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438 Ukrainian Troops Seek Asylum In Russia; Government Passes "War Tax"

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Submitted by Simon Black via Sovereign Man blog,

There’s nothing more permanent than a temporary government measure, as the old saying goes.

I was reminded of it when I came back to Kiev over the weekend and that the Ukrainian government imposed a series of “temporary” taxes to help the war effort.

And boy does this government need money.

According to both Ukrainian and Russian news sources, several hundred solders were left without weapons or ammunition and crossed the border into Russia.

The Ukrainian news suggests that this was a forced withdrawal after being routed by rebel forces. The Russian news suggests that the troops were seeking asylum, no doubt tired of war.

So the Ukrainian government is in a hurry, trying to raise at least $1 billion (a lot of money here).

[ZH: This won't help: *UKRAINE FAILS TO SELL BONDS AT AUCTION, FINANCE MINISTRY SAYS]

They’ve jacked up wage taxes, natural resource taxes, and even taxes on farming exports.

But even if they collect the money they’re aiming for, Ukraine and its government are in a serious pinch.

For the last few months, even before the turmoil began, Ukraine has been in an inflationary cycle. Both retail and asset prices were spiraling higher.

Now they’ve entered a stagflationary period. The currency has gone into freefall. Unemployment is rising. The economy is contracting (6% by phony government estimates). And inflation is a whopping 19%… and rising.

These people are getting abused. And the worst is yet to come.

The banking system is borderline insolvent. The head of the local Citigroup branch here said that the non-performing loan ratio in Ukraine is as high as 40%.

And potentially up to 4% of all bank assets are now locked down in Crimea, which may or may not even be part of Ukraine any longer.

If the banking system collapses (and many here suspect it will), this place will become unglued. Asset prices will collapse, yet retail prices will surge even higher.

I can already see it on the street; so many businesses have closed. Hopeless unemployed youths are now roaming the city or joining the war effort.

And the entire populace has been mobilized to support the fight.

Of course, it’s pretty damn easy to cheer on the bloodshed when it’s not your blood. War can seem glorious when you only have to read about it in the newspapers.

There’s so much more I need to tell you about—the only way for me to capture this was in another podcast, probably the most emotional I’ve ever done.

Come listen for yourself: (click image for link to podcast)

 

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Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:14 | 5049610 junction
junction's picture

Citizens here in the good ole' USA have been paying a war tax for 50 years, since the Vietnam War.  A whole lot of good it has done, except to make rich insiders even richer.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:14 | 5049625 gh0atrider
gh0atrider's picture

The bosses of Kiev are too busy gambling with derivatives and HFT wash-trades to bother buying bullets and MREs.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:30 | 5049711 Manthong
Manthong's picture

It’s sad to see what 5 billion Nulandbucks can do to a country.

And it is cold comfort to believe that Nuland, Poroshenko and Tymoshenko will ultimately meet the same fate as their respective role models; Himmler, Mussolini and Hitler.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:36 | 5049750 ZerOhead
ZerOhead's picture

Himmler, Mussolini and Hitler never retired in comfort to England Israel or the United States...

FUCK THESE NAZIS

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:41 | 5049796 666
666's picture

"Citizens here in the good ole' USA have been paying a war tax for 50 years, since the Vietnam War."

I thought we're stil paying interest on the war of independence from Britain.

Did they ever repeal the telephone utility tax on the Spanish-American War?

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:51 | 5049865 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

Dulce et Decorum est Pro Patria Moi:

 

The greatest lie ever told!

The banksters who rule the USSA are trying to incite a war against Russia, joyfully sacrificing the flower of our youth for their enrichment and amusement.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 14:08 | 5050032 espirit
espirit's picture

My sympathy to the Ukrainian civilians, and those enduring the tragedy of war.

It's a sick world after all (sung to Disneys "It's a Small World"). 

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 14:43 | 5050273 zaphod
zaphod's picture

Why doesn't Russia and Ukraine just print more money to pay for their war efforts?!?

It's how the US has paid for every war since WWII and it's worked great for us.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 15:15 | 5050513 SWRichmond
SWRichmond's picture

hmmmm...I wonder how those IMF loans are looking now, huh?

Someone knew what would happen to the Ukraine economy when the "independence" started, but loaned them money anyhow, no doubt secured by national assets.  How will they repay now?  Have we seen this playbook before?  Cui bono?

https://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/survey/so/2014/new043014a.htm

Don't forget to read the first comment on the link.

Wed, 08/06/2014 - 03:24 | 5052917 Haus-Targaryen
Haus-Targaryen's picture

Does no one see Putin's long game at this point? 

