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When Work Is Punished - Why The Poor Stay Poor
The dismal reality in America that we first exposed over 18 months ago is that 'work is punished'. Simply put, for increasingly more Americans it is now more lucrative - in the form of actual disposable income - to sit, do nothing, and collect various welfare entitlements, than to work. As the following brief clip exposes, supposedly well-intentioned welfare programs drastically decrease benefits at certain income thresholds - which in effect can make a breadwinner and his/her family worse off when they start earning more. Sound absurd? That's because it is.
As we noted in detail previously,
This is graphically, and very painfully confirmed, in the below chart from Gary Alexander, Secretary of Public Welfare, Commonwealth of Pennsylvania (a state best known for its broke capital Harrisburg). As quantitied, and explained by Alexander, "the single mom is better off earnings gross income of $29,000 with $57,327 in net income & benefits than to earn gross income of $69,000 with net income and benefits of $57,045."
And it appears the mainstream is beomcing more aware of this absurd reality...
Working more for less... or why the poor stay poor...
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The same folks who complain about the poor not being willing to work for the prevailing wages also claim that CEO's must be paid hundreds of millions or they won't be inspired enough to do the job...
Funny, that.
You're positive it's the same people eh?
I got my disability check in the mail today.
VIP room at the strip club tonight for me!
What about the other 29 Days of the month ????
Perhaps I am too cynical but to say that these Gubmin Programmes are "Well intentioned" is a very charitable statement. IMHO, they are mostly (Together with Illegal immigration etc.) designed to lock-in a permanenet Democrat majority. But as Margarte Thatcher once notably opined, "The problem with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money".
Who down voted this?
Many people on this site are bums that think they are righteous in collecting benefits. They feel owed. The feel entitled. They paid taxes for a while so why not? Now it is your turn to pay taxes. They will help hasten the collapse. That is their civic duty now.
Many people on this site are bums that think they are righteous in collecting benefits. They feel owed.
I was actually thinking the other day at lunch I wish we could just pay these waiters to stay home and replace them with robots. So really, this article paints a rosy picture of the future to my mind.
All this talk about entitlement, what a bunch of bullshit. Most people in the western world (those who get paid decently) work idiotic jobs to little discernable purpose. Infact, the society would probably be better off if they also didn't work. As much as GS claims to be doing gods work, I have serious doubts.
Slimy institutions are carpet bombing the entire globe with financial weapons yet it's the single mom on tiny welfare (the canard zh likes to play up is more bullshit) who's really fucking it all up, right...
At some point people will also wake up to the fact that software / hardware innovations are making human labour increasingly irrelvant and thank gawd for that!
All of this discussion is fine, but few seem to grapple with the fact that all Western economies are plagued by structural unemployment.
Sure you cut all forms of assistance -- some people will die, others will become domestics for $1/hour and be "taken" from the rear while doing the dishes, and still others will attempt to earn a living outside of the established order (property rights, civil and criminal rules).
But the jobs are simply not there and will not be there no matter what we do: that's progress. There are lots of things we can get done without needing a lot of people.
Cue my question, "We got the robots, now where is that four hour working week that was supposed to accompany the robots?"
If one man can operate a machine that does the job of ten men, why does he still have to work 40 - 80 hours per week while the other nine get the sack? Can't they all just work 4 - 8 hours per week?
Oh, but if all ten are working then all ten are entitled to a share of the production, whereas if only one works and the other nine are unemployed then suddenly only one man is "entitled"* to a share of the production while the other nine are "lazy, worthless bums" who "don't deserve anything because they didn't work for it".
* and by "entitled", I mean "entitled to as little as possible as dictated by 9 newly unemployed, all hungry and desperate to take the tenth man's job".
And yes, I know, the other nine men just need to borrow bucket loads of money and build their own machines that allow one man to do the job of ten and then we can all consume ten times more and we'll all be rich.
Has the structural unemployment been aided by the rise of social programs? Have we bred, fed and domesticated a useless underclass?
We outsourced their jobs, they were always the underclass but at one time there were reasonable jobs for them...
If the world doesn't need as many humans to operate, we only have two choices:
1) Reduce the amount of humans
2) Do we go offworld like in Star Trek?
Any other choices?
Look dude, a billion dollar jew needs the same amount of calories as a $2 crack whore. We got a few hundred (thousand?) billion dollar jews. We got millions of 'worthless eaters'. Who do you think consumes more resources (my labor included).
And I'm not saying the single mom on welfare is fucking it up. I blame the Dads.....
I was taught "if you don't work, you don't eat, period."I have mellowed over the years and think that this may be a little harsh, but you can't have everyone think that they are entitled to eat while not contributing.
The financial "weapons" you speak of are actually "products" that individuals and companies willingly consume often to their detriment. So perhaps there are not so many victims as you might want to believe.
Capitalism has the same problem. Eventually, you run out of other people's money. No matter whether it's socialism or capitalism, you're using other people's money.
+infinity to you Mr yrbmegr.
So few people acknowledge - when everyone else has gone bankrupt, the Monopoly game ends. Even the winner can not continue to play - even if he was nice and honest and provided good service and value for money - he has no-one to pay rent to him. The amount that can trickle up can not exceed the amount that trickled down.
that would be true in a completely closed system. however, in an actual productive economy, the creation of goods increases the net value of the economy allowing for expansion. it is only through artificial constraints such as government regulations, or a corrupted economic system that interfers with that process. the monoploy game could go on forever, either by completelty resetting the game every so often, or,...constantly adding new game boards when the old ones get bought up.
