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Russia Has Prepared A Confidential Retaliation Document As Ukraine Set To Hold NATO Accession Referendum

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Until now Russian retaliation against Western sanctions has been largely symbolic, culminating with this week's Holy Grail gas deal with China, 10 years in the making, which would not have happened on such a truncated timeframe had it not been for western prodding. However, now Russia may be getting ready for actionable retaliation against the west. RIA reports that Russia has prepared a "confidential document" with measures in response to Western sanctions, citing Kremlin advisor Andrew Belousov.

"I can say that, while it is not a strategy, we do have a tactic. It is in the form of a document which for understandable reasons is confidential. But it clearly lists the Russian sanctions: focusing on individuals, companies, sectors, whether they are comprehensive and systemic, and if they impact the banking system" Belousov was cited as telling TV channel Rossia 24.

According to him, there is a prescribed action at each of the listed levels. "So if any further action is taken against Russia, I can say that we know precisely how to react."

And while it is unclear if the US will dare to issue any more sanctions against Russia, considering the Russian stock market is now back to pre-sanctions levels, thus proving their complete futility (and if anything will simply serve to bring Russia and China even closer), one development that would certainly infuriate Putin is the news that Ukraine may hold a NATO accession referendum as soon as June 15.

Itar-Tass reports that Ukrainian presidential nominee Yulia Tymoshenko has suggested to hold an all-Ukrainian referendum on the country’s accession to NATO to coincide with possible second round of presidential elections. The politician said this in a statement on Friday.

Tymoshenko said: “We need to make a strategic decision. This decision is the accession of Ukraine to the system of collective security and defense of NATO”.

 

The presidential nominee believes “NATO is security and peace” and “all member states of this alliance are secured from aggression”.

 

“However, no politician has the right to make such a strategic decision without people’s will. Therefore, I suggest to hold the historic, fateful referendum on Ukraine’s accession to NATO on June 15, simultaneously with the second round of presidential elections,” Tymoshenko suggested.

Whether this is simply a publicity stunt by the former presidential frontrunner whose winning chances have slipped dramatically in recent weeks leading to the very distinct possibility of a second round runoff election without a clear winner this weekend, remains unknown. However, one thing Putin made explicitly clear earlier today is that he sees NATO expansion as the single biggest threat to Russia, especially considering the implicit understanding between James Baker and Gorbachev from 1990 that Nato would not expand east. Well, NATO may not only be expanding east but it may soon be knocking on Russia's doorstep.

And that would certainly provoke the Russian bear like nothing yet seen.

 

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Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:45 | 4788735 One And Only
One And Only's picture

Upvote me if you'd enlist in the military led by Obama to fight a ground war with Russia.

This should be a fun poll.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:46 | 4788751 MeMadMax
MeMadMax's picture

That's what the draft is for fool...

And if that doesn't work, gun point works as well....

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:54 | 4788773 BC6
BC6's picture

On the list is for Russia to buy up all the manufactured golf balls, which will really hit Barry in the duff!

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:22 | 4788914 knukles
knukles's picture

Some of the MSM this morning was describing Putin as "embattled"
Uh huh....  scratching nuts

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:53 | 4789024 inky
inky's picture

 knukles if you think thats bad you should see what that fraggle prince charles was calling putin.

 

Prince Charles's Putin-Hitler comparison

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/22/prince-charles-putin-hitler-outrageous-russia 

 

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 13:15 | 4789100 svayambhu108
svayambhu108's picture

They already know they have a second round of presidential elections, nice "forecast", is hard to know who is appointed president, hardern to know when he is appointed

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 17:02 | 4789773 TheSecondLaw
TheSecondLaw's picture

One must forgive Prince Charles.  He had an absent mother. 

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 19:48 | 4790097 strannick
strannick's picture

I thought he had two dads

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 21:21 | 4790269 The_Prisoner
The_Prisoner's picture

Prince Charles really knows Nazis. His father is one.

It takes one to know one.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:33 | 4788974 Canadian Dirtlump
Canadian Dirtlump's picture

I figured this was being done by the deep state to start a war but at this point these moves in fact may have been done in order to have something hit BErri in the duff.

 

Sanctions for the down low man.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:54 | 4788774 Herd Redirectio...
Herd Redirection Committee's picture

Classic doublespeak from Tymoshenko AKA Evil Princess Leah.  (check out her pre-braids, pre-blond lawyer look, if you can)

The presidential nominee believes “NATO is security and peace” and “all member states of this alliance are secured from aggression”.

All members except...  The newest member, of course.  Who will serve to draw everyone into a global conflagration?  Lets hope not.

 

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:24 | 4788930 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

The phrasing in the article is suspect.  Her chances of winning have not just slipped.

She is expected to lose outright.  So it doesn't really matter what she proposes.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:32 | 4788968 pods
pods's picture

I'd still slip it in her pooper.

