If you do not understand the economics of the third reich, you might want to read past the glossy pictures.

There are no natural economic orders, just man made systems to create efficiencies and enhance productivity and trade. Which is why the beneficiaries are usually slanted toward their creators.

I never challenged the success of Hitler's programs, merely the excesses of tyranny. You might prefer tyranny, it appeals to people that need to control the world and ameleorate their insecurities. It requires courage and honor to live in liberty, perhaps this is why you fear it so?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 18:30 | 4756756 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

Well, Hitler prooved that international barter trade works better than the international debt slavery:

 

It is the ultimate system to avoid the grip of the international parasites on a nation's trade. And btw, it even allows to remove a country's currency from the speculative market without hindering it's international trade!

That's how Hitler removed the parasites from Germany's trade and currency. While the debt slavery Plutocracies were drowning in record unemployment and with Roosevelt's Keynesian New Deal a collosal failure, the world jumped on Germany's honest new barter system and was crazy for the robust German machinery for fair prices.

 

Contrary to Hitler's system, the Plutocracies put pressure on foreign currencies to indebt the nations and grab the goods cheaply.

A short explanation how barter systems with market economy's can remove the international banksters, speculators and money changers from the nation's trade completely (other systems are possible, the principle is the same):

 

Both countries establish a state owned barter trade agency, company or whatever you will call it.

Then the two countries, interested in barter trade with each other, agree on a exchange rate for their currencies. Or, if the exchange rates are not fair, because for example the international speculators are already attacking them or have put them under pressure with sanctions or boycott, or if they fluctuate wildly, they agree on a basket of goods and services.

For example Russia calculates what this basket costs in Ruble, China in Renminbi. Without hyperinflation the costs of the basket changes only very slowly. Now the two nations know, how much their currencies are worth relative to the other WITHOUT the speculators but what the parity buying power is.

 

The rest, is also not complicated:

Say Russian companies want to export oil, and Russian companies want to import machinery or goods.

According to the parity buying power the agency pays the amount of Rubles to the Russian oil company, while it "receives" the oil. The oil is shipped and the machinery and goods are received. The Russian companies who ordered them receive them and pay them in Rubles to the agency.

No international banks.

No speculators.

No money changers.

 

Only barter systems exclude the parasites of the financial sector.

Wed, 05/14/2014 - 07:11 | 4758163 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Since you went to the trouble, but I will keep it short. One, you still include the concept of a central bank (Currency) leaving a small group to benefit from currency growth, which will be required to insure liquidity by commerce. While barter is an excellent means of exchange, it is limited by what each party wants, third parties, etc. This is why money was created- to make exchange easier and encourage production.If the State controls the trade, the same problems with human behavior exist as exist in corporations. Graft is an issue in all bureaucratic structures as is the disimilation of power and influence.

Would it be preferable to the present system, yes. Is it optimal, no.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:27 | 4755820 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

@Againstthelie

while I love a good argument, and you've both made strong points in the to 'n' fro, you did manage to step in some shit that's stinking up yer shoes,

sick children are kept alive with all technological measures, while healthy children are aborted just for fun of the woman! Now tell me: what is perversion and what is highest form of humanity?!

I'll just point to the obvious truth:

a foetus is not a "child" - as long as it is in utero, and completely dependent on the mother, its "health" cannot be fully ascertained, nor can its life expectancy, etc.

that you truly believe in eugenics post-birth, yet also believe "women abort for fun" tips your hand as to your idea of what a "community" might consist of/ look like.

no thanks.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:06 | 4756824 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

Following your argument you are in support of "progressive" politics to remove the ban of marriages between relatives.

Why does this ban exist if all humans were equal? If the sick child is as precious as the healthy one? So it's only consistent for degenerated egalitarist minds to remove this very useful and sane laws!

Do you want sick children or healthy children?

If there is a god, he has created life. And the biological laws that determine what is necessary for healthy beings! God does not want the sick to reproduce themselfes. He wants them to vanish. By looking at nature we see his will.

 

So it's not a question of what I want. It are the laws of life.

Humans can accept them and act occordingly by respecting them.

Or they can ignore them. Then nature will punish this behaviour.

In my opinion it is extreme inhumanity to know, if two persons will have sick children, to allow them to multiply their defects and suffering! It's a crime against the poor sick children.

We can decide to live in harmony with nature, which means to respect the eternal laws of nature, or we can decide to believe in religions from the desert to stand above nature and can ignore the eternal laws of life.

Ofcourse we can support the reproduction of sick humans, we can support race mixing and destroying creativity and biodiversity of the human species, we can decide to spread Frankenstein genome GMO's into nature without any longterm tests for profit, we can use antibiotics all the time and create super-resitant bacteria. We can do all that. But for a price.

It's against the laws of nature. And therefore a very high price will have to be paid. Not by the generation that committed the crime. But generations later will pay and suffer for our insanity and what people like you called "humanity", but in fact was the purest form of INHUMANITY:

In my understanding HUMANITY means to use the human brain to REDUCE suffering, also for future generations, and not to multiply it by only looking at the moment and the easiest way!

It's very simple: if the human species is not ripe for biopolitics and not capable to use it's mind in that manner, but only uses it for shortsighted personal advantages and profit maximization, the pursuit of happiness, then this species with all the technology it has invented will be an evolutionary dead end!

Do you want that? Then keep on supporting the current ignorance against the eternal laws of life. But then you are part of the problem, not of the solution. 

Or you begin to think about the long term consequences of our acting and begin to support sanity and humanity over deadly egoism.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 20:24 | 4757183 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

okay, you're off on a tangent that bears no resemblence to the point I was making in my previous comment.

Do you want sick children or healthy children?

I don't want or have any children, and so I've fulfilled my own wishes, and am able to chose to spend time with the children of friends whenever desired.

If there is a god, he has created life. And the biological laws that determine what is necessary for healthy beings! God does not want the sick to reproduce themselfes. He wants them to vanish. By looking at nature we see his will.

dodgy territory - you're stating personal beliefs, which is fine - but they are personal, and therefore should not be applied to other people as "laws" - and certainly not under the phony label of "nature" - if you seek a punitive life, admit it and accept that others will judge you for your beliefs, which are not universal.

while I can agree with you that the systemic experimenting with humans/animals/foodstuffs/environment for corporate profits, which is causing tremendous suffering and will continue to impact throughout all our lives, and subsequent generations - this is not a "religious" problem, it is the consequence of the out of control ruling classes of sociopaths,  creating "governments" and "religions" and various "cultures" - all of which have exploited humans since, well, forever.

we don't need any more controlling belief systems to further torture all life.  we have plenty to deal with as it is.

so chaos it is.  get it while you can.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 10:56 | 4754772 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Therefore they wherever they live as minority, they promote individualism. Knowing that it is incompatible with the cohesion of the majority's community."

