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6 Ukraine Soldiers Killed, 8 Injured Ahead Of Tomorrow's "Leave Or Face War" Deadline

Tyler Durden's picture




 

With another day left until the 48-hour "leave or face war" deadline imposed by the newly-independent regions of Ukraine, Interfax is reporting:

  • *SIX UKRAINE SOLDIERS KILLED, 8 INJURED AFTER CONVOY ATTACK: IFX
  • *ATTACK ON UKRAINIAN ARMY CONVOY NEAR SEPARATIST-HELD SLOVYANSK

This follows earlier concerns from Germany's Schaeuble who said he "can imagine" a worsening of the Ukraine crisis. As AP reports,

Ukraine's defense ministry says 6 servicemen ambushed, killed in the restive east.

And from the Ukraine defense ministry:

Today
, May 13 , about 13.00 on the outskirts of the village Oktyabrske ,
Slavic district, 20 km from Kramatorska , while driving a convoy of
military units of the Armed Forces of Ukraine was cynical and insidious
fired from an ambush .
Terrorists attacked the Ukrainian paratroopers with grenade launchers, were busy aimed fire with small arms.

 

Over 30 attackers arrived early and were located along the river in the bushes. The first shot from a grenade launcher terrorists hit the engine of the other BTRiv who approached the bridge. There was an explosion. Other BTR tried to push the damaged fighting machine that caught fire , away from the village. The soldiers took the fight .

 

After the first volley of heavy weapons from terrorists killed two soldiers, 3 more were wounded. Overall, as a result of prolonged clashes killed 6 members of the Armed Forces of Ukraine . 8 injured varying degrees of severity.

 

All the wounded and dead were evacuated.

if this is any indication what to expect tomorrow when yesterday's 48 hour ultimatum expires, the S&P should easily hit 2000 when the Ukraine civil war bursts out of the gate.

 

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Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:07 | 4754857 ShortTheUS
ShortTheUS's picture

If 6 dead soldiers is considered 'restive,' I fear what armed conflict might bring about...

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:17 | 4754905 sushi
sushi's picture

I forecast that Russia will undertake military action for the express purpose of protecting the ukrainian military from the democratic resistance against the putschists.

Kerry and the rest have been demanding this of Russia. The only way for Russia to comply with such a request would be to invade and exert control to prevent a failed state / civil war occuring on its periphery.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:17 | 4754923 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

Old Russian Proverb:

Russians  are slow to mount, but fast to ride.  

Onward to Berlin, ooops Kiev.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:22 | 4754956 BadDog
BadDog's picture

the fires of the tigers are lighting the road to berlin...Roads to Moscow, Al Stewart.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:24 | 4754971 Arius
Arius's picture

You will be the dummiest guy to buy gold at this point .... thats the all point of recommendations from BoA and Morgan Stanley and relentless efforts to keep it under 1300 just to make people shy away ... not sure how successful they are

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:46 | 4755395 Oracle 911
Oracle 911's picture

6 Blackwater mercs killed, 8 Injured. Fixed for ya.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:05 | 4755748 ebear
ebear's picture

Could be mercs doing the killing.  Wouldn't be the first time Kiev fired on its own guys.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:29 | 4755009 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

"The Russians are slow to saddle up, but ride fast" Otto Von Bismarck

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:18 | 4755268 Overdrawn
Overdrawn's picture

So not worth sleeping with I guess.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:31 | 4755026 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

Berlin?  Berlin will only be a pit stop.  Berlin, Paris, and now, London featuring the chunnel.  Napolean and Hitler rolled over in their graves when the chunnel was completed.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:40 | 4755086 Winston of Oceania
Winston of Oceania's picture

A bit of explosive would render the chunnel utterly useless...

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 19:04 | 4756885 mrpxsytin
mrpxsytin's picture

Which is why I personally would flood the tunnel rather than blow it, so that one day (when sanity prevails) it can be reopened with minimal effort.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:16 | 4755263 Overdrawn
Overdrawn's picture

If Russian gets to Berlin can they please put the wall back up to stop all those Romanians entering the UK please.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:51 | 4755417 anarcholeptic
anarcholeptic's picture

In Mother Russia....____________  Fill in the fuckin blank

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:07 | 4755993 GoldBricker
GoldBricker's picture

I dunno,

credit card max you out?

