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Putin Makes First Official Statement; Russia To Cut IBM, Microsoft Dependence: Complete Ukraine Situation Summary
Your one stop to catch up on all the latest development surrounding the crash of flight MH17 and the recovery effort. Courtesy of Bloomberg.
POLITICS:
- Putin says plane crash shouldn’t be used for political gain
- Says Russia will do all it can to end east Ukraine clashes
- German Chancellor Merkel, Russian President Putin discussed ICAO’s role in MH17 crash investigation; need for talks
- U.S. Secretary of State Kerry, Russian Foreign Minister Lavrov agree on impartial investigation of MH17 crash
- Kerry says circumstantial evidence points to Russian-supplied missile attack on MH17.
- Turkish PM Erdogan believes Russia shot down MH17: Hurriyet
WHAT TO WATCH:
- Russia seeks to cut dependence on IBM, Microsoft amid sanctions
- Poroshenko Orders Truce Within 20 Km of Crash Site: IFX
- East Ukraine separatist Borodai says train with MH17 bodies hasn’t left area; rebels seek “objective” investigation
- U.K. said to seek ban on EU defense goods export to Russia
- Looking at sanctions options, incl. energy: PM’s office
- Dutch PM Rutte says economic, political, financial measures on table in response to limited access to MH17 crash site
- Russians divided over their country’s role in Ukraine: poll
- Separatists fired at OSCE crash investigators: ABC News
- OSCE team not getting access needed to do job: Swiss ambassador
MARKETS:
- Yield on 10-yr ruble bonds up 9bps to 8.98%
- Ruble appreciates 0.1% vs euro-dollar basket; strengthens second day
- Micex -1.5% to 1,401.08, falling for 6th day
- Hryvnia depreciates 0.3% to 11.67 per dollar
- Brent crude falls 0.3% to $107.20/bbl; WTI down 0.2% to $102.91/bbl
- Gold rises 0.2% to $1,313.41/oz
- SXXP falls 0.4%
Here is Putin's speech from yesterday
And a transcript:
In connection with the terrible tragic events that happened in the skies over Donetsk, I would like to explain once again Russian attitude to events that are taking place in Ukraine.
We have repeatedly called on all parties of the conflict to immediately stop the bloodshed and sit down at the negotiating table. We strongly believe that if military action in the East of Ukraine was not renewed on the 28th of June, this tragedy most likely wouldn’t have happened. However, no one should have the right to use this tragedy to pursue egoistic political aims. Such events should unite and not divide people. It is necessary that all the people who are accounted for the situation in the region took more responsibility and reported to their own people and to the peoples of those countries whose representatives have become victims of this disaster.
Everything must be done to ensure the safety of international experts on the crash scene. Today representatives of Donbass, Donetsk, representatives of Ministry of Emergency Situations of Ukraine and Malaysian experts are already working there. But this is not enough. It is necessary to ensure that at the crash site works a full team of experts under the auspices of ICAO, the corresponding international commission. We must do everything to provide them with full and absolute security and all humanitarian corridors necessary for their operation.
In its turn, Russia will do everything possible to transfer the conflict in Eastern Ukraine from today's military phase to a discussion at the negotiating table, using exclusively peaceful and diplomatic means.
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I'm gonna be the first on my block to run WindowsUSSR.
Why give anymore money to Bill Gates when all he does with it is Common Core commie education crap?
Guess the Ruskies got tired of the Blue Screen Of Death. I wonder if they can come up with a no crash OS with no backdoor for the NSA.
Hmmm.... I might have to buy something Russian if they do,
Listened this evening to todays no agenda show and heared for the first time some convincing analyses about the shooting. Yes, I now believe a rocket has been shot. It is all related to this document by the German Traffic and Broadcasting department:
http://adam.curry.com/enc/20140720012844_1801925hunkolinke.pdf
Since the beginning of June this has been going on and it makes it possible for fighter jets to spoof military registration indicators on commercial airliners. It also explains the news that started that time that airliners disappeared from radar (remember http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/austria/10898385/13-planes-vanish-from-radars-over-Europe.htm ).
