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Forget ECB's Bazooka, Here Is China's Anti-Pollution Gun

Tyler Durden's picture




 

It was a month ago when we showed 13 "insane" proposals to fix China's unprecedented smog problem, which incidentally is now worse than any other place in the developed (or developing) world due to the country's ridiculous and unmatched pace of industrialization. As it turns out while those ideas may indeed have been insane, what we saw overnight reported by China's Xinhua is, while still completely bizarre, certainly fully operational, supposedly.

Presenting China's "anti-pollution" gun which puts even the ECB's (and certainly Hank Paulson's) "bazooka" to shame.

Google-translated:

Technicians adjust the parameters on the "multi-purpose" anti-smog car. In Zhangjiakou City, Hebei Province, the first station called the "fog gun" multi-purpose vehicle, is being used for fog suppression. The versatile vehicle can spray mist into the air, blasting water mist at a distance of 100 meters, 60 meters high, to achieve rapid fog suppression purposes. Xinhua News Agency

Some more pictures of what any other day could be confused with preparations for World War III.

Surely this alone will boost the next Chinese Markit manufacturing survey through the roof as suddenly every producer will feel so much better now that China's pollution has been fixed (that and the whole "hey Markit, nice IPO you got there, would be a shame if anything bad were to happen to your stock price...")

Source: news.cn

 

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Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:13 | 4933543 ultimate warrior
ultimate warrior's picture

I think I saw that thing in the new Transformers movie.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:29 | 4933591 max2205
max2205's picture

Good placebo

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:35 | 4933608 chumbawamba
chumbawamba's picture

Long anti-pollution cannon manufacturers.

-Chumblez.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:05 | 4933676 knukles
knukles's picture

Anthromorphic Global Wanking

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:22 | 4933735 jbvtme
jbvtme's picture

i keep looking for the industrial symbol that we've hit bottom. until now, it was the leaf blower.  might have a ways to go yet

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:47 | 4933837 pods
pods's picture

At least China has an over abundance of fresh water to waste?

pods

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:47 | 4933840 Manthong
Manthong's picture

Omigod..

They have stolen Nancy Pelosi’s oral cavity and respiratory system.

..or was that Biden’s?

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 23:21 | 4934295 BlackChicken
BlackChicken's picture

Sorry Manthong, that's her bidet.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 01:49 | 4934513 MeMadMax
MeMadMax's picture

Good idea in theory.

Too bad you need a few thousand of those to actually make a difference...

^.^

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 10:56 | 4935296 Manthong
Manthong's picture

If they really work, they will probably make more than a few thousand.. in just a couple of months.

But I wonder how much pollution the engines spew V the smog abated.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:56 | 4934066 Atomizer
Atomizer's picture

Chumblez..

 

What? No clown popped out of the cannon?

Butthole Surfers - Human Cannonball

/ heheheee

Edit: Fuck, found it after I posted. Here you go.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5j7paV0IwQ

 

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:44 | 4934055 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

Are.....you.....FREAKIN"......kidding me ??!!

I feel a Kinison coming on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Czmb6tEwFE8

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:15 | 4933548 wakablahh
wakablahh's picture

I still don't get what it does. It shoots water to thicken the smog so it doesn't fall into the city? huh?

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:22 | 4933573 Big Corked Boots
Big Corked Boots's picture

Basically, yes. A fine water mist theoretically will adhere to particulates in the air and wash them down the storm drain. The technology has been used in demolition projects for years... and it is only a little bit effective. Of course, the contaminants end up downstream. Sucks to be there, but the dead pigs in the river probably won't complain.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 22:08 | 4934112 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

Looking at those pictures......there's justice coming.  Gotta be for that kind of shit.  But nobody's gonna like it.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:18 | 4933720 Matt
Matt's picture

Better to have coal dust in the water than in your lungs, I think. As long as nothing needs to consume that water ...

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:19 | 4933725 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

I have to comment on the line that the pollution is due to the insane pace of industrialization. this simply isn't true. China, nationally, is a wealthy county, they can afford to put scrubbers and electrostatic precipatators on the smoke stacks of their coal fired power plants. But they don't give a shit. you can't sue their government, and they won't make anything off of it, so why bother? They could easily afford newer and much, much, cleaner burning coal fired powered plants, but they don't give a shit. once again, it's a centrally dictated economy; the people's opinion means nothing; so why bother? They have two shit-loads, ( which is a large number ), of crummy semi-effecient coal fired power plants, and they're still building them ! You can't un-elect a communist party boss; and they have other things to do with the money, so there you go.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:57 | 4933893 ziggy59
ziggy59's picture

Its not solar..so its using petroleum to help rid air of pollutants.?

On Bizarro World " they am" very proud...

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 01:16 | 4934482 Antifaschistische
Antifaschistische's picture

water mist, or rain, or Niagra will adhere to atmospheric particulates.  But I still don't get it.   If they're going to use this much energy to blow mist down the drain, why didn't they just put a giant HEPA filter on the back of that truck and filter the air.

