This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.

Snowden Says "Stranded In Russia By State Department"; Kerry Blasts "Man-Up And Come Back To US"

Tyler Durden's picture


This evening's interview between Edward Snowden and NBC's Brian Williams is already stirring up controversy. In one excerpt, Snowden blames the State Department for "stranding him" in Russia, saying he "never intended" to wind up there. John Kerry has been quick to react to this "For a supposedly smart guy, that’s a pretty dumb answer, frankly," Kerry said. "If Mr. Snowden wants to come back to the United States today, we'll have him on a flight today." In an interview with Chuck Todd on MSNBC, Kerry called Snowden a "coward" and a "traitor," adding that "he should man up and come back to the United States," the secretary of state said. There is a live special at 11ET (below) after the televised interview.


As NBC reports,Snowden was "stranded" in Russia by the State Department...

"I personally am surprised that I ended up here," Snowden said in the interview, an excerpt of which aired on TODAY on Wednesday morning.


Snowden's comments about his new home came in an extended, wide-ranging interview with Williams, his first with a U.S. television network, airs Wednesday at 10 p.m. ET on NBC.


"The reality is I never intended to end up in Russia," he said. "I had a flight booked to Cuba onwards to Latin America and I was stopped because the United States government decided to revoke my passport and trap me in Moscow Airport.


"So when people ask why are you in Russia, I say, 'Please ask the State Department."

To which John Kerry responded...


"For a supposedly smart guy, that’s a pretty dumb answer, frankly," Kerry said. "If Mr. Snowden wants to come back to the United States today, we'll have him on a flight today.


"We'd be delighted for him to come back. He should come back. That's what a patriot would do. A patriot would not run away and look for refuge in Russia or Cuba or some other country. A patriot would stand up in the United States and make his case to the American people," Kerry added.


"He can come home but he’s a fugitive from justice which is why he is not being permitted to fly around the world," he said.


Asked whether he had changed his mind about the nature of Snowden's actions, Kerry said Snowden "stole" information and did "great damage" to the United States.


"The fact is if he cares so much about America and he believes in America, he should trust in the American system of justice," Kerry said.


"But to be hiding in Russia, an authoritarian country, and to have just admitted he was really just trying to get to Cuba — what does that tell you?" he added. "I think he's confused. I think it's very sad."


In an interview with Chuck Todd on MSNBC, Kerry called Snowden a "coward" and a "traitor."




"He should man up and come back to the United States," the secretary of state said.

Snowden also fought back against critics who dismissed him as a low-level hacker — saying he was “trained as a spy” and offered technical expertise to high levels of government.

At 11pm ET Brian Williams will be hosting a live special analysis of what was said...


- advertisements -

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:09 | 4804013 Joebloinvestor
Joebloinvestor's picture

Kerry has a lot of fucking nerve.

get Hillary to "man up".

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:15 | 4804039 kliguy38
kliguy38's picture

Lurch is a douchebag 

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:19 | 4804058 Slave
Slave's picture

I can't imagine what they're going to do to this poor kid when they finally catch him. And my tax dollars will fund it...

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:35 | 4804078 ZerOhead
ZerOhead's picture

What is really hilarious is that Edward Snowden was on his way to Ecuador.

If Kerry and State Department had not revoked his passport he would have been back already since Correa certainly wasn't going to give him amnesty...


Kerry is an idiot who thinks he is smart. The worst kind of idiot. Come back and stand before the American system of justice my ass...

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:37 | 4804113 Gaius Frakkin' ...
Gaius Frakkin' Baltar's picture

I'd like to believe if they tried offing or arresting Snowden he'd become a martyr and all hell would break loose, but I'm not getting my hopes up.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:45 | 4804148 AlaricBalth
AlaricBalth's picture

For a man who has no time to testify in Congress about Benghazi, Kerry certainly has the time to comment about Edward Snowden.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:51 | 4804153 strannick
strannick's picture

A weasel Kerry calling someone a coward?

Snowden is courage personified in this day and age. He knows the stab you in back CIA will torture or kill him if they get their hands on him.

Kerry marries his billions, a cauligen-faced Georgetown skirt chaser, selling out America to the Banks and their CIA bagboys every step of the way.

John Kerry. Take a look at Edward Snowden. A courageous patriot. Putting it on the line for what America stands for, liberty and freedom. Not babbletalking NBC propaganda while running errands for your Banker bosses.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:51 | 4804162 Gringo Viejo
Gringo Viejo's picture

A "kept man" telling another man to "man up". John Kerry would have to stand on his mother's shoulders just to kiss Snowden's ass.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:02 | 4804200 The Juggernaut
The Juggernaut's picture

Edward Snowden: Saw Something.  Said Something.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:12 | 4804232 RetiredSilverBug
RetiredSilverBug's picture

Right, stop partying and go to prison. Such a great deal!

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:15 | 4804248 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Yeah, come back so we can torture you to death, ya coward.

Kerry, and indeed ever member of the last three administrations, is a mad dog, and needs to be put down.  The US government is now publically recognized as 100% evil, and the rest of the world isn't going to stand for it any more.  Neither should we.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:19 | 4804261 gmrpeabody
gmrpeabody's picture

Wish Kerry would man up and resign...

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:27 | 4804275 Comte de Saint ...
Comte de Saint Germain's picture

Edward Snowden = disinformation agent

This is just an ongoing PSYOP targeting to distract the attention of the ignorant masses.


Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:37 | 4804313 g'kar
g'kar's picture

All he wants to do is come in from the cold.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:46 | 4804336 Rusty Shorts
Rusty Shorts's picture

Jason Bourne, park bench.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 00:09 | 4804381 john39
john39's picture

Snowden just signed off on the gov version of 911. What more proof do you need? Fake.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 00:20 | 4804404 SafelyGraze
SafelyGraze's picture

asma says for kerry to man-up and come to syria

and bring roses

and wine

and brush your teeth


Thu, 05/29/2014 - 00:29 | 4804429 JohnnyBriefcase
JohnnyBriefcase's picture


Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:55 | 4804349 CognacAndMencken
CognacAndMencken's picture



Snowden should practice what he preaches.... move to Somalia and live in true libertarian, anti-government paradise.  Lots of guns there, too.  

Or maybe he should convert all his money into silver and loose 50% of his wealth.  

Both are great libertarian choices.  


Thu, 05/29/2014 - 00:38 | 4804357 The_Prisoner
The_Prisoner's picture

What's with the pompous names the government trolls are going by these days? You, and that count cunt above?

Contrary from you. I do not assign a man's worth by the amount of money he acquires irrespective of the means by which he acquires it.

You should go and hang out with chindit13, he too, thought that the fact he made "smart" investment decisions made him superiour to everyone.

Around here everyone knows you're a common cunt. 

 Edit: Mencken would spit on you if he saw you using his name whilst spouting the statist line.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 00:17 | 4804396 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

What an ignorant douche-tard.

Thanks for parroting the "Somalia is a libertarian paradise" meme I've mentioned several times in the past. Did all the anti-libertarians get a list of the same talking points? The Somalia thing is apparently the insult of choice for internet statist trolls who have a problem with people who dislike oppressive governments. It shows up everywhere from Politico to Kos to DU to WaPo. You're a good little robot.

By the way, Somalia is a failed state. It's what happens when government runs amok. You'll get to experience that soon enough right here in the US.

You may now return to fellating Uncle Sam.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 00:45 | 4804452 FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

Well, said. Would someone show me where the property rights, individual rights and documents or agreements are in Somalia? Somalia is actually a typical strong-man statist regime. The guy with the most guns and power is in charge. They steal stuff, like ships from others who produce. They produce nothing of their own and all are in poverty. Even the best among them live rather poorly. Very similar to the well organized police states of the Soviet Union and Maoist China. Was it not the venerbale Mao himself who said "All power comes out of the barrel of a gun."? Would that not be Somalia?


Thu, 05/29/2014 - 06:25 | 4804735 negative rates
negative rates's picture

Red eyes at morning, sailor take warning.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:47 | 4804337 Thorny Xi
Thorny Xi's picture

You're just a psyop trying to distract the ignorant masses.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 03:03 | 4804612 ebear
ebear's picture

"This is just an ongoing PSYOP targeting to distract the attention of the ignorant masses."

LOL....!!!   like the ignorant masses need distracting.

That's the funniest thing I've heard in weeks!

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 06:43 | 4804757 Al Gorerhythm
Al Gorerhythm's picture

Hmmmmm. I wasn't aware that the NSA was spying on me and the world at the time of his announcements and I thought I was reasonably paranoid. Were you aware of their activities and are you aware now?

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 07:21 | 4804813 mc225
mc225's picture

amazing that so many 'people' on zerohedge have been drinking the 'snowden is the real deal' kool-aid.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 07:31 | 4804838 SoilMyselfRotten
SoilMyselfRotten's picture

Rather drink Snowdens' Koolaid than Uncle Sams piss

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 10:15 | 4805450 Citxmech
Citxmech's picture

More options than just the "real" or "psy-op plant" false dilemma.  Yes, Snowden could be the "real deal," and he also could be a plant - by why?  This has not been good PR for the surveillance apparatus - unless he was a CIA plant to discredit and reign-in the out-of-control NSA, which would be a completely different kind of play that might not be so bad for us.  Don't assume the upper-levels of power all work in lock-step.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 07:19 | 4804807 Magooo
Magooo's picture

Or step in front of a bus

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:21 | 4804263 Four chan
Four chan's picture

who do you trust more obama

or snowden

so the option the government is giving him is to turn himself over to the same out of control government he exposed? 

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:23 | 4804270 Four chan
Four chan's picture

patriot whistleblower

lowlife traitor

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 05:58 | 4804711 Ignatius
Ignatius's picture

False choice.

Book and movie deals already signed.

Oligarch Omidyar buys Greenbucks and friends and creates The Intercept (how appropriate) to capture the phony left.

This is theatre.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 06:33 | 4804744 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

if thats true i dont blame snowden at all. I hope he got a shitload of money for the deals. He'll need it to give himself any kind of quality of life for the rest of his hounded, haunted time on this planet

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 07:35 | 4804848 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

Greenbucks does seem like a phony. Going on the Muck with its phony debates kinda did him in for me. But Snowden needed to use a journalist to break the story. So what can you do?

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 06:29 | 4804739 BorisTheBlade
BorisTheBlade's picture

Subtleties are lost on Mr. Kerry as he confuses patrios with idiots.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:23 | 4804271 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

yes, man up and bow down like your elected

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 00:20 | 4804398 Bananamerican
Bananamerican's picture

Horseface has got a lot of nerve telling anybody to "man" up.

He sold his soul (I used to think he had one) and his country's future out for a chance to play "Jockey" for a day

This, despite having all his wife's money to play with....What a shithead

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 00:49 | 4804457 sodbuster
sodbuster's picture

John Kerry isn't good enough to carry Snowden's shit stained underwear.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 02:27 | 4804582 Confused
Confused's picture

Every word out of Kerrys mouth is directly (and carefully chosen) to appeal to the brain dead viewers in front of their TVs. He doesn't believe a single word he says. Its all theatre. 


Notice its all buzzwords. It is simply to influence people into thinking what Snowden did was actually wrong. 