'locally sourced' means local thugs, not globalist thugs?

patriots die fighting, and I don't mean on internet fight club

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:08 | 4755998 Nevsky
Nevsky's picture

Try this one

'Which Russian doesn't like a fast ride'

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 18:40 | 4756807 jerry_theking_lawler
jerry_theking_lawler's picture

You obviously have never dated a russian woman.....

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:15 | 4754912 kliguy38
kliguy38's picture

Its called foreplay. The "action Jackson" will begin in earnest tomorrow

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:18 | 4754933 WhyDoesItHurtWh...
WhyDoesItHurtWhen iPee's picture

Laying there in their caskets they look so "restive".  I think thats what they were going for.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 20:30 | 4757206 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

"Release the Kraken!"

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:07 | 4754858 Hippocratic Oaf
Hippocratic Oaf's picture

Bullish

Couldn't resist, I know

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:09 | 4754862 km4
km4's picture

New Zealand: the Shell Company Incorporation Franchises (II) (and Ukraine) #NakedCapitalism http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2014/05/new-zealand-shell-company-incorpo...

Kaleniuk explains:

What we found was that the money stolen in Ukraine was heading into British and European tax havens and hidden using shell companies inside the European Union. This was very uncomfortable to find out. What we felt is the Western elites were being hypocritical to us—preaching anti-corruption but allowing this offshore world to flourish.

In  posts to come, we develop a nuts-and bolts view of these very looting mechanisms; mechanisms which, in Ben Judah’s phrase, sank Western soft power. The relevance of the story told by the New Zealand register continues to grow, and it’s time to bring it up to date.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:12 | 4754873 Smegley Wanxalot
Smegley Wanxalot's picture

Damn it,  why wasn't Nuland there, passing out pastries?

And where are those Kiev-humping assholes who celebrated torching people alive in a building now?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:30 | 4755017 williambanzai7
williambanzai7's picture

She is busy giving Soros his daily rim job.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:57 | 4755171 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

Sucks when you get too old to wipe yourself...unless you are rich and surrounded by degenerate whores.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:37 | 4755356 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

Around the world.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:08 | 4755226 Flagit
Flagit's picture

 

 

Damn it,  why wasn't Nuland there, passing out pastries?

 

She was probably busy crying about not being able to restore her native land of Bessarabia, which is now once again, more or less under Russian influence.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:36 | 4755869 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

Nuland has her bank account in Israel, she is well taken care of. Where is the 5 billion she spent to fund a nazi coup? Wanna guess how much made it's way to Israel?

So, by tomorrow the Ukrainian Waffen SS divisons are to leave or be destroyed? I suspect that this is no minor threat, to my knowledge none of the East Ukraines newly organized self defense forces have engaged in battle yet. Maybe some members of the civil defense forces, but East Ukraine has quietly been building up forces with real weapons and experience as trained soldiers. By real weapons, I mean infantry operated missiles for anti tank and anti aircraft defense. We saw three or four Ukraine Army Helicopters shot down last week by a self proclaimed Donestsk anti aircraft regiment of the self defense forces. The really good weapons are more deadly than westerners know, because these weapons do not leave the region for export. It is not beyond reality to think sympathetic Russian forces have let the most modern of infantry weapons and missiles cross the border. I saw a video of a Self Defnse unit manning a check point this week. Mounted off to the side was what I took to be a model of one of the worlds best anti tank missiles systems, small, modern, compact, easy to move and programed to be deadly against tanks. This kind pops up before impact to strike the thin armor of the turret roof. The Ukrainian army will not sit still when it's tank start to go up in flames, they will run, and I don't blame them. Who wants to die to futher the Kiev nazi agenda, who wants to die for NATO expansion in Donetsk? Nobody does, only the Right Sector, but they kill civilians on the streets, a well trained soldier could scatter a hundred fat, drunken Right Sector thugs.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:41 | 4756121 sushi
sushi's picture

Good analysis.

Plus Ukraine had mass conscription until very recently so even the civilians will have the same military knowledge as the putschist forces.

In addition there have been mass defections, or stand downs, of active units. The 25th Airborne was one of these and it was subsequently disbanded by the coup leaders. No word on what happened to all of its light arms. I suspect that the ex-members of the unit could tell us. I suspect that what you saw in that video was an example of the sophisticated weaponry available to the democratic resistance of Donetsk (DRD).

