Russia Says Has Photos Of Ukraine Deploying BUK Missiles In East, Radar Proof Of Warplanes In MH17 Vicinity

Tyler Durden's picture

Ukraine hasn’t said how it immediately knew rebels downed Malaysian plane, notes the Russian Foreign Ministry, as it unveils 10 awkward questions for Ukraine (and perhaps the US 'snap judgment') to answer about the MH17 disaster. However, what is perhaps more concerning for the hordes of finger-pointers is that:

  • RUSSIA HAS IMAGES OF UKRAINE DEPLOYING BUK ROCKETS IN EAST: IFX
  • RUSSIA: UKRAINE MOVED BUK NEAR REBELS IN DONETSK JULY 17: IFX
  • RUSSIA DETECTED UKRAINIAN FIGHTER JET PICK UP SPEED TOWARD MH17

Obviously, if there is proof that this is so, aside from CIA-created YouTube clips, these would deal another unpleasant blow to US foreign policy.

The Russian defense ministry during its press conference which concluded minutes ago:

 

Here is the full clip of the Russian ministry releasing its own forensic analysis of what happened to flight MH17 (with English translation).

 

Russia wants to know why Ukraine moved its BUK missiles systems the day of the MH17 crash:

  • RUSSIAN GENERAL STAFF HAS SPACE IMAGES OF SECTORS OF UKRAINIAN FORCES' POSITIONS IN SOUTHEASTERN UKRAINE, INCLUDING BUK MISSILE LUNCH SITES 8 KILOMETERS FROM LUHANSK - RUSSIAN DEFENSE MINISTRY - interfax

The day the Malaysian airliner crashed, the Ukrainian forces deployed an air defense group of three or four Buk-M1 missile batteries near Donetsk, Lt. Gen. Andrei Kartapolov, head of the Russian General Staff's Main Operations Department, told reporters on Monday.

 

"These surface-to-air systems are capable of hitting targets at a distance of up to 35 kilometers at an altitude of 22 kilometers. For what purpose and against whom were these missile systems deployed? As is known, the militia has no aviation," he said.

Russia has the flight paths of the Ukrainian fighters and MH17. Furthermore, it is asking the same question we asked last Thurday:

  • RUSSIA SAYS MH17 DIVERGED 14 KM FROM FLIGHT PATH NEAR DONETSK

And wants to know why. The image (as seen in the presentation above) allegedly shows Ukraine fighter jets near MH17:

Here is a screengrab of a Su-25 fighter jet detected close to MH17 before crash.

As RT reports,

“A Ukraine Air Force military jet was detected gaining height, it’s distance from the Malaysian Boeing was 3 to 5km,” said the head of the Main Operations Directorate of the HQ of Russia’s military forces, Lieutenant-General Andrey Kartopolov speaking at a media conference in Moscow on Monday.

 

“[We] would like to get an explanation as to why the military jet was flying along a civil aviation corridor at almost the same time and at the same level as a passenger plane,” he stated.

 

“The SU-25 fighter jet can gain an altitude of 10km, according to its specification,” he added. “It’s equipped with air-to-air R-60 missiles that can hit a target at a distance up to 12km, up to 5km for sure.”

 

The presence of the Ukrainian military jet can be confirmed by video shots made by the Rostov monitoring center, Kartopolov stated.

And asks for US proof of their accusations:

  • RUSSIA SAYS U.S. SATELLITE FLEW OVER MH17 AT TIME IT WAS DOWNED... which would provide all the proof needed to show who is responsible  - so why hasn't the US explained this or shown it? 
  • RUSSIA ASKS U.S. FOR EVIDENCE ROCKET FIRED FROM REBEL-HELD AREA
  • RUSSIA: NO U.S. PROOF THAT MISSILE FIRED FROM REBEL-HELD AREA
  • DEFENCE MINISTRY SAYS RUSSIA DID NOT DELIVER ANY SA-11 BUK MISSILE SYSTEMS TO SEPARATISTS IN EASTERN UKRAINE "OR ANY OTHER WEAPONS"

And went on to rebuke all the Twitter photos created by Maidan to 'prove' the BUKs were moving in Russian hands.

Additionally, as Russia noted using what appears to be legitimate photographic evidence (something the west has so far failed to provide in any capacity) MH17 crashed within the operating zone of the Ukrainian army’s self-propelled, medium-range surface-to-air ‘Buk’ missile systems, the Russian general said.

