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US Releases Satellite Images Allegedly Proving Russian Shelling Of East Ukraine

Tyler Durden's picture


A week after Russia revealed photos of Ukraine deploying Buk missiles in the east as well as radar proof of Ukraine warplanes in the vicinity of MH-17, the US has yet to present any of the incontrovertible evidence supposedly in its possession that proves it was the separatists who shot down the plane, a narrative which has already propagated through western media. Instead, several hours ago the US. Office of the Director of National Intelligence released satellite images taken by the private civilian company Digital Globe (and thus not government sourced), which US officials say offer proof that Russian forces have been shelling eastern Ukraine in a campaign to assist rebel groups fighting Ukraine’s government in Kiev.

The WaPo reports:

The grainy photographs, taken between Wednesday and Saturday, are labeled as indicating fire from multiple rocket launchers inside Russia and targets they have struck inside Ukraine. The Pentagon and State Department first accused Russian artillery of firing directly into Ukraine on Thursday. The charges were repeated Friday, although no evidence was offered.


The high-altitude images released Sunday “provide evidence that Russian forces have fired across the border at Ukrainian military forces, and that Russia-backed separatists have used heavy artillery, provided by Russia, in attacks on Ukrainian forces from inside Ukraine,” according to labels on the pictures by the Office of the Director of National Intelligence.


The most recent photograph, taken Saturday, shows what is described as “blast marks” from rocket launcher fire on the Russian side of the border, and “impact craters” inside Ukraine.


A photograph labeled as taken Wednesday shows a row of vehicles described as “self-propelled artillery only found in Russian military units, on the Russian side of the border, oriented in the direction of a Ukrainian military unit within Ukraine.” On the other side of the border, “the pattern of crater impacts near the Ukrainian military unit indicates strikes from artillery fired from self-propelled or towed artillery, vice multiple rocket launchers,” it said.

Time has more:

One image dated July 25/26 shows what DNI claims is “ground scarring” on the Russian side of the border from artillery aimed at Ukrainian military units in Ukraine, as well as the resultant ground craters on the Ukrainian side of the border:



A slide from a day earlier is said to show self-propelled artillery on the Russian side of the border oriented toward Ukraine, with impact areas near Ukrainian military units:


Another of the DigitalGlobe photos released by the Obama administration:

Curiously, the US State Department is urging those seeking objective data on this unfolding development to follow the US ambassador to Ukraine, Geoffrey Pyatt, the same person who was intercepted in plotting the downfall of the former Ukraine government in a leaked recorder conversation with US assistant secretary of state, Victoria Nuland, of "Fuck the EU" fame:

And from Pyatt:

Nonetheless, one does have to wonder: why would the ODNI, which shares intelligence with the NSA, have to resort to private-sector satellite imagery as proof? If there is anyone who has definitive evidence of anything happening in the world at any given moment and as seen from space, it would be the NSA.

To be sure, Russia once again promptly responded:

A Russian Defense Ministry spokesman, Maj. Gen. Igor Konashenkov, charged Sunday that the United States is getting most of its intelligence data on the Russian military from social media and suggested it turn to more “trustworthy” information, the ITAR-TASS news agency reported.


Konashenkov denied recent U.S. statements that Russia, after first decreasing the number of troops it has deployed along the Ukrainian border, has now increased them to at least 15,000. Regular international inspections under the international Open Skies Treaty, he said, “have not registered any violations or undeclared military activity on the part of Russia in the areas adjacent to the Ukrainian border.”

The bottom line is perhaps best summarized by WaPo: "As the ground war between Russia-backed separatist forces in eastern Ukraine and government troops has escalated this past week, charges and countercharges between Russia and the West have reached fever pitch."

So while the "evidence" of the downing of MH17 by separatists will at this point likely not be forthcoming with the event having taken place over a week ago (at least not from the US State Department) aside from administration assurances that it is "common sense" that the rebels fired the missile, expect the "evidentiary" campaign to refocus back on the hostilities in east Ukraine, where as has been the case from the beginning of the conflict in March, it will be merely a continuation of the "he said, she said" propaganda war waged on both sides that the whole world has by now grown accustomed to, and where it is increasingly becoming clear that just like in the Syria conflict, the underlying motive is a very simple one: gas.


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Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:01 | 5009932 goldhedge
goldhedge's picture

Send in the US Marines. Pu$$y

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:04 | 5009940 Jason T
Jason T's picture

"..Don't bother, they're heeere."

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:07 | 5009954 Stackers
Stackers's picture

Because only west Ukraine is allowed to shell east Ukraine.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:19 | 5009997 fxrxexexdxoxmx
fxrxexexdxoxmx's picture

I fully support Putins assistance to the freedom fighters in Ukraine. Any who does not support the pro-Russian freedom fighters probally thinks any group called freedom fighters is a bad thing.

President for Life Putin is the worlds greatest supporter of freedom in the world.

Go Putin, Go Putin, freedom for all free peoples on earth... as long as they have hydrocarbon delivery systems.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:35 | 5010043 booboo
booboo's picture

Retard rex is that you?

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:41 | 5010058 flacon
flacon's picture

MH17 passengers were travelling on invalidated passports...


Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:47 | 5010074 Save_America1st
Save_America1st's picture


The government is swarming with MUTANTS








Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:52 | 5010275 SafelyGraze
SafelyGraze's picture

does anyone have any proof of who has been shelling iraq and afganistan the past decade?

cnn and fox:  Get On It!

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 16:18 | 5010336 ZerOhead
ZerOhead's picture

The Ukrainian army surely is an exceptional fighting outfit.

To date the Russian have been providing the freedom fighters with any weapon systems their hearts desire, providing experienced Russian fighters to them, and have even been shelling and shooting down the Ukrainians for them. Yet still the mighty Ukrainians persist against not only the freedom fighters but entire Russian army, navy and air forces.

Simply unbelievable but obviously true since the US and the MSM told me so. They say they are going to provide some real evidence real soon...

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 16:20 | 5010349 Chupacabra-322
Chupacabra-322's picture

We're Goverened by Pure Evil Psycopaths, Sociopaths, Children & the Insane.

The Criminal Globalists are going for broke with this False Narrative, PsyOp, Propagandist, Demonization campaign.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 16:40 | 5010368 ZerOhead
Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:11 | 5010464 7.62x54r
7.62x54r's picture

And the western media ignores the fact thay the Ukrainian Army shelled Russian villages week before last. Not ethnic Russians, but villages inside the RF.

Guess what? If you shell Russia, Russia shells you.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:48 | 5010605 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

US Empire = protection racket.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 18:06 | 5010656 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

Interesting how the USSA still. cannot produce sat. photos of ML17 .

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 18:54 | 5010800 Son of Loki
Son of Loki's picture

smells fishy...too much escolar in DC.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 22:03 | 5011261 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

Had to look that up.  Pretty clever.