I was voted down for my suggesstion up top but I think it likely the following will occur;

1) The DRD commences to defend its territory and there is open conflict with the Banderista's

2) I anticipate the DRD will prevail. they are after all fighting for thier home lands against a group of thugs, bandits and mercs, not to mention a sleezebag, untrustworthy and illegitimate governmnet of oligarchs. I place my bet on the people to win and the oligarchs to loose.

3) NATO, EU, Kerry, Nudelstan and all the rest then seek to assist the oliigarchs put down the democratic resistance by increased military assistance. In Iraq and Libiya the grounds for intervention were based on the state using military force against the people. In Ukraine the west will intervene in support of the state using military force against its own people.

4) Things get messy and confused, the conflict grows, more lives are lost. 

5) At some point Russia intervenes. It will do so for three reasons;

5a - the responsibilty to protect doctrine used by the west in Iraq and Libya. Russia will seek to prevent the state using military force against its own people. This may be through the creation of no-fly zones, air interdiction strikes and possibly ground forces.

5b- Russia will act as the West has demanded that Russia control the democratic resistance on the grounds that these people are Russian proxies. I believe them to be independent citizens acting to defend themselves against a government that has openly spoke of nuking them, eliminating their language rights and culture, making them second class citizens in theor own lands etc, etc.

Since the West has repeatedly demanded Russia control its alleged proxies, Russia will turn around and say "OK, you win. We are going to do something about these DRD folks. We are going to establish military control and enforce a peace until a political solution can be arrived at.

5c - Russia has grounds to act based on the coming into being of a failed state on its periphery with that state being engaged in miliatry actions on the Russian border and acting against slavik peoples. If there were a civil war in Mexico would the USSA intervene. You bet. Russia will do the same.

 

Wed, 05/14/2014 - 02:41 | 4757968 The Blank Stare
The Blank Stare's picture

Untill Colin Powell is resurected, goes to the UN and holds up a toy model of "worlds best anti tank missiles systems" I won't believe what you say.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:13 | 4754893 gcjohns1971
gcjohns1971's picture

Deadline was too short.

There is no possible way to comply - even if they wanted to.

The short deadline GUARANTEED military conflict = was totally unnecessary.

Should have asked to leave within 30 days, with milestones for percentages leaving, and asked for meeting with Ukrainian commander to coordinate movement & schedule.

Arbitrary demands of men with guns do not end well. They should have been able to see that in advance.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:18 | 4754932 SpanishGoop
SpanishGoop's picture

They were able to get more forces in in a couple of days so surely they must be able to gat them out just as fast.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:21 | 4754946 Sticky Wicket
Sticky Wicket's picture

It's hard to pull out when it feels so good.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:25 | 4754978 SpanishGoop
SpanishGoop's picture

Been there, didn't do that, still sorry.

"Shut up child, daddy is typing".

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:29 | 4755586 MarsInScorpio
MarsInScorpio's picture

Believing that Ukraine can't get out in a couple of days is on the same level as believing it takes 7 years to repatriate a hundred tons of German gold . . .

-30-

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:29 | 4755839 gcjohns1971
gcjohns1971's picture

Reasons?

Can YOUR company abandon a base of operations that has been in use since WWII in 48 hours?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 20:39 | 4757229 angel_of_joy
angel_of_joy's picture

Yes, if your life depends on it...

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:19 | 4754936 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

The Italian(or French) army could handle 48 hours no problems.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:47 | 4755922 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

Sort of cheating...when they were never actually on the battlefield in the first place....

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 16:07 | 4756235 messystateofaffairs
messystateofaffairs's picture

Yeah but the Italians have five speeds in reverse on their tanks and only 1st gear in forward.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:21 | 4754950 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

dumb comment   they could march out in 48 hours

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:25 | 4755824 gcjohns1971
gcjohns1971's picture

Your reasons are deafening in their silence.

 

Ukrainian troops had been there since they were called 'Soviet' troops. 

It is not normal for the Army to keep locals in the area they came from because it makes for Army units who can't work with the units from elsewhere.

It is normal for soldiers to be moved away from where they enlisted, and to be moved periodically in order to standardize procedures across the Army.

Those soldiers, by decree, just became homeless, jobless, and under threat of arrest if they don't defect immediately. 

But those same soldiers remain armed.  The ones who had not chosen a side yet were just forced to fight.

That was the 'brilliance' of the short ultimatum.

You will see more killing there in the next week, which was not there last week because of this stupid decision that was made by incompetents and demons.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:48 | 4755927 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

...Ukrainian troops had been there since they were called 'Soviet' troops....