“We have space images of certain places where the Ukraine’s air defense was located in the southeast of the country,” Kartapolov noted.

The first three shots that were shown by the general are dated July 14. The images show Buk missile launch systems in about 8km northwest of the city of Lugansk – a TELAR and two TELs, according to the military official.

Another image shows a radar station near Donetsk.

Radar stations of the air defense in Donetsk Region, 5km north of Donetsk city, on July 14, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense MinistryRadar stations of the air defense in Donetsk Region, 5km north of Donetsk city, on July 14, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense Ministry

 

While the third picture shows the location of the air defense systems near Donetsk, he explained. In particular, one can clearly see a TELAR launcher and about 60 military and auxiliary vehicles, tents for vehicles and other structures, he elaborated.

Buk missile defense units in Donetsk Region, 5km north of Donetsk city, on July 14, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense MinistryBuk missile defense units in Donetsk Region, 5km north of Donetsk city, on July 14, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense Ministry

 

“Images from this area were also made on July 17. One should notice that the missile launcher is absent [from the scene]. Image number five shows the Buk missile system in the morning of the same day in the area of settlement Zaroschinskoe – 50km south of Donetsk and 8km south of Shakhtyorsk," the Kartapolov said.

No Buk missile defense units in Donetsk Region, 5km north of Donetsk city, on July 17, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense MinistryNo Buk missile defense units in Donetsk Region, 5km north of Donetsk city, on July 17, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense Ministry


Buk missile defense units in Zaroschinskoe, 50km south of Donetsk city and 8km south of Shakhtyorsk, on July 17, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense MinistryBuk missile defense units in Zaroschinskoe, 50km south of Donetsk city and 8km south of Shakhtyorsk, on July 17, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense Ministry

The question that has to be answered is why the missile system appeared in the area controlled by the local militia forces shortly before the catastrophe, he stated.

* * *

Summing it all up, the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs, has 10 questions for Ukraine (google translated)

The global public expects a speedy and independent investigation into the causes of the disaster Malaysian aircraft in the airspace of Ukraine.

In order to conduct an objective investigation of possible leadership of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation has ased ten questions to the Ukrainian side.

1. Ukrainian authorities immediately identified the militia as the perpetrators of the tragedy. What is the basis of such findings?

 

2. Could official Kiev to report all the details of using [BUKs] in a war zone? Most importantly - why these systems are deployed there, as the militia no planes?

 

3. What are the causes of inactivity of Ukrainian authorities on the formation of an international commission? When such a committee will work?

 

4. Are the armed forces of Ukraine international experts to present papers on accounting for missiles, air-to-air and ground-to-air ammo and anti-aircraft missiles?

 

5. Whether these funds objective control on the movement of the Ukrainian Air Force aircraft on the day of the tragedy brought international commission?

 

6. Why Ukrainian air traffic controllers allowed deviation of the route of the aircraft to the north side of the "anti-terrorist operation zone"?

 

7. Why was not completely closed to civilian aircraft airspace over the combat zone, especially because in this area there was no solid field of radar navigation?

 

8. Could official Kiev to comment on reports in the net, ostensibly on behalf of the Spanish air traffic controllers working in Ukraine, which shot down over the territory of Ukraine "Boeing" was accompanied by two Ukrainian military aircraft?

 

9. Why Security Service of Ukraine has begun without international representatives work with recordings of talks with Ukrainian crew dispatchers "Boeing" and Ukrainian radar data?

 

10. How were the lessons from previous similar disasters Russian Tu-154 in 2001 in the Black Sea? Then the leaders of Ukraine until the last minute denied any involvement of the Armed Forces of the country to the tragedy until irrefutable evidence showed no guilt official Kiev.

Unfortunately, there has been no response by the Ukraine side to these questions so far. We expect that there will be some answers.

*  *  *

Needless to say, this places Ukraine and The US (as main protagonist of "finger pointer") in an awkward position as finally someone, somewhere will have to present some actual facts instead of merely continuing the "emotional appeals" propaganda.

We expect many of these questions to be answered once the contents of flight MH17's black box are revealed and/or when Ukraine finally releases an undoctored version of the Air Traffic control recording with the doomed flight.