But that's not efficient either compared to just putting a catalytic converter on the cars and dealing with it at the source.   The problem with China is that they've grown so rapidly they have no means of enforcing stricter auto polution standards.   I think they'll figure it out eventually, but we'll see a lot of abstractions along the way.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:15 | 4933549 Frank N. Beans
Frank N. Beans's picture

giant fart machine

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:07 | 4933930 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

Ah, ah, your comment having closeness of accuracy possessing.

Machine condensates and precipites harmful matter judiciously. Air pollutements concentrated into brown paste given then to roadside depositions cleverness of manner. Air breathings now the cleanly.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:15 | 4933550 i_call_you_my_base
i_call_you_my_base's picture

So in other words, an acid rain generator?

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:06 | 4933678 knukles
knukles's picture

Bingo!  And we have a winner!

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:25 | 4933756 Amish Hacker
Amish Hacker's picture

Yes. State-of-the-art electronics cleverly turn a small amount of the air pollution into water pollution.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:20 | 4933988 old naughty
old naughty's picture

My 100 meter is clean(-er), who gives a shit 100 km downstream.

Not industrialization.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:14 | 4933961 pods
pods's picture

That Chinese lettering on the side of it roughly translated:

"Makin it rain, Bitchez!"

pods

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:19 | 4933560 screw face
screw face's picture

impressive............. MOAR thrust

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:28 | 4933585 ImnotPOTUS
ImnotPOTUS's picture

A re-purposed snow making blower.

I wonder if the instructions on the side mention DO NOT USES BELOW 10C.

USE ONLY POTABLE WATER, FIT FOR HUMAN CONSUMPTION.

Never-mind that one, I see it is pumping some sort of liquid.

It reminds me of the Steven Wright joke. I put a humidifier and a de-humidifier in a closed room and let them fight it out.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:30 | 4934017 mjcOH1
mjcOH1's picture

"Never-mind that one, I see it is pumping some sort of liquid."

 

They'll soon enough realize they can spray untreated sewage from it, and still call it an anti-smog machine.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:28 | 4933587 NOTaREALmerican
NOTaREALmerican's picture

Hmmm.   I liked the mayor of Mexico City's smog idea much better:  Build a ring of fans around the basin that Mexico City is in, and blow the smog away.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:29 | 4933592 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Maybe I'm just tired, but I see that as test runs for a new kind of anti-crowd weapon.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:35 | 4933611 robertocarlos
robertocarlos's picture

Replace the water with gas and light the fuse.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:16 | 4933715 knukles
knukles's picture

Betcha ICE and Border Patrol order up a whole buncha these things to wash the newly arrived masses.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:25 | 4933754 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

That's not nice, knucks.

Hilarious, but not nice;)

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:31 | 4933598 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

Mobile snow maker on cold days; it could be followed around by a sand truck -- a Krugmanian wet dream.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:33 | 4933602 Dublinmick
Dublinmick's picture

They are probably directing the smog Japan's way as retribution for bowing to the war criminal shrine.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:34 | 4933604 Lin S
Lin S's picture

I like it.  Can I buy one at Wal-Mart?

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:27 | 4933763 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

Attach that some bitch to  a smart car (aka stoopid car) and I think you got sumpin'..,

  but WTF?

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:42 | 4933622 One And Only
One And Only's picture

Water is a greenhouse gas. In fact water (aka water mist, aka H2O) retains far more heat than carbon dioxide. So clearly this device is a provocation of war aimed at every liberal in the US with an iphone made in China.

If the liberal global warming fanatics are correct in their "science" this weapon was created to destroy coastal cities all over the world.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:45 | 4933631 Big Corked Boots
Big Corked Boots's picture

Release the Gore.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:04 | 4933672 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Water has a residency time in atmosphere of about 9 days. For CO2, when turn-over is considered it's about 2,000 years.

You can play around with water all you want to, in 9 days it doesn't matter what you did.

With CO2, you get to live with what you did for 2,000 years.

If you don't get any of that, fine. Nobody else gets it either.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:07 | 4933686 knukles
knukles's picture

So the more I breathe, the more immortal I become.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:10 | 4933694 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Dude. You were already a ZH immortal about 3 years ago. Any other kind of immortality pales in comparison.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:15 | 4933712 knukles
knukles's picture

LOL
Gasping for breath!

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:33 | 4933785 One And Only
One And Only's picture

Source.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:34 | 4933792 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Science.

We gave up guessing about shit like that 300 years ago.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:51 | 4933830 One And Only
One And Only's picture

So if Antarctica measured in ice is growing (most recorded in modern history) and so are the northern polar ice caps...and the temperature of the Earth has been cooling. How does the residence time of water not matter?

It seems to me as Antarctica grows (less water in the atmosphere) and the temperature of the planet has been cooling it very much matters.

By the way the residence time of water in Antarctica is 20,000 years. So the fact that Antarctica is growing at such a rapid clip should be disconcerting.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:53 | 4933879 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Making no sense at all.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:00 | 4933898 One And Only
One And Only's picture

Water is the largest contributor to the greenhouse gas theory. So more ice in antarctica (and north pole) = less water evaporating from oceans (as more water is concentrated and "frozen" in ice). The Earth has actually been cooling over the last couple of decades when one removes the manipulated data from NOAA (NOAA admitted).

With a longer residency time in ice and less water in the atmosphere and the climate has been cooling how does this not make sense?