Mon, 07/28/2014 - 00:25 | 5011555 Pinto Currency
Pinto Currency's picture



May be Nuland disinformation / hoax:


p.s. see now that Pegasus Muse has posted same article below.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 21:34 | 5011197 SDShack
SDShack's picture

Satelite photos?... hell, I would settle for just a cellphone cam photo of the exhaust of the missle from ground to target. After all, it's only at least 33,000 feet long so it shouldn't be hard to spot. But they can't even provide that. Just check out You Tube and you will see videos showing BUK Missles generate one hell of an exhaust trail all the way to the target. Very easy to see with the naked eye so no need for fancy satelite cameras.

Mon, 07/28/2014 - 06:04 | 5011906 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

Yes, it's just ridiculous.

And the Russians once agaon show USrael, that not the whole world is on their subhuman mental level:

“Publishing charges on the US ambassador to Ukraine’s Twitter and using them as a basis to argue that Russia is firing at Ukrainian territory is ludicrous and unprofessional,” Korotchenko told RT.

“In serious cases like that, I would recommend for the US to look into briefings, such as the recent briefing by Russia’s Defense Ministry. In it, everything was clear: satellite images were presented, they were decoded, and the pictures were as detailed as possible; everyone could make out the details,” he said.

“In addition to satellite imagery data, the satellite control and electronic intelligence were attached. There were also maps, plans, and diagrams included. On the US ambassador’s Twitter you cannot make anything out, even with a magnifying glass.”

“This is not serious at all, it is low-skilled work,” he added. “What was published by the US ambassador is part of an information campaign to force European countries to agree on anti-Russian sanctions.”

Mon, 07/28/2014 - 07:44 | 5011997 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

US Empire = Biggest seller of "accident" insurance.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 19:27 | 5010876 Budd aka Sidewinder
Budd aka Sidewinder's picture

And the western media ignores the fact thay the Ukrainian Army shelled Russian villages week before last. Not ethnic Russians, but villages inside the RF.

Guess what? If you shell Russia, Russia shells you.


No No No....only Israel can act in 'self defense'

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 19:33 | 5010890 Pegasus Muse
Pegasus Muse's picture

Paul Craig Roberts

Another State Department Hoax?  

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 22:00 | 5011259 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

That seems fairly reasonable there ak.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 21:59 | 5011257 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

I have a hard time having a hard time with a lot of those statements.  If NATO is to be a real alliance then yes, everyone needs to pull their own weight. 

What is done with the resulting forces is not my point.  A defensive alliance should remain defensive, not imperial.  That the US should avoid encumbering alliances is not my point.  It should but doesn't so here we are.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 21:54 | 5011243 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

If you read some sites that proclaim to be pro-Russian you would find articles claiming great victories by the rebels and Ukrainian forces have been utterly decimated to the point that commanding generals are asking to pull back and regroup else their units will cease to exist in less than a week.

Who really knows? 

Mon, 07/28/2014 - 08:49 | 5012148 roadhazard
roadhazard's picture

"the whole Russian Army"...

I always knew the Russians were a bunch of punk paper tigers.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:24 | 5010514 FreeSlave
FreeSlave's picture

here is a Geoffrey Pyatt talking about falls flags: is that what he is doing in Ukraina???

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 23:50 | 5011510 Antifaschistische
Antifaschistische's picture

I, for one, am just glad that a US Made Tomahawk Missle has never been fired from any US Naval Vesel at any other country.  

That's what gives POTUS the moral authority to condemn Putin for any action he may take in the Ukraine.

okay...well, except for these.

out of respect for ZH'ers...I cut the list off.  The complete list is here.


Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:58 | 5010643 johansen
johansen's picture

MH17 is MH370.


that's why the passports are fake, and the bodies aren't fresh.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:47 | 5010260 FreeSlave
FreeSlave's picture

Ukrainian military bombarded civilians in one of rebel cities. Does MSM say something about this!? Warning! Some graphic pictures:

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 18:52 | 5010793 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Those people were dead before they were in that nice grassy field.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 18:45 | 5010771 williambanzai7
williambanzai7's picture

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 19:55 | 5010948 knukles
knukles's picture

Oh, very, very good, Willaim.
One of your absolute best.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:23 | 5010008 Buck Johnson
Buck Johnson's picture

Yet they are using a private company to show low end pics of evidence, but yet won't use the NSA or govt. satellites that are 100 times better.  The problem is that if they used those, then people would say that you should have HD pics and vids of the area around where the plane was shotdown and they know that they Russians or seperatists didn't shoot that plane.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:37 | 5010053 Manthong
Manthong's picture

This is garbage.

On a clear day they can read license plates with spy satellites.

I can see the new 4 foot tall evergreens in my yard and my Mexicans with the mower on a one year old Google Earth snapshot.

There is no there there

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:54 | 5010096 Lumberjack
Lumberjack's picture

Google earth does have satellite imagery but as you zoom in, it utilizes ariel photography (photogrammetry) of the area. There are small planes that fly in grids taking photo's of the area usually used for planning, surveying, agriculture etc.. That is why you can see the small trees and other objects on your property. 

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:11 | 5010140 zhandax
zhandax's picture

The ROTC instructor in college in the late 70's told us we had satellites that could read the label on a golf ball.  I would imagine they have improved in the last 30 years.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 18:26 | 5010719 knukles
knukles's picture

Was it a Titelist #3 NXT TourS with a red line under the brand name?  Been lookin' for that since 1973.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 22:12 | 5011283 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

Word is someone in DC has found it and has been using it regularly for some time now.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:14 | 5010145 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Trust me, the US government does indeed have much better imagery than this.  They do not want to publicize just how good it is.  This practice goes back a long time...

I would not release any of our better satellite imagery either.  "Sources and Methods"  "Need to Know"

Why let our rivals know what our capabilities are?

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:21 | 5010170 Lumberjack
Lumberjack's picture

Even with the hubble telescope, which is a very large object, I cannot believe that anyone can read the writing on a golf ball let alone a license plate from orbit. Heat distortion and other issues would make it impossible IMHO. I don't think they can do much better then what they show. 

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:35 | 5010218 bbq on whitehou...
bbq on whitehouse lawn's picture

Fractal agorithems. Yes, distortion is a known and like all knowns you have models for them. So its a computer interpretation of the image not the image itself. Still close enough to be scary.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 18:34 | 5010737 knukles
knukles's picture

Do you guys know the story behind the Hubble?  NASA wanted a telescope that fit all these specs, sent out RFP's and got several replies back for a bazillion dollars from each recipient.  As time goes on, they decide that they need certain gyro-stabilization greater than they thought, different more powerful solar panels, etc., etc., etc.  So winds up that the NASA guys are touring one of the manufacturer's facilities and they walk into a room with what happens to be a surplus out of date spy satellite.   Just hanging from a crane.   The manufacturer guy says "Lookie here!"  The NASA guys say: "Golly gosh by jiggums."  NSA says OK give it to em', but only if it points out, not in.

And therein was the bazillion dollar cost for the Hubble.  Already paid for by NSA and re-billed to NASA.

It's a public story, BTW, but not well known.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 20:34 | 5011056 Manthong
Manthong's picture

..and with a billion dollar bum mirror.