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 06:37 | 4804749 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture


Kerry could never stand up for his convictions in the way snowden has. He'd have to get some convictions to start with

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 05:45 | 4804708 Frankie Carbone
Frankie Carbone's picture

"Horseface"? RFOLMAO. With that mug in that pose, man... how apropo!



Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:35 | 4804309 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

not sure how much partying snowden is doing, some i hope.

kerry peaked when he threw somebody else's medals over the u.s. capitol fence.  he had a few decent prosecutions as a d.a. and helped unearth some dirt on ollie north, et. al. 

but it's been pretty much downhill since then, the last few years double black diamond.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 03:16 | 4804618 ebear
ebear's picture

"not sure how much partying snowden is doing, some i hope."

Dude are you kidding?  He's a handsome, notorious outlaw in a city full of hot Russian women!!!  

I'd say he landed on his feet.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 04:46 | 4804682 Yes We Can. But...
Yes We Can. But Lets Not.'s picture

Yeah, he just has to be careful to select the right kind of killer-babes.

And here is the one he left behind in the States:

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 07:19 | 4804805 Magooo
Magooo's picture

Moscow is not such a bag place :)


Now that blows aways that skanky bitch he had in Hawaii...

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:00 | 4804192 DeadFred
DeadFred's picture

Well there you got it, staight from the horse's mouth.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 01:59 | 4804556 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture



Those horse jokes never get old for me. 

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 03:11 | 4804615 zhandax
zhandax's picture

That Mr Ed routine is just his warm and fuzzy public persona.  I think you meant straight from the mouth of the horse's ass.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 03:31 | 4804629 Hobo Sapien
Hobo Sapien's picture

Thougt Kerry was pretty convincing in RE-ANIMATOR, not so sure about his present gig....

NSFW; can't be unseen.

"No one will ever believe you, a talking head, why don't you get a job in a sideshow?"


EDIT: awshucks, it's not the uncut version.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 04:52 | 4804671 Anasteus
Anasteus's picture

But what seems to remain unnoticed is the fact that Snowden for the first time appeared live and uncensored on crony NBC tv. It's indeed remarkable how much room he was given to openly present his ideas and attitudes to the public. As for me, this is far more important than Kerry's 'compulsory skating'.

Which means, something is changing.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 04:54 | 4804685 zhandax
zhandax's picture

It's gotten obvious enough for damage control?

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 07:16 | 4804799 Magooo
Magooo's picture

"A weasel Kerry calling someone a coward?

Snowden is courage personified in this day and age. He knows the stab you in back CIA will torture or kill him if they get their hands on him.

Kerry marries his billions, a cauligen-faced Georgetown skirt chaser, selling out America to the Banks and their CIA bagboys every step of the way.

John Kerry. Take a look at Edward Snowden. A courageous patriot. Putting it on the line for what America stands for, liberty and freedom. Not babbletalking NBC propaganda while running errands for your Banker bosses."


Nice to see no down arrows on that - maybe people are waking up to the fact their government is a monstrosity - Obama = Bush = Obama ----- Deep State runs the show

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 07:24 | 4804820 mc225
mc225's picture

hairlip alert... snowden is disinfo... anybody awake here?

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 08:11 | 4804921 fallout11
fallout11's picture

You think Snowden's releases were a form of "limited hangout"?

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 10:59 | 4805613 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

is this episodically-released, time-released, dosage-released


does it have lawyers manipulating the story? (GreenWald)

does it feed the masses and their need for Heroic Saviours?

is it a young white male with "hot tastes in babes"? (ie, someone people can pretend to be, desire, envy, look up to, fantasize about? as a manufactured storyline?)

is Sony gonna make a movie about the book deal?  and are the folks making the movie well-schooled in heroic propaganda films like James Bond & Zero Dark Thirty?

hello?  anyone out there?


Thu, 05/29/2014 - 01:06 | 4804487 FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

I agree with you on Kerry being an idiot. I will add that the worst kind of idiot is an idiot with power. There are a whole lot of them in this regime and that is the achilles heel of statism.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 02:03 | 4804561 Joenobody12
Joenobody12's picture

Come back and stand before the American system of justice my ass.


That is what anyone is afraid of ... American system of Justice...  when Ketchup and the neo-cons already judged Snowden and called for his demise before the trial. 

Revolution is the only way to get America back on track but it is never going to happen when everyone has a TV remote control.  

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 02:48 | 4804598 ebear
ebear's picture

"If Kerry and State Department had not revoked his passport he would have been back already since Correa certainly wasn't going to give him amnesty..."

Probably not, but I'll bet Evo Morales would.  Probably give him a Bolivian passport too if he asked.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 07:14 | 4804793 Magooo
Magooo's picture

Married money.  That's worse than inheriting it


Say no more

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:09 | 4804218 Payne
Payne's picture

Kerry giving a lesson on "Maning up"?, he lost his balls so long ago that he has forgotten the memory.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 01:55 | 4804552 Wile-E-Coyote
Wile-E-Coyote's picture

Hey Kerry has balls but they are made of Silicon!

He stands in front of the wife naked swinging them in the breeze, "hey darling look what your $110k got me".

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:20 | 4804067 Canadian Dirtlump
Canadian Dirtlump's picture

So let's recall..

Edward snowden was originally presented as a pedestrian stooge who ( if one was honest with themselves ) had way too much polish for an honest person to consider him legit.

Then some people ( like Webster Tarpley ) warned that he bore all the hallmarks of a CIA limited hangout operation whereby his revalations didn't involve anything THAT new and would ultimately serve to fuel short term outrage with NO discernable change of policy.

NOW? We see gutted anti NSA bills working their way through the system concurrent with revalations that Snowden isn't some low end nerdly auto-didact but in facts a trained spook.