The people in Crimea are living high on the hog compared to those in the rest of the country at this point.  While the Russian and thus, Crimean economy isn't doing great, its better than most (in terms of # of countries) of "Western" nations.  (See, Spain, Greece, Portugal, Mexico, Italy, etc., etc.,)

All Putin has to do is keep the Crimeans happy, and then after the first freeze, fail to turn back on the gas.  I fail to see the Ukranians bending over and dealing with high inflation coupled with collapsing asset prices, a defunct banking system, and freezing to death in the snow like morons, when their former country men are drinking Vodka nice and warm in their homes in Crimea. 

Wed, 08/06/2014 - 18:18 | 5056244 Idaho potato head
Idaho potato head's picture

They don' have to, US state dept pick up that tab for them.....so far.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:19 | 5049646 RaiZH
RaiZH's picture

Only US citizens? Much of the world has been funding the USA's hegemony for the past 50 years... and many pay an even bigger price. 

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:26 | 5049690 Greenskeeper_Carl
Greenskeeper_Carl's picture

true. inlfation is pretty much our only export, along with debt

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 19:07 | 5051507 conscious being
conscious being's picture

CG You forgot Fraudulent Bonds and various other Frauds.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:21 | 5049665 Eirik Magnus Larssen
Eirik Magnus Larssen's picture

The poor are always the first to be hit.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:55 | 5049929 icanhasbailout
icanhasbailout's picture

It was not long ago that we finally stopped getting phone lines taxed to pay for the Spanish-American War of 1898.

 

And the Federal Reserve itself is arguably a perpetual war tax as well, dating to the start of WWI (1913).

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:11 | 5049611 PlusTic
PlusTic's picture

Komrades, velcome home!

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:11 | 5049612 Gringo Viejo
Gringo Viejo's picture

We're from the IMF and we're here to bleed you dry.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:16 | 5049643 junction
junction's picture

I thought it was "We're from Goldman Sachs and we're here to help you."

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:26 | 5049698 Realname
Realname's picture

We're here to steal your gold...man.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:44 | 5049813 zhandax
zhandax's picture

"Sorry, the fed beat you to it in March"

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:28 | 5049705 Charles The Ham...
Charles The Hammer Martel's picture

Phone call to the Ukrainian embassy... "I'm John Kerry and I'm here to help you." "You mean like you helped the Libyans, Iraqis, Vietnamese, Afghanis, Koreans, Central Americans, Native Americans, Germans..."

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:45 | 5049831 Toolshed
Toolshed's picture

The IMF is sooooo misunderstood. They are real humanitarians actually. Their goal is to restore complete social equality. When no one has any assets remaining.............they have achieved their goal.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:12 | 5049615 Theta_Burn
Theta_Burn's picture

Wasn't the IMF tripping over themselves with loan guarantees?

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:42 | 5049797 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Only upon Kiev defeating the separatists, if I recall.

I wonder what the chocolate export tax is?

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 15:11 | 5050488 tvdog
tvdog's picture

Yes, release of the bailout for Ukraine is conditioned on reconquering the eastern part of the country. It makes sense - that's where all the assets are, all the shale gas, all the industry. The rest of Ukraine is dirt poor, Moldova-poor.

Problem is, they are blowing their loan security to oblivion in the process of reclaiming it.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:13 | 5049619 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

U kraine seen nothing yet. 

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 14:36 | 5050235 karutzar
karutzar's picture

Yeah, it is just the beginning. This jooish-polish bastards is going to see the rage of the cossacks. What I can foresee is the end of Poland - this fabricated (jooish) country.

Wed, 08/06/2014 - 22:46 | 5057221 Capissimo
Capissimo's picture

What I see is Ruine.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:14 | 5049629 Duffy
Duffy's picture
Mafia States: Israel and Ukraine’s special relationship

the term "must read" is thrown around a lot these days... 

I'll just describe it^ as very interesting, indeed.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:41 | 5049798 Seek_Truth
Seek_Truth's picture

Overall a well written, fact based article, with this notable exception- the author states:
"Today about half of Israel’s Jews are of Eastern European descent, and most of those are from Russia and Ukraine"

Actually, approximately 95% of Israel's "Jews" are Ashkenazi (hence non-Semite), while only 5% are Sephardim (hence Semite).

Other than that glaring error, good article!

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:45 | 5049830 ZerOhead
ZerOhead's picture

Good read.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 15:20 | 5050555 Anarchy 99
Anarchy 99's picture

ok I'll say it,    Must Read

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 17:14 | 5051063 The_Prisoner
The_Prisoner's picture

Article provides a good overview to those who are beginning to establish that link.

Case in point:
Italy to extradite former IDF major convicted by Brazil of organ trafficking.
(Link in Portuguese)
http://m.terra.com.br/noticia?n=3d46a927e5887410VgnCLD200000b1bf46d0RCRD

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 19:13 | 5051524 conscious being
conscious being's picture

What sickenning bastards!!

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:14 | 5049632 USD Long
USD Long's picture

None of this would be happening if John Kerry was still alive!