I belirve most jews are democrats.  The democratic party is not about individualism.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:10 | 4754850 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

You still believe in their two party game? That it matters which actor becomes president?

In case you haven't recognized it: They control both sides.

ps: the democratic party is not in support of genderism, gender mainstreaming, gay-marriage? Where is the Democratic party in support of COMMUNITY over individualism?!

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:52 | 4755140 moneybots
moneybots's picture

ps: the democratic party is not in support of genderism, gender mainstreaming, gay-marriage? Where is the Democratic party in support of COMMUNITY over individualism?!

 

Social Security, medicare for all, redistribution of wealth, gun control, common core, it takes a villiage etc., etc.  Socialism is not individualism.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:23 | 4755258 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

That's not socialism, that's Marxism.

The difference?

Look at a family. That's socialism. No rights without duties! And authoritarian: the children must follow the orders of the parents and therefore the parents have the responsibility for the children.

A family as true socialst entity has another criteria: the commuinity is stricly separated from foreigners. The opposite of Marxism, where all people are equal and there is made no differentiation between MINE and YOURS.

Marxism is a Jewish lie. It turns the noble socialist idea into the internationalistic agenda of the Jew. Therefore it doesn't work. It never has and it never will. It's not even intended to work. It's intention is the dissolution of the natural communities, the destruction of the traditional order to create the NEW HUMAN.

Therefore Marxism also fights families. The TRUE socialist entity, the most important cell of any society and culture! Is fought by the "Socialists"! It's so obvious, but the sheeple do not recongize it.

 

Contrary to the Jewish scam of international socialism, any real working socialism is always respecting the principles how it works in reality, with a family:

No right without duties.

Different not equal!

Own and foreign.

Mine and yours.

Community instead of society.

 

The one who wants help from the community must follow the rules of the community.

 

Now you can check which side the Democratic party belongs to and you should be able to recognize it's pure Marxist and has nothing to do with the noble socialist cause every family is built on!

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:41 | 4755640 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Marxism is a Jewish lie. It turns the noble socialist idea into the internationalistic agenda of the Jew."

 

Anti-semitism.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 16:10 | 4756248 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

If the truth is anti-semitic, then it must be something good!

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 09:00 | 4754171 J S Bach
J S Bach's picture

Good reply...

 

Hitler was and is vilified by the victors of WWII because he showed the possibilities for prosperity without the yoke of usury tied around a nation's neck.

 

http://mordant-truth.weebly.com/hilter-monetary-system-real-cause-of-ww2...

 

Economist Henry C K Liu writes of Germany’s remarkable transformation:

"The Nazis came to power in Germany in 1933, at a time when its economy was in total collapse, with ruinous war-reparation obligations and zero prospects for foreign investment or credit. Yet through an independent monetary policy of sovereign credit and a full-employment public-works program, the Third Reich was able to turn a bankrupt Germany, stripped of overseas colonies it could exploit, into the strongest economy in Europe within four years, even before armament spending began."

In Billions for the Bankers, Debts for the People (1984), Sheldon Emry commented:

"Germany issued debt-free and interest-free money from 1935 and on, accounting for its startling rise from the depression to a world power in 5 years. Germany financed its entire government and war operation from 1935 to 1945 without gold and without debt, and it took the whole Capitalist and Communist world to destroy the German power over Europe and bring Europe back under the heel of the Bankers. Such history of money does not even appear in the textbooks of public (government) schools today."

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:00 | 4754806 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Hitler was and is vilified by the victors of WWII because he showed the possibilities for prosperity without the yoke of usury tied around a nation's neck."

 

Not even close.  The Holocaust, 20 million Russians killed, upward of 40 million on both sides.  That is why Hitler is villified.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:21 | 4754940 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

Well, that Hitler could gas 6 million jews and make them disappear and not a single corpse as evidence was found, turns Hitler already into a god. On the other hand I'm wondering why there are so many Holocaust survivors with that German efficiency?

But that you demand that he should have been able to avoid the Soviet losses due to the Red Army's incompetence, is a bit too much.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:24 | 4755238 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Well, that Hitler could gas 6 million jews and make them disappear and not a single corpse as evidence was found, turns Hitler already into a god. On the other hand I'm wondering why there are so many Holocaust survivors with that German efficiency?

But that you demand that he should have been able to avoid the Soviet losses due to the Red Army's incompetence, is a bit too much."

 

The Holocaust is well documented.  Those who were gassed were cremated, so i wouldn't expect any corpses.  People who have loved ones cremated, get an urn full of ashes.  No corpse inside the urn.

I don't know why you would wonder why there were survivors, as the Holocaust was well documented.  Why are you biased against the truth? 

Where do you get the silly idea that i am demanding anything as far as Russian casualies were concerned? 20 million Russians were killed.  Hitler attacked Russia, not the other way around.  As far as incompetence is concerned, Hitler lost the war.

Hitler is not being villified for some phony accounting of the reichs economy that is being pushed here.  I have watched various clips of Hitler's speeches.  He was an evil man, obvious from just watching his demenor as he spoke, even without understanding the words.

 

 

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:52 | 4755387 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

The Holocaust is well documented?

So well documented, that the plate with the 4 million number in Auschwitz, and in front of which the pope had kneed, silently had been removed?

So well documented, that not a single corpse has been found?

So well documented, that the Nazis had crematories, that could burn more corpses with their lack of energy and resources, than today's modern crematoria?

And for your information, what about the other places where not this ridiculous lie of burning millions of corspes without remains has been used? Babi Jar? Where are the tens of thsousands of corpses?

 

So well documented, that in the Fisher World Almanac of 1948 the Jewish world population was the same as before WW2!

 

So well documented, that Simon Wiesenthal survived 12 death camps! So well documented that this person even buried soap made of Jews - the problem: it was a fake. Not so well documented...

 

So well documented that the Auschwitz gas chamber had a wooden door with a normal glass that opens to the inside? Every sheeple is this sown today and you all are that braindead to recognize anything!

So well documented, that on the alleged gas chambers in Auschwitz no remains of cyanid can be found, but on the walls of the REAL gas chambers, where the clothes were desinfected?

Have you ever looke how REAL gas chambers in the USA look like? The huge ventilation system?

Why don't you inform yourself about the gas, Zyklon B? It's chemical and physical behaviour?

So well documented, that Auschwitz had a swimming pool! A hospital! A maternity clinic! Camp money! A camp orchestra! A theatre!

So well documented, that the prisoners FREELY marched with the SS, when the camps were evacuated?!

So well documented, that the Red Cross examining the German camps and it's death books are kept out of the media?