Less water in atmoshere = cooler climate.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:03 | 4933913 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

The residency time of water in the atmosphere is 9 days.

For CO2 it's 2,000 years.

Deal with it or don't -- I certainly don't care either way.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:06 | 4933924 One And Only
One And Only's picture

With more water frozen in Antarctica and less water in the atmosphere the globe is cooling. 

Deal with it or don't. I certainly don't care either.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:16 | 4933963 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

o i c where you went wrong:

water in the atmosphere is a constant relative to temperature.

c you got it backwards.

that's kinda funny.

it would be nice if we were cooling, but we're not, because we can't, and we won't for about 2,000 years.

make up any other nonsense you want to, it's funny I find it amusing. but you better know that making up random rules concerning the universe doesn't work.

you're still gonna suffer, sing any song you want to in the mean time.

 

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:30 | 4934019 One And Only
One And Only's picture

Ok. Globe is warming. Polar ice caps are metling. Polar bears are dying and cities are being swallowed by oceans never to be seen again. Whatever lies help you sleep at night.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:46 | 4934046 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Yeah that's pretty much the shape of it.

I sleep fine. Know why? Because there is nothing much more I can do about it than I already do. What's coming, is coming, and so be it. We'll deal with it or perish, just like everything else we had to face over the unblinking eons. It bothers me that we did this one to ourselves, but maybe that too is just how the universe works. That smart monkeys end up out-smarting themselves, and doing so instantly once they become smart enough to manage it.

There is a theory floating around that the reason we haven't found any signs of intelligent life out among the stars is because -- there isn't anyone that made it.

Well la-dee-da and there we are; a few decades of looking like smarties and then -- pow -- we're no longer an intelligence among the stars, either.

It has a nice symmetry about it, you have to admit, if that's how it turns out.

Everyone gets a shot.

But just one.

We had ours.

We're done.

Now back to real life as this planet allows for it, and anyone wants to be a smartie can start with finding clever uses for scrap plastics...

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:55 | 4934079 falconflight
falconflight's picture

Who prognosticated 2,000 years?

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 22:16 | 4934123 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

It's basic organic and inorganic chemistry. Everybody with a Ph.D knows how this goes down now. Someone can pretend they don't get it, but we all get it.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 23:44 | 4934330 Wild Theories
Wild Theories's picture

@One and only

So if Antarctica measured in ice is growing (most recorded in modern history) and so are the northern polar ice caps...

 

BS, Arctic sea ice is shrinking and opening up all the way, how the fuck do you think growing arctic drilling and cutting transportation time through arctic shipping is becoming possible?

Don't read or trust science sites? refuse to even look at historic satellite image comparisons? or too obscure to check out what the govts and people in Greenland, Iceland and places close to the arctic are saying?

Then read any of the articles relating to Russian arctic developments right here on ZH and ask yourself how the fuck can the Russians suddenly do all that in the Arctic if the ice is growing?

The northern ice in the Arctic is in fucking retreat, deal with it or GTFO.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 00:36 | 4934408 One And Only
One And Only's picture

Credible Sources other than the fact that Russians are developing things in cold areas.

There is also a ZH article about how global warming fanatics got stuck in an iceberg and had to be rescued....and the rescuers had to be rescued because they got stuck in ice.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-01-03/ship-sent-rescue-global-warming...

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 01:51 | 4934517 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

So I guess it's Random Day now.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 02:22 | 4934533 One And Only
One And Only's picture

You make up facts, I present them.

You can call it whatever you want.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 04:52 | 4934619 Wild Theories
Wild Theories's picture

I just mentioned everything you could look up about the arctic, and you quote a bunch of morons who got stuck in the Antarctic.

Are you even pretending to be arguing about facts or did you just get too carried away jerking off to your 'believes'?

 

And no, I'm not your kindergarden teacher here to hold your hand and spoonfeed you 'sources', do your own research, go ring up someone who lives in Iceland or Greenland.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 22:07 | 4934108 falconflight
falconflight's picture

No I think "science" is still guessing its collective ases off.  Just think, for 40 years the scientists and their "settled" science proferred that obesity and heart disease was directly linked to consuming meat, especially read meat.  And now, although very quietly, the science is settled again that transfats ect., has nothing to do with cholesterol, heart disease, or obesity.  Funny how our decadent society has barely taken note of this revolutionary walk back by the so-called scientific rationalism so pervasive in the fascist and communist nations of lore.  

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 22:24 | 4934150 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

I have no clear idea what you are talking about.

There isn't much actual "science" in medicine. Big Pharma would like you to think otherwise, but they just want to make easy money claiming to have a cure for what is killing you. Which they don't.

If you mean to say people should just live their lives free of worry, then yeah that sounds fine.

But the understanding we have of the world based on science (as I mean it) goes back about 600 years and that body of work isn't going anywhere so you better wrap your head around that one so you can move on.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 05:24 | 4934646 css1971
css1971's picture

You're basically correct. Science is as error prone, biased and as full of corruption as anything else. However, it has one redeeming feature, a built in mechanism for correcting errors...The Scientific Method. Testability and repeatability. Yes it can be slow, take years to decades as the vested interests die off but it's better than the alternatives.