The World is an adiabatic (closed) system. Just how much cheap energy is there left?
An economy based upon exponential growth, as ours, is not sustainable. Exponential Growth leads to Exponential Collapse.
That is where we are at.
occurring without gain or loss of heat
are you retarded?
The two of you were made for each other...
I'm off to get some popcorn...
The winner can afford to make a new game board. The losers will have to borrow money from the winner to continue to play.
you know when u play with monopoly money and you have all the $500.00 dollar bills and people are forced to avoid landing on your property to pay the rent,,,,,in this case though everyone will be getting their social security and disability checks with newly printed money for the next 20 years, if gold aint high enough to absorb all that new monopoly money we will have a problem,,,,,,,,,
There's always lazy people looking to cheesepoop the system, we're talking about human beings here. So always complainin about the dingleberry misses the point, LOOK TO THE REAL CRIMINALS!!!
2014 R'tard Cabernet seems a popular vintage
prains LOOK TO THE REAL CRIMINALS!!!
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A criminal is a criminal no matter what level. I have as much respect for a politician stealing my money as I do the welfare abuser stealing my money.
Stealing is stealing. Theft is theft.
4 trillion vs. 400 billion, I beg to differ. There is a quanitifiable difference and your justice system also makes the same comparison in it's judgements. You should too.
fyi the numbers are allegorical and only meant to imply the difference is vast. If anyone knew the real numbers they'd be dead. But you and I both know the two levels of theivery are VASTLY different.
Ah......the lesser of two evils syndrome.
Ok folks, this time lets vote for the greater of two evils and elect me, Pure Evil, Emperor of the World!
50 million people kiting a system, many of whom do it just to fucking eat IS a whole lot different than 500 people kiting the system for a 100 fold more than the body politic. First degree murder vs. involuntary manslaughter........yes degrees do mean something
No, it's not different !
It's the same principle: everybody steals as much as he/she can.
Your 50 millions would steal as much as those 500 if they could.
...but they did dint did they, so you sit at home and suck on it while a few cheespoops take ALL the gravy and you sit at home and blame the easy fat ass target offered up for your scorn....
you dweebs are too stoopid and easy to manipulate it's almost child-like, they laff at you daily while they empty the register
You are not a special unique snowflake. Mother Earth did not give society any kind of dowry when you were born. Why does anyone believe they are entitled to anything for just existing? How can any system function sustainably with large swaths that consume resources but do not contribute towards the accumulation of resources? People waste time arguing about the morality of elements of an immoral system.
Welfare people can only "steal" that which TBTJ makes available to them.
You got a problem with leaks? Go ahead, blame the holes in your bucket. But you really ought to first take a good look at the guy with the electric drill in his hand.
I'm thankful for the comment section for teaching me a great deal.
Someone break this down for me, if you would: Some on this site who must be well aware of the fiat currency system we endure, rail on welfare as if it came out of their taxes. It's all funny-money. I understand the hidden tax and the dilution of purchasing power, but, correct me if I'm wrong, welfare is a drop in the fiat ocean.
When I work, I make minimum 4 x what I get on welfare. Assuming 10% unemployment - 9 workers pay for one unemployed, that takes 2.8% of my income to pay for unemployed people - plus admin costs. So what happens to the rest of my tax money that gets diverted to "welfare"? Well, I haven't accounted for rent subsidies, child payments etc, so a bit goes there but yes it would be good to see a more detailed break down. The basic dole itself is good insurance and doesn't hurt anyone.
So someone steals my car and I shouldn't mind that someone else steals my TV. Makes perfect sense to a dingbat.
To me, they're both scum. Anyone who is not disabled or too old to work should not be on welfare. If they just need food, then put them in military barracks and feed them military grade food.
somebody steals your car while at the same time a completely different person steals your wife and kids at the exact SAME time....who do you go after?
I'm talking relativity while you're talking medium or large slurpee....dingbat!! or maybe it's dingleberry to your friends
now there's crickets sun spew.....?WTF answer the question dumbfuck who do you choose, car or family, it's about the same relative importance as my previous point.....
weakling
So, the 100k people stealing 4T are creating laws to help other 50M people steal 400B in order to keep the majority of tax payers occupied. That's pretty smart, isn't it?
Or, to ilustrate for a first class Johnny: Matt takes from you 10$ through intimidation and beating and Brad takes only 1$, but after Matt. They just need these dollars to survive. Who is the worst? Response: Johnny, because he doesn't fight back!
After three marriages...I'll take the car.
Well that obviously depends on who is farther away.
And sorry, your argument is invalid without weighing the benefits and drawbacks of each class of people. Is the velocity of money that the entitlement moochers provide more beneficial that that of the greedy CEO class? What about innovations provided by each class? What about inspiration to create or succeed? What about the maintainence of a culture which wants to do 'better' than the generation before?
Please make a real argument for why I should loathe one moocher equally or more than the other.
prains:
Actually, it's more like a criminal steals some clown's house and contents and gives the old VCR to some mentally retarded person who lives under a bridge. And then the clown claims victory when the cops jail the homeless retard and the clown reclaims his old VCR, while totally ignoring the loss of the rest of his house and contents and the original criminal that enabled all of it.
great analogy........there's too many clowns and for some reason the "smart" ones who found ZH still fall for the same fucking pea game.....yes the criminal is under that cup, while the real criminal is running the fucking pea game
"Put the welfare recipients to the guillotine and the "original thieves," the pols, crats and banksters, will just make more. Put the pols, crats and banksters to the guillotine, and their theft and welfare end."