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OldPhart's picture

Cold War Air Force brat and USMC vet...and I've given up on our War Criminal Government.  I USED to be extremely patriotic, but the dumbfucks we've got in DC bring tears to my eyes.

Dublinmick's picture

They are not dumb, it only appears that way to you before you roast in a sacrifice to Molech.

Sirius Wonderblast's picture

I own some Russian military tech - believe me, it is exceptional.

Pee Wee's picture

Its Chinese, and you bought it on the Internet.

Pee Wee's picture

You Rusky corn-hole chasers confuse Chinese technology with chinstraps.

Likedeeler's picture

I am still curious about what the NSA has to say about all this.

I mean a radar that wants a proper reflection in 10 km hight has to be somewhat powerful. No satellites no AWACS no nothing to look there???

If I am the boss of the NSA some of my relevant duty might be to look at the russian borders if something is going on there.

I would expect to be fired within a day could I not deliver the exact location of an active radar in mid of the conflict region within minutes. What else is the NSA as part of the United Stated Department of Defense good for - looking at our porn or what?

surfer433's picture

NSA is too busy keeping an eye on Americans.

 

Backwoods's picture

American intelligence services don't seem to have much time for any kind of information gathering that requires them to leave their offices and their warm cups of coffee.  No more trench coated agents in exotic places, now all we have are nerds with big pocket protectors peering at algos and eating cheetos. 

deflator's picture

...and wondering why their dicks are turning orange.

Bunga Bunga's picture

Scary stuff. The German government confirms that the secondary surveillance system was jammed. At the same time NATO held drills on electronic warfare in conjunction with air defense units. 

EscapingProgress's picture

How can anyone believe a fucking word out of Obama's mouth/asshole after all of the Syrian chemical weapon attacks BS? The Ukrainians shot that passanger jet down. It is only a matter of time before this can be proven definitively.

Barack Obama is a jackass trying to play a chess game with Monopoly pieces, and he can't remember how many spaces the wheelbarrow can move.

dobermangang's picture

They can't even play checkers.  Too advanced for them.  This is the only game Obama and Kerry can play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsBSLGcvGVo

layman_please's picture

NATO having drills? Where have I seen this before?
http://www.bollyn.com/the-terror-drills-that-became-real
1994 Baltic ferry Estonia. 852 people perished.

"Although it is seldom mentioned, the Estonia catastrophe occurred on the first day of a 10-day NATO naval exercise called Cooperative Venture 94, in which more than fifteen ships and "a number of maritime aircraft" were prepared to conduct "humanitarian and search and rescue operations" in nearby waters."

icanhasbailout's picture

It's trivial to determine who is responsible for the downing of this plane. Just look at who moved to a) point the finger when no person had information which could reasonably determine blame; and b) take exclusive and private control of key pieces of forensic evidence.

 

(For the slow crowd, the answer is "The CIA and their Fascist Ukrainian puppets")

ThirteenthFloor's picture

As I watch this report...a second time...two thoughts

> I am hit with great respect for the honest factual adult presentation by Russia Intell.

> I am hit with utter devastation that my country has now been reduced to a bunch of lying con-men.  WAKE UP America...don't become a bigger joke.

 

SF beatnik's picture

There seems to be a dangerous situation developing here in the US with such incompetent leadership.

icanhasbailout's picture

most people aren't going to get it until the electricity goes out and doesn't come back on again

Paveway IV's picture

Now we know why all the network talking heads have been crying about Western officials restricted access to the crash site. How can they control the narrative if they can't plant evidence and 'interpret' the facts for us?

A bogus Western investigation would drown out all other voices for months on end before coughing up the inevitable 'inconclusive' finding. Plenty of time for the public to forget most of the details. Plenty of time to forget that the Ukraine Stazi confiscated air traffic control tapes it will never release. Plenty of time for the 'Russia did it' message to be repeated ad nauseum and eventually taken for granted as fact. 

The ball is now squarely back in Ukranian-NATO's court. Since they seem to be following the Mossad playbook lately, I'm guessing they will offer nothing but arrogant denials and contemptuous silence. That's what they usually do when they have nothing. Besides, the next five false-flags are already in the works. 