This BTW is why anthropogenic global warming is not science. Sure there are plenty of pretty models and lots of big computers with lots of weather forecasters involved, but no testability, no repeatability. It cannot be shown to be wrong, or correct and therefore until it becomes testable is nothing more than a religion (or philosophy) but is not science.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:38 | 4933804 Steroid
Steroid's picture

@Cougar,

Where does water go after residing in the atmospher? Isn't it the concentration what counts?

It is true though that every glass of water you drink contains what Hitler (Stalin or Obama, depending on your affiliation) has pissed!

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:01 | 4933903 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Water vapor falls out of the sky back to liquid form, releasing heat, when it rains. It's really easy and for the water molecule is net energy negative (a lower entropic state) so it's like a ball rolling down a hill. Just happens.

There is no easy net-of-net route for CO2 to do the same thing. Takes a lot of energy input to bind carbons, only plants can do it. Seriously, where do you think the energy in oil and coal came from in the first place? Took millions of slow years to deal that hand. That's pushing a ball up a hill slowly, one carbon atom at a time.

If you get the energy pathways, you instantly get the whole picture. It's beautiful. If you don't get that part you simply never will.

It's okay if you never do. Hell this shit is hard. I've been doing science for 30 years and every day I learn something new, sometimes something new opens up all kinds of doors. But when you get it and all the pieces fall into place you have to laugh.

Nature just likes to yank our chain, making it seem hard. Heck even bacteria play this game.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:44 | 4934056 shovelhead
shovelhead's picture

Plant Hemp.

It loves CO2. It will give you foodstock, paper, cloth, building materials, oil, chemicals for paints and plastics and is a renewable source of ethanols superior to using corn needing no chemical salts fertilizers and with very little water and will grow where most other crops wont grow.

Hemp is thought to be one of the first domesticated plants of mankind.

 

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 22:13 | 4934117 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Any plant can perform the service I mention. Hemp is fine, go nutz with hemp. The problem is not the carbon chaining itself. The problem is chaining the carbons and then burying all that in the ground so it doesn't reenter the atmosphere as methane or CO2 in a few years.

The planet underwent huge changes during the plant-mediated carbon sequestration phase that took place about 300 million years ago. It was that phase that made the planet what it is today, and the world in which our form of life could evolve. The planet is undergoing a similar (though opposite) change now that the carbon that was buried is being released via burning of fossil fuels like coal and oil. There is simply no way we can deal with that now. Nothing on the horizon is going to reverse that, there is just no mechanism at hand to deal with the magnitude of the challenge.

Nature will have to figure it out, again.

It's going to be slow because that is how nature does things. It's going to take nature 2,000 years to do that for us.

That's just where we're at, and there's nothing we can do about it. It's just going to take ages and in the mean time the entire world is changing right out from under us.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 22:29 | 4934156 One And Only
One And Only's picture

Name a period (100 years) where the climate remained constant and did not change at all.

The climate will change with or without humans on it.

As proof -

The ice age ended before the industrial revolution. What caused the earth to warm (and melt all that ice) before we started using carbon based energy? Lemme guess...we were eating more red meat and farting too much.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 01:36 | 4934503 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Climate is really constant over "100's of years". No really, it's like clockwork. You get a cold winter or you get a few years of drought, but it's really solid.

You want to talk variability, you need to open the book to a few more pages.

Shit gets crazy out to 10,000 years at a leap. And for lots of reasons, some of it being solar output, some of it being Milankovitch cycles, and some of it being (often mysterious) carbon releases and sequestration events.

It's all there in the geological record. Basic science. Really boring actually.

The story is if things get messed up, it's bad news. All sorts of crap comes unwired.

So what do we do, we mess it up. Didn't wait for the sun to do it. Didn't wait for the planets to align just right. No we set out deliberately to dig up and burn every drop of buried oil and every lump of coal. Brilliant. Just brilliant. The one thing of a very few that was something we could fuck up -- and we fucked it up.

Do I sound bitter? Well I did live a good life from all that. I'm happy enough. My kids, they'll be fine. But it still feels like I shit all over everything I value in the world.

Maybe I'll burn some carbon credits and fly to Italy to see Venice before it vanishes beneath the Adriatic. Someone needs to be witnesses to that kind of bullshit.

 

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 02:35 | 4934542 One And Only
One And Only's picture

If you believe the way you declare you do. Stop using the internet and stop driving a car. Never fly on an airplane. I never want you to come in contact with petrol based devices.

It won't happen because you're just full of shit and pushing an agenda.

You're a cheap Al Gore spin off.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 03:00 | 4934562 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

I've already said it doesn't matter what I do. Doesn't matter what you do either. Have fun.

It's a done deal now. Sit back and watch it roll over you.

For the record I don't drive a car and I don't fly or travel at all ever.

As for the internet, I'm a network engineer so being on the internet is my job.

Seriously. Did you think I would be out here laying down heavy fire if things in my personal life were otherwise?

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 03:06 | 4934568 One And Only
One And Only's picture

If you think humans control the climate than you are ignorant and arrogant.

You're waisting my time.