Sum Total? We have a polished champion of liberty replete with an ocular impediment who is factually a trained spy whose revalations have not led to any positive changes in the machinations of the police state..

So now what?

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:37 | 4804116 john39
john39's picture

The fact that the msm is all over this should be a big red flag.  Just another mind control hoax:

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:48 | 4804139 ZerOhead
ZerOhead's picture

Now we wait to see what the failed creature known as Greenwald is going to release.

Has it all been stage managed?

It's still too early to tell so let's give Snowden the benefit of doubt but whatever we hear we know it's way worse than we are being told...

(Even if Snowden was for real as I hope he is... they would still have proceded in gutting the bills anyway...)

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:28 | 4804289 besnook
besnook's picture

the only reason i don't trust any of the accepted version of this story because snowden is hooked up with greenwald who is hooked up with pierre omidyar of ebay and a new alt news media venture, who is neck deep in helping the western coup in the ukraine succeed.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:48 | 4804338 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

I don't trust it either, but I don't hear anyone claiming the facts of his relelations are wrong.  Maybe some require spoon-fed MSM explanations and justifications, but I don't.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 02:40 | 4804593 Confused
Confused's picture

I don't know if he is, or is not, the real deal. And I'm not sure it really matters. He brought to light something that the masses should be discussing with more passion. 


As for Greenwald, he only hooked up with that assclown PO, after the Snowden thing. Doesn't mean it wasn't pre-planned, but it could just mean that Greenwald is chasing money. Who knows. But it is also possible to view both Greenwald and Snowden seperately. Snowden could be fake, and Greenwald not. Both. Either. But to what end is the question. What purpose would someone have of releasing this info? How is this distracting the masses? And from what? (please don't say economy, plenty of people know it when they live paycheck to paycheck)

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 11:04 | 4805633 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

shit, you can view everything that happens in the world "separately" - it's easy.

or you can connect a few dots and see how things REALLY happen.

What purpose would someone have of releasing this info?

one day you'll see an event that kinda ties it all together for you, no doubt.


Thu, 05/29/2014 - 17:56 | 4807562 11b40
11b40's picture

Yes, and your paranoia can so blind you as to be unable to see, too.

I have no idea if a con is being played, and if it is, who might be playing it, or what their objectives may be.

We can sit here and prognosticate all day and never know anything.  I agree with earlier sentiments that this is a subject that needs way more attention from the general public, and from tinking politicians.  After all, this power of tracking everything we do only benefits a very few with their hands on the levers of power...and that is not your normal Congress Critter.  For all the rest of us, including the very powerful, it presents a very dangerous situation wherby any of us can be blackmailed, framed, controlled, ruined.  That includes the captains of industry and titans of Wall St.

Is it so far-fetched to think that if there is a con, it may be one conceived by true patriots looking to stop an incredible power grab?

Bottom line is, we are just going to have to see how it plays out over time.  Snowden is the hero we need.  I just hope he is legit.

I also sense someting angry and independent in Greenwald.  He is essentially an expat living a nice life in Brazil.  As a homosexual, he has surely suffered some persecution and discrimination in America.  Who knows what personal scars he may be carrying around, but he has obviously done a lot of thinking about freedom and liberty.  I sure am not going to judge him yet.  His lover was detained and had personal elctronics confiscated in the London airport.  Assuming that was not part os some far-flung plan, that likely set Greenwald off even more.

If both these guys are simply following their hearts, they are uber patriots and deserve medals in my opinion.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 02:35 | 4804590 Confused
Confused's picture

I'm for giving him the benefit of the doubt as well. For now. And yes, any bills introduced would have been gutted. This happens all the time when a piece of legislation is introduced that could potentially do some good. 


But the thing that I find amusing is the old, "we didn't learn anything new from his leaks" meme. 


Oh really? Nothing? Not? A? Single? Thing? Rubbish. 

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 06:07 | 4804723 Ignatius
Ignatius's picture

Russ Tice is/was all but ignored by corporate media and his revelations were mind blowing.  Snowden's poo-pa on 9/11 truth is a big tell.


Thu, 05/29/2014 - 07:45 | 4804863 Confused
Confused's picture

As shameful as it might be to say, I have never heard of Russ Tice. So thanks for the reference, much appreciated. 

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 09:31 | 4805256 Ignatius
Ignatius's picture

HuffPo pcked it up briefly.  He gave a good interview to BoilingFrogsPost but one needs to be a subscriber to hear it.  There are other interviews out there.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:19 | 4804257 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Are you nuts!?  The man single-handedly destroyed the US electronics industry by revealing its incestuous relationship with spy agencies.  Their sales are plummetting in a 100% predictable manner.

No, no government would EVER do this to itself on purpose.  Why must you search for ever deeper conspiracies when you have a perfectly plausible story right in front of you?

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:28 | 4804277 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

I think you misread his post

or maybe I did

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 03:16 | 4804620 zhandax
zhandax's picture

Single handedly?  Come on, let's give Bernochio a little credit here.  This bitch was already leaning heavily to port.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 00:02 | 4804364 palmereldritch
palmereldritch's picture

 No, no government would EVER do this to itself on purpose.

But what if there was another shadow government of private criminal elites who have for generations been building up and tearing down the "democracies" they inhabit with their weapons of financial terrorism, espionage and false-flag fueled MIC orgies of destruction to negate the potential for real global progress in social justice, free enterprise capitalism and open source technology for the betterment of everyone?  

Would they have the resources to war-game complex scenarios to launch actions that would direct lethargic inert social insects along a predictable path?