Then they should have no problem switching out the Uke patch for the new Russian one.

asshat

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:11 | 4756010 GoldBricker
GoldBricker's picture

They wouldn't have been the first ones, either.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:27 | 4755830 gcjohns1971
gcjohns1971's picture

You have obviously never coordinated loading of large amounts of materiel on a train.

You are dreaming.   And your logic is even weaker than the reasons you offered (none).

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:13 | 4756017 GoldBricker
GoldBricker's picture

How much material you think this US left in Vietnam? When it's your life, you go. Maybe not you, of course, just a figure of speech.

Victoria, is that you?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:56 | 4755159 socalbeach
socalbeach's picture

Irrelevant point since Kiev said "special operation" to continue. Read a similar thing yesterday also.

.

Kiev to Continue Special Operation in Southeastern Ukraine – Interim Leader

15:47 13/05/2014

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:40 | 4755371 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

.

Arbitrary demands of men with guns do not end well.

Government. You're talking about government.

 

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:37 | 4755780 gcjohns1971
gcjohns1971's picture

Exactly,

 

Government loves bureaucracy - which has the minor benefit of reducing the arbitrary demands, because no one wants the extra red tape to file the demands.

 

I see that everyone hated the post.  The problem is that there are no answers in hate.

Armies aren't generated solely locally, nor are they made only of conscripts.  Some of the Ukrainian soldiers were going to be from elsewhere in the Ukraine, who had been stationed there years before.  Those people will have families, houses, and all the rest.

With the stroke of the pen this demand makes them jobless, homeless, and under threat of arrest.  That is why it is shortsighted.

Some of those people might have decided to switch to Donetsk.  They won't now.  Now that Donetsk has offered to rob and imprison them for doing exactly what they did last week, last month, last year, etc.  They are not going to be friendly.  And that will make a violent revolt in Donetsk.

Also there is the Ukrainian Army equipment, air defense installations, etc.  At this time last week that equipment was there legitimately, as it had been for years if not decades.  It may have nothing whatsoever to do with the unrest.   Now, it has to be gone in 48 hours.  And the operators have to perhaps separate permanently from their families to stay in Donetsk or leave their jobs and homes behind.

That is why it is not a realistic timeline.  It is impossible.  And it was never meant to be possible.  It was meant to facilitate a robbery.

There are two explanations for the short timeline. 

ONE:  They might have hoped that this would trigger those who haven't chosen a side to defect to Donetsk and steal equipment from Ukraine to do it.  I discount this.  Ukraine will not voluntarily surrender its Army equipment.

TWO:  They wanted bloodshed for their own reasons.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 16:01 | 4756201 Omen IV
Omen IV's picture

Tanks don't have to make UTurns - all they do is turn the turret around and go

no notice is necessary when they came in noee required to leave

as Brad Pitt said in Inglorious Bastards: " I like to kill Nazi's! - should be the tag line

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:13 | 4754896 ObamaDepression
ObamaDepression's picture

Looks like our Spaetnaz friends are back.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:26 | 4754985 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Nyet  locals

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:52 | 4755947 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

Nyet...

It's the Wolverines! Yikes!

 Things are so fucking sideways these days you can sub in Russians for Wolverines and it works.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:15 | 4754907 SpanishGoop
SpanishGoop's picture

Good or bad depends on if there where entering or exiting the area.

If they where on the way back to Kiev they should have let them go.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:16 | 4754918 the not so migh...
the not so mighty maximiza's picture

cossacks

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:18 | 4754930 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Schnauble, Germany's answer to poison dwarfs.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:37 | 4755059 Itchy and Scratchy
Itchy and Scratchy's picture

So much for the 48hr warning! And no Obamacrae neither!

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:38 | 4755063 b_thunder
b_thunder's picture

Thre are witness reports of hundreds of Chechen fighters aremed with AKs, RPGs and Stinger missiles on the streets of Eastern Ukrainian cities (how did they get from Chechnya to Ukraine?  hmmm...)  Chechens, like Taliban, are well trained and experiened in tergeting military convoys.