"My guillotine can reduce theft and dependence at the same time."
to sit, do nothing, and collect various welfare entitlements
"doing nothing is a dangerous occupation." quoted from what's his name in that movie....you know....
sitting and collecting is doing "something" and the "entitlement" is the going free-market rate.
I have to agree with prains on this one it seems that while the emir and the grand vizier are stealing treasures you are trying to cut off the arms of the small boy that stole the loaf of bread.
I don't think it's "laziness" at all. I think the word to best describe the prevailing attitude is "resignation." The idea that there is no longer any alternative and so turn desperately to paltry government benefits. No longer is the "market" able to provide job security, so people latch onto the "security" of government programs because that's all that's available.
All that these welfare programs do is delay the growing political time bomb from going off which serves the 1%, not those enrolled in these programs despite what the MSM and the associated punditry have convinced far too many people of.
No one with a job would ever give their job up to sit back and receive a government check each month. You will barely be able to afford food-like products on an EBT, much less actual food. Pink slime for meat. You can't even buy Kraft Macaroni and Cheese, you have to buy imitation macaroni and cheese. And considering what's inside the name brand box, I would not shock me to find out the imitation stuff is Soylent Green or recycled diapers from the primate exhibit of a local zoo.
The response of those at the very top to the ongoing crisis (which they greatly fostered, along with the "middle class") is to take away what few crumbs the poor and destitute are offered up in these programs while simultanously demanding subsidized workforce that drives their revenues.
Hate to break it to people, but the middle class are the reason why things are so bad. It was the "middle class" that followed orders from the top to eviscerate those below them. Which they did. I will shed no tears for the "middle class" now that the upper class is in the process of looting the middle class in order to preserve itself; the 1% are eating their way up the food chain and it's not as if myself and others haven't been warning people for two decades or anything. The middle classes have been so convinced by the "job creators" and "captains of industry" that the poor and their demands for a meager existence via government benefits are finding that as they turn to the system they are now discovering the fruits of their labours.
I'm sure many thought that "it could never happen to them" so it was no problem to cruelly marginalize the poor and stigmatizing them. "Poverty happens over there on the other side of the tracks and it serves them right for being 'lazy'."
Boo-Fucking-Hoo. Mr. Middle Manager who dutifully voted Republican and shopped around at Walmart is starting to find out firsthand how inadequate things are when it's discovered their employers no longer require their services when their old jobs were outsourced to Vietnam or Ecuador.
The Bard wrote "those injuries they themselves procure must be their schoolmasters." Indeed.
No one with a job would ever give their job up to sit back and receive a government check each month.
I wouldn't be so sure about that... There are many other ppl who already given similar examples..... And btw not to throw in politics becuase the left right paradgim is pathetic but democrats passed nafta (bill Clinton administration) where a lot of the "outsourcing" started
Wasn't that Ross Perot's big point? Would that not put the major source before Clinton?
Bemused Observer The same folks who complain about the poor not being willing to work for the prevailing wages also claim that CEO's must be paid hundreds of millions or they won't be inspired enough to do the job... Funny, that.
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You certainly are bemused. You're probably bemused why you can't get a job from a poor person. Of course if all these poor people were as talented or educated, they would be running companies or start their own.
That is not to say there isn't pay disparity. But it answers why the poor are poor which isn't inline with your comment.
putting everything in terms of economic wealth is a false narratve, economic wealth and providing "jobs" is also a sign of depravity. I submit to you sir, Jamie Dimon, Flyod Spankamime, John Free Me Corozine as "jobs" providers but also the sum of humanity.
I'd rather eat dirt, than be your kinda wealthy
I haven't decided if that deserves a junk or not, but...
I have an employee that basically pushes a broom and labels containers because that is really all he can do without serious supervision else he fuck it up. He's not retarded. Just not smart. See, he made bad decision after bad decision. Got messed up on drugs, knocked up his girlfriend a few times, got his baby mama on drugs, both lost all custody and then got kicked out of their grandparents, tried to get clean, couldn't get a job, squatted different places, got clean again, lost his car, got shit stolen, pissed away good Samaritans goodwill, etc etc. The combination of bad decisions and bad 'luck' just compounds after awhile. He's stuck in a vicious cycle. Like that Cracked article said, once you're poor or make a single mistake, the bankers and their system fuck you.
So, this guy is trying to climb out of a deep fucking hole. But it's a hole he dug. I don't have pity on him. I have hope and a job for him. That's the best I can do.
his uselessness is a condition of humanity that will never change. As humans shit out offspring the genetic lottery will always be random. His taking of your wealth compares so much less than the destruction of your city, country, mankind, that the few central bankers can inflict upon you at a moments notice.
You put sloth-boy at too high an apogee in relative importance. worry more about what your children will inherit as a civilization
Good point and well taken.
I'd also like my children to inherit some kindness, compassion for their fellow man and civility, so that they can understand what a selfish, psychopathic, sociopathic evil fuck looks like so they can help me beat back the tide of central banking cock suckers and build a better civilization too.