So well documente like the Anne Frank diary, partially written with a ballpen, that was invented only years after the war?

 

You have internet and www.vho.org is only the tip of a finger away. Contrary to former times, today it's not difficult to find suppressed information. So you are worse than the most stupid people in the middle ages. They had no chance and it was difficult to get the information, but you IGNORE it freely and you believe you were well informed.

 

"The Holocaust is well documented."

Incredible.

 

ps: Google: Faurisson a man

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:44 | 4755656 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"The Holocaust is well documented?"

 

Yes it is, as you well know, anti-semite.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:51 | 4755691 moneybots
moneybots's picture

 "You have internet and www.vho.org is only the tip of a finger away. Contrary to former times, today it's not difficult to find suppressed information. So you are worse than the most stupid people in the middle ages. They had no chance and it was difficult to get the information, but you IGNORE it freely and you believe you were well informed."

 

I know that anti-semitic propaganda is a fingertip away.  Anti-semitism has been a problem for ages.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:32 | 4756079 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

I presented a number of facts that show that the official story stinks to high heaven and your reply is "ANTI-SEMITE"?

Well, if anyone had any doubts that Holocaust-promoters are not interested in facts, then they should be gone now. Nobody interested in facts avoids a factual discussion.

And btw, have you ever thought that using primitive lies in conjunction with propaganda phrases could turn one day agains the inventor? Because if it is anti-semitic to think logical and to question more and to demand answers, instead of repeating physically impossible claims, then calling someone anti-semite could be seen as something very positive!

You should be very careful with your stupid propaganda phrases, because it's an integral part of human existance to demand LOGICAL answers!

And if an alleged gas chamber did not even have ventilators but a wooden door with normal glass, then it's only a matter of time until even most dumb sheeple one day will begin to doubt. Denouncing to demand answers will not make the human wish for truth go away.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 16:50 | 4756396 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"I presented a number of facts that show that the official story stinks to high heaven and your reply is "ANTI-SEMITE"?"

 

You presented anti-semitic propaganda.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 20:10 | 4757135 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"You should be very careful with your stupid propaganda phrases, because it's an integral part of human existance to demand LOGICAL answers!

And if an alleged gas chamber did not even have ventilators but a wooden door with normal glass, then it's only a matter of time until even most dumb sheeple one day will begin to doubt. Denouncing to demand answers will not make the human wish for truth go away."

 

Goebbels was a master of anti-semitic propaganda.  What propaganda phrases did he use to incite hatred of jews?  Were they the same kind of phrases which lead Bufford furrow to murder?

The documented gas chambers?  The truth doesn't go away, regardless that you wish it to.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 22:21 | 4757547 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"The Holocaust is well documented."

Incredible.

 

"Holocaust denial is a form of anti-Semitism, positing that Jews have concocted a giant myth for their own ends. It persists despite the fact that the Holocaust is one of the best documented genocides in history, with a wide array of evidence documenting virtually every aspect of it.

For example, approximately a million Jews on the Eastern Front were shot during 1941-42, and buried in large pits. This is known partly because the Einsatzgruppen, the mobile killing units that coordinated these massacres, prepared detailed reports on the murders - reports that contained precise death tolls, broken down into men, women and children.

These reports were sent to high ranking officials in Berlin, and to army, police and SS officers, as well as diplomats and even prominent industrialists. This wide distribution suggests that the perpetrators felt no shame at what they did. Had these killings not been part of Berlin's policy, the reports would never have been so widely distributed"

 

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:56 | 4755436 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

The holocaust is not well documented, merely written about and passed off as true. Read "Witness to History" by Michael Walsh (pdf's on internet). Many histories have been discredited - especially Shirer. See "Hitler's War" by David Irving. 

There were many cremations, because of rampant typhus, the result of Allied bombing of factories and the camps which were part of them. The same typhus that was pandemeic in Allied camps and killed hundreds of thousands of Germans.

There is zero support for jewish death totals, however, German reparations are built on NUMBER of deaths. 

The German and Soviet aggression was mutual and fairly well telegraphed. The Jewish declaration of war in 1933 at the international congress is well documented. No serious military historian will entertained the concept of incompetence regarding Hitler's conduct of the war. He was a brilliant strategist. He did underestimate the influence of world jewry in Britain and America. He did seem to place himself in positions where additional time to develop supplies and weapons may have helped his cause. Air power especially. 

Hitler was a man with a dream and the power to fulfill it. Evil or good are moral judgements which depend on who wins. While I found many of his policies detestable and without merit, there were many I can find great respect for. Reality is rarely an either or proposition, but a commotion of dark and light fighting for dominance. 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:46 | 4755670 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Hitler was a man with a dream and the power to fulfill it. Evil or good are moral judgements which depend on who wins"

 

Evil is as evil does.  Hitler was evil.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:54 | 4755703 moneybots
moneybots's picture

Evil is as evil does.  Hitler was evil.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:12 | 4756015 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Evil or good are moral judgements which depend on who wins"

 

Hitler lost the War.  Hitler was evil.

Stalin won the war. Stalin was evil.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:51 | 4755941 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Then tell me, was it yahweh or the judahites that supposedly carried out the slaughter of whole groups of people, including women and children, at his command whom was EVIL? You do read the torah?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:08 | 4755995 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Then tell me, was it yahweh or the judahites that supposedly carried out the slaughter of whole groups of people, including women and children, at his command whom was EVIL? You do read the torah?"

 

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_ANTI_SEMITISM_INDEX?SITE=AP&SE...

 

NEW YORK (AP) -- A new survey has found that anti-Semitism remains prevalent around the world, with one in four adults surveyed in 102 countries expressing anti-Jewish sentiments.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:22 | 4756043 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Don't want to address the history? No, you play the victim card, kind of predictable...

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:35 | 4756102 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

They always do.

For 3000 years. They will never learn - until one day the world learns, that they are the problem, not the nations!

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:17 | 4756485 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"They always do.

For 3000 years. They will never learn - until one day the world learns, that they are the problem, not the nations!"

 

You are the one pretending to be a victim.

 

Bufford Furrow went to a Jewish community center and shot people.  He later shot and killed a postal worker.

 

"U.S. Attorney Alejandro Mayorkas said Furrow confessed to killing Ileto, who was shot in the chest and head by a 9 mm handgun while making deliveries in Chatsworth, California.

"He stated that the postal worker was a good 'target of opportunity' to kill because he was 'non-white and worked for the federal government,'" Mayorkas said. "According to Furrow, the mail carrier appeared to be Hispanic or Asian.""

"On August 7, Furrow bought a used red Chevrolet van in Tacoma, Washington, and loaded it with five assault rifles, two pistols, 6,000 rounds of ammunition and a flak jacket. Furrow considered attacking three Jewish institutions: the Skirball Cultural Center, the University of Judaism and the Simon Wiesenthal Center's Museum of Tolerance, but security measures presented too much of a problem.