 

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 13:11 | 4789089 Canadian Dirtlump
Canadian Dirtlump's picture

Maybe just to teach her some respect, but to be honest you're probably thinking back to the old one, before she was transformed into an invalid crohn.

 

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2014/02/23/article-2565489-1BBEF838000005...

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 16:47 | 4789741 InvalidID
InvalidID's picture

sOMEONE SAID iNVALID?

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 16:21 | 4789672 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

If she's gonna act like a slut, I'd treat her to act like a propper Fluffer (that she is for her handlers).

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 17:11 | 4789786 BigJim
BigJim's picture

 I'd still slip it in her pooper.

'It' being one of the thermonuclear devices she proposed using to incinerate several million ethnic Russian Ukrainians?

http://www.businessinsider.com/ukraine-pm-wipe-out-russians-2014-3

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 16:25 | 4789682 crazzziecanuck
crazzziecanuck's picture

Ukraine can't join any more than Georgia can.

Outstanding border issues.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:55 | 4788778 linniepar
linniepar's picture

Trying to legitimize the impending war. Cocksucker banker war.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:10 | 4788866 CPL
CPL's picture

It's weird how “NATO is security and peace” usually means guns and bullets.  I wonder sometimes if people understand who they are actually working for.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:23 | 4788919 knukles
knukles's picture

Doublespeak, Winston.  It's Doublespeak.
And if you appear not to like it, we're going to put this hungry rat into the cage about your head and...

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:34 | 4788976 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

"Plan Ost" is not double speak. Too much honest maybe...but not doublespeak.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:41 | 4788945 Anasteus
Anasteus's picture

None war. Concerted Russia-China treasury dumping & cash withdrawal, while simultaneously demanding delivery of 1000 tons of gold from Crimex, would do the job in few days.

These morons are doing their best to lose everything. They perhaps forgot whose hands were holding their balls. Time for another squeeze. The only war they can launch is a civil war in the US after implosion of the economy.

Idiots.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 16:35 | 4789706 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

Like I've said before, if the US really wants a shooting war over there, it is going to have to fire the first shot, and likely soon.  Otherwise, if it looks like Russia and/or China will be suckered into one, they will make some huge moves against the dollar first, and we'll get what you are talking about and what the country is primed for:  Another US civil war.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:35 | 4788981 Payne
Payne's picture

she would not make the proposal unless the election is already fixed.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 13:35 | 4789161 Bobportlandor
Bobportlandor's picture

That's what the student debt is for.

Enlist and we expunge all your student debt

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:47 | 4788752 observer007
observer007's picture

US authorities are pressuring non-governmental organizations to ignore the detention of Russian journalists in Ukraine, a source at a prominent media rights group told RIA Novosti Friday.

 

Latest on Ukraine:

http://tersee.com/#!q=ukraine&t=text

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:54 | 4788772 Relentless101
Relentless101's picture

Enlist and die for nothing. Don't enlist and die for nothing when we are nuked. Fucking doomsday prep people had it right all along. Just were preparing for the wrong event.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:21 | 4788909 CPL
CPL's picture

...it's going to get so much weirder than that.  Think left field and from out of no where.  Two things most people never think about, but are pretty important.  Solve the riddle and you'll have your answer.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:36 | 4788985 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

some people are born assholes. some people become assholes. some people just are assholes.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:27 | 4788940 earnyermoney
earnyermoney's picture

Never up or down voted anyone. Stupid feature of the site. Not going to start now. Any way, my son will never be cannon fodder for the evil agenda of these arseholes. I'll help him avoid the draft if it comes to that.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 13:52 | 4789209 Fuh Querada
Fuh Querada's picture

do you get a #REF after 99 downvotes?

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 15:52 | 4789581 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

I voted up based on the idea that Obama literally leads - from the front - and that once one leader or the other is dead the fight is over.  In that scenario I would be very happy to be behind this tyrant.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:45 | 4788738 maskone909
maskone909's picture

so russia gots the gas and is prepared to dump the dollar.  most likely on taco tuesday

ZING

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:01 | 4788816 Carpenter1
Carpenter1's picture

Does this shit ever end? Feels like the beginnings of major hostilities over and over, but all end as quickly as they started,  then another starts, with the same result.

 

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:16 | 4788887 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Same was said in 1914 & 1939.
Look up the "phoney war" and then compare.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:45 | 4788743 SimplePrinciple
SimplePrinciple's picture

The US treaties seem based on those with the Indians, as in Native Americans.  The difference is Russia has more than bows and arrows.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:45 | 4788744 MeMadMax
MeMadMax's picture

Ukraine joining NATO/UN is a pipe dream.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:21 | 4788913 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

The dreams you get after the third 'cup' of chandu at
the opium den.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:48 | 4788756 Fuh Querada
Fuh Querada's picture

NATO is toothless anyway.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/ukraine-crisis-shows-up-crac...

a couple of gems from this article:

...."Our commitment to collective defence is rock solid, now and for the future," NATO Secretary General Anders Fogh Rasmussen said more than a week ago, first in the Polish capital Warsaw and then, on the same day, in the Estonian capital Tallinn. ......