This part of the analyses starts at 1h and 10 minutes in the show: NoAgendaShow.com
btw, worth listening to the whole thing ofcourse
Bring back the DUO:
Kerry and Lavrov
remove the big dogs with big egos ...
only these two guys with their deep professionalism and dedication are able to find a common language and trade some horses in the process ... both are pros!!!
only these two guys with their deep professionalism and dedication are able to find a common language and trade some horses in the process ... both are pros!!!
Arius
You forgot the /sarc tag on the 50% of what you just said!
If you're speaking in those endearing terms about the U.S. Secretary of State you must have been high as a kite while you were writing that playing an lp of Iron Butterfly while watching a historical documentary of a much younger Kerry delivering his famous speech in Washington before Congress as a "Winter soldier" about the urgent need to get out of Vietnam!
With where this Country is headed I might join you as I don't believe we have the same number of underground bunkers that Russia has!
This country has underground tunnels but they're not for us--they're for the DC psychos who start all the trouble.
fdl
Actually you are correct on that assertion.
My bad!
But then again. What difference does it make when the Russians will attempt to protect the "99%", while ours will protect the "1%"!
T
Hopefully, Russia will be switching over to Macs. Smart move. Buy AAPL now.
Mac's "Maverick" OS would be an apt compliment to Putin's governing style.
Ermmm... Russia (government agencies and state-run enterprises) wants to be independent from foreign technology, so the LAST thing they will do is buy Macs.
Any open source LINUX flavor will do.
Dump AAPL now, consumer electronics are rapidly becoming commodities.
Now you're talkin. LINUX RULES!
Just waiting on Kerry to put his hoof in his mouth again, letting
Putin take control of the situation ,just like Syria.
With his form, its only a matter of time.
Hey ho Kerry.
"Putin says plane crash shouldn’t be used for political gain"
Ha! Putin once again shows how unAmerican he actually is, ..oh, ...wait.
MDB, is that you?
Imagine the dirty tricks one could do with the capability of making commercial planes look like military planes and vice versa. wow
Cool. The Adam 'Madonna' Curry. I'll have a look at his blog.
good find. this is a very plausible scenario
Looks like usint sat images showing Ukraine troops (or those dressed in Ukraine uniforms) fired the missile. Interesting large amount of beer bottles on the ground next to the equipment and troops. I hope the whistleblower has a good life insurance policy.
http://www.infowars.com/whistleblower-u-s-satellite-images-show-ukrainia...
jaap posted this link above. It offers a fresh perspective.
"This part of the analyses starts at 1h and 10 minutes in the show: NoAgendaShow.com http://mp3s.nashownotes.com/NA-636-2014-07-20-Final.mp3
btw, worth listening to the whole thing of course"
My take the Malaysian Jet shoot down was possibly from the Corporate Play Book for "LebensRaum" with many parts played by the US Warmongers like Hillery, Peter King, John McCain.
US Corporate Lebensraum for Oil & Gas Expansion, but Royal Dutch Shell has a lot in the Game. And of course the Royals themselves.
Interesting that UK, France, USA, Russian knew the war script would include commercial jet shoot down and so kept their airlines out of the war-zone or corridor.
I actually didn't finish the MP3, so he probably has different conclusions later on.
This would also jive with information coming from people in the Eastern Ukraine about Ukrainian fighter jets shadowing commercial airliners to get close enough to targets to initiate bombing runs.
"No back door to NSA, comrades! Back door only to KGB. We will not sell your data."
I do not care about the KGB.
At least they are not taking nude pictures of your children and passing those along to one another. They have some morality, at least.