ThirteenthFloor's picture

Obama = Social Network Tiddlywinks (via 26 yo Resume liars)

Putin = Realtime Serious Chess (seasoned intell guys without a need for resume)

icanhasbailout's picture

I have extreme difficulty taking anyone seriously who did not immediately make the connection between MH17 and MH370. How much more blatant and obvious could they be?

 

I'm just glad MH370 resurfaced in Ukraine and not in New York.

Gaius Frakkin' Baltar's picture

Has anyone in the USSA state media bothered to calculate the odds of two Malaysian 777s going down within 6 months of one another? Or is statistics a conspiracy theory now? That alone is mysterious, even without the first one missing, BUT of course it is...

Cacete de Ouro's picture

Malaysian Airlines originally had a batch of 17 Boeing 777s

9M-MRO said to have disappeared
9M-MRD looks to be down
9M-MRK said to be dismantled /disassembled in Florida in 2013
9M-MRI catalogued as being in Tel Aviv hangar: GA Telesis

So that leaves 13 flying Boeing 777s at Malaysian Airlines and a lot of questions about the other 4

IndyPat's picture

This!!!
DANGER!
DANGER, WILL ROBINSON!
Holy crap, the zios are gearing up for something real stupid.

WhackoWarner's picture

Malaysia convicted Bush and Cheney in absentia of war crimes and other amusing skullduggery.  Enough said?

Kobe Beef's picture

Because in the end, Lies are all they've got. The Obama administration will just have to LIE HARDER!

My intuition on this says accidental shoot down, call to Ukrainian Defense Ministry, call to Ukranian NatSec advisor, call to CIA station, call to NatSec advisor = hastily fabricated "Rebel shootdown incident", youtube video, destruction of tower recordings, etc. As seen in Benghazi, the Obama administration can't crisis manage for shit, but they sure can spin. LIE HARDER!

The press blitz is called "anchoring": whatever the public is first told, generally sticks. That's why a majority of Americans still believe Osama Bin Laden and 19 Magic Hijackers pulled off 9/11: because within an hour of the planes hitting towers, the public was told he was the culprit. That's the power of anchoring, and that's what CIA is counting on here.

Of course the people responsible for pushing this Dirty War in the first place will seek to leverage it to their advantage. Facts be damned, when you own the airwaves and the President. Never let a crisis go to waste, right?

Miffed Microbiologist's picture

The pathetic part is Obama couldn't even come up with a decent forgery of his birth certificate. Before you lie harder, you should at least lie well. The man is either incredibly stupid or so confidently arrogant he doesn't feel he needs to make an effort.

Miffed;-)

WhackoWarner's picture

The pathetic part is Obama couldn't even come up with a decent forgery of his birth certificate. Before you lie harder, you should at least lie well. The man is either incredibly stupid or so confidently arrogant he doesn't feel he needs to make an effort.

 

Give it up. Nobody in the world gives a flying fuck about the US obsession about the origin of their puppet. If you can't get beyond that heaven help. 

Tall Tom's picture

Nobody in the world gives a flying fuck about the US obsession about the origin of their puppet. If you can't get beyond that heaven help.

 

Well it is evidential that I am in the World. I care about it. It is evidential that others whom do care about it are also in the World.

 

Perhaps you do not care about the US Constitution. After all the President said it is just a God Damned Piece of Paper...(That was actually Bush who said that...that Mother Fucker.) The CURRENT BOZO, TELEPROMPTER IN CHIEF IS NO BETTER BUT WORSE. (And I did not believe that possible...) But many here STILL DO care about the US Constitution.. That is supposed to be the Law of the Land, after all.

 

So you are just LAWLESS. And YOU CAN GO FUCK YOURSELF. You probably are giving yourself a Blow Job as I write because you LACK A SPINE and can. 

 

Fucking yourself. What a laugh.

The_Prisoner's picture

Obama could have written his birth certificate on a napkin and the media would eat it up.

It's not the lie. It's whom wants the lie to go unquestioned.

Murdoch press in Australia is in a hate-Russia frenzy.

www.news.com.au

 

WhackoWarner's picture

You are still clinging to faded ideals IMHO and with all respect.  THIS was no accident.  This was a planned, orchestrated, pre-video'd PLOT.  Now we ask by whom?

Tall Tom's picture

The rogue Ukrianian fighter pilot that shot it down, perhaps...