Mon, 07/28/2014 - 04:00 | 5011775 AmericanFUPAcabra
AmericanFUPAcabra's picture

Ball Aerospace made a good chunk of change fixing that little mistake.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 19:12 | 5010850 Lumberjack
Lumberjack's picture

"So its a computer interpretation of the image".... Key word 'interpretation',


Thanks for making my point. 

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 19:38 | 5010903 Duffy Duck
Duffy Duck's picture

Yes.  It's a bit like what the brain does with your vision - filling in the literal hole in your vision necessitated by the optic tract to the occipital lobe, controlling for the constant movement of the eye... and as you get older, 'correcting' a fuzzier image. 

Not sure about a golf ball because the distortion is partly chaotic... but in any event, for sure, .gov knows or should know and have evidence of who shot the plane down, and for sure they'd release this info, showing capabilities be damned {you just claim its from an old sat or something, who cares} if it were Ivan.

Still seems possible to me it was the rebels, tricked into firing on it by Kiev or CIA, but it also could simply have been Kiev or CIA mercs figuring they could easily control the story.  Look at Assad and the chemical attacks, or "wipe Israel off the map" or the IDF airstrikes that *started* the recent rocket fire, or Iran's nuclear program - which is in fact civilian, and on and on.

It doesn't matterif 10 or 15% of the population know the truth or suspect the official tale is false.  What matters is the MSM presents a compelling, coherent picture, and repeats it over and over with - truly - brainwashing/cognitive infiltration techniques at least for the biggest audience programs...

It's all but certain the Syrian foreign mercenaries used chemical weapons.  They were certainly targeting Christians and other minorities and committing atrocities early on.  Few know it... Assad, no angel, is blamed not only for his, at this point, mostly defensive violence, but for all the violence of Saudi and Turk and CIA backed foreign jihadis, and his re-election is dismissed out of hand.


Point is - information control isn't complete, but it doesn't have to be, it is incredibly effective.  This gives false flag ops a frightening amount of wiggle room.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:42 | 5010244 Maxter
Maxter's picture

Interesting comment for two reasons:


-I heard the hubble telescope was pretty much a by product of spy satellite at the time, wich mean they already had spy satellite bigger then hubble looking down at earth in the 90's.

-Ground telescopes use a technic called adaptive optic to get rid of the distortion of the atmosphere. (which involve deforming the mirror in real time to compensate for the distortion) That makes it a non-issue.


So yea I think they can do a lot more better then what they show.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:51 | 5010268 COSMOS
COSMOS's picture

How do we know these are not archive pictures from past military exercises, or these could be Grad rockets fired from inside ukraine at the freedom fighters.  Its a bunch of BS, lol I love it how the blast marks are oriented as if to imply missiles were fired from east to west.  What a bunch of BULL.

Phuck your evidence state dept.  They should call you the Stasi dept.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:39 | 5010573 HamFistedIdiot
HamFistedIdiot's picture

We need to keep our eye on the ball here. The US is trying to change subjects. Where is the satellite footage of rebels hitting MH17? That is what the original concern was. With another lie here, it would appear the US is just trying to find an excuse to go to war and claim the moral high ground. The world needs to stop listening to the US. The US has sold its ethics to purchase short term support of the petro dollar. In any event, good on the east Ukrainians for fighting back, if the photo is even legit. This area is Russia's backyard, not the US's. We have no business weighing in on anything there.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 18:03 | 5010648 Lore
Lore's picture

Those little dots and dashes might contain a secret message, as in Morse Code.  Do we have any vets here with knowledge of international Morse Code?  Is there any message in recent Crop Circles that would finally provide the proof America needs? 

I Want To Believe

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 22:19 | 5011299 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

Instead of denial it is better to show counter proof.  If counter proof is not available then say "so what?"  So what if Russia is helping them?  Heck, someone could claim that the attacks on civil populations has been a false flag by Russia.  Who do we believe?  If we weren't sticking our noses in there and stirring the pot it wouldn't matter.  That is the real crux in my mind.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 20:04 | 5010982 CrabNuggetOne
CrabNuggetOne's picture


Sun, 07/27/2014 - 18:02 | 5010651 johansen
johansen's picture

the mirrors are stretched and pushed and pulled by hundreds of pezeo electric actuators to counter act the atmosphere's distortion.


this technology was developed in the 70's by the nsa/cia/spy sat folks because there is a limit to how big you can get a mirror in space.

the ground based telescopes which are 10 meters in diameter or bigger all use this technology, and its now possible to get better imaging from the ground than it is with the "hubble space telescope" even with similarly sized mirrors.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 16:15 | 5010339 Dublinmick
Dublinmick's picture

Of course not, once US capability is leaked to Isreal, the rest of the world goes and buys it from them.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:48 | 5010611 Jerk_Store
Jerk_Store's picture

Trust me, the US government does indeed have much better imagery than this.  They do not want to publicize just how good it is.  This practice goes back a long time...

I learned a long time ago what to do whan a man starts a sentence off with "trust me"

As if anyone that matters doesn't already know what what their satellite capabilities are..

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 18:32 | 5010733 COSMOS
COSMOS's picture

Those satellites could sure do a good job policing our borders.  Pfuck you state dept.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 19:03 | 5010828 Sirius Wonderblast
Sirius Wonderblast's picture

They do know.

Mon, 07/28/2014 - 08:53 | 5012158 roadhazard
roadhazard's picture

Thank you. The obvious apparently eludes most ZH posters. Or the hate of the West always get the better of them and makes therm look stupid.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:01 | 5010116 TeamDepends
TeamDepends's picture

You actually own these Mexicans or they are leased?  And were you forced to hire them under threat of the new Open Border Forced Labor Act ("Every Non-white A Job Because Obama!")?

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:46 | 5010258 Manthong
Manthong's picture

It's the yard service company's problem.

If they are not legal then ICE can just round them up and then release them to go back to work somewhere like they always do.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:06 | 5010457 TeamDepends
TeamDepends's picture

You said "my Mexicans", couldn't resist.  While we're on the subject, have you seen Joel Gilbert's film There's No Place Like Utopia?  Probably not, unless you live in Denver but it is going nation-wide soon and you can buy it on Amazon.  Folks, this is a slam-dunk, home-run, knock-out, five star tour-de-force!  Without being mean-spirited or snarky, Mr. Gilbert completely destroys the plague which is devouring this country known as "progressivism", otherwise known as communism.  He goes to a Home Depot in L.A. and asks the "day laborers", who are all from Central America, "why did you come here (in perfect spanish by the way- he also goes to Dearborn and speaks to the mooslims in arabic)?  Their answer:  "We are fleeing socialism."  Repeat:  "WE ARE FLEEING SOCIALISM."  If you have any progressive friends left, make them watch this movie.  Trick them if you have to- think of it as an intervention.  If they leave the theatre unchanged, there is no hope for them.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:43 | 5010589 Manthong
Manthong's picture

Well, slavery is all the rage nowadays.