Goodnight.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 03:28 | 4934581 MEAN BUSINESS
MEAN BUSINESS's picture

If you think humans releasing (soon to be) 1000 gigatons of CO2Equivalent in the blink of a geological eye is consequence free in a closed loop system you are in denial. The risks are REAL the question is how much are we willing to pay for insurance?

Here, "waist" your time with this: 'Canfield Oceans', it might just keep you up at night.

 

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 22:35 | 4934168 konputa
konputa's picture

 

This gentleman is looking for someone to debate with. Any takers?

 

Http://stevengoddard.wordpress.com

 

 

 

 

 

Thu, 07/10/2014 - 23:51 | 4946227 Ionic Equilibria
Ionic Equilibria's picture

You're right, but I wonder if Terra Preta which is carbon negative might be capable of saving our sorry asses.  We'll never know since it's obvious we're too stupid to even look into it properly, though a few lonely agricultural scientists are trying.  I wish someone would do an Emergy analysis of TP.  Oh, well.  Even if AGW wasn't going to provide the final knock-out punch for the 6th great extinction we'd still do oursellves in through overpopulation.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 23:01 | 4934241 Steroid
Steroid's picture

@Cougar,

-"Water vapor falls out of the sky back to liquid form, releasing heat, when it rains."

-And when it evaporates takes the same amount of heat. It is an equilibrium, for god's sake. Only partial tensions (i.e., concentrations) count which is dependent only on temp and pressure. So the vapor concentration is always the same. 

-"Seriously, where do you think the energy in oil and coal came from in the first place?"

-The energy ultimatly comes from the fusion energy of the sun for the biotic and from radioactve decay of earth for the abiotic hydrocarbons. Biology just lowers the energy barriers.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 01:47 | 4934509 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Jee-zuz.

I was talking about relative energy of phase change compared to chemical reaction, not net-net energy balance.

What -- you thought it was the heat of combustion that is warming the earth? Is that where you were headed?

Time for some schooling; all the heat your Ford puts out idling down at the Micky D in line for a obesity burger radiates into space that very night. It's just gone, see? The "carbon is the problem" meme has nothing to do with extraction heat. It has to do with a "greenhouse effect" created by the resulting carbon remaining behind in the atmosphere holding back ground radiation from finding the upper atmosphere and getting out. The heat of rxn from your Ford is nothing. Absolutely ziltch. The radiant energy from the Sun turning into radiant heat and ending up trapped is absolutely 1000% the problem.

See that's the problem around here. Nobody pays attention to details in a discussion where attention to detail is Job One.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 05:10 | 4934627 css1971
css1971's picture

ok, well google "pyrolysis". You don't have to oxidize everything.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 23:24 | 4934298 kchrisc
kchrisc's picture

I have to send Gore money for 2,000 years?!

Does Mt. St. Helens have to pay?!

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 23:29 | 4934314 Leraconteur
Leraconteur's picture

Your education forgot to mention plants.

Google it. 

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 04:15 | 4934560 Urban Redneck
Urban Redneck's picture

That water cycle is certainly NOT 100.00% efficient Moreover, in the past century about 2% of the earth's land area are has been converted to dam reservoirs which are then used to irrigate 10% of the earths land area continuously (round #s).

So it's not like the 80 year old Hoover Dam hasn't actually been irrigating the desert and atmosphere EVERY FUCKING DAY for 80 years with less than 100% efficiency....

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 05:04 | 4934624 css1971
css1971's picture

Not necessarily.

A practice of coppicing -> pyrolysis -> biochar -> soil ammendment could take vast quantities of carbon out of the air very quickly for hundreds to thousands of years. With the side effects of improving soil and producing biomass based energy from the gaseous pyrolysis products.

CO2 is "not a problem", Never has been. I'm fairly sure that the hoohaa is really about getting people off oil before the production decline rates get really bad.

Fri, 07/11/2014 - 00:04 | 4946249 Ionic Equilibria
Ionic Equilibria's picture

You almost get it, but let's have some data on how effective the Terra Preta/Biochar idea could be in remoning CO2 from the atmosphere.  Then you turn around and totally screw up by claiming CO2 isn't a problem.   If wishes were fishes..  If only bullishly claiming this could make it true.  It can't and that'a that.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:58 | 4934088 falconflight
falconflight's picture

Jesus, I hope they're right.  I've been running all of my internal combustion engines for hours on end on Earth Day.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 01:26 | 4934495 Zeta Reticuli
Zeta Reticuli's picture

I think we should run the A/C with the windows open and the heat on for Earth Day. And burn mountains of tires. I'm old enough to remember the first Earth Day. I was a student in college. I distinctly remember the banners on the podium/stage about the Coming Ice Age caused by Global Cooling.

I don't listen to any of these hysterical politician/trendoids any more.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 04:02 | 4934599 MEAN BUSINESS
MEAN BUSINESS's picture

Are those hedgetard voices I see in your head? Pray silence! Let's listen too...

Darn, all I heard was the sound of your voice ZR

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:45 | 4933627 BovespaBroker
BovespaBroker's picture

Hecho in united states de america.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 23:28 | 4934313 Leraconteur
Leraconteur's picture

Hecho en Los Estados Unidos.

