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A Divided World
Yesterday we showed how 'isolated' Russia was (if you chose to look only at isolating parts of the world). Today, we glimpse at the world's views on China vs US... As The Global Post notes, we know that only 35 percent of Americans have a favorable view of China. But what about the rest of the world?
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Who's isolated now?
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zerohedge is like Russia Today
So what are ya tryin' to say??
There's no way that India has a higher rating for the U.S. than China...
That's actually not a surprise at all. You do know that the two countries have very tense border regions and have often been at odds with each other both politically and militarily. That's why Pakistan is more favorable toward China (well, drones aren't really popular either). In fact, Chinas friendship with Pakistan is even more reason the Indians see the USA in a better light. Totally legit result.
I'm aware. But I don't think you're aware of the gigantic, ancient list of positive Chinese-Indian relations and trade.
Turkey and Ukraine are "divided"? Invade!
Who's isolated now?
Umm.... given the chart, I'd say Russia. Is this the right chart? Because it looks like only Russia and a few backwards outliers think more highly of China than the US. And you can't really blame Pakistan when we send drones to their wedding parties. Only god can save us from the great axis powers of Tunisia, Palestine, Greece, etc.. sarc/off
I think Boris got posting rights today.
I'm confused...where is China again? I haven't seen any articles about the smog there in a while, so I'm having trouble remember if China is the one by the ocean or the one by the other ocean...
I'm pulling for team USA. I don't like rice, and cold weather give me shrinkage.
This place has some serious cognitive dissonance going on, on one had they preach sound money and liberty and on the other they adore authoritarian states like Russia and China...
At some point I hope they connect the dots and figure out that we don't gain anything if a collection of despotic states overthrows our despotic empire. More reflection on the constitution and it's values and less cheerleading for one group of slave masters over the other would be nice (I'm not holding my breath though).
zh went tits up 1-2 years ago... Problem is they also went tits up regarding econ. analysis, which is actually unpleasant. Nowdays you get a worthwhile information once/month with luck...
I mean, I don't read cnn because I'm not interested in US propaganda, so clearly I'm interested to read russian/chinese propaganda. Because definitely if you're not pro US, you have to be pro China.
Why does this sound eerily familiar? Like 2 party system and shit?
It's a bit shocking isn't it? Screw that critical thinking garbage, lets just hop up into the bleachers and find a team to root for. Team China, Team USA, Team Russia...
You know the worlds in trouble when the majority of people can't tell the difference between geopolitics and a football game.
Can't really blame the site, they have to make money and to do that they have to put out what their audience wants, It's clear that it's no longer supported by a libertarian base though, it's become a place for people to feed upon each others hatred, discontent and paranoia and thats about it.
The regulars who actually contribute something down here are leaving for this reason me thinks.
A lot of people have been posting on that topic - regulars leaving and the changes. The regulars used to talk about waking people up but I guess they were full of crap since they have a brand new crop of newbs to chew on and they just leave instead.
Enough people could have influenced the site back toward whence it came but they didn't bother so it's just a shame.
And that's all.
I think you would be correct in calling them cowards if the environment were different, but nobody wants to waste their time arguing with a brick wall.
Many on here have already decided upon a fantasy narrative they like and invested themselves emotionally to the point where they don't want to even consider alternatives. Why bother with people like that? They've made up their minds and closed them.
ZH runs plenty of articles on the Chinese economic shit mess...
worthwhile; keyword ;)
I remember reading some very goods articles here; with new and very good interpretations. Sometimes with new data too; that less often, but that's ok, afterall there are few relevant things happening.
Asset x disconnected from y; that happened when z said t. That's useful; maybe I missed it. Not "chinese houses are empty", "China is a buble", blabla; that I know already, it's 0 information. Or post about Hindenburg omen; that's not analysis, that's... wishful thinking.
Why does this sound eerily familiar? Like 2 party system and shit?
____________
This is an 'american' world.
I don't admire or trust Putin but he does seem readable and thoughtful. There is a level of predictibility about him, kind of like a bear. If you understand bear behavior you can deal with a real live bear. He appears to be bucking the system and standing up to the bankers so that makes a sort of the enemy of my enemy isn't necessarily my friend but there is no reason for him to be my enemy too situation.
We don't see Russia/China attacking countries all over the planet. That makes them somewhat better neighbors than the US, which is also authoritarian in a heavily veiled way. For instance, the choice in the last election was about which way we would go about opening the Qatari pipeline through Syria. Obama played the buddy with Russia when the mike was on but look at his actions toward Russian interests. Do you think Romney would have been much more aggressive even though he said he saw Russia as the primary advisary? Bankers would probably still be running rampant and untouchable like they are today.