Police found Furrow's abandoned van, where they discovered a cache of ammunition, assault rifle magazines, bulletproof vests, a Ranger Handbook, and freeze-dried food. Two books by Richard Kelly Hoskins, a Lynchburg, Virginia, leader of the Christian Identity movement were also found; a copy of the book War Cycles, Peace Cycles, and Vigilantes of Christendom: The Story of Phineas Priesthood, a book which according to the ADL justifies anti-Semitic and racist acts of violence.

Furrow fled 275-miles in an $800 taxi ride from Los Angeles to Las Vegas, ending the manhunt by walking into an FBI office to confess, saying "You're looking for me, I killed the kids in Los Angeles." Furrow also stated that he wanted his shooting to be "a wakeup call to America to kill Jews.""


Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:31 | 4756527 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Just how is this story relevant to the discussion? That your victims? Then, you are playing the victim card?  I asked a pretty simple question, twice, are you incapable of discussing jewish history? Would you prefer the early american trading in slaves by sephardic jews? Their acts of kindness (terrorism) to palestinians in the run up to statehood? The USS Liberty? The fact they are always spying and stealing secrets from us? Pollard ring a bell? AIPAC? JDL terroeism? MOSSAD terrorism? Press censorship? Debt slavery via fractional reserve banking? The Versaille Treaty? Nuremburg trials? They financially supported Hitler and brought him to power. See a trend here?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:16 | 4756939 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Hey, it's YOUR encyclopedia. Exposed by your people. Better keep better control over your people, create a few more ghettos- it's your history..."

 

You keep that imagination thing going. 

 

"The fact they are always spying and stealing secrets from us? Pollard ring a bell? AIPAC? JDL terroeism? MOSSAD terrorism? Press censorship? Debt slavery via fractional reserve banking? The Versaille Treaty? Nuremburg trials? They financially supported Hitler and brought him to power. See a trend here?"

 

Just what is it with your hatred of Jews?

The KKK burned crosses and went to church on Sunday. 

The NSA spies on everyone. Talk to woodrow Wilson about fractional reserve lending.  Prescot Bush.

 

I see a trend that you want to paint, to support anti-semitism.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:27 | 4756983 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

What is it with your unwillingness to answer a single simple question: Yahweh or the juddahites? Woodrow Wilson had nothing to do with the FED, read"The Creature from Jekyll Island" , the Fed is the result of Congressional action spurred on by JP Morgan and Bernard Baruch- They be zionist and jew zionist. Only Congress can grant the charter.

I do support anti-semitism. However, the only trend I see is your inability to get a handle on the facts.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 20:22 | 4757168 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"I do support anti-semitism"

 

That is obvious to me.  

 

However, the only trend I see is your inability to get a handle on the facts."

 

I do see the trend of your propaganda.  That is how Goebbels worked it.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:29 | 4756995 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Just how is this story relevant to the discussion? That your victims? Then, you are playing the victim card?"

 

The story of Bufford Furrow is very relevant to a discussion of anti-semitism and how it breeds hate.  A Philipino postal worker was murdered.  Hitler refused to greet Jesse Owens, as he considered black people to be inferior.  Jesse smashed the myth of Aryan supremacy.

Recently an anti-semite killed some people he thought were jews, but who turned out to be Christians. 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 22:39 | 4757597 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Do you have ANY knowledge of history? Hitler was told by the president of the Olympic committee he could not greet the athletes. Jesse Owens was treated better in Germany than the US. He could eat in any restaurant or public place. The people went crazy over him. This led Jesse Owens to remark how wrong people were about Hitler and Germany. 

We weren't discussing anti semitism, we were discussing why you continue to dodge the question of yahweh and the judahites. 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 16:53 | 4756406 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Don't want to address the history? No, you play the victim card, kind of predictable..."

 

What victim card?  The history of the Holocaust is well documented.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:08 | 4756451 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

So Moneybots, yahweh or the Judahites? Who is responsible for the EVIL acts in Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy,Joshua and Judges? Who is responsible for the "vengeful god of the old testament"? If you have holocaust documentation, then show it. Perhaps you could peruse "The Controversy of Zion" by Douglas Reed. Should we check out the jewish assassin that killed William McKinley or the Archduke? Or the Russian royal family? You want to blame Stalin for the soviet atrocities? When he was just the agent of the bolshevik jews? Nobody does holocaust like the jews- it is your history. Hiding in the shadows, seemingly safe in your talmud and secret oral teachings. 

How about, "The Curse of Canaan" by Eustace Mullins? Shall I go on?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:19 | 4756494 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"So Moneybots, yahweh or the Judahites? Who is responsible for the EVIL acts in Leviticus, Numbers, Deuteronomy,Joshua and Judges?"

 

Having a difficult time acknowleging that Hitler was evil?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:32 | 4756535 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

That's three times. Hitler was a jewish production- your funding. Your responsibility. 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 18:58 | 4756858 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"That's three times. Hitler was a jewish production- your funding. Your responsibility. "

 

You are still having a difficult time acknowleging Hitler was evil. 

 

Hitler was responsible for his own actions and his own anti-semitism.

 

" your funding. Your responsibility. "

 

Your interesting imagination.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:04 | 4756887 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Hitler was the least evil of the people arrayed against him. FDR, Stalin, Churchill, the jews which declared war against hin in 1933. All these parties make Hitler's actions pale in comparison. True evil comes from the judahites, which by the way, you are still having a difficult time acknowledgig that either yahweh or the juddahites were evil. See how that works?

As for the funding, you can look it up on the internet...

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:36 | 4757021 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Hitler was the least evil of the people arrayed against him"

 

I have seen films of Hitler speaking.  The evil is obvious.  The man had severe anger issues.  An unstable personality.

"True evil comes from the judahites, which by the way, you are still having a difficult time acknowledgig that either yahweh or the juddahites were evil. See how that works?"

I see how Goebbels propaganda works.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 22:41 | 4757606 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Still refusing to face your own history. What a gutless pig.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:21 | 4756498 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"You want to blame Stalin for the soviet atrocities"

 

It is not a matter of want, it is a matter of fact.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:33 | 4756541 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Then provide the facts. Scared?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 18:59 | 4756867 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Then provide the facts. Scared?"

 

They on on the internet.

 

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:05 | 4756889 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

So, I guess that's a no. Typical.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:23 | 4756505 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Nobody does holocaust like the jews- it is your history. Hiding in the shadows, seemingly safe in your talmud and secret oral teachings."

 

You have an interesting imagination.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:36 | 4756547 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Hey, it's YOUR encyclopedia. Exposed by your people. Better keep better control over your people, create a few more ghettos- it's your history...