The end-game is a flattened feudal gulag ruled by a cabal of psycho-sociopaths if the majority doesn't begin to recognize the organized criminal networks lurking within the government and eventually realize the political capital to prosecute, punish and incarcerate them accordingly.  The crimes are legendary, global and untouched.

Snowden could be just another chess match to move an agenda forward or an organic event. If the raping of liberty illustrated by Snowden's revelations of the surveillance state is not completely reversed by political action then it says more about our delusion of freedom than anything else...making the conspiracy a fait accompli regardless of whether it existed or not.

The biggest conspiracy is the certainty of human nature.  Without it criminals would have neither purchase nor refuge.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 06:10 | 4804725 Doña K
Doña K's picture

You are describing Machiavellian machinations which are as ancient as humanity from Eve the apple and the snake to medieval witch hunting and heretics to contemporary NSA and those hiding in the shadows. With fewer words "GOOD and EVIL"

They do exist and always will. It is up to Snowden like people to expose them and disrupt their rhythm.



Thu, 05/29/2014 - 03:24 | 4804626 ebear
ebear's picture

So then, Snowden and Greenwald were short Intel?

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 08:20 | 4804946 Zadig
Zadig's picture

It's not just the tech companies which the NSA needs to spy everywhere, but the MIC itself has lost billions in deals due to exposure of their spying to "win" contracts.  There's no explanation for those 2 groups harming themselves like that.  Certainly not when there's nothing to gain.

If this was some idiots plan, then it would've been called off long ago and they would've joined the irresponsible nail gun owners club.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:55 | 4804341 Christophe2
Christophe2's picture

Well, in keeping with the fact that Snowden was certainly a limited hangout operation, with some of the action happening in Russia (since Russia was still playing along with the NWO back then), then it seems almost funny to hear what may be basically true words from Snowden at this point: he has been left out to hang in now enemy Russia, and he isn't too happy about it.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 02:51 | 4804599 Confused
Confused's picture


Being a principle at Booz Allen is certainly alarming. Or not. I guess it depends. And we all know who is father is. 


I'm sure of this. I don't know if Snowden is a controlled situation or not. But the dialogue that SHOULD have come from his leaks is lacking in the public sphere. 

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 08:17 | 4804938 fallout11
fallout11's picture

...and that is because the control is now nearly total, as aptly demonstrated within the last few months by Congresses's second approval of indefinite detention of US citizenry without trial or charge and the gutting of all attempts to limit or end NSA spying operations. The gates on this panopticon are already closed and locked, and chains are being added daily.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 18:06 | 4807601 11b40
11b40's picture

And we wonder why the Neo-Cons are frothing at the mouth for war over Ukraine.


Thu, 05/29/2014 - 08:16 | 4804939 RaceToTheBottom
RaceToTheBottom's picture

Plus what about the pole dancer?

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:20 | 4804069 HungryPorkChop
HungryPorkChop's picture

Rumor on the street, if you repeat Benghazi three times real fast that Kerry vanishes and will not be seen for 3 days. 

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:36 | 4804110 knukles
knukles's picture

You forgot clicking your nuts together.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:56 | 4804181 strannick
strannick's picture

And giving yourself ketchup warpaint

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:04 | 4804205 DeadFred
DeadFred's picture

Ouch!! Did it work?

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:57 | 4804355 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

No such luck. Was I supposed to use Heinz?

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:20 | 4804070 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

Hmmm for an interview with Snowden . . . Kerry seemed to get most of the excerpts printed.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 02:07 | 4804563 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

$10 says they are going to run the horse again...

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:32 | 4804095 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

This from Gunboat Kerry?  From peacenik Kerry who was thought a traitor for spilling secrets of American war atrocities in Viet Nam?  The same Kerry who got hooked up with a sugar momma?






Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:13 | 4804238 falconflight
falconflight's picture

He knew nothing about atrocities, Nothing.  It was nothing but rhetorical tripe that dripped from his sewage pump station.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:36 | 4804109 williambanzai7
williambanzai7's picture

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:20 | 4804264 Eahudimac
Eahudimac's picture

Is that Dee Snyder, famed frontman of Twisted Sister?

I'm sorry Dee Snyder, but that does kinda look like you from back in 1984.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:39 | 4804127 prains
prains's picture

How does Kerry have so much time? I hear it takes most of the day to brush down his coat and clean his horse shoes

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 03:30 | 4804632 ebear
ebear's picture

Stop horsing around.  This is serious!

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:05 | 4804207 Leonardo Fibonacci2
Leonardo Fibonacci2's picture

Edward Snowden is an AMERICAN PATRIOT.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 00:23 | 4804411 JJdog
JJdog's picture

Looks like John Kerry voted arrow down. :)


Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:05 | 4804209 drendebe10
drendebe10's picture

"A horse is a horse, of course, of course..."

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:16 | 4804226 falconflight
falconflight's picture

Dig it, I suspect Hillary has trimmed way more carpet than that punkassed fop named John F. Kerry.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 06:22 | 4804733 negative rates
negative rates's picture

Get Kerry to man to his denial, case closed.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 13:36 | 4806340 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture

I used to tell people Dick Cheney is about the only neocon Obama has yet to appoint to his administration, but obviously Kerry is channeling Dickhead Cheney.

Who Owns The American Intelligence Establishment ?

Quite recently, the multi-billionaire American Secretary of State, John Forbes Kerry***, feebly attempted to trivialize and publicly diminish Edward Snowden by saying he just did "computer stuff" (penetrated Swiss tax havens with the CIA, gave computer security talks and lectures with the DIA and was a technical specialist with the NSA) and that he should come back and face the American justice system.

Well, Johnny, he can't return because you revoked his passport, you effing douchetard ASSHOLE!