Ask any of your overseers in .gov or in the banking racket.  :-)

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:10 | 5010136 ThirteenthFloor
ThirteenthFloor's picture


US Alphabet soups have a lot of experience cut, copy and pasting photos going back the famous Lee Harvey Oswald picts. (Life Cvr and Atgens 6), oh yes Iraq troop deployment in 1990.  But they are obviously still hacks since the quality is garbage to the real stuff.

What is amazing after what 50 years of lying....some people still believes a single picture from these con-artists.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:32 | 5010211 Coke and Hookers
Coke and Hookers's picture

I wonder if the US State Department has any satellite photos of the Blackwater mercenaries they sent to Ukraine.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 16:39 | 5010390 Chupacabra-322
Chupacabra-322's picture

Plenty. HD Video too I bet. These Sick Scum Fucks enjoy watching themselves at work. Remember those War Crime CIA Torture tapes that were destroyed during the onset of the Illegal Criminal Iraq War?

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 16:17 | 5010344 Dublinmick
Dublinmick's picture

Are you saying the moon landing was filmed in the California desert because there were no shadows?

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:13 | 5010477 deflator
deflator's picture

 Some areas of the badlands of South Dakota are eerily similar to what you would expect a moonscape to look like.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:36 | 5010228 ThirteenthFloor
ThirteenthFloor's picture

Note: This is the same Wash Po that printed "CIA changes data in order to support Bush invasion of Iraq 2002".  You would think they might consider that.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 18:26 | 5010718 Last of the Mid...
Last of the Middle Class's picture

saw my neighbor's bush. wel actually landing strip love google maps

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:40 | 5010059 Lumberjack
Lumberjack's picture

I noticed crop circles next to them... right by the Siberian Sasquatch waving at the satellites.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:27 | 5010199 ThirteenthFloor
ThirteenthFloor's picture

Three points

> Private companies gives somebody to be fall guy if evidence appears that is contradictory.

> And finally our gov. believes "you can't handle the truth" as a way to PREVENT us from seeing the real truth.

> Change the dialog, to avoid a real discussion about the Ukraine guys shooting down MH17.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 16:30 | 5010370 SyriaL Stowlker
SyriaL Stowlker's picture

On a different but related note , can anyone tell me how I can get a sattelite picture of a certain property in terrorist controlled territory in Syria ? Googles maps most recent one is like over a year old , and I'd like a recent image to know it's status because I heard .gov forces been shelling the area and knowing this propert has been used by terrists as a hideout .

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:31 | 5010034 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

From where? The US already has 62 official battlefronts where they're stationed. Now 63?

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:16 | 5010151 ThirteenthFloor
ThirteenthFloor's picture

Only facsist governments like US can have double standards.  Only the US/UK partnership is allowed to assist rebel groups.  I think it is safe to double the US battlefronts if you include Langley based Mercenaries.

Even a dummy looking at this stuff can see the lies, double standards, and con that is happening here.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:37 | 5010568 putaipan
putaipan's picture

it's about the kdnappers

it's about the rockets

it's about the tunnels

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:36 | 5010051 Duffy
Duffy's picture

Yes, because what happens in Eastern Ukraine is of vital strategic importance to the United States.  That's why when we foment a coup and hand-pick the leader of a country on the other side of the planet, it's for "freedom" but when Moscow gives Russian separatists the means to defend themselves from Kiev and, no doubt, American mercs, it's unconscionable meddling.




Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:41 | 5010584 Sedaeng
Sedaeng's picture

IF I was still utilizing social media, which I have not for several years since my "awakening", I would of re-posted your comments.  Spot on!

By the way, are you hoping for an Independent Scotland?

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 19:42 | 5010910 BKbroiler
BKbroiler's picture

bullshit. pretty words.  The Ukrainians want freedom (ie: consumerism and debt slavery) just like we do and are entitled to it.  They don't want the russian system.  Russia has nothing any backwards middle eastern country doesn't have.  Ever bought a Russian car? watch? toaster? stereo? ever see a good russian movie, or any other commonly used export except vodka? no.  russia is old, russia is backwards. it was never a world power, it was never a 1st world country.  this is all nonsense and you are all idiots for believing this man is strong.  Putin has ruined his resurgent country with his idiocy.  He just didn't know when to stop.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 20:23 | 5011039 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

useless talkings


Sun, 07/27/2014 - 20:32 | 5011052 cockroachfuture
cockroachfuture's picture

entitled to it with my tax dollars? fuck off. Im entitled to plenty of freedoms i dont have thanks to emotional fucks like you. For fucks sake, if you think they are so entitled to be free of the russian system buy a cheap ak and go lend a hand.

Also, what the fuck are you on about toasters and shit? Half the shit you named comes from fucking china. And have you driven american cars in the last few decades?

probably fed the troll, but it felt right.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:20 | 5010161 junction
junction's picture

According to the website below, Israel has a grudge against Malaysia for promoting the view that Israel is guilty of war crimes in the West Bank and Gaza.  Among other things.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 18:26 | 5010715 Jam
Jam's picture

There goes my plans to sell "I love Malaysia" tee shirts in the Lower East Side.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:12 | 5010475 kchrisc
kchrisc's picture

Send the TSA.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 19:10 | 5010846 lovemesomeZH
lovemesomeZH's picture

Breaking: Russian Satellite Imagery on MH17
Sun, 07/27/2014 - 21:33 | 5011194 One World Mafia
One World Mafia's picture

Send them to Saudi Arabia where the gov really sucks.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:01 | 5009935 kurzdump
kurzdump's picture

I couldnt care less

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 16:48 | 5010408 1stepcloser
Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:02 | 5009936 q99x2
q99x2's picture

Give those photoshoped images to Bonzai7 and see what he can do with them.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:09 | 5009966 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Purely for internal US consumption.

The RoW would not beieve America iif they said the sky was blue at this point.

Lying scum, is the most polite I've heard.

The state dept., may as well be holding their press conferences in Kiev. with

Poroshenko as the spokesperson.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:01 | 5010111 JR
JR's picture

Not only are questionable charges coming from western governments, but they are involved in massive censorship of the social media.

This is what true censorship looks like. And on the Internet, France and the US lead the way.

French news publications are clients of an “online moderation company” which censors what users see of the news. These paragraphs from ynetnews today tell the story:

"As soon as you talk about Israel, it crystallizes all passions, with up to 20,000 or 30,000 comments sometimes after an article, of which we will only let 5% to 10% through," explained David Corchia, head of an online moderation company of which both Le Figaro and Liberation (French news publications) are clients. 

Corchia says that as an online moderator, generally 25% to 40% of comments are banned. Moderators are assigned with the task of filtering comments in accordance with France's legal system, including those that are racist, anti-Semitic or discriminatory.

Regarding the war between the Israelis and Hamas, however, Corchia notes that some 95% of online comments made by French users are removed.,7340,L-4549369,00.html

Notice that one of the French censorship criteria is "anti-Semitism," which of course is interpreted as anything anti-Israel. The dilemma here for finding truth is that Zionist forces not only control most of western mass media and western governments, but they now are in charge of censorship of individual comment on the social media that they control (thus the Orwellian term "moderator").