Rasmussen's remarks were well intentioned but relatively toothless -- little more than whistling in the dark. The Balts and Poles sense it, and the NATO secretary general knows it.

" Slashed Budgets and Capabilities

in 2010 some 16 member states had cut spending, adjusted for inflation, to below 2008 levels. This applied to 18 countries in 2011, and in 2014 it is expected to apply to 21. Between 2009 and 2014, German defense spending shrank from 1.44 percent to 1.29 percent of GNP. All European member states combined spend an average of 1.5 percent of gross national product on defense, compared with the official NATO target of 2 percent, and in some countries the ratio is less than 1 percent. The report argues that already deficient defense structures as they exist now cannot even be maintained at that level. And yet, "despite the action by the Russian Federation in recent months, currently there is little evidence to suggest that the defense spending cuts experienced by a majority of allies over the past five years will be reversed to any great extent."

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:57 | 4788782 Relentless101
Relentless101's picture

Nail on head. The US is NATO. We are really the only one pushing to increase defense. If taken weighted, none of the other members matter all too much.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:03 | 4788821 Bioscale
Bioscale's picture

Not surprising, the Europaens are not stupid to spend on "defense" because of terrrrrrorrrrrists. Most people know that those terrorist are financed by CIA and USG that have FED with infinite $$$ printing machines. Once the dollar is gone, let's see the defense budget of USA, fuck yeah

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:51 | 4788766 Temporalist
Temporalist's picture

Need not worry, Obama is ON IT!

Russian Companies Active in Syria at Risk of U.S. Sanctions

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-05-23/russian-companies-active-in-syr...

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:55 | 4788777 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Looking forward to seeing the retaliation act. If the same type as previous actions, the only question remaining is when Putin signs the document to be accepted in the 'american' world gang.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 13:33 | 4789153 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

.

Looking forward to seeing the retaliation act.

Confidential retaliation document has fragment leaked out of. Tells retaliation act if Prince Charles compares again Putin to Hitler. Responds with Putin compares Prince Charles to Liberace.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 16:01 | 4789611 ebear
ebear's picture

"compares Prince Charles to Liberace."

More like Pee Wee Herman.

Liberace had more class.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:55 | 4788780 Bankster Kibble
Bankster Kibble's picture

Of course Ukraine will vote yes to join NATO.  A lot of the anti-NATO votes went to Russia with Crimea.  But the Ukraine vote is not as important as the NATO vote among its members.  Odds are, Ukraine will be blackballed because of the conflicts, frozen and hot, within its borders.  No way do France, Germany, or Italy want to be dragged into a shooting war with Russia, and that is what Ukraine would demand.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:02 | 4788827 SpanishGoop
SpanishGoop's picture

The chance that Ukraine will become a NATO member is the same as getting a health insurance after being diagnosed terminally ill which they currently as a country are btw.

 

 

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:30 | 4788957 sushi
sushi's picture

NATO accension requires the applicant state to not be engaged in any current border disputes.

Ukraine would not qualify under this provision.

Of couse nothing stops NATO from ignoring its own agreed articles and conventions and doing whatever the USSA wants. After all everybody hates us for our freedoms.

And FUCK THE EU.

 

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 13:00 | 4789055 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

Good point "sushi"! The preconditions for NATO membership and EU membership are going to be very hard to meet by a bankrupt Ukraine with a part of it's territory in open revolt against a coup government. First of all Ukraine is bankrupt and the IMF is planning on sending 17 billion dollars just to prevent default and pay government obligations, NOT to produce economic revovery.

The EU requires a certain financial status. Ukraine does not have it!

NATO wants all of Ukraine, but a rump Ukraine at war with East Ukraine? NO matter how the vote went, NATO is not obligated to go to war over rebels in East Ukraine.

Ukrainains are look more and more fascist and stupid every day. Like yesterdays masssace of their own troops bby Right Sector death squads. The videos coming out show the massacre was a Kiev ordered hit of reservist troops refusing to attack a village. The killers are even seen on a video out of Ukraine.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 13:55 | 4789217 Fuh Querada
Fuh Querada's picture

what 17 billion dollars? I would wager that money is not there, would have to be printed-up SDRs. Sorry, no collateral.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 16:26 | 4789685 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

TPTB will just pick a "Quiet Tuesday", when the conditions are being met.  Wouldn't put anything past them. 

But, as someone above noted, the real question is if the rest of the EU-NATO countries want to bleed for Nuland and the USSA.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 16:27 | 4789690 ebear
ebear's picture

"The videos coming out show the massacre was a Kiev ordered hit of reservist troops refusing to attack a village."

The Stalingrad approach.  Leaves UK military command in the position of having to fight fellow UK's or REMOVE present govt.