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:25 | 5049692 kurt
kurt's picture

Instead of Big Chin Lurchbot?

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:16 | 5049640 NOTaREALmerican
NOTaREALmerican's picture

Jezzz,  who woulda thunk people would be killing each other in DaUkraine in 2014.    Oh well, as long as our economy keeps improving and the top 20% keep getting richer; it's all good.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:20 | 5049661 Charles The Ham...
Charles The Hammer Martel's picture

So... at what point does Kiev just throw in the towel? They have got to know that they are on borrowed time right now and the E.U. and U.S. are truly insignificant factors at this point. Herr Merkel is practically begging Putin to take Ukraine so they can get on with it. I'm not even sure why the western Ukrainians are fighting anymore, its not like their country has been around for more than 25 years. Speaking of that, when is Belarus going to be assimilated? They are ready. The Baltic states are ready, Georgia is ready.... Lets get the ball rolling Ruskies, you are taking too long. We need a viable competitor to the U.S. so we can stop pretending the world will ever agree to just get along.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:25 | 5049685 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

The junta in Kiev thinks they are exceptional people.

Seems that delusion is not confined to the US after all.

More infecteous than ebola.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:56 | 5049931 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

Winston, I can see you still have the Churchill insight! Kiev's junta and it's 10% support in the population are not rational people. They have grown up over the last 20 years to believe they are a special race and they are chosen to cleanse Ukraine to a new nation. Based of their fascist dream. No, they do not know they are doomed, they think they are on the verge of a new golden age of Ukrainian fascism. To wipe out the ethnic Russian 8 million is their first goal.

Nuland knew this, she is just using them for US foreign policy goals. They are indeed doomed, but DO NOT KNOW IT.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 14:16 | 5050084 potato
potato's picture

Yes. There wouldn't be war if the other side wasn't also sure it could win.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 14:29 | 5050193 Charles The Ham...
Charles The Hammer Martel's picture

The Gazans know they cant win, doesnt stop them from trying to kill as many jews as they can. Kiev is no different. It will look like Gaza shortly.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 23:11 | 5052513 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Cornered wild animals will fight with everything they've got!

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 15:23 | 5050571 Anarchy 99
Anarchy 99's picture

I just think they are preparing their next stop (israhell 2nd) for when they decide to shut down israhel the 1st, which will happen sooner or later.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 16:58 | 5050999 The_Prisoner
The_Prisoner's picture

Indeed, time for the US to ramp the propaganda war to 11, as it's the only thing it is still competent at doing, because it is gone by private companies.

Perhaps they should try and down a civilian airliner and blame it on Russ... Oh, wait!

Gangster Kolomoisky, head of European Jewish council, who financed the Ukrainian nazi death squads is seeing he is unlikely to get a return in his investment, Silverstein-style. So he pressures Poro to institute a draft and war tax on its Citizens, because the paid thugs are not getting the job done.

To paraphrase HS Thompson: Wherever you look, there they are.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 19:27 | 5051579 conscious being
conscious being's picture

Read The Vineyard Sakers blog. Many more Uke trops are trapped. The Uke conscripts can put down their weapons and walk acroos the Russian border to internment for the durration. The Polish and  other mercenaries cannot. They maybe would not get a warm welcome.

The Ukees are losing 25 pieces of armour and 700 to 1,000 troops a day trying to free the pocket that managed to get itself trapped against the Russian border.

Saker says in 60 days it will all be over.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 23:49 | 5052630 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

In 60 days (more or less), the snowflakes will be accumulating; next up, frozen bodies accumulating.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:23 | 5049677 JRobby
JRobby's picture

Why didn't they call janet?

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:26 | 5049689 Sick
Sick's picture

There is a billionaire running the country.  Take his money since he want war.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:38 | 5049765 ZerOhead
ZerOhead's picture

Makes sense. Send his kids to fight too.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:26 | 5049694 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

the reason a war tax is needed is because the Ukranian Govt is so stinkingly corrupt the existing budget isn't getting to the soldiers but being pilfered by the Govt itself

once again the morons/politicians grasp the wrong end of the stick.. and stick it to taxpayers

 

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:29 | 5049704 Smegley Wanxalot
Smegley Wanxalot's picture

Welcome to the EUSSR/USSA, Ukes.  If you like your war tax you can keep your war tax.

Besides, it's time to pay up for those free pastries that gringo hag was givin' ya.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:30 | 5049719 SoDamnMad
SoDamnMad's picture

I watch a couple Ukrainian stations over here in Europe and the Uki soldiers all complain about no food or ammunition. One picture showed a soldier skinning snakes to eat. Where are all those MREs we gave them?   Sitting in some general's warehouse to sell on E Bay.  Their families haven't been paid either. Let's take a pole at a US base and see if our soldiers might be a bit pissed off.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:37 | 5049754 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

Exactly ..even private donations to the Ukranian army are being pilfered by the rotten Govt

which all adds to moral 

Putin crosses the border and the soldiers are between a rock and a hard place ..who wants to fight for a Govt that pilfers your wages and doesn't feed you either

Ukraines defence will be all over in 5 minutes ...all due to stupid rotten Govt

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 19:35 | 5051623 conscious being
conscious being's picture

Putin does not need to cross the border. The anti-Fascist militia seems to be getting the job done.