More importantly, what Edward Snowden's whistleblowing does is point us in the right direction: he had access to the most senstive programs within the NSA while a contractor with Booz Allen Hamilton, which is owned by the private bank, the Carlyle Group, which begs the question, what kind of access do these private banks and intel contractors have to the NSA?

Seventy percent of the NSA budget goes to private contractors now, thanks to the privatization of the American intelligence establishment, begun under Reagan, and incredibly advanced under Clinton, then furthered again under Bush #2, the first MBA president!

Before the blockbuster book by Glenn Greenwald, No Place To Hide, there was another book with the very same title by Robert O'Harrow, a WaPo reporter.

In this book O'Harrow explains (unwittingly, I suspect) the structure of the Total Information Awareness network, the brainchild of Adm. Poindexter and Dick Cheney, which was transformed from a gov't operation to strictly private contractors' project.

Many private contractors, developed and still developing various surveillance devices and software and processes, were involved in the grand structure of domestic and foreign surveillance, from monitoring hotel rooms and auto travel (from contracts with OnStar and the companies which operated the cams at the tollbooths) to the more obvious stuff we are aware of today.

Both books are well worth reading, again and again.

The Carlyle Group has a long a shady past, involved with CIA front organizations at various times, financed originally with Mellon family investment, and some highly questionable World Bank investments.

Pertaining to the World Bank: when the wife of Michael Beschloss (self-described "president scholar" or hack who has appeared on PBS News Hour, another hack show) was with the World Bank she directed funds to a private bank, strangely enough, which was the Carlyle Group, which she would later join to manage said funds, then leaving to start her own hedge fund (again, perhaps, with the very same funds????)!

Reading Greenwald's No Place To Hide (really an incredible book, a must-read) along with O'Harrow's No Place To Hide, explaining the privatization of the intel establishment, and what those private contractors are up to, is a most enlightening and eye-opening experience.

The groundwork for a privatized Total Information Awareness network began with the SAIC, which ostensibly flubbed a contract with the FBI, which allowed them to copy the FBI's most sensitive files.

Next, the SAIC ostensibly flubbed the Trailblazer contract at the NSA (this is the one which whistleblower, Thomas Drake, attempted to go through normal channels, was rebuffed, then sought out his congressman, and later would have his career and life destroyed in the federal courts by the US government), where again SAIC had access to highly sensitive files [great way to move the files in plain sight].

Booz Allen Hamilton (Carlyle Group), SAIC, etc., etc., etc., the list of private intel contractors is horrendously long and growing. . . 


***Interesting item regarding the son of Vice President Biden (Hunter Biden) and stepson of John Kerry (Chris Heinz) and their connections to Burisma Holdings, the number one gas and oil producer in the Ukraine. Curiouser and curiouser. . . .



Thu, 05/29/2014 - 18:19 | 4807654 11b40
11b40's picture

Great work, Sarge....and don't forget where Cheney went when his government employment ended abruptly and surprisingly.  After Clinton beat Poppa Bush (former head of the CIA, remember) in the elections of 1992, Cheney went off to run Haliburton.  Not only is Haliburton the big dog in the oil services business, they also owned Kellog,Brown, & Root, a MAJOR military private contractor.  Cheney becomes a multi-millionaire

No sooner does this ass-wipe traitor get back in office than we are busy invading Iraq, to the enormous benefit of both Haliburton and KBR.

This bastard, with his 5 deferments during the Viet Nam war era, was instrumental in ending the draft and in the drive to privatize the military.  Mercenaries are so much more pliable than conscripts, doncha' know.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:18 | 4804017 Kprime
Kprime's picture

Kerry is a communist cunt.  Snowden is a patriot.

Really, "trust the American system of justice"?  That fukin bankrupt, sociopath criminal government stolen false religion,  fuck you Kerry, you and all your sociopathic pussy comrades in DC.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:45 | 4804141 prains
prains's picture

not sure you know what a communist is as clearly you've used it in the wrong context but it's clear he's a crony to the faux capitalist scheme you shmoes are running in 'merika, so either your entire system is communist or you don't have the adequate vocabulary to express your anger...and yes Snowden has big balls, bigger than yours and mine put together but that's a different discussion

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:08 | 4804217 TrustbutVerify
TrustbutVerify's picture


Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:14 | 4804244 prains
prains's picture

yes...exactly, HuH! what the hell is a :communist" in nSSA/uSSA? your verbage is all wrong. Language and terminology is a powerful tool. You live in Crony Town, it's NOT's the failed version of capitalism. So stop using the WRONG words to describe your anger, it just makes you look dumber than you already are.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:27 | 4804282 gmrpeabody
gmrpeabody's picture

They are recent grads from public schools..., what do you expect, prains?

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:42 | 4804324 prains
prains's picture

you're right gm, thanks for the calming voice, I just hope when the fog of woar has cleared there's a few sentinels left to keep the real message alive, so when history repeats itself for the 500th time maybe a few generations of relative empathy can exist


realtive empathy...what a concept, so smart it hurts......yet we're too dumb to get it 

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:54 | 4804267 Kprime
Kprime's picture

You see the definitions at the bottom?

 Well our government or "state" believes all properties belong to them, we only rent them.  They personally charge me taxes that equal the entire value of my land every 40 years.  I can never own the land free and clear.  If I do not pay and I resist they kill me.  That is definition one.

Definition two is our defacto red/blue government. The double speak of two parties, republican and democrat, is confusing you.  They are two sides of a single ruling party.  It is a self perpetuating totalitarian state. They exempt themselves from their own rules. They own the entire economy.  They give riches to themselves and steal from the rest of us.  They charge us to spend our own wealth. They have a pen and a phone and enough military equipment and ammo to kill every resisting American 50 times over.