Leaves the common soldier no choice but to bug out eastwards.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 21:43 | 4790311 dsty
dsty's picture

wow, great insight, looks like goint east for sure

that would be the smart choice, words not backed up by force won't work

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:26 | 4788932 Mine Is Bigger
Mine Is Bigger's picture

My understanding is most Ukrainians do not want to join NATO.  Only die-hard anti-Russians, like Tymoshenko, are calling for Ukraine to be a part of NATO.  if a referendum on NATO is held fairly, it will likely be rejected even without votes from the pro-Russian eastern region.  

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 11:57 | 4788790 q99x2
q99x2's picture

You can't stop western bankers. They are like pedophiles they won't stop until they are locked up Or in this case nuked.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:00 | 4788806 Theta_Burn
Theta_Burn's picture

Ukraine getting a little ahead of themselves with a NATO accession. this Yulia has some nutz popinov like that, and almost all Ukrainians hate her

Elect a government 1rst then take the bribes Yulia...

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:26 | 4788938 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

She is expected to lose.

Again.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 16:15 | 4789656 ebear
ebear's picture

All hair, no gas.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 13:57 | 4789228 Fuh Querada
Fuh Querada's picture

herniated disk from too much humping

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:01 | 4788819 gcjohns1971
gcjohns1971's picture

NATO is supposed to be about defense.  The implied task is to not include anyone who has a habit of provoking violent responses. 

It is far from clear that Ukraine is stable enough, that its policies are proportional enough, or measured enough to not be simply brining more trouble to the other NATO allies.

EU membership might be a much better thing for Ukraine because it would lower their overhead on gas transport sales.

HOWEVER...it also risks a flood of young Ukrainians leaving Ukraine to work in the West.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:08 | 4788851 Bioscale
Bioscale's picture

No way can EU brings something positive to Ukraine. After the coup has changed nothing - if you don't count those nazis playing police and army. In fact the EU is responsible for supporting nazis - this is supposed to be support for stability? The oligarchy stays the same. Fuck

 

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:21 | 4788911 Zerozen
Zerozen's picture

"it risks"?? That's the whole point of EU membership for these Eastern periphery countries. The people who vote to join are all the young people - so they can leave and get jobs in the West, because there is nothing going on in their home countries.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:35 | 4788984 sushi
sushi's picture

And the rise in UKIP and other parties is directly due to the fact new immigranst from low wage regions are migrating west and undercutting labour costs and taking jobs away from locals. Since the EU oligarchs are keenly aware of this fact (viz the recent elections) they will be extremely reluctant to add another failed state to the EU ménage a vingt.

 

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:08 | 4788832 cowdiddly
cowdiddly's picture

Hmm U.S. globally announced santions vs Russia's confidential sanctions. Now tell me, who is the bigger idiot here. The bully who tells you what he is fixing to do to you and how bad it will hurt, or the opponent who just smiles.

Ok, let me show you the rules, your supposed to move your red checker aaaaall the way baaaack here where my queen and rook is and then I make you into a King, like this see?

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:07 | 4788849 dontgoforit
dontgoforit's picture

We need a new Commander in Chief - pronto Tonto!

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:10 | 4788865 vyeung
vyeung's picture

Just fark em up via funding. They can't operate without $$$. NATO/EU/US is playing with fire.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:29 | 4788954 yrbmegr
yrbmegr's picture

As long as we're having votes to determine what "the people" want, I suppose there could be a vote to see whether "the people" want to join NATO.  Good for the goose, good for the gander.  If Russia annexes eastern Ukraine, they could have NATO literally on their border.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:32 | 4788964 Canucklehead
Canucklehead's picture

NATO is irrelevant to Russia. 

The Oligarchs have all their business based in Luxembourg, Switzerland, and other European centres.  If you wanted to do damage to Russia, you would do what is happening right now, sanctions.  Russia is not going to annex eastern Ukraine.  They didn't annex South Ossetia.  The Russian Oligarchs know they have too much to lose by getting into a "real" war with the West that would culminate with sanctions on Russian economic partners.

Putin knows this.  Note how his talking points have changed over the past couple of weeks.  Thoughts about provoking the Russian Bear don't carry the same effect as they did a couple of months ago.  Given time, Putin would be slid to the geopolitical sidelines.  The next big geo-political issue is what to do about Ukraine after it's election.  Putin can beat on the Ukraine if he chooses.  The rest of the world will look to help Ukraine.  That global acceptance of Ukraine's terrible state of affairs will force Putin's hand.  He will need to either fall in line or pick up his ball and go home.

Maybe Russians can help the civilized world look for those Girls in Africa.  Maybe Putin can do something that causes the world to look up and notice a Russian prescence in the civilized world.