Our Pentagon is a bunch of Pedophiles. You can see that here...
http://deadlinelive.info/2013/01/22/why-was-pentagon-child-pornography-investigation-halted/
and...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/07/23/pentagon-child-porn-scand_n_656839.html
Furthermore our Soldiers were child rapists in Iraq...Here is one admitting it. Fast forward to the 2 Minute mark
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=607pyA_TTck
And then you can look at George Washington's article...
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-07-17/snowden-nsa-employees-routinely-pass-around-nude-photos-obtained-mass-surveillance
Now add it up...The NSA is the Pentagon Spy Agency...er...the Pedophile Spy Agency.
yes but if your livelhood is in the u.s. better to have that known by kgb, than your own gvt.
Timed with Microsoft's layoff of 18K. Short term gain for Apple HW running Linux.
Pubuntu
Rubuntu
"Red Hat."
Mint.
Oh noes! Russia giving up Windows will only up the effectiveness of their cool and nasty weapon development programs and make them even more dangerous and make Putin even more likely to personally shoot down unarmed civilians and tear out the hearts of innocent babies and grandmothers! Save us Obama, you're our only hope!
"Why give anymore money to Bill Gates when all he does with it is Common Core commie education crap."
Common Core is far more insidious than anything Putin is up to.
Resistance is beginning to grow, and it crosses partisan lines.
Well, as long as there is a consensus.
maybe the ruskies are too smart for windows, and will go back to thinking persons o.s.not the disneyland of spinning glyphs and undocumented "features". maybe a stable os. would not require "replacment" every 4 years or whenever Bill needs a new yacht.
That's what a Statesman speech should be, whether Russia is implcated or not, but not the crap coming out of the Uk & US
UK is run by school kids. They are the upmarket version of the yobs in Magaluf.
Once Britain had men of stature but they have left the political scene which is now simply a playground for half-wits with motor-mouths
Same in USA!
Makes one think Scotts might know something after all ... hhhmmmmm
#Dipshits
I presume your statement does not apply to EU politics, where UK politicians shine bathed in the light of reason and statemanship /s
no, it's not that OT. Italy proposed a new EU "Foreign Minister" for the EU Commission, and all the UK newspapers I'm reading are joining the chorus of the Balts and Poles in saying that she is too friendly towards Russia. (Thank you Mr. Cameron for this infusion of antagonistic politics/s)
having said that, Putin is really saying the most reasonable things:
"Everything must be done to ensure the safety of international experts on the crash scene. Today representatives of Donbass, Donetsk, representatives of Ministry of Emergency Situations of Ukraine and Malaysian experts are already working there. But this is not enough. It is necessary to ensure that at the crash site works a full team of experts under the auspices of ICAO, the corresponding international commission. We must do everything to provide them with full and absolute security and all humanitarian corridors necessary for their operation.
In its turn, Russia will do everything possible to transfer the conflict in Eastern Ukraine from today's military phase to a discussion at the negotiating table, using exclusively peaceful and diplomatic means."
just make sure you hold your promises, Vladimir Vladimirovich. your choice of ICAO instead of OSCE is NOT a good sign
"I presume your statement does not apply to EU politics, where UK politicians shine bathed in the light of reason and statemanship /s"a
I hope to be wrong but my hunch and it is only a hunch is that Scotts will NOT agree with your statement
you know what /s means, do you? I presume you did not see it
as for the Scots (not Scotts and not Scotch), you hunch is correct. in fact, should they do the unlikely and vote for independence... watch them getting back on board of the EU while England exits... all the way hindering Scotland to re-enter, also because of some backroom deals they have with Spain on the matter
forgive me, but i do not think it is that unlikely .... and as for the future, i wouldnt bet on just a simple "getting right back on board with England", reason being why start it in the first place if that was the case?
yeah, i know unexpected ... but so was this malaysian airliner ... a lot of unexpected things, which make the remaining things more expected... you dig??? not so special after all ...