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:00 | 4756871 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Hey, it's YOUR encyclopedia. Exposed by your people. Better keep better control over your people, create a few more ghettos- it's your history..."

 

You have that interesting imaginination thing going again.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:08 | 4756908 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

"The Controversy of Zion" by Douglass Reed. Will you forever rationalize the horrors perpetrated by the jew? I willing to bet yes, based on your responses so far. Who do you think you're fooling?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:48 | 4757049 moneybots
moneybots's picture

""The Controversy of Zion" by Douglass Reed. Will you forever rationalize the horrors perpetrated by the jew? I willing to bet yes, based on your responses so far. Who do you think you're fooling?'

 

You are not fooling me.  Buford Furrow was subject to being fooled, which is why he shot those people at the jewish community center and that anti-semitic man in Kansas? shot several Christians to death, thinking they were jews.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 22:44 | 4757625 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

But I must be confusing you, for you have lost understanding of the english language, making bizarre statements and refusing to answer simple queries. Yahweh or Juddahite Mr. Evil.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:46 | 4757062 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

Sean,

this is sooo typical. :p

Immediately after your first post, I wrote that you are honestly argueing.

And now compare your upright way of discussing with this Jew.

Their dishonesty, their rabulism, their disrespect for truthful arguments, their slimey character makes me physically sick.

Like Jesus said: they are the children of the devil.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:58 | 4757098 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"

Sean,

this is sooo typical. :p

Immediately after your first post, I wrote that you are honestly argueing.

And now compare your upright way of discussing with this Jew.

Their dishonesty, their rabulism, their disrespect for truthful arguments, their slimey character makes me physically sick.

Like Jesus said: they are the children of the devil."

 

You have got your imagination thing going, tooQuite wild it is, even.

Actually, you are making yourself physically sick.  Psychosomatic.  With a problem of  such hatred, that is making you physically ill, it is odd that you would mention Jesus. 

 

 

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 22:48 | 4757645 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

It is amazing to attempt communication with an imbecile. I can usually get reasonable responses from intellectally challenged people, but this is a whole new experience. It is if he is locked in a cage, poking a stick at phantom demons. Must have a huge med bill.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:00 | 4755973 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"He did underestimate the influence of world jewry in Britain and America."

 

Anti-semetic propaganda.

 

Hitler declared war on America, following U.S. declaration od war on Japan.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:17 | 4756025 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

You might want to look at the members of various war commissions and treasury positions in FDR's cabinet. You might want to examine the lend lease program and wholesale shipment of complete factories to the USSR PRIOR to WWII, as well as other war materials. You might want to read up on Allied concessions to Soviet territorial requests at the end of the war.You could look into the transfer of nuclear weapon secrets by jewish members as well. Not to mention the actions of Churchill prior to 1925 and after. 

The Anti semitic propaganda charge is the essence of propaganda itself. Just because you cannot confront or confound history, to think silly name calling will give credence to your intellectual shortcomings is embarrassing. Either do the work or go home. 

By the way, I consider anti-semite to be the highest compliment. Please feel free to refer to me in this manner any time you wish.:)

There is no more murderous and contemptible people on earth, with a history of death, destruction and slavery that exceeds the dreams of the most terrible tyrants. They are the source of most evil on earth.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:59 | 4756193 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

"There is no more murderous and contemptible people on earth, with a history of death, destruction and slavery that exceeds the dreams of the most terrible tyrants. They are the source of most evil on earth."

In all times, in all cultures the greatest thinkers knew this.

A highly recommended book: Israel Shahak, Jewish History Jewish Religion The Influence Of Three Thousand Years.

Since Shahak was a Jew himself, their usual distractions with anti-semitism, Shlomo also practizes here, do not work.

Shahak is excellent for brainwashed, naive Goyim, who, for example, don't even recognize that the Jews talk just as they need it and that truth has absolutely no value in their culture: In one sentence the Jew claims to be a people, for example when demanding Israel, and in the next sentence the same Jew is outraged of being called a hostile people and demands to only be a religion, when it comes to a discussion about loyalty to the state he is living in.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:27 | 4756518 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"There is no more murderous and contemptible people on earth, with a history of death, destruction and slavery that exceeds the dreams of the most terrible tyrants. They are the source of most evil on earth."

"In all times, in all cultures the greatest thinkers knew this."

 

Anti-semitism knows no bounds.  It destroyed Buford Furrow, for one.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:31 | 4756530 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Shahak is excellent for brainwashed, naive Goyim, who, for example, don't even recognize that the Jews talk just as they need it and that truth has absolutely no value in their culture"

 

Hitler had no use for truth.  He even pretended that Poland attacked Germany, so he could invade it.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 20:07 | 4757113 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

You want to discuss history, Jew?

Ok.

The relationship between Germany and Poland when Hitler took power?

Miserable. Because before Hitler took power, Weimar Germany insisted on the reunification of the Polish occupied land.

Under Hitler the relationship with Poland improved dramatically.

Why? Because Hitler did only demand a corridor to Danzig! ("no other German politician could dare to suggest this")

The Poles and Germans were already very close to an agreement, when the Jewish controlled Plutocrats in Britain under high grade freemason and alcoholics Churchill played their best card: they guaranteed the chauvinist Polish forces absolute support, even if Poland would attack Germany! A first class act of warmongering and the typical Jewish inciting problems betwen nations.

This move put the sane Polish forces checkmate and the chauvinists took power. Polish newspapers circulated that showed Berlin as part of Poland.

The supression against the Germans in the occupied country increased more and more and when German farmers were killed on their fields, they internationalists had Hitler where they wanted Germany: forced into war.

But Hitler sent one suggestion after the other. The German generals already were pressuring him but he delayed the attack five times.

In the days before Sept. 1st, there were numerous border violations.

What is also interesting: according to international law a general mobilization is seen as casus belli. The Polish army had it's general mobilization days before Sept. 1st!

So even if all the killing of Germans is ignored, alone the fact the Polish army was in a state of general mobilization is enought to show that the German attack was absolutely accordingly to international laws.

 

But there is more!

Two days later the Plutocracies Britain and France declared war on Germany but did not move a finger to help the Poles, despite the British treaty!

And when Stalin attacked Poland the Orange internationalists in London did not declare war on the Red internationalists in Moscow.

But there's more:

Although the German army was gloriously winning, Germany sent another peace offer to London: to stop the advance immediately, retreat behind the borders if an international peace delegation would be sent intot he Polish occupied German territories to find a solution!

 

Who has to fear the truth, Jew?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 20:43 | 4757243 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Who has to fear the truth, Jew?"

 

Got that imagination thing going again.