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 16:24 | 5010358 Abitdodgie
Abitdodgie's picture

Save Gaza ,shoot a Jew . Just joking some of my best friends are Jewish we have lots of fun together playing video games like "World of bomb Gaza" . 

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 16:45 | 5010405 Omen IV
Omen IV's picture

Same experience with NYT - multiple examples I have experienced

This is a serious game now if they are that scared of the public

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 19:12 | 5010849 JR
JR's picture

Exactly. First they censor responses from the public. And, then, they do a public poll to let you know how the public feels.  It reminds one of the television news programs that used to have the on-air announcer, say Dan Rather, explaining what someone was saying while you saw the film in the background of the person speaking without being allowed to hear what he was saying.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 19:57 | 5010958 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

I have been heavily censored by the Daily Mail Online. One comment got through, and then I was black balled. My comment pointed to Britain's criminal acts in Iraq. It slipped though the filter, but never again. I commented a few weeks ago on simple Royal Family stuff, I was not negative or attacking, just a harmless comment. Never made it through. They are ruthless once you burn them with a political point that hurts the Murdock liars.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:43 | 5010251 ThirteenthFloor
ThirteenthFloor's picture

"Tonkin Gulf Syndrome." First you fabricate a lie about an incident or its authorship to justify military action; then you quickly escalate hostilities; and war is irreversibly underway before anyone has time to think twice about it.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:03 | 5010450 daedon
daedon's picture

It would be good to do like Paul Craig Roberts and always use the word "Washington" instead of "America", two very distinctive groups.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:23 | 5010516 kchrisc
kchrisc's picture

So correct.

The American people and the land they inhabit is the country of America.

The criminal occupiers and oppressors of the American country is the DC US, "Washington."

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:41 | 5010581 tvdog
tvdog's picture

The reason Paul Craig Roberts is still alive is that he says "Washington" rather than giving the names of the individuals involved.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:03 | 5009939 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

Open letter to Tyler

Why aren't you focussing more on the petrodollar ?The fact is that this crisis in Ukraine simply exists because the US sees Russia as a direct threat to petrodollar hegemony. It's as simple as that. Rosneft is the biggest oil company in the world. This is a fight for the petrodollar. This is also why Europe doesn't really care. They don't have the petrodollar to lose.



Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:05 | 5009944 Statetheist
Statetheist's picture

It's covered here all the time. Try paying more attention. Thanks.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:35 | 5010044 earleflorida
earleflorida's picture

take no prisoners Ty...

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:38 | 5010055 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

The ground war in Ukraine should be referred to as the petrodollar war.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:18 | 5010138 logicalman
logicalman's picture

All wars are BANKSTER'S wars.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 18:37 | 5010746 earleflorida
earleflorida's picture

the 'suez crisis of 1956', was a funky kind of war. britain and france, the imperialist colonizers were no moar. egypt's nasser, was playing the nationalist card while juggling communism (in 1956 nasser establishes diplomatic relations with communist chhina] and capitalism at the same [but, preferred nationalism?] tyme. he was playing with fire.

 lebanon was a hot bed, and syria had just united with egypt in the 'united arab republic [uar]'. jordan, was 60% occupied by palestian refugees and anti-imperialist. they had no resources and relied on eqypt, syria, and saudi arabia for financial and economic aid.

the ussa brainchild of dulles comes up with 'cento [northern tier]' to prevent ussr from expanding which included iraq, iran, pakistan , and the wild turkey?

but, where was all this going now that britain was officially the lap dog of the united states. france had given up the sykes-picot after wwii and moved further into n. africa [algeria/ libya?] eqypt had gotten its independence from the british. all but for the suez canal which was the british crown jewel since the uk/ pm disareli in 1869 bought a 50%+/+ ? interest with rothschild's money was left!?!

nasser nationalizes the canal cutting off israel's economy. it was likely no big deal for israel was banned from transporting via the canal from day one! but, the british were israel's bloodline, period! without the canal, the french and english were fucked, having to go around the whole of africa. france was in good position with libya and algeria. the brirtish trade with india was worth going to war for!

the french and british decided to attack egypt using israel as a lynchpin? in 1956 the british and french and israelites invade egypt and show a resounding defeat of nasser up to gaza/ sinai and crossing over egypts border from port said via the strait of tiran at the entrance to the gulf of aqaba [nasser wasn't preparing for a surprise attack, nor was he planning an attack himself!] and was caught bare-ass!

needless to say this was all about commerce and oil, the lifeblood of a european squalid existence brought on by the ravages of wwii! the european's depended solely on america for their future!

remember that eisenhower doctrine tethered to the truman doctrine which was plagarized all by the monroe doctrine via the atlantist, now incorporated into the four seas? well, it turned out to backfire on the ussa. the united nations and the security council were overwhelmed by the entire world condemnation of such a brazen attack of war [gunboat diplomacy was now past-tense!]. the ussa and russia had to bite the bullet in what was a 'vindictive resolution' both condemning france, england, and israel for a blatant act of war! the lebanese called the eisenhower doctrine a 'pos' of ussa propaganda! it was just as everybody knew?

the ussa was to replace the old colonialist with a new colonialist imperialist empire! what had happened to france and the british was a humiliating event on the world stage being admonished by both the ussa/ ussr together? note, that there was an election year, and as always tempers flared on both sides of the isle.

so as in todays war with palestine and israel [july/2014] presently,... as it was in 1956, the israeliites had won the battle but lost the war!?! and, not to forget the rhyming pasteurs... it is also today, as it was yester`year [1956], 'the psychological ramifications of a genocidal 'blitzkrieg', by god's chosen david in disguise... Bibi`de`NET'... that nasser actually snatched a moar telling political victory from a military defeat! strange how geo-politics work in a, 'black and blue gold`rush'??? 

england and france were bitter for years against the ussa foreign policy, but as always, in todays ussa mighty-mite ventures,... the limey's and frog's go all END, licking uncle sam's balls!!! until?

ps. the only hope for a peace in ukraine is the german's siding with russia. for... if not, the geography surely isn't in the ussa favor with three world [~3billion people is an alful lot of consumers] powers seeing their day in the sun arising fast! that be india, china, and russia with grandmaster Vlad at the helm!!! note, russia never worried about me oil for they have plenty and the future is 'blue gold' as pepe escobar so eloquently states at   

thankyou Tyler

Petro$$$'s have been around since the late 40's ~ 3 scores and 5 years and the FRBs is a Jewish Holding Co. with CEO's as is the BIS and the USSA is a subsidary of AIPAC (-: it's when china open's for business under the BIS instructions that were all fucked! (is chiang kai-shek's 'roc' usurping china's 'prc's 'Black`hand'?  curious minds want to know...

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:08 | 5009960 Tyler Durden
Tyler Durden's picture

Respectfully, perhaps you are writing open letters to a wrong "Tyler"?