Our system is faux/capitalist in name only, it is communism in practice and enforced by murdering dictators.  Clearly the doublespeak confuses you.  Our government by law says I own my land and it is free and clear of all debt.  Our government also says if I do not buy it back from them every 40 years they will kill me for it.  That is not even false capitalism, it is communism enforced by legalize murder. The only ones who can legally commit this murder are the totalitarian dictators.  I am no more a free citizen than are the citizens of dictators world wide.  I am a slave.  Actual ownership of my property is ascribed to the state.  I must pay up every year or be killed.

Clearly your reasoning capabilities are suspect. Your understanding of the operating structure of the US is faulty. Further, if you are going to teach vocabulary you might at least do some research before-hand.


1. a theory or system of social organization based on the holding of all property in common, actual ownership being ascribed to the community as a whole or to the state.

2.( often initial capital letter ) a system of social organization in which all economic and social activity is controlled by a totalitarian state dominated by a single and self-perpetuating political party.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:58 | 4804352 prains
prains's picture


you've answered your own question with your own definition you fucking TOOL!!


1. a theory or system of social organization based on the holding of all property in common, actual ownership being ascribed to the community as a whole or to the state.


Your failed crony capitalistic system has devolved into a CONCENTRATION OF POWER AND WEALTH into a very SMALL few........NOT dispersed into a community as a whole or state


are you oxygen deprived??? Your "State" clearly operates to benefit the very few in your country, or have you been asleep for the last decade?

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 00:46 | 4804369 Kprime
Kprime's picture

lol,   dude, learn to parse a sentence.  Also, slow down, get your eyes checked.  "dispersed" does not appear in the definition.  You appear to have confused "Holding" with "dispersed".  Public school perhaps?

Let's strip out the non-essential modifiers and break it down a bit.

“A theory “OR” system of organization, based on holding all property, actual ownership ascribed to, community as a whole “OR” State”.

Using the alternative choices provided by the two inclusions of the conjunction “OR”, a reduction of the sentence to the following statement is a full and correct interpretation of the concept set forth. This is the reality of the current system of the US.

 “A system of organization based on holding all property, actual ownership ascribed to the State”.

Further, the State does not have to claim or admit that it is perpetrating this system.  It simply has to act in a manner in accordance with the definition of the system.  The USA acts exactly as described by the precepts of communism.  It just doesn't claim to.  Doublespeak.


Thu, 05/29/2014 - 00:18 | 4804400 Proofreder
Proofreder's picture

Parse ?  Prains didn't even read the second Communism-with-a-big-C definition ...

So, Dickhead, pay attention; communism is a Theory -

Big-C Communism is what we live under in the USSA today - highly centralized government controlled to infinity by a single tiny group under a rotating "elected leader" enriching the few at the top (the .01%) at the expense of the masses at the bottom.  

RIP, former middle class America, you are soon to be extinct.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 04:29 | 4804675 Doña K
Doña K's picture


Can we just, at least, all agree that all goverments are oppressive and count on doing things with our money until the people run out of their money?

What's in a name? Wasting time jumping on each other. I bet that all of us  do want the same things. (unless you are part of the aparata or part of the entitlement crew which was created by .gov anyway)

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 15:12 | 4806894 Meatier Shower
Meatier Shower's picture

This is Fight Club.

If you counter someone's argument with uninformed bullshit, you deserve to be destroyed.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 00:57 | 4804470 FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

Nicely done Kprime. As a libertarian what I do actually like about communists is that they are the honest leftists. They assert they own everything. I would add one small thing to your post in that the State also owns all people. They own YOU and me. If you challenge that assumption by not doing precisely what they tell you when they tell you will also have your property taken up to and including your life. This will make the point to the other serfs much like an IRS audit. Fail to register your car and pay the requisite taxes and you lose the sticker, the right to drive it and will be jailed if you try.

What bothers me is how many people unwittingly agree that our purpose in life is to be ruled which is to be owned by the State.

What also bothers me is how few Snowdens there are. There should be more people in government with some sort of conscience who are not fully brainwashed or cowed by the State.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 03:00 | 4804609 Confused
Confused's picture

What also bothers me is how few Snowdens there are. There should be more people in government with some sort of conscience who are not fully brainwashed or cowed by the State.


I used to sit very close to a guy, who kept a government reporting phone number in his top draw. During our little bitch fests at work complaining about what was going wrong, he would often tell me that he wanted to call and "blow the whistle." But he was young, had a family, and would be blacklisted from a specialized industry. And then there is always the chance that nothing will be done to correct anything, and you've put a target on yourself. 


Anecdotal from a small .gov contractor. These people do exist. But there is always leverage which cuts down the decision tree. 

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 06:54 | 4804770 laomei
laomei's picture

They issued what? Some 60k+ NSLs to companies demanding obscene amounts of data that they had to right to, but had just passed it around to enough lawyers to find technical potential loopholes for authorizing it.  That's some 60k+ people who received these letters, were told "it's legal, so just do it", no proper warrants, and finally, just 1 dared to challenge it, and even then refuses to break the gag order.  And people still use the excuse that conspiracies involving lots of people are impossible... 60k letters in just under a decade, and the entire thing was kept hush hush.  Comply or go to jail.  Stay silent or go to jail.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 13:41 | 4806366 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture

Yes, but the banksters are running the show, and paying off everyone.

Remember, ONLY ONE person was fired at Merrill Lynch leading up to the global economic meltdown (a trader), ONLY ONE senior mortgage writer was fired at Washington Mutual (Keysha Cooper) for refusing to wrte up fraudulent loans, ONLY ONE exec was fired at Chase for refusing to put her name to a crooked contract, and nobody was fired at Goldman Sachs, Morgan Stanley, Bank of America, Citigroup and Wells Fargo.