Get it right - it's not Chinese.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:44 | 4933629 socalbeach
socalbeach's picture

Just don't send it to Kiev for maintenance.

(08.07.2014)

Six tanks junta exploded after overhaul

"According to sources in the new Russia, punitive Kiev junta suffered new losses in manpower and equipment. According to sources, six T-72 tanks after the repair works at the Kharkiv tank plant was destroyed. According to some information, combat vehicles detonated ammunition when you try to shoot..."

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:18 | 4933719 Dublinmick
Dublinmick's picture

Silly boys hiring separatists as mechanics.

Reports floating around the Ukraine army will get free land when the ethnic cleanse the Russian separatists. The contract states that Royal Dutch Shell has in the contract that many people would have to be "relocated" before drilling starts.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:50 | 4933639 kurt
kurt's picture

We're Doomed!

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:52 | 4933640 MassDecep
MassDecep's picture

Great for aluminum nano particles and Barium and strontium also. Wonder what other abomination they will spray. Maybe the same as our jets that fly the friendly skies of amerika.

 

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:55 | 4933649 john39
john39's picture

They chem trail radiation world wide.  Interesting question is... why.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:08 | 4933687 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

No the interesting question is why you think that.

There are at least 5,000 actual things you could worry about on a daily basis -- and that there isn't even on the list.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:13 | 4933702 knukles
knukles's picture

Indeed... Not the if, the why...
oldie but goodie

http://www.viewzone.com/chemtrails44.html

 

Some time ago, Mrs K and I saw large curving chems, or so we thought and I ran immediately to Flihghtaware and loh and behold...
It was a NASA flight that originated in Palmdale with a stop at Edwards AFB and curved back and forth all the way up 1/2 the CA coast leaving this off white spreading "chemtrail"
Which hung all day and into the night spreading...
Now if that ain't catching it ed handed, I don't know whathefuck is. 

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:21 | 4933731 Dublinmick
Dublinmick's picture

Check on the viewzone, I read it also. Nothing like a day with doomsday Dan Eden :)

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:27 | 4933760 Dublinmick
Dublinmick's picture

Lots of theories on it. Some say it barium helps satelite monitoring, some say it blocks the sun to slow up ice cap melting, barium in turn penetrates the blood brain barrier and is bad for health thereby killing the useless eaters. (they use it in MRI) . It also harms farm crops knocking off more useless eaters. Aluminum dumbs them down.

And then some relate it to the Georgia Guidestones ............... save room for nature ..... save room for nature.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 00:53 | 4934450 BringOnTheAsteroid
BringOnTheAsteroid's picture

Is it just me who thinks chem trails are nothing more than the condensed exhaust from jet aeroplanes and if you were to analyse them they'd contain a list of pollutants so long just reading it would make you sick.

Has the world gone so completely nutty that everything bad that occurs is because a Lex Luther or Dr Evil type persona is planning all this from their evil lair. Just wait for the claims that the typhoon slated to hit Japan has been caused by some device like HAARP. 

 

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 04:13 | 4934604 MEAN BUSINESS
MEAN BUSINESS's picture

Terrence Moonseed where r u? +1 BringOnTheAsteroid

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:53 | 4933646 NoWayJose
NoWayJose's picture

I get the concept of getting the water vapor to adhere to the pollution in order to drop the pollutants out of the air. Of course, some will wash into storm drains. But what if you own a car or anything where this pollution lands? You will need to run your car through the car wash more often, or use power washers to clean buildings and sidewalks -- requiring more electricity which will be generated by coal fired power plants!

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:19 | 4933728 Matt
Matt's picture

Old sawmill towns along the west coast in the 60s and 70s, the mill companies ran the car washes and gave people free car washes to clean off all the particulates.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 19:57 | 4933653 The_Prisoner
The_Prisoner's picture

Imagine the noise that thing makes.

Long earmuffs.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:05 | 4933673 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

I'll bet they use only the cleanest most pure distilled water in that thing. [/SARCASM]

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:36 | 4934036 mjcOH1
mjcOH1's picture

The lettering on the side is Chinese for 'Port-a-John'.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:07 | 4933684 VWAndy
VWAndy's picture

zyklon B ?

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:28 | 4933764 1stepcloser
1stepcloser's picture

Why don't they just release more bags of mountin air until the world runs out of bags

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 00:26 | 4934412 Bohm Squad
Bohm Squad's picture

Don't be silly.  The world ain't gonna run out of bags.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:28 | 4933768 Dublinmick
Dublinmick's picture

No zyklon B is only used to kill lice, pretty harmless stuff.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:28 | 4933769 Joebloinvestor
Joebloinvestor's picture

If they really want to make a dent, show the internals of the truck, where a pollution offender is tried then sentenced to the highly modified chipper that he is thrown into resulting in the vapor mist ejection.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:28 | 4933770 Joebloinvestor
Joebloinvestor's picture

If they really want to make a dent, show the internals of the truck, where a pollution offender is tried then sentenced to the highly modified chipper that he is thrown into resulting in the vapor mist ejection.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:33 | 4933788 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

A diesel truck cleaning the air of particulates, much of which comes from diesel trucks.