 

Perhaps his commanders?

 

Perhaps the CIA?

 

The answer your question...Who benefits?

McCormick No. 9's picture

I was listening to NPR this morning- Diane Ream and shills from NYT WaPo, etc, spewing disonfo and lies about MH17. I couldn;t stand it- who can believe this wretched DIY crap? I want to punch someone's face in NYT= Not Your Truth.

icanhasbailout's picture

> I was listening to NPR

 

I see the problem.

Aussie V's picture

Yes! and isn't that a photo of the "Big Board" in the War Room?

"Sir, you can't let em in here, they'll see the big board"

Buck Turdgidson

sweaty7's picture

Antonio Banderas would be perfect for this role with speedy gonzalez a natural second choice.

MonsterBox's picture

Assaunge, Snownden.  Pick up on line two. Confirmation, please.

power steering's picture

"Well, let me finish, Dmitri. Let me finish, Dmitri. Well, listen, how do you think I feel about it? Can you imagine how I feel about it, Dmitri? Why do you think I'm calling you? Just to say hello?"

Urban Roman's picture

"You can't fight in here, this is the war room!"

worbsid's picture

Near the bottom of this article it is explained that the rebel anouncement of shooting down a plane has been fabricated.  If so, there goes the argument that the rebels were celebrating the shooting down of a military transport about the time MH 17 went down.

Paveway IV's picture

They *did* shoot down an AN-26 last week. That's where they lifted one segment of the conversation from. It's authentic. They just stitched it together with segments of an entirely different conversation that took place days later after MH-17 came down. The deception was  to give the impression that the segments were all part of one, continuous conversation after MH-17 came down.

IndyPat's picture

No shit.

As if two rebel field commanders are going to be giving each other hi- fives over non secure channels about downing a fucking commercial plane.

Right.

The Russian SAT pix of the UKE BUK system that did this could see fucking beer bottles all over the place and uniformed UKE mil assholes doing keg stands. Even inside sources at CIA confirm this, offline. Ye Gadz! UKE Neo Nazis with Surface-to-Air systems throwing keggers and dropping civilian airliners?
While my supposed gov supports the side with the hitler frat boys and wanna call out Vlad to the playground?
This is bad news folks.

Headbanger's picture

The main item that has me very doubtful it was the rebels who shot it down is that radio conversation in Russian allegedly between two rebel military men where the commander said something like "Well they are spies" upon learning it was a civilian aircraft. 

That conversation was way too "staged" to be believable as why would a commander be so quick to say it was a spy plane instead of asking if any spy cameras were found in the wreckage if that was what he was thinking?

Chupacabra-322's picture

And then there's the curiouser and curiouser story of Carlos, the Spanish air traffic controller working at Kiev's tower, who was following MH17 in real time. For some Carlos is legit - not a cipher; for others, he's never even worked in Ukraine. Anyway he tweeted like mad. His account - not accidentally - has been shut down, and he has disappeared; his friends are now desperately looking for him. I managed to read all his tweets in Spanish when the account was still online - and now copies and an English translation are available.

These are some of his crucial tweets:

"The B777 was escorted by 2 Ukrainian fighter jets minutes before disappearing from radar (5.48 pm)"
"If the Kiev authorities want to admit the truth 2 fighter jets were flying very close a few minutes before the incident but did not shoot down the airliner (5.54)"
"As soon as the Malaysia Airlines B777 disappeared the Kiev military authority informed us of the shooting down. How did they know? (6.00)"
"Everything has been recorded on radar. For those that don't believe it, it was taken down by Kiev; we know that here (in traffic control) and the military air traffic control know it too (7.14)"
"The Ministry of the Interior did know that there were fighter aircraft in the area, but the Ministry of Defense didn't. (7.15)"
"The military confirm that it was Ukraine, but it is not known where the order came from. (7.31)"

Assuming Carlos is legit, the assessment makes sense. The Ukrainian military are divided between Chocolate king President Petro Poroshenko - who would like a d?tente with Russia essentially to advance his shady business interests - and Saint Yulia Timoshenko, who's on the record advocating genocide of ethnic Russians in Eastern Ukraine. US neo-cons and US "military advisers" on the ground are proverbially hedging their bets, supporting both the Poroshenko and Timoshenko factions.

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Central_Asia/CEN-01-190714.html