Here, you choose: Heads I win or tails you lose. That doesn't sound like much a choice to me.
Good attitude to have, objective awareness of the situation without the mindless sycophancy for other authoritarian states that some around here allow their hatred of the US to foster.
Although I would focus more on analyzing each state on it's own merits, rather than comparing and contrasting them with others. The current state of the US is a pretty low bar to measure liberty by, it's more useful to consider the principles themselves and hold the country up to that.
Since Zerohedge is directly or indirectly a creation of the anti-Western propaganda machine, its valid criticisms of the modern West notwithstanding. Whether its publishers are aware of this or not, I don't know, but given the amount of criticism directed at Russia, China, and the third world (which are still shitholes of orders of magnitude worse than the United States) that I see coming from here, I have my suspicions.
My thoughts too. Looks like that contribution backfired a bit. The first glimpse deceives as Russia and China cover large surfaces. Apart from those two, only Malaysia has any semblance of a respectable nation. The remaining half dozen are shitholes or failed states. That's not really a divisive world.
In any event, when the Chinese are confronted by an either/or situation, they'd always follow the money first. i.e. the US. It's not as if Russia is a reliable parnter to the Chinese or vice versa.
Then again, just because the other nations prefer the US, doesn't mean it's uncritical adoration. Quite the opposite. It's just that the US (government) is seen as the lesser evil. (as I do too)
Apart from those two, only Malaysia has any semblance of a respectable nation.
___________________________
Respectable? What meaning?
Clearly, a large number of China's supporters are also eviscerated by 'americans', Lebanon, Jordan, Egypt...
While history matters, the geopolitical realities of today matter more. After the South China Sea, the biggest tract of ocean between China and resources in Africa is....that Indian Ocean. And who controls that? I assure you it's neither Myanmar nor Mozambique.
I have an Indian friend who disowned his son for dating a Pakistani girl, yeah, theirs some bad blood for sure
Uh, Dude. China is now occupying one third of the Kashmir, and pushing for more.
Armed invasion will tend to piss off your neighbor. Count on it.
Nonsense...Chinese government only attack running dog capitalists!
(And Tibetan monks...lol)
They can text with both hands and both feet, but can't read a damn map.
Great Caesar's Ghost;)
Most Americans probably couldn't find Iowa on a blank map of US states. Do we expect our fellow countrymen to know where Kashmir is?
Sad isn't it?
Moar gubmint edukation pleeze!
Why is it sad? Can you find capacitor in a circuit? Do you know what it does? Can you identify the best set of credit cards to use based on purchasing habits? Can you build a computer that optimizes power consumption, price and performance? Can you build a table with scraps of wood?
Sorry...what purpose does memorizing geographic locations that can be quickly looked up serve? Let me focus on that instead of something useful. I guess I'll tell you that you are sad for not knowing the name of every bone in the human body.
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Your point?
it's called mental association(I guess, not a native speaker). Let's say that I might consider parallels between economic situation in Roman Empire at the end of the republic and today. For that: I need to know there was such a thing as Roman Empire. I need to know they were a republic for some time. I need to know there was some economic problem back then. Etc.
or let's say you're an armchair strategist. How can you analyze geopolitical problems(the geo in there is for a reason) if you have no clue about geography?
For all of the above you need to have stuff to associate. Which doesn't really work if your memory is empty, does it?
I guess by far the dumbest idea propagated nowdays(worse than anything else by a longshot) is the idea you can "look up" said information. How the fuck could you look up for something if you don't know that thing even exists in the 1st place? Feeling lucky, or how? How do you plan to develop your cognitive abilities? If you avoid any chance to actually use that brain? Again, feeling lucky, or how?
p.s. - and regarding your questions, beside the credit card one, as I have none, it's yes to all of them. And ok, I don't know all the bones in the human body, but I know enough of them. And guess what, no, I don't have a headache, and no, my brain isn't worn out, burnout or anything.
p.p.s - and afterwards, let's complain about the lack of independent thinking. How could you think independently if all you do is "look up"? In order to look up, you need to have someone/something tell you what to look up for. As I imagine you don't look up for random stuff just hoping. Not very independent, is it?
"Sorry...what purpose does memorizing geographic locations that can be quickly looked up serve?"
How many times have you looked up a known geographic location on the net and it was wrong? If you are over forty I would imagine plenty of times. Are you then in the habit of taking what is an error and promoting it as truth? But of course, you wouldn't know you were in error.