 

"On September 1, 1939, Germany invaded Poland. The Polish army was defeated within weeks of the invasion. From East Prussia and Germany in the north and Silesia and Slovakia in the south, German units, with more than 2,000 tanks and over 1,000 planes, broke through Polish defenses along the border and advanced on Warsaw in a massive encirclement attack. After heavy shelling and bombing, Warsaw surrendered to the Germans on September 27, 1939. Britain and France, standing by their guarantee of Poland's border, had declared war on Germany on September 3, 1939. The Soviet Union invaded eastern Poland on September 17, 1939. The demarcation line for the partition of German- and Soviet-occupied Poland was along the Bug River."

 

2,000 tanks, 1,000 planes.  A well planned major offensive.  Poland was obviously no threat to Nazi Germany.

Britain and France had a sitzkreig.  So much for them wanting to go to war with Hitler.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 22:55 | 4757574 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

Did the British plutocrats tell the Poles, when they offered their total support treaty, that they wouldn't move a finger for Poland and that it was only about destroying the German economic system that excluded the international banks from parasiting? And did the Brits tell the Poles that they would ally with Stalin, and that Poland would come under Bolshevik rulership? That they would ally with the Bolsheviks and cover any genocide against the Polish middle and upper class, for example like in Katyn and blame it on the Germans after the war?

Just another victim in the plutocratic chessgame for their plan of world dominance. Just like these days Ukraine. Or last year Lybia. Or Syria. Or Afghanistan. Or Iraq. It are the same forces.

Would the Poles have signed that treaty and rejected the German hand, if they would have known, how they were used only as tool to involve Germany into a war, knowing well, that Poland would have no chance and that their suffering was just collateral damage to increase the profits of the international banksters regime?

 

2,000 tanks, 1,000 planes.  A well planned major offensive.  Poland was obviously no threat to Nazi Germany.

And ofcourse it was. Everyone knew that a German - Polish war was inevitable with the continued killings of Germans.

Or do you believe, if the Ukraine coup government would kill Russian farmers that Russia would not intervene at some point?!

The world knew, that Germany and Poland was steering torwards war and that the Plutocrats did everything to increase the problems.

It's a result of the ridiculous anti-German after war propaganda, that removed the whole development and cause for the German reaction to paint the picture of a German aggression, while the facts clearly show, that the plutocrats and the Jews escalated the German - Polish war to a European war and later to a world war. Intentionally!

Just like they do today!

 

And following the argument that Poland was no threat (although it clearly was for the killed Germans!) France would have also been no threat to Germany, because it was finished in six weeks, only two weks longer than Poland. While btw, one third of France was not occupied by the intolerant Nazis. They even let France it's fleet! Which later was attacked and destroyed by the Brits... And German soldiers had to step down on the street, when they were approaching French citizens on the pavewalk.

Not occupying the whole country? Not burning the nations books? No atrocity propaganda against the defeated enemy? Leaving the country it's own government and administration? That's indeed not plutocratic, not Jewish, that's total Nazi intolerance...

And at least Poland was a bigger threat to Germany as Iraq or Vietnam to the USA, wasn't it?

And since Germans were killed under Polish occupation the international laws were absolutely clear on the side of Germany anyway.

Btw, where are the American or British or Canadian settlements in Iraq? In Serbia? In Afghanistan?

Especially the inspection of the German - Polish war is an eye opener about the tactics of the plutocratic forces.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 16:55 | 4756410 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"You might want to look at the members of various war commissions and treasury positions in FDR's cabinet. You might want to examine the lend lease program and wholesale shipment of complete factories to the USSR PRIOR to WWII, as well as other war materials. You might want to read up on Allied concessions to Soviet territorial requests at the end of the war.You could look into the transfer of nuclear weapon secrets by jewish members as well. Not to mention the actions of Churchill prior to 1925 and after."

 

You might want to look at the fact that Hitler declared war on the U.S.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 16:58 | 4756418 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"You might want to read up on Allied concessions to Soviet territorial requests at the end of the war."

 

You might want to look at the fact that 20 milllion Russians died in WW2.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:18 | 4756487 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Do provide a source. Most of those russians were killed by the Soviets. The Jewish commisars were driving the soldiers at the front and shooting them in the back if they faltered. They often ran to be german prisoners. But then, the jews never really care how many gentiles are killed, they are just mules, slaves to work for their jewish masters. 

No you'll probably just resort to neener, neener. 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:37 | 4756552 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Do provide a source. Most of those russians were killed by the Soviets. The Jewish commisars were driving the soldiers at the front and shooting them in the back if they faltered."

 

It is called the internet.  Multiple sources, which anti-semites would not be interested in.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:45 | 4756568 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

I'm interested. But, you actually have to provide citations, kind of like I have provided books. Unless you're chicken...or a liar- a jewish liar, hmmm, haven't run across one of those before.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 18:02 | 4756653 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"I'm interested. But, you actually have to provide citations, kind of like I have provided books. Unless you're chicken...or a liar- a jewish liar, hmmm, haven't run across one of those before."

 

Of coarse you are not interested.

 

Hitler certainly lied.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 18:19 | 4756720 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Pants on fire?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 18:34 | 4756786 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Pants on fire?"

 

Hitler's were.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:13 | 4756462 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Only because the US declaed war on Japan. Treaty obligtion. Further, the US had been attacking German shipping long before a declaration was made. These US actions PRECEDED any action on the part of Germany. Are you intentionally ignorant?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:57 | 4756607 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"Only because the US declaed war on Japan. Treaty obligtion. Further, the US had been attacking German shipping long before a declaration was made. These US actions PRECEDED any action on the part of Germany. Are you intentionally ignorant?"

 

"Escorting convoys meant that America was entering an undecalred naval war with Germany in the North Atlantic. The first U.S. freighter, the Robin Moor was torpedoed by a German U-boat and sunk May 21. The lifeboats were found June 10. Hitler was still intent on keeping America out of the War, especially as he was about to invade the Soviet Union, and ordered Doenitz's U-boats to avoid all U.S. warships. The U.S. destroyer Greer on September 4 attacked the U-652, eluded 2 torpedos."

U.S freighter torpedoed by Germany.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 18:17 | 4756712 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

"It was reported that the American Navy had been ordered to fire without warning or provocationon any german warship; American commanders concerned were instructed to deny responsibility and to suggest a British unit was involved. Thus Roosevelt hoped to provoke countermeasures. All these facts Hitler learned from intercepted US naval code signals." July 20, 1939 

The Robin Moor was sunk in 1941.

Pg 423. "Hitler's War", David Irving

That was better, but when you are desperately seeking internet citations, rather than doing the hard work of studying history, you can become exposed. 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 18:27 | 4756748 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"That was better, but when you are desperately seeking internet citations, rather than doing the hard work of studying history, you can become exposed. "

 

I can see that you are desperate.