Arius, you are forgiven if you forgive me a further correction. I wrote "watch them getting back on board of the EU while England exits". yes. unlikely. the future, imho, is probabilistic
for example: imho it is unlikely that the USD will hyperinflate. the chance for it is 5%. unlikely is not impossible
Promises? He wants Europe dead. He couldn't even express his condolences...yet again...to the civilians his missile slaughtered.
This is he game changer...to Putin and his cronies that Boeing 777 represents all that is wrong with the world. And in his KGB mindset "those passengers were just collateral damage."
Talk about a throwback to an Age long since gone. Windows and IBM? This guy is stuck in 1981.
the civilians his missile slaughtered.
And you know this how?
Putin does not want Europe dead. we are behind the days of total annihilation. just unconscious, divided, and not US-led
yes, he is a near-fascist, conservative bully leader... with nearly all his nation behind him in a cultural/national conflict involving the Russian Diaspora in the remnants of the old empire. this is both a very old and very new
the throwbacks to 1981, though... they are in Washington, DC, London and sadly also in Warsaw, imho. toghether with all those who still use the USSR label, a good giveaway
According to Dr. Paul Craig Roberts, the neocons around Reagan wanted him to launch a preememptive nuclear strike against Russsia, Bucky Turgidson style. "Catch em with their pants down." Reagan said, no no no no no... we don't want to attack Russia.
These neocons are still present in Washington, whispering in Obama's gullible ear.
See Roberts on youtube.
shill
Putin doesn't want Europe dead. Europe is the meat in a giant bitch sandwich, in which both Barry and Vlad are sick of crossing swords and are now openly fighting to turn it into a monogamous one-on-one thing with Europe.
gross sexual reference. but yes, apt. we are, after all, a partner in many ways. the Eagle's BFF and the Bear's best customer. "1984"?
I got's me a diploma from the Sam Kinison and Lenny Bruce school of foreign policy. We can't all be articulate Europeans.
Perhaps you should change your moniker to "mentally disabledvet" ??
your mindless blather "represents all that is wrong with the world"
Ghordius you must be a big f...ng exspert on Euorpe? PROPAGANDA SHILL
just live here. even visited a few times the countries behind the Iron Curtain, then. Including Albania, both before and after. your argument is...?
I have ben reading your comments and I live in euorope too.Behind the curtians are the same pepople ho rule in Europe and in the US.
wish it was so. and... since when do you think it is so? the Middle Ages? 1815? 1919? 1946?
really Ghordius, USA in the Middle Ages ?
The Old World Order finding new colonies? Why not? We are talking of sinister conspiracies, aren't we?
Since July of 2013 when the American government was allowed to take a more active role in creating news programs both government accountability and the role of free media has been diminished. As of July 2, 2013 a taboo came silently to an end with the implementation of a new law passed in January.
For decades a so-called anti-propaganda law prevented the U.S. government's mammoth broadcasting arm from delivering programming to American audiences. The new law unleashes thousands of hours per week of government-funded radio and TV programs for domestic U.S. consumption. This was criticized by many human rights activist as a green light for U.S. domestic propaganda efforts and in my opinion it is already being felt. More on this subject in the article below.
http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2014/07/when-propaganda-and-surveillance....
He's reading off a script. *golfclap*
another teleprompter?
Turkish PM Erdogan
Ha...he was the guy caught on tape admitting that Turkey used false flag attacks (killings) in Syria and wanted to do more....ie Erogan is a murderer.
And WTF would he know....nothing of course, paying his dues by socking US cock so he can keep his job in Turkey..
Also after the Turkish coalmine disaster Erdogan was quoted as saying that it comes within the territory of working at a mine site.What a complete prick.
Dear friends,
Slight correction.Erdogan is a Donmeh prick.
Double post.
He is also the full blown NATO member who is currently in negotiations to become a full blown member of Vlad's Trade Union. You've got to admire the guy's "flexibility"...