Would you? ;-)
Only when it matters, my friend, and even then, only those who understand Kipling.
" an it's Tommy this, an Tommy that, and Tommy how's your soul,
but it's thin red line of heroes, when the drums begin to roll."
Everyone knows that being a monk for Tibetians is merely a cover for being insanely selfish Capitalists that would kill anyone that did not obey their dictates...
/sarc for you morons.
There would be a lot more red on that map if the surveyors were brave enough to question people in airborne-ebola Africa.
China went in there 10 years ago and started building schools, hospitals, roads, and factories... that little pig is all trussed up and going nowhere.
1.27 billion Indians can't be wrong? ;-)
That's a lot of teepees.
Don't get me goin, ORI will be comin round trying to kick my ass...lol...I think I may have had a life changing experience over the holiday.
Or somebody slipped me a mickey ;-)
I hope that life changing experience didn't involve scissors, a scalpel, and some stitches.
Came close on the stitches but its healing up nicely.
There was some, uhhh, landscaping involved ;-)
"I hope that life changing experience didn't involve scissors, a scalpel, and some stitches."
no, now he "knows" he's gay....he liked it..."Mickey" gave him alka-seltzer....
Looks to me like you're the one "foaming at the mouth".
Are we going to have a problem, spud?
/////
Awww, now I've hurt your feeewings, you have a wittle boo boo?...lol.
You win the internet tough guy award.
The guy called me out (of a closet or sumpin...lol) BK, if he wasn't so hung up on his own gheyness I'd assume he'd have some sort of retort.
This is Fight Club, if the boi ain't got the balls to back up his shit he should have just junked me and moved on anonymously like every other four week old pussy passing through.
His comment was meant as a slander, kinda like, TeaBagger.
Because he's a dumbass ;-)
I don't know why I bother posting, it's like you read my mind and post it for me. I was so hung up on my gheyness, as your grandkids say, to come up with a retort.
You've been posting on every article for the last 4 years and you barely get upvotes. That must be discouraging but the junks aren't mine. Keep at it though, gotta do something all day.
I have no idea what or who you're talking about.
As for myself, I've been a member for over four years but I don't "post all day", I have a job and I prefer they not know who I am as sometimes my comments run very much contrary to their interests. I comment in the mornings with coffee & evenings with an adult beverage and of the current articles on the ZH front page I believe I've commented on just three....look it up, its all there in black & white.
If you've ever read me (or even tried to understand me) you know I reserve my compassion AND my venom for the ones who deserve it most. He deserved the latter and I provided only a small dose.
Now tell me why you're defending him...
I too had a life changing experience. Had to deal with the TSA at O'Hare.
I've never thought of myself as a homicidal maniac.
Turns out, I have limits.
I ran into an old friend.
Turns out, so do I ;-)
He's trying to say CNN didn't report this, so it can't be true.
So Canada, Australia and Saudi are not included because they are Colonies?
Along with Norway, Sweden, Finland and New Zealand.
inconsequential sock puppets perhaps......that and populations are hardly rounding errors compared to the BRICS
It's saying that... 1. The BRICS are missing the BIS
2. Vietnam turned on China, in favor of the US. Two-faced bass turds!
3. Chile, Georgia, and the Baltics are America's "bitch", no matter what Simon Black says.
4. Even Canadian NATO forces can understand this 3-color map.
lol
Former libtalker/ peddler of fake Obama "presidential coins" Montel Williams begs president to provide leadership:
http://tinyurl.com/krho8se
Tyler is trying to compare US global image in the world vs China's.
According a poll from July 2013 it still remains more positive.
See: http://www.pewglobal.org/2013/07/18/americas-global-image-remains-more-positive-than-chinas/
and http://www.pewglobal.org/2013/07/18/chapter-1-attitudes-toward-the-united-states/
maybe the majorirty of the tyler durdan uploaders are from russia, i have seen several grammar mistakes in Zero's posts
"Today, we glimpse at the world's views on China vs US"
Get real deagle44-ass....
Everyone remember, colored geography maps don't reveal "POPULATION"....
It's no secret that we have allowed the 1% to make "America" a "few" enemies....like....THE WHOLE FUCKING 6.5 Billion REST OF THE WORLD's PEOPLE...!!!
Perspective?
I would be curious to see percents within US and China! Those Turkey numbers are a problem since Turkey is the most important ally of the US right now.
They couldn't find China on the map and were therefore excluded.
As for the Turkish numbers, they are both so low, it really doesn't matter.