Guest Post: From PetroDollar To PetroYuan – The Coming Proxy Wars

This is the famous petrodollar in action. It is also a major reason the dollar is still the world’s ... expense of the Petrodollar. For some years now China has been making the Yuan a settlement currency. ... those that talk about RMB being useful are talking shit. * Live from Ukraine(tm). As to the ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 01/31/2014 - 20:59 - 113 comments - 0 attachments

Petrodollar Alert: Putin Prepares To Announce "Holy Grail" Gas Deal With China

Ukraine, and how to halt Russian expansion through appeasement (hardly a winning tactic as events in the ... on natgas exports to Germany and Europe (the imminent surge in Ukraine gas prices by 40% is probably ... Black Sea peninsula from Ukraine would be counter-productive.   The underlying message from the ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 03/21/2014 - 09:41 - 710 comments - 0 attachments

US Threatens Russia Over Petrodollar-Busting Deal

Petrodollar *U.S. HAS WARNED RUSSIA, IRAN AGAINST POSSIBLE OIL BARTER DEAL *U.S. SAYS ANY ... Petrodollar.   ...   " If Washington can't stop this deal, it could serve as a signal to other ... ," And here is Voice of Russia, " Russia prepares to attack the Petrodollar " : ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 04/05/2014 - 14:27 - 769 comments - 0 attachments

Checkers Versus Chess

the petrodollar system that has virtually guaranteed the US the position of having its currency be the ... sundry. It would take some time before the chickens would come home to roost. Enter the Petrodollar ... " petrodollar " was assured. Returning to the present, we have stated for some time ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 06/23/2014 - 20:55 - 116 comments - 0 attachments

Guest Post: Would America Go To War With Russia?

Obama has ruled out a “ military excursion ” in Ukraine. America is not obligated legally to take ... invasion of Ukraine to restore the ousted, pro-Moscow government of Viktor Yanukovych, currently under U.S. sanctions. And we would not even send troops if Ukraine was partitioned, or absorbed by Russia. ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 03/23/2014 - 11:21 - 308 comments - 0 attachments

Russia And China Finally Sign Historic $400 Billion "Holy Grail" Gas Deal

was ten years in the making and was never certain, until the Ukraine crisis.  And yes, this was ... Because while the west is focused on day to day developments in Ukraine, and how to halt Russian expansion ... (the imminent surge in Ukraine gas prices by 40% is probably the best indication of what the outcome ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 05/21/2014 - 10:47 - 340 comments - 0 attachments

Ukraine: A Deep State Analysis

Submitted by Charles Hugh Smith from Of Two Minds Ukraine: A Deep State ... insight into the situation in Ukraine to conclude that no one narrative illuminates all the dynamics. ... agenda in Ukraine: energy . Nations with a strategic "vital interest" in the region's energy mix include ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 02/27/2014 - 19:48 - 134 comments - 0 attachments

The Decline Of Influence

taking place today are not the result of warring factions. The people of Iran, Ukraine, Israel, ... In Ukraine, the conflict between nationalists and separatists sympathetic to Russia is an immediate ... nothing will surprise you in our present days, if you dare to think! When the PetroDollar dies, ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 07/23/2014 - 17:50 - 57 comments - 0 attachments

It's On: Gazprom Prepares "Symbolic" Bond Issue In Chinese Yuan

population inside Ukraine and make them the first casualties of the petro-dollar war.  "We're not funding ... Curious what the fate of the petrodollar is? Look no farther than this Interfax update blasted ... Petrodollar Alert: Putin Prepares To Announce "Holy Grail" Gas Deal With China Russia And China About ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 04/10/2014 - 18:03 - 316 comments - 0 attachments

Energy Markets Are On The Brink Of Crisis

within energy markets is the undeniable threat that the U.S. dollar may soon lose its petrodollar status ... oil will continue to climb. The petrodollar has always been seen as invincible — a common ... gas pipelines to Ukraine, and now, some analysts fear this strategy may extend to the EU , in which ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 06/19/2014 - 20:59 - 127 comments - 0 attachments

BRICS Plan To Become "Political Alliance" To Reform The International Financial System

more USSR had many more millions-around the same as US till 1990- but Russia lost the Ukraine ... flames in Iraq and Ukraine/Syria type games; the stuff that "divide and ruin" strategies are made off.  ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 07/19/2014 - 23:07 - 300 comments - 0 attachments

White House Readies Unilateral Sanctions On Russia As US Utilities Scramble For Russian Coal

considering imposing unilateral sanctions on Russia over its threatening moves in Ukraine - a move reflecting ... sanctions on Russia over its threatening moves in Ukraine, a shift in strategy that reflects the Obama ... Senate hearing on Ukraine with administration officials last week.   ...   Heather ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 07/16/2014 - 09:09 - 196 comments - 0 attachments

Russia Holds "De-Dollarization Meeting": China, Iran Willing To Drop USD From Bilateral Trade

influence) of the US dollar ever since the onset of the Ukraine crisis (and before) is no secret: this has ... Yuan ; Petrodollar Alert: Putin Prepares To Announce "Holy Grail" Gas Deal With China ; Russia ... Reserve Currency; From the Petrodollar to the Gas-o-yuan and so on). But until now much of this ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 05/14/2014 - 10:47 - 579 comments - 0 attachments

Putin Advisor Proposes "Anti-Dollar Alliance" To Halt US Aggression Abroad

dependent on the petrodollar. A nuking of the Ukraine is definitely within the realm of possibilities. ... It has been a while since both Ukraine, and the ongoing Russian response to western sanctions ... just why the western media dropped Ukraine coverage like a hot potato, especially since the civil war ...

"This Is A Trend": Increasingly More Russian Companies Set To Drop Dollar, Switch To Chinese Yuan

policy in Ukraine, which has merely succeeded in pushing Russia that much closer, and faster, to China. ... toward Ukraine setting off new sanctions, and being "forced" to de-dollarize that extra bit more. Rinse, ... until hyperinflation hits ? The petrodollar meets it end. The petrodollar meets it end. We ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 06/09/2014 - 07:52 - 178 comments - 0 attachments

Europe Folds As Putin Tells It To Pay Ukraine's Gazprom Bill, Or Else

countries)-7 like a fiddle. The latest: Europe should provide aid to Ukraine to ensure uninterrupted ... "Russia is the only country helping Ukraine’s economy with energy supplies that are not paid for,"   ... DEPENDS ON UKRAINE: IFX Or, as we explained yesterday, Russia is quite happy to keep the EU gas ...

Story - Tyler Durden - 04/11/2014 - 10:03 - 474 comments - 0 attachments

* * * * * *

And so on.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:15 | 5009978 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

Petrodollar is a real word recognized even by spellcheck on this piece of garbage iPhone I'm on. I'm just saying this term should be used more often. Petrodollar hegemony is also a legit term that impartial people can learn about. I see petrodollar scattered about but I'm just sayin. These are my only concerns.



Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:22 | 5010002 denverdolomte
denverdolomte's picture

There is this amazing new website I hear they have untold amounts of information about any topic you wish to read and stay interested about. Maybe they have a million or more articles on the petrodollar dating back even possibly to the 70's.




Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:31 | 5010021 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

With all due respect, the ground war in Ukraine , the actual ground war, should be referred to as the petrodollar war. That puts it into perspective. I refer a lot of people to this site for coverage and they aren't fully making the connection.

Respectfully, piss up a rope.


Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:37 | 5010050 Aussie V
Sun, 07/27/2014 - 18:45 | 5010776 COSMOS
COSMOS's picture

Evil witch Nuland with the crooked nose making money for her kind.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:38 | 5010054 TahoeBilly2012
TahoeBilly2012's picture

Taking it further, what would causing a war in Ukraine actually do for the petro dollar? I suppose one outcome would be shut off Russian gas and replace with US gas, but the OTHER potential hopeful outcome would be cause instability and the eventual replacement of Putin with a Zionist leader in Russia, making the One World Order and single currency that much closer.

So what do they really want, our peace loving leaders? I think they want an uprising in Russia with some "progressive" leadership to step in i.e Pussy riot.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:41 | 5010064 blabam
blabam's picture

Bad for Euro... GOOD for dollar.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:43 | 5010068 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

They are trying to keep Rosneft and Gazprom out of Ukraine. And they are trying to create this USSR boogeyman out of Russia to try and quash Russian influence and deals.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:02 | 5010117 PontifexMaximus
PontifexMaximus's picture

....shut off Russian gas and replace it with US shale gas, spot on !

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 18:01 | 5010338 cowdiddly
cowdiddly's picture

Yea and that defensive "moat" they are building at a feverish pace of 2KM per day around Lithuainia would never be for a new pipeline of Bidens son.  Nah, Never.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:08 | 5010460 Omen IV
Omen IV's picture

Yhoo - Clueless!!!

The USA wants the seven time zones of Undeveloped Resources worth $100 Trillion!

Once they secure the border it will be endless false flags until they go in after nuclear strike

Phony War reparations in the trillions will get the property for FREE

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:53 | 5010090 denverdolomte
denverdolomte's picture

Pissing up a rope is difficult and I don't have time to learn a new talent today.


As "the" Petrodollar War? What caused the Petrodollar? What happened when the Petrodollar was created here in the states? What happened to the rest of the world, in particular oil producing countries?


If this horribile conflict is the only thing you believe is the war, you should study deeper in to centralized banking and planning, then you will find your true war....because it's much much much larger than Ukraine. 




Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:01 | 5010112 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

It is not me that has to do more studying.

The petrodollar deal was done right after the US defaulted on it's gold obligations.

The true war is the fight for the petrodollar by the US. And it is being fought in Ukraine.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:20 | 5010169 denverdolomte
denverdolomte's picture

Do your maps not show any other countries beyond the EU? Or are you completely blind to the US's geopolitical actions?


Just read that entire article, come back and explain to us logically how Ukraine is "THE" Petrodollar War. All of us ZH'ers eagerly await your in-depth analysis. 

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:35 | 5010216 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Ukraine is merely the current battle in that petrodollar war.

A fact that Putin well recognises.He will not be sucked into winning a battle,

to lose the war. If the federalist can hang on, winter is coming.

The NATO excerciss planned for September in Ukraine is going to be a major flashpoint,

and a very deliberate provocation by the west.

If Ukraine starts WWIII, its going to be then IMO.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:38 | 5010238 denverdolomte
denverdolomte's picture

Thank you well said. 


Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:34 | 5010217 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

My MAIN point IS, that the US can and ALWAYS will hide under the guise of Islamic terror successfully in those areas. They do not have that luxury against Russia. This is why the Ukraine/Russia war should be named the petrodollar war.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:53 | 5010278 COSMOS
COSMOS's picture

My little kid can do a better copy and paste job than that pic with pictures of grad rockets fired by the Ukes at the freedom fighters lol and call it the opposite thing.  I doubt its real, if it is then its a good thing.  Gotta stop the USA sponsored state terrorists from killing innocent civilians who dont want to be IMF slaves and take the dollar.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:21 | 5010173 piratepiet
piratepiet's picture

Hey Spitzer,

I am quite ignorant in these matters.  Is Russia currently accepting euros as payments for it's gas and oil ? I suppose it has been for a while.  So how would this situation all of a sudden present a threat to the petrodollar ?  ( the petrodollar is under threat on many other fronts though ).   

I think you could be right that energy is a factor in this conflict.  However, consider this : There is a completely different energy revolution taking place : solar and wind. To the point that in the Netherlands for instance many gas powered electricity plants are expected to have difficulties to remain competitive.  

Could it be that Russia fears dwindling exports and thus a downward pressure on energy prices and thus a relative weakening of it's position vis a vis the EU and is more desperate than ever to maintain Ukraine as a buffer state between the EU (  this means Germany and to a lesser extent France ) and Russia ? 

The renewable energy revolution is possibly a real game changer for Europe, making it less dependent on both Russia and the USA.  You completely ( deliberately ? ) misread the alligned strategic interests of US and Russia in this regard. 

Your thoughts ? 


Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:39 | 5010233 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

Just the opposite actually.


  • The new Russia-China gas deal, along with a new trend of setting prices linked to gas prices rather than the traditional crude oil benchmarks, could upset western Canada's plans for launching a liquefied natural gas export industry, according to a new report by TD Bank.
  • "With so much LNG supply capacity set to come on stream, Asian buyers have more power to bargain for lower prices in LNG contracts, lowering the potential prices Canadian producers would receive, and could squeeze the economics of certain LNG projects,” TD says.
  • Canadian projects still offer attractive spreads and proximity to Asian markets despite the challenges, but proponents must move quickly to grab first-mover advantage, TD says as it expects two LNG projects to secure final investment decisions before the end of the year.

The Russia-China gas deal "could squeeze the economics" of proposed LNG projects, says a report by Toronto-Dominion Bank. Russia recently clinched a deal to feed gas to China at a chummy price of $10 to $11 per million Btu, shaking up an industry that is used to fetching $14 to $18 from Asian markets.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:48 | 5010262 piratepiet
piratepiet's picture

ok, no real answer to my renewable energy revolution hypothesis, but interesting info as well. thx

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 20:06 | 5010989 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

Cheap gas under cuts renewable ebergy too

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:00 | 5010446 daedon
daedon's picture
So is "bullshit, see ? bull·shit ?bo?ol?SHit/ vulgar slang noun  
  1. 1. stupid or untrue talk or writing; nonsense.
  1. 1. talk nonsense to (someone), typically to be misleading or deceptive.
Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:16 | 5009990 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

I have posted several times that the petro dollar is the whole issue that drives this conflict, as Syria, Iraq, Libya etc. I have read Tyler posts on this subject and many other comments have addressed the issue. But I agree, it should get more coverage, as it is the source of nearly all American power. Without the dollar hegemony, America is bankrupt totally.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:35 | 5010045 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

This is the whole problem with the debate.

Most impartial people will just take the extremist Muslim side on all those other conflicts. That is a loss cause. To lump Russia in with them is not a good idea.

Russia is a Judeau Christian society. This should be an easy one against the petrodollar. You spelled it wrong btw

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:12 | 5010119 Duffy
Duffy's picture

Hold on, is gas priced in dollars?

Russia is a "Judeau Christian" society?  What does that term even actually mean?  It's a largely Eastern Orthodox society, and I'm not sure what that has to do with either the economic issues, or the strictly geopolitical issues.