In Ukraine you don't cross the Russian border. The Russian border crosses you.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:36 | 5049728 tony wilson
tony wilson's picture

this is not a polish matter.

no poles in the theatre of horror.

no pole in su25 frog foots shooting ribs,heads and guts

no sir rebob

 

this is not a jewish matter.

israel has no interests in kiev

ukrainia is another country.

israel is small and only interested in defense.

 

bill gates and monsanto are developing vaccines and gm corn holes that cure anti semtism.

israel should win this years no bull peace prize.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:59 | 5049956 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

Tony, The rebels believe they have trapped a group of Poles in the cauldron pocket on the Southern Border. If true, the rebels are determined to capture some alive to show to NATO and the EU as live evidence.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 15:19 | 5050552 ross81
ross81's picture

NATO/EU will probably release a statement saying something along the lines of "we condemn ALL foreign interference in Ukraine", just like they say meaningless shite such as "BOTH sides in the Gaza conflict must show restraint" when the Israelis launch a missile at a UN school, or blow up kids playing football on a beach.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 17:20 | 5051105 The_Prisoner
The_Prisoner's picture

Jack, I've probably read the sane reports as you. They spoke of Polish and "other nationalities which cannot be mentioned at this time".

Would be really neat to get prisoners from some other NATO countries, as the Netherlands seem to be actively involved in financing the coup as well. Or god forbid, some Americans.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 18:59 | 5051485 Zadig
Zadig's picture

The media in Mordor isn't likely to acknowledge anything so damaging to the propaganda as American soldiers captured by the separatists.

There'd either be completely hysterical propaganda that "Putin" invaded Ukraine to capture American aid workers or complete silence.  Non-American foreign captives wouldn't harm the propaganda very much, at least for most Americans.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 19:07 | 5051511 alus
alus's picture

If yu really believe in this kind of shit so I can only say - nothing will surprise me. People believe in every crap. There's NO polish troops there. But I know there're plenty of swedish, italian and even Academi (blackwater) dogs of war from coutries like Israel and USA. Some of them are paying for the pleasure to shoot to other people. They should stay there forever...

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:53 | 5049898 JuliaS
JuliaS's picture

The West is saying Russian troops are crossing into the Ukraine. Turns out it's the exact opposite.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 13:52 | 5049903 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

"War is a racket"

 

Quite profitiable at that.

 

 

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 14:12 | 5050063 JohninMK
JohninMK's picture

A plea today to Obama. Hope they are not waiting for a rely.

The Chairman of the Parliament of Novorossiya, Oleg Tsarev, published this letter to Barack Obama on his Facebook page:

Petition

From: The Parliament of the Union of Republics of Novorossiya
To: The United States President Barack Obama

Mr. President!

What is happening now on the territory of Donetsk and Lugansk People's Republics can only be called a genocide of the population. Killing civilians - children, women and the elderly. Ukrainian army is fighting with their own Ukrainians, who Ukrainian authorities today refer to as "terrorists".

A fratricidal war is going on in Ukraine. Ukrainian military is killing residents of Donbass every day. They are shelling towns and villages from hotwitzers, mortars, multiple rocket systems, using planes and helicopters, weapons, prohibited by all international conventions - phosphorous bombs, cluster warheads and exploding bullets.

In two months the punitive operation killed more than 1129 civilians, including 348 women and 76 children. The infrastructure of our cities is destroyed, many of which are left without electricity, gas and water supply. Hundreds of thousands of people are homeless. More than half a million people have been forced from their homes.

Ukrainian authorities unleashed real terror against dissidents and inhabitants of the South-East of Ukraine. Hundreds of prisoners are behind bars for political reasons and fabricated criminal cases. Representatives of the law enforcement officials said, that from now the leaders of the anti-war movement will be arrested as well.

The Kiev regime, giving the orders to kill one year-old "separatists" and using the conscripts as "cannon fodder", long ago has crossed the line of humanity and showed the world their true evil face.

What is the crime of these people? For what are they arrested and killed? In a referendum for independence, the residents of Donbass region voted in favour of self-determination of Donetsk and Lugansk People's Republics. In accordance with the international law, as confirmed by a court decision in the case of Kosovo, they were entitled to do so.

In February, a coup d'état took place in Ukraine. The country is run by a neo-nazi government. They publicly call for killing and expelling of dissidents from the country. The Ministers of Interior, Defence, Security, give illegal orders to shoot civilians of Novorossiya without any trial.