And if you ask how the heck did the ex-Chechen "terrorists" became russian mecenaries - simple:  they've been "bought" by KGB just like "Sunni awakening" in Iraq was nothing but bribery of Sunni fighters by the CIA

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:02 | 4755198 CannoncockerUSMC
CannoncockerUSMC's picture

These are a mix of Chechen official internal security troops, Chechen militia, and Chechen war volunteers who had fought with Russia. Chechen fighters do not equate to former Muslim terrorists who fought against Russia.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:20 | 4755266 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

no one I know in these region are  aware of any such, not that it won't happen.

as remember kadrov had offered help if needed to crimea

if actually there, once word got out, I doubt any half smart sent by kyiv would be hanging  around..

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:35 | 4755623 MarsInScorpio
MarsInScorpio's picture

Volk:

 

"if actually there, once word got out, I doubt any half smart sent by kyiv would be hanging  around.."

 

Maybe thatr's the idea - get the wpord out that they are there to terrify the Ukrainian troops.

 

My question: How do you think the mercenaries will react? They aren't going to be firing at unarmed cvilians - wonder just how brave they are up against a real army?

-30-

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:48 | 4755677 BlindMonkey
BlindMonkey's picture

Probably about as brave as the police.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:29 | 4755705 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

well,  Georgia Ossetia conflict...not long after chechens vostok and zapad battalions hit  battle then Georgians and "advisors" didn't stop running till they well past Tiblishi...

there were tons brand new taxpayer paid for dropped m4s, other and equipment, radios, mres supplies everything and abandoned wheel and track

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:56 | 4755959 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

The same Hardass Chechens that tore South Ossetia a brand new asshole...in record time, I might add.

Because fuck those guys.

 

Edit: Volkodav beat me to the punch line....

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:11 | 4755242 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

proof?

which cities? I have not heard any such from friends in those regions

show me some

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:03 | 4755739 gcjohns1971
gcjohns1971's picture

Channel 1 reported the Chechens were there over a month ago.

 

Of course, channel 1 reported the Chechens worked for the CIA.   I guess the bullets the americans fired at the Chechens in Afghanistan were love symbols, that earned their undying love and loyalty.

No one could ever question Channel 1's honesty or accuracy!!!

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:27 | 4755832 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

nothing you said is proof...more nonsense

post link at first or forget

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:40 | 4755895 gcjohns1971
gcjohns1971's picture

Reasons?

Is your head as empty as your words?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 11:42 | 4755096 EllaDara
EllaDara's picture

War does not determine who is right ? only who is left. ~Bertrand Russell

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:09 | 4755228 JR
JR's picture

The takeover of Ukraine, a playbook crafted by Western intelligence these past 25 years, is following instructions to a tee.

Excerpt from  Israel Shamir’s "The Spectacle in Kiev -The Brown Revolution in Ukraine," February 24 on Counterpunch.

Revolution: the Outline

The revolution deserves to be described in a few lines: Yanukovych was not too bad a president, prudent though weak. Still the Ukraine came to the edge of financial abyss. (You can read more about it in my previous piece) He tried to save the situation by allying with the EC, but the EC had no money to spare. Then he tried to make a deal with Russia, and Putin offered him a way out, without even demanding from him that the Ukraine join the Russian-led TC. This triggered the violent response of the EC and the US, as they were worried it would strengthen Russia.

The US-orchestrated attack on the elected President( Yanukovych) followed Gene Sharp’s instructions to a tee, namely: (1) seize a central square and organise a mass peaceful sit-in, (2) speak endlessly of danger of violent dispersal, (3) if the authorities do nothing, provoke bloodshed, (4) yell bloody murder, (5) the authority is horrified and stupefied and (6) removed and (7) new powers take over…

The Spectacle-like unreal quality of Kiev events was emphasized by arrival of the imperial warmonger, the neocon philosopher Bernard-Henri Levy. He came to Maidan like he came to Libya and Bosnia, claiming human rights and threatening sanctions and bombing. Whenever he comes, war is following. I hope I shall be away from every country he plans to visit. …

http://www.counterpunch.org/2014/02/24/the-brown-revolution-in-ukraine/

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:41 | 4755637 MarsInScorpio
MarsInScorpio's picture

JR:

 

"The ECB had no money"

 

Which explains why, in the end, the entire western half of Ukraine will become the straw that broke the ECB camel's back . . .

-30-

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 23:14 | 4757716 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Either the EU has to step up and pay for the Gaz/Oil Ukraine is (or already used!) using, or Russia will simply raise the price of EU gaz/oil to compensate.  Yo Eu, be sure to thank the USA for screwing up your country's finances!