And at $10/hr he ain't taking to much of anything from anyone. It's not a hand out; my floors will always need cleaning. It isn't glamorous either. If he's still pushing that broom in another year or so, we'll know what type of person he is. There will always be the ambitious and those that clean up after them.
e.m.p.a.t.h.y
we can't teach empathy because we can't first demonstrate it and in the face of criminality it's almost impossible. That's why we need to beware folks like Harbanger, they teach nothing......that helps us all
dead thread I know, but I just wanted to acknowledge the truth of your exchange(s) above,
keeping that part of our humanity that can still empathise with other peoples, some of whom are doing the best they can with what little they started their lives with,
and not letting ourselves get co-opted into the "divide 'n' conquer" game played by those who script nation-all stories that pit us against each other, from all angles.
hate is hate, and wherever it is directed it boomerangs right back, because it originates from self - THAT's how THEY "win".
trooth !!
too few against too many...it's all up hill from here
He got messed up on drugs BUT unlike high school kids in Greenwich CT or Scarsdale NY his parents were probably not wealthy enough to get him treatment or for therapy & psyc doc sessions (which cost me $157 per visit and that is the 50% Copay WITH insurance)..... Heroin & prescription drug abuse is rampant in Westchester County & on Long Island but mommy & daddy have deep enough pockets to A) pay off the judge & police of the town since their taxes pay for it and B) The $100,000 + treatment center
Yeah, I think got high. So would you pay the freight for me to go to the hospital and dry out?
Shit! What's with you people?
I didn't get high. But plenty of times I have been unemployed while high people have had jobs. Maybe I shoulda got high.
If someone wants to be a lazy welfare yob then let 'em. Plenty of good people who will start work early and work hard to look after their bosses. Sort them out first.
Boo hoo, your point? Life isn't fair? Isn't that a lesson we learn in kindergarten?
"also claim that CEO's must be paid hundreds of millions or they won't be inspired enough to do the job... Funny"
Or rewarding CEO/corporate board FAILURE with contracts that provide FAT compensation when they resign. Kill the company? Ruin earnings? No problem. Their contracts provide $$$ if you fail or succeed!
The poor stay poor...because that's what your money masters want.
the poor stay poor because the people who create jobs have less and less incentive to hire them or create new opportunities for them--for a plethora of reasons--and then of course because they are actively being robbed through inflation.
Bro of the Sorr... the poor stay poor because the people who create jobs have less and less incentive to hire them or create new opportunities for them--for a plethora of reasons--and then of course because they are actively being robbed through inflation.
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It is so sad to see a culture that has no initiative and won't take responsibility for their own lives.
So, every thing is manipulated. The government is corrupt. Everything is against you.
Then why don't you just give up and commit suicide?
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America has lost its can do spirit of hard work and sacrifice, despite the odds. So sad.
Again, don't know if I'm junking this. I pretty much agree with you in the lack of work ethic and drive. It's true. But there are certain forces at work to ensure plenty of debt slaves to be conditioned from birth to love their chains and crush any individuality or legacy "American spirit" that was once there.
We're getting closer...
We just be gettin redy for dem hard workin robots.
"work ethic" and "drive" come from the marginal utility of leisure vs labor for each individual. what the government does is make the marginal utility of giving up one unit of leisure very high through welfare incentive programs, which is another way that the poor are kept poor, as the video points out. if there was no welfare at all and everyone was exposed to market forces, all the people who are sitting at home leeching off of society would enter the workforce, which would drive down the cost of labor while at the same time freeing up the resources previously being used by the leeches for use in more productive ventures. in the long run everyone would be better off in terms of accumulated capital and purchasing power.
this is all a roundabout way of saying that you cant blame such vague concepts as low work ethic and drive for the way these people are acting. they are acting very rationally, and exactly as one should expect, given the environment in which they live. the outcome is also exactly what one might expect, that EVERYONE is poorer and there is less capital accumulation, which i suspect, is exactly what the tyrannical oligarchs want.
When I was a kid growing up in farm country, my parents both had an episode of health problems. I had a lot of brothers and sisters so the parents went on Food Stamps, AFDC and WIC. This was in the mid-1970s. I worked on weekends, evenings and all the time in the summer. I was 10, 11 and 12 those years. Some of the jobs I had were cash under the table from neighboring farmers. Others were through a county job service of some kind. The wages I made through the job service paid about $1 per hour at the time. Remember, minimum wage and child labor restrictions don't apply to agriculture.
The money I earned through the job service was deducted, dollar-for-dollar, from our family's welfare assistance. That was to teach my parents (and me) the value of work, I guess. But mostly it was to make sure nobody got one penny more than they "deserved." Whatever. We lived as well as we could, eating the bug-infested rice and chalky government cheese and drinking the blueish powdered milk. I'm not complaining, but I sure did learn how work is valued in America. Punishing a 10 year-old for working harder than most people ever have. Farmwork ain't easy, nor always pleasant.
I haven't had any experience with those programs since, but from the look of the people on them, they aren't any more rehabilitative now than they were then.
My hat is off to you. We are about the same age and I grew up in farm country, but had it easy compared to you. I did not live on a farm except for 18 months while our house was getting built. A friend asked me if I wanted to make some money and since I, did he took me to a gentleman farmer's place to bale hay for the day. I baled hay for only 5 hours in the hot sun without any gloves. My soft hands were bleeding withing an hour or so as the baling twine just cut right through. I remember my salty sweat stinging my wounds.
When we were done the farmer took us to his kitchen, gave us each a glass of water and pulled out his check book. My pay? $15. This was the mid to late 1970's. On the way out to our bicycles we walked past his yellow Mercedes sedan.
Wear gloves when you bale hay my friends.
$3 dollars an hour! what about the $15 minimum wage!!! that reminds me...have to vote democrat next election.
The only place playing by the rules will get you is poor.
poor is rich
rich is poor
sound heard at
the knocking door.
poor is rich
rich is poor
no one home,
move along.