Putin has overplayed his hand because he relies on fear to make his point.  Going forward, there is no dignity in the Russian position.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:38 | 4788999 earnyermoney
earnyermoney's picture

As an American, I really got a good laugh at the next to last sentance. Fear to make a point has been the MO of the US government since 9/11.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 13:20 | 4789119 DogOfSinope
DogOfSinope's picture

"Civilized world" as in using polio vaccination as a cover for spying?
"Civilized world" as in killing wedding parties with drones in foreign countries?
"Civilized world" as in invading countries on false pretext, resulting in million dead civilians?
"Civilized world" as in torturing prisoners?
"Civilized world" as in doing illegal "renditions" (kidnaping people)?
"Civilized world" as in keeping people indefinitely imprisoned without bringing any charges?
"Civilized world" an in spying against each other's leaders and citizens?
"Civilized world" as in prosecuting whistleblowers?
"Civilized world" as in facilitating coups against legitimately elected governments?

Sorry, I'd rather side with barbarians...

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 19:47 | 4790089 novictim
novictim's picture

"Civilized world" as in using polio vaccination as a cover for spying? Yep, pretty despicable.

"Civilized world" as in killing wedding parties with drones in foreign countries? Nope, "wedding party" is irrelevant.  Real judicial oversight is the question.  War is messy...we can be more civilized if we have our executions justified to a neutral party to help ensure some level of accountability and appropriateness.  But war is hell and no judge can really make it otherwise.

"Civilized world" as in invading countries on false pretext, resulting in million dead civilians?  Yep, the Iraq was was bullshit.  

"Civilized world" as in torturing prisoners?  Yep.  The USA has been taken over by the lowest level of scum and it is horrible.  Torture is another way the USA has betrayed our national values.

"Civilized world" as in doing illegal "renditions" (kidnaping people)?  Same as above...simply horrible and criminal.

"Civilized world" as in keeping people indefinitely imprisoned without bringing any charges?  Well, foreign nationals caught in a war situation do not get the same consideration as a civil defendent.  War is not pretty.  But we ARE in a war with Radical Islam.  So is Russia and China and Syria.

"Civilized world" an in spying against each other's leaders and citizens?  Yes, that has certainly trashed the US reputation even more.  Thank you Mr. Snowden for helping us understand  just how out of control the USA police state has become.

"Civilized world" as in prosecuting whistleblowers?  This is the most dangerous aspect of where the USA is heading.  The future is a dark tunnel.  We had better encourage whislteblowers and protect them for our own good. 

"Civilized world" as in facilitating coups against legitimately elected governments?  If this is a reference to Ukraine, then you are surely a moron.  And don't make Ukraine pay for the crimes of the USA.  

Sorry, I'd rather side with barbarians...  How about getting politically active and fighting to get Money out of the democratic system?  Siding with Russia and their oligarchs is not rational or moral.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 16:12 | 4789648 Wahooo
Wahooo's picture

Putin has already done enough to get my vote. He kept psychos in DC from going into Syria. Screw Africa.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 19:24 | 4790052 novictim
novictim's picture

Dimwit, you can thank the British House of Parliament for stopping Idiot Obama from attacking Syria.

Thank you Britain, for stopping us.  Deepest thanks!  We look to you as our own democracy died some time ago, don't know exactly when.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 19:17 | 4790038 novictim
novictim's picture

High five!  You beat my down votes!  But be warned, Canuck...I WILL NOT BE OUTDONE!

 

Dear Russian of ZH, I would like to discuss the Russian national anthem, how would you describe it?

...sad and epic? glorious and tragic? bureaucratic and long suffering?  A death march in drag?

Please, let me know how you feel about it.  Is it still worthy of your greatness?  

Wouldn't George Lucas' "Imperial Death March" be more in tune with your national mood lately?

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:37 | 4788995 SillyWabbits
SillyWabbits's picture

Russian bears will not be allowed to perform in circuses. 

Russian bride phone app will be blocked.

Snowden will become Russian UN and NATO negotiator.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:37 | 4788996 bankonzhongguo
bankonzhongguo's picture

This is the only method for "the West" to "win."

NATO will not dive into a divided Ukraine to face Russian armor.

Poland and its Catholics are the pivot point pre-Ukriane. They are true believers to keep Russia from knocking on their back door.

I truly wonder if Russia has the will to take everything east of the Knieper and Odesa before June 15.

That is a scary scenario.

Everyone has had months to pre-plan. Let's all hope all sides want to avoid conflict.

 

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:45 | 4789004 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture
"Ukraine Set To Hold NATO Accession Referendum"

What took them so long to make this announcement?  All the cards laid out on the table for all to see in this Country and this is how we respond to the promotion of WWIII?

The kid in the winter soldier dialogue in the middle of this clip says something extraordinary which I've never heard any of them say in front of civilians before.  That they all knew that 9/11 was an inside job as far back as 2004 and raped, maimed, tortured and murdered anyway for that "honorable discharge"!  If that statement is indeed true and the "privates" all the way up to the "sargeants" knew it was an inside job I hope and pray that the rest of you that are still alive put a round in the chamber and put it against your own heads -because if that is true not one of you deserves to live. 22 a day ain't enough!