Much depends, I think, on whether you believe the petrodollar/Bretton Woods/Reserve Currency is the only driver.  I do not believe it is, mostly because I do not believe that all of the people shaping policy are primarily driven by economics.  Economics serves Geostrategy for people like Zbig - if you don't think so, how about reading his books.  Ditto for the neocons, essentially Zionist 5th Columnists - they are most concerned with remaking the middle east, and if you don't believe me, try reading their works, starting with "A Strategy for Israel in the 1980s" through "A Clean Break..." and "Rebuilding America's Defenses."

This doesn't mean access/control of oil and gas aren't huge, this isn't "either/or" - my suggestion is merely that this kind of thinking does not in fact dominate the thinking of goals-oriented militarists.  Take it or leave it as you will.

The other thing is that the petrodollar is dying, no matter what, because the dollar is dying, no matter what.  The massive, massive printing has barely achieved stasis.  I'm willing to bet you that printing has been acclerated in secret - arguably a sign of this is the Belgian US debt buying, but I'd guess most dollar creation was far more subtle. 

No fiat can exist forever - but sure, perhaps retaining the petrodollar system and excluding Russia from more and more western markets extends the life of the dollar, hence of the US military to punish economic rebels.  But it stands to reason that if gas is important there, it's also important elsewhere:


In Gaza, we see {as very well-described in the first link at the top of this post} the convergence of both natural gas interests and geostrategy.  In Lebanon and the West Bank, water resources, sorely under-discussed, is also heavily in play.

The attack on Russia isn't just about natural gas and pipelines, but about removing all potential impediments to the Washington-London-Tel Aviv axis, in terms of military power, banking power, even cultural power.

Much of the hate poured on to Russia has nothing to do with economics, and everything to do with a kind of culture war - one that certain people have waged on Russia and its people for 150 years.  It is not just Russia's military and economic strength that is despised, but its independence in terms of both banking and culture, and indeed, its Orthodox Christianity.

The FRN is dying no matter what.  Efforts to prop it up are frequently, perhaps generally linked to primarily non-economic, geostrategic and ideological goals.  If you want to know what those goals are, look at those arguing for them, and what their interests are. 

The $ as the reserve currency is a means to an end, and the end is to remake the world, and ensure a thousand year reign of a Anglo-Zio-American Banking and War Industry Empire.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 16:06 | 5010306 piratepiet
piratepiet's picture

"The attack on Russia isn't just about natural gas and pipelines, but about removing all potential impediments to the Washington-London-Tel Aviv axis, in terms of military power, banking power, even cultural power."

You are out of whack.  There hasn' t even been an attack on Russia. 

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 16:45 | 5010393 piratepiet
piratepiet's picture

ok there have been a few incidents in the border Region on Russian territory according to RT :

Have not heard the Ukrainian version of events but in any case this does not seem to qualify as ( full scale ) attack on Russia.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 20:11 | 5011001 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Judeau Christian? 

you post ignorant

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 17:50 | 5010615 Truly Inspiration
Truly Inspiration's picture

Its not only the petro dollar. It goes much further. Gorbatschov only agreed on the reunion of Germany if he gets the guarantee that the NATO will not extend to the east.

But history showed that the contrary happened, Slovakia, Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria, the Czech Republic, Poland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Slovenia, Albania and Croatia, they all became NATO members. For one reason to get the NATO (missiles) closer to Russia. 

With the Ukraine the US stepped over the red line and Putin cannot allow this as this will kill Russia.

A missile from the Ukraine border will need less than one minute to Moskow. US and NATO can do the first strike before Russia can even react. This would change the world power globally.

You have to remember. The NATO is never leaded by the secreatary. He is only a puppet. The real command has always the Supreme Allied Commander of Europe, and guess ... it is and was always a gerneral from the US!

In 2002 the US withdrew the ABMT without any reason. The Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty secured the balance of weapon power between US and Russia (site comment, George W. Bush gave Russia notice of the United States' withdrawal from the treaty on December 2001, three months after 911)

So its much more than only petro dollar with the Ukraine conflict. 

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:03 | 5010121 lincolnsteffens
lincolnsteffens's picture

Petrodollar will loose. The machinery is in motion and too late to stop.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:03 | 5009941 petaloka
petaloka's picture

Why haven't they released the photos of the missile that took down MH17?

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:18 | 5009995 ilion
ilion's picture

They have none.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:19 | 5009996 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

The photoshop guy who normally makes those pictures is on Holliday to guantanamo after he got kind of talky after that Obama birth certificate incident...

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:23 | 5010004 Uncertain T
Uncertain T's picture

@Petaloka.... Oh the images were released last Monday.... by Russia.

For a pretty complete photo analysis follow the link

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:07 | 5009955 Absalon
Absalon's picture

Seems pretty clear that Russia hss troops on the ground in Ukraine mascarading as Ukainian separatists.  Shooting down MH17 is a sideshow.  The real issue is the defacto invasion of Ukraine.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:10 | 5009968 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

They voted for independence in the East before the West Ukrainians defacto invaded. 

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:11 | 5009974 kowalli
kowalli's picture

you can't see impact crates from real weapon in this images... if usa find something in earth surface - why it is impact craters and not a simple craters??

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:43 | 5010070 booboo
booboo's picture

god dammit Nurelmann Cow patties are now to be labled "impact craters" 


Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:52 | 5010089 Headbanger
Headbanger's picture

Yeah, they explode when the methane in them is ignited by fire flies..

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:25 | 5010189 logicalman
logicalman's picture

Take some satellite pics over France - you'll see lots of craters. A lot of 'em 100 years old.

Hard to date a crater occupying 10x10 pixels in a greyscale image.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 16:06 | 5010312 JohninMK
JohninMK's picture

Seem to remember that WW2 may have made a few craters in the area, but they may have been ploughed in by now.

Sun, 07/27/2014 - 14:17 | 5009993 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Seems pretty clear that the US has mercenaries on the ground in Ukraine

masquerading as Ukrainian soldiers.Shooting down MH17 is a false flage,

The real issue is the de facto invasion of Ukraine.


Sun, 07/27/2014 - 15:20 | 5010166 Duffy
Duffy's picture

No, the real issue is the US-backed coup on Russia's doorstep designed to rape and pillage Ukraine economically, and expand NATO, and provide a forward op area for US troops.

One of the primary subgoals was to grab Crimea and kick out the Black Fleet - like the 'too soon' grab for the breast on a first date, this kind of aggressive tactic ruined an otherwise lovely covert overthrow of yet another government, miles from American shores or genuine security interests.

The American Empire is not, at all, the same thing as the American Republic, which has been gang-raped by the MIC, banks, and kleptomaniacal political duopoly for so long, it's hardly shocking anymore when you research just all the kinds of taxes people pay, and just what "our government" spends it on.

Mostly transferring wealth from workers to people who didn't earn it, and making war profiteers wealthy while engaging in proxy wars against russia and for israel, control of oil/gas resources, and and the private central banking cartels.


Petrodollar = private central banker hegemony, too, you know.

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