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:00 | 4755168 tony wilson
tony wilson's picture

when you are blackwater,serco or g4s and you shoot a ukrainian copper or soldier or cut off the head of the chief of police in front of his wife.

do you get extra on or over the basic wage.

a head cash bonus or heart bullet cash win.

like king leopold of belgium paying gold per black hand in congo.

do you get extra for killin both sides that is the question.

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:03 | 4755203 newworldorder
newworldorder's picture

Regardless of the point on view that each of us may take on the various ethnic/political positions in Unkraine -one thnng is true and clear.

A country/government either exists or it does not. If Unkraine is not able to control its borders due to the will of its people, then that country ceases to exist. National identity is key.

In history many nations have been invaded and occupied without losing their national identity. None have survived without a strong National Identity. For Ukraine, this is their "Bunker Hill" moment. It matters not that its potential enemy is from within or without.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:51 | 4755416 geno-econ
geno-econ's picture

In th new Global Economy there is no such thing as National identity. Instead there is only Corporate profit enhanced by a political system dependant on  and controlled by financiiers and large Corporations.  Ukraine is a test case of Nationalism vs. Globalism although it is being portrayed as US empire vs. Russia empire resurgence.  If Nationalism wins in Ukraine they will be a united but smaller Nation financially dependant on Russia.  If the Global West prevails, they will be split, no longer a Nation of consequence and dismembered economically as well. Tough choice to chose between future of a fiat global economy or maintaining a national identity not beholding to East or West. Suspect most will vote with their wallet in the industrial  East to remain in Russian orbit and maintain some form of national identity 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:42 | 4755377 rodonmeguro
rodonmeguro's picture

Now that neighbor invasion is ligitimized, let's get after Cuba and Mexico. There's some great ocean front real estate there just waiting to be developed.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 12:57 | 4755430 IndianaJohn
IndianaJohn's picture

Rodon, -- you got blood and treasure in Cuba or Mexico?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:22 | 4755547 Hmmmmm
Hmmmmm's picture

I think you might have a hard time with the voting part of the plan.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:42 | 4755905 Boogity
Boogity's picture

The USA already tried the invade Cuba thing at the Bay of Pigs and gots its azzzz handed to 'em. 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:02 | 4755979 IndyPat
IndyPat's picture

should we wave to the north bound mexican illegals on our way to Cancun?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:02 | 4755454 laomei
laomei's picture

lol, since when is killing soldiers "terrorism"?  The instant that uniform goes on, you are fair game and marked for death.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:04 | 4755465 Jason T
Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:05 | 4755473 IndianaJohn
IndianaJohn's picture

That 48 hour deadline don't sound right. I ain't too smart, but even I know that a move begins with a step and the turn of the wheel. 48 hours?

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:41 | 4755638 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

why? could march out inside 48 hour

they arrived in only few hours....

you make no sense

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:12 | 4755498 fxchange
fxchange's picture

protesters casualties:

30 in Slovyansk&Kramatorsk

48 in Odessa

20 in Mariupol

Now 6 Kiev returned, but still owes 92 (30+48+20)-6

 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:27 | 4755577 robertocarlos
robertocarlos's picture

Those soldiers killed today could just be kids in the army. They might be innocent victems or maybe not. The ones that should be killed are those who shut down that polling station the other day and shot that guy dead and the other guy in the foot.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 13:49 | 4755682 SimplePrinciple
SimplePrinciple's picture

You are known by the company you keep.  Conscripts might want to consider the consequences of fighting someone else's war.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:00 | 4755726 gcjohns1971
gcjohns1971's picture

Conscripts don't have a choice.

That is what 'conscript' means.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 21:06 | 4757329 SimplePrinciple
SimplePrinciple's picture

One always has a choice.  Some Ukranian conscripts defected from the Kiev army, duh.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:34 | 4755866 gcjohns1971
gcjohns1971's picture

We are talking about the Army in what was ITS OWN COUNTRY a few days ago.

Argue if  you like, but the US has the best logistics infrastructure in the world

How long did it take to move a few thousand bodies out of the SuperDome?

But you guys want thousands of people who have worked and lived there to abandon their homes or to defect within 48 hours?

YOU ARE DREAMING.