Presenting facts is so not like American Propaganda isn't it?
"zerohedge is like Russia Today"
I've been saying all along that I suspect Zero Hedge has been bought out by Russian Entities, or at the very least become a propoganda arm
Fuck China and its bullshit territorial claims.
Fuck America and its' bullshit extra-territorial claims.
.....how many time zones...... again ...... sorry thought we were still on Russia .... my bad
interesting views from the BRICS countries though
Aren't we all citizens of the world? That's what Zero said anyway.
and only 8% of Americans have favorable view of Washington DC.
Another study finds that 8% of Americans are completely brain dead.
That low?
......that only 8%........are NOT brain dead, and they can be found on ZH.
fixed.
"and only 8% of Americans have favorable view of Washington DC."
That must be a RAND Corp, Kock Bros. paid poll....it's too optimistic....
This seems bogus. Is PEW saying Iran is not in China's camp? Do you really need to take a survey to know that? Which makes one wonder about the credibility of the whole thing. And what about Africa where the Chinese are actually building infrastructure instead of paying off dictators for access?
The grey countries were simply not surveyed
Because it would not fit the message to see so much red on the board.
Canada and Australia would fill in a lot of blue, so it really doesn't appear their choices skewed the color map all that much. USA still has a better reputation than is deserved, or the Chinese haven't been doing a very good PR job in the countries they are snatching resources from. You'd think with all the trade deals they've made with Central/South America they would be a bit more popular.
Nicaragua is really odd considering it's China that is working with them to build a new canal to replace the older Panama Canal. Then there's the history with the Sandinistas and the fact that Nicaragua is an utterly impoverished shithole.
The whole thing is questionable because of its obvious errors and omissions. It wouldn't rate a passing grade in a freshman poli-sci class. Which makes one wonder why publish this at all?
Surveys like this are impossible, but there is probably a massive skew toward city dwellers and the wealthy, so it's seems like those more "metropolitan" people would side with the West more than the East. But that's also how you predefine the outcome going in.
City dwellers and the wealthy? Hmm....how do you know that? In any event, I'm pretty sure the vast majority of "city dwellers" in most of the countries don't have a dime.
Because they have to have access to communication to participate in a survey. And it's also doubtful that people went out to rural areas and did legitimate sampling. It just wouldn't be possible logistically.
Yeah, that's definitely possible, though cell phone penetration is pretty thorough these days. Hell, they could have polled IS.
I've been to some poorer and remote countries, and it's surprising how many people have cell phones, but many people don't have "minutes". They basically buy time and use it all up right away, or buy time for a specific purpose.
You conflate governments with the people.
In Africa, like everywhere else, the locals realise that the Chinese come in and build nice, big, shiny, new infrastructure projects, businesses, and factories.
Then in Africa, like everywhere else, the locals realise that the Chinese:
-Do not hire any locals for the project
-Do not socialise nor do business with the locals
-Bring in and build dedicated housing, restaurants, and Chinese-centric businesses
-Build company towns to cater to the Chinese workers
-Bring in Chinese service industries of all kinds, including Chinese hookers
-Do not invest the money locally
The local government puts forth some money, the Chinese put forth their part, and every single Yuan is kept within the Chinese economy. When the project is finished, the Chinese go home and they take the entire value of the contract with them, and put every RMB into their accounts back in China.
Keep in mind this is what Africans realise when the Chinese ''give them great infrastructure"'.
Oh, did I mention the riots and Chinese racism towards the locals?
BITCOIN!!!!
Honestly, USA did better than I expected.
Just got some quick stats from one guy in Canada they are as follows:
0% US 0% CH
Anyone ask ISIS what they thought?
If those pictures of the hot coolie chicks to the right side of this page were up, there would be much more red.
- Kung pow chicken
- Ballpark frank
Who would have thought Vietnam would be more.aligned.with USA than China?
I wonder if in 40 years ISIS will be more.aligned with USA.....
I know they both use the same military equipment. And share 300 "advisors/militants".
greeks?
Canada would be blue as would most of Africa. Still a pretty blue world despite our many, many faults.
Nobody actually "likes" China.
Russia is being forced into an unwanted alliance with them and Pakistan only cozies up to them because they despise India.
The handful of tiny muslim nations aren't the least bit relevant but I have to admit that Greece is a bit of a mystery.
I'm sure most Chinese would favor China. Regardless, despite all the faults (and I know there are very many) I would definitely vote positive for America over both Russia and China.
Greece isn't a mystery at all. They always had left leanings. They identify with the Russians on the basis of religion (orthodox). They feel the US is the imperialist pig. They even felt this way during the Soviet Union years.