(He also that love/hate, kind of gay relationship with Bibi, which he doesn't like to talk about)
which could bite back, particularly since Erdogan's party is the wannabee hidden hegemon of all Turkic tribes, the sometimes troublemakers in Vlad's EurAsia
Ghordius, Erdogan isn't Turkic - he is Georgian
did not know that, thanks. so I'm even happier I wrote his party
Dudes were a bunch of Ukranian drunks that fired the missle.
The source said CIA analysts were still not ruling out the possibility that the troops were actually eastern Ukrainian rebels in similar uniforms but the initial assessment was that the troops were Ukrainian soldiers. There also was the suggestion that the soldiers involved were undisciplined and possibly drunk, since the imagery showed what looked like beer bottles scattered around the site, the source said.
That's from InfoWars.com
But Putin's not that smart either if he was still using Microsoft. Wouldn't be supprised if the missle launcher was found to be running it.
The source said CIA analysts were...
Probably watching porn.
Your children undressing from images taken from their Smartphones...
Don't worry. You want your children safe, right?
The area where the Malaysian passenger jet MH17 fell in Ukraine is a crash site not a crime site! Painting it as a crime site does not make it so. Whether shot down by accident or intentionally, most of the evidence on how and why this occurred will most likely come from sources other than where the flight went down.
I for one feel total disgust and seriously distressed that this tragedy has become nothing more than a propaganda gem. More on this topic in the article below.
http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2014/07/ukraine-crash-propaganda-gem.html
Shooting down a plane in a war zone is a "crime". So when will Israel be brought to account for shelling civilians with flechettes ?
Whether shot down by accident or intentionally, most of the evidence on how and why this occurred will most likely come from sources other than where the flight went down.
Taking care of the bodies of the victims might be placed as a priority over some bull shit political theater!
I have no doubt they were drunk when they shot it down. I have no doubt they (both sides) are drunk 85% of the time. So maybe they had to sober up to carry around the bodies. You try living a shitty existence in those hills where there is probably zero enjoyment in your life other than when you are trashed. Then you end up with a whole shitload of advanced weapons. Then a commercial plane is dumb enough to fly over your war zone miserable existence. Sometimes it's just that simple.
OK so did we have blackwater mercanries with Ukraine's BUKS shooting this thing down, on schedule once the plane was diverted. Wouldn't be the first time the US has done this sort of thing.
At this stage anything is possible. ONE thing is sure...neither Russia or Ukrain would be stupid enough to deliberatelly shoot down a commercial airliner....however Ukraine and US would gain from such an act if it could be blamed on the enemy.
You speak of Russia and Ukraine as countries. Of course they would not be stupid enough to want to do this. Now minimize this down to small groups of guys living in hills all day every day. Not much else to do but sit around. Not many chicks around. Not much stimulus other than stashes of booze and advanced weaponry. Shit happens.
Could it have been some blackwater op? I guess. Can't rule it out.
Blackwater, ex-US military guys, have any knowledge how to operate russian BUK? They can't even read cyrillic.
Your 'shit happens' version, on the other hand, is much more likely.
My money is on a US proxy/merc op. C'mon man, what difference does it makes whether 220 people are dead? Russia looks bad.
I missed the UK tabloids with pics of Palestinian kids. Did they run those covers yet?
I missed the UK tabloids with pics of Palestinian kids...
As long as the Saudis keep paying them, the tabloids will keep printing the pics.
OMG don't you realise you are forbidden to criticise the Tribe? shush now
Disagree. The BUK missile isn't big enough to "blow up" the whole plane alone, it's triggered some distance away and a blast of schrapnel is fired into the plane. So it's important to know what part of the plane was hit first and how the plane was caused to break up. A BUK missile may have been fired (or just the radar systems operated) and following fighter jets were used for the kill. Clues about all of this will be found amongst the wreckage. Operation of the BUK missile takes 17 trained personell and three vehicles. Since the plane was at the limit of the missile's range, knowing where the plane was hit pinponts the location of the launchers on the ground quite accurately. 17 people need to eat and sleep. Locals will have seen them. Therefore whoever orchestrated it knew exactly what they were targeting (if it was a BUK), and ruling out a BUK missile as the mechanism even more stronly implies deliberate targeting.