Sat, 05/31/2014 - 03:58 | 4812138 FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

Well, in the case you are describing I like the analogy of the drunk and the bartender. The drunk is the government who sits at the bar and the bartender who serves up the drinks is JP Morgan, Sachs and the rest of the gang. The drunk has a gun but he really cannot shoot his bartender. So, a small sacrifice gets offered up as you describe.

Meanwhile the party goes on.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:05 | 4804210 DeadFred
DeadFred's picture

Green arrow even if you were way to easy on him.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:25 | 4804022 Millivanilli
Millivanilli's picture

Edward Snowden has more balls than the CONgress, Executive and Judicial branches of govt. COMBINED.  Disclaimer, Feinstein has large balls but they are cancerous and filled with maggots.


The only traitors I see are in the District of Criminals.


"He can come home but he’s a fugitive from justice which is why he is not being permitted to fly around the world," he said.

Meanwhile Corzine and the bankster brood fly with impunity. FUCK YOU,KERRY. OH YEAH, DON'T TASE ME BRO! MAN UP MY ASS, MOTHER FUCKER. Watch this useless sack of shit with ears stare as a man is tased for asking questions.
Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:12 | 4804029 Bernankenstein
Bernankenstein's picture

Let's do a swap. Trade Kerry to Russia and Snowden comes back a patriot. Win-win.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:27 | 4804085 napper
napper's picture

I'd throw in Obama, Hillary Clinton, GW Bush, Dick Cheney, Rumsfeld, the entire NSA and the state department for the swap.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:27 | 4804088 The_Prisoner
The_Prisoner's picture

Kerry is an errand boy. If you want Russia to give up Snowden you'd have to offer up Brzezinski.

The world would be a better place without that vampyre.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:38 | 4804115 XitSam
XitSam's picture


Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:55 | 4804177 The_Prisoner
The_Prisoner's picture

The lot of them.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 03:01 | 4804610 Confused
Confused's picture

As I posted above, his son is a prinicple at Booz Allen. So yes. The lot of them. 

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:14 | 4804034 logicalman
logicalman's picture

Mr Snowden has a pair.

Kerry, not so much.

Mr. Snowden has principles

Kerry not so much.

Mr Snowden's soul is not for sale.......

I'm sure the list is longer, but you get the point.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 03:38 | 4804635 ebear
ebear's picture

yeah, sort of.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:13 | 4804035 Stockmonger
Stockmonger's picture

"trust in the American system of justice"


Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:15 | 4804038 The Shootist
The Shootist's picture

Come back to the USSA and earn you some counterfeit federal reserve notes working in a nonessential government job.

(We're a banana republic with nukes)

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:38 | 4804118 Yes_Questions
Yes_Questions's picture



a Banukenukepublic


after using two, a banana republic can just use a number after "nuke" such that, when the ussa uses a nuke again, it will then advance to Banuke3public status, and be forever hated.


by everyone.



Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:17 | 4804040 Strat-O-Sphere
Strat-O-Sphere's picture

For a supposedly smart guy Cohn acts like the talmudic fucktard he is every time he opens his gob.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:16 | 4804044 nmewn
nmewn's picture

"Kerry called Snowden a "coward" and a "traitor,"


Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:16 | 4804046 holdbuysell
holdbuysell's picture

Draft-dodger Kerry telling someone else to 'man-up'.

Sheezus...the hypocrisy is strong with this one.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:27 | 4804087 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Kerry did not dodge the draft...he served and served with honor.

I would say there is no dishonor in not being a man however.
Most "manly men" are dead actually.

I find nothing wrong in him coming home actually...if
I were advising him...certainly do what's in your heart...but seriously think about what you feel you represent before the return. Definitely have a lawyer!!

"Doin time" is part of this business. If that is what Secretary of State Kerry means then I think what he's saying is okay. If on the other hand he is berating a kid for acting on what that kid believes are his principles then clearly...well, isn't that why you came out against the war Senator Kerry?

I mean have a heart here. You were that kid once too.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:41 | 4804131 BeetleBailey
BeetleBailey's picture

"Served with honor" - fuckin please.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:19 | 4804259 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

If you count machine gunning people in the back, then yes. Honorable.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 00:59 | 4804474 FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

Hey! He was wounded by flying rice and that got him a purple heart! What an honor!

If he is so proud of his service, his actions in Vietnam and his sacrifice why would he toss the medals over a wall?

Remember when the young Democrats and protestors were the anti-establishment types? Now he IS the establishment!

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 23:12 | 4804236 drendebe10
drendebe10's picture

Could u pass around some of that crazy sh-t ur drinkin or smokin?

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 03:26 | 4804627 SilverFish
SilverFish's picture

If your definition of "serving" includes going to a far off land, just because some douchebags in Washington DC told him to do so, and and killing people that never laid so much as a fingernail on his country, I guess you'd be correct.


As for the honor part, I have no fucking idea what you're talking about.

Thu, 05/29/2014 - 07:11 | 4804791 Al Gorerhythm
Al Gorerhythm's picture

Fuck me, mate! Did you stop one with your head?

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:29 | 4804092 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

Kerry didn't dodge.

He got shot at.  The details of that are shaky and less than pristine, but he didn't dodge the draft.

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:32 | 4804097 rubiconsolutions
rubiconsolutions's picture

Kerry didn't dodge the draft......just like McCain didn't land planes. 

Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:40 | 4804103 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture


Wed, 05/28/2014 - 22:41 | 4804132 booboo
booboo's picture

Kerry served on the USS Munster as the mascot and don't ever post a fucking photo of him that large on ZH again or "there will be consequences"

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!