Same with India, minus religion.
To which questions US (government) had higher rates in Spain?
Brazil favoring the US? Remember BRICS, agricultural trade with Russia and China?!
Map is propaganda!
There would not be a BRICS country aligned with blue for the USA. The purpose of BRICS can not be ignored. Therefore, the map is erroneous...
Also many other countries that are painted cool blue are not cool blue and I see that as I travel the world regularly...
Sorry people, but this map is western propaganda and western sponsored...
Like some other commenters, I find it hard to believe that Brazil & India favour the US over China. They're all members of BRICS which they see as essential for their economic future. Brazil also has a long memory of the military junta running their country which was sponsored and funded by the US/CIA. Then there is the small matter of Dilma Rousseff canceling a planned summit with Obama because of NSA spying.
The only way this chart could be correct is if it's limited to societal & cultural matters, ie: Brazilians would rather watch a Hollywood movie that a Chinese one, would prefer a Big Mac to a mung bean sandwich and would prefer to learn English than Mandarin etc.
China today has about 100m plus middle class. This class has almost comparative literacy rate of US/EC and are exposed to global media. This class matters and the backbone support of the incumbent Govt and the power base of President Xi.
Goto their internet to get a feel of the thoughts of this middle class and their young. The best feel despite the heavy censorship. This group is more vociferous in "Japan Bashing" (not disouraged by their Govt). This group is literate and do not unthinkingly suck up to domestic propaganda. They poke at Americans but that is different from "hating" Americns. They criticise their own govt using global best practices (often US based).
It is only the Western MSM that is stoking up Americans hatred for China and pounding away at the collapses of their systems. (Not that Chinese or China do not have faults).
yeah China is heavily investing in Brazil and is a part of BRICS
I've been losing respect for China lately seeing how they are doing Hong Kong. There was a 50 year agreement and China is breaking it.
China just made it known clearly to Britain: "How big is the stake that the Britain is willing to put on the table?"
China warns Britain that ties are at risk if UK parliamentary inquiry continues
"The lawmakers are examining the implementation of the Joint Declaration, which states that Hong Kong should have a high degree of autonomy and executive power, and that personal rights in the territory must be enshrined by law.
Ottaway said Beijing's ruling on reform appeared to have breached those undertakings."If you have a committee that is not neutral and is nominating a limited number of candidates, there seems to be a prima facie case that the undertakings given have been breached," Ottaway told the BBC.
But he admitted Britain had little leverage with Beijing.
"As far as sanctions are concerned, frankly we are in a fairly weak position. Indeed, we were in a very weak position right from the beginning when this declaration was signed," Ottaway said.
In July, British Deputy Prime Minister Nick Clegg said Britain would honour its 1984 pledge to "mobilise the international community and pursue every legal and other avenue available" if China breached the deal.
But other members of the British government are eyeing Chinese investors and tourists and attempting to rebuild ties after Prime Minister David Cameron met the Dalai Lama in 2012."
http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/article/1583535/beijing-slams-uk-plan...
~~~~~~~~~~
Two decades ago there's just a little thing the Britain could do to bargain with China over HK, even the Iron Lady couldn't budge Deng Xiaoping let alone intimidate him; what they've more now to make them think that they can do any more?
Some folks are really blank about the Chinese history. Some degree of autonomy, yes, yet China won't ever accept a country within country...not even feasible in any future deal with Taiwan.
Some figures in HK are either quite delusional or they get their paychecks to stir up problem there. Lets see how big the stake these individuals are willing to play :-)
Uber forbidden in Germany.
Oh I though its rich against against poor map :)
Too many people it appears a struggle is occurring to unseat America as the worlds most dominate nation. For many proud Americans who see the world from the unenlightened and possibly undefendable position of the United States having a right to be in control it is both threatening and frustrating to see control slip away.
It is threatening to think the country might quickly fall to the position of a second rate power mired in debt with many of the options we have come to see as our right suddenly ripped away. It is frustrating that in many ways the country has become its own worse enemy guilty of political inaction and squandering its power through a series of bad choices and missteps. More on this shift in power and our best response in the article below.
http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2014/06/americas-struggle-to-stay-on-top....
That map may look impressive but vast swaths of China and Russia are very sparsley inhabited. So it basically boils down to China and Russia having a favorable view of China.
Okay, so now we use population count instead of the vast territories ... :-)
as if the info/chart/poll fed by PEW has such high regard of credibility or trustworthy, and not a measured move to boast certain image :-) lol