 

"FDR also protested the September 5 sinking of U.S. freighter Steel Seafarer clearly flying U.S. flag. He gave the Navy orders to "shoot-on-sight"

 

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:12 | 4756925 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

Again 1941 and the bomber was unidentified. You sure you want to keep going? You're not very good at this.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 21:50 | 4757463 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

The US was officially neutral but was de facto in war against Germany.

The US was not only supporting Germany's enemies, but US ships were also reporting locations of German ships to the British navy.

If the declaration of war from Germany shows one thing, that Germany was acting truthful, while the Jewish warmongers around Roosevelt did everything to get the USA into war, while this high grade freemason had run his presidential campaign with thepromise to keep the USA out of a war.

Interestingly before the elections this plutocrat had a meeting with the Warner Brothers and other big Jewish media owners and he asked them, how long it would take to turn the public opinion on a war against Germany and they estimated six months.

Nice Jewish "democracy"...

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 18:19 | 4756719 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"The Anti semitic propaganda charge is the essence of propaganda itself."

 

"Joseph Goebbels: Hitler’s Propaganda Minister

In January 1933, Hitler became the German chancellor, and in March of that year he appointed Goebbels the country’s minister for public enlightenment and propaganda. In this capacity, Goebbels had complete jurisdiction over the content of German newspapers, magazines, books, music, films, stage plays, radio programs and fine arts. His mission was to censor all opposition to Hitler and present the chancellor and the Nazi Party in the most positive light while stirring up hatred for Jewish people."

 

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 18:25 | 4756739 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

All learned at the feet of Edward Bernays- a jew. You have to do your homework. Sloppy, sloppy, sloppy...

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 18:30 | 4756765 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"All learned at the feet of Edward Bernays- a jew. You have to do your homework. Sloppy, sloppy, sloppy..."

 

Goebbels wasn't Jewish.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:13 | 4756933 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

However, Bernays is the recognized father of propaganda. Do you do any research or just write whatever sounds good to you.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 20:56 | 4757272 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"However, Bernays is the recognized father of propaganda. Do you do any research or just write whatever sounds good to you."

 

"PHINEAS T. BARNUM was a 19th Century circus promoter and press agent, a showman in every sense of the word. He staged bizarre events and generated sensational publicity for his circus. His association with public relations lies in his mastery of promotion and press agentry, out of which has developed the publicity model of public relations."

 

"You can fool..."

 

"EDWARD CLARKE and BESSIE TYLER established the Southern Publicity Association, which created a promotional campaign for the Ku Klux Klan, increasing KKK membership from a few thousand in 1920 to 3 million in 1923."

 

"PENDLETON DUDLEY, a pioneer public relations consultant, opened an agency on Wall Street in 1909. Dudley emphasized the public information model of public relations. Today Dudley-Anderson-Yutzy, a subsidiary of Ogilvy & Mather Advertising, is admired for its introduction of innovative techniques to win public approval."

 

"HENRY FORD in the first decade of the 1900's was the first major industrialist to make extensive use of two basic public relations concepts – positioning and accessibility to the media. Ford's public relations counselor was EARL NEWSOM, who worked behind-the-scenes in a planning capacity, with Ford bearing the public persona of his company."

"WILLIAM WOLFF SMITH in 1902 opened the nation's second public relations agency, a firm in Washington DC specializing in influencing legislators through publicity. The firm, which lasted only until 1911, specialized in press agentry to businesses defending themselves against muckrakers."

"GEORGE WESTINGHOUSE established the first corporate in-house public relations department in 1889, headed by journalist E. H. HEINRICHS. The department was charged with promoting Westinghouse's alternating current against the direct current of Edison General Electric Company."

"EDWARD BERNAYS was a press agent and public relations consultant to many clients, including Presidents Woodrow Wilson and Calvin Coolidge, the American Tobacco Company, General Electric, Alcoa, the American Dental Association, Dodge Motors, the NAACP, and many others. In 1923 wrote Crystallizing Public Relations, which provided principles and practices for an emerging profession. At New York University, he taught the first college course in public relations."

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 23:00 | 4757673 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

"Propaganda" by Edward Bernays. 1928 You really need to get out more often.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 22:32 | 4757567 moneybots
moneybots's picture

"The holocaust is not well documented, merely written about and passed off as true."

 

That is a false claim.

 

"In the Auschwitz archives one can inspect the architectural drawings for Crematoria 4 and 5. These call for 30 x 40cm windows, through which Zyklon B was to be thrown. In February 1943 the Auschwitz Construction Office issued a work order for the 'production of 12 gas-tight doors (window shutters) approximately 30/40cm'. In Auschwitz there remain a number of decrepit 30 x 40cm window shutters. The remnants of a gas-tight seal are still visible around their edges. The handle for closing the windows is on the outside, a decidedly impractical arrangement for any room, unless one wanted to ensure that those inside could not open them"

 

"Deniers have said for years that physical evidence is lacking because they have seen no holes in the roof of the Birkenau gas chamber where the Zyklon was poured in. (In some of the gas chambers the Zyklon B was poured in through the roof, while in others it was thrown in through the windows.) The roof was dynamited at war's end, and today lies broken in pieces, but three of the four original holes were positively identified in a recent paper. Their location in the concrete matches with eyewitness testimony, aerial photos from 1944, and a ground photo from 1943. The physical evidence shows unmistakably that the Zyklon holes were cast into the concrete when the building was constructed."

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 23:21 | 4757727 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

The crematoriums were for rampant typhus.

An American Officer Spreaks out: "I was in Dauchau for 17 months after the war, as a US war departmment attorney and can state there were no gas chambers at Dachau. What was shown to visitors and sightseers there and erroneously described as a gas chamber was a crematory. Nor was there a gas chamber in any of the other concentration camps in germany. We were told there was a gas chamber in Auschwitz, but since this was in the Russian zone of occupation, we were not permitted to investigate since the Russians would not allow it.From what I was able to determine in six years of post war Germany and Austria, there were a number of jews killed, but the figure of a million was certainly never reached. I interviewed thousands of jews,former inmates of concentration camps in Germany and Austria and consider myself as well qualified on the subject as any man" Stephen F Pinter, Sunday Visitor, June 24th 1959.

" BY reason of heavy bombing road communications had been destroyed and no supplies had reached the camp (Belsen), typhoid fever ensued and hundreds of prisoners had died as a consequence. The Allies arrived on the scene and found a terrible situation". The Golden Horizon, Weidenfeld and Nicholson, London.