.
anyway p ...
a cheezeburger is a cheezeburger is a cheezeburger
wages have deflated and benefits have not
in the public sector wages have inflated
the government pays itself by pushing a button to create money out of thin air and those in the private sector need to go out and earn it
what is the end game ?
Neofeudalism. For an artist's illustration, see The Hunger Games.
Thinking on those lines it is quite easy to reconcille the relentless attack on the middle class in Australia, isn't it?
In the UK back in the 1970's it was called the "poverty trap".
Any incremental increase by way of wages was lost to taxation removing
all incentive to work,producing a permanent underclass.
I'm working under the table for a friend and even he keeps my wages limited based on what he deems fair, and in this case fair is very subjective. This is why unions are formed, and yes the other worker and I are discussing how to bring up a wage increase.
The best way is usually to just ask. Timing is important, say after a job or project that went well. Don't be afraid to turn it into a discussion, nor to point out a few opportunities you took to go the extra mile. Even if you don't get the raise you should be able to get a few pointers where you might be lacking. Address those and he won't have a choice!!
I've never had an employer fault me for being ambitious, good luck!
Very good, forward focused answer. For people living in the present, debating history hides individual steps they can do now.
Not saying analysis of history is not needed for a solution, but people need to make decisions now, and training of the mind is probably the most important thing.
Money earned at W2 wage labor is taxed pretty damned high, too. When I fired my boss/went freelance, I doubled my gross pay very quickly, and the whole range of expenses I could deduct on Schedule C far outweighed the additional 7.65% in paying the other half of payroll tax.
I remember one financial guy on the radio (dating myself), who said the most important thing he has done is get each of his kids to have some business at an early age. I am talking first tax return. It could be butterfly collection, it did not matter. Then the concept of investment, expenses, overhead, taxes, are become real....
That was at least 40 years ago and I remember it like yesterday.
ironic but the perverse incentives for the poor work exactly in reverse for banksters.
What do they share in common? IT'S YOUR $$$
the poor vs oligarch paradigm is age old gospel trooth. Some are stoopid, some are lazy, some are unlucky.......some take a criminal advantage. Never gonna change as long as knukles drag the earth.
The best part is every once an awhile the knuckle draggers get together and have a good old blood soaked Oligarch Party!!! Me thinks this one will particularily stand out...
The social engineers who design these programs operate with about the same understanding of human nature as economists designing economic theories... and the results are about the same!
We're not above social Darwinism. Politicians capitalize on this to buy votes-which compounds the problem and holds back our ability to thrive and adapt.
Doing a porno scene and sharing one guy's loads? That's cummunism!
What if I told you, you could get $100,000 in Government Benifits and not have to work; would you be Interested?
What if I told you that I know people who are Upper Middle Class Making $110,000 a year right..
I'm going to Share a few quick facts about this amazing discovery; and why so many people are dropping on to the Government Dole.
And why my coming YouTube Video will reach 100's of Thousands...
Fact #1
Disability pay out a women with 3 childern on Avg 45K a Year
(Disability Planner: Family Benefits)
http://www.ssa.gov/dibplan/dfamily.htm#fmax
Fact #2
With the Economic Crash many clear head Americans went on the dole and guess what they figured out?
(Meet The Disability-Industrial-Complex: Up To 45% On Disability Insurance Are Frauds)http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-10-08/meet-disability-industrial-comp...
(The Number Of US Citizens On Disability Is Now Larger Than The Population Of Greece)http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-05-09/number-us-citizens-disability-n...
Fact #3 ingenuity definition
For as long as I can remember people will do what it takes to survive; and survive they will. You take a family of 5 Boyfriend Girlfriend setup and both making about $100K together and then the crash hits them in 2008... Guess what?
By the time it hits 2014 they are back in full swing and she ain't working? (Just throw in some Lawyers and there kissing cousin the doctor and BAM Shes 40K with full medical)
Boyfrined heads the family to the Nearest Oil Patch and you got $140K Plus coming through the door....
In the video I'm working on; you will meet some of these families...... Also Take Not there are still 10's of thousands of them working through the System. There's nothing like being in Line Watching them use that EBT and Living HIGH ON THEE HOG!!!
Have a Great Day!
Winston Churchill: Any incremental increase by way of wages was lost to taxation removing..."
There in lies the fallacy (scam/ Ponzi) of income taxation. It is 100% purely punitive when your owners can just fire up the PC and add digits / credits / units FRN's.........
Explain to me again why all these bail outs are on the backs of the ultimate bag holders, the taxpayers. Explain to me again how it is mathematically possible to pay down this debt either through"growth" in the economy or taxation.
Nothing will change until more people realize that fact.
Encountered a situation few years ago with a friend who lived in a subsidized housing unit, paying a superficial rent of $375 for a 2 bedroom apartment, as long as his salary was below $30k. If his salary went above the threshold, the montly payment would've jupmed straight to market value, which at the time was $1500. So, we're talking $13500 annual increase in the cost of living without taking any other factors such as taxes into consideration.
When the friend was offered a $200/month raise, he turned it down, for obvious reasons.
crazziecannuck: No one with a job would ever give their job up to sit back and receive a government check each month. You will barely be able to afford food-like products on an EBT, much less actual food.
Bullshit. Total bullshit. I see fat mama-Jama stuffing her shopping cart with $200+ of shit food to 'feed" her Zygotes. The Zygotes were specifically hatched because her uterus is Big Business, getting paid from FEDGOV. Now, this walking, talking shit bad with her too tight pants and her asscrack 1/2 way up her back could easily buy $200 of actual Food products to feed her future leachfuck / criminals.... but she chooses to feed them shit on my dollar.