Where is Boris to explain all this.......
There isn't any evidence left. Why bother with a "robust" investigation? Just be nice enough to get the bodies back to their families. Please Vlad, no more church scenes until January 7.
I'm tired of hearing how drunken separatist thugs have been gathering up the bodies of the dead and moving them with little respect. Anyone who has ever undertaken such a task will tell you it is a difficult and horrible job. Someone who is drunk cannot or will not go far into a field and be able to help carry a heavy body in 85 degree heat. Any ass ranting about how these are a bunch of drunks has never worked a day in their life! More on this subject in the article below.
http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2014/07/putin-holds-all-cards.html
Not exactly a trend setter, I did this years ago.
Meanwhile Robert Parry says US spy satellites saw Ukraine troops shoot down the plane.
http://consortiumnews.com/2014/07/20/what-did-us-spy-satellites-see-in-u...
very good article, makes sense.
Great link, thanks.
Video: Putin appears statesman-like , Heinzketchup does not.
The image I always conjure when I think of Kerry is the man windsurfing. That, I believe, is his calling in life. He should stop pretending to play diplomat.
i guess putie really isn't that smart after all. microsoft and ibm have been spying on them for years.
Still no explanation on why the US governement spent USD$4 billion on the regime change in Ukraine.
Still no valid explanation on why the US government is arming Israel.
Still no valid explanation why the US government is arming Al Quaeda in Syria.
Still no valid explanation on why WMDs were never found after the Iraq invasion.
Since July of 2013 when the American government was allowed to take a more active role in creating news programs both government accountability and the role of free media has been diminished. As of July 2, 2013 a taboo came silently to an end with the implementation of a new law passed in January.
For decades a so-called anti-propaganda law prevented the U.S. government's mammoth broadcasting arm from delivering programming to American audiences. The new law unleashes thousands of hours per week of government-funded radio and TV programs for domestic U.S. consumption. This was criticized by many human rights activist as a green light for U.S. domestic propaganda efforts and in my opinion it is already being felt. More on this subject in the article below.
http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2014/07/when-propaganda-and-surveillance....
History 2044
"......the citizens finally took back the US........and then it was discovered the US Regime had silently replaced all of its reporters with State Agents trained by the military forces and unconventional warfare experts...Obama was never found, having once again changed disguises before fleeing the country."
"Back off or the Chinese and unconstitutional domestic spys get it!"
Is this some sort of threat/joke from retarded Reds?
U.S. Secretary of State Kerry agree on impartial investigation?
The US and impartial is a classic example of an oxymoron
How is Putin going to ensure a full investigation on the ground in Eastern Ukraine, when the country doesnt belong to him.
I am sure it was all part of Putin's plans to be alienated by the western world and increase the sanctions being put on his country. It must have been Russia, this is what they intended.
/sarc
It would be nice to see US companies follow in Russia's footsteps and drop M$ and IBM. There are lots more effective ways to spend your money and avoid long term buy in.
Many here in India think the Ukraine was trying to shoot down Putin's plane and hit the wrong one, FWIW.
It'd be a theory if not for the fact Putin hasnt flown over Ukraine since conflict started. Why give the Ukie fascists even a tiny chance of scoring that sort of spectacular victory?
then many in India are absolute fucking morons, since Putin was in Brazil when MH17 was shot down
seriously, look it up
Then I stand corrected, but I have heard that 3X since yesterday.
Russian state media has been fucking that chicken for days now... too bad everyone knows it's a bald faced lie
Hang around here the BS is much deeper and they speak Engish you can understand. Don't forget your tin foil hat and Russian flag.