"National Guard", which is the core of the Ukrainian army, is made up of notorious Nazis, openly proclaiming fascist slogans, wearing Nazi symbols and praising Hitler's henchmen, who shot and burned the citizens of Ukraine during the second world war. The Nazis force the other soldiers to kill our citizens, otherwise to be shot without trial.

Mr. President!

We appeal to you.

People of Novorossiya want peace. But they have no choice, but to defend themselves from Ukrainian punishers. They could not accept the massacres of civilians in Odessa, Kharkov, Mykolayev, Zaporozhye, Dnepropetrovsk, Kiev and other cities, occupied by the Nazis. Residents of the independent Republics by all means are trying to defend themselves and their families from the ultimate annihilation.

We encourage you to put pressure on Ukraine's leadership to stop the terror and killings on the territory of Donbass, and to withdraw its forces from the territory of the independent Republics.

The Chairman Of The Parliament Of Novorossiya, Oleg Tsarev.

https://www.facebook.com/oleg.tsarov/posts/508630985935939

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 14:46 | 5050291 JohninMK
JohninMK's picture

One of the reasons for the above letter, plus parts of the city have no water, electricity, sewage systems etc. This is not a small town, it normally has a population of about 500,000 (bigger than Edinburgh, Liverpool, Dresden, Dublin, Sacramento, Kansas). Incidently, Donetsk's population before this started was just under a million (the same as Birmingham UK, Cologne, Turin, bigger that Indianapolis or San Francisco).

If you live in any of them, just image what it would be like with no power as MLRS missiles landed every night.

As thousands of Luhansk residents are leaving the city which is curently facing a humanitarian crisis, Luhansk resident Olga, who managed to flee to Kharkov, shared the story of her life in the city with RIA Novosti.

“A lot of people fled from the city. I have nobody left here, except for my sister. When you go out to the balcony, it feels like the city is dead,” Olga said. There are serious problems with the transport network, electricity, communication and water supplies, food became more expensive, she added.

http://en.ria.ru/world/20140805/191755192/It-Feels-As-If-The-City-Is-Dea...

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 14:15 | 5050078 NoWayJose
NoWayJose's picture

Doesn't look like Russia is going to collapse before Ukraine collapses...  time to ratchet up more sanctions --

Winter is coming...

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 19:41 | 5051648 conscious being
conscious being's picture

Winter is coming. Russians fight very good in Winter. Everybody else ... not so much.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 14:18 | 5050098 Fix-ItSilly
Fix-ItSilly's picture

How can this be? The US and EU promised to return the Ukrainian oligarchian thievery to the people!

Oh... that was before Biden and Kerry offspring were appointed as Boardmembers...

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 14:24 | 5050148 Captain Obvious.
Captain Obvious.'s picture

IMF wants the Ukraine broke and feeding out of its hand.

Just like the Bulkans,

Just like any African country

Just like South America.

And then they will impliment "Economic Structural Adjustment Programs" Translation "Drop them and bend over."

Divide and conquor. From the playbook of Julius Caesor.

Coming to a country near you.

Next lady for a shave.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 14:27 | 5050171 karutzar
karutzar's picture

Well, welcome to IMF hell. So far you (ukrainians) got gas from Rossia virtually free. Now you have to learn the life in hard way - no free lunch. After 70 (or so) years of communistic propaganda you didn't learn to sift out the truth. Get free from your jooish oligarchs and recover you roots - khazars is not your roots - look at your (distorted) language and recall your past. Maybe then will be future for you.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 14:29 | 5050191 Road Hazard
Road Hazard's picture

Fuck me......... stop posting simon black articles for fucks sake! He's just another Captain Obvious that "visits" countries in turmoil and knows what the majority of people in a country are thinking because he rented a house there for 30 days?! How do I block seeing his name on here or any articles he submits?

 

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 15:31 | 5050600 Anarchy 99
Anarchy 99's picture

jeesh.........keep an open mind

and no I will not fuck you, need to see pics 1st, and must be female to start.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 14:47 | 5050293 Itchy and Scratchy
Itchy and Scratchy's picture

This news must be positively orgasmic for the lovely Sec of State Victoria (F.U.) Nuland (nee: Nudleman) Kagan!

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 14:59 | 5050303 scam_MERS
scam_MERS's picture

Putin is getting just what he deserves, right close to home:

Federalization, which the Kremlin is so aggressively pushing for Ukraine, is clearly a dirty word closer to Moscow.  A word that can get civic activists and those who report their peaceful protest plans, into trouble.  Nonetheless  the current feverish moves seen by the Russian Prosecutor General to block all mention of home-grown calls for real federalization are proving spectacularly counter-productive

At least 15 websites, including Ukraine’s TSN.ua, have received formal warnings from Roskomnadzor, Russia’s media and Internet surveillance body demanding that they withdraw publications reporting an initiative by Artem Loskutov and some other activists in Siberia who are planning to hold a "March in support of Siberian Federalization".