You wouldn't live like that. And neither would I. Just because people don't seem to see how degraded they doesn't mean they aren't degraded.
I've seen this too. Yes, she should buy actual food and prepare meals. She probably doesn't know how. And her "benefits" shouldn't pay for the crap people eat that makes them sick (which we have to pay to maintain, too). But the food-like substance manufacturers have spent a lot of money making sure their crap is subsidized by you and me.
That ain't livin'.
Who were the two idiots who down voted you? Your 100% right... That's the harsh truth and ppl don't want to hear it... I can't tell you how many times is have seen the same thing... They buy all that good and then pay for liquor and cigrettes seperately with a roll of $100 bills.... It's crazy
This article misses a few points worth noting, like shareholder preference, excessive labor market competition, absurd taxation and regulation... I could go on for days why it is more beneficial so kick back on the dole. If you can handle that lifestyle that is.
The question is: How is the government going to handle this slow motion train wreck. I'm curious if there have been any initiatives at street level to address this problem. Any first hand experience out there?
How will the government handle it? It will keep spending until EBT doesn't buy anything due to inflation.
whats the answer suggested? keep paying benefits as long as a minimum standard of living is attained that is set by the benefits that were once paid? (sounds like the solution proposed is keep benefits whilst earning larger and larger amounts that gradually reduce at a fixed level).
what is the incentive to work again? get out of the house and feel useful? a lot of people would do this because they have a sense of pride and want to get off benefits. too many see the flaw in this, since low skilled wages will bottom plateau at the level of benefits so there is no difference between working and not working..so they will not work.
this is a backdoor minimum wage guaranteed by the state.
solution = no benefits or no food stamps, but soup kitchens?
probably too harsh for liberals who want to spend your tax dollar money on their voters, so it wont fly democratically (mobocratically).
stop paying taxes because of the abuse of power by exisiting legislation? go to jail, do not pass go because he mobocracy has enforcers with guns bought from your tax dollars and who have a labor force paid to enforce the mobocracy with your tax dollars.
make benefit fraud punishable by prison terms? sounds good, but housing prisoners costs more because of the systems adopted by the mobocracy with your tax dollars.
hmmm.. migrate to..... a state with no unemployment or state taxes or benefit fraudsters? where is that? dakota? nebraska?
It is not a trap, it's a racket.
If people leave "assistance" they are less likely to "vote" and the pols and crats running the "assistance" "programs" will have a smaller budget to lord over and skim from.
All actions by government are either, schemes, scams or rackets.
I'm curious because it seems there is a potential void developing here. I'm not familiar with exactly how welfare and unemployment are regulated in the US, but something I do know is that the government is not going to be able to sustain half the country. They will indeed be looking to cut benefits, eligibility, and of course inflation is going to do it's thing as well.
If they weren't able to fund directly, I'm sure an aspiring entrepreneur would find them to be quite accommodating on this issue. Something that is generally overlooked around here is that government is a two way street if you know how to play the game.
I agree with you completely, however living in Europe, they are sure trying to test that theory.... It's something like 1/3 of ppl in France work for the goverment "just another form of welfare"... It's crazy that this amount of "handouts" has lasted this long.
That's a good point. From what I understand there is also a near constant state of revolt in some of the major city centres. I don't think that would fly in good ol America, too many guns lol
The government will sustain half the country as long as they can. As long as politicians are seeking re-election they will not dare cut benefits. They need the votes. The Fed will accommodate the politicians with more money printing until either the debt becomes unsustainable or the US dollar loses reserve currency status. Either of those could take a long time.
Ya about that voting thing...LOL
You might be surprised how fast the dollar loses it's favourable standing on the world stage. Many countries are coming to terms with the fact that America is essentially standing on their heads to keep their own above water. IMO there are only a few more pieces to be positioned and we will being to witness a MORE substantial difference in trade, and well a more proactive gov. In the US. Which can mean many things.
if you look at "benefits paid" for the pixels they truly are - created from the thin air that is the Fed - and you understand that those pixels are being "traded" at supermarkets via JPMorgan's SNAP cards, which skim a few pennies every swipe, or used to prop up the rentier class with Section 8 housing, or "welfare" card swipes to help pay for utilities, transportation, insurances, licenses - whatever outgoings each family needs,
then you realise the "benefits" are merely propping up the corporations/ government institutions/ businesses - they are the FACADE of the amrkn dream.
and we can either see through that facade, or we can point fingers at who is to "blame" - I'd rather just acknowledge the WHOLE scheme for what it is, cultures imposed on human realities, for obvious profit-skimming, and opt out to the maximum extent possible.
Thas rayciss!
Few Americans ever really work through the numbers but fact is if you can get enough from the Government in disability, unemployment, or some other kind of welfare why even jeopardize that income by thinking about taking a job. For all the moaning about how it is not enough and those living on the dole are forced into a life of poverty in fact those that suffer greatly often do so because of poor spending choices rather then the amount they receive. More on the subject of why so many Americans chose to live off the government in the artile below.
http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2013/06/living-on-dole.html
It works as designed. Keep people poor and Suckling on the entitlement teet in return for votes on the left. Vote liberal or the big rich White racist GOP candidate will cut your benefits and you will be on the street.
You are too funny. You still believe in 'liberals' and the 'left' vs 'right' and 'conservatives'
Oh how easy it is to fool the children.
You have to be crazy to work when you can live inside your brain for free.