 

YOU HEARD IT HERE FIRST:

THE SOLDIERS WILL HAVE BEEN KILLED BY SOME OF THEIR COMRADES WHO DEFECTED.  = USELESS BLOODSHED.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:51 | 4756150 Mr. Pickles
Mr. Pickles's picture

It's not as black and white as you are making it. 48 hours may be too soon to pack up and leave entirely, but it is plenty of time to make a decision to stay or go. The logistical problems you are bringing up can be negotiated. In other words, if Right Sector (and they won't) announced they will begin withdrawal, Donetsk would sit down with them and talk about it. The goal isn't "vacate everything in 48 hours, or else" - the goal is "recognize our legitimacy within 48 hours, or we will fight for it."

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 16:19 | 4756288 blentus
blentus's picture

Hah. Ok, so now I know that you've probably never been outside US.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 14:52 | 4755914 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

I saw Yats on TV today making some statement about wanting free Russian gas to continue. Calling Putin a terrorist and demanding free gas in the same breath. What a pathetic IMF slime this Yats guy is. He looked in pretty rough shape, not getting much sleep I suspect. One eye open for his Nazi allies who might kill him, the other eye open for anti fascist Ukrainians who want to lynch his NATO ass from a tree. Plus the IMF is probably asking him for a repayment schedule to ensure the western bankers get the interest on their IMF loans. Imagine loaning Yats 3.5 billion. As if that little pick can squeeze the carrying costs out of a bankrupt Ukraine, a Ukraine in which most all wealth and tax revenue comes from the Russian East Ukraine. Yats has lost all that tax reveneue, taxes on production, value added taxes, all the real money is in the east, an east that has just declared independence from Kiev, Just like America declared independence for the King of England. The King of Kiev, Yats and the Queen of Ukraine, Yulia are beholding to a nazi street mod for their power. The bankers have handed over billions to a king and queen of nothing. This royalty rules only in Nuland's mind, Nuland believes she is a king and queen maker, when in fact, she is a fuck up.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 16:14 | 4756264 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

.

I saw Yats on TV today making some statement about wanting free Russian gas to continue. Calling Putin a terrorist and demanding free gas in the same breath. What a pathetic IMF slime this Yats guy is.

This Yats guy and other Banderastani guros are so full of it. Can't tell words without sinking into cheap propaganda. Odessans already observed it and I now better understand the torment they suffered at the hands of Ukrainian Yatzi Junta Citizenism.

But hey, Ukrainian Yatzi Junta Citizenists are like that: addicted to cheap propaganda. They spurt propaganda and in the same breath, the debunking of it.

Ukrainian Yatzi Junta Citizenists can not align two cogent ideas these days.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:06 | 4755990 Jano
Jano's picture

What Schaeuble furzt from his mouth is less imporant, then the horse s..t.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 15:49 | 4756144 messystateofaffairs
messystateofaffairs's picture

Somebody needs to tell Yatsy the Patsy that when you send armed troops uninvited and with hostile intent into sovereign territory there is a slight chance they could get killed. 

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 16:23 | 4756307 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

It is typical to the Ukrainian Yatzi Junta Citizenish way of doing things, denying the consequences of their own doings.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 16:37 | 4756362 tommylicious
tommylicious's picture

I agree the market chips out 2000 if war breaks out.  

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 21:04 | 4757318 novictim
novictim's picture

And so dies the dream of Slavic unity.

Good Job, Princess Putin.  That is one hell of a legacy.

Tue, 05/13/2014 - 22:20 | 4757539 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

What a lot of hogs wash. What a rewriting, uninspired and all...

Wed, 05/14/2014 - 11:39 | 4759166 Fractional Reserver
Fractional Reserver's picture

The European Union rules without the consent of the majority, you don't need to know much about human nature to know the explosion is just a matter of time...

Most Europeans are passionately supporting the Russian/Eastern cause because they have been sold out long time ago by their corrupt European Union politicians.

If push comes to shove which it most likely will then most European citizens will volunteer to serve in the Russian and Eastern Ukrainian armed forces and fight their own European governments tooth and nail.

Europe and the USA have to be very worried because the European Union will most likely be the cause of the next voilent and bloody conflict and we are all part of it whether we like it or not.

Most people outside of Europe don't realize what an explosive barrel Europe really is and that the fuse has been lit long time ago, you are not looking at an Ukrainian civil war but an European, mark my words.

Most Europian citizens don't feel any loyalty or obligation towards their country and the EU or the USA most of us despice them, and most of us support the Eastern cause and you are looking at an all out European civil war.

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