The event that has set the Prosecutor General and Roskomnadzor into overdrive is a march in support of Siberia’s federalization, scheduled for Aug 17 in Novosibirsk.  Their action, under the slogan “We’ve had enough of feeding Moscow!” is aimed at achieving greater autonomy by creating a Siberian republic within the Russian Federation. Autonomy from Russia will enable the people of Siberia to: introduce benefits and wage supplements for people living in harsh climactic conditions; introduce a regional component to the tax on extracting precious metals, resulting in a fairer divide between local and federal budgets; exercise their constitutional right to their own authorities who are more independent of the centre and to remove the idiotic situation whereby all decisions are taken by the government in Moscow. No call to arms, no demand to overthrow the constitution.  Quite the contrary, they simply wish to exercise a constitutionally enshrined right.

It seems likely that this annoyed Russia’s Prosecutor because it is impossible to read without one highly seditious question coming to mind.  Why is Moscow pushing federalization in Ukraine when it brooks little or no autonomy at local level at home?.  Siberia, in particular, hands over its vast wealth and gets only “dumb laws” and a governor chosen by the president in exchange.

The contrast is also highly telling.  Moscow is defending ‘the rights’, as well as heavily arming and manning so-called separatists in eastern Ukraine who call Ukraine a foreign country; who have repeatedly suggested joining the Russian Federation and even more frequently called for Russia to send in troops to support them.  The federalists in Siberia are really only asking for a little bit more say over what happens in their part of the Russian Federation and over the wealth their area brings in.

http://khpg.org/en/index.php?id=1407025405

Read the entire story - Putin has opened a can of worms and there's no way back now. Now, Kaliningrad is next up, how can he justify cracking down on what's happening on his own territory while fomenting it in another country?

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 15:13 | 5050504 ross81
ross81's picture

For a supposed Ukrainian Human Rights group, they dont appear too concerned with the many acts of barbarism committed by Kiev's forces against their own Russian-speaking citizens.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 16:51 | 5050563 scam_MERS
scam_MERS's picture

Nor does the Kremlin (or Putin) seem too concerned when the "little green men" or mercenaries are doing the exact same thing. Two wrongs don't make a right. Maybe there are just no "good guys" in this situation?

But getting back to what I posted: it seems what's good for the goose isn't good for the gander - at least in Putin Land. More hypocrisy, what a surprise.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 18:52 | 5051461 ross81
ross81's picture

personally, I don't think killing fascists is a bad thing. Maybe you disagree. If you are claiming that the "polite men in green" are in Ukraine, then they are killing fascists. There are no "polite men in green" killing Ukrainian loyalist civilians in Kiev, Lviv or any parts of western Ukraine for example. They are defending ethnic Russians in Novorossiya who under siege from the forces of Dmitry Yarosh....i.e. Hitler-worshippers.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 23:28 | 5052560 scam_MERS
scam_MERS's picture

Interesting, so Yarosh is now the commander-in-chief of the Ukrainian Army? I thought he was wanted by Interpol. Guess I'm not as informed as you are.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 23:20 | 5052471 scam_MERS
scam_MERS's picture

Funny, 15 down arrows (so far) for my initial post - yet no one will point out anything posted in that story that's incorrect or untrue. Attacking the source of the information doesn't change facts. Certain people just don't like that Putin has opened a Pandora's Box and now has to deal with it. Feel free to continue down-voting the issue, it's still a fact that Siberia desires autonomy from Moscow and may vote on it. Where it will lead isn't clear at this time (maybe nowhere, if he stomps on the right of the Siberians to choose).

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 15:15 | 5050515 Duffy
Duffy's picture

ah, well, regarding your link... at bottom of the about page...

The website is created with assistance of the International Renaissance Foundation and National Endowment for Democracy (USA)

The NED is a bastion of neocons and zionists and headed by http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Gershman

The IRF

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Renaissance_Foundation

was founded by George Soros..  also Jewish, as it happens.  So, as has been noted previously, is the head of the very-active-in-ukraine  FDD -headed by the Jewish Clifford May

 

Shortly after its founding, FDD quickly developed into a prominent member of a group of neoconservative think tanks and advocacy groups—including the American Enterprise Institute and the Hudson Institute—that were influential in shaping the early foreign policy priorities of the George W. Bush administration. At the height of the so-called "war on terror," FDD also absorbed the Committee on the Present Danger, a Cold War-era anticommunist group that been reconstituted to push for hardline policies in the Middle East.