Kinda surprised that you got down arrows, since all you were doing was reporting local beliefs. The beliefs may be unfounded but there is value in knowing that large parts of the world don't believe what the western MSM is pushing.
The 'crime scene' for this crash is on Pennsylvania Avenue, the 'crash site' is in eastern Ukraine.
putin is my hero. he's not a dirty muslim, gay boy who likes is women with packages.
U.K. said to seek ban on EU defense goods export to Russia
Don't worry Israel, we'll still sell them to you. Hurry, buy one get one free whilst stocks last.
Article in french, unfortunately, but pretty interesting perpsective if confirmed : the video allegedly "showing reponsibility of Ucrainian dissidents" may have been created 1 day before the crash.
All to be verified, obviosuly, just posting this because Zerohedge is quoted .... and actually gives a nice way to easily verify by ourselves what we are shown those days ...
http://lesmoutonsenrages.fr/2014/07/19/false-flag-le-gouvernement-ukrain...
; )
Dont know whose missile, by whom, or even if it were a missile.
50/50 bet it was a fuck up by rebels, or Ukraine/US/Blackwater frame up.
Alternatively...if it were running windows a BOD at the wrong time....
no - i'm calling a G20 punk here - :
I know its far out but watch this video :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYmViPTndxw
but especially take note of the last part - the reference to the G7 and the G20 -
obviously the G8 became the G7 because they dropped Russia.
if the G20 dropped Russia it would be the G19
as per the video (stated compression of numbers)
G7 and G19 (the Group without Russia)
7 and 19
becomes
7 + 1 + 9
= 17
which was also the day.
Australians on-board - now 321 pack the security resolution with a "admission of guilt" or some other insulting line that Russia will not accept - veto = dropped from G20 -
world split in half , job well done.
That's alot of Math to handle in a Post...just saying
Barry is busy vacationing. No problem, Kerry will look like the fool he is. Commercial airliners need to be away from areas of conflict.
Good. That monkey needs to stay out of this.
Barry is preparing the backdoor even while vacatioing
Which is what he loves doing
loves preparing his backdoor ?
Ukrainian Su-25 fighter recorded in close approach to MH17 before crash - Russian military
If the US can see beer bottles on the ground in Ukraine, they sure ought to be able to track jets near MH 17. The US will also have captured all communiucations between those jets and base as well as Kiev air traffic control. Speak up, fellows.
So you would believe what they said? That would be the first time.
For those of you untrained in the subtleties of Russian diplomatic language...Putin is suggesting that though the missile system hardware in question is Russian... the software that controls it is from IBM or Microsoft... and we all know that the NSA has the ability to remotely control all these systems. Could the missile have beeen fired from remote control?
I thought that missile system was designed and built in the 1970s
by Linda Lovelace?
Yes and B-52s were designed and built in 1960s. For a missile designed in 1979 ( and updated continually) it certainly makes Boeing 777s look vulnerable and other aircraft. Wait until ISIS get some of those in Syria - no more overflying Iraq
Just how are they going to get out of Afghan ?
Quit screwing up the story.
And haven't had a software update since?
I'd like to pass a little scenario past you guys.
A high ranking separatist (dont remember the name) stated that the cadavers that were supposively those of the passengers were not "fresh" for lack of a better word and drained of blood.
Tinfoil hat on
1-Take a similar plane, say one 'lost' over the indian ocean
2-Fill it with cadavers and possibly nasty chemicals
3-Set the plane to go crash in tel aviv or some shit (not sure what is on the changed flight path) and get justification to go even more apeshit on the palestinians
4-Russian intelligence gets wind of the plot and shoots down the damn thing one way or another. lesser of 2 evils kind of thing
Tinfoil hat off
You are a moron. Tell that story to the crying relatives.