Read "Witness to History" by Michael Walsh. There is plenty more. Your refusal to examine documents that would change your views is the only falsity here.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:23 | 4754966 moneybots
moneybots's picture

""Germany issued debt-free and interest-free money from 1935 and on, accounting for its startling rise from the depression to a world power in 5 years. Germany financed its entire government and war operation from 1935 to 1945 without gold and without debt"

 

"When the Nazis came to power the most pressing issue was an unemployment rate of close to 30%. The economic policies of the Third Reich were in the beginning the brainchildren of Hjalmar Schacht, who assumed office as president of the central bank under Hitler in 1933, and became finance minister in the following year. Schacht was one of the few finance ministers to take advantage of the freedom provided by the end of the gold standard to keep interest rates low and government budget deficits high, with massive public works funded by large budget deficits."

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 09:03 | 4754182 TrumpXVI
TrumpXVI's picture

I'm wondering about buying the book.  Halbrook is an excellent scholar, so I'm inclined to buy it and think through for myself my own conclusions.  

It's true that the Nazis not only encouraged gun ownsership (for Nazis), but IIRC, they REQUIRED it of all Party members.  This created problems in locating sufficient production capacity for handguns.  The Nazis, I'm pretty sure my history is correct on this, pressed EVERY handgun production source in all of occupied Europe into full production and they STILL couldn't produce enough handguns to enable full compliance with their "Every Party member must be armed.", (plus military procurement) decree.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:37 | 4756550 goneYonder
goneYonder's picture

Wow, just when you start to get the faintest glimmer of hope that maybe people are beginning to wise up, you read something like this post and the replies to it. Here is a clue: There is no such thing as Austrian Economics. Chew on that for a bit.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:31 | 4756957 Sean7k
Sean7k's picture

No, but there is an Austrian school of economics and it is shortened in the interest of brevity. It alludes to the number of economists associated with the Unversity in Vienna: Menger, Balwerk, Schumpeter, Mises, Hayek etc. and their general agreement on certain principles regarding time preference and capital. Chewed, spit out.

Wed, 05/14/2014 - 09:59 | 4758667 goneYonder
goneYonder's picture

Yes, thank you. And 2+2=4, by the way. I wasn't making a point of semantics. Let me spell it out: There is freedom or there is not freedom. That's it. Everything else is mere elaboration and, excuse me for saying, wordiness.

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 22:35 | 4753289 Bill of Rights
Bill of Rights's picture

If you have to hide it, its time to use it.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:23 | 4756047 fallout11
fallout11's picture

DWM (Deutsche Waffen und Munitionsfabriken), the single largest manufacturer of German military small arms, was created and owned by Ludwig Loewe, a Jew. After his death the company (and his substantial estate) was seized by the Nazis.

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 21:40 | 4753124 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

+ (7.62 * 39)

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 22:10 | 4753208 Kilobar
Kilobar's picture

Commie pop-gun. 7.62X51!

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 23:29 | 4753436 Seize Mars
Seize Mars's picture

.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 00:44 | 4753644 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

7.62x39 is just fine for a little room-to-room or house-to-house social work with holo red dot, assuming you ran out of 00 and slugs for the 12GA. On the other hand, my 7.62x51 is zeroed @ 500 yds and known holdover out to 1000 yds - 8 ring or better, prone off a bipod and off-the-shelf LE Savage bolt and moderate scope (very rookie F-Class). Shot and verified. Plenty of ammo from the same XM118LR batch.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 02:48 | 4753765 Manthong
Manthong's picture

.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 08:16 | 4754026 MeMongo
MeMongo's picture

@remus

Mongo's assuming you don't live in a small apt in New York City!

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:49 | 4755934 RallyRoundTheFamily
RallyRoundTheFamily's picture

That was awesome thanks

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 00:48 | 4753653 Schmuck Raker
Schmuck Raker's picture

"What is your major malfunction, numbnuts?!!

Didn't
Mommy and Daddy show you enough
attention when you were a child?!!!"

>BANG<
Tue, 05/13/2014 - 17:22 | 4756501 Monty Burns
Monty Burns's picture

The main tenet of this articel is grossly misleading. I KNOW that there was not a mass confiscation of guns in Nazi Germany. I don't know the legalities or any of the other stuff Ms. Kline writes about but I do know that there was never a mass confiscation.

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 21:23 | 4753074 Slave
Slave's picture

You want my rifles? You have an open invitation to come and get them.

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 21:31 | 4753095 JuliaS
JuliaS's picture

Never bring a rifle to a drone fight.

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 22:38 | 4753301 Leraconteur
Leraconteur's picture

This is a variant on the anti-gun crowd's canard that 'you would lose against a modern army'.

Ok, let's look at that claim.

Point 1

You fight:

How many DECADES has the USA been in Iraq and Afghanistan? Afghanis make weapons in caves. Iraqi's have engaged in urban warfare at length, to a protracted stalemate.

So if you fight, you can win or draw. You may die, moving on to

Point 2

You fight and die:

Anti-gun nuts claim it's better to live than not.

I quote a great North American (but don't say that to Mexicans, Mexico is not in North America from their pov), Emilio Salazar Zapata:

"Prefiero morir de pie que vivir de rodillas."

This cannot be debated. Either you are a human who will tolerate living as a slave, or you are not. I allow the slaves to live on their knees - I merely ask that they allow me to die a free man on my feet. But they cannot do that, and that is the issue. They want to force me to live on my knees because it is best for me.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 00:30 | 4753615 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

Afghanistan, like the original 13 colonies, were repelling foreign invaders. Using of The Tool of the State (a.k.a. the gun), will not defeat The State. French and Bolshevik Revolutions teach us precisely that what comes after, is even worse. Perhaps arms represent a paradox....we should have them, so that we do not need them.

Si vis pacem para bellum

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 02:00 | 4753739 TBT or not TBT
TBT or not TBT's picture

ICBM are the equivalent for states. Volleys of those can kill a state.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 07:38 | 4753969 N2OJoe
N2OJoe's picture

An effective strategy vs drones and air power may be not to "stand" and fight at all but rather to adopt the WWII French resistance strategy.

Small, disposable single shot or derringer type weapons to pick off individual occupiers whenever the opportunity presents itself. An entire nation doing this could cause horrible attrition to the occupying force and vastly demoralize their will to join/fight for the tyrants.

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 22:28 | 4753266 fishmonger
fishmonger's picture

If they come for your guns, make sure to give them the ammunition first.

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 21:26 | 4753082 Van Halen
Van Halen's picture

You want my rifles?

Well... here!

Signed,

Every Obama voter in America.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 05:53 | 4753858 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture

 

 

You know how half white people will do you...

Mon, 05/12/2014 - 21:30 | 4753083 hobopants
hobopants's picture

"political power grows out of the barrel of a gun"

That's pretty much both sides of the argument, public safety ain't got shit to do with it.

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