Today, FDD's experts are leading advocates of a U.S. military strike on Iran, tougher sanctions over Tehran's nuclear enrichment program, U.S. intervention in Syria's civil war, and one-sided U.S. support for Israel in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

http://rightweb.irc-online.org/profile/foundation_for_defense_of_democra...

 

funny how the neocons became so interested in Russia after Putin took back some of Russia's stolen natural wealth from the mostly Jewish oligarchs who, in a deliberate and planned series of thefts under a compliant Yeltsin, essentially wanted to control Russia financially just as the mostly [initially] Jewish Bolshviks had. 

http://rightweb.irc-online.org/

 

Perhaps we should worry less about the Russian Federation's constituent Republics and more about 5th columnist Jews/Zionists in our government, media, and banks trying to arrange anothe rmajor war to benefit Israel and/or Jewish elites?

Whaddaya think?

 

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 15:29 | 5050594 scam_MERS
scam_MERS's picture

I really don't care who founded the website, the story still stands (It's not a fake story). I read all sides (including what is regarded as Putin's mouthpiece, RT) to try and understand all points of view. I don't automatically dismiss a story just because it comes from "joos" or "Russkies" (nor do I automatically agree with it). This place is like an echo chamber sometimes, I'm just providing a different point of view.

I'm still waiting for someone to justify Putin's actions in regards to Siberians wanting more autonomy from Moscow. Wanna bet this gets stamped on, hard?

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 19:58 | 5051677 conscious being
conscious being's picture

You should care. The same Kagan-Knoodleman's that funded the website, funded this event you're going on about.

Why do you want to promote the NeoCon agenda that is destroying the world?

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 22:51 | 5052432 scam_MERS
scam_MERS's picture

Not promoting anything here, if that's what you read into my comments. I only said I don't care about the source in this case, as it isn't fake, nor has it been refuted by the Russian government.

Still waiting for a good reason why Putin should complain when Siberia or Kaliningrad desires more autonomy. If he rabidly supports this in Ukraine, why is he so against it at home, hmmm?

My main point, Putin is hypocritical as much as any other politician. Any benefit derived from his actions that help the average Russian is just a by-product, not the main reason. Bottom line, I'm pretty neutral about this entire mess. I'm not a Putin "hater" as some here might like to believe, but I am realistic. I'm quite willing to consider that it's probably just as likely the Ukrainians shot down the plane as Russian-backed rebels (or maybe even the Russian government). From what I see, nearly everyone here is as quick to blame the Ukrainians as people in the West are to blame the rebels. The only people that know for sure are the ones that pushed the button (and the ones behind them that ordered them to do it). Anything is possible, and there is plenty of "evidence" to support a case that either side did it. One thing I really don't want to believe - that whoever did it, did it purposely. I honestly believe that the truth on this may never be known, something like the JFK assassination, etc. It's already been too long since the crash and both sides have had plenty of time to do whatever covering up they wanted to do - the rebels controlling the crash scene could remove/destroy evidence (they had days in which to do so), while the black boxes/ATC tapes could easily be tampered with by the other side. So who really knows?

For myself, I'm not taking sides here, just pointing out some very blatant and obvious hypocricy by the Russians today - tomorrow I may read a story that strikes me as hypocritical on the Ukrainian side and post that (although numerous people here have taken that "burden" upon themselves already). I don't mind the down arrows, really don't care. Fire away. It won't affect my opinion at all and in fact, to me it just means some people don't like to hear or consider both sides of a story. Fine with me.

Like many things in life, the truth, if it exists at all, often lies somewhere in the middle ground between black and white. Just something I think about every day when someone tries to brainwash me with propaganda.

Wed, 08/06/2014 - 21:17 | 5056876 conscious being
conscious being's picture

I got as far as "Not promoting anything ...

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 18:08 | 5051307 Monty Burns
Monty Burns's picture

Well spotted Duffy.  Committee for the Present Danger members were very active in developing and propagating the 9/11 cover-up as well.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 15:31 | 5050607 JohninMK
JohninMK's picture

You make a valid point but Putin and the Russian Government are not some kind of 'new and good' operation.

They are as corrupt and intent on power as any other government around the world. They are two faced like the rest, wanting their cake and eating it (by force if necessary).

In my short time on ZH my interpretation of the support here for Putin is not so much support for him and Russia per se but a reaction of horror at the antics of the US Government and its accolites in the West.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 15:43 | 5050670 scam_MERS
scam_MERS's picture

@JohninMK, thanks for posting that, something I can agree with. You're absolutely right (and I "up-arrowed" you for your comment BTW), and Putin is no better than the rest. I just get tired of reading "Putin is da man" here, with no balance at all (I understand that many posting here are paid Putin trolls though, but not all). Yours is a more balanced point of view, something that's lacking in what I read in many comments.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 18:22 | 5051347 Parrotile
Parrotile's picture

You may also wish to consider that for the majority in the West, there has been a lifelong barrage of "West is Best", and on the other side of the propaganda coin, "Russians, and Communism, are bad, and must be controlled / constrained / stamped out".