Russia is blazing an interesting trail in its efforts to reduce reliance on the big communication technology companies. This is quite interesting, as we'll need the resources of sovereign nations to throw off the digital shackles currently around every person's wrists as they take to their 'keyboards'.
if putin wasn't prepared to cut back on oil and natty exports as a weapon he should have just kissed the maggot's asses. the only thing that hurts those scumbags in any way is $200+/bbl oil or nukes up their asses, or both.
IBD is all over Putin today like a cheap suit, including a Rameriz cartoon of Putin's hand crushing the plane in mid-air.
Sheesh.
This one: http://news.investors.com/IBDEditorials.aspx
F me......
Cheesier than cheese, can I have extra cheese pleeze?
A rag for Barry. Hollywood and the media loves Obama.
If Putin is such a forward thinking chess player why did Russia continue to run Microsoft/IBM and other US sourced computer products. It has been known that there were backdoors for a long time and that computers were bing detored to NSA/CIA for special modifications prior to going to targets. This action should have been taken at least 8 years ago.
These facts make it appear Russia and others are very far behind in their actions.
The question is: Is Putin's honesty and sincerity a match for the West's (America's) propaganda?
is this a kind of moral contest, where the child that lies less wins? seriously, sometimes this lie/honesty thing can be a bit excessive (is this an American cultural thing?)
Putin is not a honesty and sincerity hero and saint. evidence: unmarked "green men" in Crimea
propaganda is relative, and the reasons are also important. but at the end... it's about actions that matters most, not words
so my question is: will Putin help to calm things down? will the US do the same?
Hey Ghordius,
If the "green men" are unmarked, how do you know they are Russian ( controlled ) ?
Same goes for the US : if these men were Russian (controlled), it would be unthinkable for the US not to be able to provide proof of it. As the US has not done so far, that leaves us with 2 possibilities :
1. They are not Russian ( controlled )
2. They are Russian ( controlled ) and US is acquiescing
Which one is it, Ghordius ?
of course they are Russian, either in the narrow or the broader sense. they flew the Russian flag for Russian national purposes, for criminy. why, is there any doubt it's 2? I don't get your angle
Flying the Russian flag does not qualify as being marked Russian and could be a mere expression of an aspiration on their part. I could fly the Russian flag tomorrow. I trust you get my angle as far as the role the USA might be playing is concerned. It is not too difficult to suspect their potential role by simple logic, an angle surprisingly few posters ( none ? ) here seem to take an effort to examine. For some reason ( let's call it intuition ) I lumped you in with the US intelligence elites and hoped you could answer for them, my bad.
are we still about unmarked "green men" in Crimea?
of course, Crimea and Eastern Ukraine. In the case of Crimea, did the US almost imperceptibly nod to Russia, or did I just imagine ? Nevermind.
How can immorality(atheist homosexual USA) beat morality( Christian traditional Russia) in a moral contest?
How can being the biggest liar be a virtuous and sustainable geopolitical strategy?
How do unmarked 'green men' prove Putins intransegence?
How can your undocumented befuddled musings be used by others as evidence of anything other than your severe lack of cognition?
These questions are better than your question.
China will gain a closer relationship with Russia.
Maybe the flood of illegals can help the US with more EBT cards and welfare (sarc). They can push the buttons to vote for the liberals.
Its a false flag at worst, mistake by Ukraine military at best.
Either way, USA is going to use this as more ammo to make Russia look like the bad guys when the real bad guys are in Langley, DC, NY, and Basel.
So that the USA/Western collapse can then be (falsely) blamed on Russia seeking out revenge.
So when the derivatives blow up: Russia's doing
So when your bank account is suddenly 0: Russian hackers stole it.
So when your IRA/401k account is 0: Russian hackers stole it.
All to get the USA/West pissed at Russia - for revenge over BRICS Bank, de-dollarization, gold-backed Ruble, Yuan, etc.
Go Putin ! Please destroy once and for all the Rothschild Regime and the Basel Castle Dwellers.