And for those that are still "serving proudly"?

You'll be getting yours in Ukraine or Syria or wherever you happen to go from this point forward. Know that you will be treated like the complacent scum that you are that has done irreparable harm not only to yourselves but more importantly everyplace you've been in your career that you destroyed lives based on lies you knew were lies!...

Fuck this Country!  It's getting what it richly deserves...

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:45 | 4789012 novictim
novictim's picture

Are Russians confused as to "why?" the world is looking askance at them?  Ask yourselves this:

"Who, exactly, can Russia turn to as an loyal ally?"  A year ago, I would have listed Germany and France as as possible future friends...but now? There is no one.  

Hey, how about China?  At best, China is a "Frenemy".  The Chinese Totalitarian State is just opportunistic and will gladly allow Russia to help fuel their own industry and their own military expansion...but China is the definition of FUTURE ENEMY for the Russian State.

Folks, Russian chauvinism on websites like ZH as well as the jingoism Russian citizens are displaying toward this new Totalitarian State of theirs is UNSETTLING to non-Russians.  Putin Worship has created a climate of fear.  

It would be woeful negligence for any country within reach of Russia's greedy grasp to NOT attempt to join NATO.  Princess Putin's militarism has insured that all of Russia's neighbors fear for their territorial integrity. 

Russians of ZH, to all the world it appears that a Fascist Regime has arisen from the ashes of the USSR.  This is a problem only YOU can address.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 13:28 | 4789099 IridiumRebel
IridiumRebel's picture

How can you get angry at American oligarchical aspirations on other threads and then come here with this tripe? I am against all of these fuckers. It is well known that much of this shit storm was self inflicted by America. I'm sick of our involvement.

I was giving you digital high fives yesterday and today I wanna text/yell at you.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 14:30 | 4789358 Leraconteur
Leraconteur's picture

So why do so many here support Putin when he does the same?

Oligarchial territory grab by Putin: Good.
Oligarchial territory grab by USA: Bad.

You guys are full of shit. At least hold them both to the same standard.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 18:45 | 4789965 novictim
novictim's picture

Look, Leraconteur...everyone sees iridiums' hypocrisy, especially iridium.  

You should stop assuming that you are dealing with honest actors who merely manage to overlook their own double standard.  The proof is that when the obvious is pointed out to them that they deflect by changing the subject or they resort to the ad hominem.  

Most of the ZH posters are engaged in a propaganda war for Russia so the argument you make should be geared to the 3rd party lurkers and less so to the actual posters.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 20:00 | 4790115 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

.

You should stop assuming that you are dealing with honest actors who merely manage to overlook their own double standard.

Ah, yes, the double standard. One recalls the words of certain commenters who are proponents of Ukrainian Yatzi Junta Citizenism.

The proof is that when the obvious is pointed out to them that they deflect by changing the subject or they resort to the ad hominem.

Indeed that is the proof. Reminds of this novictim guy. When the obvious is pointed out to him he pours a non sense Princess Putin ad hominem. Guys like that should abandon their hypocricy. Or at least work on building a robuster propaganda, as the current version has cheapness to excess.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 19:40 | 4790078 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

.

So why do so many here support Putin when he does the same?

Oligarchial territory grab by Putin: Good.
Oligarchial territory grab by USA: Bad.

So where is the territory grab by Putin to which you refer? The Russian borders with Donetsk and Lugansk remain unchanged, do they not?

If your reference is to Crimea, you are confused. Crimea seceded from the Ukraine, and then petitioned Russia for accession and reunification. The Russian Duma, not Putin, made the decision to accept Crimea's request. This was not a territory grab by Russia, but a Crimean exercise of the principles of democracy and self-determination, principles which the West pretends to support.

At least hold them both to the same standard.

Sounds like a good idea. Does Kosovo ring a bell?

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 23:46 | 4790566 Leraconteur
Leraconteur's picture

but a Crimean exercise of the principles of democracy and self-determination,

 

Many Western governments are not Democracies. Democracy is  3 of 4 people voting to kill one of the group.

Without laws to prevent the destruction of the Rights of the minority, the 3% who did not want to become Russian, the nation of Ukraine that did not approve of secession, Democracy is nothing more than mob rule.

A Republic is best. South Africa, France, USA.

It is, however, unlikely that you or anyone else reading this will understand this distinction.

Democracy is mob rule. The majority vote to strip a minority of their Rights. A Republic secures the Rights of a minority no matter what.

Again, I am confident few here understand this.

Example:

If a fairly elected legislative body, with an election approved of by the UN, elected by a super-majority (67%++) of the populace and/or electorate of a nation, voted to strip one person of their Rights, it's still wrong, unethical and immoral and to be stopped.

Just because everyone agrees to something, that does not make it acceptable.

Again, I am confident few here will understand this.