They gotta be desperate to go down that road.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:17 | 4933973 Big Corked Boots
Big Corked Boots's picture

I'm sure it's a Tier IV compliant diesel running Ad Blue or some sort of urea-based crap thru a catalyst. Not.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:23 | 4933996 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Well well -- looks like someone besides myself gets it.

I'll be keeping an eye on you.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 23:30 | 4934319 boattrash
boattrash's picture

Cougar,

Could you please tell us what % of this terrible Carbon is man-made Vs. % that is naturally occuring? My numbers may not jive. Also, does Mother Earth currently have enough unused land, that if planted, would equal a "net-zero" on the carbon pollution.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 01:16 | 4934483 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

1) The percentage or relative make-up do not matter as much as the absolute. The absolutes are all that matter, and the absolute is going up, and there is no demonstrable reason for this other than human activity. Think what you want but that is how it is playing out.

2) Harder to say. As a practical matter we already use about all the arable land there is to grow food. It would take a lot of technology (irrigation, special varieties, fertilizers, mechanical tilling, etc) to bring a significant quantity of marginal land into production, and technology is what got us into this mess in the first place so I can't see how that helps. Besides which, there is no money for projects like that at scale. You can do a demonstration project, but we need projects on the scale of the Amazon rainforest to make a dent. And notice, we are quickly destroying the Amazon even as I suggest we need another one just to balance the books as they stand.

In all events the challenge is not limited to carbon uptake, as important as that is. The problem extends to sequestration. You have to bury the carbon, otherwise the normal carbon cycle (which culminates in decay) has that carbon right back in the atmosphere within a few seasons. Notice that "solving" your problem for a few years matters little for a cycle with a half life measured in centuries. Digging up and burning the carbon deposits sequestered 200 million years ago is what is causing trouble, we have to reverse that. And just as with bringing more land into production, there is no money or political will to bury other shit to make up for consuming fossil fuels. There was money (you cannot even imagination how much money) to be made in digging up stored sunlight and releasing the energy slave genie so contained, but there is no money to be made and only unimaginable expense in putting back the resultant carbon genie that was his cousin, who is now going to hang around for a while fucking with us.

Sorry, those are all painful things to read. I wish there was some other news, but there isn't any. And from where I'm sitting running the numbers it just looks really bad. At just the time when we could use with some rational decision making, our government has been bought up by the energy companies (among others) and the door to a reasoned (instead of, reactionary) solution has been shut forever. Or at least for a hundred years. And if we don't solve this issue in much much less than 100 years, it may as well be forever, because everything we might want to save is just going to turn to rat shit.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 02:08 | 4934526 boattrash
boattrash's picture

Cougar, I've gotta crash, I'll try to find/post you a link tomorrow. My #s are Aprox 2.5-3.5% man made, and yes, while totals DO matter, the fact that mankind can not change what man-kind did not cause, are very stubborn facts. It sure as hell won't be changed by the Taxation being proposed by TPTB(think alcohol and tobacco). That is the root cause of all of this "science" that they keep teaching/shoving down our throats with the help of the MSM.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 03:10 | 4934572 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

"Science" in air-quotes just makes you look silly.

Either you accept the science and go from there -- or my advice is you get another hobby.

Or go ahead and talk about "science" if that makes you look good with your buddies down at the bar knocking back Coors Lights. Whatever floats your boat, pal. But that's not going to come up to my level, and I bring my game all the time. Fast, up the middle, and right over the plate. You want to run with the big animals then get an education on the topic and you'll find me interested. Otherwise this is hard ball and I don't pitch anything suitable for a weakling.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 09:50 | 4935076 radiobomb
radiobomb's picture

hi Cougar, just a few Q's;

i] why have global temps & peak CO2 not always correlated ( pre-humans and also during the dark ages ) ?

ii] why do other planets in the solar system and beyond show temp fluctuation ?

   if your answer is solar activity, why does this not apply to our planet ?

iii] do you agree that big business would rather consumers shouldered the responsability for environmental impact rather than they [multinationals] were fined for pollution, or ecological destruction ? 

iv] Do you agree that the enviromental agenda enforced by TPTB is not actually altering this eco-destruction ?

    Please be aware that grants for research can influence research results. [think tobacco in the 50's etc]

    most people have a consience and want to do the right thing. Mis-direction and propaganda has hijacked the  collective response, see iii] . 

v] thanks.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 10:35 | 4935229 boattrash
boattrash's picture

Oh my, it seems I really struck a nerve to garner such a belittling response. I believe one should question science rather than blindly accept it, especially if you trail out the $ providers that buy it. These days, for enough grant money, you can get "scientists" to say anything and back any agenda you want.

   Maybe you should get a hobby also, like trying to source some of this science that's tattooed into you. I'll skip the piss beer and bars, thank you, but I will continue operating a deepwater OSV to do my little bitty part in providing the oil you so despise. And please, hard ball? All I see from here is a pitcher's mound, covered with the vomit that you have regurgitated from the Govt paid studies, as reported by Govt media mouthpieces.

  PS It's really sad to see people in this pit-fall trap of buying into this illness. There is an antidote, though it's quite extreme, it involves CO2, the head, a plastic bag, and 3-6 minutus of your time. Thanks, and have a nice day Cougar

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 07:52 | 4934620 css1971
css1971's picture

Go ogle "Terra Preta", and "biochar". Carbon sequestration is a solved problem.