It is not poorly designed, it is meant this way. Government needs dependent poor for voting them into more power. Just like they need terrorists to increase their powers. It's not stupid they are droning people into terrorists nor that they regulate people into welfare dependence. The goal is power and domination. They are not stupid, they are evil. The ultimate power domination is your death. Goverment killed 260 million people in the 20th century world wide. The first modern welfare state (if you omit the Romans Empire) was Germany under Bismarck around 1870. There is your future.
hahaha! 'american' voting, you make me laugh. DIEBOLD decides who 'voted'.
No actual people matter.
The purpose of the poor is as a slave force. Those who are just above welfare are corporate slaves, those ON it can be imprisoned any time with almost no one caring, and certainly no one of power.
Once in prison 100% of your work can be put to efficient slavery.
DNA scans to get a job or a meal: THAT is your future.
" ... Sound absurd ?
That's because it is."
The SOURCE of those problems
has always been the paradox of
successful warfare based on deceit.
There are chronic political problems inherent in the nature of life. Those problems have been resolved through conflicts, in which context the people who were the best at being dishonest and backing that up with violence prevailed. Those people became the War Kings that created the powers of sovereign states. The same processes, manifesting fractally at different levels, resulted in the Fraud Kings, the bankers, being able to take over control of the sovereign powers, through stealthy means which were originally more covert, but with time became more overt, and quite blatant during the last decade or so, since the basic processes have been on more or less exponential growth curves for quite a long time. Those started out relatively small and slow, but have become enormous, and are now galloping along ...
It was crazy corruption to allow private banks to make the public "money" supply out of nothing as debts, which sounds absurd because THAT CAN ONLY BE UNDERSTOOD AS DUE TO THE SUCCESSFUL APPLICATION OF THE METHODS OF ORGANIZED CRIME TO DOMINATE THE POLITICAL PROCESSES, IN ORDER TO MAKE AND MAINTAIN RUNAWAY SYSTEMS OF LEGALIZED LIES, BACKED BY LEGALIZED VIOLENCE.
As the comments of Prains above pointed out, the banksters' frauds are orders of magnitude bigger than all the other frauds of lower classes combined! The banksters' frauds were the foundation upon which all of the rest of the political economy was built, for more than a Century in the USA, so that generation after generation have been born, lived and died within the enforced frauds of debt slavery systems, which have generated mind-boggling numbers, which have become debt insanities: "Sound absurd? That's because it is."
In my opinion, most of the comments above to do not demonstrate sufficient penetration into the paradoxical problems that are due to human history selecting for us to resolve our chronic political problems in ways which ended up being done through the maximum possible deceits and frauds, because those were the most successful strategies during each short-term increment, no matter that, in the longer term, those sets of expedient solutions to those problems would create a society almost totally dominated by professional liars and immaculate hypocrites, on every level: "Sound absurd? That's because it is."
That is even MORE ABSURD because it is even MORE SO the higher the level in the social pyramid system one looks at. The social pyramid systems of Neolithic Civilizations were expedient sets of solutions to the chronic political problems inherent in the nature of life, which were based on the pyramidion people being the most successful at organized systems of lies, operating robberies, while the other levels of society were within that system, with the controlled opposition groups being co-opted within that system.
The current North American system was the most fantastic flourishing of that social pyramid system ever, due to transplanting the Neolithic style of civilization to a fresh continent, whose resources could be summarily strip-mined. However, beneath those processes were the same perpetual chronic political problems, which are always present due to the nature of life, and which are now reemerging with a vengeance, due to the ever more apparent diminishing returns from the strip-mining.
The USA exemplifies, more than anywhere else, the rise and fall of social systems based upon enforced frauds. All political economy issues are handled by people who are professional liars and immaculate hypocrites, which are enabled to deliberately ignore the enforced frauds which are the foundation of their whole system. Those lying hypocrites include most of the controlled opposition groups within those systems, just as much as they include the ruling classes, and theoretically even more so, because the controlled opposition groups are willing and able to even more indulge in promoting false fundamental dichotomies, and their related impossible ideals, which actually continue to cause the opposite to happen in the real world, because, after all, they are mostly opposition which is controlled by the ruling classes. "Sound absurd? That's because it is."
Theoretically, what would not be so absurd was IF people were to admit and address the chronic political problems, and respond to those more scientifically and systematically. However, that is practically impossible, because the entire established system is already based on enforced frauds, which have enabled almost everyone to become proportionately "successful" through attitudes of evil deliberate ignorance towards those enforced frauds!
From as much of a sublime point of view as one may be able to attempt, the absurdities are amusing, as well as understandable, since it makes sense that the combined money/murder systems evolved on the basis of their successes being built on the maximum possible frauds and deceits. When we look at the predicament of the lower classes, we are looking at the lower level fractal patterns of those ever more convoluted and entangled systems of deceptions, reflected and reverberating from self to others, back and forth.
Governments have attempted to monopolize the use of violence to back up robbery. However, the actual use of those powers has become directed in ways which became almost totally privatized, although those still loop around and around as an Ouroboros of Incorporated Robberies. The fundamental social facts are always necessarily systems of organized lies, operating robberies, but the language used to explain that was due to the long history of the biggest bullies' bullshit social stories becoming dominant, through the ruling classes, and their controlled opposition, and throughout all of the lower levels of society, within the social pyramid systems, which resolved the chronic political problems in the most expedient ways.
However, at the present time, going through enough of an intellectual scientific revolution to resolve those ABSURDITIES any better is extremely problematic, because that would require enough people facing enough of the social, biological, and technological facts, in ways which penetrated more deeply into accepting that there ARE chronic political problems, which MUST be resolved, while also appreciating the degree to which the actually established sets of solutions to those problems now depend upon society being controlled by enforced frauds, which developed through the long history of successful warfare based on deceit.