Sat, 05/24/2014 - 01:09 | 4790668 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

I do hold them both to the same standard, Support for Neo-nazis that have vowed to exterminate sections of the population is bad, regardless of which government is involved, in this case its the USA.,

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 18:53 | 4789988 novictim
novictim's picture

I call 'em as I see them, iridium.

Do you have a favorite football team?  I don't.  It is sort of like that.

Russia has become worse for human rights, worse for income inequality, worse for democratic outcomes for its citizens, more militaristic, more fascist, more unfair, than even the USA.

The USA is a pretty low bar, we can both agree to that.

iridium, my recommendation to you,, assuming that you are sincere, that is, is that you take stock of your core principles and then apply those principles uniformly without regard to preconceptions or the spin of others.  

Think for yourself using your principles as your standard.  

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 20:33 | 4790170 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

.

I call 'em as I see them, iridium.

Perhaps scheduling your optometrist visit is long overdue.

Do you have a favorite football team?  I don't.  It is sort of like that.

Funny way of wording to say that you do have a despised football team. It is sort of like that.

Russia has become worse for human rights, worse for income inequality, worse for democratic outcomes for its citizens, more militaristic, more fascist, more unfair, than even the USA.

Yes, sure, of course, Russia is become the worse on all things. Might even say Russia is become massive worse if one despises it like one would if Manchester City was a despised football team.

That is why you play football. Kicking the can in row z...

Think for yourself using your principles as your standard.

Please demonstrate by the example if it is in your capacity to do so.

Sat, 05/24/2014 - 01:06 | 4790663 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

'Russia has become worse for human rights, worse for income inequality, worse for democratic outcomes for its citizens, more militaristic, more fascist, more unfair, than even the USA.'

Than even the USA? surely not the land of the free, I thought everyone hated our freedom?

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 13:45 | 4789186 DogOfSinope
DogOfSinope's picture

NSA or GCHQ troll?

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 18:47 | 4789975 RMolineaux
RMolineaux's picture

Yes, of course, Zbigniew.   (Sarc.)

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 19:01 | 4790003 novictim
novictim's picture

Hey, I'll take the compliment!

You may not always agree with Brzezinski but one should certainly take his opinions seriously.  He is one of the greats. 

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 20:42 | 4790185 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

.

You may not always agree with Brzezinski but one should certainly take his opinions seriously.  He is one of the greats.

Banderatards have a weird reference frame for greatness.

But hey, Ukrainian Yatzi Junta Citizenists enjoy their lies and they do not like being disturbed when they savour lying.

Sat, 05/24/2014 - 01:03 | 4790661 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

Im confused, which is easy to occur, so your saying that Russia should go along with the CIA removal of the Democratic government of the Ukraine, the Neo Nazi's that have taken control with their vow of exterminating the Russian speakers in the Ukraine, so that the US will be friends with them?

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:48 | 4789022 BOPOH
BOPOH's picture

Every day on their own lands Russians are dying from hands of Americans. Never in history United States experienced hate and anger coming from real Russian population.  Never in history Russian people considered Americans as their true enemy.   Anger towards Americans slowly accumulating. Angry Russian broke Hitler's back bone and it will do it again. Sacrificing their own lives for others - it is the historical signature and nature of true Russian soul.

Brothers and Sisters wake up, stand up for your motherland, we may all die, but will die in glory.

Our couse is just, the victory will be ours

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 15:08 | 4789460 SmittyinLA
SmittyinLA's picture

Americans hate their govt far more than Russians hate our govt 

Sat, 05/24/2014 - 01:00 | 4790656 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

With your sentiments on anger up until:

'Brothers and Sisters wake up, stand up for your motherland, we may all die, but will die in glory'

This is the sort of idiocy that tyrants use on their population to entice them to charge the machine guns unarmed, strangely enough the tyrants themselves are never in the charge, you would think if they actually believed it they would be front and centre, however they always manage to be a long long way away. This sort of crap stopped working a long time ago, people can see right through it now days.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 12:51 | 4789030 Joe Tierney
Joe Tierney's picture

When Putin retaliates it won't be toothless. It will deeply damage America's already-flagging geopolitical position and strength.

 

Remember how the little people ganged-up on the giant and tipped him over? The most effective strategy for Putin is to use Russia's position and influence to gather the "little" powers around the world against the American giant - get them outside the petrodollar system step-by-step and otherwise lead them away from the U.S.-dominated order. He's even doing that with Germany, which is now becoming anti-sanctions against Russia.

 

Once the giant loses most of his cooperation from smaller powers everyone will see what a scam the unipolar world was and will abandon it en masse. The giant is alread past the tipping point toward collapse.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 13:15 | 4789095 Son of Captain Nemo
Son of Captain Nemo's picture

JT

All the rose petals and perfumes of Arabia couldn't take the rotting fetted odor out of the U.S.

9/11 commission report, the pictures of torture and abuse at Abu Ghraib and the massacre of Fallujah with white phosphorous made their debut in America and it did absolutely nothing to change the direction of this Country. 2004 in earnest was a very significant year and watershed indeed!