Youtube video for the uninitiated:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfVQ-QpVyzw

 

And if you want to have a go at "Saving the planet" yourself:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXMUmby8PpU

 

Fri, 07/11/2014 - 00:33 | 4946309 Ionic Equilibria
Ionic Equilibria's picture

Nowhere near good enough.  I want some real analysis, some hard data on wheter the TP concept might be able to remove enough CO2 from the atmosphere to head off the climate disaster already obvious to anybody paying attention.  

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:42 | 4933818 yellowsub
yellowsub's picture

No need to open up fire hydrants?

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:48 | 4933847 IronShield
IronShield's picture

Hmmm...  Doesn't China have a water scarcity problem?  Great thinking fellas, keep up the good work.  ;-)

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 20:59 | 4933896 nathan1234
nathan1234's picture

The Gunooka is actually for crowd control disguised as for pollution control.

When cold, wet and been blasted by a jet stream one's resistance is down and out

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:17 | 4933962 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

The conspiracy minded amongst Us might not believe that this military hardware was dispensing something as benign as unadulterated water mist.

 

Even if this kind of Rube Goldberg contraption worked really well: wouldn't it make sense to employ something of the kind right at the factory smokestacks and vents rather than to drive it around in traffic downtown miles from the sources of the contamination?

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:25 | 4934002 VWAndy
VWAndy's picture

yeppers its a city killer

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 23:48 | 4934353 Wild Theories
Wild Theories's picture

No, they are made to placate the complainers, who are the city-folk. The polluting factory workers aren't the ones complaining, even though their health may be far worse off.

They are parked right in front of who they are trying to please, no mistakes there.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 04:47 | 4934617 css1971
css1971's picture

Yup. Fill it up with pepper spray, mace or other stronger anti-personnel chemical of your choice. You could just drive a bunch of them through a neighborhood and send teams to clear out the bodies after the chemicals disperse.

There's no way this was developed as an anti-smog device.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 11:50 | 4935534 VWAndy
VWAndy's picture

How much ya want to bet that thing has a ratio gauge on it?

 Does that look like a fuel manfold from a jet engine? Not that that proves anything. But still. Oh he is operating it with a remote control. I dont see a need for that if its just to spray water.

 One thing is for sure it will not be effective as a pollution control.

 

 

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:20 | 4933989 are we there yet
are we there yet's picture

This is a military grade gozilla hairdryer. Only less useful.

However Mylie Cyrus may have a use for it.

                

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:51 | 4934070 knukles
knukles's picture

I'm standing in line at the grocery store replenishing the basic ingredients of my Hagen-Daz and potato chip diet while up front, some lady is arguing about coupons that don't yet become good until Friday.  So, sorely lacking intellectual stimulation I'm looking through the Enquirer, News of the World, whatever.  And there's some stuff about little Miley.  Holy Smokes, that's one Fucked up kid.  My only thought for her redemption was an arranged marriage to Justin Bieber

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:29 | 4934018 VWAndy
VWAndy's picture

Air/fuel bomb truck.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 21:50 | 4934069 falconflight
falconflight's picture

Chemtrails actually creates some jobs there.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 22:00 | 4934090 grunk
grunk's picture

In the winter they haul that mama over to the Vermont ski slopes.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 22:01 | 4934093 Haager
Haager's picture

Awsome, I want one!

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 22:04 | 4934102 p00k1e
p00k1e's picture

CAR - Concentrated Acid Rain.  LOL

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 23:08 | 4934263 are we there yet
are we there yet's picture

Expensive leafblower. Water cooling units on top of many buildings are better and recycle their water for cooling as well as particulate absorption. And a lot cheaper.

Mon, 07/07/2014 - 23:17 | 4934285 user2011
user2011's picture

It is amazine how these Chinese think of shit like this.   They are trying to put out a freak show just to say " we are combatting the situation with out latest invention".

 

These fucker Chinese government officials are only good at stealing money, having more women.    Other than that, they are fucking useless.

Fuck the communists.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 04:41 | 4934614 css1971
css1971's picture

Communists? Are you taking the piss?

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 00:51 | 4934443 Zest
Zest's picture

That's the key missing piece at my local nightclub.

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 03:47 | 4934595 dojufitz
dojufitz's picture

So let me guess....

a really fat guy gets blasted out of that thing and he is paid to collect the smoggy air as he travels through it.......

 

works for me......

Tue, 07/08/2014 - 04:11 | 4934603 zipit
zipit's picture

Don't treat the cause, treat the symptom!  Smart!

Sat, 07/12/2014 - 02:18 | 4949406 Zeta Reticuli
Zeta Reticuli's picture

This is just a cyclone sprayer. They are used to spray insecticide in orchards, mostly. No high-tech here. I know people who used them in CT in the 1970's.

 

Sat, 07/12/2014 - 02:22 | 4949413 Zeta Reticuli
Zeta Reticuli's picture

Know what's the scariest thing about the huge, polluted cities in China? The city residents of Beijing, Shanghai, Hong Kong, Shenzhen, etc, live longer than Americans.

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