With the fall of the Iron Curtain, many have travelled to Russia and other former Communist states (such as Ukraine), and - surprise, surprise - found that the population are generally just the same as the West. Resonable, intelligent (often VERY intelligent (in comparison to the West)) people who were fed exactly the same propaganda, with the actors reversed.

In view of this, it pretty depressing to see the "standards" the West "expects" from their career politicians (American, UK, German, French, etc.), in comparison with the leader of the Russian Federation. Like him or not, Vladimir Putin has done more for his Country and his people in 15 years, that the West has in a century. I suspect this is the main motivator for the demonisation of the emergent Russia - the belated realisation here in the West that we have allowed our "Politicians" to squander the advantages we had (and they were substantial advantages), and we collectively are starting to realise that our time in the sun is coming to an end.

WIll this be Russia's century? Who knows. Maybe a Sino-Russian alliance? Again who knows. Maybe Ebola, or "Son of Ebola" will mean  depopulation on such a large scale that the present territorial structures will be dissipated in the wind, and life as we know it will change very markedly.

One thing is certain though - the days of Western dominance  are looking increasingly shaky, and no-one ever likes change (especially when even the blind can see that for the West, this change will not be beneficial)

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 19:00 | 5051489 JohninMK
JohninMK's picture

Thanks.

Although I view Putin without 'rose tinted' spectacles and view the way the Russian Government operates with some caution, it is clear that, having been through their own financial crisis without QE, they occupy a financial high ground that most of the heavily indebted West and China can only dream of.

I believe that it is also arrogant for the West to think that the parliamentary democracy is the only way to run a country. What makes the sheeple qualified to appoint good leaders or short term governments a good thing? A long term dictatorship, especially a technical one, can work well. Corruption in everywhere in all systems, sometimes it comes to the surface, mostly not.

In life you see and sometimes meet people with something 'special' about them, a 'star' or 'leadership' quality if you like. If you work for them you will follow them wherever they go. There are many in the military. Sometimes they make it to the top in politics, think JFK. When in power they are like a 'god on earth' people really believe in them. It is difficult to see any in politics ATM but I think Putin is one of them and that is perhaps a reason for 'Putin is da man' on ZH.

I suspect that a majority on ZH wish that their country had a 'Putin'.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 19:32 | 5051609 Peanut Butter E...
Peanut Butter Engineer's picture

If you hate Putin so much there is another crowd at all major us news that will fit your views. Yahoo cnn msnbc and many many other news station will satisfy your view.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 23:15 | 5052525 scam_MERS
scam_MERS's picture

Peanut Butter, if you're directing that at me:

1. Don't hate Putin, don't have a man crush on him either. He's just a corrupt politician like 99% of others in all countries. He lies just like the rest, when it suits him (just my opinion, not a fact).

2. I'm not seeking sycophants. I'd rather interact with people that hold a different viewpoint than I may have, to hear both sides of a story or a different opinion. Mine may be different than many people posting here, doesn't make me right and you wrong or vice versa. However, when people try to tell me their opinion is absolute fact, I expect them to be able to back up that assertion. Often, that isn't done.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 21:04 | 5051958 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

yawn, all governments are the same, with the same goals, they just say they are different.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 23:18 | 5052536 scam_MERS
scam_MERS's picture

Aussiekiwi, just my point, and I agree with you.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 15:00 | 5050400 Itchy and Scratchy
Itchy and Scratchy's picture

Which country is the U.S. gonna ruin next?

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 21:02 | 5051951 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

but, they are there to help, right?

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 15:36 | 5050625 Anarchy 99
Anarchy 99's picture

stupid ukies, getting trapped between a rock (the militia) and a very hard place (russia)

There is also information that among those who did not surrender there are Polish mercenaries, which essentially explains the stubbornness of the resistance (a serious international scandal is possible)

 

The Shrinking Cauldron - The Surrender of the 72nd Brigade........saker

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 16:14 | 5050809 SMC
SMC's picture

When the Obummer has your back,
Seeking asylum is a wise choice.

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 20:18 | 5051781 Herdee
Herdee's picture

The long and very cold Russian winter is coming.Only the fall season left to prepare.She's going to get pretty tuff.I can already see massive shortages of food and whatever there is,nobody will be able to afford it.It's going to cost Europe and the U.S. bigtime and that's if they even give a damn about any type of planning.Hitler found that out the real hard way,maybe history will repeat itself?You try to bring NATO up to the borders of Russia with no consequences?

Wed, 08/06/2014 - 00:04 | 5052670 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

General Winter has a plan, and it's relentless!

Tue, 08/05/2014 - 21:00 | 5051941 Aussiekiwi
Aussiekiwi's picture

but but but, the IMF is helping.

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