Our fate was inevitably sealed from that year forward and the banker bailouts less than 4 years later only served as the last nail in the coffin to make ithe send off complete.

 

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 18:09 | 4789908 TweedleDeeDooDah
TweedleDeeDooDah's picture

I'll agree that the US is definitely dead within 100 years, but it's important to remember that even the Roman empire had centuries of "death throes" with much less to go on.
Between the planned exodus/expulsion of culture-bearing Americans, and the in-house accumulation of governments-in-exile (not to mention the remittances to guarantee fealty), there are already more than 100 "New Londiniums" globally.
The Romans moved from Rome, but they still managed to rule the earth until now (Republic). Look what happened when they abandoned the east after the split of the empire.
The last thing you want to experience is the dying breath of a tyrant.

Sat, 05/24/2014 - 00:54 | 4790650 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

Change occurs so much faster today than in the  days of the Roman empire, to compare the US to the Roman empire when we now have near instantaneous communication around the world as opposed to sending a runner is nonsensical

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 13:38 | 4789172 kchrisc
kchrisc's picture

Putin: "Check again."

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 13:49 | 4789199 orangegeek
orangegeek's picture

another day, another threat of war, another all time high in the markets, another trip to the store to cash in my foodstamps.

 

life is bliss.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 15:07 | 4789457 SmittyinLA
SmittyinLA's picture

dont tempt me to join u

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 14:11 | 4789261 Joe A
Joe A's picture

This pretzel woman -who wants to nuke pro Russians in Ukraine- wants the rest of Europe to become a burial ground for her own ambitions and wealth.

All NATO countries need to agree before another country can join and Germany for starters is not too keen.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 17:54 | 4789883 TweedleDeeDooDah
TweedleDeeDooDah's picture

Yeah... historically Germany has no interest in Ukraine. They wouldn't even steal Ukrainian babies that "looked" german... or aryan, or whatever.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 15:03 | 4789446 SmittyinLA
SmittyinLA's picture

The punishment should be a "buy out" of Russian and Ukraine assets owned by US & EU elite hostiles (not everybody just the Goldman sacks types)  in exchange for a big pile of their own country's fiat and a 1099.

Here's is the note

"Dear US & EU elites, your stock ownership input in Russia and Ukraine is no longer needed or wanted and is determinated to be hostile, so we're buying you all out at fair market value* based on Friday's market close*, here is your giant pile of fiat with interest and accumulations, you are now ex-stock holders of Ukraine and Russian assets, enjoy your pile o fiat" 

PS you still owe us $10 billion for unpaid fuel bills, and we don't want that fiat shit, we want gold, or steel or Cadillac Escalades or some Dreamliners.  

 

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 17:52 | 4789877 TweedleDeeDooDah
TweedleDeeDooDah's picture

Without foreign investment, Russia is pretty much dead in the water, and not even China has a tug that big.

Sat, 05/24/2014 - 00:49 | 4790645 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

Money will always find a way to flow to a profitable investment, trying to stop investment in Russia will be like trying to herd cats, we have already seen the result of current sanctions that were designed to scare of investors, the Russian market went up.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 16:37 | 4789714 dearth vader
dearth vader's picture

Breaking. The geniuses of the European Commission (EC) - Barroso and his ilk - are proposing the member states should stop imports from Russia when Putin disturbs the presidential elections in Ukraine of May 25th. If he'd pull a Crimea in the eastern provinces more serious measures are to follow.

Article in Dutch newspaper 'de Volkskrant': http://www.volkskrant.nl/vk/nl/2668/Buitenland/article/detail/3660504/20...

Which products are part of the import ban? At first, luxury goods, caviar, wodka and furs.

Next, weapons, ships and fertilizer.

Next, bank restrictions, coal, technology.

Last - wait for it - oil and gas!

As the EU-countries will all be hit by these restrictions, differently, the EC declines to specify the damage per country. Are they really that stupid? The EU has a 30% dependency on Russian gas. Speaking of shooting yourself in the foot.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 17:51 | 4789873 TweedleDeeDooDah
TweedleDeeDooDah's picture

Yeah... better save the oil and gas for last.
People will need gas for cooking food and heating water.
Of course NATO will need oil for petroleum products and jet fuel.

Fri, 05/23/2014 - 18:54 | 4789991 RMolineaux
RMolineaux's picture

Tymoshenko is demonstrably an insane egomaniac.  She has no chance of winning a fair election.  So her statements should not attract serious attention.  I am certain that the other candidates have been advised of the draconian consequences for Ukraine if it even thinks about joining NATO.

Sat, 05/24/2014 - 09:41 | 4791061 Peter Pan
Peter Pan's picture

Ukraine needs to wake up to the fact that nobody really wants her territory. The Europeans and Americans simply want to use her so as to park their missiles in an effort to neuter Russia and Russia got what she wanted by taking over Crimea.

The Ukraine is a quagmire of bad economics and bad politics.

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