The ways that the political economy operates fractally, with level after level of frauds being its central characteristic controls, were built on the basis of human ecology similarly having developed through the history of its murder systems based on fractal levels of deceits. Both the ruling classes, and their controlled opposition groups, operate through those systems of maximized dishonesty about themselves, and the deeper real nature of their problems: "Sound absurd? That's because it is."
Since money is measurement backed by murder, because the debt controls depend upon the death controls, both have developed to be done through the maximum possible deceits and frauds, which, on the most profound levels, includes denial and evil deliberate ignorance towards the deeper nature of those problems, especially towards the chronic political problems which were innate. In that context, the social pyramid systems resist going through the processes of perceiving themselves more completely as nested systems of toroidal vortices. Social pyramid systems are examples of general energy systems, which can be intelligibly comprehended as having developed to be controlled by lies backed by violence, and therefore, necessarily manifestations of the least moralities. However, of course, those systems deliberately deny that, while the ruling classes work hard to make sure that those they rule over also deny that, while they therefore BOTH share in those same attitudes and behaviors.
Attempting an attitude of greater overall objectivity, human civilization is an astonishing example of general energy systems, because it operates itself through the mechanisms which were selected to become socially successful by being based on the maximum possible deceits and frauds. Looking at America is looking at still the world's leading example of the resonating Ouroboros of Incorporated Robberies, which are operated by thoroughly developed languages which facilitated professional liars and immaculate hypocrites to manage their systems, that everyone is being forced to live inside: "Sound absurd? That's because it is."
So therefor, if people were to stop participating in, stop submitting to the force applied unto, and engage in purely consensual interaction and commerce, to accept a system without enforced parameters of our corrupt overloads, mankind may finally realize the beneficial state of true freedom.
"true freedom" acknowledges the limitations inherent in "human form" - which inevitably comes with hierarchy & culture, as that's what humans "do". . .
but within that awareness, true freedom can arise, simply by creating your own net-worked reality of trusted similar individuals, and yes, knowing that the "corrupt overlords" may encroach via their uniformed gatekeepers, even to the local.
that's life, eh.
Lol I suppose it is a bit more complicated then just saying,"I'm free" and acting as such. But I do have a good deal of confidence that people can achieve great things with the right mind set, and when you get motivated, like-minded individuals working together.... Then look out!
Even the overlords and their gatekeepers will be inclined to give pause, as despite the destructive and illogical system they serve to maintain, I still consider them human and therefor humane, which allows for possibilities beyond what we have witnessed thus far.
Bah why not do some good old fashioned laboring that uncle sam doesnt take part in?
To me 0 income looks like a pretty sweet deal with 45k wellfare benefits.
"for increasingly more Americans it is now more lucrative - in the form of actual disposable income - to sit, do nothing, and collect various welfare entitlements, than to work"
Proof America is a backward country. You're only just getting around to this now. In Europe, we've had this feature for decades.
Yup, Paul Ryan, Newt Gingrich, Americans for Prosperity.....I could name a dozen without stopping to think.
We must motivate banksters to WORK! Stop giving them QE, ZIRP handouts! If we give welfare to banksters, we'll create another generation of useless, lazy, fat and piggish people.
What seems to be surprising to Americans is common knowledge for most Europeans. Benefits trap people in the system. In the UK this is debated all the time, but you can't change/cut benefits without someone, somewhere losing out. And in a democracy those stories are poison to reform, who wants to vote for the guys who put a poor single mother on the street? If you are sick, sometimes the cure makes you feel worse for a while. But democracies are not designed to live with short-term pain for long-term gain.
Yeah, we know that if you're unemployed then it helps to be single and female and with a few kids, but what about if, say:
You're single, white, able-bodied, male, have no debt except for your mortgage and you used to have a job but now you're unemployed. Do you get to keep your house?
y'know, the "example" favoured always includes single "mothers" - but single fathers are entitled to the same benefits, they're just rarely mentioned.
intentionally, of course.
it would be more honest, and less inflammatory, if these stories simply used "single parents" as the exhibit "A" - but that would hardly keep the anger simmering. . .
as to your question: rent out a couple bedrooms to make your mortgage, then perhaps you can "keep your house".
many do.
That requires you to have a couple of bedrooms but that's drifting away from the point I'm trying to make.
The dole burden on a single person with no dependents is almost nothing. In my country, the basic dole payment is about a quarter of average wages, so with even with 10% unemployment less than 3% of your wage pays the unemployment benefit. So why is the welfare burden so high when the basic payment is so low? What happens to the rest of the money?
"Programs designed to help the poor..." - that's where you're wrong - they're designed to enslave the poor and keep them in bondage. An independent person can make independent decisions - a DEPENDENT person is a CONTROLLED person. The PTB loooooooove dependent people - that's what "Socialism/Communism" is all about: Control. People who are self-supporting are a threat to the power structure - therefore their ability to support themselves must be destroyed through any means. Shipping jobs overseas, ridiculous taxation, ridiculous bureacratic red tape, and yes, stripping benefits when the "addicts" act as if they might be thinking about getting off the drug of "assistance."
It's not stupidity, it's planned, and it's EVIL.
Clearly the solution is to increase the minimum wage and make automatic additional money directly go into a MyRA filled with Treasuries & shares in BP.
Not to worry, hordes of money will be saved when California & Texas and half of Nevada are rejoined to Mexico.